kalki: What Do You See In Jazz?

tempest-- 09.26.13	edgy list wow great words i think we met on r/atheism
Cygnatti 09.26.13	jazz sucks >:/
MosesMalone 09.26.13	If you're white, you don't actually understand jazz ever. Fact.
treeqt. 09.26.13	lol
ShitsofRain 09.26.13	i think so too
tempest-- 09.26.13	i am 13 years old and i apologise for my generation i know true music like ac/dc metallica and disturbed
kalki 09.26.13	How is not liking jazz an attempt at being edgy? Anyway, if being white means I don't understand jazz then I guess I never will, and that explanation is quite disappointing. Makes me feel like I'm not missing out on anything too special.
ButteryBiscuitBass 09.26.13	What I see in Jazz? Well if Jazz was an actual object it would be a big comfy sofa. It just relaxes me so much.
MosesMalone 09.26.13	I mean do you like mariachi music?
Winesburgohio 09.26.13	maybe you just need free jazz try 'One Too Many Salty Swift and Not Goodbye' or Ornette Coleman's 'Free Jazz' or McCoy Tyner's 'Enlightenment', you might find the spontaneity of the pieces engaging (and compositionally they're p. complex too)
joshuahuntkc 09.26.13	Listen to some Charlie parker or Chet baker. Jazz is musicians music If you listening to it this late in the game. It's really hard to appreciate it unless you play it or have acquired a taste for it. I'm a saxophone performance major and even I have trouble listening to a lot of jazz.
tempest-- 09.26.13	look i just want to fuck shit up because you said you want intelligent discussion and you're on sputnik
JamieTwort 09.26.13	@Wines: Judging by what he considers to be one of the genre's main shortcomings (uncreative structure) I'm pretty sure free jazz (a genre which has very little structure at all) isn't what he needs.
joshuahuntkc 09.26.13	listen to some count basie too. Big band jazz is generally pretty well structured.
tempest-- 09.26.13	listen to this it's jazz but it's basically structured like a pop song http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5u2btTS9FL4
Winesburgohio 09.26.13	uncreative structure =/= very little structure, though i take your point that said i wouldn't say Free Jazz has very little structure. in its own way it's tremendously structured around interplay
MosesMalone 09.26.13	The sawtooth grin is like jazz applied to grind. Naked city is grind applied to jazz. Go cray!
joshuahuntkc 09.26.13	@LloydNewgreen That's because it's R&B not jazz
dimsim3478 09.26.13	"dumping away all their potential in a structurally uncreative genre" I get that the whole solo-based structure of standard jazz (bop, particularly) initially seems very samey, but there's something very special that this type of structuring enabled classic jazz musicians to do. John Coltrane's "Blue Train" is a good example of a record that might help you grasp the concept: on the surface, it's pretty simple, but it's truthfully quite a masterful work.
zakalwe 09.26.13	Jazz isn't about what it is, its about what it isn't.
JamieTwort 09.26.13	"uncreative structure =/= very little structure, though i take your point that said i wouldn't say Free Jazz has very little structure. in its own way it's tremendously structured around interplay" True Well by it's very definition free jazz is free of harmonic structure and is based around free-form improvisation, so I'd say it generally has less structure than other forms of jazz, although it can certainly be just as creative in other ways.
Dunwich 09.26.13	Spinal Tap on jazz http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYSEQImJnNw
rasputin 09.26.13	just shut up and listen that's how to 'get' music
kalki 09.26.13	How exactly is Liszt horrible? He's not always the best, but his piano concertos and the Faust Symphony are masterful. When he's at the top of his game he's one of the greatest melodic developers around, and his mastery of harmony is astounding.
rockandmetaljunkie 09.26.13	The reason I love Jazz is because the genre isn't based on a formulaic structure/approach. The genre is solely based on improvisation. And what I love mostly in music is improvisation. Attention, I'm not talking about solos. Solos and improvisation are different.
PunchforPunch 09.26.13	free jazz is a more cultural thing like spiritual freedom and shit thats why white peeps like Bill Evans and Chet Baker played the calmer, more structured side of jazz
kalki 09.26.13	@rockandmetaljunkie It's not based on improvisation. 90% of jazz (free and avant-garde jazz excluded) is based around a very rigid and repetitive ABA or ABC form with which the "improvisers" take some mild liberties and then solo over a bunch of times. This is one of the things that annoys me. There is no development of ideas, no sense of getting from one point to the next. I can find far better improvisation-based music in the works of krautrock bands like Can.
tommygun 09.26.13	nothing
Keyblade 09.26.13	"just shut up and listen that's how to 'get' music" Spittin' that truth
SaneTBP 09.26.13	"Attention, I'm not talking about solos. Solos and improvisation are different." Woah thank you
PitchforkArms 09.26.13	I'm not super into the genre man, but I think it is incredibly enjoyable. I love thelonious monk, he is great. It's hard to really describe hey people 'like' just about anything. For me jazz will always be the genre I have incredible respect for, enjoy listening to, but never dive incredibly deep into
kalki 09.26.13	Whenever I "shut up and listen" to jazz I just end up annoyed and wanting to listen to something. I get the impression that maybe I'm just going in with the wrong mindset, thus the list.
elephantREVOLUTION 09.26.13	idk how much you've searched around within the genre, but you are bound to find something you like if you look around enough.
elephantREVOLUTION 09.26.13	try listening to mouse on the keys
Friday13th 09.26.13	I hear you man. Jazz in general is like the antithesis of pop. Free jazz is virtually void of structure and emphasizes instrumental skill whereas pop is rigidly formulaic and focuses on hooks. Middle ground is where I like. I like jazz that is classically influenced or rock/jazz fusion. The Dave Brubeck Quartet is a (shockingly) white group that is pretty famous and for good reason cause it's jazz with classical structure. Jazz fusion like Mahavishnu Orchestra is pretty rock riff-based and got me into jazz.
JamieTwort 09.26.13	^Yeah Mahavishnu Orchestra are pretty easy to get into even if you're not that into jazz.
treeqt. 09.26.13	"Jazz in general is like the antithesis of pop." nop
Cygnatti 09.26.13	pop and rock are heavily rooted in jazz so wtf
mindleviticus 09.26.13	Jazz is the worst genre on the planet my god are you people stupid
Cygnatti 09.26.13	"The reason I love Jazz is because the genre isn't based on a formulaic structure/approach. The genre is solely based on improvisation." umm... >:/
RadicalEd 09.26.13	I gotta say, I do prefer fusion jazz like Zappa or Mahavishnu to the balls to the wall 17 minute saxophone solo jazz, even if that means I'm not intelligent enough to handle jazz. There are some really great Jazz records out there though.
PunchforPunch 09.26.13	@cyg you probably mean blues
Keyblade 09.26.13	Mindflowers mmh
UnnamedOcean 09.26.13	I totally respect jazz, since I played it for like 10 years...but I agree that it has a lot of issues. That being said, there is a lot of really good stuff out there right now.
RadicalEd 09.26.13	"pop and rock are heavily rooted in jazz so wtf" List 10 songs from the top 100 that are even remotley rooted in Jazz. I know you're basically right, but Pop (and rock to a lesser extent) has removed itself soooooooooooo far from Jazz.
tempest-- 09.26.13	i know what im talking about i read it on wikipedia
RadicalEd 09.26.13	Bow to the almighty wikipedia lord.
Smial 09.26.13	jazz was my fav genre when i was like 5-8 always be turnin on that jazz station I don't really care much now
Keyblade 09.26.13	I unno bout y'all, but I personally see a gold-paved path to elite-dom
treeqt. 09.26.13	plebs in this itt - _-
Keyblade 09.26.13	ititt
Friday13th 09.26.13	there's no such thing as a true opposite to a style of music (opposite of music = dead silence), I just contrasted two elements of jazz and pop I think most would agree with. @RadicalEd don't let em tell you that you're less intelligent for having respect for jazz but not enjoying it. We all hold different values.
DrMaximus 09.26.13	_____________
tempest-- 09.26.13	if the opposite of music is dead silence what is 4'33"
Smial 09.26.13	lol
treeqt. 09.26.13	"I just contrasted two elements of jazz and pop I think most would agree with." You can't say Jazz is the antithesis of Pop and then compare Free Jazz and Pop. I mean you can but that makes you look like a retard and I don't think that's what you're going for.
dimsim3478 09.26.13	"4'33" is whatever sounds are made by the musicians NOT playing their instruments (i.e. there's still sound).
treeqt. 09.26.13	"if the opposite of music is dead silence what is 4'33"" Silence = ¬Music Music = ¬Silence 4'33 = ¬Silence => 4'33 = Music Wow that was easy.
tempest-- 09.26.13	i know damn guys so srs on the net shit fuck dick ass balls
dimsim3478 09.26.13	"Silence = ¬Music Music = ¬Silence 4'33 = ¬Silence => 4'33 = Music" Failed this shit on my philosophy exam. lol
JamieTwort 09.26.13	Nice rec Decaying ;)
Ecnalzen 09.26.13	Maybe you should try some jazz fusion. Its a little less out there than regular ass jazz. Or you could listen to Jizue - Novel. Its jazz and post rock and its a beautiful thing.
treeqt. 09.26.13	"regular ass jazz" what's that? "Failed this shit on my philosophy exam. lol" I wish they'd let me take philosophy courses as a math major ~_ ~
YankeeDudel 09.26.13	Jazz is cool. If you aint cool you aint like jazz.
VisionsFromTheDarkSide 09.26.13	Never been into jazz that much but I appreciate the talent that goes behind it, prefer all the wanky stuff than the smooth stuff
dimsim3478 09.26.13	"I wish they'd let me take philosophy courses as a math major ~_ ~" I'm talking 9th grade philosophy.
dimsim3478 09.26.13	Jizue - Novel [2]
treeqt. 09.26.13	Grade 9 philosophy was the worst. Couldn't even call that philosophy but rather applied ethics. We watched Kubrick movies though, that was cool. I wish we talked about logic. But we didn't. Like at all. In 6 or 7 years of philosophy. :[
Havey 09.26.13	I have to wonder what your obsession with structure is all about. I'd say the appeal of jazz is primarily found in performance/execution and is not compositional. The interaction between the musicians, the intricacies and spontaneity of the improvisation... But that is not to say that jazz can't be compositionally interesting (listen: Andrew Hill - Point of Departure)
Havey 09.26.13	"if the opposite of music is dead silence what is 4'33"" not the opposite of music, because it's not dead silence any further questions?
treeqt. 09.26.13	what's dead silence even
MO 09.26.13	"I'd say the appeal of jazz is primarily found in performance/execution and is not compositional. The interaction between the musicians, the intricacies and spontaneity of the improvisation..." yep no one's put it better. having predictable structure all the time gets tiresome. jazz is just a free form of music. held to no boundaries
Friday13th 09.26.13	@Lloyd Newgreen and ilovetree Wow, word games do not equal logic. Thank you, Havey
treeqt. 09.26.13	r u stupid x D
SirDrumsalot 09.26.13	Jazz drummers can kick some balls.
ethos 09.26.13	rasputin, winesburg, yankee, and havey nailed it listen to more jazz! keep listening until you find something you remotely enjoy if you really want to get into it and then go from there. there's all sorts of composition ideas/emotions in jazz, i actually feel like it is one the most open and unappreciated genres of music! have fun, white boy
RadicalEd 09.26.13	so your saying. Everybody who has the same taste in music as you nails it... huuuh. Interesting.
MeatSalad 09.26.13	Just listen to more miles Davis, youll get it eventually
Havey 09.26.13	same taste huh http://puu.sh/4ALKB.png http://puu.sh/4ALJR.png hmm, i dont see it
bakkermaarten007 09.26.13	Jazz has the power to create a very cozy and outgoing atmosphere in groups of people. But I don't enjoy it much as an attentive/lonely listening experience.
Cygnatti 09.26.13	You guys r silly.
pedro70512 09.26.13	Coltrane does with Jazz what Isis do with metal. The music takes you on a spiritual journey. It lifts you out of your crappy world and gives you hope that there is something greater out there, whether it's heaven or just a purpose for things.
mryrtmrnfoxxxy 09.26.13	you can be on the site for a day and get a feature, it just depends on whether or not It's.... diffe1[2.06.12 "what's ha7ppeni[9ng?]
treeqt. 09.26.13	:")
Gwyn. 09.26.13	Just listen it's the only way you'll find what you wanna find so much
Cygnatti 09.26.13	Opposite of pop how?
Gwyn. 09.26.13	"Coltrane does with Jazz what Isis do with metal." I just found my new profile name
bakkermaarten007 09.26.13	Any music genre will sound better as you listen more to it. That's not exclusive to music but basically to every single matter. As you see a person more, he/she becomes more attractive, as you see a commercial more, you're more likely to buy the product.
treeqt. 09.26.13	idk i feel like it's the exact opposite for most things in life
bakkermaarten007 09.26.13	It's just neuroscience ilovetree. But maybe the things you see too often have a reverse effect. lol I'm no neuroscientist.
ethos 09.26.13	lmao those pics destroyed me. calm down, radicaled everything's gonna be alright. here ya go, kool kat: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFRsgGF80To ~close your eyes briefly but without rush, wrap yourself with the finest silk, caress the most luxurious velvet, drink the finest Bordeaux and kiss your first love on the cheek, feel it, it is the most elegant expression of love turned to music~ and why would i agree with someone who doesn't have the same taste as me (that immediately) on a genre which i feel as though i appreciate and spend a good amount of my time on? i mean, yeah someone with different taste could be absolutely right in their opinion but i'm not gonna back it unless i feel the same way or hear it for myself lol
pedro70512 09.26.13	"as you see a commercial more, you're more likely to buy the product." Or get pissed off that it keeps delaying your youtube video and vow never to buy it ever again.
MeatSalad 09.26.13	Bakker has a point but for a lot of things there's a rise and then a steady fall. Sometimes this applies to music too
treeqt. 09.26.13	"It's just neuroscience ilovetree. But maybe the things you see too often have a reverse effect. lol I'm no neuroscientist." It might be true for music (some of it/all of it, idk) but it's definitely not true for attraction to people (from my experience) and the absolute exact total 100% opposite for commercials.
bakkermaarten007 09.26.13	"Or get pissed off that it keeps delaying your youtube video and vow never to buy it ever again." That's when your mind is set on something else. You immediately want to see that video, so anything that disrupts that video unconsciously gets associated with annoying. It's actually funny that some big entreprises with their large marketing budgets don't acknowledge that. However, in a more or less neutral situation that principle works perfectly. Unconsciously the message will get more plausible as you encounter it more often.
Cygnatti 09.26.13	"Any genre sounds as you listen to more of it." Really?!? I wish I was you guys.
Yotimi 09.26.13	How about a couple really easy to get into Jazz album recs? Herbie Hancock - Head Hunters David Axelrod - Seriously Deep
bakkermaarten007 09.26.13	"It might be true for music (some of it/all of it, idk) but it's definitely not true for attraction to people (from my experience) and the absolute exact total 100% opposite for commercials." Well, every person's biology is different. Some states of the brain can influence modal behaviour and transform it to an irregular behavioral form (for instance: depressive patients will have no problems at all recalling bad memories and will have a very hard time to recall happy moments, more so these depressive patients are more likely to show impulsive shopping behavior to get a temporary relieve from their illness) Not suggesting you'd be depressed, but you do differentiate from the mass. =)
mryrtmrnfoxxxy 09.26.13	sup toyimi
bakkermaarten007 09.26.13	""Any genre sounds better as you listen to more of it." Really?!? I wish I was you guys." It doesn't necessarily sound GOOD Cygnatti, but it will sound better =)
PunchforPunch 09.26.13	do u even quando quando quando quando
treeqt. 09.26.13	i don't think that's the problem for him Yotimi. i feel more like he just hasn't found his type of jazz.
ethos 09.26.13	wtf is going on
PunchforPunch 09.26.13	yeah yotimi rec him shit like michael buble ffs
pedro70512 09.26.13	@bakkermaarten -- fair enough. the digital age is ruining us. #vinylisbetter I'm a big fan of jazz crossover artists like Cynic and Intronaut. Even if you don't like jazz, there are some fascinating things about it that can be applied to other styles.
bakkermaarten007 09.26.13	I wish I had money to buy vinyl =/
Havey 09.26.13	"If something is boring after two minutes, try it for four. If still boring, then eight. Then sixteen. Then thirty-two. Eventually one discovers that it is not boring at all." -John Cage with his Zen powers just keep listening : ^ )
ethos 09.26.13	preach
zakalwe 09.26.13	50s, needle in my arm, sat in a smoke den with the cats, listening to a beat poet scatting nonsense while Chet plays on. Nice. "The digital age is ruining us"
wabbit 09.26.13	do more drugs
treeqt. 09.26.13	essentially
ZippaThaRippa 09.26.13	Trying to provoke thoughtful discussion on Sputnik. Heh
omnipanzer 09.26.13	Listening to good Jazz is like watching someone put one red lite-brite tab in the middle of a bunch of green ones. It looks totally out of place until you pull back and see a random yellow one and then blue and so on. You don't dislike it you're just not sure where it's going. Then once the camera pulls back the rest of the way you see it's really a Christmas tree with multi colored bulbs and that was the only place that tab could have possible gone. Dave Brubeck - Time Out Herb Alpert - Whipped Cream & Other Delights ^ those are some pretty light lifting, these two are a lot more down & dirty: Miles Davis - A Tribute to Jack Johnson Eric Dolphy - Out to Lunch
omnipanzer 09.26.13	do more drugs +1
Crawl 09.26.13	Miles Davis' Kind of Blue bores me, so yeah, I can't see how it is one of the best albums ever
Havey 09.26.13	it's not
Trebor. 09.26.13	try some DJ Jazzy Jeff he might be a bit easier for you
ZilbelPing 09.26.13	If you watch a big band or a combo live, you'll get it instantly. If not, there's no hope That being said, listen to Count Basie for "structured". One of the best big band composers and big band jazz is generally structured.
Cygnatti 09.26.13
AgainAnd 09.26.13	Are you performing 4'33'', Cyg?
wabbit 09.26.13	3:30 am back from a party messed up on stuff drinking a stout / smoking a joint put on a love supreme you'll get it
NordicMindset 09.26.13	i hate jazz too
NordicMindset 09.26.13	just bores me
treeqt. 09.26.13	greenlinkinmuse
Greyvy 09.26.13	u shud check out wes montgomery you bitch
frigyourgenre 09.26.13	i am 13 years old and i apologise for my generation i know true music like ac/dc metallica and disturbed (2)
skeames1214 09.26.13	mostly saxophones and black guys, right?
treeqt. 09.26.13	saxophones suck ~duck~
Cygnatti 09.26.13	Saxophone? Nan, u mean sexophone.
ncguitar 09.26.13	is btbam jazz too?
treeqt. 09.26.13	yes the nastiest kind of
EasyModeDX 09.28.13	John Zorn is most of the jazz I need. Also check out shining (nor) what I see in jazz is ever changing song structures, improvisation, experimental potential, great musicianship and sometimes gives me a feeling these musicians are one with their instruments, it's a structurally varied genre with lots of different approaches. That's also why I love Billy Cobham's work.
rockandmetaljunkie 09.28.13	Saxophones are amazing.
Havey 10.06.13	listmaker have you even listened to my rec yet or has your lisztomania gotten the best of you
Havey 10.14.13	awaiting response
klap 10.14.13	phoenix are heavily influenced by jazz
YetAnotherBrick 10.14.13	jazz is a journey for me. i love the shapes that the notes make. spirals, splats, sometimes squares. i love the atmosphere of it too, but that's something i appreciate in all music. i just love hearing the difference between how the song starts and where it ends up, depending completely on the impulses of the musicians
MisterTornado 10.14.13	http://i.imgur.com/G125bnF.png
PunchforPunch 10.14.13	destruction is a form of creation agreed
TMobotron 10.14.13	I rec this as often as I can, but check out Bohren & Der Club of Gore's album Sunset Mission. It's jazzy AF but its main appeal comes from its dark, atmospheric sound. It has a lot of crossover appeal IMO, and you don't necessarily have to be into jazz to like it, but it might help bridge the gap.
MisterTornado 10.14.13	steely dan, phil collins horn-samples
YetAnotherBrick 10.14.13	"I rec this as often as I can, but check out Bohren & Der Club of Gore's album Sunset Mission. " hell yes
toxin. 10.14.13	can't read all of this thread but i'm not into jazz either. well that's not true, i think jazz can be fun to listen to and i rly wanna learn jazz/improv style piano. but hearing a guy solo (gifted tho they may be) for like 5 minutes just isn't interesting to me personally it's all opinions tho
PunchforPunch 10.14.13	u don't like bill evans and Keith Jarrett?
treeqt. 10.14.13	"I rec this as often as I can, but check out Bohren & Der Club of Gore's album Sunset Mission. It's jazzy AF but its main appeal comes from its dark, atmospheric sound. It has a lot of crossover appeal IMO, and you don't necessarily have to be into jazz to like it, but it might help bridge the gap." http://i.imgur.com/U8oGG8Q.jpg
Hyperion1001 10.14.13	fuck off back to mu please
Acanthus 10.14.13	Acid jazz and other subgenre's hold my love, simply adore the vibe and flow.
treeqt. 10.14.13	http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6FPJOgfCkc best jazz agreed
Myrkur 10.14.13	Try these two albums: Charles Mingus - Let My Children Hear Music Keith Jarrett - The Koln Concert
SIMBOLIC 10.14.13	probs already been said BUT a "j" an "a" and two "z's"
SIMBOLIC 10.14.13	oh yeh oh yeh oh yeh oh yeh
Cygnatti 10.14.13	jazz suks and is gay
DrMaximus 10.14.13	What do I see in jazz? I see something more profound than you do, that's for sure.
skeames1214 10.14.13	Might not be the most challenging Jazz, but I just bought Stardust by Coltrane on vinyl and it's sweeeeeeeee oh man.
JokineAugustus 10.14.13	I knew a nice blonde named Jazz. I'd stare at her ass on 4th spare.