Friday13th: Prog - A Beginning - Discovery Rd 10

Friday13th 07.21.21	Voting ends next Wednesday, July 28.
Divaman 07.21.21	Ooo, you snuck this one there on me. I didn't expect to see it until tomorrow.
Mythodea 07.21.21	Here we gooooooooooo.... Last round fellas, hope it's a good one!
e210013 07.21.21	Let's go the last round. I've already did my four listenings of Collegium Musicum and two of Kollektiv. Both are very different proposals, almost in the oposite sides. The fiorst one is more in the line of the classic prog, I mean symphonic, and the other is more jazzier and experimental. Still, I like both. It seems to be another tough journey. Happy week and enjoy it my friends.
bgillesp 07.21.21	I have also listened to both already and have a strong preference, but I will listen again to solidify my opinions for my full ranking.
bgillesp 07.21.21	I know it has ended but I’m honestly still trying to decide my preference from round 6
MiloRuggles 07.21.21	Ah, matched against the very individual that invited me! What a privilege. Sorry about that shit write up, I was in a rush. To make amends, let me suggest that if you have any interest in digging for obscure gems (I mean, look what we're doing here) and you listen to music on YouTube (a travesty, but often a necessary one) subscribe to Terminal Passage - the channel that Kollektiv is on. Whoever they are, they have a hell of a hit rate. Happy listening!
Friday13th 07.21.21	These definitely look interesting, can't wait. Say, anyone heard music from the band Black Midi? Their album Cavalcade is described as avant-prog and is the top of the rym 2021 charts.
Mythodea 07.21.21	avant-prog? I'd describe them as experimental, for sure, and they're more on the hardcore/jazz punk side, imagine Naked City's debut album
Friday13th 07.22.21	yeah I turned it on for a bit and thought it was only kinda prog
Mythodea 07.22.21	admittedly, it's a lot more ''prog'' in the literal sense than most prog bands out there
someone 07.22.21	oh shit, is this the last round?
Divaman 07.22.21	It's the last match up of the first round, yes.
Inoculaeted 07.22.21	Can anyone help me understand what krautrock is? I've bumped into this term a few times but I've never really been able to pin down what aspect of the music it relates to or why certain bands get this tag.
someone 07.22.21	it's mostly just recordings of sauerkraut squelching and flapping on the floor
Inoculaeted 07.22.21	The genres humble beginnings at the condiment station of a Nathan’s.
Divaman 07.22.21	"Kraut" is usually considered a derogatory English-word term for Germans, although I think when whoever forged the term "Krautrock" came up with it, it was intended to be more playful. Here's the first part of Wikipedia's definition: "Krautrock (also called kosmische Musik, German for 'cosmic music') is a broad genre of experimental rock that developed in West Germany in the late 1960s and early 1970s among artists who blended elements of psychedelic rock, electronic music, and avant-garde composition among other sources."
Inoculaeted 07.22.21	So it seems like a segment of prog rock that has a weirdly rigid blend of elements. I did a quick google on notable krautrock bands and I don't think I've spent any time with them except for Kraftwerk.
MiloRuggles 07.22.21	Maybe it's something you f E E l
Inoculaeted 07.22.21	I can feel that.
Divaman 07.22.21	I've gotta tell you, there are definitely times during the Collegium Musicum LP where I'd like to smack their keyboard player upside the head.
Divaman 07.22.21	>I did a quick google on notable krautrock bands and I don't think I've spent any time with them except for Kraftwerk. I don't know a lot of the others, but I LOVE Tangerine Dream. In fact, I think it was the last prog contest were I rec'd one of their albums.
bgillesp 07.22.21	Okay, I can solidly vote for Kollektiv on this one. It’s wild but not so much that it loses identity and discernible variety. It’s a very good album to me. Collegium Musicum is fine but not one of my favorites this year
e210013 07.23.21	In reality the term krautrock can be applied to many German bands with many varied music, Inoculaeted. Kraftwerk and especially Tangerine Dream and also Klaus Schulze are more in the side of electronic music. But you can check many other bands with completelly different styles. If you are intersted, I advise you to check in the first place, Can, AmonDull (both versions, Amon Dull and Amon Dull II), Ash Ra Tempel (both versions, Ashra, more electronic, and Ash Ra Tempel) and Popol Vuh. All are great in their own way, but very different. I think you can be surprised from what you are going to listen.
Inoculaeted 07.23.21	Thank you e210013! Will jam your krautest of recs.
Friday13th 07.23.21	"Krautrock" is extremely varied, but there are German prog bands that aren't Krautrock. I think Kraftwerk, Tangerine Dream, Harmonium, etc. are generally not Krautrock (though they may have some Krautrock albums). Electronic German bands are berlin school, progressive electronic, etc. The most clear examples of Krautrock would be like Can, Amon Dull II, and Faust, which is a unique style.
Friday13th 07.23.21	New Yes, my dudes: https://youtu.be/PbGEa7ju8bg
SharkTooth 07.23.21	Is it good though? I know that last record of theirs was kinda poopoo
Friday13th 07.23.21	It's okay. I think this song is better than Heaven and Earth's first released song.
Friday13th 07.23.21	Steve Howe and Alan White are the only classic era members left. I think they should have called it quits after Chris died, but apparently Chris wanted Yes to live on. We'll just have to see. I hear Anderson, Wakeman and Rabin are working on something as well.
Divaman 07.23.21	And poor Alan White is barely there. I don't know how much he participated in the recording of this album, but when they perform live, he's physically only capable of playing on 3 to 4 songs. They always have another drummer with them, and then White comes out just for the end of the shows.
e210013 07.23.21	Yeah, I forgot to mention Faust. Thanks Friday for added them.
e210013 07.23.21	This isn't a bad track indeed. It doesn't belong to their classic era, but is an honest track. It sounded nice to me. At least, it sounds like Yes. Thanks for the info and link Friday.
Jethro42 07.23.21	Krautrock is probably the prog subgenre I'm the least familiar with, and when I'm listening to some, It's leaving me cold most of the time, but it's just me. Thanks for the Yes link, Friday. They kinda annoy me nowadays, but I'll give an effort.
Zig 07.24.21	Checked both albums and for the first time I don't have an obvious winner. Very strong entries here.
TwigTW 07.26.21	another great match
Inoculaeted 07.26.21	@bgillesp "know it has ended but I’m honestly still trying to decide my preference from round 6" Round 6 in hindsight was also my greatest challenge to pick. I still listen to them both frequently.
Divaman 07.26.21	Might be just me this year, or the fact that the first round is longer than usual, but I'm not feeling a lot of these albums as much as I usually do. In any event: The Collegium Musicum album really isn't my style. I already mentioned that I didn't like a lot of the way they used the keyboards throughout (and I usually love keyboards) - for example, the harsh, church organ part. I also wasn't thrilled with the vocalist. There were little flourishes here and there that I enjoyed, but by and large, this LP just wasn't for me. The Kollektiv LP also had long passages that went right by me. (There is a lot of jazz in both of these albums.) But it felt more varied. (In this case, the extra length might have actually helped.) And I liked a lotto the little flute flourishes. I also liked some of the Allman-Brothers-sounding guitar parts on the track at about the 54-minute mark. On the whole, I enjoyed it more. So my vote goes to Kollektiv.
someone 07.26.21	"by and large, this LP just wasn't for me." shame
Jethro42 07.27.21	I've learned to appreciate both. Kollektiv got couple of great, sexy bass, melodic or nervous guitar sometimes a la King Crimson, soaring flute a la Jethro Tull and punchy jams, but most of them are just ordinary and tend to sound samey. It's often random sounds also, so it's hard to follow. For Collegium Musicum, we get a talented composer in the organist player who is mastering both rock and classical music. The weaknesses are the way guitar and drums sound like the 60's more than actual progressive music, but it's not a huge con, since it has psych flavour. ''Strange Themes '' are the strenght of the album, and also the finish track that reminds us ELP. My choice goes to Collegium Musicum for it's classical approach of progressive rock.
Pangea 07.27.21	I really liked both albums, but my favourite became clear after a couple of listens Kollektiv is great and jams a lot, i also always appreciate it if bands incoperate flutes, love flutes. But it does tend to drag a lot and i feel myself zoning out a couple of times. Collegium musicium, in contrast, is much more tightly arranged. And it still jams a lot, with great instrumentation My vote is for collegium musicium
Zig 07.27.21	Kollektiv gets my vote, mainly because of a more experimental and instrumental sound. Collegium Musicum is also fantastic, very good record, but the vocals and constant ELP reminisce turned out be a con for me. Anyways, both albums have great jam moments.
Mythodea 07.27.21	Both albums sound great, first is more digestible, shorter and spacier, while the second is tighter, more proficient and weirder. Still don't know which is going to win me.
Friday13th 07.27.21	2:2 Jethro Pangea Divaman Zig
zakalwe 07.27.21	I’m going with Kollektiv. Has the better groove.
Friday13th 07.27.21	2:3 Jethro Pangea Divaman Zig zakalwe
bgillesp 07.27.21	I already voted for Kollektiv btw
Friday13th 07.27.21	ah yes 3:3 Jethro Pangea bgillesp Divaman Zig zakalwe
bgillesp 07.27.21	Kollektiv is the second one. Should be this if it helps 2:4 Jethro Pangea Divaman Zig zakalwe bgillesp
someone 07.27.21	Do people vote for their own recs?
bgillesp 07.27.21	Yes, usually but not always
someone 07.27.21	I don't want to do it
Divaman 07.27.21	You should definitely do it. Unless you and Milo make a gentlemen's agreement that he will abstain from voting also.
Friday13th 07.27.21	@someone you don't have to but like Divaman said, without an agreement, don't be surprised if Milo votes for his anyway.
MrSirLordGentleman 07.27.21	oh fuck I absolutely forgot about this week's round. Will try to check them tonight
MiloRuggles 07.27.21	Just gonna take this opportunity to pop in and vote for Collegium without explaining myself. Ball's in your court, someone.
someone 07.27.21	Imma vote for Kollektiv then. Charitable of you to pass me balls when yours are do big.
MiloRuggles 07.27.21	Plenty to go round big fulla
TwigTW 07.27.21	I thought Collegium Musicum was going to be an easy win for me. Keyboard centered prog is my fave, but I can't stop listening to the Kollektiv. I keep thinking; I'll give them each one more listen and decide, but I honestly can't make up my mind...
Friday13th 07.27.21	3:5 Jethro Pangea Milo Divaman Zig zakalwe bgillesp someone
Inoculaeted 07.27.21	I’ll vote Kollektiv, despite the weird album cover…. I found that it’s meandering unnecessary moments are balanced by really rad spacey jams that hit home. Collegium was fun in spots though and definitely gave me ELP vibes. I love the write up btw. Really interesting context for the album release.
MrSirLordGentleman 07.28.21	I'll go with Kollektiv. There are some great jams throughout the album and that flute rules hard
Mythodea 07.28.21	Yup, I'm also going with Kollektiv (4). I think it's meatier, and while Collegium Musicum(3.5) picks up after the first ten minutes, I think it's enjoyable, but doesn't amaze me. It's still a fairly dynamic album, with great moments. Kollektiv is flashier, the flute is great, and there are many moments thick with information. It's overlong, yes, but in the end I feel it's more coherent and well-constructed. Also, the album art rips.
Inoculaeted 07.28.21	Flute god yes. Wtf is that album art anyway? A headless dude bound with a bomb to his chest? The orientation of it is so weird.
TwigTW 07.28.21	I'm going with Kollektiv too.
Divaman 07.28.21	Not sure it's a dude.
TwigTW 07.28.21	It's a gatefold cover, so there's a whole other half of the picture we're not seeing: https://www.popsike.com/KOLLEKTIV-Same-KRAUTROCK-ORIGINAL-GREEN-BRAIN-1973/250678163201.html Does that clear things up, or make it more confusing? I'm not sure, lol.
Inoculaeted 07.28.21	Ah yes of course! All is clear now Twig. /sarcasm
e210013 07.28.21	After 4 auditions of both albums: Collegium Musicum - Collegium Musicum: This was an album that take me by surprise. I didn't know nothing about the prog rock in Slovakia. It's a pity that they never had the recognition they deserved. The band is heavily influenced by ELP, and especially Nice, and also by the classical music. The album has a flavour of the music of end of of the 60's, as happened with Nice. Their music is commanded by the keyboards, as happened with ELP and Nice. Their keyboardist and composer is very talented, clearly classical trained. Despite the influences, we cannot say they are clones of those bands. Kollektiv - Kollektiv: I'm not an expert and even I cannot say that I'm a huge fan of the krautrock music in general. However, I must confess that I was deeply and very well surprised by the quality of this album. From what I know, this is an excellent album, one of the most well ballanced in terms of quality. It's a very inspired album with a perfect mix between the psychedelic music and electronics combined with jazz influences. The original version of the album has only four tracks with great quality. But, the four bonus tracks are also great with the same level. "Collegium Musicum" rated with 4.0. "Kollektiv" rated with 4.0. These are two nice albums, two great surprises for me. I must confess that I already have checked the albums for some time, but I hesitated a bit with my decision till now. I wanted to vote on both, but by different reasons. So, finally, I decided to vote on "Kollektiv", but only by a very thiny hair.
someone 07.28.21	It's interesting that so many draw similarity between CM and ELP, when the two bands rose simultaneously (CM is even a bit older, though not by much). CM had little to no access to western music at the time, certainly not hot new stuff that ELP became at the time (actually after the release of that CM album). So CM's influence was mainly their infatuation with rock music in general, as well as their classical musical education. ELP of course played a significant role in CM's further development down the line, as did many orchestral prog bands and trends of the time.
wham49 07.28.21	2 is where it is at gets my vote
SharkTooth 07.28.21	Requesting a one day extension, I will vote tomorrow
porcupinetheater 07.28.21	Oof very enjoy both sides But krautrock and tone-fucking is a one way ticket to the porc pleasure center Voting Kollektiv hell yeah mash my nipples like a stompbox
Friday13th 07.28.21	I'm joining the late bloom vote for Kollektiv, but it's a close one. I do dig Collegium Musicum. Like e21 said, kinda like ELP and the Nice, also the lesser-known Clouds comes to mind. A little proto-prog-ish but some solid melodies and great orchestration. The jazz influence is smaller than expected but still good. Kollektiv meanders a bit, but the parts that jam really jam. The production is also significantly better I think (though it may be a bit unfair to compare since the CM rip on youtube may be partially to blame). 4:12 Jethro Pangea Milo Normaloctagon Divaman Zig zakalwe bgillesp someone Inoculaeted Gentleman Mythodea e21 wham porcupine Friday
e210013 07.28.21	I see and I can agree with you, someone. But, although the difficult access to western music at the time, I'm pretty sure that CM knew about the existence of the music that was made in the wstern world. Besides, despite the similarities between CM and ELP, for me, the music of CM is closer to The Nice than closer to ELP. That is particularly evident, for me, with their sound much closer to the end of the 60's than to the sound of the 70's, what also happened with The Nice.
TheIntruder 07.28.21	Both albums are great. I really like of both. But my decision goes to the first one, Collegium Musicum. I love their vibe of ELP. I am a huge fan of ELP. So, my vote goes to CM.
Jethro42 07.29.21	I used to know an early 70s keyboard's centered band similar to CM, but I don't remember many things about them other than being similar and obscur. As for Kollektiv, my favorite part is that guitar at 29:40...the most memorable for me in any case.
Friday13th 07.29.21	5:12 Jethro Pangea Milo Normaloctagon Intruder Divaman Zig zakalwe bgillesp someone Inoculaeted Gentleman Mythodea e21 wham porcupine Friday Okay y’all, I’m calling it for Kollektiv.
Divaman 07.29.21	Nice first round.
MiloRuggles 07.29.21	ggwp, egregious scronky noodling was the winner on the day. Love your work, Friday. What a gracious host.
Inoculaeted 07.29.21	This Discovery phase was such a treasure trove of goods. A lot of recs for things that weren’t even in the tourney have become some of my most intriguing recent discoveries (Krautrock queue, Holocausto, Procol Harum s/t, L’Uovo Di Colombo, Yolk s/t, etc.) Seriously guys, thank you. Friday you rule the most.