[QUOTE=Mr. Ron]I was just coming from a perspective most people on this earth have: Flirting with others while you are taken is disrespectful.[/QUOTE]

It's disrespectful even if it's a core part of the person's personality and they have absolutely no intention of letting it go anywhere?

I cannot for the life of me understand why some people insist on being so hung up on this.

I can see why people have a problem with flirting, but the act itself is so vague and can be considered so many different things. I dont know, I dont think there is anything wrong with it too much.

But then again, if I saw my boyfriend doing meaningless flirting with another girl, chances are I wouldnt be too impressed (naturally).

Everyone has flirty nature inside of them.

wow, nice to see that I sparked some kind of debate here.

[QUOTE]I cannot for the life of me understand why some people insist on being so hung up on this.[/QUOTE]

insecurity

[QUOTE=Illmatic]insecurity[/QUOTE]

Well, yeah, there's that.

Some people are just natural flirts. And it saddens me to see so many people who, as soon as they start dating someone, stop seeing that as a part of who they are and start looking at it as either a warning sign or a character flaw. It's insane.

Well my gf is one of those friendly, "hug is my handshake" girls and is a little flirty, and it bugs me a little if I see it but in the end it doesn't go nowhere, and she always loves me rather than them, so no real harm done.

[QUOTE=Illmatic]Well my gf is one of those friendly, "hug is my handshake" girls and is a little flirty, and it bugs me a little if I see it but in the end it doesn't go nowhere, and she always loves me rather than them, so no real harm done.[/QUOTE]

Well yah, it'll bug people. As Steerpike's veiw is probably one that everyone should adopt (which would improve relationships by a huge amount, I'd say) its still something that will bug people regardless.

Flirting is okay, but there are borderlines with all of it. But if its harmless and whatnot, people need to stop getting so distraught with it.

Well I don't get seriously bothered about it.

[QUOTE=Illmatic]Well I don't get seriously bothered about it.[/QUOTE]

Oh yah, I know/knew what you meant. It was just a general statement I was throwing out.

Everyone's first reaction is to be bothered by it in a little way. But a healthy mindset is to stop and remind yourself that it's part of who this person is. They still chose you out of everyone else they could have had, so just let them do their thing.

I've been dabbling in psychology off and on for the last couple years specifically because I want to avoid letting myself get bent out of shape by situations like this. A lot of people would be a lot healthier mentally speaking if they'd just take the time to learn where these knee-jerk reactions are coming from. Once you learn that, you're no longer at their mercy.

Steerpike, your mindset of relationships is very refreshing. I am the same way, as well as my boyfriend which is why we get along so well and have gone 9 months without fighting or arguing (not saying people that do necessarily have a bad relationship)

But I was wondering, what do other girls/people or girlfriends think of your perspective? Its very chill and realistic and I was just wondering if anyone has made a comment or anything about it.

[QUOTE=Steerpike]Everyone's first reaction is to be bothered by it in a little way. But a healthy mindset is to stop and remind yourself that it's part of who this person is. They still chose you out of everyone else they could have had, so just let them do their thing.

I've been dabbling in psychology off and on for the last couple years specifically because I want to avoid letting myself get bent out of shape by situations like this. A lot of people would be a lot healthier mentally speaking if they'd just take the time to learn where these knee-jerk reactions are coming from. Once you learn that, you're no longer at their mercy.[/QUOTE]
I've been thinking since last night about my views on flirting. You're view was correct and mine was overboard...it's weird, you're the only person on these boards that actually makes me think and later change things about my views on certain topics.

I now do recognize flirting as a character trait, but as always there are limits to things.

[QUOTE=purplefeet]But I was wondering, what do other girls/people or girlfriends think of your perspective? Its very chill and realistic and I was just wondering if anyone has made a comment or anything about it.[/QUOTE]

Most people see me as either very analytical and level-headed, or self-help-ish and out-there. Depends on how open they are to my opinions.

[QUOTE=Mr. Ron]I've been thinking since last night about my views on flirting. You're view was correct and mine was overboard...it's weird, you're the only person on these boards that actually makes me think and later change things about my views on certain topics.

I now do recognize flirting as a character trait, but as always there are limits to things.[/QUOTE]

Good to hear I've gotten you thinking about the subject. Everyone needs to question their ideas now and again.

Limits isn't really the word I would use, though. Certain actions which you would consider "off-limits" probably wouldn't even fit the definition of flirting anyway.

So, I started workin with a girl I went to high school and grade school with, but never once talked to. We talk often now, she got my msn and myspace, and we talk quite a bit. She's the total preppy girl, clean, doesn't do drugs, drinks, has the stuck up friends, and is totally gorgeous. And I want to tell her I like her, but then I look at myself. I'm a grunge rocker to the core. I have long greasy hair, a messy goatee, perma fried look, loose clothes, occasionally ripped jeans, I smoke, I drink too much, and I sing about nothing at all. And I want her to give me a chance, but I know that her friends don't like me, and we prolly wouldn't work out... But I still want to try. She's a girl, that for the first time in my life, I don't want to just have sex with. Fine, call me a sex hound, or whatever, but I just want to date her.

Like I said, problem is, I don't know how well we would interact as a couple. I mean, it couldn't be anyworse then my relationship with the last gf. If any of you remember there was 3 girls I liked, and everyone said to try the 2nd. Well, she turned out to be a crazy bitch when we were dating, and would freak out for anything I did. But ya, this girl is a really nice girl, who I get along with, but I'm not sure if she could deal with me. I'll admit I have a lot of emotional problems, hell my boss yells at me all the time because everytime I do anything I say sorry, I apologize too much and always feel bad for everything I do.

So, I don't know if I should tell this girl I like her... or just bottle it up like I usually do

uh maybe work on your self esteem a little

[QUOTE=Shady Ultima]So, I started workin with a girl I went to high school and grade school with, but never once talked to. We talk often now, she got my msn and myspace, and we talk quite a bit. She's the total preppy girl, clean, doesn't do drugs, drinks, has the stuck up friends, and is totally gorgeous. And I want to tell her I like her, but then I look at myself. I'm a grunge rocker to the core. I have long greasy hair, a messy goatee, perma fried look, loose clothes, occasionally ripped jeans, I smoke, I drink too much, and I sing about nothing at all. And I want her to give me a chance, but I know that her friends don't like me, and we prolly wouldn't work out... But I still want to try. She's a girl, that for the first time in my life, I don't want to just have sex with. Fine, call me a sex hound, or whatever, but I just want to date her.

Like I said, problem is, I don't know how well we would interact as a couple. I mean, it couldn't be anyworse then my relationship with the last gf. If any of you remember there was 3 girls I liked, and everyone said to try the 2nd. Well, she turned out to be a crazy bitch when we were dating, and would freak out for anything I did. But ya, this girl is a really nice girl, who I get along with, but I'm not sure if she could deal with me. I'll admit I have a lot of emotional problems, hell my boss yells at me all the time because everytime I do anything I say sorry, I apologize too much and always feel bad for everything I do.

So, I don't know if I should tell this girl I like her... or just bottle it up like I usually do[/QUOTE]

Where to start...

First off, stop trying to file yourself and others into these sorts of categories. I remember not long ago reading a story about a woman making 6 figures a year who dated a dirt-poor, grungy graphic artist with a wicked sense of humor and loved him to death.

Second, you need to stop internalizing other people's perspectives of you. Whenever you walk into a room, you have to maintain the mindset that you belong there, and if someone has a problem with that, it's their fault for being on the wrong page.

If you're concerned about your greasy image, just shower. Women aren't as concerned with how much you've got as with what you do with what you have. Play up the strengths, minimize the weaknesses.

Don't let her beauty or status intimidate you. You need to maintain the attitude that good looks and money are not enough to impress you. People with those are a dime a dozen.

You need to consider every positive trait you have and develop that, hype it up. It's all about turning a strength into a virtue.

Also, stop with the guilt! Stop apologizing for everything! You're doing yourself so much harm by doing that. I used to be the same way, but I learned to stop, so it is possible.

You need to work on yourself a bit before dating will become easier for you.

One thing that will help: screw what her friends think! You're not trying to impress them, so if they don't like you, it's their problem, not yours.

You need to find ways to boost your self-esteem. Keep a journal of goals and accomplishments. List all of your positive and negative traits and detail ways to improve upon the former and minimize or eliminate the latter.

As for the girl herself, casually flirt with her, tease her a bit. But don't put your feelings on the table too quickly. Never play an ace when a deuce will do.

[QUOTE=Shady Ultima]So, I started workin with a girl I went to high school and grade school with, but never once talked to. We talk often now, she got my msn and myspace, and we talk quite a bit. She's the total preppy girl, clean, doesn't do drugs, drinks, has the stuck up friends, and is totally
BLAH BLAH BLAH
So, I don't know if I should tell this girl I like her... or just bottle it up like I usually do[/QUOTE]

buy some soap?

jks, i know exactly how you feel man, but seriously, maybe smarten yourself up, make yourself look nice one day and go for it

but not TOO obvously, if you suddenly turn into a clean shaven suit wearing teddy boy shes gonna smell a rat...

get some self confidence...

Ok, I have a quick question that anyone can help me with...

What are some creative things you can do when you go out with a girl (for example, anything OTHER than dinner-and-a-movie)? I mean, the dinner and/or movie rarely fails, but hey, it doesn't hurt to be creative, right?

Picnic? Shopping? Mini golf?

[QUOTE=Steerpike]
First off, stop trying to file yourself and others into these sorts of categories. I remember not long ago reading a story about a woman making 6 figures a year who dated a dirt-poor, grungy graphic artist with a wicked sense of humor and loved him to death.
[/QUOTE]
Alright, that actually made me feel better. I don't think I'm funny though.

(gah, there's that lack of self esteem again...)

[QUOTE=Steerpike]
Second, you need to stop internalizing other people's perspectives of you. Whenever you walk into a room, you have to maintain the mindset that you belong there, and if someone has a problem with that, it's their fault for being on the wrong page.
[/QUOTE]
That's not a bad idea. Like I mentioned, emotional problems run strong in me.

[QUOTE=Steerpike]
If you're concerned about your greasy image, just shower. Women aren't as concerned with how much you've got as with what you do with what you have. Play up the strengths, minimize the weaknesses.

Don't let her beauty or status intimidate you. You need to maintain the attitude that good looks and money are not enough to impress you. People with those are a dime a dozen.
[/QUOTE]

I shower daily... or at least, daily if I'm goin out. If I'm not goin anywhere and just sitting on my computer all day, I won't even bother. I need to look into some shampoo that'd get rid of greasy hair...

I guess a part of it is the fact that I usually can't win over beautiful girls. When I do... they're too young.

[QUOTE=Steerpike]
You need to consider every positive trait you have and develop that, hype it up. It's all about turning a strength into a virtue.
[/QUOTE]

Care to elaborate on that a bit, I don't get it. Sorry

[QUOTE=Steerpike]
Also, stop with the guilt! Stop apologizing for everything! You're doing yourself so much harm by doing that. I used to be the same way, but I learned to stop, so it is possible.
[/QUOTE]

I'm workin on it, my boss is actually trying to help me :chug: for good bosses.

[QUOTE=Steerpike]
One thing that will help: screw what her friends think! You're not trying to impress them, so if they don't like you, it's their problem, not yours.
[/QUOTE]

It's not that I'm worried about what they think... I think SHE will care about what her friends think

[QUOTE=Steerpike]
You need to find ways to boost your self-esteem. Keep a journal of goals and accomplishments. List all of your positive and negative traits and detail ways to improve upon the former and minimize or eliminate the latter.
[/QUOTE]

Hmm... This is a good idea.

[QUOTE=Corkofski]maybe smarten yourself up, make yourself look nice one day and go for it

but not TOO obvously, if you suddenly turn into a clean shaven suit wearing teddy boy shes gonna smell a rat...[/QUOTE]

I tie my hair back for work every day, and I shave (except the goatee) I don't think a suit would be a good idea for where I'm working though lmao

Thanks. I guess the real point here is... I need some self confidance...

[QUOTE=Chaindrive]Picnic? Shopping? Mini golf?[/QUOTE]

Add onto that:

-homemade candlelit dinner for two
-stargazing
-watch an eclipse
-wine-tasting tour at a local winery
-a walk along the beach/lake/park/etc.
-cruising around town to a mutual favorite album
-pub crawl
-window shopping in the city artistic district

[QUOTE=Shady Ultima]Alright, that actually made me feel better. I don't think I'm funny though.

(gah, there's that lack of self esteem again...)[/quote]

Go down to Barnes & Noble and buy some high-rated books on comedy writing. Try taking a class in improv.

[quote]That's not a bad idea. Like I mentioned, emotional problems run strong in me.[/quote]

Same here. I have clinical depression, and spent most of my life being kicked in the face by my peers both literally and metaphorically for being "too weird." But I got fed up with being treated that way and completely turned my life around.

[quote]I shower daily... or at least, daily if I'm goin out. If I'm not goin anywhere and just sitting on my computer all day, I won't even bother. I need to look into some shampoo that'd get rid of greasy hair...[/quote]

Look into some of the various Pert Plus shampoos. They have different formulas for different types of hair.

[quote]I guess a part of it is the fact that I usually can't win over beautiful girls. When I do... they're too young.[/quote]

You'll learn soon enough that her beauty is unimportant.

[quote]Care to elaborate on that a bit, I don't get it. Sorry[/quote]

Simply put, it's the essence of being cool. Whatever good quality you have, you have to continually improve and expand upon it. You then have to make sure people know about it without looking like you're bragging.

You have to find the impetus to turn yourself from good to great by constantly improving on your talents and skills and continually learning new ones.

[quote]It's not that I'm worried about what they think... I think SHE will care about what her friends think[/quote]

Believe me, if you impress her enough with your actions, she'll begin trusting her own judgment over theirs.

Recent update - She's 'seeing' somebody... :(