ArsMoriendi
03.25.23 | Also I guess what artists should I help tag Funeral Doom, since at least that's actually a genre |
JohnnyoftheWell
03.25.23 | Hilarious that we get funeral doom before death/doom, but hey at least the tags are still coming
I agree that world music kinda sucks as a tag, but it can be fairly useful on sput as a second/third tag behind Folk and sometimes Jazz for genres like bossa nova, enka and klezmer just as a concessional "hey we don't have the right tags for this" dummy label
But fuck knows I'm not about to get out there spamming the site with it |
Sunnyvale
03.25.23 | Slowcore when?
Yeah, funeral doom and melodic black metal are kinda funny additions given the limited nature of existing genre tags. |
ArsMoriendi
03.25.23 | Genres we've voted for that we're still waiting on specifically:
-Disco
-Trap
-Slowcore
-Vaporwave
-Screamo
-Garage Rock
-Dungeon Synth
-Krautrock
Genres we've voted for that we got:
-New Wave
-Synthpop
-Noise
-Djent
-Deathcore
Genres MX has given us that no one asked for:
-Atmospheric Black metal
-Melodic Black Metal
-Funeral Doom
-World |
el_newg
03.25.23 | all music is from the world :) |
Cimnele
03.25.23 | not mine |
dedex
03.25.23 | world tag sucks, agreed. i need the skronk tag!! |
MoM
03.25.23 | “ not mine”
[2]
In need of a scenecore tag
I wanna know how my nostalgia ranks in the charts |
AsleepInTheBack
03.25.23 | For a website that doesn’t rep enough non western music, World as a tag may be a helpful stepping stone towards scrapping it and getting more specific, but I feel like you almost need a gateway tag if that makes any sense. I get that conceptually it’s a dumb tag for the reasons outlined by ars, but may be practically helpful as a necessary evil. |
GhandhiLion
03.25.23 | cringe |
ArsMoriendi
03.25.23 | On a more positive note: 17 bands are now tagged funeral doom, which bands should be tagged that? |
GhandhiLion
03.25.23 | we have a funeral doom tag? Why are there no announcements for these things |
Demon of the Fall
03.25.23 | What? This actually happened? I thought you were here to discuss the merits of potentially adding it and was gonna be all like nah, that’s a silly idea for a genre tag Ars 😄
Also, Funeral Doom is fine I guess, doesn’t seem overly important compared to what’s still missing but perhaps if we’re patient then more will be coming our way |
Calc
03.25.23 | mx is known for timely updates of his site I think this will work |
porcupinetheater
03.25.23 | Fucking gross, Ars you read David Byrne’s piece on how self-congratulatory and imperialistic the idea of “world music” is? |
GhandhiLion
03.25.23 | 'World music' could of had some utility if instead it was only used to describe the newer amalgamations of non western music. Such as Gabriels Passion, Alice Coltrane's Universal Consciousness or Lou Harrison's Pacifika Rondo.
RYM essentially has a less problematic and western including version of the term in the form of 'Regional Music' |
ArsMoriendi
03.25.23 | I have porc! It formed a lot of my opinions on the term.
For those curious, here is David Byrne of Talking Heads', famous for incorporating African folk styles into his rock music, opinion on the term:
https://archive.nytimes.com/query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage-9901EED8163EF930A35753C1A96F958260.html |
GhandhiLion
03.25.23 | ^ thanks for the link |
GhandhiLion
03.25.23 | I'd rather it was deleted too, but at least I can tag gamelan with something other than classical now |
Demon of the Fall
03.25.23 | ‘Hilarious that we get funeral doom before death/doom, but hey at least the tags are still coming‘
Is death-doom important? Most bands can just be tagged with both, making their style obvious enough, no? Rare that you’d need it as one all-encompassing tag |
GhandhiLion
03.25.23 | No they are not interchangeable, there is just a noteworthy amount of overlap. Death doom is less niche than funeral. |
GhandhiLion
03.25.23 | Also when did we get Atmospheric Black metal? |
foxblood
03.25.23 | most world music is often recorded with the intent of selling it to the foreign market though, usually the euro market. Issa Bagayogo for example I would call 'world' music because his work was pushed by six degrees records in the west and his only recorded shows that I know of were on british television. Something like Ata Kak I wouldn't call 'world' music because it's just lofi dance house music made in mali intended for locals |
JohnnyoftheWell
03.25.23 | "I feel like you almost need a gateway tag if that makes any sense"
this only works for positive, inclusive categories (e.g. "electronic", "queer"); world music is a gross othering category in the same ballpark as "foreign" and "exotic". like, it can still be vaguely useful as a classification tool (purely bc this stupid site has so few of these available), but actively starting a Horizon-Broadening Walk Of Musical Erudition with quote-unquote world music is a gross poison chalice that should never have been in the conversation
foxblood raises an interesting point though - using it as a term for foreign music actively produced to tick whatever preconceptions importing countries have of their aesthetics and styles would be great, if it weren't already overused to the point that people will still confuse it with the real deal |
GhandhiLion
03.25.23 | It turns out that my comment of what the term 'should' have meant is compatible with the original philosophy behind the term, coined by Robert E. Brown.
https://symposium.music.org/index.php/29/item/9510-world-music-past-present-and-future |
AsleepInTheBack
03.25.23 | I mean you could pick another gateway tag (I.e. the regional music compromise RYM seems to have gone for) but (for better and clearly worse) world music already has enough traction behind it as a recognised term to be a helpful label/way of identifying things, even if I completely agree it has icky self-congratulatory/imperialistic overtones - I’m saying if we’re only gonna get 1 geographically linked genre tag (which, given how the parcelling out of new tags has gone so far I think sounds likely) then it’s better than nothing: BUT obviously ideally better to scrap it AND get appropriate, specific, non-generic tags for each school of non-western music. If someone is willing to pool together a sensible list, send it to mx, and actually get him to do something about it, then please do that would be sublime. |
porcupinetheater
03.25.23 | Tagging Boris as world music |
GhandhiLion
03.25.23 | " BUT obviously ideally better to scrap it AND get appropriate, specific, non-generic tags for each school of non-western music"
The issue with that is that there are too many of them to list, so including them will break this website. |
Demon of the Fall
03.25.23 | ‘No they are not interchangeable, there is just a noteworthy amount of overlap. Death doom is less niche than funeral‘
I could maybe agree to an extent, but with how restrictive Sput’s tagging system is, I think that’s asking a lot to have a separate death-doom tag in all honesty (although funeral doom doesn’t seem particularly important and I certainly wasn’t comparing the two’s necessity).
maybe this will be pointless debating because we’re getting ALL the genres 😄 |
GhandhiLion
03.25.23 | https://www.erudit.org/en/journals/cumr/1900-v1-n1-cumr0468/1014442ar.pdf |
GhandhiLion
03.25.23 | I'd agree with you that the funeral doom tag is preferable if death doom wasn't such a deceptively weird genre. (it's not just death metal + doom equally)
There's different strands of death doom. e.g Winter and Katatonia weren't death metal but diSEMBOWELMENT and Sempiternal Deathreign were.
In the case of funeral doom tagging all of the bands with doom is always correct. |
ArsMoriendi
03.25.23 | Honestly, I didn't mind folk holding up the mantle
I guess some broad ones like "Latin" would also work |
Ryus
03.25.23 | lmaooooooooo bruh mx what r u doing fam |
ArsMoriendi
03.26.23 | HOLY FUCK MX JUST ADDED A BOSSA NOVA TAG
lol i guess that's sorta good actually thanks MX, why do you hate disco? |
ArsMoriendi
03.26.23 | Wait so like should bossa nova cover samba/tropicalia/MPB or not?
Man if he added Samba instead it'd be so much easier since that's broader gahhh |
pizzamachine
03.26.23 | Sputnik: begs for tags and offers human sacrifices to mx
Also Sputnik: wtf is this, I didn’t want these tags, what’s wrong with you mx |
ArsMoriendi
03.26.23 | Well duh, we don't just want tags for the sake of having tags
That's like asking for Radiohead tickets, receiving Meghan Trainor tickets, and some guy being like "well you asked for tickets!" |
pizzamachine
03.26.23 | True dat but is a good meme lol |
SharkTooth
03.26.23 | Mf will add world music but nobody even considers a Latin music tag wtf |
ArsMoriendi
03.26.23 | I mean Latin would be useful as fuck, but I guess underdoing it with world and overdoing it with bossa nova will have to do |
porcupinetheater
03.26.23 | Kaatayra - Bossa Nova |
porcupinetheater
03.26.23 | Meghan Trainor - Bossa Nova, World, Atmospheric Black Metal |
JohnnyoftheWell
03.26.23 | bossa nova tag based
shibuya kei tag is just one step away |
Purpl3Spartan
03.26.23 | I need this tag for my Israel Kamakawiwoʻole jams |
Jasdevi087
03.26.23 | normalise tagging americana and britpop as world |
Parallels
03.26.23 | yo mx, add the tag for april fools but call it earth music |
Demon of the Fall
03.26.23 | ‘HOLY FUCK MX JUST ADDED A BOSSA NOVA TAG‘
WHOA! This is actually happening guys, next level Sputtacular. We have arrived… this is emotional!
👍🏻🥹
|
Borracho
03.26.23 | My partner runs a music platform and they were recently in a big dust up with their board of directors about the whitewash of the term World Music. |
Mort.
03.26.23 | better to have world music until we have all the specific names for regional folk music
which we will likely never get
anyway, twenty more metal subgenres please |
pizzamachine
03.26.23 | I may wait forever for symphonic metal |
Ryus
03.26.23 | mfw we still dont have a tag for one of the most popular genres today |
MoM
03.26.23 | Funaná will get the justice it deserves someday 😤 |
Ryus
03.26.23 | i was talking about balani show actually |
MoM
03.26.23 | I’m so behind the times i don’t even know what that is
https://youtu.be/5DlTexEXxLQ |
GhandhiLion
03.26.23 | "Balani Show," these street parties began in the late 90s
it's dad rock don't worry |
GhandhiLion
03.26.23 | https://rateyourmusic.com/genre/belgian-techno/
|
ArsMoriendi
03.26.23 | Repeating this: should bossa nova cover samba/tropicalia/MPB or not? |
Mort.
03.26.23 | calling the imaginary bossa nova expert of sputnik |
neekafat
03.26.23 | Of all the tags smh |
anat
03.26.23 | delete all the genres just have rock and metal |
MoM
03.26.23 | Delete all genres [2] |
Borracho
03.26.23 | Should bossa nova cover samba/tropicalia?
Aside from them coming out of Brazil, there’s nothing tying them together. Should metal cover electronica and folk? |
ArsMoriendi
03.26.23 | I mean samba influenced both tropicalia and bossanova to my understanding
Prob why MX should've added samba and not bossa nova but I digress...what about MPB? |
Borracho
03.26.23 | No idea. Mpb is essentially fusion Music. It’s a moot point to a degree because yes, it won’t happen, but having thirty metal sub genres in while mashing all of the world into one category is fucking lame.
And yes, samba influenced bossanova, but by the same measure that American folk and blues music influenced every guitar genre since. |
ArsMoriendi
03.26.23 | Okay, that seems like a proper no then, thanks for letting me know since I've been tagging a bunch of artists bossa nova to take advantage of the few new tags MX give us
I still refuse to use the World tag tho |
GhandhiLion
03.26.23 | @ars no |
MoM
03.26.23 | “ And yes, samba influenced bossanova, but by the same measure that American folk and blues music influenced every guitar genre since.”
This is so fascinating! I’ve got so much to look into with so many genres, goddamn |
Demon of the Fall
03.26.23 | Cool info because I would’ve assumed what Ars had re bossanova (and possibly started tagging stuff incorrectly) |
ArsMoriendi
03.26.23 | I don't know ton about Brazilian music, but tropicalia (Caetano Veloso, Os Mutantes, Gal Costa) are all great
Basically psychedelc pop and rock (in the case of Os Mutantes) mixed with Brazilian styles like samba etc |
Mort.
03.26.23 | more than genre tags i want a 'to listen' function that lets me sort by genre
ive gone from a massive word document to just adding shit to spotify to making sputnik lists |
MoM
03.26.23 | “ more than genre tags i want a 'to listen' function that lets me sort by genre”
[2]!!! |
Mort.
03.26.23 | goodreads is a good example. i can list books in custom shelves and tag them as read, or want to read and give them a rating
|
9Hammer
03.27.23 | I'm not sure if it was ever brought up but I was thinking about a "Mathcore" tag.
Some bands I see on the site (Dillinger, Rolo, etc.) have tags like Math-rock/Hardcore/Metalcore, and I feel that it would truncate the tags down a size. |
TheSonomaDude
03.27.23 | New genre tags were a fun surprise after having not logged in regularly for a few months. funeral doom is an odd tag, but the rest is pretty awesome |
Jasdevi087
03.28.23 | nah funeral doom is clearly priorities
if we're hyperfocusing on guitar genres tho, we def neef garage rock and industrial rock / metal, because there is hella misappropriation going on rn with the current tags |
Emim
03.28.23 | It's called earth |
ArsMoriendi
03.29.23 | Now that we have
Nu jazz… power electronics… and omfg Viking metal
I think it isn’t MX anymore, it’s gotta be a hacker. I mean Viking Metal? Wtf even is that |
Ryus
03.29.23 | swag |
Kompys2000
03.29.23 | The plot thickens |
JohnnyoftheWell
03.29.23 | shibuya kei tag or we riot you trolling piece of shit |
pizzamachine
03.29.23 | Meh |
MoM
03.29.23 | Visual kei or we hack the site and delete the forum! |
Jasdevi087
03.29.23 | I feel like including visual kei as a genre wouldn't be much more descriptive than having a "hair metal" or "scene" tag
shibuya kei tho |
Borracho
03.29.23 | Yes to Japanese Fuck Porridge being a tag!
Users should have personalized tags. If I want to tag something in my chart as Clump or Fuzz, i should be able to. |
Prancer
03.29.23 | mathcore got added too |
GhandhiLion
03.29.23 | Viking metal lmao |
9Hammer
03.29.23 | Thanks for mentioning that Prancer. Went ahead and voted on the tag on a couple of bands. |
pizzamachine
03.29.23 | Power Electronics is added |
MoM
03.29.23 | Mathcore AND Power Electronics!? Fuckin sick |
Jasdevi087
03.29.23 | ok let him cook |
Demon of the Fall
03.29.23 | I'm overwhelmed by the urgent need to tag the shit out of everything, yet there's too much to get through. Option paralysis. |
ffs
03.29.23 | we should be able to tag albums with numbers, on say a scale of 1 to 5, to indicate how good we think they are |
Demon of the Fall
03.29.23 | nah, that'd be absurd wtf |
ArsMoriendi
03.29.23 | STOP THE PRESSES glam rock is here
Yesss |
ArsMoriendi
03.29.23 | I can’t keep up with all these but I am absolutely gonna get glam rock up to snuff… gonna make a list later for it
Maybe this troll or MX or whoever isn’t so bad |
JohnnyoftheWell
03.29.23 | someone make mathcore list plz this is good add |
Cimnele
03.29.23 | 311
Blink 182
Front 242
10,000 Maniacs |
Pangea
03.29.23 | johnny make this list i'm counting on you |
ArsMoriendi
03.29.23 | People should make more of these
Though none for Viking metal or world, those aren’t real genres |
ArsMoriendi
03.29.23 | Who here likes groove metal? That got added
Aren’t there only like 5 groove metal bands or something tho like Pantera and maybe idk White Zombie? |
Ryus
03.29.23 | where in the goddamn fuck is TRAP |
ArsMoriendi
03.29.23 | Unfortunately this troll or MX, seems to specifically avoiding the genres we voted for so |
GhandhiLion
03.29.23 | groove nice. |
Jasdevi087
03.29.23 | who's gonna get started on power electronics, that's a big move |
ArsMoriendi
03.29.23 | Make the list Jas, and I’ll help tag |
Colton
03.29.23 | coltonmusic has both trap and disco and does not have world music. |
ArsMoriendi
03.29.23 | We now have "Instrumental Rock" and "Instrumental Hip Hop"
Those are going in the same category as World and Viking Metal IE: why would anyone use that tag |
SharkTooth
03.30.23 | In get viking metal, Vikings are cool. But world is too broad.
When are we're gonna get garage rock already? |
JohnnyoftheWell
03.30.23 | instrumental
rock
begin memes |
Jasdevi087
03.30.23 | why the fuck is there a hair metal tag heeeeeelp |
ArsMoriendi
03.30.23 | Because the troll doesn't realize the actual name for the genre is glam metal? |
Ryus
03.30.23 | mx trollin fr |
Kompys2000
03.30.23 | My favorite instrumental rock band gotta be dream theater you KNOW they are rockin some serious instruments |
ArsMoriendi
03.30.23 | Well at least we got some good ones |
Demon of the Fall
03.30.23 | yeah, I'd encourage anyone who thinks a tag is a load of codswallop to you know, just not use it, maybe?
controversial |
Elynna
03.30.23 | would've gone with folk metal instead of viking metal, but at least there appears to be some serious movement in the adding of new genre tags |
Jasdevi087
03.30.23 | @ars I'll think about it if no one gets to it before the weekend |
GhandhiLion
03.30.23 | Instrumental hip hop is nice and could actually be a genre as it has a traceable musical tradition.
Instrumental rock is pretty dumb and purely a descriptor though. Similar to 'acoustic rock'. |
GhandhiLion
03.30.23 | folk metal instead of viking metal [2] |
ArsMoriendi
03.30.23 | Art pop and disco just dropped!
I call dibs on the disco tag list |
sonictheplumber
03.30.23 | i say we do specific countries, "world music" sounds nice but its vague |
pizzamachine
03.30.23 | I pop art like pop tarts |
GhandhiLion
03.30.23 | Art pop is huge |
JohnnyoftheWell
03.30.23 | Sowing can i introduce you to this fantastic life hack called Get A Shibuya Kei Tag And Never Look Back Dentist HATE Me |
JohnnyoftheWell
03.30.23 | (also psst this heroic cull is the stuff of sunbeams but can Instrumental Rock and Hair Metal go the same way i will pay one kidney) |
Mort.
03.30.23 | we really should have a trap genre
useful for filtering out shitty hip hop
yes i am a boomer soulwise |
GhandhiLion
03.30.23 | Based |
ArsMoriendi
03.30.23 | Hair metal should be changed to glam metal but it should ultimately stay |
GhandhiLion
03.30.23 | >adds picopop instead
Gigachad.png
|
ArsMoriendi
03.30.23 | Guns N Roses, Van Halen, Cinderella, Poison, Def Leppard, Motley Crue etc
Hate those but it is what they’re called right |
Sinternet
03.30.23 | forgot to step in here, but i think 'traditional' would be a good replacement for more ethnic traditions
although some moron would tag traditional and doom metal for sure |
GhandhiLion
03.30.23 | Ars first two are bait right |
ArsMoriendi
03.30.23 | My pipe dream genre tag is baroque pop tbh |
Mort.
03.30.23 | wait how long have we had jam rock ? |
ArsMoriendi
03.30.23 | “ First two are bait right”
Nah they’re just the more respected bands in the genre |
GhandhiLion
03.30.23 | That's wrong
@mort Forever I think |
ArsMoriendi
03.30.23 | @mort: since forever, that’s not a new one |
Sinternet
03.30.23 | marmalade rock clears tbh |
Mort.
03.30.23 | ah damn
ars can you please post a comment with all the new genres im getting confused/overwhelmed/frightened/mildly aroused |
GhandhiLion
03.30.23 | Uh has anyone voted hair metal for pantera yet? |
ArsMoriendi
03.30.23 | idk but we do have groove metal now so that belongs with Pantera at least |
GhandhiLion
03.30.23 | Is there a groove list in the making? |
ArsMoriendi
03.30.23 | I’m doing disco when I get home
So idk I’m kinda letting other people do the metal ones since that’s like the furthest thing from my knowledge |
Mort.
03.31.23 | charts are working again aswell. no longer stuck with norma jean at the top of last years charts, and this years charts are now active |
ArsMoriendi
03.31.23 | Awesome!
Mathcore/glam rock/nu jazz stuff has been put on meds threads so the harder artists can get their proper tags
For now we focus on instrumental hip hop/disco/a 3rd genre perhaps? Someone make one for something! |
Jasdevi087
04.01.23 | world tag is now gone |
Mort.
04.01.23 | well that was quick |
Get Low
04.01.23 | lol |
GhandhiLion
04.01.23 | Well boys, we did It. Racism is no more |
ArsMoriendi
04.11.23 | Viking metal, instrumental rock, and hair metal are GONE
Nice, thanks Sowing and maybe MX
someone make the power electronics thread, it's the last domino, I don't wanna do it aaah |
JohnnyoftheWell
04.11.23 | BLESSED and based gj everyone big mews gg mx you are troll best boss |
ArsMoriendi
04.11.23 | Who actually enjoys Power Electronics... I wanna say CaliggyJack
what's he been up to |
Ryus
04.11.23 | i like how mx is completely silent about all this
if it is really him making these changes 🤔 |
ArsMoriendi
04.11.23 | Tbh I told Sowing in the meds thread yesterday that no one was gonna use those 3 genres and today they’re gone, and this was while I was also asking him to fix up the groove metal bands as per usual, so idk is it Sowing? It corresponds to Sowing more lol |