sry to hear

led zeppelin immigrant song

pity cant rope us erectus

Album Rating: 5.0

t/t on this is stupid cool

Album Rating: 5.0

Might bump this up - obsessed with that t/t rn

ed. aww yeah, Love Chant is finally starting click properly - up it goes!

Yeah the title track is classic. check the video on YouTube of Eric dolphy ridiculous solo on “Peggy’s blue skylight,” which lopes along similarly

Album Rating: 4.0

I hadn't gotten around to checking early Mingus and I must say I'm loving this one. So this was his 'breakout' of sorts? Hmm. The t/t does seem absurd for 1956

Album Rating: 4.0

Yeah for 56 this was impossibly cool. Revisiting now and it's amazing.

Album Rating: 4.0

A Foggy Day gets a bit annoying with all the honking though XD

Album Rating: 5.0

this really is the fucking song

Album Rating: 4.0

Nah foggy day is peak Mingus

Album Rating: 5.0

Foggy Day is essential yes

Idk guys, this feels kind of restrained and rigid compared to Black Saint. Black Saint has this raw intensity to it that I love. I mean, ignoring the fact I'm partial to the theme and atmosphere, it's just a more visceral experience. The compositions are super interesting (I hesitate to say the songs have 'hooks', but they kind of do in an unconventional way) and there's a good variety of sounds across the board. It's hard for me to connect with this much at all though. It mostly just sounds like traditional jazz to me. I enjoyed it well enough as background music when doing dishes and cooking dinner, but even when I tried actively listening to it, it still sounded like it was all happening in the background. Jazz has been maybe the hardest genre of music for me to get into. I often call death metal albums too 'homogeneous,' but I'd apply that even more towards jazz. It's funny because I love jazz fusions, but straight-up jazz like this is often exhausting to listen to intently.

What is it about this you guys find so essential? Not trying to shit on something you all love, I'm genuinely just curious what makes an album like this a 5. I want to know what others are hearing that I'm not, after 2 spins -- during which (both times) the album ended and some other old school jazz started playing without me being able to tell much of a difference. Perhaps I just need more time with it, but Black Saint was pretty much immediate for me, so Idk.

Album Rating: 4.0

Black Saint is *probably* (assistance needed) unique, you likely won’t replicate that experience anywhere. It’s a phenomenal album, of course. The fact you enjoy it means the potential is there but it’s funny you mention “jazz fusion” because I actually get those vibes from that one. Third stream / flamenco influence after all. It’s a bit of a fusion, of sorts

To your broader question / point, I’d say it took me many years to really GET jazz. It was mostly appreciation at the artistry / skill (or whatever) for ages. Over time it started to slow down so it wasn’t overwhelming. Familiarity brought out distinct qualities etc. Apologies if I’m not saying anything revolutionary here. I didn’t ever learn theory, so it’s all instinctive. One thing I would say is maybe try and appreciate the more visceral side of jazz, like don’t you just get all hyped about the sheer unfiltered energy or passion that comes across? Then there’s the more solemn moodier side. It’s all there. I think attaching to vague feelings in an instinctive way comes before the understanding / knowledge (which again, I don’t really understand because theory is ??? to me )

Album Rating: 4.0

'Love Chant' is so incredibly blessed.

Album Rating: 5.0

Yeah, re. both above comments I think Black Saint is very easy to approach without needing to view it through the lens of jazz, whereas this is way off on the opposite end — the t/t has its ear catching moments, but for the most part, you're either loving those chords and motifs and hanging off the end of those grooves, or it's much tougher sell. I defs did not *get* it at first, and it took ages replaying this before I started to realise just how much shape and character moments like e.g. the little break they play on Love Chant at the end of each phase add! Ig the reason this holds up so well within bop/post-bop has to do with how well those little composerly flourishes punctuate what's otherwise a p lackadaisical set of grooves (not to mention the timelessly great motifs in the bookend tracks), but idk this whole record is so slick and stylish to me where Black Saint is overblown and spectacular — very hard to compare the two beyond that, would struggle to say which I preferred if Black Saint's guitar sections didn't feel so phoned-in compared to its big band masterclass

None of that is probably very helpful, so I'll just say to peep the Clown as a more approachable stepping stone between the two. First track is all ear-catching bombast, the third is a perfect go-to if you're trying to pin down something tangible in steadygoing bop, comparable to the t/t here in that regard

"It’s a bit of a fusion, of sorts"
Yeah, I can hear it.

I wasn't aware of the gap in his discog between this and Black Saint until I looked just now, but it makes a lot more sense to me why I connect with one way more than the other. Actually only 7 years apart, but he released so much in-between, it looks like.
I think I just need to forge ahead. I'm not gonna linger on this for too long, but I'll come back to it. There have been other albums in the genre where the pattern has basically been: play the album for the first time and think, "this shit is boring as hell", but keep it playing in the background while doing chores, then have it on some more in the background when gaming or whatever, start noticing motifs and subtle little details, and eventually come to enjoy it. It's rare I find many truly exceptional albums, but I usually find something to like with most of them if I push hard enough. I just find myself asking, "Is it worth it to put in this much effort?"
Gonna give Clown a shot rn

Album Rating: 5.0

Yep exactly — don't turn it into a chore, just keep it in rotation, use it as a touchstone while you check other stuff, and see what cooks. Will say that this is a far easier album than Black Saint to throw on casually, I'd struggle to find an actively bad time to jam it

Album Rating: 4.0

Black Saint is the 8 Mile of 60s jazz

I thought that was In a Silent Way.