If you had the moral obligation to check the entire backstory of every artist's work you consume then you'd be very busy indeed

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I believe they should be punished and imprisoned for their actions and that's all I'm going to say on the matter.

I agree with that con. I believe we’ve totally failed our justice system by killing this guy in cold blood rather than putting him thru fair trial. It fucks up everyone’s perceptions. Just imagine how less sad people would be if he got the death sentence instead of getting murdered. They’d be like “eh he probs deserved it.” Now they don’t cuz ignorance

That’s so true too tho. Who, when listening to a new artist, goes like “WAIT, lemme make sure he didn’t beat his pregnant girlfriend hol up”

We’d be some busy ass bugs, and there would be a whole lot of music no longer worth

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I don't believe in the death sentence whatsoever but I agree with you there

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I just think there needs to be a point where we as a society say "hold up, maybe we're taking this 'art from artist' thing a little too far". art's important but it shouldn't be held so sacred that we put it ahead of basic human decency.



at the very least, I just think that when an artist's crimes are known, they should be publicized more highly and associated more strongly with that person's name instead of being pushed to the back of public consciousness over time like we've seen with people like Lennon. make sure more people are aware of it and then let them decide whether or not they want to continue to support their art.

100%
The glossing over is worse than ever with this guy

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I agree with you there, I am mostly for this trend of a call-out culture. by having discussions like these, however, we are given the opportunity to make it known how awful and inexcusable his crimes were. I just think we disagree on social obligations as a music listener

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the only obligation I think someone should have as a listener is to keep somebody's actions in mind and make sure they don't glorify or celebrate the person behind the art. it's a choice people should obviously make for themselves, and while I admit I'd probably be disappointed in one of my friends if they decided to listen to XXX's music while knowing what he did, all I really want is for people to just be aware and be responsible.

Well if it's known it's up to you to decide as you said and con pointed out. Personally I can still enjoy the art for what it is most of the time. But I would never financially support an artist I find deplorable. Hvis Lyset Tar Oss is great for example, but I'm not about to fund that fucker's cabin fever.

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the listener should be socially conscious, yes, and understand that glorifying an artist who has had a history like X's could be considered socially rude. basically all comes down to being socially considerate and polite towards others which is something everyone should practice

"and while I admit I'd probably be disappointed in one of my friends if they decided to listen to XXX's music while knowing what he did"

guess u dont listen 2 much trap then

id be more disappointed if a friend listened to xxx's music cause they thought it was good

lets not listen to black metal either they all satanist murderers

doesnt sound good in my ears anymore

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Acting like Varg wasn't framed for everything by a giant multinational conspiracy. ;)

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"Well if it's known it's up to you to decide as you said and con pointed out. Personally I can still enjoy the art for what it is most of the time. But I would never financially support an artist I find deplorable. Hvis Lyset Tar Oss is great for example, but I'm not about to fund that fucker's cabin fever."



yeah I mostly agree with that. like I said a few pages back, I enjoy the music of bands like Emperor and Dissection with actual murderers in them. I think I kind of excuse Emperor since Faust only played on one album and served his time and seems genuinely remorseful, but the actions of Jon Nodtveidt are a lot harder to reconcile and something I struggle with.

@tranqyl: lol

think u shouldnt spin trap then cause all the best trap is when its by actual current thugs who kill people and probably hit women

I've bitten by tongue a fair bit but separation of art and artist is something I always enjoy talking about so I'ma chime in, but not before I [2] everything Con said.

"You guys aren't wrong but his art is such a manifestation of himself its really hard to separate the two imo"

This is definitely worth considering and brings up the point that some forms of art are more difficult to separate from the context of their creation than others. You can have cases where the transgressions of an artist do not inform the subject matter of their art (Brand New). There's art in which lyrics can - but don't necessarily - reflect the views of bad people and may (or may not) be symptomatic of some much larger issues (NSBM, power electronics). You've even got idealistic tripe made by terrible people, the sentiments of which do not reflect the actions of the people conveying them (John Lennon's "Imagine").

It's all a matter of where you personally draw the line, and it really should be stressed that said line is arbitrary and always subject to your conscious and unconscious biases. I don't think anyone has made the argument that X's art exonerates him or makes his actions "more forgivable"; there are simply people out there that prefer to listen to music in a uhhh... vacuum, for lack of a better term, because allowing your opinion to be informed by extra-musical circumstances limits the amount of art you could potentially enjoy.

Hey, some people enjoy listening to music made by hateful individuals because, assuming the art is a reflection of who created it, their work can offer insights into twisted minds. This also can be done without endorsing them as people or lending credence to any potentially underlying, problematic causes. Why do y'all think people find serial killers so fascinating?

Cheers jac. Solid and well articulated points ya cunt.

dumbest argument to focus on probably ever made

almost as bad as trump turning universe into star wars

there's vid of Jon after a concert where the interviewer asked him about his crimes and he seemed pretty anxious and remorseful to me, but I haven't seen it in a while so idk. The difference with him at least is he can't benefit from your consuming his art anymore.