shrapnel
11.03.10 | list is music to get high to |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | Can someone explain why it would be good to legalize it? I want to know what people think. |
PanasonicYouth
11.03.10 | because keeping it illegal is doing so much already herp derp |
whywontyoudie
11.03.10 | generic stoner remark. |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | i dont |
PanasonicYouth
11.03.10 | i've never even touched the stuff
but thanks for playing anyways |
MasBarHigeuoris21
11.03.10 | Great list of dope smoking music. Not a good idea to legalize weed in Cali when the state has so many other problems to deal with |
shrapnel
11.03.10 | @ Josh
since people are getting it already, if you tax it that's more money for the state
also it would save the state loads of money if they don't prosecute people for weed |
SCREAM!
11.03.10 | @Josh it being illegal really isnt doing much to stop anyone. So by legalizing it the government can have a bit more control over it (like alcohol), they hope itll reduce organised crime by a small fraction and its an extra source of revenue for the state (since it can be taxed like cigs and alcohol)
|
MindTrain
11.03.10 | because there's nothing wrong with it. look at all the music it helped create! |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | My main thing is people say it's a vicitmless drug, which has to be bullshit. |
whywontyoudie
11.03.10 | i want it to stay illegal in georgia long enough for my brother to get in trouble. fucking no life high school drop outs man. |
SCREAM!
11.03.10 | ive never tried it so im not biased for or against it but it doesnt seem like its really much worse than alcohol (according to researcches its actually better but i dunno bout that) |
shrapnel
11.03.10 | also, it's already legal for "medicinal purposes" in cali
which means that anyone who wants it can get a prescription for it anyway |
MindTrain
11.03.10 | "victimless drug"
I don't get it. Who's the victim? A user who gets caught and sent to jail? |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | I'm good with it being used medically for sure. |
PanasonicYouth
11.03.10 | it's the only logical solution, people are just too afraid of said logic |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | " don't get it. Who's the victim? A user who gets caught and sent to jail?"
What I mean is if people will drink and get behind a wheel and drive, people will die. Since weed slows reaction/reflex time as well, you can't tell me people haven't been high and done something that caused accidents of some sort, whether with a car or anything else. |
shrapnel
11.03.10 | "I'm good with it being used medically for sure."
the thing is, ANYONE can get it for medicinal purposes
ask anyone in this state and they know someone who has their "weed card"
anybody can get it |
MindTrain
11.03.10 | Better make alcohol and cellphones illegal too while you're at it. |
MasBarHigeuoris21
11.03.10 | Though I am against prop 19 you bring up a very good point Mindtrain, weed has helped to create a lot of good music. Hell, drugs have been forever helping to create good music. |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | "Better make alcohol and cellphones illegal too while you're at it."
I was expecting someone to say that. |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | But there are laws against cell phones and driving all over, so that doesn't count. Plus I said things other than car accidents as well. |
AnotherBrick
11.03.10 | there is no reason to keep it illegal |
shrapnel
11.03.10 | "But there are laws against cell phones and driving all over"
there are also laws against weed
doesn't seem to be stopping anyone |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | Just because people aren't obeying a law doesn't mean you should abolish it. People still murder, but we aren't giving that law up. |
AnotherBrick
11.03.10 | have you ever drove high? |
MindTrain
11.03.10 | "I was expecting someone to say that."
Well of course. theres this thing called DUI. |
combustion07
11.03.10 | For me they should either legalize weed of make alcohol illegal. It doesn't make sense to have the laws the way they are now. I really don't care, either way I know how to get it and have been smoking for a solid four years now on a daily basis and have never been busted. When and if I get busted I'm sure my opinions will change. |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | "have you ever drove high?"
I don't think I have, but for the third time, I also mean things other than driving.
"Well of course. theres this thing called DUI"
Right, and I already said there are laws against that, but because people don't obey a law doesn't mean you should change it.
I like the conversation though. I just wanted to know what people thought. |
deathofasalesman
11.03.10 | If they legalized weed, then ppl wouldn't care if someone was selling weed. They'd be like "Dude, it's legal, I can just go in the store and get some foo." And then dealers would cry every night. |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | I honestly would hate it if I was out in public and there were just a bunch of people smoking weed. |
MindTrain
11.03.10 | @combustion
alcohol causes a tremendous amount of death, so one of those would be a more consistent course of action to take |
AnotherBrick
11.03.10 | well give me some examples of what bad could come out of legalizing it? and you can't say driving is dangerous, they sit at stop signs for 3 hours waiting for it to turn green and by that point they're sober again! sounds pretty safe to me |
shrapnel
11.03.10 | "If they legalized weed, then ppl wouldn't care if someone was selling weed."
and it would reduce drug-related violence |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | "well give me some examples of what bad could come out of legalizing it? "
I have. |
PanasonicYouth
11.03.10 | "well give me some examples of what bad could come out of legalizing it?"
this please
and if someone says something about everyone being high all the time
you're retarded |
Baphomet
11.03.10 | It would be a good idea to legalize pot for the folowing reasons:
- People should be free to do what they wan't with their lives, as long as they don't harm others in the process. It's not like people are not buying it anyway. Prohibition only generates black market, it does not make the product disappear.
- Black market would disappear, thus throwing down the prices and screwing drug lords.
- When legal, it would be possible to tax it and provide income for the state. Also, it would be possible to track the ammounts of weed sold.
- People fail to realize, making it legal won't put a gun to children's heads and making them smoke it. It should be sold with IDs like cigs and alcohol, which are more harmful than pot btw.
- I had some other points but I forgot them. |
MasBarHigeuoris21
11.03.10 | Maybe death, but dealers would probably learn to sell weed cheaper than it is being sold in stores so they would keep their customers |
PanasonicYouth
11.03.10 | "- I had some other points but I forgot them."
AHA MARIJUANA IN ACTION |
shrapnel
11.03.10 | "I honestly would hate it if I was out in public and there were just a bunch of people smoking weed."
in this state you can hardly even smoke cigarettes in public places |
AnotherBrick
11.03.10 | butttttt baphomettttt it's a gateway drug duhhhhh. once we legalize it then everyone will have the desire to acquire some meth and heroin |
MindTrain
11.03.10 | josh, you bring up people driving stoned and now people smoking in public outside of a special bar
i think youre paranoid. hopefully nonsmokers wouldnt notice much of a difference at all. its safer than cigs (except when driving) so if it becomes popuar intead of cigs, it actually might not be worse than cigs
keyvboard broken so you talk to someon else fr nw |
AnotherBrick
11.03.10 | all this talk has made me hungry ; ) |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | "People should be free to do what they wan't with their lives, as long as they don't harm others in the process"
Those were good points, but for this particular one, you know there are still going to be issues with people getting hurt, be it self-inflicted, accident, or otherwise because of it in some way. |
combustion07
11.03.10 | "AHA MARIJUANA IN ACTION"
lmao |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | "josh, you bring up people driving stoned and now people smoking in public outside of a special bar"
Yeah, so? |
shrapnel
11.03.10 | "I had some other points but I forgot them"
I was gonna give more reasons why but then I got high... |
AnotherBrick
11.03.10 | but honestly...how the fuck is marijuana illegal and alcohol is legal? that's just stupid as fuck.
|
Josh D.
11.03.10 | I don't know, but two wrongs don't make a right, as gay as that sounds. |
shrapnel
11.03.10 | "how the fuck is marijuana illegal and alcohol is legal?"
because you can't grow alcohol in your backyard |
MasBarHigeuoris21
11.03.10 | As someone who has driven stoned before it depends on the who you are driving if it is dangerous or not. As long as you aren't trying to speed (which is almost impossible to do high) weed does not really impair you ability to drive |
AnotherBrick
11.03.10 | but there isn't anything wrong with a little bud. it just makes everyone happy and hungry. |
Jash
11.03.10 | I'm fine with it being illegal. I can walk down the road smoking a joint as it is and nobody turns a head. Legalizing it would just make it more expensive and I'm fine with my low ass prices thank you very much |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | "weed does not really impair you ability to drive"
You can't say that abotu everyone. |
MasBarHigeuoris21
11.03.10 | Lol @ shrapnel. You can make your own alcohol but it is hard and expensive |
AnotherBrick
11.03.10 | ""how the fuck is marijuana illegal and alcohol is legal?"
because you can't grow alcohol in your backyard"
you're right, you can just brew it in your basement. |
Baphomet
11.03.10 | "- I had some other points but I forgot them."
"AHA MARIJUANA IN ACTION"
ILU for getting the joke.
@Josh: You're right about that. But a case could be done that more people die or get into accidents because of alcohol and it is still legal.
@Brick: IT WOULD BE LIKE OPENING PANDORA'S BOX! But srsly, weed is not harmful. At least not until smoked in huge doses (is that the prural of dose?) While crack, meth and E can kill you or drive you mad. It would be much more difficult to legalize them. |
shrapnel
11.03.10 | @ MasBarHigeuoris21
weed grows like... well weeds
it's very easy to grow so if it was legal and people grew it themselves, the government couldn't tax it |
AnotherBrick
11.03.10 | haha i know, i'm with ya baph.
and andcas last i saw it was like 56% no |
MasBarHigeuoris21
11.03.10 | "weed does not really impair you ability to drive"
I'm on your side Josh and I stated in that post"
It does depend on the driver |
AnotherBrick
11.03.10 | "weed grows like... well weeds"
lol ya, cause being the lazy stoner i am i would totally rather wait for a full fucking plant to grow in my backyard, rather go across the street to buy some |
wyankeif1337
11.03.10 | If makes perfect sense to legalize it, even if the federal gov't won't support it: it's a stepping stone for other states and eventually the country. I'm disappointed in my state right now, and in my party (repubs). |
shrapnel
11.03.10 | @ andcas
still don't know but it's unlikely to pass |
PanasonicYouth
11.03.10 | and california fails me yet again |
AnotherBrick
11.03.10 | oh well, it'd be fucking cool if it passed but iowa is too concerned about marrying homos, so we wouldn't have it for a longgggg time |
MasBarHigeuoris21
11.03.10 | "no its not. easy and cheap. all you need is yeste, a pot, lemonade and lemons"
I have never made alcohol before but I know you need more than that to make it. You at least need a still or a washbasin to put in while your making it. Can't make alcohol in a pot |
Jash
11.03.10 | @ anotherbrick yeah it does take a lot of time and effort to grow but I did this last summer and the bud I grew was ten times better than anything I've bought in the last few months |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | Johnny Drama got a weed card easily. |
shrapnel
11.03.10 | "pot is legal to tons and tons of california citizens already"
yes it is
trust me when I tell you: ANYONE can get it legally now |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | reefer madness |
Uranium
11.03.10 | Weed detaches people from their surroundings which I think would be bull shit to legalize because we would be nurturing a vegetable population. |
MasBarHigeuoris21
11.03.10 | Don't mean to be a buzzkill but according to cnn:
marijuana no 56% and 44% yes |
Baphomet
11.03.10 | From what I've heard it's true that anyone can get legal pot in Cali. But I would have loved it if it was legalized cause it would set a precedent the world could later follow. Hell I don't even live in the US but it would have been great. |
ShadowRemains
11.03.10 | legalization/weed list on sputnik = MILLIONS of comments
|
shrapnel
11.03.10 | "we are already a vegetable population. just look around at our youth."
or read comments on sputnik |
SCREAM!
11.03.10 | anyone wondering....the bill is failing as of right now
http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2010/results/individual/#CAI01 |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | you know... everything negative about weed that people have talked about here is either biased, or just false.
i'd like to take a moment to point out that, weed is impossible to OD on, it isn't addictive (sure you can form a mental addiction to it, but that goes for anything). it has many benefits other than getting high. hemp in it's natural form is great for: fuel, paper, clothes, and basically most things you can imagine.
as for the actual act of getting high, to each his own. people need to realize that it really isn't a big deal, and it isn't going to cause "hallucinations" and it's not a "gateway drug". if you're an idiot and want to try meth and coke, etc, then that's YOUR stupid choice. do not blame it on weed, because i can safely say i smoke it every day and it doesn't make me want to go buy coke....
although i COULD go for some subway.... mmmm.... eat fresh.... after getting baked ;) |
MasBarHigeuoris21
11.03.10 | "we are already a vegetable population. just look around at our youth. people smoke anyways. drink. ect. its cool to be a slut and be a waste of space now of days."
Amen andcas! Look no further than Brokencyde for proof of waste of space |
Baphomet
11.03.10 | dammit it's somewhat close! Idk the population there... does weed stand a chance?
|
qwe3
11.03.10 | "For me they should either legalize weed of make alcohol illegal."
yeah because outlawing alcohol worked so well last time |
Uranium
11.03.10 | Yea but legalizing weed is going to implement kids who would never originally try weed to try it since their are no longer negative consequences. If you think a lot of people abuse it now, wait until it's legal. Let's just put a pot leaf in the middle of the American flag now. |
MasBarHigeuoris21
11.03.10 | " i can safely say i smoke it every day and it doesn't make me want to go buy coke....
although i COULD go for some subway.... mmmm.... eat fresh.... after getting baked ;)"
Lol |
shrapnel
11.03.10 | @ MasBarHigeuoris21 and SCREAM!
this prop passing was a real longshot we all knew that already |
SCREAM!
11.03.10 | @uranium: from what i hear amsterdam is doing just fine |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | "Weed detaches people from their surroundings which I think would be bull shit to legalize because we would be
nurturing a vegetable population."
i have a job, i contribute to society just like everyone else. who are you, and who is the government, to tell me that i
can't smoke pot? if I show up to work on time who cares? if i pay my taxes who cares? if i don't break any laws
(besides the painfully obvious) who cares?
it's silly ideas like yours that has kept this unnecessary prohibition going on for years when it should've ended in the
70s.
i'm praying this proposition passes, so that canada will follow suit. it's TIME! |
SCREAM!
11.03.10 | @shrapnel i know i jsut thought people would appreciate the update seeing as how big of a debate it is |
qwe3
11.03.10 | "Yea but legalizing weed is going to implement kids who would never originally try weed to try it since their are no longer negative consequences. If you think a lot of people abuse it now, wait until it's legal. Let's just put a pot leaf in the middle of the American flag now."
you're a colossal moron, especially by your last sentence |
shrapnel
11.03.10 | "Let's just put a pot leaf in the middle of the American flag now."
I hope you're not being sarcastic cuz that's a great idea |
Baphomet
11.03.10 | Uranium wins the post for most retarded comment in a while.
And concider this IS sputnik.
So have a drink, you deserve it. |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | The United States of Marijuana |
qwe3
11.03.10 | anewtypeofpunk bringing truth itt |
MasBarHigeuoris21
11.03.10 | ANewTypeOfPunk=Hippie |
SCREAM!
11.03.10 | also right now a bunch of stores are selling legal alternatives to it that are chock full of chemicals and acctually a bigger health hazard than the actual thing. That right there is fucked up |
East Hastings
11.03.10 | If it's legal, it loses the "cool guy" allure of doing something against the rules, so it'd be mostly for people that already do it, do it for the feeling, or do it to fit in |
MasBarHigeuoris21
11.03.10 | Your right SCREAM! You can even buy those "legal highs" on ebay. They are highly processed and get you even more high than average weed can |
qwe3
11.03.10 | smoking weed to be cool is so dumb. it's just not a cool thing. its a great thing, but cool it ain't.
although a girl smoking a bong is pretty sexy |
couldwinarabbit
11.03.10 | I can't believe that this is being argued and gay marriage hasn't been approved everywhere in the states yet...get your fucking priorities in order. |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | Intake of bong smoke through the vag is cool. |
Baphomet
11.03.10 | Hastings makes another good point. |
shrapnel
11.03.10 | "also right now a bunch of stores are selling legal alternatives"
and a bunch of dispensaries in cali are selling weed legally already
for "medicinal purposes" but anyone can get a prescription |
ShadowRemains
11.03.10 | qwe speaks da truth |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | "I can't believe that this is being argued and gay marriage hasn't been approved everywhere in the states yet...get your fucking priorities in order."
Hell yeah. |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | actually, i can assure you i'm not a hippie. in fact, hippies piss me off. all that good for the earth bullshit and being vegan. = gay.
i'm just a stoner, who is educated, and isn't listening to the lies everyone tells me about weed. when i was younger i was firmly against it, until i tried it, then i realized it isn't as bad as everyone makes it out to seem, and it actually has a lot of benefits to using.
i self medicate for depression and a number of other issues. it really helps me out. i'm not kidding, i probably would've committed suicide if i hadn't discovered weed. it literally has saved my life. |
Baphomet
11.03.10 | I always knew rabbit was kinda.... fruity... |
MasBarHigeuoris21
11.03.10 | I misstated ANewTypeOfPunk=The fucking Truth |
MasBarHigeuoris21
11.03.10 | Um... I'm assuming that gay marriage is not being argued on sputnik because no one on sputnik cares and because arguing about gay marriage would be.... well.... you know... kind of gay |
shrapnel
11.03.10 | I always knew rabbit was kinda.... fruity...[2] |
PanasonicYouth
11.03.10 | the truth is probz the best gta character ever |
Uranium
11.03.10 | If you wanna smoke, go ahead and smoke. I don't care if you damage your neuron communication or increase your chance of schizophrenia. My philosophy goes for cigarettes too.... Let the fragile take themselves out.. |
bungy
11.03.10 | Pretty sure, weed + driving + music is my favorite nonsexual activity besides eating fruit snacks. |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | Hell yeah, fruit snacks like a mother fucker. |
MasBarHigeuoris21
11.03.10 | @andcas
Lol, Katt Williams sounds like he could be in our discussion |
ShadowRemains
11.03.10 | "Um... I'm assuming that gay marriage is not being argued on sputnik because no one on sputnik cares and because arguing about gay marriage would be.... well.... you know... kind of gay"
...Not that there's anything wrong with that
|
shrapnel
11.03.10 | "Pretty sure, weed + driving + music is my favorite nonsexual activity besides eating fruit snacks."
that's kinda... fruity |
Emim
11.03.10 | I voted no just to piss all you people off. |
MasBarHigeuoris21
11.03.10 | "...Not that there's anything wrong with that"
There isn't but its still funny
|
Uranium
11.03.10 | I'd be edge if it were not for the love I have with Guiness |
Baphomet
11.03.10 | @Uranus: Dude, I don't smoke that much pot but drink and smoke cigs every weekend. Still I'm at the top of my class, have a girlfriend, great friends and a good relationship with my family. You don't wanna do drugs? Fine. My philosophy is let everyone do what they want as long as they don't harm others. But don't make steriotipes. Fragile? You just come out retarded. |
Nomos
11.03.10 | People against prop 19 are bitter losers with misconceptions and an elitist, brainwashed attitude. |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | "People against prop 19 are bitter losers with misconceptions and an elitist, brainwashed attitude."
That's an elitist thing to say. |
Uranium
11.03.10 | I have a friend who is a pot head and is breezing through college and has a cute girl. I have a friend who is straight edge, dropped out, plays wow and sits at home all day. So yes, there are exceptions. |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | Not only is weed NOT a gateway drug, the fact that it's illegal is probably the main driving force behind people going from weed to something harder. If weed was sold in stores legally there's a big line drawn between weed and harder stuff, but if you're buying it from your drug dealer you have a connection to the market that sells other drugs, and not only have easy access to it you might be pushed into it by people you know.
And yeah its dangerous to drive while high, but that's why driving while high is where the law should intervene. Keeping MJ illegal because of how it can be dangerous ONLY in one scenario that would still be illegal anyways makes no sense.
Underage people can also get MJ easy as hell. Say MJ is legalized but only for a certain age group (which it should be, as with cigs and alcohol). A sales clerk might lose his/her job for selling to a minor, with no benefits to them for selling it. As it is today, drug dealers sell to minors because to them they're just a customer like anyone else. They're breaking the law either way so might as well sell it to younger people.
Honestly though the real problem I have is that here in AZ the proposition to get it legalized for medical use only isn't winning. It's written so that not everyone can get it like in CA, it's supposed to have tighter limitations to make it only available to people w/ cancer/aids/etc. The fact that anyone would vote no for that strikes me as so ignorant it's disgusting. The Arizona Republic is quoted saying "This proposition is a dishonest attempt to nudge the state toward legalization of marijuana." Well let's say even if this WAS the purpose, is it really more important to keep some stoners from getting it legally than it is to allow suffering, dying people to get some relief?
IMO it all comes back to the fact that from the second we were born we've gotten "Drugs are bad" hammered into our heads constantly, and some people are either too dumb to see the truth or just don't even try to. |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | tl;dr |
shrapnel
11.03.10 | "I voted no just to piss all you people off."
watchu mean YOU PEOPLE? |
Dryden
11.03.10 | TMobotron doesnt smoke weed obvs by thoes many paragraphs |
AnotherBrick
11.03.10 | lol'd at emim |
shrapnel
11.03.10 | TMobotron doesnt smoke weed obvs by thoes many paragraphs[2] |
MasBarHigeuoris21
11.03.10 | TMobotron doesnt smoke weed obvs by thoes many paragraphs[3] |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | TMobotron.... thank you. that was a great post.
Emim, i sincerely hope you didn't. that would just be immature and spiteful.
|
TMobotron
11.03.10 | lmao |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | and thanks anewtypeofpunk i wish i could stick around and talk about it more but i have way too much homework i gotta get done |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | hey guys, i just want to say a few days ago i bought my first beautiful bong. it's a dark blue GEAR one, and it does the job so nicely. i'm going to go toke and be sad about how this prop is going to fail :(
|
MasBarHigeuoris21
11.03.10 | If it fails and Cali continues to go down the shitter then legalizing marijuana will be open to voting again one day |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | TMobotron doesnt smoke weed obvs by thoes many paragraphs[4]
LOL this made me laugh |
wyankeif1337
11.03.10 | when this officially fails, half of the people in my grade will miss school because they're stoned out of their fucking minds. |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | It officially didn't pass. Rofl @ stoners. |
wyankeif1337
11.03.10 | ah well. Next time. |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | I can't wait to see the Facebook posts, it's seriously going to be epic. |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | sigh.... stupid people. again propaganda and biased uneducated opinions wins over logical reasoning.
great. |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | ^butthurt |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | like fucking seriously good job california voters! now instead of taking the money citizens spend on weed and putting it into the states budget... the money will go to fucking mexicans who grow shitty weed and use the money to fund drug/cartel wars. great. what a win for democracy and freedom.
|
Jakeitwasaghost
11.03.10 | Precsription meds are misused in the same manner. People are going to get high. Arizona's proposition outcome will have nothing to do with the amount of weed people buy... other than the governement won't get any money from it. |
Jakeitwasaghost
11.03.10 | Says the virgin. |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | of course i'm butthurt lol. something i genuinely care about is illegal, when there are so many benefits to making it legal. the benefits outweigh the consequences too.
it's just such a stupid situation. for fucks sake 3 of the founding fathers grew CANNABIS. THEY ENDORSED IT. The declaration of independence is written on hemp paper for crying out loud!
fuck im gonna stop ranting, pointless now. i guess we can only hope that the next time this bill is written up, it actually passes. |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | Do you honestly think that legalizing weed will end drug cartels? |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | And for the record I didn't vote on 19 simply because I thought it was pointless. |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | nope, never said that. BUT it will at least stop the majority of their funding, which comes from the sale of illegal marijuana in the United States. |
wyankeif1337
11.03.10 | no, but it'll help.
And it;s sure to pass in the future: it's just a logical move. Matter of time. |
ZippaThaRippa
11.03.10 | Hahahahaha stoner angst |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | But what stops them from illegally selling it even if it would have passed? They sell it illegally now, what prevents them from following the same model? It's not like our government is just letting them into the U.S. right now anyways. |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | oh and for the record... not voting because it's pointless is a direct insult to everything your nation stands for.
i can see not voting for leaders, because in the end most things they do will be the same. but voting on specific laws and bills? not pointless. why? because you yourself are going to affect the direct outcome.
people regret voting for leaders all the time, but they rarely regret their choice on bills. whatever though, i'm going to go get baked and play some fable 3. |
bungy
11.03.10 | Steve Irwin riding a whale!
http://haringliwanag.pansitan.net/uploaded_images/steve%20irwin-713038.jpg |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | whether or not legalizing weed would end drug cartels doesn't matter (it wouldn't BTW) because it would definitely take away from them at least to some extent. Plus it would put money in the government's hands which is something needed right now. |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | Yea I failed to vote for one initiative that doesn't really matter much to me, that basically makes me the Taliban. |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | @reaganomics mostly the fact that it would be legal and anyone can grow it/sell it. companies like marlboro are sure outselling the tobacco lords. |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | well, the state would sell it themselves, and they would lower their prices to drive the illegal dealers out of business. then the state would take all profits from the direct sale of weed.
also the bill would make it legal to grow, so either you would buy it from the state (which most people would because growing is pretty complicated and it takes a lot of time) or you could grow it at home. both would end the illegal sale of the drug, and would stop the flow of money into the hands of people who are out there to hurt you. |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | Completely different scenario. |
shortone323
11.03.10 | I still haven't heard a single legitimate argument against Prop 19. I've heard plenty of arguments based on misinformation though. People should really educate themselves about this before they start making reefer madness-like arguments.
http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/misc/driving/s1p2.htm - Why all the concerns about stoned driving are stupid.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/05/25/AR2006052501729.html - I don't think I saw any arguments about the perceived health risks of marijuana in here, but I'll include this anyway.
http://boards.cannabis.com/medicinal-cannabis-health/161539-granny-storm-crows-list.html - I think people actually realize that marijuana does have valid medicinal benefits, but this list shows how many benefits it has. Which is a lot.
People need to realize that this vote is not about the marijuana plant. It's about marijuana prohibition. Regardless of what the outcome of Prop 19 is, people who enjoy smoking marijuana will continue to smoke it. People shouldn't be voting no on this because they don't want people to use marijuana (because that is an unrealistic outcomes), but because they like the current status of marijuana prohibition as compared to a state where it would be legal for adults to use responsibly. And if you like the current state of marijuana prohibition better, there's something wrong with you. |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | You realize illegal sellers could just lower their prices as well? It's much cheaper to run some shitty, underground organization with no regulations than a gigantic state governmental system. I've also failed to see how someone would "buy it from the state." California would regulate it, not sell it. Very different. |
Josh D.
11.03.10 | tl;dr |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | @reaganomics777, first of all, are you against marijuana because you're of christian faith? (the 777 in your name)
and second of all, what a silly comment. taliban? who said you were a terrorist? no one. you should just vote when it comes to laws. because chances are at some point they will affect you. |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | reaganomics, most people are gonna want to be able to walk into a convenience store and just buy weed, not find a drug dealer. i mean you could make this argument about any product really. |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | I'm a deist, not a Christian. My name is supposed to be comical. I'm conservative, but I'm strictly non-religious and socially moderate. I'm not against Prop 19, I just don't buy the argument that it will help stop the flow of illegal drugs from foreign cartels into CA. The reason I didn't vote for it is A) It's regulated on the local level, meaning that your everyday city or town could simply tax it to shit, or not enforce it all, and B) It's ultimately an issue for the Federal Government. If the prop passed and the FDA dgaf'd, they would crack down on prop 19 just as they did dispensaries a few years ago. |
ZippaThaRippa
11.03.10 | I agree with Josh on the issue that it would bother me immensely if people were smoking weed in public. |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | @shortone323
another great post. wow. great articles man, i'm going to read them all thoroughly. |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | @ZippaThaRippa really? it would bother you? that's sad. it's just smoking a plant. it's the same as smoking a cigarette basically... |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | also reaganomics if weed was sold in a store, even if it was way cheaper from drug dealers, there surely would be some people buying it from the store supporting legal growers and thus taking away from drug lords, it's essentially doing the same thing but on a smaller scale which would be a less important change but just as sensible to support. |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | Dude, weed smells awful. |
ZippaThaRippa
11.03.10 | It bothers me when people smoke around me too, the smell is awful and I could do without inhaling all that shit. Also, kissing a stoner is frankly the worst thing ever. Period. |
ZippaThaRippa
11.03.10 | I have no problem with people getting stoned in the comfort and privacy of their own homes but I rue the day that people are walking around town buzzed and blowing dope smoke everywhere; |
ZippaThaRippa
11.03.10 | And also sucks. Your argument appears to be, we already have shit so let's just put more shit on top of that shit because it might as well get shittier. |
ZippaThaRippa
11.03.10 | pretty much |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | pretty sure anyone who supports the legalization wouldn't complain about a law against smoking it in public at this point. Not that that changes the fact that it would happen if 19 was passed, im js. |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | You probably wouldn't have seen it around in public a lot, except in places with a high concentration of young people such as colleges, club scenes, music scenes etc. Basically places where people already do it out in the open. |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | true... for me at least its the kind of thing id want to do when i was at home anyways |
shortone323
11.03.10 | Fuck. I was on the wrong side of this the whole time. Who cares about the people who live completely normal lives, use marijuana responsibly, and then get screwed over by the current system of laws for absolutely no reason? You know what, I'm fine with college students losing financial/federal aid because god damn if some obnoxious fuckers are going to smoke some weed in public and slightly irritate me.
Do guys realize what you're fucking supporting when you are voting against marijuana legalization? Read this list of drug war victims (http://www.drugwarrant.com/articles/drug-war-victim/) and come back and tell me that you're fine with the status quo. |
ZippaThaRippa
11.03.10 | I would vote yes on a bill that allowed it inside private residences. |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | shortone323, I hate to do this to you bud...but u mad. |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | Oh, and the drug war thing has already been discussed to great lengths. It wouldn't do shit. |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | I'm much more pissed that prop 23 in CA failed. |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | reaganomics you havent provided any proof that legalizing it "wouldn't do shit" |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | Not to beg the question, but has there been any proof put forward that states the opposite. As of right now there isn't really a 'truth' to the problem at hand, it's all theoretical. Calling someone out for deductive reasoning - which, by the way, is actually quite helpful in determining the outcome of circumstances - is pretty foolish. |
JWT155
11.03.10 | I have no problem with an honest philosophical debate over whether legalizing an illegal substance is right or wrong but to simply say something can be taxed and it'll make us a profit so we should legalize isn't acceptable. |
shortone323
11.03.10 | My point is not about the damage that Prop 19 would do to the incomes of the cartels, but about the damage that the police do to citizens in the enforcement of marijuana laws. Did you even read that link? People have their homes raided by swat teams over a few grams of a harmless plant. U.S. citizens have been killed by police for no other reason than they happened to possess a few grams of a mostly harmless substance.
Watch this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RbwSwvUaRqc
If you're against Prop 19, you're supporting this, even if it is indirectly. |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | right but ive responded to a lot of what you've stated which went unanswered. and im not saying that there is proof that it would lessen the drug war, but you're the one making the claim about what the outcome would be. Personally I think the only reason drug dealers even have a market to sell to is because it's illegal. I don't think they're good businessmen, good at growing, careful with their product. I think the only thing they have going for them in the drug market is the fact that they are okay with breaking the law. Once it's legal there's gonna be plenty of competition from people who know how to market their weed, grow better weed, and reach a wider audience.
I'm not saying that's completely correct or anything, but I don't think you can make a final claim that it wouldn't do shit because there is plenty that points to the contrary. |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | No, but as I said before I don't really have a problem with 19 in general, just that particular argument of it, because it really is unfair. |
shortone323
11.03.10 | JWT155 - That's one argument in a series of arguments that support the legilization of marijuana. We need to legalize it because the prohibition of marijuana does more harm than the actual drug does. This exact same thing happened with the prohibition of alcohol after people realized that the temperance movement did more harm than good.
Reganomics - It can't hurt. And again, that is but one of the arguments in favor of marijuana legalization. |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | and JWT if you're referring to any of my posts know that you only caught part of my argument which was with reaganomics (BTW reaganomics dont take any of my posts harshly, if they sound that way they're not meant to be). my first post, along with plenty of other posters, states plenty of reasons why it should be legal besides just that. |
JWT155
11.03.10 | Nah, I was just generalizing. I still don't think it would work because if it was legalized Weed would
be dealt with straight through the government, just like how in PA hard liquor is only sold at the
state store. We all know how great of a job the government is at running shit and how there's like
never any corruption...
And shortstone, like I said I have absolutely no problem with a legit debate over it. Personally, I
smoke occasionally and attending one of the nations largest party schools I first hand know for a fact
that alcohol is far more destructive then weed will ever be. |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | right reaganomics and im happy to know that, i wasn't arguing your stance on prop 19 or anything, just more your statement "Oh, and the drug war thing has already been discussed to great lengths. It wouldn't do shit." but im not the most knowledgeable person on the subject anyways. |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | well there would probably never be as much corruption as there is now if it was completely government run |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | In response to the post before you're last one: the problem doesn't arrive when one simply goes to a market and legally buys some weed, it comes from the seller's source. How is our government supposed to regulate who buys and sells legally and who does not? How are they supposed to know where exactly every joiny or hashbrownie is coming from? It's impossible, the cartels would sneak their way in some how. And I realize that "wouldn't do shit" was a bit of a stretch, that's just how I act sometimes. |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | ^joint* (Sorry, forgot about the edit button) |
shortone323
11.03.10 | JWT155 - I don't definitively know if marijuana legalization would work (although drug use statistics in the Netherlands and Portugal might have something to say about that), but I do know that the current system doesn't work at all. Sticking with the same failed drug policies year after year and expecting a different result in the future is the height of stupidity. |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | i think that if weed was legalized in california cartel would target the other 49 states, but if weed was legalized nationwide cartel might be able to sneak their product in but they wouldn't be able to compete with a legitimate company the size of some of the big tobacco companies today. |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | try this andcas
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MorR04iLtMw |
DeafMetal
11.03.10 | Maybe somebody has already answered this above. I absolutely support smoking herb, but how much money would the government/states make on said revenue if people are growing it themselves and still buying from dealers? |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | im not saying that videos better or anything, but id already seen the zach thing and i love that guys laugh. but idk whos to say it was real weed on the show. its definitely funny though. |
tapitforever
11.03.10 | it will cause people to die more from negligent accidents, to be less successful, will increase cancer rates, and honestly if you're having trouble getting weed now then you sir, fail
weed impairs you. thats all there is to it. |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | I think it was around 14 Billion. I've seen some supporters claiming it will give as much as 23B, but that seems a little unrealistic to me. |
DeafMetal
11.03.10 | I'm going to go pack a bowl right now. Later fellas.
Also, Dopesmoker slays. |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | @tapit:
http://www.alternet.org/drugs/142271/smoking_marijuana_does_not_cause_lung_cancer/
and its never been about having trouble getting weed now, in fact that should be an argument for its legalization |
tapitforever
11.03.10 | fine, even then, what about the whole impaired thing. Negligent driving accidents will undoubtedly increase, and much of the stupid injuries i've caused myself over the past couple years have been while stoned. there will be substantial adverse effects post-legalization. |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | driving high would still be illegal |
tapitforever
11.03.10 | im not necessarily against it, because from about 3 years ago up until the past few months ive been a regular stoner, smoking every other day, etc. im mostly just trying to entertain both sides of the coin.
also, increased drug use, including weed, has a decent correlation to an increased prevalence of psychological disorders too. |
tapitforever
11.03.10 | "driving high would still be illegal"
yet people still do it. it obviously doesn't impair you as much as alcohol does behind the wheel, but there will be more "legally" impaired drivers on the road. |
tapitforever
11.03.10 | and what about the myriad of other stupid shit that people get into while stoned? driving regulations are but the tip of the iceberg. |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | im not gonna claim there are no adverse affects of weed or that there's no negative side to its legalization, but the pros far outweigh the cons from where im standing |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | tapit, what else is there?
personally i think that a large portion of people who would pick up marijuana after its legalization would be replacing alcohol with it, making them MORE safe on the road.
but overall i do agree there would probably be more driving accidents because of it. But I don't think the numbers would be very big. |
tapitforever
11.03.10 | "But I don't think the numbers would be very big."
this. its a good point and it is probably true, but imo the biggest concern for the government is maximizing the population's welfare. if you try to quantify the financial repercussions of just one life, you'll find the opportunity cost of losing a potentially-productive individual to a negligible accident like this staggering. j/s |
tapitforever
11.03.10 | idk, i just think that people aren't concerned enough with the increased casualty rate that could potentially result from it. productivity, thats another issue. and alcohol and weed are not substitutes of each other. its not an either or type thing, as in, "oh hey, weed's legal now, ill just quit drinking and switch over to that!" if anything, they complement each other and we could potentially see an increase in the consumption of alcohol to go along with it. |
Winsomniac
11.03.10 | ilu, sputanik. |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | I think that the people of California as a whole agree with you. It's not necessarily a bad thing for marijuana smokers that Prop 19 didn't pass. Like prop 8 it will be reviewed, improved upon, and most likely put back on the ballot for 2012. The issues with the prop can only lessen from here. |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | yeah i agree tapit, but its not just money vs. life. theres the whole argument about how easily available it is to underage people, and how it encourages involvement in a criminal environment. And how it would affect drug cartel, though as me and reaganomics know the affects are up for debate.
But the thing is weeds available to basically anyone who wants it in California, the medical marijuana thing is a joke. The only people who want to use it that don't are people who don't want to break the law, or people who would be interested in trying it but not enough to break the law/go through all the effort of getting a medical card. I don't see a lot of these people lighting up a joint and then going for a drive. It's impossible to predict the outcome for driving accidents.
And to go even further legal marijuana will also cause cops to be more on the lookout for stoned drivers. Here in AZ if you get pulled over stoned you have a pretty good chance of getting off with nothing, but if you're drunk, cops are always looking for that. Cops ask, "have you been drinking anything tonight?" not "have you been smoking anything tonight". This might change that. |
tapitforever
11.03.10 | im not opposed to the eventual legalization of marijuana. i just don't think we've ironed out all the confounding variables associated with it yet. especially the 25 sqfoot growspace for each resident. are you fucking kidding me? i would never purchase weed again, especially not from the gov't. |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | haha i honestly thought the fact that you were limited at all was weird. Like, Hey you can grow it, but we're still scared if its a lot.
But yeah 25 sq ft is plenty anyways, just thought it was weird. But you can grow tobacco too, people still buy it in stores. |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | OK reaganomics. How does this make you feel. Thousands of people have been sent to jail for possession of sometimes a joint. Not always obviously, but it has happened. Now if CA were to vote yes, then other states would follow faster, and less people would have a PERMANENT record keeping them from getting jobs and contributing to society. Now those people are just going to cycle through the legal system, thus causing the state to pay more legal fees and such. Or they will just become less of what their potential promised, because of the senseless prohibition on marijuana. |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | @tapit, although interesting when you play the devil's advocate in threads such as this... I hate to admit it's a tad annoying when I realize you weren't 100% serious. js.
also, there have been a ton of successful people who smoke pot, and as a stoner myself, i can honestly say that my ambition nor drive is inhibited or affected negatively in any form by smoking up. |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | Less than 1% of California's prisoners are in jail for pot related crimes. |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | @andcas well ok i guess i'm not familiar with that 100%, but i do however know that even with a misdemeanour when traveling is a bitch. |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | @reaganomics again, for like the fifth time, i really wanted this to be legalized because it will speed up the global process, or at least in north america. i couldn't give 2 shits about california because i live in canada. i still support their movement though. i wish i lived there... |
Heysatan
11.03.10 | '' Dude, weed smells awful. "
wtf man the smell is beautiful. |
tapitforever
11.03.10 | i am opposed to it...for now. |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | can we just all agree vote yes on whatever prop it is next time? :) |
tapitforever
11.03.10 | also, weed is a fucking heavenly smell so whoever said it isn't should take a bath with a toaster |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | I had no idea I ever disputed that idea. I was just refuting the other argument you came up with. (Anewtypeofpunk) |
reaganomics777
11.03.10 | Weed smells like fucking shit if you don't smoke. |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | @andcas no, when going through customs with the united states, they're very anal about foreign visitors with drug
related crimes no matter the severity of it. like a friend of mine from canada has a possesion charge of like 1 gram or
whatever it would be and he cant go to the states... ever |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | nah, even when i didn't smoke i still liked the smell. smells sweet ish. MUCH better then cigarette smoke or cigar smoke. |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | that would be interesting to know indeed
|
Butkuiss
11.03.10 | I would provide arguments, but I think my good friend Mr. Bill Hicks has already done that more than thoroughly.
Case. Fucking. Closed. |
MindTrain
11.03.10 | why are you so mad
now you can still be a secret stoner and not get the shit taxed out of you. it's good for stoners |
Spec
11.03.10 | Prop 19 was very poorly written. A lot of people in favour of legalizing pot still voted no. It's a shame it was so flawed or we might have been on the way to ending this.
Good thing I live in Canada, I think i'll go smoke a bowl right now. |
Powerban
11.03.10 | you guys are retarded, weed is cheap and easy to get anyway. get a job if you can't afford it you lazy fucks.
stupid complaining motherfuckers. |
shortone323
11.03.10 | Why do most of the arguments presented against the legalization of marijuana also work as arguments against alcohol? Like lol people are complaining about stoned driving (which already happens, and likely won't increase if marijuana is passed) when people drive drunk all the time. The number of people killed by stone drivers is so minuscule when compared to the number of people killed by drunk drivers. There seems to be a double standard with a lot of people here, and double standards are always bullshit.
So, people against 19, tell me why Alcohol should remain legal and Marijuana should remain illegal. |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | @special3ff3cts that was exactly my stance last night hahah, fuck it, smoke a bowl in canada :)
although the bill was poorly written, it still would've been better if it passed... fuck tho it didn't whatever. life goes on, everyone who smoked weed will still smoke weed. |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.03.10 | in all honesty, alcohol SHOULD be illegal. it's pretty bad, a ton of deaths are associated with it each year. you have drunk driving, alcoholism, addiction, then you got the medical problems associated with too much drinking, like liver problems etc.
weed? you lower your lung capacity, but if you stop, in a month your lungs will heal up to about 94%. that's about it, weed doesn't cause cancer, and it certainly doesn't cause many accidents on the highway.
alcohol although awesome, is abused way more than marijuana. and it's for sure more dangerous. |
TMobotron
11.03.10 | tobaccos worse than both IMO... although at least the victim is usually the user, i dont like that alcohol causes drunk driving deaths for people who were sober victims.
and: "you guys are retarded, weed is cheap and easy to get anyway. get a job if you can't afford it you lazy fucks.
stupid complaining motherfuckers."
Don't be ignorant, no one in here was complaining about the price or availability of weed. People don't want to legalize marijuana so that it's cheaper, they want to legalize it so that its fucking legal, and they don't have to be concerned about smoking a relatively harmless plant. I could go through the whole list of beneficial reasons but you could just read just about any post in here. |
SteelErectedb4you8er
11.03.10 | Don't forget legalizing marijuana would be a good way to stimulate the economy. Maybe not for illegal farmers, traffickers, sellers, but overall, it would be beneficial to our country. |
AnotherBrick
11.03.10 | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RZYZ2s1OuZw |
Counterfeit
11.03.10 | lazyz |
Torii
11.03.10 | Too late teh heh |
climactic
11.03.10 | guy who discovered DNA was on lsd at the time js |
DeafMetal
11.03.10 | It won't matter if it gets approved in the 2012 election, the world's ending remember? |
combustion07
11.03.10 | "Dude, weed smells awful"
your nose is broke |
Uranium
11.04.10 | "guy who discovered DNA was on lsd at the time"
highly doubt that statement is anywhere near valid
|
shortone323
11.04.10 | Francis Crick didn't "discover DNA" so much as come up with double helix structure, but he was on lsd when he did it. http://www.hallucinogens.com/lsd/francis-crick.html
And Doc Ellis threw a no hitter on LSD, which might actually be more impressive than coming up with the double helix. |
Baphomet
11.04.10 | Hey look! Uranium is still making ignorant statements! |
DeafMetal
11.04.10 | Uranius. |
Uranium
11.04.10 | good thing i'm high or else i'd be so mad right now |
DeafMetal
11.04.10 | I was blazed when I typed that. No hard feelings chief. |
ANewTypeOfPunk
11.05.10 | i luv u guys^ |
Ire
11.05.10 | lets legalize gay
oh wait those god damned democrats already did that |
Baphomet
11.05.10 | You know you want some man-on-man lovin', ire |
ConsiderPhlebas
11.05.10 | "in all honesty, alcohol SHOULD be illegal. it's pretty bad, a ton of deaths are associated with it each year. you have drunk driving, alcoholism, addiction, then you got the medical problems associated with too much drinking, like liver problems etc."
Poor diet kills more people than alcohol; just because something can cause problems doesn't mean it should be deemed immoral or unlawful. The prohibition of weed, or indeed any drug, is as pointless as the prohibition of alcohol was in the US near the start of the 20th century - it doesn't stop people using, over-using or abusing drugs, it just creates criminals. It always falls into people either claiming that "drugs are great, look at all the awesome music that came out of it!" or "drugs are bad, look at all the crime it causes" but this totally misses the point. The only way to erase crime would be to erase natural human urges, the destructive aspects that make up a significant part of human psychology. This is overwhelmingly the cause of crime in every society that has ever existed on earth, and since the only way to eradicate it would be the total extinction of the species, maybe it'd be better if we found more progressive ways of dealing with the problem, instead of jumping on tabloid bandwagons and medieval, far-right wing fearmongering. |
Enotron
11.05.10 | governments shouldn't tell people what they should and should not be doing with their own bodies
/discussion |
