[QUOTE=lucky luciano]They are selling good music with their own ideas, opinions and thoughts in it, nothing else. I don't see them trying to present an image to draw in a certain crowd, or write a song to appeal to a certain group of people. For some reason that bothers you, I don't know why, but I'm just going to ignore you until you have something intelligent to say or some factual basis to back up your opinion.[/QUOTE]


I dont have much say in this but they do rely on their image they talk about it in magazine's more then anything the whole mystique thing.....

[QUOTE=lucky luciano]They are selling good music with their own ideas, opinions and thoughts in it, nothing else. I don't see them trying to present an image to draw in a certain crowd, or write a song to appeal to a certain group of people. For some reason that bothers you, I don't know why, but I'm just going to ignore you until you have something intelligent to say or some factual basis to back up your opinion.[/QUOTE]
Would you shut it already. God damn no one cares about what you have to say.

commercial:

Adjective
1. a. Of or relating to commerce: a commercial loan; a commercial attaché. b. Engaged in commerce: a commercial trucker. [B]c. Involved in work that is intended for the mass market:[/B] a commercial artist. 2. Of, relating to, or being [B]goods, often unrefined, produced and distributed in large quantities for use by industry.[/B] 3.[B] Having profit as a chief aim:[/B] a commercial book, not a scholarly tome. 4. Sponsored by an advertiser or supported by advertising: commercial television.

According to the first two defintions Tool could be a commerical band, but its debatable. But they are definitely not commercial according to the 3rd definition. Tool's main objective isn't to make money, its to make music. They feel very strongly about this seeing as how they mention it once in every interview. I disagree with the statement "Tool is a business". If you think they are s'hitting their fans then thats your opinion I guess, but I disagree. It's a stupid argument anyways, Tool are a great band and I enjoy them. End of story.

I dont care if Tool are a commercial band. I drink coke, and I know the complete evil behind that company. I use Microsoft products (though I phase out as much as I can with better alternatives) even though I totally object to almost everything that company does.

And I listen to, and buy the work of Tool, even if they are throwing out cheap excuses for money (DVD singles, over-priced shirts). Any band with a major label have to be turning a profit, its why they're on a major label, the guys in the boardroom see the music buying market and sign the appropriate bands to rake in the cash.

Sadly, its not easy to seperate the bands that want to make masses of money, and those that dont have much choice in the matter, (risk losing their contract, or going through legal battles over breaching original contract agreements). With the amount of lawsuit problems Tool have had with record lables, it doesnt suprise me that they wern't rushing to prevent these marketing moves.

I dont see Tool looking at the mass money making angle, look at the recent interview with MJK over APC, there's an air of acceptance with the current record label deal. Personally, like I assume RTS is getting across, I dont care who is trying to make money, and if Tool is nothing more than a commerical bandwagon, so be it.

I have faith in the artistic side, the 4 members who want to make music, not money

It costs them money to record music and such, so they can't expect no compensation. I just don't think money is their main purpose. Well said AJIG.

I don't see how any band recording music for money cheapens the value of the music itself.

[QUOTE=ATC]I don't see how any band recording music for money cheapens the value of the music itself.[/QUOTE]
True, they do have to make a living.

[QUOTE=deadohiosky9]It costs them money to record music and such, so they can't expect no compensation. I just don't think money is their main purpose. Well said AJIG.[/QUOTE]
They say that in one of their interviews...I love MJK.

No, over and above the cost of living. Why is it wrong for artists to want to make money with what they do? Surely you'd expect to make more than just enough to cover the costs with whatever job you do.

You compare the amount good musicians get, who work hard, tour loads and write good music, to Formula 1 drivers, who drive around the same bit of road loads of times once every fornight, and you see how screwed wages are.

Though using those 2 as an example show you the 2 opposites, in Formula 1, the racing teams do all the hard work, yet the drivers make the most, wheras the opposite seems to happen with artists/record labels

If you mean that Formula 1 drivers are any less skilled than elite musicians, you'd be wrong. And with labels getting more than musicians, you'd think this whole 'musicians must do it solely for their art' thing would be redundant by now. Well, they are, they're giving a large part of their income to the sales for their art, are they not? Now telling them not to make money and that commercialism is inherently bad is just a load of crap.

Just to confirm, I have no problem with artists making money, whatever amount, they are the ones who earned, and deserve it. And I used the example of Formula 1 drivers as an example not for skill, but for the sheer difference in how much they earn, thats a whole different debate though.

[QUOTE=Adam Jones is GOD]Just to confirm, I have no problem with artists making money, whatever amount, they are the ones who earned, and deserve it. And I used the example of Formula 1 drivers as an example not for skill, but for the sheer difference in how much they earn, thats a whole different debate though.[/QUOTE]
Are you using the Formula 1 example in the sense that the drivers make more then the pit crew?

Musicians aren't risking their lives. Also Formula 1 drivers earn what they're worth in terms of crowds and money made from them.

[QUOTE=RideTheSpiral]Haha anyone who doesn't think Tool is commercial is very naeive. They've tapped right into the teenage market by giving themselves the mystical image that people love.

The limited release of Salival was probably done with a re-release in mind.

Releasing DVD singles? Cmon people. Tool is a business. I'm not saying they make bad music but Maynard has created the perfect musical corporation.[/QUOTE]
That's true, but it's not like their hiding that. See the song Hooker with a Penis. I don't care if I got ripped buying the DVD singles, I enjoyed them for what they were.

[QUOTE=Dunkelheit509]That's true, but it's not like their hiding that. See the song Hooker with a Penis. I don't care if I got ripped buying the DVD singles, I enjoyed them for what they were.[/QUOTE]


Hey I'm as big a Tool fan as anyone. I'm just saying they're playing the game better than anyone else out there.


Also they treat their fans terribly. I'm sure I'll get some arguments about that one too.

I think they just demand a little more respect of their fans. Maynards an a[I]s[/I]s yes, but I heard Danny was the nicest guy in the world.

NP Eulogy.

I remember why I used to love them now. :cool:


I still dislike 10 000 days except for Vicarious though.

Okay, I hear that Maynard is an *** all the time. Why is that?

From all the interviews I've read, he's an intelligent guy who needs some space. Is it that which makes him an ***? I'm not getting it.

[QUOTE=Dunkelheit509]I think they just demand a little more respect of their fans. Maynards an a[I]s[/I]s yes, but I heard Danny was the nicest guy in the world.[/QUOTE]


My guitar teacher met them and apparently Maynard was incredibly nice and humble but Danny way grumpy and didn't say anything. This was straight after a gig in their dressing room though so you can't really blame him.


How exactly do they demand respect?

Maynard can be pompous and arrogant in interviews etc.. But I don't recall them being mean to their fans in person.

[QUOTE=Dried Muffin Remnants]Maynard can be pompous and arrogant in interviews etc.. But I don't recall them being mean to their fans in person.[/QUOTE]
I just think he's intelligent in their interviews and has good views. He's really good at explaining his perspectives.

[QUOTE=Dried Muffin Remnants]Maynard can be pompous and arrogant in interviews etc.. But I don't recall them being mean to their fans in person.[/QUOTE]


Not mean just completely ignoring them and never giving them anything. Not really the best way to treat unbelievably loyal fans. At least that way you know if you release some crappy dvd singles, or re-release a DVD they'll sell a million copies.

Well it's like MJK said in that interview someone posted a page or two ago. He'd be walking with his son in the park and someone will come up to him and say "hey aren't you maynard from tool?" and MJK feels that he's a father walking with a son in the park at that moment and is being disturbed. He goes into some detail about it in that interview...I mean I don't blame him for his actions. It makes perfect sense to me and I can see where he is coming from. I can also see why people find him to be "pretentious" or an a'ss because of it. I don't think he's really an a'ss though, he just doesn't seem to like being interrupted and just wants his space. Tool aren't very social with their fans anyways.

That's what I got out of it. They don't want to become celebrities and such..

[QUOTE=RideTheSpiral]I do not want people like Blizzink and others to be able to buy something that they were not able to before.[/QUOTE]

HEY THANKS MAN

a fan breaking up a conversation maynard is having considered rude or acceptable. ive done it to several musicians so far... just to take a picture though

You should realize... When you have a band that huge, there will be fans. Dealing with fans in a good way is part of what comes with a band.

Half of the reason Tool goes through so much to keep there private lives private is so that people will like there music and not just the band members. So, who cares?

^Yeah, same thing at their concerts. The spotlights not on them....