TheSpirit: Your Relationship w/Music

TheSpirit 09.20.21	how do you ya'll feel about this?
zakalwe 09.20.21	Streaming, and all the bullshit that surrounds the entire scene now with its appeasers, Instagrammers and total morons has yielded the death blow. Music has become commodity. Fucking useless.
TheSpirit 09.20.21	i absolutely agree
Josh D. 09.20.21	I've never regularly used a streaming service, so idk
JohnnyoftheWell 09.20.21	yeah agreed with this, 2 and 4 are the word there's sometimes something encouraging about realising you don't need to spend too much time with most records, and what that does to the rate you can explore, but it sure as hell comes at a cost tbh idk if streaming necessarily made music any more or less of a commodity than it was through the golden age of piracy; if it's expendable/disposable, it's ultimately something you do to yourself either way (and boi do we)
zakalwe 09.20.21	It became the norm. The accepted way to ‘consume’ and the brainless fuckers lapped it up because substance and depth is just a waste of time that serves no purpose.
fogza 09.20.21	I feel you on chasing stuff and short attention span, I have to discipline myself on how I listen to music and I don't always get it right. However, on the flipside it does allow you to delve more deeply into an artist then I normally would. Like when you have to make decisions based on cost, I couldn't justify buying more than maybe two albums from, say, the Rolling Stones, like I'd buy a comp. I remember when I was getting into Bowie I bought a greatest hits and the album that seemed to be generally considered the best (Low). With streaming I could easily go through his discog without having to source the records and I realised that for me, I should never have bought that record, as it wasn't the right one to focus on for me.
MO 09.20.21	yea with the advent of all these new technologies for streaming and consuming music I find myself getting pulled more and more towards physical albums. I recently inherited a great 70's record player and it's amazing to hear how much better records sound I just find with streaming you listen then almost just throw it away, pretty sad really
sometimes 09.20.21	"How do you feel streaming music has impacted the way to ingest/digest music? " it's made it so that almost all music ever made is pretty much available at your fingertips at your demand. Install bandcamp/spotify or whatever your preferred streaming setup on your phone and all the music is available at all times in your pocket when you go out (please use headphones in public). definitely a completely different era as compared to pre-streaming. Music is more than ever tightly knit and integrated into our lives even outside of streaming (films and tv, stores in the public etc etc) "Do you feel as connected the music you consume as you did when tapes/CDs were still the standard?" err yes and no. difficult to answer and highly context dependent as to what i am doing/my particular circumstances at the time and also what i am listening to. My all time favourites will always remain. My intimate connection will never end with them. however anything less than that has attained a certain "disposable-ness" yea, if you will. it's not so much that it is more of a commodity now as it was always a commodity (ever heard of a VINYL record eh zak ? fucking pillock), but rather the ease and speed of access we have to it nowadays can instill a sense of oversaturation and almost a "been there, done that" feeling, no matter how radically novel or different the new music we listen to is i think great list yo !
JesperL 09.20.21	tbf i feel much more connected to music now than when i just bought cds. there's so much more to explore, there are so many more ways and opportunities to support small artists, i don't have to force myself to like simple plan records anymore after i bought them bc a friend said they were a good band, etc. i reckon it kinda comes down to how the iNdiViDuAL experiences the whole short attention span thing, for me it's a useful tool to sift through the bad and get to the good (which i will then devote all my attention to). but then again idfk i'm a fuckin zoomer, stopped exclusively listening to physical albums when i was like 13 so maybe i just feel more connected to music bc i have a semi functional brain rn
fogza 09.20.21	I still think the benefits of streaming for the listener outweigh the negatives. It's probably terrible for artists though.
Supercoolguy64 09.20.21	I mostly use my streaming service in the car (since it doesn’t have a CD player) and it’s useful for when I don’t have a physical copy of an album. I try to listen to albums all the way through and tbh I feel like it hasn’t made a personal impact on the way I consume albums. As a kid I would skip songs I didn’t like or replay favorite ones all the time and I still buy physical and digital copies frequently (though I try to not do so since it gets expensive). I think in the end it depends on generation and the individual, kids who didn’t grow up having to save up for CD walk men’s and individual albums don’t get why it’s a big deal to sit through a whole record as they had the luxury of being able to listen to what song they want growing up.
DoofDoof 09.20.21	I used to read all lyrics multiple times...now I never do. Physical medium and only buying 2-5 albums a month you are just so much more likely to read the lyrics/check the album art. Sure, great lyrics shine through, but sometimes you bond deeper reading all the lyrics. Not sure if it's a streaming thing or just a kid/adult thing.
fogza 09.20.21	"Not sure if it's a streaming thing or just a kid/adult thing." Great point, I do think age has lots to do with it, I find it way harder to bond with an album now, and I don't think it's just because of streaming. Like I found from the 90's to 2010 I got majorly excited by new records without even trying, and then it sort of stopped being as easy to do so. Maybe streaming is a small part of it, but I think I just got old.
DoofDoof 09.20.21	I don't worry about being too jaded and/or overwhelmed with music now. If a 9 or 10 out of 10 album comes out I'm just as I used to be - I'll spin it 20 times within a week, 40 times within a couple of months. Those 5% best albums still take over my life for a while. It's just that if you bought a 6-8 out of 10 album back in the day then that album you'd also give that many listens to due to the commitment and hope lol. Now you just go 'next!' after a few spins (at most) and move on. I'll usually still return later but it'll never get that level of attention like back in the day. Of course some became growers, others just got seeped in inexplainable nostalgia. Less of that now.
Aerisavion 09.20.21	"I know that being a music "journalist" (using that term loosely) has not helped this. There's always that unsaid feeling of a)not wanting to miss out on what's "hot' and b)wanting to be the one to "break" that next new hot thing." This is honestly the exact reason I got out of the industry, tbh. Freelanced as a music journalist for 2-3 years and had some amazing opportunities, but the endless churn of 'review this, news item that review this, news item that' killed a lot of the passion. Plus if I'm honest, the pay isn't great unless you're fulltime for an established name.
Calc 09.20.21	I never stream music but I felt a little of what aeris is talking about in terms of how writing about music influenced how I listened to it. I didn't like it.
DDDeftoneDDD 09.20.21	I only listen to full albums
DoofDoof 09.20.21	'I only listen to full albums' pretty much same for me, can't shake all the old ways
Sowing 09.20.21	I feel this a lot. I'm in an eternal struggle to give records the time they deserve. The urge to see what's new is just too seductive though; even when I'm head over heels for an album I cannot resist peeking at the new slate of LPs each week and "skimming" them to see which would be my thing. On the other hand, the extent of my musical interest is at least 10 times what it used to be thanks to having so much music at my fingertips. It's very much a depth vs breadth tradeoff; I'm not certain which is better tbh because the grass is always greener. If we reverted to 2005, being used to streaming as I am now, I might hate it.
Pikazilla 09.20.21	I only listen to full albums too. Mainly buy digital now, because space is finite. Will be building a house next year and gonna make a special music room with good acoustics and shit. Will be an interesting experience.
SmallMess 09.20.21	My interest in music first started showing somewhere around 2000, so I've always preferred mp3's to anything else - you get something you can own and that does not require much maintenance. Nowadays I download stuff by people who have a lot of money and buy stuff by those who don't on Bandcamp, and I never gave a damn about streaming. In terms of the big picture, the only main difference is that the pile that you shovel in order to get to the good stuff got much bigger, but nowadays I have enough knowledge of my own preferences to quickly tell if I'm going to like a band/record or not. Occasionally there's an odd album that makes me go "goddamn I hate it, now let's hear it again" where something new catches you off-guard, and it's always a great feeling, but for the most part it's more like "I know exactly what I want, the rest can go down the drain". Mostly I'm just waiting for those 90's revival acts to grow a personality of their own, that's where the fun's gonna start for me.
DDDeftoneDDD 09.20.21	@Pika build one for me from a listener perspective streaming is fuckin awesome, what yall wining about?
TheSpirit 09.20.21	read the thread and find out!
DoofDoof 09.20.21	'If we reverted to 2005, being used to streaming as I am now, I might hate it.' I'd be poorer for sure
Kompys2000 09.20.21	Bandcamp is the light bandcamp is the truth, streaming offers unparalleled convenience but the apparatus is not engineered around the inherent preciousness of art. the only way out is forward!
Hyperion1001 09.20.21	the over abundance of media coupled with instant access to entire catalogues via streaming has absolutely degraded the value of media across the entire digital ecosystem. i find that nearly 95% of new digital media I consume is ultimately disposable. the tools for creating professional level media are very easily accessible even to those without much disposable income, which means that the barriers to creating have been massively reduced. for creativity’s sake, this is a wonderful thing, because now creative mediums aren’t exclusively for the upper class. however, this has a negative consequence: media over saturation. being creative in a vacuum is fine but everyone releasing everything all of the time means it’s increasingly difficult to find new creations that aren’t simple reinterpretations of better creations that already exist. it also depersonalizes the entire experience because we spend so much time wading through all the chaff that the wheat becomes less and less apparent as time goes by. if the ratio of new music I listen to versus new music I relisten to was like 2:10 before streaming, it’s something like 2:30 now, because there just so much average, disposable, never should have been shared gunk clogging up all the information pathways that it’s becoming increasingly difficult to find valuable works. the only way I’ve found to combat this new reality is to actively disregard streaming as a tool for finding new music. the algorithm always pales in comparison to human interaction. Spotify is just a mobile library for tunes I already like. anything new I buy so I spend time with it.
Nerdurosis 09.20.21	all music fucking sucks
Hyperion1001 09.20.21	plus fuck Spotify, pay artists
alamo 09.20.21	My cousin in Trinidad won’t listen to music cuz his friend did it & became impotent. His testicles became swollen. His friend was weeks away from getting married, now the girl called off the wedding. So just pray on it & make sure you’re comfortable with ur decision, not bullied
luci 09.20.21	Never signed up for a streaming site for the abundant reasons above. I listen to mostly electronic and rely on direct downloads to keep up with new releases and discover old ones. I find the ritual of searching for and acquiring downloads creates a pleasing 'investment' in the listen, far more than clicking through a streaming app. I also purchase my favorites on Bandcamp, by far the best platform for supporting artists. For other genres, YouTube tends to do the trick. Pretty satisfied with my current process.
TheSpirit 09.20.21	I agree Hyp… Bandcamp all the way. I feel it’s helped me reestablish more healthy listening pattens in the same way buying records as a kid did. I purchase something and I want to get my money’s worth by listening to it until it makes me physically ill haha
DDDeftoneDDD 09.20.21	"read the thread and find out!" I read.it and I m telling you, yall crying with a full belly.
CottonSalad 09.20.21	I agree with a lot of the stuff said here - so I won't rehash... but something to note, there are definitely projects that "address" this seeming point of stress/uselessness...: Free improv like Anthony Braxton releasing a 12 hour disc a few months ago, Autechre dropping a 5 hour, then an 8 hour album, THEN an obscene amount of live sets... I totally have a nostalgia for learning every word to a Kalmah record like it's a personal mythology (that probably has to do with age, said above - and that Kalmah came to mind possibly explains whats wrong with me...), but the question can definitely be "what is music good for" otherwise...since our modes of existing around it are tending in new/different directions. Not even gonna re-read that...if it's nonsense, cool lol
TheSpirit 09.20.21	Who's crying? People are just making observations about how they feel about music -- something important to them. If you don't understand or relate that's fine lol. Nobody is pretended this is a first world problem. Just talking about music on a music website.
MillionDead 09.20.21	Physical media will never die but there’s a cost barrier there, where streaming is cheap and free in some cases. I 100% think that not cherishing the music you hear and not critically listening to it just because you’re streaming it is a personal choice. Just because music is more disposable to the masses doesn’t mean it has to be more disposable to you.
TheSpirit 09.20.21	@Million - I 100% agree. I think myself and others who feel similarly are just being open about what has caused us to have this more jaded perspective when it comes to how we consume what we listen to.
TheSpirit 09.20.21	I also think a big point of difference between some people and others here, is people who just listen to music vs. people who want to write about it. I LOVE to write about music. But the field is also competitive which has led to some unhealthy listening habits that kind of perpetuate themselves.
ArsMoriendi 09.20.21	I still use my iTunes library most of the time and only stream for quick lookups for stuff not in my library.
Sunnyvale 09.20.21	Great list idea and interesting thread! I would say 80% of my average listening is full albums, start to finish, and in recent years with easy access to streaming I've been listening to a lot more different albums at any given time, meaning it's rare for me to devote nearly as much time to a single record as I used to. As such, it's pretty uncommon these days for me to solely obsessed with a single artist, etc. the way I often used to be. However, I think this has more to do with me getting older and more familiar with music than I used to be, rather than streaming, per se. I got into music quite late (late high school, early college) and I think earlier on it was easy to fall in love with particular albums both due to the time in my life and everything being "new and wonderful".
Supercoolguy64 09.20.21	I was thinking about the idea of buying music as means to force yourself to pay more attention to it like the olden days of yore but then it made me think about impulse buying music and how it got worse for me after bandcamp Friday’s became a thing, like there’s stuff I’ve bought before covid that I still listen to regularly and then after they were introduced I’ve bought a shit ton of records that I don’t pay as much attention to because I saw it more of a donation thing. Not that I regret it, more music for me and more money for my favorite bands and labels, but another curious thought. Like is it truly any different to buy music I neglect than to add a bands discog to my Apple Music library when I only ever go back to one or maybe two of their albums?
DDDeftoneDDD 09.20.21	Obs Eeeer Vations Go buy cd s and leave us be freaks
Keyblade 09.20.21	pretty much all my listening is to various playlist I or others have created and my tastes in general trend towards more easily digestible stuff. idk if it's a result of streaming or just my own listening habits changing as I got older. probably both tbh
porcupinetheater 09.20.21	Check my daily last.fm avg play stats if you dont think I be bumpin
Kompys2000 09.20.21	People who fetishize physical media are a little weird but not nearly as weird as people who are like "ew gross CDs go fuck yourself grandma"
TheSpirit 09.20.21	I lost my CD case a few years ago and I’m still very bitter about it even though vinyl is now my preferred medium for physical media
Coast 09.20.21	Growing up with a trickle of new CDs and taping songs off the radio onto cassettes, streaming is cheap, instant and boundless. Miss that intimacy with albums and now can barely recall album names, let alone songs. The benefits of instant vast access wins out.
Egarran 09.20.21	Can't complain about having all music available for free. I do miss feeling really attached to an album - the whole process of reading reviews, deciding what I wanted to buy, go buying it at the record store, not listening to anything else for weeks and becoming slightly obsessed - but like yall said, this might just be an age thing.
Muzz79 09.20.21	Interesting discussion. I grew up on tapes then cds then apple music when that started. I’ve still got all my tapes, cds and even all my old metal mags ffs ! For me apple music is the greatest. I can find the most obscure metal albums on here whereas in the past it was a real struggle. I bought so many cds on a hunch with no guarantee that I’d like them. These days I buy the ones I really like on Bandcamp
Trebor. 09.21.21	I still don't stream music I listen too way less new music since kingdomleaks shut down and I just don't have the energy to keep up with downloading shit anymore
Deez 09.21.21	I stopped buying physicals for a long time due to travelling for many years etc but started to buy Vinyl again last year has been a god send and made me realise I had a very disposable attitude with music for a while. Streaming has many pros, Many. But for me its been great to kind of invest more of myself with music again in a more tangible form. Rather than just d/l and deleting after one listen if I dont like. Or just d'led an unlistenable amount of shit.
Snake. 09.21.21	i'm early gen z so the CD collection/itunes era of music consumption was already starting to wane in my formative years but ever since downloading spotify i've been able to store all the music i enjoy (unlike apple music) i will admit right now most of my ratings are for albums that i spun once maybe twice back in high school upon listening to on youtube and just never came back to but shuffling spotify reintroduces me to those albums and allows me to escape from the song/artist that's been stuck in my head for weeks/months/years on end
Satellite 09.21.21	i basically just listen to my liked songs on shuffle on spotify and my records when i'm home at this point.
trilo 09.21.21	i think streaming has made new albums a little more transient for me, but i think getting older has had a bigger effect tbh. as a software dev i find it almost impossible to get work done w/ music on, and when i get off work i have other priorities. given that, most music isn't worth my time other than the initial spin or two. the best ones get more spins and my absolute favorites i'll jam often & buy the record for collection sake. also agreed w/ earlier post that most rec algorithms are worse than personally curating. i consistently find better stuff sifting through blogs, following good labels & going on here than going off rec engines.
Snake. 09.21.21	yeah i never play those daily mixes bc the genre labeling on spotify is either incomplete or totally inaccurate i usually find stuff like oathbreaker and suicide silence in the same playlist lmao
Gwyn. 09.21.21	I feel kinda lucky how, despite the fact that I've essentially never really had a phase where I was entirely basing my listening experience on physical music (because when that was still the norm, I was a child more interested in video games and anime and eating pizza than music), my listening habits still center pretty heavily around albums and I've not felt the total commodification of music as of yet, and I honestly kinda doubt I will because I have always had a kind of collector spirit and I do still buy physical media whenever I can. Which, is not often, so maybe when it becomes the norm for me when I have more money and free time it will start to feel that way, but at the moment I feel pretty good.
Gwyn. 09.21.21	Also, kinda helps that I've actually never used streaming services, because they're not available in my country. Even if they were though, I would still prefer downloading things because the internet here is crap for the most part, goes off all th etime, and I just prefer feeling an actual sense of ownership, even if it's in the form of a bunch of pixels on a screen. THe only times I'd willingly use a streaming service over the ability to download music would be purely out of convenience or because what I want somehow cannot be found anywhere else.
Captain Civic 09.21.21	Disposable is a perfect word for it. The Internet cheapens a lot of things, I find. I use streaming services (Spotify) but only when they have those 3 months for the price of 1 deals, because I just don't use it enough. I do have it because it lets me check out new music without having to purchase it, but if I like something enough, I'll buy it digitally. I don't really miss CDs that much but I do like to 'own' my music, not 'rent' it.
Koris 09.21.21	I definitely agree with the "blessing and a curse" thing. When I was younger and still bought CDs on the regular (though I still buy them from time to time), it was during a time when I had much more limited funds, so I had to cherish the records I bought because I had no other choice. When I look back at my most played music of the last 5 years on Spotify, there's definitely much less new music on there than there used to be; a lot of that comes from the fact that I was jamming the hell out of the classics I'd already worn out instead of discovering new albums and really giving them the time to sink in. But this year, I've gotten a lot better about that (mostly because my 2020 Top Songs list almost entirely consisted of 70s music and I didn't want to repeat that for 2021). A lot of the new stuff I've reviewed this year is still in my rotation and I've even bought several of the records physically as well - the new Carnifex, Mare Cognitum, Pupil Slicer, and Julien Baker immediately come to mind.
MetalMarcJK 09.21.21	Music helps me navigate inner space, to make sense of what’s inside and how to cope with the outside world. Music is essential to me. It’s life.
Parallels 09.21.21	I have never once used or signed up for a streaming service, lol. Grose. I worked in bookstores with massive used cd sections that I was able to "check out" like a library, so I got to rip a lot of songs back in the day. Still, that's what I did previously. I dont really see the need for physical media since downloading a file is easier and you can then record it how you like.
Sharenge 09.21.21	never got into streaming music... occasionally I might use YouTube or Bandcamp to listen to a new single/music video that dropped from a band I follow - other than that I still make a point to acquire mp3s for anything and everything I check out to add to my mp3 library (mostly pirated - occasionally I will purchase, usually when it's an artist I already know I love/admire dropping new material and I don't want to go through the trouble/patience of waiting for and/or seeking out the files to pirate)... if I really love an album, it'll be on my radar for potentially purchasing a physical copy at some point, or occasionally I may even seek one out or order it online... but considering I typically really have to dig something considerably to be willing to dish out the big bucks to get it on record, my physical collection is very limited relative to my digital library
Emim 09.21.21	My music consumption has slowed down considerably in the last ten years. There is just too much to keep up with, so I mainly listen either to old stuff or new stuff from old bands and let it branch out organically from there through Spotify recommended or recs on here. I do agree that it does feel a bit cheap at times how easily I can access new music and I miss the days when I could spin albums dozens upon dozens of times without getting tired of them. I knew every beat, note, and lyric to them. Shit, I can still probably recite Satellite or Wonder What's Next from memory and tell you the track numbers of each. I think I've found a good balance between the two these days though.
Sharenge 09.21.21	as far as exploring new artists/albums, from where I was 5-10 years ago, I've slowed down considerably the past number of years also... the main factor that's led to that for me is just the consumption of hard drive space and the fact that I haven't upgraded my PC in all that time when I'm well overdue for it so free storage gets more and more scarce as my music library only increases in size.... I have externals, but I just want my music on an external as a backup in case my PC dies and I would lose everything on it - otherwise, I like having my entire library located on and accessible from my PC alone.... so yeah if and when I finally upgrade to another PC, I imagine the rate at which I explore stuff I'm unfamiliar with will step back up again
Gwyn. 09.21.21	I have actually never once in my life kept up with new music. Like I will check out new music if it's like really doing a lot of buzz and I'm like might as well see what all the fuzz is about, but otherwise I almost spend time listening to new music unless it's an artist I am already a fan of. The majority of music I listen to came out long before I actively made music hunting a part of my life
Captain Civic 09.21.21	I like to find new music, but I just find I don't either have the time or patience to let some stuff sink in, and some music just can't be appreciated on the first run. So I end up either going back to stuff from 10-15 years ago or new albums from bands from that time period. Last new album I tried and loved was Gang of Youths in 2018.
Dewinged 09.21.21	Really good read you all, and great list Spirit. I'd say i grew up in a internet-less age, buying cheap vinyl judging by the cover and trafficking with tapes at highschool and I don't miss any of it. I abuse Spotify, and ever since the digital media started I've hoarded far and wide. Did I bond with music the same way? I believe so! Like most things it's a matter of how you make use of it. I still buy records that have become somehow special throughout the year (now knowing what I buy lol) or old records I used to have, etc. Bandcamp is also great to discover unsigned bands or for genres with minimal representation otherwise. tl;dr I think we're lucky we have all these options at our reach and it's just a matter of being organized and real with your music habits (or that's what worked for me!)
Dewinged 09.21.21	Also Hyperion had a great point there. It's crazy how easy has become for anyone to make your own music available for the whole world (well, everywhere except where Gwyn lives) almost instantly. That was unthinkable years ago, and I feel it's also part of the blessing/curse thing.
Koris 09.21.21	"It's crazy how easy has become for anyone to make your own music available for the whole world (well, everyone except where Gwyn lives) almost instantly. That was unthinkable years ago, and I feel it's also part of the blessing/curse thing." Absolutely. I was able to put one of my compositions from my notation software onto Spotify, and it barely took any effort or time to get it on there. So easy
AnimalsAsSummit 09.21.21	Music is life
Gnocchi 09.21.21	Featured on the grounds of community values/holding hands/sput unite etc
zakalwe 09.21.21	The way I see it is this. Music right up until the 21st century was always woven into the fabric of society to the point where groups of people interacted at clubs, pubs, festivals, dance halls, churches, village fetes, music shops where music was being played. The music shaped how theses interactions took place and new styles and scenes formed. From these scenes further styles developed and cultures were born. People had their leaders and persons who could speak for them in the albums and live performances which again people bonded over and the cycle repeated. Timeless music was produced, icons were formed. Then the internet happened. Then the shut down of venues. Then the social media generation dominated by clueless fuckers branding and franchising themselves representing absolutely nobody started to bleed into music. Then the artists were stymied, had to toe the line or be forever be damned if they said or felt anything that went against ‘common values’ While this was seen as ‘progress’ streaming services acted as a flue for literally anyone and anything to enter the fray. The dilution happened. The same money making production tropes, and styles were churned out a hundred fold. We all drowned. People lost interest. Albums weren’t listened to. Music wasn’t digested, it was solely consumed and disposed. Music as both an art and an outlet in the form it has always been played and listened to had reached its peak. Anyone who says that current music and streaming is the best of times is either young, deaf, was an absolute fucking nerd back in the day or simply doesn’t ‘get’ music the way most of us do.
rockarollacola 09.21.21	I'd say you make some solid points that many would agree with; but it's thanks to streaming that I now have the ability to discover and listen to music I never would have heard otherwise. It could be that I'm in my low 20's but music hasn't lost any of its luster for me.
fogza 09.21.21	steady on zak, it's not all bad
zakalwe 09.21.21	Agreed it’s definitely not all bad. The mine has been opened to all to dig for past gold. Where the pit entrance is though there’s a used car salesman offering up shit.
ghostalgeist 09.21.21	nah i'll never get tired of music, and having it be readily available at my fingertips has only heightened my sense of connection with it, and that's because of its accessibility these days. there are some artists i love that i would have either never discovered without the internet/streaming, or would have never gotten to explore their works without the internet/streaming. don't be a boomer /m/
Dewinged 09.21.21	Guess I'd fall into the "absolute fucking nerd back in the day "
DoofDoof 09.21.21	Zak is right, it’s the reason people put up album lists of stuff before 2000 and there’s consensus and a feeling of weight and importance to the picks. After that slowly there was less and less consensus and weight, so you get ‘I agreed with you until year dot then your picks seem very random’ Everyone is in their own bubble listening to whatever in mostly complete isolation of any greater significance or feeling of connection. Everyone’s just into ‘their thing’ and very unique sure. When you realise Kanye is the biggest artist of the last two decades, the one supposedly uniting the music masses, and the bloke trolled at least half that time and is totally full of nonsense in terms of his art, image and personal life it’s just a case of ‘hmmm, no wonder people head for their own little private Idaho’ or whatever.
DoofDoof 09.21.21	Don’t get me wrong Kanye is a perfect reflection of the age: - social media whore - celebrity culture disaster - mental health overshare - redemption arc - meme worthy - unlikely genre splice album - constant trolling - public political badge waving He’s perfect but still, actually LISTENING to his music every day? No. History books? Side note. Despite everything, side note. Highest profile artist of the last two decades, most lasting youth cultural influence, and he’s a side note. That shows how shit has changed more than anything.
JohnnyoftheWell 09.21.21	doof get back in the school bus and carry on binging olivia rodrigo with the rest of our universe plz
quetzal 09.21.21	if music has less consensus as time goes on that is because of the democratization of music caused by the internet and ease of creation. no longer do bands have to go to studios to record great music. no longer are we held hostage by the whims of record executives. there's more stuff out there now, more stuff of higher quality and great amounts of creativity. also kanye sucks
Sharenge 09.21.21	no one even know what a ipod iz anymore =( I'm a fucking dinosaur
zakalwe 09.21.21	Absolutely bang on doof
DoofDoof 09.21.21	Of course Kanye sucks but he’s the closest to an Elvis, Beatles, Stones, Bowie, Cohen (lol), Pink Floyd, The Clash, Nirvana, Radiohead we’ve had since the turn of the century. Let that sink in. Record execs NEVER had an influence on what music nerds listened to really, never ‘held hostage’, but the mainstream also used to have some big fucking balls swinging believe me Now we have Kanye
fogza 09.21.21	"Of course Kanye sucks but he’s the closest to an Elvis, Beatles, Stones, Pink Floyd, The Clash, Nirvana, Radiohead we’ve had since the turn of the century." Are you saying he's the biggest artist who has a commercial AND music nerd following?
Casavir 09.21.21	"nah i'll never get tired of music, and having it be readily available at my fingertips has only heightened my sense of connection with it, and that's because of its accessibility these days. there are some artists i love that i would have either never discovered without the internet/streaming, or would have never gotten to explore their works without the internet/streaming." This is my experience too. There's a lot of stuff I love listening to that I'm glad isn't made totally lost due to there not being readily available copies because it's uploaded online. I usually listen to full albums by bands when I get to them anyway, so it's not too different from when I listened to my parents' music collection as a kid.
Demon of the Fall 09.21.21	Yeah this is the ultimate blessing/curse conundrum for me, nothing has ever made me feel so conflicted. I have benefited massively from the availability of music now, discoveries are not as exciting as they once were but I'm still thankful for the opportunity. I see myself slowing down as I age - definitely don't want to keep up with all the new releases, it's been like that this year.
DoofDoof 09.21.21	fogza - biggest over the period of time, and biggest cultural significance, esp youth cultural significance Yes, big with nerds/‘serious’ listeners, other artists, and ‘the kids’
Demon of the Fall 09.21.21	Had a very unfulfilling conversation with an early Radiohead fanboy who assumed I loved Kid A due to our (relatively modest) difference in age, then he was confused as I said 'but my fave album of all-time came out in '94'. It's nice that you don't have to be defined musically by the era/environment you grew up in.
quetzal 09.21.21	"Of course Kanye sucks but he’s the closest to an Elvis, Beatles, Stones, Bowie, Cohen (lol), Pink Floyd, The Clash, Nirvana, Radiohead we’ve had since the turn of the century." because of how music is disseminated now. how music is consumed. back in the 90s we listened to the radio, everyone did. now, most people don't. that's not a claim that really has much meaning, because the internet changed everything. i lived it, i listened to the radio heavily in the early to mid 90s when i was a teen and by '97 i'd given up completely on the radio because i didn't want to hear the trash they were playing, i wanted to hear stuff like Ulver and My Dying Bride, and i couldn't hear that on the radio. i had to buy albums and once I got broadband around '99 download them.
DoofDoof 09.21.21	Demon - dunno, still think it’s better to be defined by the bands at their peak when you were a kid going to watch them at shows and all your mates liked the same band too and there was a living breathing buzz around them at that exact moment Sure it’s nice not to feel boxed in if that’s your thing but I think anyone who hasn’t had the former experience missed out a bit
JohnnyoftheWell 09.21.21	"Everyone is in their own bubble listening to whatever in mostly complete isolation of any greater significance or feeling of connection" a little more candid, but this is only half the story and mainly represents the general dimension of nerddom that we're all typing from rn. as far as "bubbles" go, I'm not convinced there's a precedent for fanbases with remotely the same scale and infrastructure as artists like BTS and Taytay. they're the ones smashing release records more than Kanye, and their streaming numbers are particularly absurd and international on a level the old music biz never had the same shot at. as much as our current matrix sees some of us going our own way to our hearts' content, the big names are bigger than they've ever been
DoofDoof 09.21.21	I’m still pissed I didn’t live in London until 1998 so before then all I went to for watching bands were festivals Would have watched so many more legendary bands at their prime
JohnnyoftheWell 09.21.21	whether or not BTS fever is a worthy replacement for Beatlemania is another story, but it's kinda ridiculous to deny the collective element is there the real story here is that it's easier than ever before to phase out of aspects of the mainstream you don't care for
Demon of the Fall 09.21.21	'Sure it’s nice not to feel boxed in if that’s your thing but I think anyone who hasn’t had the former experience missed out a bit' Oh yeah, not denying that. People do end up becoming a product of their generation or environment where music is concerned though, of course that's perfectly natural - yet in some cases, limiting. It's certainly possible to incorporate both.
DoofDoof 09.21.21	If it’s all kicking off in Asia Johnny that’s great but it hasn’t resonated too much worldwide in mainstream terms. I knew who you were talking about but that was it. I guess it was in your face in the 90s - I never cared for Oasis or Blur and there was no escape, but I never caved into liking their stuff. Still respected something big was going down.
JohnnyoftheWell 09.21.21	you can do your own reading on how much international traction bts have; shrugging that off reflects your own bubble and age bracket more than anything else, which as i said is more proof of individual disengagement than a lack of assertive mainstream movements not that this is good or bad, and I'm certainly grateful for the distance most of the time. you're right that it's less in your face now, but by that token i don't really think you're in a position to comment on how much clout current pop phenomena do or don't have outside your four walls
Cryptkeeper 09.21.21	I'm very torn on this because I think streaming has both positively and negatively impacted the artform massively. On the one hand, music nerds can scour a near endless collection of genres and artists from nearly every timeperiod. It's easier than ever to find new stuff you might like by joining internet communities, artists can get inspired by anything, regional genres and musical styles can break out and make an impact that would be impossible with exclusive physical releases, and in the end, I do think in general it broadens and helps advance the development of both old and new genres. On the other hand, the very large portion of the audience that is not interested in getting anything out of music beyond a surface level enjoyment are put more and more comfortably in their respective musical 'safespaces' and are exposed to less and less impactful and different music. I have had so many friends of mine exclaim how they hate all current/popular/radio music beyond their personal niches, when in truth they actually dig a lot of the music not being pushed by conglomerated radiostations and music outlets/blogs, which they are not aware of at all. Eventually the artform will have splintered enough to no longer be able to bear pop-arbiters of truth like Pitchfork, Rolling Stone and Kerrang!, and perhaps we can move back in the right direction.
fogza 09.21.21	"Demon - dunno, still think it’s better to be defined by the bands at their peak when you were a kid going to watch them at shows and all your mates liked the same band too and there was a living breathing buzz around them at that exact moment" I'm the same generation as you but this didn't really happen for me because the bands I really liked didn't tour here, not important enough a destination. So perhaps the differentiation doesn't really matter that much for me.
DDDeftoneDDD 09.21.21	I get Nocte but streaming made me take chances to many music I wouldn't...so there's that btw I fuckin hate playlists, and listening algrthms
Egarran 09.21.21	>the real story here is that it's easier than ever before to phase out of aspects of the mainstream you don't care for Great point. Definitely don't miss the top 10 in my life. Of course you have sad people who will go out of the way to locate the mainstream and piss in it, but I think those people have always existed.
JohnnyoftheWell 09.21.21	real ones know that enough clear water runs through the mainstream to warrant collateral pissing
GhandhiLion 09.21.21	"are put more and more comfortably in their respective musical 'safespaces' and are exposed to less and less impactful and different music." How are they? I assume it's the opposite.
Cryptkeeper 09.21.21	Mostly through Spotify algorithms, and partly by the sheer size of every individual genre allowing people to stick around longer in a certain sound than before where you would eventually have to start looking at adjacent styles to scratch your itch
Pheromone 09.21.21	music? never heard of ic
Egarran 09.21.21	we have been missing your input phero
Pheromone 09.21.21	thank you best friend
DoofDoof 09.21.21	'the real story here is that it's easier than ever before to phase out of aspects of the mainstream you don't care for' I don't really get how this is a deal breaker - 'oh no, they're playing that same song again in Footlocker and oh no here it is again on the radio' - I think it is pretty easy to ignore or switch off annoying mainstream stuff, always has been. No advantage or disadvantage for me, still hear the same amount of trash going about in everyday life, prob more now if anything. Maybe more variety in the trash? Best I can give you.
zakalwe 09.21.21	Please don’t say trash Diluted
rabidfish 09.21.21	I think it's just age, personally. When I was a teen there was already a bunch of ways to download music, and I did. A lot. I listened to a lot of stuff. Now I don't give stuff I know I won't like much of a chance, and dedicate that time to listen to music I like or know that I'll probably like more.
DoofDoof 09.21.21	'Now I don't give stuff I know I won't like much of a chance' Opposite for me, as I've got older I'm much more open to stuff. Aged 13 I liked about three genres and one of the genres was probably Metallica
DoofDoof 09.21.21	'not that this is good or bad, and I'm certainly grateful for the distance most of the time. you're right that it's less in your face now, but by that token i don't really think you're in a position to comment on how much clout current pop phenomena do or don't have outside your four walls' Johnny I don't mean this in a bad way, but your defence is in itself incriminating. If it doesn't get inside every set of four walls on the planet it is far from a phenomena in a historical sense. MJ was the most recognisable human on the planet for a long time, one example. Anyway think I'm losing the focus of this...enjoy current music, love streaming, music culture seems to be missing something a bit that it used to have in abundance, possibly due to the same over saturation I have embraced along with everyone else
rabidfish 09.21.21	It's not so much about comfort or safe spaces, but more that I know what I like and I can tell more quickly if something is going to click for me
DoofDoof 09.21.21	rabid - true, i won't persist with something I realise I don't like, I've listened to enough music to know if something is a no hoper for me
Egarran 09.21.21	>I don't really get how this is a deal breaker Too bad, but it is pretty important.
JohnnyoftheWell 09.21.21	@Doof depends on what you count as a phenomenon. if you mean that bts is unlikely to leave a lasting mark on collective memory (not that that exists in the same way that it did in the 90s) as Oasis, I'd agree - however, if that is the case I'd say it's phenomenal in and of itself that a pop movement can tie together so many lives across the world and rack up such insane figures without securing that kind of legacy. once again, this speaks more to our unprecedented luxury in curating our own bubbles of reality than anything else and that aside, the phenomenon of online fancults is very real and likely more encompassing than either of us would like to think
BlondeGuardian 09.21.21	I agree with zakalwe and DoofDoof. Although I think part of the death of music as cultural phenomena is that record executives have given up on taking risks, and thus never promote any music that is truly interesting and courageous. I don't think it's as big of a factor as the death of music venues, but it seems guaranteed that anything good and original will be forever relegated to music nerd sites. Looking at the variety of music that used to appear in the Top 40 a mere 2 decades ago is depressing. Has the public's taste changed that much?
Egarran 09.21.21	>I agree with zakalwe and DoofDoof Uh oh, it's contagious
zakalwe 09.21.21	Don’t get me wrong if you’d have told me when I was 13 about ‘the future’ with the internet and streaming I’d have taken it. I just wouldn’t have realised what would be forsaken as a result.
Hyperion1001 09.21.21	just chiming in to say I super agree with zak’s point about music losing its sense of community. in fact, I think this is probably the defining feature of the current zeitgeist. music is, at its core, simple communication. it is intended to be shared and experienced in a communal sense. nowadays, like most other media, we primarily consume music alone, form our opinions of it alone, and even share it “alone” (the internet is absolutely a great social tool but it’s still not a complete interpersonal experience). with the pandemic this trend was shot into hyperdrive and now I worry that we’re gonna lose one of the last secular communal experiences we have left. the degradation of freely accessible communal spaces and free communal experiences is probably the most harmful cultural trend that’s come out of the last half a century or so. it’s why society seems so polarized, because we don’t fuckin talk or interact with each other in genuine, empathetic ways anymore. really sad honestly, it keeps me up at night sometimes. please, get vaxx’d and go listen to music with your friends on a Friday night. keep the spirit alive even against the inevitable tide of change.
zakalwe 09.21.21	Even that was eroding cos of you slags recording the moment at live gigs rather than living it. That communal sense of abandonment, recklessness and togetherness ruined cos of some sap with their fucking I-phone out.
Egarran 09.21.21	now I worry that we’re gonna lose one of the last secular communal experiences we have left
deathofasalesman 09.21.21	I-phone
Cryptkeeper 09.21.21	I hate those goshdarn eye-foams
deathofasalesman 09.21.21	in regards to this topic, i'm getting into the habit of burning playlists to discs and wearing them out like i used to when i was a kid. except now i'm playing them in my car
Keyblade 09.21.21	"He’s perfect but still, actually LISTENING to his music every day? No. History books? Side note. Despite everything, side note." absolutely not. he was a phenom before the internet age. he revolutionalized a genre not once but twice. he'll go down in history as one of the greats, shenanigans and all
wham49 09.21.21	I do not stream music very much, maybe bored at work once in a while, streaming takes all the piss out of listening to music, also much of the coolness out of what you listen to. You used to be judged on your collection, what you were able to find, now everybody has everything takes the fun out of it, thats why I stick to vinyl for the most part
deathofasalesman 09.21.21	is this just a cringe copypasta thread
Space Jester 09.21.21	If you don’t connect with music as much because of streaming it’s your own fault. No one is forcing anyone to listen to as much as possible
Deez 09.21.21	I'm too old to understand the 'Why isn't this on Spotify!!!???' When the cd/vinyl/tape ..has been out for fucking ages and you could just stick it on your phone/player It's been explained to me. 'on the move/in the car/gym' Yadda Yadda. I still don't get it. Is it because phones have replaced MP3 players, iPods etc etc ? Waiting for something on Spotify rather than buying the fking thing blows my mind tbh
Cryptkeeper 09.21.21	"is this just a cringe copypasta thread" Yea
Hyperion1001 09.21.21	nothing in this world is more embarrassing than calling something cringe. go outside.
Deez 09.21.21	The feeling of going into a record store buying some physicals going home reading them, immersing in them, whatever format. Maybe taking a chance on a some you haven't heard and therefore giving it more than one listen and a delete is just incomparable to downloading 50 albums a week and motoring through them. I've benefited from downloading free shit massively but there's many time albums I've really liked I couldn't even tell you the artwork. But is suited me for a long time so I understand it. Also a lot can depend on where you live, space, etc etc and money ofcourse.
haesslichermensch 09.21.21	I had certain phases I went through in my life. - build up a record collection - build up a CD collection - download from Napster - download from torrents - Spotify/Apple Music/Tidal/YouTube - download from torrents - download from hosting sites - Apple Music/YouTube At some time in point I had a collection of 250k albums on my hard drives. All deleted. I still listen to the music I love that has not changed. The format has changed, but the format did not have an impact, well maybe in case of quality. What really has changed and it is hard to deal with, is the sheer amount of new releases every week, every damn week. An endless stream of mediocre bands and albums. I cannot handle it and to a certain degree it makes me sick. Music has not become a commodity for me, but it is like with news, pictures, social media in general. Pray that your internal filter mechanism work, else you have to wade through a sea of endless shit. Albums and bands I love, once I found them, will never leave my life, even if I have my phases when it comes to genres over the year.
Hyperion1001 09.21.21	yeah my preferred listening experience is at my computer with headphones so I’ve started curating my digital library like I would my physical library so I can really engage with albums. only digital files I keep now are in uncompressed formats and I only keep albums I’ve actually bought/own. it’s been really successful so far an bandcamp has become one of my favorite services in the internet. there are ways to subvert some of these problems you just gotta find what works for you.
Keyblade 09.21.21	i've never bought music physically but I can definitely understand the appeal of it, I'm the same way with games. there was something different about buying the game physically, sitting with the manual and popping it in and playing it that I don't get from my digital library with music I kind of do miss the hunt of hawking blogspots for albums I think I'll be interested in, finding a 320 rip, unzipping, organizing it into my folder properly etc. more than anything though I think I just don't connect with music the way I used to. I don't just grab my headphones and lie on my bed and just listen to albums front to back anymore. if I ever listen to an album fully nowadays, it's while I'm working and I think I reached the point where I listened to so much music in my heyday to last me a lifetime. there's no need to check out 100 albums a year anymore. for one I don't even have the time, but also I don't care to wade through the musical equivalent of shovelware to find some gems. I have hundreds of albums that I love dearly that never get old and fit different purposes and moods and I'm sure I'll come across a few more over the years
DungeonBoy 09.22.21	dude you've never bought any physical copies of music? That's insane. Have you ever paid for any digital music?
conesmoke 09.22.21	I miss being able to lube and love those disc holes with my micropenis, it barely fits into the headphone jack and ive gotta really jam it in there
conesmoke 09.22.21	On a side note, those Samsung galaxy pods are supposed to go in your ass right?
Storm In A Teacup 09.22.21	Limewire ruined me. I remember buying Hopesfall Magnetic North in 2007 at best buy and having that cd in my car forever was magic.
deathofasalesman 09.22.21	"i've never bought music physically" FBI. get him.
Keyblade 09.22.21	lol fr tho, growing up I used to just listen to and record tapes off the radio and watch BET for my music fix. couldn't afford to buy physically plus my parents were religious and wouldnt let me anyway. and tbh I didn't even care for physical media. by the time I became a music "head", itunes was thankfully a thing, and then spotify which I still use
tectactoe 09.22.21	I agree that streaming services have further commodified music in ways it never was previously, and I'll always hold a fondness for that nostalgia of wandering into an FYE or Sam Goody store in the mall and flipping through vinyl, cassette, or CD racks to just browse the covers and see if anything looked interesting. And, sure, because the act of going out and purchasing an album physically was an "event" (or more of an event than streaming a new album, anyway), there was an attachment to it, a level of both depth and maybe even forgiveness and commiseration that might not be there otherwise. I'll never forget my first album - MELLON COLLIE AND THE INFINITE SADNESS - and how I obsessively read through the lyric book over and over and knew every song like the back of my hand by the tender age of thirteen. On the other hand, as a now-thirtysomething with a full time job, wife, and two kids, I just don't have the time to dedicate to "seeking out" albums in the same capacity, and I have to admit that the accessibility of streaming is a godsend for someone in my position. And yes, streaming has inevitably brought with it a swathe of lifeless, tailor-made, ready-for-consumption music in the name of earning a few bucks, but there's still an abundance of excellent, heartfelt, and genuine music-as-art out there (I'd argue even more so now than ~10 or 20 years ago or whatever), you just have to be more diligent with how to find it. You have to dig a little deeper, I guess, but it's there.
FadedSun 09.22.21	I started to listen to music a lot less once streaming became a thing. I felt disconnected. Too much at my finger tips. Wasn't able to keep track of what I wanted to listen to, forgetting about a band I heard once, etc. I used to keep a folder of music with all my FLAC files, organized within the VOX app, but eventually I got way more into vinyl. Stopped downloading FLAC files. My music is almost exclusively now absorbed via records, mostly discovering older music. Anything modern I'll stick to Spotify, unless I really want the record. So, my music consumption is records + Spotify now. I stopped downloading music.
Sevengill 09.22.21	I don't stream music. I'm probably more committed than ever to buying physical albums to help bands I care about.
TheSpirit 09.22.21	I don’t buy physical copies unless it’s a special record, but I have bought over 600 items on bandcamp, so I still feel like I’m doing my part.
TheBarber 09.22.21	I pirate everything and only pay for art made by my friends as well as gigs that keep the city alive. Things are good. Still in love with music and can confidently say I always will be thanks to the limits of memory.
TheBarber 09.22.21	Streaming always felt to me like the worst of both worlds. You pay the corporation 99% of the artists work to lend you something that'll disappear as soon as the corporation does.
ConcubinaryCode 09.22.21	It hasn't changed the way I invest music but I think it has changed the way artists make music. Who was it that said making albums is a waste now and they just make singles?
DungeonBoy 09.22.21	Ola Englund used to talk about that a lot on his channel. At least the don't waste your time trying to record a full length if you have zero fan base. Start with some singles and put them out there.
AlexKzillion 09.24.21	Spotify is just far too convenient for me to buy physical albums anymore. Don't think it has made music more disposable for me though, as I've really never been all that into checking every album under the sun. In terms of supporting artists I'm far more of a buy a ticket and a shirt kinda guy. Much more inclined to buy a fun experience or something I will likely wear for years than a record I might spin like... once a year if that.
Relinquished 09.24.21	boys I just bought a $450 ISIS test pressing. I love music and I love all forms of it, I'm glad to be at this age where we can listen to whatever the fuck and that we have a lot of all that shit stay blessed you lovely idiots
Deez 09.24.21	Yoooooooooo I saw that go up today and it was already sold out, Not that I would have paid that because Im not lowriding round Miami dealing flake like you Wolfe but what a fking score
Nikkolae 09.24.21	well shit this has a lot of replies already so my two cents: I have only recently have started to collect vinyls and it has reignited my love for the whole craftmanship that goes into the creation of an album in general, its something I remember when I was a kid and that was very special to me as getting albums from my fav bands used to be much more difficult as it is today, I do streaming but in general it is a comodity more than an actual experience some times, i have had a lot of fun finding new musicians from switzerland and the nordic countries as well as a lot of japanese musicians as well that I would no doubt have never had the chance to check if not for streaming. In conclusion streaming good for discovery and low invesment, physical music for special albums for me (and lets not even talk about how fun it is to piece together your own HI-FI set up)
Asdfp277 09.24.21	i don't stream, i just get the music i don't particularly enjoy having cds or vyynyyls n stuff, not good for the planet
JefferyBigglestein2 09.24.21	i fuck the music i make it come.
Asdfp277 09.24.21	wig
Relinquished 09.24.21	deez how did you know
Hyperion1001 09.24.21	i think a big concept that we've kinda glossed over is just how bad spotify and streaming are for artists. they're essentially stealing music to make billions of dollars in revenue while artists starve. obviously, the best option is to go to shows and buy directly from bands, which i encourage everyone to do, but at this point i genuinely believe that streaming is more unethical and immoral than pirating. at least with pirating, no one is making money.
Deez 09.24.21	I can smell my own wolfe
DDDeftoneDDD 09.24.21	my relationship with music is sex every day.
Egarran 09.24.21	> how bad spotify and streaming are for artists Not always. For example we have some jazz bands who had songs ending up on some popular 'easy background jazz' playlist, and they suddenly make a lot of money. It's not ideal ofc, but they are not complaining about 1000s of new listeners.
Demon of the Fall 09.24.21	Yeah surely a lot of the point re streaming services is that although artists make a pittance (which absolutely IS wrong), they also get exposure in ways they otherwise wouldn't. Most people just don't have the money to buy everything, especially if it's by an artist they're unfamiliar with. Streaming is a convenient and easy way to discover new artists. Increased exposure = fans, fans = people who're prepared to shell out for physical copies, merchandise or tickets. It acts as 'phase 1' of the process, doesn't mean it stops once that's over.
Gwyn. 09.24.21	There's good and bad about most things, in this case there's plenty bad about spotify and plenty good, although I would say the good is very lopsided to the favor of the listener and the bad almost wholly on the side of the actual artist and that's an unfair balance
Egarran 09.24.21	Hope Lars Ulrich reads that
fogza 09.24.21	Isn't he Danish? And aren't you Danish? omg could it be?
Egarran 09.24.21	He is a precious national pride and embarrassment.
fogza 09.24.21	Stop deflecting Lars, I know it's you
wham49 09.24.21	look at the Grateful Dead gave away all their shows, even put up a special section at their concerts for people to get top quality recordings for free to pass along to other fans. They are not hurting for money, I even think they make so much money because they allowed that, bands being stingy and trying to get every penny out of themselves I have no sympathy for
wham49 09.24.21	but I buy lots of second hand physical music, I want to support bands who apperciate my fandom and make physical items that are top quality that make me wqant to purchase them
Pizza 09.24.21	i find that i don't care as much about new music. it comes out streaming and i have the thought "okay i can now listen to this whenever" and it usually means i dont give it full attention for a while. because i will stream it driving or working. i used to always really focus on an album first couple listens, and i do that less often now unless i obtain a physical copy.
Keyblade 09.24.21	^ feel that
Egarran 09.25.21	Woah Pizza is from '05? Much respect, although he's allegedly super unhealthy.
DDDeftoneDDD 09.25.21	I think, as expected, you re all mixing 2 different things: how stream affected our listening habits (which I thought it was the subject in matter) and how stream affected music industry and what should we do to listen with a clean consciousness (and sleep well at night). I'm sure if I owned and listen to my only 30 albums I would give more attention to them, instead of the current 200 per year. On other hand I wouldn't see me learning as fast either. Would be stuck in the same tunes forever. In other words - just another thread to make us streamers feel like monsters. I'm from 83 and been through all phases since tape, but mostly value what it means to be on a Plato's Allegory of the Cave in this little corner of the Earth/ or the reality surrounding me anyway, and what the easy access made to my musical growth.
Egarran 09.25.21	What are we drinking today?
DDDeftoneDDD 09.25.21	working, unfortunately. Fortunately I can still vent here and watch Man UTd with the GOAT, my little ega goatty
Deez 09.25.21	Fk Man Utd
DDDeftoneDDD 09.25.21	not this year lmao
Egarran 09.25.21	Don't tell me you're sober 3D. Drinking on the job was the norm here in Denmark before everything got so PC.
DDDeftoneDDD 09.25.21	Totally sober, yet never sober PC?
Deez 09.25.21	As said..fk Man Utd.
Demon of the Fall 09.25.21	Imagine liking Utd MORE after CR7 signs. Bloody ‘ell!
DDDeftoneDDD 09.25.21	yeah, pretty sure only few of us Portuguese dig the dude. There's a lot of Portuguese plumbers and lawyers who hate him too - hate community goes bigger than sput fs (the other half ends up being quite larger tho)
Egarran 09.25.21	Ooh they lost! Watching highlights I kept thinking they would do a Ronaldo tap-in at 94 minutes. Sweet.