KILL or KEEP Vol.13

Sufjan Stevens – Illinois

‘Sufjan Stevens is the Picasso of indie folk. He takes the soothing NPR/car commercial sounds we know and love for their warmth and familiarity and says “Nope” and farts in our faces.’ – V. Dreth

Sufjan Stevens is indeed the most ubiquitous, evasive, phlegmatic chameleon of our times (the indie ones), and represents many a thing to many a chum. To Pangea, he represents comfort and joy. To Pheromone, he represents balance and gay. To johnnyoftheWell and MarsKid, he represents being sick to death of the press circuit around which his latest effort Javelin is still running many a lap in this limpest of years. Now, KILL or KEEP has always been about pluralism (usually in the form of severe fucking death), and as a result we are going in! Into Illinois! Everyone has something to say about this one: the songs are endless, the possibilities are infinitesimal and the classic status is, yes sure okay you get it. What will our takeaways be? Will we sync or swim (in the Maynardian sense) as a team? Only Sufjan has the answers…

Rules

The team is johnnyoftheWell and MarsKid and Pangea and Pheromone.

Every song must either be KILLed or KEEPed.

There is no minimum KILL threshold. 

Every time a song is KILLed, the KILLer must name a location that Sufjan Stevens should have made a concept song/album about instead

Okay.

 

Starting Impressions

Phero: I accidentally listened to this album for the first time in like 3 years two days ago and didn’t know this would happen so i am about as ready as one can be – it was good! It has everything good about Sufjan but also everything over the top and bad and sloggish about Sufjan and my god is it LONG and daunting. My expectations are that this will be better than most albums we kill keep but also that this might be more of a slog hm hmmmm hmmmmmmm happy friday

jotW: I tried to fall in love with this album during my National/Modest Mouse/Brand New -simping undergraduate hipster heyday and, uh, there was too much coffee in my blood and not enough coffeeshop in my heart so it didn’t work out. Somewhat enjoyed the great zany-bloat ambition of the record, found most of it dispensable. Have since returned to it not at all, but have explored the bulk of Sufjan’s discog and come to the conclusion that he’s anaemic and drab and well-intentioned but has never made anything I’d rate above 3.5. Let’s see how that holds up. 

Mars: I haven’t really given Sufjan much thought beyond a few listens here and there. I decided to check out their latest album this year and really felt that, while it was rather pretty and on the whole well-composed, so much of it was hardly memorable. It was like a very pleasant breeze that whips past and, well, it feels pleasant, but then it’s gone. I’m expecting something of the same when revisiting big ol’ ILLINOISEEE here, but also my hopes are pretty low at this going up in my estimation given we have… 22 tracks? Is this a Drake album?? Actually imagine Drake + Bon Iver log cabin collab album, can we make this happen because the comedic potential is there.

Pangea:  I love Sufjan and I love this album! Although i only return to a few tracks and i don’t know if i ever remember many tracks from the second half. But this overly sentimental, overblown silliness is definitely my cup of tea and i have fond memories of listening to it when i was an indie kid

Mars: I googled “sad white man” and this was the first result and I assume this is the target audience?

jotW: Lmfao is that robert downey jr jr 

Mars: Walmart brand yes

Phero: he doesn’t look sad he looks kinda concerned i think he has a sore neck

Mars: I’d be concerned too, did you see the tracklist

jotW: Enough chat, more tracklist

(1) Concerning the UFO Sighting Near Highland, Illinois

jotW: FUCK a piano

Pangea: this is a very cuteand pretty intro track i like it very much KEEP

Mars: As a tone-setter, this is quite pleasant. Delicate melancholia + Sufjan’s soft delivery = winning combo here.

Phero: This is Sufjan at his best n when he is at that best mm kiss lips chef kiss he warms the heart n winter mm KEEP

jotW: I rate this as an intro. Very musical theatre Suf, feels like we’re gonna get a full revue and, uh, ig we are. KEEP.

Mars: Sufjan Presents: Hamilton, the Sufjan version. But uhm KEEP as well here. Wow first time I got to keep or kill, I feel powerful…

jotW: “THREE STARS” is this prophetic is he in on this KILL or KEEP?

(2) The Black Hawk War, or, How to Demolish an Entire Civilization and Still Feel Good About Yourself in the Morning, or, We Apologize for the Inconvenience but You’re Going to Have to Leave Now, or, ‘I Have Fought the Big Knives and Will Continue to Fight Them Until They Are Off Our Lands​!​’

jotW: Albums that have two intros: Sufjan Stevens – Illinois, Linkin Park – A Thousand Suns. This is baggage! KILL it! Sufjan should have done a concept album about empty space, because that is where I’m staring right now.

Mars: This sounds like I’m entering a Ren faire lol why do we have two intros, is Sufjan a cosplayer and if so is he into elves? Can he write me a song in elvish. Uhm honestly KILL we don’t need two intro tracks lol. Also WHAT IS THIS TITLE. Let’s do an entire concept about Alaska because that sounds depressing as shite.

PherO: Mine is black hawk also mr not fuckin using streaming – this is so extra n bombastic n kind of everything I didn’t like about Adz but fuck it works in such smal l2 min quantity is so FULL KEEP

Pangea: Black hawk is fine, but after a really nice intro track, it feels a little unnecessary and with such a long album it is a KILL Uh lets do concept on Antarctica. I want to hear Sufjan sing about penguins that would make me happy

(3) Come On! Feel the Illinoise!

jotW: I remember this being the best Sufjan song not named “Impossible Soul”. It is fun! The metre is funky! It’s got those cute horns, it is doing the Broken Social Scene things in a way that you can present to your parents or significant other!? It’s a smash! I want to shake my limbs offly kilterly to it.

Phero: This is the Sufjan u miss in late era melancholic C&L Javellin Suf and is about as good a mood setter for the BIG nature of Illinoise (for better or worse) 

Mars: Agreed on this being cute, that upbeat energy + horns is where it’s all at. Album flow is probably perfect if the prior track is cut, and it’s a great one-two-combo.

Phero: a great one-two-three-combo i agree

Mars: How would you describe Sufjan’s music using only fast food restaurants ready go

Phero: Subway ask no questions

Pangea: this is one of his best songs. Love the upbeat instrumentals and background vocals, feels perfect for the track for this concept album. One of the best examples of his style during this Sufjan era. Very easy KEEP

Mars: Subway is bland and boring I agree with you

Pangea:  subway good 

jotW: Subway is mid as piss, but this has to go with a restaurant that has a buffet, no? Wait FUCK maybe it is Subway!!!!

Phero: you think piss is mid???

jotW: My piss is hella mid I am forever envious of your piss. Brb getting a beer to cure my apple-soured bowels of imminent diarrhoea

Mars: These strings are pretty though! Let’s focus on Rampart people. I mean, the music.

Phero: Ok this song is glorious it is known it is Sufjan he is confident he is big and broadway and is a big boi who is proud of his horns n strings n oh no i forgot he talked about crying his self to sleep i want to hug him KEEP hard KEEP Sufjan has SUCH an ear for these lil ear worm backing vox melody bits sometimes mm

Mars: This is a very easy KEEP for me, has a decent runtime but spends all of it unraveling a surprisingly layered soundscape, ebbing and flowing gradually with horns and string arrangements paving the way. Stevens’ voice is perfectly suited for these moments.

jotW: This arrangement and instrumental progression is just perfect, has exactly the same magic you can tell got him roped in for “Fake Empire”. Even in my best condition… backing vox is so cute, love this yes KEEP. Used to remember the first verse being the easy highlight of this one, but I think the whole trajectory is just right now.

Pangea: Outro is lovely, the paired down vocals are perfect

(4) John Wayne Gacy, Jr.

Mars: Ah yes, the one everyone knows. I wonder if it holds up. 

jotW: I have no memory of this (or most tracks to come) lmao

Phero: ur crazy this is the ONE 

Mars: Great vocals here too. Like the bleakness of the lyrics and how Sufjan’s voice makes it unsettling in a way.

Phero: top 5 song to put on mixtape to ur crush – (song is very good and also highlights how fuckin top heavy i find this album)

Pangea: Gorgeous song, even with the subject matter. The guitar and piano at the begin intertwine so perfectly KEEP

jotW: Piano counterpoint is kinda making this so far oh wow he just did a compelling voice goat quaver legato thing

Phero: iconic oh my god – a lego?

jotW: A legoat

Phero: song would be at risk of being too much if it was not this well done 

jotW: You are beyond the risk of being too much hurr. Song if anything is on the verge of being too little, but that piano is nice and the chorus nooo-o-o-o-te is a hook you can pin a song on. KEEP.

Mars: Okay so I’m gonna go ahead and KEEP this as well. Piano counterpoint as aforementioned is a winner, hook is aces, it’s a winner.

PherO: fr – yeah KEEP slay

(5) Jacksonville

jotW: Really enjoying not having to open another tab to copypaste these titles while it lasts.

Mars: As a Titans fan, I am not sure I am at liberty to recognize the city of Jacksonville and feel compelled to disown this track on principle alone.

jotW: Real talk, is Jacksonville even in Illinois? Could have sworn it was in Florida, but that’s because the only thing I know about it is that it’s where Shinedown come from (don’t ask) and they are literally Florida in my head

Mars: There is likely a Jacksonville, Illinois. Hell, there’s a Baltimore, OH. Look it up lol

Phero: Shinedown era Johnny is precious lore

jotW: Okay I have googled and we stan a Jacksonville plurocracy 

Pangea: train wifi gave up, i started a wifi hotspot ESPECIALLY FOR YOU ALL

Mars: ANYWAYS trans-ition this song is pretty swell right now. Sufjan has a knack for these kinds of songs, light and upbeat but with some heft to them so they don’t float away. Feels like that’s what happened on this last alb tbh, too empty and it floated off.

Phero: I agree but i think it can feel sorta oversaturated over 22 songs here n this isn’t one of my fav 

jotW: Formula for this album so far = throw a ton of the right instruments into the mix, have each do something refined, clearly mixed, and distinct from every other layer, and one of them will hit exactly the right note for someone (in this case, the banjo for me). Arrangement is carrying the song for me – not in love with the rest of the songwriting (are there hooks? is there an engaging direction?) but there’s enough ear candy that I’m not phased. Suspect this is an observation that will cover a lot of the record, but for now this one is above water. KEEP, but not nearly as strong a KEEP as the last two.

Pangea: This is a nice song, i always appreciate a well-placed banjo (this is a banjo right? okay johnny confired that it is a banjo nice)

Mars: Yeah the songwriting early on here is wonderfully done. Cohesive while having every facet of a given track shine in its own way. Can agree that the hook is lacking here vocally, but I think the instrumental melody central horn + strings that swing through is what sells it. I’ll go ahead and call this one a KEEP as well.

Phero: i love the strings on this but everything else kinda bloats in the grand big scheme of things esp. those vocals yeah – he is real good at developing a sort of nothing track into a bit more expansive, layered n comprehensive build n this defo hints at that ahhhh do i keep do i kill ok i KILL and Sufjan should write a song about Yorkshire instead

Pangea: this barely has hooks, but it works despite it I think!  KEEP

(6) A Short Reprise for Mary Todd, Who Went Insane, But for Very Good Reasons

jotW: This song is famous someone talked about it in a Youtube video once.

Mars: What role did Daniel Day Lewis play in this song. Is he the first note. Please someone tell me I need to update the IMDB. I’m gonna KILL this is just filler and this is not Naruto okay, anyways write a concept about the Principality of Sealand Sufjan, ready GO.

Phero: i want to KEEP for the name alone but it is a KILL and write about my Uncle Ronan’s house instead pls

Pangea: what do you all think the reason was

jotW: Oh wow uh it played it finished it never did anything to anyone, and for that reason alone KILL. Sufjan should have sung about uh idk Andorra. Transitional gimmick country etc

Pangea: yeah it kind of a nothing track KILL Sufjan should have done a concept on Andorra I will not explain

(7) Decatur, or, Round of Applause for Your Stepmother!

Mars: This song desperately needs Isaac Brock having a midwestern mental breakdown over it. Because that’d be fun.

jotW: Yeah lol, gimme that Jesus Christ Only Child cope complex breakdown Mr. Brock. Feck, I usually hate that side of MM, but this has got some educating-your-5-year-old campfire energy to it, and I am not thrilled.

Phero: yeah i feel that but it is lovely educating-your-5-year-old core and better than most in that genre which i am very familiar with 

Pangea: This one is very nice, I always really liked the vocals melodies on it. They are very ear-catching KEEP

Mars: On one hand, I appreciate how this works in the scope of the album (we’ve had two mostly grand arrangements up front, let’s cool down and do something chill and more acoustic-based), but this feels like settling for a bunt when you’re hitting home runs. Filler track. KILL this never goes anywhere and sounds far too fluffy, anyways I demand a Bikini Bottom folk album let’s make it happen.

jotW: This is twee flab and I resent how catchy it is. KILL, Sufjan should have written a concept album about my Sunday school when I was a kid.

Phero: twee flab are two words that should not be combined – KILL but kind of a narrow KILL and write about the Netherlands instead maybe 

Pangea: Yes i hope he has a song about the Hema. KEEP

(8) One Last “Whoo-hoo!” for the Pullman

Phero: this will be my wedding dance song hard KEEP

jotW: Haha I geddit track 8 is 8 seconds long lmfao ha ha a ha KILL write a concept about uhhh Pheromone’s mattress (idk who else to insult here), it’s used to action of this approximate timespan

Pangea: round of applause boys! KEEP

Mars: lmao KILL uhm anyways location, uh make a concept about Mars, for me. Do it bb.

(9) Chicago

jotW: Shoutout neekafat  

Pangea: Hard KEEP

Phero: Yeah Chicago is maybe the best song on the album maybe it is everything this album does best – it really nails that specific location feel this albums conceptual namesake done best i love it and it makes me feel warm and fuzzy 

Mars: Okay nevermind I take back what I said about track 7 working for the album, album works fine without it. I want to kill it harder now. Those strings are so pretty.

Pangea: such a pretty song; one might even call it life-affirming

jotW: Not a hot take, this could have easily been an Arcade Fire song. Bit low energy, but has a bit of the same pomp going for it

Pangea; It is very Arcade Fire yes but the good Arcade Fire. Give me those Rebellion vibes

Mars: I’m a sucker for cute pomp energy with some tasteful horn shenanigans. 

Phero: Mars as resident American have u been to Chicago have u eaten a deep pizza

Mars: Yeah this is exactly what Chicago sounds like, I had a man with an acoustic guitar and a sad face sing that Wake Me Up When September Ends song and we ate deep dish pizza, we now have three kids and listen exclusively to indie singer-songwriter.

jotW: Aww cute/tragic – on a different note, what are some mistakes y’all have made 

Phero: i mistakenly signed up for sputnikmusuic dot com

Pangea: doing a keep or kill in the train

Mars: I’ve made far too many mistakes, I’m trying to have a good Friday :^(

jotW: Jesus Christ energy intensifies, get you a holiday boi!

Phero: Sput staff annual (recorded) holiday when – this is a KEEP obviously

jotW: The main string motif from this has wormed its way into my head it must be a KEEP. Like the choral outro a lot

Mars: Anyways this is a pretty solid KEEP for me, have to say this album is working out better than I anticipated.

jotW: Yeah tbh same, am braced for the rest of it but it might get a bump from this. Definitely in a different league to the Nine Inch Nails/Smashing Pumpkins bullshit that KILL or KEEP is usually all about.

Pangea: Yes Johnny that motif is so catchy

(10) Casimir Pulaski Day

Pangea: this is the song. Maybe his best one. One of the most heart-breaking songs ever KEEP

Phero: Everything I said about Chicago was a lie – this is actually the best on the album yeah it is sad and queer and lovely and heartwarming and heartbreaking and gorgeous n low key and yes best 

jotW: This is the kitchen sink someone-put-the-teapot-on-while-I-do-a-sad-candid Sufjan that I have much less time for. First track on the album so far that’s revolved around him as a singer-songwriter and not all the cute dreamy zany shit he’s thrown into the mix for vibes and contour etc.. 

Phero: singer-songwriter not ott Suf is best Sufjan fight me

Mars: When just his voice is the focus, I find myself far less engaged in the songwriting even when it’s not necessarily bad. It just feels lacking stacked next to what’s preceded it so far. It’s caught in a weird middle ground between trying to be grand and trying to be understated; Sufjan shoots to land in that said middle and sounds bored.

Pangea: I love the horns in this song

jotW: I think I’d prefer this stripped back further tbh – I like/respect his spartan singer/songwriter presence on, like, C&L because it’s so unflinching in how it foregrounds that shit; this feels like a toss-up and it doesn’t match the appeal of the record for me (could easily argue that it brings an extra angle to it, but the banjo sounds too perky so I do not care for this)

Pangea:  i have already liked his almost casual delivery of “I am crying in the bathroom”

Phero: I think CPD is amongst his best but i get the feelings n thoughts even if you are wrong and should feel bad – KEEP

Pangea: Not sure I agree, this song has much more elements as the average C&L song. Like it wouldn’t be the same at all without the horns and such

Mars: These horns at the end are doing nothing for me unless it’s announcing the arrival of Sir Lancelot. KILL for me I’m not big on it and we need to trim this shit so here goes, anyways next Sufjan concept album can be about the sci-fi planet in Jason X or something. He wrote a killer clown song now write a killer Jason album.

jotW: Lmfao, I kinda like the coda tbh. Don’t have enough reservations about this to KILL it but it’ll be another weak KEEP. Has this series finally reached the need for a middle way? Ig it’s a KOPE (soft KEEP)

 

(11) To the Workers of the Rock River Valley Region, I Have an Idea Concerning Your Predicament

Pangea:  this is one of the better interlude tracks on the album it is very nice i will KEEP it

Mars: This actually does feel like a more natural segue. I’m not too intent on killing it and interludes aren’t ALL bad. Ehhhh KEEP.

jotW: Yeah, this feels like a good segue / individually engaging piece / cute arrangement KEEP

Phero: er! I agree about interludes as a whole and feel bad killing pretty much all of them but this is a KILL for me because i just am not that interested n i do not find it much interesting and please Sufjan write a song about Cornwall and in particular their pastries

(12) The Man of Metropolis Steals Our Hearts

Mars: Do we have an electric guitar in MY indie folk album??? Oh good it’s gone I got concerned there.

jotW: Okay now I wish this was an Arcade Fire song. Actually now the rock part has stopped, it’s okay. In a very pasty way. 

Pangea: Love this song too! The electric guitar is a perfect change of pace and it has one of my favourite verses on the album. Really pretty, love the gang vocals (there is a better word for this, but i cannot think of it leave me alone) KEEP

Phero: that 20 second mosh at the Sufjan show makes it all worth it

jotW: What happens if you fall down

Phero: u tie peoples laces into little hearts :3

Mars: To speak generally since we are far enough along; I prefer this album, and Sufjan as a whole, when he aims for the grandiose in this cute, lightly-understated and ultimately artfully layered way. His vocals are more of a passenger there and accentuate the atmosphere, where the main prize are the strings and horn arrangements. 

jotW: 100% agreed with this

Mars: The longer the song, the more space it feels he’s able to explore and really let songs progress. Stripped-down Sufjan does far less for me and feel like it exposes his faults, namely the fact that his singing voice isn’t too much of a feature for me.

Phero: I am inclined to maybe agree but over the course of his extra-super-long-fuckin albums it all becomes a bit much n too sweet n pomp. I feel like this comes to a real head in Adz but here I just don’t LOVE these 6 min grandoes – KILL and write a 6 min epic about my grannies house aw

jotW: Rock-stomp + choral refrain is one of the few arrangement decisions so far that flat-out does not work for me. This song is a bit of a jumble and I don’t specifically love any of its constituent elements, KILL it and write a song about a composite location like, uh, Luxembourg.

Mars: Yeah the guitar is pretty goofy in context of all that has come before it, but it’s delightfully goofy and upbeat in a way that I think works for this album, provided the fluff is fluffed out like a disobedient, lumpy pillow. Gut instinct is to KEEP and so I will go with my gut.

Pangea: I understand but i do like the choice of the rock stump + choral. It makes the song sound huge and it’s a good contrast of the more subtle songs before

Mars: This fade-out has me worried we’re about to do another sadboi slowdown Sufjan song oh no oh no oh no. WAIT WE’RE ONLY HALFWAY DONE???

jotW: Aww the culmination of this one is pretty cute, too late it is KILLed.

(13) Prairie Fire That Wanders About

Phero: Has Sufjan done a Christmas album?

jotW: Surely yes

Phero: Right? I feel like even his ~warm~ stuff is caroly

Pangea:  this is also a very nice interlude track. KEEP. I am pretty sure he has made christmas albums, i have not listened to them because they are christmas albums 

jotW: This title is very Welcome to Night Vale. Gimme that sentient fire taking a leisurely stroll round the district conspiracy

Mars: Yeah this works in context if we are ultimately aiming for the pomp and the grand over subtlety, which as I said before, I’m in favor of. Christmas vibes notwithstanding, uh KEEP.

Phero: i do not like fantasy i think maybe this is my issue KILL and write about something real like – oh the 19 second song just happened – Scotland (which is soooo fuckin real)

jotW: This does actually remind me quite strongly of Seiko Oomori’s Christmas anthem (which is also not much of a KEEPer). Enjoy the vocals, don’t particularly love the shape(lessness) of the song, guess it’s a KILL write about Lapland you festive slut

(14) A Conjunction of Drones Simulating the Way in Which Sufjan Stevens Has an Existential Crisis in the Great Godfrey Maze

Mars: KILL this is stupid. Write about Brexit as punishment.

Pangea: this is 19 seconds i am not sure why it exists KILL write about the Vatican instead

jotW: Oh fuck off KILL or give us an hour-long extended version. Write a song about Boris’ studio.

Phero: that song title walked so this new Andre 3000 82 minute ambient flute album could run 

jotW: Lmfao

Phero: KILL write about the gap between time and space 

(15) The Predatory Wasp of the Palisades Is Out to Get Us!

Mars: Did he try using bug spray

jotW: If you spray a bug away, is it still out to get you? Do wasps serve their revenge cold

Mars: Okay I feel like a Disney musical number about exploring the great open somewhere is about to begin lmao am I wrong?? I half expect the balloons on the cover to start singing.

Pangea:  i probably sound like a broken record here but this is very pretty 

jotW: These lyrics + relatively straightforward instrumental is very haha let’s write a song about anything, and I am not sure how cute / annoying it is yet

Mars: This is making me retroactively dislike Javelin more lmao

Phero: This is pretty and another Sufjan at his most open and queer and lovely and again one of his best on here 

Mars: Wow these vocal arrangements… this is some beautiful stuff. Yeah he should just never do the standard sadboi shtick ever, it’s so clearly not his strength to me. Sure sometimes it gets cluttered (i.e. “Metropolis Man” song or whatever) but there’s so much more earnest energy and a tangible vivacity.

Pangea: yeah the interplay of vocals in the second half is gorgeous 

jotW: Yeah, the backing vocals and horns in this bridge are really picking up the slack here. Song still has a bummer first verse and is ever so slightly messy as a whole. Don’t think it gels in the way of the best tracks, KILL it and write a song about a kennel (PAWSS > WASPS)

Phero: I will KEEP the wasp song and it is one of the shining buzzzzzzzing lights of a slight slog of a second half

Mars: I am again surprisingly going to KEEP this lmao maybe I actually liked this record all along??? Then again there’s still some cutting to do probably.

Pangea: It is a KEEP song

(16) The Walking Sufjan: Daryl Visits Illinois pt. 65!!! Dead indie singers!! Guitars and STRINGS!! CAREFUL

Pangea: was the song title chosen by budgie

Phero: lmao pang Sufjan discovers the bass guitar

jotW: Oh fuck it’s a new instrument and the first sex groove moment okay 

Pangea: the bass is very nice, this is a very good intro

Mars: Where did this funk bass come from. Yeah Sufjan randomly making me feel like sexy sexy I don’t know.

Phero: i dont think Sufjan would be very good in a zombie apocalypse 

jotW: Sufjan himself in this song is so funny to me lol

Mars: Sufjan has very strong “Guys we can reason with them they were like us once” energy, definitely the first to go

jotW: Lollll yes he does. He does not sound frightened enough :[

Pangea: the backing vocals are gorgeous again, this album has masterful backing vocals, vocal arrangements

Phero: yeah the backing vocals are dope – i  do think this song is sliiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiightly boring 

Mars: That’s because Sufjan’s voice on its own is entirely unimpressive for the most part, and the brighter the spotlight is on it, the more it’s exposed. Need those big boi compositions to cloak it.

Phero: he has a lovely delicate oh it might break vocal style i am willing to fight again

jotW: Mars on the money lol, backing vocals on this album aren’t really backing vocals and they kinda outgun him at every turn. 

Pangea: I like sufjan’s voice quite a bit, but he definitely can’t carry an album with it, so this was a very good choice

Mars: It’s not a BAD voice whatsoever, but it’s just not the kind that can carry an effort. It’s especially apparent in efforts where the lyrics seem to require more of an emotional OOMPH and he either can’t get there or declines.

jotW: I feel he can absolutely carry a spindly folk song, but yeah this album is just too vibrant for those pasty sadboi tones. They’re a good complement at points (including most of this song tbh, which I will KEEP it’s a fun goof), but he does not have the magnetism of his arrangements.

Pangea: his voice is perfect for Carrie & Lowell though. That breaking part of it makes that album

Phero: This song is GOOD but if we are tryna make a classic it is one of the first good songs to go and go it does – KILL and give me a song on the backing choir origin location (vs zombie)

Mars: Of the epics so far, this one is one I’ll safely KILL honestly. Feel like it rests on the laurels of what came before it and doesn’t have as strong of a progression. That bass intro is not expanded on enough let me feel SEXIER damnit. Anyways write a concept about my imaginary land in my head.

Phero: a dark, scary place…

Pangea: really good it is a KEEP

(17) Let’s Hear That String Part Again, Because I Don’t Think They Heard It All the Way Out in Bushnell

Mars: KILL Sufjan stop this nonsense we don’t need to die by fluff here.

jotW: Second listen did not improve the string part, KILL it and write a song about Staines.

Pangea: i like strings i will KEEP it

Phero: so – [KILL]

(18) In This Temple as in the Hearts of Man for Whom He Saved the Earth

Mars: KILL please stop it’s happening too fast and I’m running out of locations to hide

Pangea: this one isn’t very neccesary though. One interlude is enough, Sufjan! KILL

jotW: Uh another one? KILL it, write a song to go beside the Staines song – Slough, please.

Phero: Sufjan had NO consideration for the pace by which we need to do these Kill / Keeps – KILL and write a song about a race course because vrmmmmm so fast so fast

(19) The Seer’s Tower 

jotW: Maybe this should have been a little earlier in the tracklist? Between Casimir and Man of Metropolis would have been tight.

Pangea: It is a very nice piano intro. 

Phero: yeah a big issue for me as i do kind of enjoy most of the album is the pacing of the album – most of the big hitters are in the first half, so where these genuinely real good songs crop up in the latter you’re just kinda flattened

Mars: This sounds really out of place compared to the rest of the album. Yeah Phero pacing just doesn’t exist here lol, some of these tracks and interludes are total momentum killers. Those backup vocals are coming to perform a salvage job I see. KEEP but probably move elsewhere yeah.

Pangea: I think this is the perfect place for it. The first half already has its fair share of slow songs as well

Phero: this end is so lovely though – so i goooo to the deepest grave aw er KEEP because it is haunting and in my track list it wont be the 19th song of a 22 song album 

Pangea: Such a beautiful part KEEP

jotW: Album kinda needs this song, much more pared back and arresting than its other soft tracks so far. KEEP it and reorganise it plz.

(20) The Tallest Man, the Broadest Shoulders (Part I: The Great Frontier – Part II: Come to Me Only with Playthings Now)

Phero: Oh hey look he namedropped the colton artist guy

jotW: Yuck. 

Pangea:  oh no Johnny hates tall man

Mars: Oh we have claps lol what is this, are we pop punking and call and responding? Please. OK but anyways welcome back to the Ren Faire I will be your guide King Arthur.

jotW: Phero what KILL or KEEP does this remind you of the most, it is kinda giving me Heavenly Punk Adagio vibes (although you weren’t there for the main part where we were all half-asleep and everything and nothing was happening)

Phero: haha yeah i feel truly 

Pangea: this is such a lively and spirited intro

Mars: OK I am enjoying this but have to admit I’m growing weary of dude’s songwriting relying on a bit of a too-dependable pattern…

jotW: This is a bit of a pale echo of what Come On! Feel the Illinoise! served up earlier (and is directly reprising it, yes?)

Phero: yeah yeah yeah yes maybe

Mars: This is an hour+ album with no cohesion and a flimsy-at-best lyrical through-line conceptually, if anything is having a coda it sure as shit ain’t earned lmao

jotW: Yeah ngl I love how easy it has been to not pay attention to the lyrics and have slightly regretted tuning into them more often than not

Phero: From 3 mins on this song switches up a gear n instrumentally which borders in wonderful album-at-its-best territory but fuck man this album (and especially Adz) sort of grates on me by the end – it’s kind of worse then the sum of its parts

Mars: Yes that 100% Phero. It’s starting to get a bit too-sweet and too-sugary. Starts off strong but now it’s just playing the hits. And this song is 7 minutes ahhhhh

jotW: Adz is one of the most please-skip-me records ever for like at least 75% of its playtime, which is hilarious given that idk if I actively dislike any given track there

Phero: Johnny why did ur version only not have song two – did the file you downloaded from already embark on a KILL KEEP of their own

jotW: L o l idk! One sec, I’ll check slsk oh hahaha wait yeah it was shared by windowpain he must have been getting ready to read this discourse

Phero: bless him – ok i like this song and i like most Sufjan songs do not get me wrong but KILL and write me a song about windowpains Friday evening embargos 

Mars: Please backup vocalists come in we need your help, Sufjan Stevens is ebbing and flowing to death. Ehhhh this is flimsy as hell. KILL KILL write about King of the Hill, so uhm, Texas I guess?

jotW: Finale (if that’s not too strong a word) of this is better, but this is the flabbiest flab we’ve had so far by some distance. KILL it and write a song about Scotland – Sufjan needs to see what those levels of cholesterol have done to folks there

Pangea: Okay internet is back. This is a good song, but in an already long album, it is maybe the only non-interlude song I would cut. Just doesn’t feel it quite kicks up the gear that it wants and it’s a bit too long to forgive it for that. Write about the real Tallest Man on Earth instead. KILL.

(21) Riffs and Variations on a Single Note for Jelly Roll, Earl Hines, Louis Armstrong, Baby Dodds, and the King of Swing, to Name a Few

Mars: Find someone who loves you the way that Sufjan loves his random-ass interludes. KILL In Bruges concept folk album please and have Ralph Finnes guest star.

jotW: One-note variations are cool and I like this song for marking that the last song has ended, it can be KEEPed.

Phero: google tells me jelly roll is an american rapper omg fuck yeah a bruge concept album would be kind of up sufjan alley er KILL and i second Mars suggestion

Pangea: yeah this one isn’t very necessary. KILL write about

(22) Out of Egypt, into the Great Laugh of Mankind, and I Shake the Dirt from My Sandals as I Run

jotW: Oh hey it’s All My Friends by LCD Soundsystem with emo piano lfg

Mars: My goodness we’ve made it to the end my friends. I feel like we’re at the volcano and this album is the ring. Cast it into the fire. Who’s gonna do it. Wait is this how the album ends? 

Phero: how did we get from Illinois to Egypt? Fuck i missed a few turns

jotW: This reminds me of the time Arcade Fire ripped it off for the Reflektor closer

Mars: I hate to be that guy but this is dangerously anticlimactic lol.

Phero: arcade fire r really on ur mind right now eh johnny

jotW: It is ’00s indie fever (extremely Mike Myers Austin Powers voice) yeah baby

Phero: yeah this is a hilarious closer for best-album status album sufjan – (i do quite like the song but yadayada same criticism verbatim used over over) KILL and write me a concept album about a chord that David played to please the lord

Pangea: I do like the emo piano here

Mars: KILL this is like if all those useless intros were compiled into one ball of nothing that went nowhere. As a final request before I head back to the void, politely write a folk album on the state of Missouri. No reason why, I just said so.

jotW: I actually quite like this, forget Arcade Fire – this has that Steve Reich worship all over it, quite sophisticated shit. Would have been a great coda to a decent closer, but that Tallest Man song dropped the ball so epically that it falls flat in sequence. KEEP on its own terms though, thank you minimalism arrangement god Suf for shutting the fuck up and doing what you do best one last time on this needlessly long headtrip.

Pangea: I actually dig the choice to end on something so paired pack. In such huge and often maximalistic album I find it nice to end on something more reflective like this KEEP

Mars: I consider the album cohesion here sufficiently broken enough to where I can’t be fucked to reconsider an order right now. I went somewhat song-by-song with exceptions.

Closing Remarks 

Pangea: This is a lovely album! And I actually was surprised with how impressed I still was with most here. Even the songs I didn’t remember in the back half usually impressed me well. I do have to reconsider my current 4.5. This is still a bit too bloated with a few too many interludes and would have benefited from a different track list order. But, that being said, the overall song quality is too strong for any less as a high 4/low 4.5 for me

jotW: This is probably the most an album has ever gone up in my estimation from any KILL or KEEP (3 -> 3.5 type shit) – definitely has highlights I didn’t appreciate fully before, and Sufjan’s mastery of complex (and catchy!) arrangements has aged so, so well. Sequencing issues, bloat, and can-this-tepid-singer-man-carry-a-decent-tune grievances aside, I’d call this more an endearing hit-or-miss now, where it would have been an innocuous indulgent chore before. Cute!

Phero: I’ve got a new theory with why I don’t fuck with Illinoise as much as my top-tier Sufjan picks and it’s the level by which he seems to understand everything at-the-right-amount on Javelin and Carrie & Lowell and so consistently fails to do with every other album. I like pretty much every song on Illinoise (interludes excluded) but I always leave it with a sense of sluggishness. At its best it is gorgeous and maximalist and Sufjan at his usual lyrical prowess (which we didn’t get to touch on much heh) but as a whole it’s (as I said before) less than the sum of its parts. This is maybe the one album we have KILLed and KEEPed that would benefit most from the treatment – fuck it, do a Kid A / Amnesiac and split it into two. 

Mars: Similarly to Johnny, I was surprised at how much this actually improved in my eyes (ears?) upon revisiting. The flow is unquestionably shattered and there’s an overdose of fluff, but the highlights are genuinely captivating and demonstrate his talents as a songwriter. As I mentioned before, it really devalues Javelin further for me, since I just don’t find scaled-back Sufjan engaging whatsoever; he’s far more comfortable when making bombastic stuff! I can’t deny that said bombast can become very tiresome and, in the case of “Tallest Man” or whatever the track is, it sounds purely like self-plagiarism, but when Illinois clicks, it’s a trip. Probably worth a subtle .5 bump or so. Anyways happy to participate in this! :^)

Final KILLstats

jotW: 11/22 (50%)

MarsKid: 12/22 (54.5%)

Pangea: 6/21 (28.6%)

Pheromone: 11/21 (52.4%)

Surviving Tracklist

The following are the remaining songs that not one competitor elected to KILL.

They constitute the new, official version of the album:

1. Concerning the UFO Sighting Near Highland, Illinois

2. Come On! Feel the Illinoise!” (Part I: The World’s Columbian Exposition ˆ Part II: Carl Sandburg Visits Me in a Dream)

3. John Wayne Gacy, Jr.

4. Chicago

5. The Seer’s Tower

KILL or KEEP will return soon, please be excited and stay posted!

 ・・・・

Archive

Vol.1: Smashing Pumpkins – Mellon Collie…

Vol.2: Nine Inch Nails – The Fragile 

Vol.3: Carly Rae Jepsen – Emotion

Vol.4: Deftones – White Pony

Vol.5: Nightwish – Once

Vol.6: Tavito Nanao – Heavenly Punk Adagio

Vol.7: Big Thief – Dragon New Warm Mountain…

Vol.8: The Beatles – The Beatles

Vol.9: Taylor Swift – Red

Vol.10: Kanye West – My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy

Vol.11: Weezer – Pinkerton

Vol.12: Phoebe Bridgers – Punisher