The PA Thread
 

Since theres always a million questions about PAs, please post all of them in here so we dont have half the first page asking whats a good PA for X amount of dollars. :thumb:

ok bands got about 1500 bucks for our p.a. system, mics,mic stands,mic cables ect.
were going to need atleast a 10 channel mixer....our band has 2 guitarists,bassist and drummer, the guitarists and bassist amps all have 120 watts, so kind of mics.p.a.,ect do you guys think i should get that would be loud enough and good quality....?

Check out the packaged PA setups on musiciansfriend.com
You should be able to get something really decent for $1500. 600 watts, along with stands, mics and etc. Look at brands like Yamaha.

right, so my band need something to run a microphone through. We have less than £100 though.

I thought about buying a small guitar amp (10"- or 12" speaker) to use but the people in the guitar forum say it breaks it, and the people on the bass forum say it would break it if i used a bass amp.

So my other idea was to get a really small power amp (like 40 watts or something) and buy a 10" speaker to go with it. But theres one problem, the least power, power amp i have found is about 150 watts.

My third idea (which i dont think works) would be to set it up something like this:

microphone > DI box > 1-2 channel tiny mixer > 10" speaker

would that work?


Thanks very much if i get a reply:)

Any ideas?

I saw this thread in the guitar forum. i was about to post in it but i'll answere here instead.

There is nothing wrong with running a microphone into a guitar amp.. in the short term that is. After a while the amp will just die. And it'll sound like it is full of sand. Give it about 6 - 8 months or so.
So. You can do it. But dont do it with your good amp.
Go to a pawn shop and buy an old POS that you dont care about if it gets wrecked. It'll do the job until you can save up for something a little more suitable.

The poweramp + speaker option would work. But it'll be cheaper to just go with an old second hand guitar amp.

Your third idea won't work. You'll need a poweramp for any decent amount of volume.

When I first started off with my band, we used the old guitar amp. Lots of people do... Just remember, dont use your good amp.

right, and if there are no pawn shops where you live?

so what about bass amps? does it affect them?

I have this monitor/compact PA system....
[url]http://www.samash.com/catalog/showitem.asp?ItemID=17285&TempID=2&Method=2&CategoryID=0&BrandID=0&PriceRangeID=0&PageNum=0&DepartmentID=0&DepartmentKeeper=&pagesize=10&SortMethod=0&Word1=galaxy+audio&Contains=%22%2Agalaxy%2A%22+AND+%22%2Aaudio%2A%22&Search_Type=SEARCH&GroupCode=nonetodaythanks[/url]


Would this work to be heard live and over a band during practice?

[QUOTE=lineyukbass]right, and if there are no pawn shops where you live?

so what about bass amps? does it affect them?[/QUOTE]
Ebay, or the classified in the newspaper.
It's the same deal with bass amps.


Screamin_Demon_Auz: It looks small.. But it says it is 146 watts and 144dB... So that kinda gives me the imprssion that it could be pretty loud.
I say, give it a go. It should be fine for jamming and practice..
If it is struggling to keep up.. Just pick it up onto a desk or something, so it is a litle higher and closer to your ears.

It probably wouldn't be enough for gigging tho.

I've checked ebay, theres nothing. Its all over-priced.

Ill get the new ad-trader then and have a look in there

ok this is what ive come up with, tell me what you guys think, and if im missing anything at all that i would need to perform live with a pa system PLZ PLZ tell me...[url]http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/sid=040718112121068102051115526489/g=live/s=speakers/shop/viewcart/[/url]

^ That link points to your shopping cart. Because of the cookies on your computer, you'll be the only one who is able to see what is in it. Why dont you list what you were thinking of getting.

1)Behringer Eurodesk SL2442FX-PRO Mixer
2)JBL SF25 Dual 15" 2-Way Speaker Cabinet (2)
3)Shure SM58 Mic (3)
4) Mic Stand, Mic Clips, Cables...

Is there anything i would need at ALL to perform live with a band that I havent listed? and what do you guys think about this equipment?

not a bad board (not the best, but...), looks good.

If you're using acoustic guitars (or putting any instrument into the board), and you are any distance from the board, I would buy a DI box for each instrument, and a mic cable for each DI box.

:-P at

A very good desk..
Put you'll need a poweramp to push the speakers mate.

Why not downgrade the mixer you are using.
And invest a few dollars in a good poweramp.
Depending on the wattage handeling of the speakers get yourself a stereo poweramp to suit. Say if the speakers are 300 watts each.. get a 2x300 watt poweramp.
Look on Ebay for some decently priced poweramps.
Run it off a mixer like this one:
[url]http://www.behringer.com/UB1222FX-PRO/index.cfm?lang=ENG[/url]

I tried searching for info about the following items, but didn't find anything. Do you think that this setup could handle small gigs powering vocals AND drums?

1. Behringer PMX660M Europower Powered Mixer (2 x 300 watts or 600 bridged) - [url]http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/sid=040720104244024017203011599030/g=live/search/detail/base_pid/631250/[/url]

2. 2x Behringer B1520 Eurolive 15 Inch 2-Way Loudspeaker - [url]http://www.musiciansfriend.com/srs7/sid=040720104244024017203011599030/g=live/search/detail/base_pid/600592/[/url]

Thanks,
R6Elite

^ Yeah. That setup would be awesome.

But you might want to double check the wattage at differnt loadings with the powered mixer. the speakers are 200w RMS @ 8 ohms. And the Mixer is 300w RMS @ 4 ohms.
Now this should be fine as it is.. Although if the speakers were only 4 ohm they you may risk damaging them.
But, at this point, seeing as the speakers are 8 ohms. The wattage from the powered mixer will be a little less than it's full 300 watts. And so in that case running 200w speakers off them should be fine.

Just, dont run it up loud all the way. Although, considering it's amount of headroom, I doubt you ever will be.

ok tell me what you guys think about this, and if its everything i would need to perform live with a band.
1)Behringer Eurodesk SL2442FX-PRO Mixer
2)Behringer EuroLive B1500X PA Loudspeaker x2
3)Behringer EuroPower EP1500 Power Amp
4) Shure SM58S Mic with Switch
5) Musiciansfriend, cables,mic stands,clips...

The poweramp is 2x700 watts. The speakers are only 300 watts @ 4 ohms.
It wont be suitable.
You'll have to get some speakers that are capable of handling the wattage.
Or, more preferably, Get a different poweramp. One that is rated at 2x300 watts while at 4 ohms.

i couldnt find any Behringer power amps that size, there all way to powerfull, any ideas?

It doesn't have to be Behringer.

Here's one that is 2x300 watts into 4 ohms.

[url]http://www.peavey.com/products/shop_online/browse.cfm/action/details/item/00511500/wc/2A2C1/fam/2C/tcode/1/v.cfm[/url]

Alternatively, there should be a whole heap of poweramps floating around on eBay. For nice and cheap.

Just to be slightly helpful: A good musician site for cheap (sometimes) is [url]www.zzounds.com[/url]
Check it out and tell me if Im wrong.

why would singing over a guitar amp ruin the amp?

its just an audio signal right?

is the signal that a mic produces so different to the guitars signal?

^ It'll ruin it after time. It is normally fine to run vocals through a guitar amp. But after a while, (about 9 months or so) your amp will sound like crap.
As in, dont use your 'good' amp.

The range of frequencies of the human voice, and the levels of the vocal mic constantly overdriving the input stages of the guitar amp, does eventually take its toll.

For those in bands who are a bit strapped for cash and cant afford a proper PA. Just go to a second hand store and buy an old cheap guitar amp. Use that until you can afford something more permanent.

[QUOTE=Aes820]It doesn't have to be Behringer.

Here's one that is 2x300 watts into 4 ohms.

[url]http://www.peavey.com/products/shop_online/browse.cfm/action/details/item/00511500/wc/2A2C1/fam/2C/tcode/1/v.cfm[/url]

Alternatively, there should be a whole heap of poweramps floating around on eBay. For nice and cheap.[/QUOTE]

Nady SPA 850 Pro Stereo Power Amp, would this work okay?

Yep. The Nady 850 Looks pretty good to me.

Now. With regards to poweramps just some general advice.
1. NEVER run them without speakers (or a load) attached.
2. Don't bridge them unless you are certain you've got the loading and wattage for the speakers correct.
3. Run the volume of the poweramp up nearly all the way, all the time. Turn it up full then turn it down just slightly if it is too noisy while up full. Use the output level on the mixer to control overall volume.
Dont have the output level on the mixer all the way up while only having the poweramps volume down low, this is an incorrect gain structure and you can experience some major problems with clipping (which can burn out your speakers).
Turn up the poweramp and leave it up. Use your mixers levels to control your overall volume.

so what if you run a keyboard over a guitar amp... same effect?

^ I think you should have no worries with running a keyboard through a guitar amp. Although, just keep the output levels on the keyboard low to avoid continually overdriving the input of the guitar amp.. As it is this that causes the damage over time.

Thanks for all the help, Aes820...

my band just purchased a squier 4 PA system and it was a good investment....but, every time we try to get it loud enough to practice it screams like a b*T*h and we have no idea why does any one have any suggestions?

Either, You are getting a feedback loop coming through via the microphone. Or, it is a crappy quality mocrophone which is causing something called microphonics.

Try standing further away from (or even behind) the speakers while you've got the microphone.
Or if that doesnt work, you might have to invest in a higher quality microphone. One that is less prone to microphonic squealing.

ya that is probobally the problem we do have cheap mic's i just guess were going to have to suck it up and get a better one ....about how much should i spend for a decent mic?

Um. Maybe put aside about 50 - 80 bucks for a semi decent Mic.

Look at brands like Studiomaster. Their KM series is pretty good.
And priced around the 80 dollar mark if I remember correctally.

im looking for a cheap yet efficient and durable PA system that can be heard over 2 guitars, bass and drums playing at slightly loud volume levels. All i need to plug into it is 1 microphone. Im thinking maybe something around 100watts.

someone suggested the fender passport (i think it was the 150) and it seemed good but a bit expensive. The same person also recommended the kustom profile also seemed good. What are you opinions on these two pieces?

go with the squier 4 pa system by fender it rocks and is well worth the money ......myself and my bandmates (well just me and the bassist because the drummer is cheap) just purchased it and it is well worth the money.

Does anyone have any experience with the SoundTech S20... it is only $250 on music123... [url]http://www.music123.com/SoundTech-S20-i131742.music[/url] ... just asking this for the singer of my band bc he is looking to buy a cheap PA system that is goin to be loud enough to be heard over us... thanks for any help...

how do the mixers and power amps plug into the speaker cabs? i know this is a dumb question sorry guys, my band is geting a p.a. so I was jw, do i need to buy speaker and mixer cables or something?

[QUOTE=dg_88]Does anyone have any experience with the SoundTech S20... it is only $250 on music123... [url]http://www.music123.com/SoundTech-S20-i131742.music[/url] ... just asking this for the singer of my band bc he is looking to buy a cheap PA system that is goin to be loud enough to be heard over us... thanks for any help...[/QUOTE]
Yeah.. that looks pretty good. It may struggle to keep up at some larger gigs but it should suit practise / jamming / and 'backyard party' sized gigs quite nicely.

[QUOTE=AfroDrummer16]how do the mixers and power amps plug into the speaker cabs? i know this is a dumb question sorry guys, my band is geting a p.a. so I was jw, do i need to buy speaker and mixer cables or something?[/QUOTE]
All the mics (or the line outs from the amps) go into the mixer. Mixer sets the levels.
The two main outputs of the mixer each run into the respective left and right channels of a stereo poweramp. The left and right outputs of the poweramp both run to each speaker.

What type of connections these bits of equipment use all depends on the equipment.
Some poweramps and speakers use 1/4" TS plugs.
Some poweramps just have the screw on pole connections.
Some higher end stuff have specially designed Neutrick connectors.. Which are an industry standard.

Same with the speakers. The majority use 1/4" TS, yet some of the higher end gear use Neutrick. Although Neutrick connections are usually used for speaker cabinets that can be split for biamping.. but that is something else all together.

Then again.. You can buy powered speaker cabs... which are like a speaker cab and a poweramp all built in. In which case you wont need a poweramp. Just run the outputs of the mixer into the input of the powered cab and that'll do.

But.. Also.. Quite often you can get powered mixers. Which are like mixers and poweramps all built into the one unit.. So all you'll need then is some speaker cabs.. Setups like these are extremely common. and extrememly popular. Because of their ease of use.

well the speakers cabs im thinkin about getting dont have the built in power amp, the mixer isnt a power mixer, so do the speakers, mixers, power amps come with cables i need to hook them up to each other? ill post what im getting later today, thanks

what cables would i need to connect this stuff together...? thanks...
1) Nady XA-1100 Pro Stereo Power Amp
2)Peavey PV 215 Dual 15" 2-Way Speaker Cabinet (2)
3)Behringer Eurodesk SL2442FX-PRO Mixer