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Old 05-26-2006, 02:41 PM   #31
PepsiMetal
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diabolus in Musica
You obviously didn't read Meds or my posts....
I replied to your post which was wrong. I didn't reply to Med.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Diabolus in Musica
Why do you lay down and accept what the regimes of rogue nations say, and doubt everything the US government says?
Doubt everything US government says? No.

I fail to believe them much until new administration comes in. They were wrong in Iraq big time, so they probably would be wrong again. Do you ever ask yourself a question, Why was only US afraid of Iraq? Don't you think if world was in trouble all countries would do something? Seriously. You think america is the only country doing it cause they're special or something?

Quote:
Originally Posted by nowhesingsnowhesobs
Do you even follow the news, or just fill in details to suit yourself?
News, ahaha. If your only source of information is news, then you will probably be wrong sooner or later.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nowhesingsnowhesobs
Why is a comparison to Bush neccessary?
Why do you love Bush or something? Did my statement offend you in any way? I just compared them because they both have done stupid things. None of our discussions here are necessary.

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Originally Posted by nowhesingsnowhesobs
It's also great that you know his actual aims and goals. How do you do this?
Where did I say I know this? I never stated a fact. Read up again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashman
You really don't know anything about Nuclear power do you?

If they built a station, they'd have to pay for 10 years worth of labour, all the materials and all the other stuff related to the Station. They might even need to build a reservoir or some sort of dam, because they need steam to drive the turbines.

They're very expensive, they won't be saving any money for a long long time.
That makes no sense. It's like asking a new business owner, why is he starting a business when he'll loose money in the beginning. You always loose money in the beginning, but if it saves billions in the future, you don't care.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Profit of Maine
Because you know their intentions. And if Iran "really wanted to attack Israel," the easiest thing for them would be to taunt Israel and the U.S. into doing something so they having the seeming higher moral ground.
What are you talking about? I don't know their intentions, but neither do you. Assumptions aren't worth a war and I'm the one who doesn't want anymore wars.
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Old 05-26-2006, 02:55 PM   #32
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News, ahaha. If your only source of information is news, then you will probably be wrong sooner or later.
News as in current events. gj

What I mean, if you knew anything about Ahmedinejad you would know that he deliberately goads the US, amongst others. His statements are intentionally provocative.
Quote:
Why do you love Bush or something? Did my statement offend you in any way? I just compared them because they both have done stupid things. None of our discussions here are necessary.
They may both be poor presidents, but that doesn't mean it makes much sense to include little asides of this sort. It just flags up the anti-Bush fervour that allows you to pretend that Ahmedinejad is some harmless clown.
Quote:
Where did I say I know this? I never stated a fact. Read up again.
You seemed pretty sure he won't 'actually make nuclear weapons'. This flies in the face of much of what we know - see Med's earlier post.
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Old 05-26-2006, 03:44 PM   #33
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ahaha stupid reporting
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Old 05-26-2006, 03:52 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by PepsiMetal
I replied to your post which was wrong. I didn't reply to Med.
Let see here, what you did was misread my first post thenn proceed to form an arguement on your misconception. Did you even bother reading my post that cleared up what I said?
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Old 05-26-2006, 06:15 PM   #35
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Red face

Quote:
Originally Posted by Diabolus in Musica
Let see here, what you did was misread my first post thenn proceed to form an arguement on your misconception. Did you even bother reading my post that cleared up what I said?
So you admit that post was wrong? Ok, then. There's no point complaining if you later figured out it was wrong.

If you agree that the whole friggin world knows Iran doesn't have nuclear weapons, why would you start a war? For assumptions that they MIGHT have them in a couple of months, or years?

Quote:
Originally Posted by nowhesingsnowhesobs
News as in current events. gj

What I mean, if you knew anything about Ahmedinejad you would know that he deliberately goads the US, amongst others. His statements are intentionally provocative.
How does he do those things please explain. He says what he wants to say, his comments are harmless. Does Vladimir Putin like Bush? I doubt it, but they're not going to start a war with each other. Presidents don't like other presidents, get over it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nowhesingsnowhesobs
They may both be poor presidents, but that doesn't mean it makes much sense to include little asides of this sort. It just flags up the anti-Bush fervour that allows you to pretend that Ahmedinejad is some harmless clown.
No president is harmless as they have control over a country's military. Look at it this way. They're both idiots, I'm comparing them, so what? Are you seriously going to argue that I shouldn't compare two presidents, who are ruling at the same time, and who are both incompetent for their jobs?

Quote:
Originally Posted by nowhesingsnowhesobs
You seemed pretty sure he won't 'actually make nuclear weapons'. This flies in the face of much of what we know - see Med's earlier post.
Nobody knows what Iran is going to do except Iran. And as I said, I'd rather not start a war, and then later be proven wrong. It's not like Iran can magically make more nuclear weapons than USA overnight. First, Mossad will know that before USA, so they would probably do something about it. They know the area alot better than USA ever will, so it's better to leave it to them to solve this problem if needed. All USA would do now is attack Iran, destroy its government, loose a couple thousand American soldiers, a couple hundred Uk soldiers, Bomber planes would kill about 10,000 innocent iranians, etc... And all that before iran even has one nuclear bomb. So how are we going to know if making nuclear bombs was their plan? Basically in this case, USA again attacked too soon.

Last edited by PepsiMetal; 05-26-2006 at 06:17 PM.
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Old 05-26-2006, 07:05 PM   #36
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uh i think its safe to say we ****ed up iraqs ****, at least for the time being
not safe enough huh
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Old 05-26-2006, 08:32 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by PepsiMetal
That makes no sense. It's like asking a new business owner, why is he starting a business when he'll loose money in the beginning. You always loose money in the beginning, but if it saves billions in the future, you don't care.
The thing is, it won't really save billions in the future, maintenance costs of a nuclear reactor are quite huge.
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Old 05-26-2006, 09:45 PM   #38
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On wikipedia, it says Nuclear and coal power plants have similar operating costs, they're just more expensive to build compared to coal or oil based plants.

But even if it costs more to maintain, they'll still have more oil to export as they wouldn't need oil based power plants.
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Old 05-26-2006, 11:02 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by PepsiMetal
So you admit that post was wrong? Ok, then. There's no point complaining if you later figured out it was wrong.
ARE YOU AN IDIOT???? Thats is what I meant in my original post, could you please read. I'll repost them in context since you seem to have trouble to finding the post.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PepsiMetal
At least USA didn't go to war in Iran just to find out they don't have nuclear bombs either. I think Iraqi mistake is enough to embarass CIA.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Med57
Actually Iran doesn't have nuclear bombs yet.They've succesfully enriched uranium, albeit to a level far below that necessary to make a nuclear bomb. Unlike Iraq, however, they've actually come out and said that they're enriching uranium, and although they insist that they have no interest in nuclear weapons, the fact that they're rejecting offers from Russia to enrich uranium to a level that can be used for energy purposes but not to create nuclear weapons indicates very strongly that Ahmadinejad is lying.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DIM
We all know this, even the US does. You also make it sound like the article was written by the CIA.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DIM
I'm sorry I meant to say the the US knows that Iran doesn't have nukes yet. And to think that they don't want them is prett ubsurd.





Quote:
Originally Posted by PespiMetal
If you agree that the whole friggin world knows Iran doesn't have nuclear weapons, why would you start a war? For assumptions that they MIGHT have them in a couple of months, or years?
All evidence points to them attempgting obtain nuclear armament. The only thing that contradicts are statements that the Iranian gov't has made. They know they aren't supposed to have them so they are not going to come out say "hey we are attempting to create nuclear arms." It would be a very stupid move on there part to state, the point is to create them not spark an invasion that would topple your regime and keep you from reach nuclear armament.

Last edited by gmoneyguy; 05-26-2006 at 11:07 PM.
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Old 05-26-2006, 11:07 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diabolus in Musica
All evidence points to them attempgting obtain nuclear armament. The only thing that contradicts are statements that the Iranian gov't has made. They know they aren't supposed to have them so they are not going to come out say "hey we are attempting to create nuclear arms." It would be a very stupid move on there part to state, the point is to create them not spark an invasion that would topple your regime and keep you from reach nuclear armament.
Ok, show me this "evidence" that Irans goal is to make nuclear weapons and bomb USA with them.
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Old 05-26-2006, 11:16 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PepsiMetal
Ok, show me this "evidence" that Irans goal is to make nuclear weapons and bomb USA with them.
http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/world/iran/nuke.htm
http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/iran/nuke/

Iran is also known for rejecting Western culture, why would suddenly start to accept in the form of Nuclear Power.

Last edited by gmoneyguy; 05-26-2006 at 11:23 PM.
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Old 05-27-2006, 01:16 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diabolus in Musica
The fas article basically says Iran could make nuclear bombs using the left overs or output from nuclear power plants. But that doesn't mean that's their goal. Even their president hasn't said that's their goal. If he said he wants to see Israel wiped off the map, then saying he wants to make nuclear weapons isn't much of a difference either.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Diabolus in Musica
Iran is also known for rejecting Western culture, why would suddenly start to accept in the form of Nuclear Power.
Well USA is known for rejecting their culture, so that's a poor reason.

Anyways it's hard for Iran to negotiate,
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5011176.stm

"Meanwhile the US has rejected Iran's call for direct talks on the issue."

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Old 05-27-2006, 01:21 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PepsiMetal
The fas article basically says Iran could make nuclear bombs using the left overs or output from nuclear power plants. But that doesn't mean that's their goal. Even their president hasn't said that's their goal. If he said he wants to see Israel wiped off the map, then saying he wants to make nuclear weapons isn't much of a difference either.
A) they are pointing out the duality in what they are doing.
B) If you plan to rob a bank you're not goign to tell the police. Its the same principle with Iran.

Quote:
Well USA is known for rejecting their culture, so that's a poor reason.
Give a GOOD example of that, and don't use the wars because they are not about Islamic culture.

Quote:
Anyways it's hard for Iran to negotiate,
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5011176.stm

"Meanwhile the US has rejected Iran's call for direct talks on the issue."

Iran has been cooperating on and off for two years now. The real explanation is to stall the the nation that have been putting pressure on them. Why would they stall if their nuclears programs are purely for civilian purposes? They have had chance after chance and they pull the same crap. The US rejecting Iran's request is understandable given these circumstances.

Last edited by gmoneyguy; 05-27-2006 at 01:25 AM.
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Old 05-27-2006, 09:02 AM   #44
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Well USA is known for rejecting their culture, so that's a poor reason
the US isn't pretending as though their suddenly ready to accept islamic technologies so they can develop weapons systems from it.
the Iranians are.
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Old 05-27-2006, 09:06 AM   #45
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guys pepsimetal is dumb as fuck and always has been, he posts in here for a stretch every now and then to relay some stupidity and disappears for a while. he also doesn't respond to posts that defeat his argument, which is really frustrating. just ignore him and save yourself from being dumber for having read his re-hashing of other peoples opinions.
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Old 05-27-2006, 01:22 PM   #46
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not safe enough huh
thats why i need my suv

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the US isn't pretending as though their suddenly ready to accept islamic technologies so they can develop weapons systems from it.
the Iranians are.
but why should you hinder their attempts to become more western? arent they becoming more accepting of western culture in other areas too, like language? how many iranians speak english today as compared to 30 years ago. you shouldnt blockeade their attempts to become more progressive. cmon mr freedom, let them be free
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Old 05-27-2006, 04:10 PM   #47
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Cool

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Originally Posted by Paranoidd
guys pepsimetal is dumb as fuck and always has been, he posts in here for a stretch every now and then to relay some stupidity and disappears for a while. he also doesn't respond to posts that defeat his argument, which is really frustrating. just ignore him and save yourself from being dumber for having read his re-hashing of other peoples opinions.
If you have nothing to contribute, then why post at all. Why do you come into threads I post, and throw these cheap shots? Why don't you either reply with something useful or go fuck yourself.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Tway
the US isn't pretending as though their suddenly ready to accept islamic technologies so they can develop weapons systems from it.
the Iranians are.
I thought the difference why US supported Israel more than other middle eastern countries was that they have a working democracy in place. So if Iran wants to have a democracy, then they can also have nuclear weapons like Isreal does right?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Diabolus in Musica
Give a GOOD example of that, and don't use the wars because they are not about Islamic culture.
Well USA is forcing Iraq and Afghanistan to switch to democracy. How is that respecting their ways of doing things? Just because USA likes democracy doesn't mean everyone else has to. They've (Iraq/Afghanistan) lived without democracy for thousands of years.
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Old 05-27-2006, 04:40 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by PepsiMetal
Well USA is forcing Iraq and Afghanistan to switch to democracy. How is that respecting their ways of doing things? Just because USA likes democracy doesn't mean everyone else has to. They've (Iraq/Afghanistan) lived without democracy for thousands of years.
You have a fundamental mistunderstanding of what democacy is. The reason a democracy is set up, is to let the people can vote on how they want the country to be run, and what their laws should be like.
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Old 05-27-2006, 04:42 PM   #49
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If Iran is a democracy, it's an extremely half-assed one.
 
Old 05-27-2006, 04:47 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by spitfirejunky
If Iran is a democracy, it's an extremely half-assed one.
It more or less has the guise of a Democracy, because every anwsers to the Shah.
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Old 05-27-2006, 04:51 PM   #51
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Exactly. They don't exercise some of the most fundamental aspects of freedom.
 
Old 05-27-2006, 05:08 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by spitfirejunky
Exactly. They don't exercise some of the most fundamental aspects of freedom.
Democracy doesn't necessarily mean freedom.

Just look at that case in Afghanistan. That guy converted to Christianity like 16 years ago, and Taleban government did nothing to him, but now that they have their contistution and a valid judicial system, he might be executed, go to jail, or get some other punishment. Plus since most of Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, etc... are muslims, most of their new laws will still follow islam laws which aren't really respected in the western culture.
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Old 05-27-2006, 05:10 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by PepsiMetal
Democracy doesn't necessarily mean freedom.

Just look at that case in Afghanistan. That guy converted to Christianity like 16 years ago, and Taleban government did nothing to him, but now that they have their contistution and a valid judicial system, he might be executed, go to jail, or get some other punishment. Plus since most of Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan, etc... are muslims, most of their new laws will still follow islam laws which aren't really respected in the western culture.
Can you provide a link to that story. I hear people talk about it and seems really odd. Putting the validity of the story aside, its still the only occurance of such a violation of freedom the I ever see brought when it come to Afghanistan. Come to think of it I think you are the only who has brought that up.

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Old 05-27-2006, 05:17 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diabolus in Musica
Can you provide a link to that story. I hear people talk about it and seems really odd. Putting the validity of the story aside, its still the only occurance of such a violation of freedom the I ever see brought when it come to Afghanistan. Come to think of it I think you are the only who has brought that up.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/4823874.stm
http://www.voanews.com/english/archive/2006-03/2006-03-18-voa7.cfm?CFID=13875487&CFTOKEN=32921517

The thing is his family was the one that turned him in now instead to Taleban before. Supposedly their new constitution states, non-muslims can follow any religions, etc... but muslims still have to obey to strict islam laws, which isn't much of freedom for muslims there.
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Old 05-27-2006, 06:51 PM   #55
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Originally Posted by PepsiMetal
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/4823874.stm
http://www.voanews.com/english/archive/2006-03/2006-03-18-voa7.cfm?CFID=13875487&CFTOKEN=32921517

The thing is his family was the one that turned him in now instead to Taleban before. Supposedly their new constitution states, non-muslims can follow any religions, etc... but muslims still have to obey to strict islam laws, which isn't much of freedom for muslims there.
It states in the article that conservative clerics control the judiciary system. They are the type of people who were for the Taliban. It also stated the new poeple in the government such Hamid Karzai have been pushing for a more liberal and tolerant gov't.
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Old 05-27-2006, 07:31 PM   #56
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That story is outdated, the charges have been dropped.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/4865818.stm
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Digging: Ghostface Killah - The Lost Tapes

Old 05-27-2006, 10:02 PM   #57
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Thats good as it was pretty stupid.
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Old 05-27-2006, 10:14 PM   #58
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I thought the difference why US supported Israel more than other middle eastern countries was that they have a working democracy in place. So if Iran wants to have a democracy, then they can also have nuclear weapons like Isreal does right?
yes if Iran had a completely different government and was a US ally they could have nukes if we wanted them to.

but this would also require a parallel universe
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Old 05-28-2006, 02:20 AM   #59
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Originally Posted by PepsiMetal
If you have nothing to contribute, then why post at all. Why do you come into threads I post, and throw these cheap shots? Why don't you either reply with something useful or go fuck yourself.
What I wanted to contribute is a notification to people in this thread who haven't "contributed" anything to one of your dicussions before, that it is pointless. In my experience, you completely ignore every rebuke to one of your retarded arguments, perferring to continue arguing ridiculous points of veiw, especially when you're flat out wrong and have been proven so, therefore it's not very interesting nor worthwhile to discuss things with you, and I'm just trying to warn others not to waste their time if they're expecting meaningful or knowledgeable discussion in this thread.

I'm not trying to be a dick or some hilarious internet troll.

And by the way, before you ask me to post links, I'm talking about the marijuana legalization thread a while back (among others) where you argued a totally ignorant and biased opinion, devoid of fact, and then just kept rambling on without even acknowledging that you were completely naive, even after you were proven wrong several times. This is why I don't like you, because people like you spread misinformation without any regard to the truth of the matter.

Don't bother replying, I won't be back to read it.
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Old 05-28-2006, 02:32 AM   #60
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Do you have no life Paranoidd? Did that arguement about Pot bother you that much? Geez, get over it, it's the internet. Afaik, most posts in that thread were merely my opinion, which nobody should have to get worked over it. It wasn't misinformation, it was what I think. Just like in this thread, neither of us can possibly know what's actually going on in politics. It's all big mumbo jumbo, we're just discussing different opinions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Tway
yes if Iran had a completely different government and was a US ally they could have nukes if we wanted them to.

but this would also require a parallel universe
What different government can they have if they followed democracy? The truth is probably, USA doesn't even want to be an ally to Iran whether it does become a democracy or not. Unless of course USA attacks it, forms its own government there, and then maybe they'll have some kind of bond between the countries, like Iraq or Afghanistan.
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