I absolutely LOVED Undertow, but Aenima even blew that jem away with two of my favorite songs by Tool (46 & 2 and H) and also the AMOUNT of quality songs on it. I mean, talk about a band giving us our money's worth. I'da paid $100 for that album if there were no way to pirate.

[QUOTE=AEDICULA]a perfect circle had the best stage set i have ever seen... maynard sang behind a drum of fabric and his shadow was projected onto it from behind. they played in this forest of metal trees. the ends of the branches lit up. lots of shadowy folded fabric too... like a david lynch movie or something... does anyone know where i can get trees like that? the acoustics Sounded like crap though... the mars volta opened for APC and I COULDN'T EVEN HEAR THEM.
sang is a stupid looking word.[/QUOTE]
Yeh there stage set up is insane, they usualy open up with vanishing at there concerts.

[QUOTE=GeeTarus]A friend of mine, who is also a huge TOOL fan, told me that their last album, Lateralus, was written like the steps of the Kabbalah. Each song was, in a sense, written about those steps. The only song that wasn't written in that format was "Ticks and Leeches", notice that it sounds a little heavier and different from the rest.[/QUOTE]

the lateralus order is based off of the fibonaccii sequence, that is the order the album is supposed to be played. i read that there were versions of that album made for the band members and such.

the fibonaccii sequence is the ratio that describes the golden ratio of dividing something in half, and then half into half, and so fourth... this geometry will create a perfect spiral, as it appears in nature...like lateralus "ride the spiral to the end, may just go where no one's been"...that is my inturpretation.

[QUOTE=G_Mac07]To answer the first question, it is probably because of the many shorter tracks, ie: Intermission, Message to Harry Manback, Die Eier Von Satan, Useful Idiot. I can't see why anyone might complain about an album having too many tracks though. (You didn't, but I'm curious to why you asked)

Secondly, a release date for the new album has not been set. As far as we know, writing/recording is still in progress.[/QUOTE]

Just a note I wanted to make about Aenima. i've seen a lot of complaints around these forums that it was full of too many pointless filler tracks and that it makes it less of an album. However, I find that the filler tracks on Aenima are probbaly some of the best filler tracks on any album. The way they break up the big epic songs make the album (think about what I mean when saying this - ) easier to listen to. And if they dont have musical credit, tracks like (-) Ions are well produced to create an interesting effect.

Apart from Cesaro Summability. That track makes me feel very moraly wrong inside

The tracks have some meaning to them, i think it was in this thread that someone mentioned intermission being the calm before a storm or something?

The fibbonaci sequence is 1, 1, 2, 3, 5, 8, 13...

You add the two previous numbers together to get the next one.

It appears in nature quite a bit and is pleasing to the mind much like the golden ration and phi.

/maths geek :(

ok i understand the fibbonaci sequence and phi, but what exactlly is the golden ratio that i hear about alot in this thread?

Hmmz, i really don't know the ins and outs of it. But it is apparently a ratio that involves an artist drawing the main theme at one point in his canvas, which pleases the eye. I'm not an artist however and I have only heard this in passing.

(-) Ions, this track as most of you know, does mean something. negative ions create happiness. it's a little more technical but thats the jist of it. intermission is jimmy an octave or two higher at a faster pace. you could see it as life was great, having fun, then you come of age and life sucks. you cant find yourself, your stress level can be unbearable. allaborate please, but that is the basics of what i feel intermission and jimmy mean. the other ones, don't ask me, took me long enough to get the two.

They should have called it anions.

Or, honestly, they could have not done them at all.

I love the songs on Aenima, but the filler...not so much.

I think the fact they put them on there shows that they were making their album, not one that was made to be liked. Besides, most bands who fill their albums with filler material do it often to make up for lack of songs. There was no problem like that for Tool.

Though the filler parts on 13th step I find weak.

[B]ANALYSIS OF LATERALUS[/B]

To me, Tool's Lateralus is the most amazing piece of music ever composed. I think Tool deliberately wanted to give their fans something truly amazing, but wanted them to find it on their own. "Recognize this as a holy gift..." At first, I thought that the song Lateralus was about tripping acid - discovering true color by seperating the body from the mind. At first listen, I imagined the bending envelope as an intense visual. After becoming more familiar with the track, however, I had reformed my interpretation to something broader: think deeper. Lateralus, perhaps because it is the album's "title track", serves as the central clue for a puzzle that a friend of mine had read about somewhere on the internet. "All I know is that there is a different order for the songs - something about two spirals. Oh yeah, and thirteen is in the middle." After scavenging through endless google search results, I gave up on finding more about this 'alternate order'. Intent to figure the album out, and very curious about the spirals - I put on the proverbial 'thinking cap'. I understood how the spirals could have a lot of significance, in that the album's title track offers the inspiring, "swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human..........And following our will and wind we may just go where no one's been. We'll ride the spiral to the end and may just go where no one's been." In my internet scavenging, I had read one review, written by a drummer, who mentioned that Danny Carey's drum beat formed a fibonacci sequence during the song Lateralus. A drummer myself, I decided to get out the graph paper and follow Danny. I can't play like he can, but at least I can hear everything he's doing, and thus was able to construct the drum tabulature. Sure enough, Danny repeats a Fibonacci sequence through the number 13: 1,1,2,3,5,8,13. After 13, he starts again with 1. Bringing in my Algebra 2 knowledge of the Fibonacci sequence, when the equation for the Fibonacci sequence (which I don't actually know) is graphed, it forms a sprial whose vertex depends on the number at which the sequence begins. Coincidence? I began to think not. I had already known of Danny's obsession with sacred geometry and am familiar with Bob Frissell's book, Nothing in This Book Is True, But It's Exactly How Things Are , so the significance of what I had stumbled upon had actually begun to settle in. This is where I just had to play with Lateralus. I had doodled a few spirals in the corners of my graph paper, and in doing so made the first important connection to Lateralus. I knew that if the tracks were in fact intended to be heard in a different order, "Parabol" and "Parabola" would have to go together. In drawing my spirals, I had begun with a vertex and 'spiraled' outwards. After writing the numbers 1 through 13 linearly, I could immediately see that Parabol and Parabola would have to be the middle of my spiral (in that 13 / 2 = 6.5). I drew a simple arrow between 6 and 7 and then pondered the next pair. At first, I actually drew a spiral connecting pairs of numbers whose sum equaled 13 (the number of songs on the album). This, however, left the last track in the same position and without anything to connect to. At this time, I had used my copy of Lateralus and Cool Edit Pro to take out the silences between tracks and put the songs in the following order: 6,7,5,8,4,9,3,10,2,11,1,12,13. The transition from Parabola into Schism blew my mind, as the plucks, probably dismissed by listeners as a drawn out rant of an ending, perfectly transition into the beginning of Schism. When you count out beats as the strings are plucked, Schism resumes with the same time signature and tempo - mirroring the progression of notes. The transition from Schism into Ticks & Leeches is equally intriguing. Schism ends with strong double-kick bass and tom smacks, and Ticks & Leeches begins with what many would call a 'tribal' drum beat. The beat at the very start of Ticks & Leeches is slightly different every subsequent time it is repeated - the measures are two beats longer. Yup - you guessed it - those two beats are ACTUALLY the last two beats of Schism. I can honestly say that I never understood the album's fourth track, Mantra until reordering the album's songs. What I had originally heard as whale calls now had begun to resemble the worst imaginable dry heaves - or a stylized choking. Fitting, seeing as how the last line in Ticks & Leeches is "I hope you choke." After this transition, none of those following it really seemed to make much sense. I certainly didn't like that Disposition and Reflection had been seperated - as they sound quite good when played sequentially on the album. This was the only real roadblock in my disciphering of the Holy Gift. Then I had remembered what my friend had told me - 13 was in the middle. At the time, probably just wanting to believe that there was more to this cd, I had equated this to the positioning of the song "Intermission" on the previous release, Ænema. For the song to be in the 'middle' of the album it would have to be the seventh track in sequence, here having six tracks on either side of it. So I inserted Faaip de Oiad after Lateralus, and almost peed my pants when I discovered that (ever-so-faintly) the fading tone of the last note of Lateralus could be heard in beginning of Faaip de Oiad, and how the distortion of the guitars at the tail end of Lateralus resembled, and later transitioned seamlessly into, the static at the beginning of Faaip de Oiad. The lyrics of Lateralus justify this break in the spiral, almost instructing: "spiral out, keep going, spiral out, keep going." I went back to Lateralus to find the next clue. In Danny Carey's amazingly competent Fibonacci sequence, he had stopped at 13 and gone back to 1. This is what I chose to do to finish the sequence. A second spiral was now constucted, and the order for the Holy Gift now became 6,7,5,8,4,9,13,1,12,2,11,3,10. Already many of you are probably fascinated at what I have revealed to you, but I can not even begin to tell you what this new order has opened up for me. The beauty of Lateralus is very, very fragile and has to be viewed with a very open mind. It can also be different when looked at from different points of view. Aside from the fact that the new order of the songs places them in an order where they flow together nicely - often ending and resuming on the same notes or within the same progression, and some times - in the case of Lateralus into Faaip de Oiad and The Grudge into Triad - even overlapping (though admittadly sound much better when actually electronically overlapped, this is kind of cheating. Consider this a hint, however, if you plan on doing this yourself), the two spirals help to tell a story that every Tool fan should hear. In the interest of not boring the only casually intrigued, I will try to keep this very brief. I would also recommend familiarizing yourselves with Frissell's book (yeah - the one I mentioned earlier). I consider Parabol and Parabola to be quite expository. Maynard wants us to know that no matter what happens, we must all know that this is not our only existance. Our very minds and the contents of our subconscious are intended to be immortal, and if we accept this into our lives (be it because of personal or religious reasons), it will be so. As such, pain is an illusion. At first, I called it "The Lateralus Prophecy" (for reasons you will soon understand), but I have since decided to call the 'reordered' version of Lateralus "The Holy Gift". As Maynard says, "Recognize this as a holy gift and celebrate this chance to be alive and breathing," I take the word "this" to mean much more than just his simple cautioning. Since Parabola is the second track of the Holy Gift, it can be considered at the beginning (esp. considering the context of it's duality with Parabol), and as such, I interpret Maynard's words as more than just clever lyrics in a song. They are a plead for his listeners to listen to everything he has to say and truly celebrate the chance of immortality offered throughout. I would be lying if I said that each song has a specific translation. On the contrary, Tool's music is designed to make you think, not say something specific. It must be treated like great literature - much is hidden contextually.

edit: Sorry, thort i mentioned this was not my own, my friend sent it to me, the original source is unkown to me. and another thing, forgive me if you HAVE all seen this before, i havent.. and i foudn it pretty **** cool.

^^ We've seen that before, if you post the link to the website you found it on, it'll be cool. I keep misplacing it.

If you did type that out yourself, its very very similar to what i've read before

[QUOTE=Adam Jones is GOD]I think the fact they put them on there shows that they were making their album, not one that was made to be liked. Besides, most bands who fill their albums with filler material do it often to make up for lack of songs. There was no problem like that for Tool.

Though the filler parts on 13th step I find weak.[/QUOTE]
I did like crimes though, the only filler i liked on that cd.

[QUOTE=Adam Jones is GOD]^^ We've seen that before, if you post the link to the website you found it on, it'll be cool. I keep misplacing it.

If you did type that out yourself, its very very similar to what i've read before[/QUOTE]

I found a site on it last night and bookmarked it.

[url]http://www.angelfire.com/ma4/question/insight7.html[/url]

Found it.^^ Enjoy.

To Drum2k, I liked your version better. It was more concise. :thumb:

[QUOTE=Remedy]I did like crimes though, the only filler i liked on that cd.[/QUOTE]

I think Lullaby was great, it ended Pet perfectly and just flowed really well in my opinion. I recently realized the greatness of that album. For awhile, I just let APC mull around in Tool's massive shadow, but I finally listened to them with an unbiased approach, and they really are amazing.

I honestly don't like any filler. If I buy a band's album, I want [b]music[/b]. Random noises, phone calls, stuff like that, are not songs.

[QUOTE=The JoZ]I honestly don't like any filler. If I buy a band's album, I want [b]music[/b]. Random noises, phone calls, stuff like that, are not songs.[/QUOTE]

I can see where you're coming from, there. But a lot of times the "filler" adds to the flow of the album, where it gives it a more conceptual feel and I think the bands that add filler tastefully really put it in there for a reason.

I have a question about The Grudge's guitar intro. I know one guitar is just plucking, hammer/pull pluck on the 6 string, but I was wondering, is the second guitar a bass, or what? Sorry if I'm not clear on this, but it's the best I could describe it.

I'm pretty sure it's the bass, but then the guitar starts playing the same thing a few measures into it. I could be wrong, though.

[QUOTE=Kage]I can see where you're coming from, there. But a lot of times the "filler" adds to the flow of the album, where it gives it a more conceptual feel and I think the bands that add filler tastefully really put it in there for a reason.[/QUOTE]

Agreed. There are 3 types of albums for me.
1) A collection of songs place on a CD that dont necessarily go together well, but are great on their own
2) A collection of songs that work with each other to build up an overall mood
3) The 80% utter waste of a good CD albums that are out there

The filler works best on option 2. When put in with option 2, thats when they annoy the hell out of me.

[QUOTE=kombucha mushroom mofo]I have a question about The Grudge's guitar intro. I know one guitar is just plucking, hammer/pull pluck on the 6 string, but I was wondering, is the second guitar a bass, or what? Sorry if I'm not clear on this, but it's the best I could describe it.[/QUOTE]

im almost definitely sure it is bass.
take a look at the bass tab from tooltabs.net

[url]http://www.tooltabs.net/tabs/tool/bass/lateralus/the_grudge.htm[/url]

it sounds right to me

i think one of the only problem with that theory of the spiral thing in Lateralus is that last note of the second track, Eon Blue Apocalypse rings out into the beginning of The Patient. if you break that cycle and go from Eon Blue Apocalype into Reflections, it doesnt really fit it sound wise, but going from Refections into The Patient sounds like it could be right to me.

[QUOTE]Or, honestly, they could have not done them at all.[/QUOTE]

hey man they put these fillers in for a reason as to explain more the meaning of the album in whole, like many poeple have posted that you have to look at every song, whter it be a filler or not , to get the message behind the album.

thats just IMO

Speaking of bass. Lately, I've been obsessed with Intolerance because of the dark background the bass gives the song.

To see older discussion of drum2K's post, go here:

[url]http://www.musicianforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=136377[/url]

Please don't bump that thread. And if we ever update the first page, that link should probably go there :)

[QUOTE=Kage]I can see where you're coming from, there. But a lot of times the "filler" adds to the flow of the album, where it gives it a more conceptual feel and I think the bands that add filler tastefully really put it in there for a reason.[/QUOTE]

i totally agree with you, but i mean it was dissopointing to hear so many fillers on lateralus (im sorry i always spell that one wrong :upset: ) after we waited so long for it to come

[QUOTE=pigonthewing82]i totally agree with you, but i mean it was dissopointing to hear [b]so many fillers on lateralus[/b] (im sorry i always spell that one wrong :upset: ) after we waited so long for it to come[/QUOTE]

There are 3 fillers on Lateralus, out of 13 songs. Eon Blue Apocalypse is very, very cool, and I find that Adams guitar on it leads nicely into The Patient, especially complimenting Justins bass line.

Mantra is indeed a filler track, but it is intriuging none the less. And Faaip de Oiad is a very spooky way for the album to end. I can't see how anyone would complain about Lateralus having too many filler tracks.

Does anybody know for sure what the noise is in Mantra? If not, just tell me what you think it is.

For the person asking about the Golden Ratio - it's a ratio of approximately 1.6:1, and is the most visually pleasing ratio for the sides of a rectangle. The Greeks used it (in the desgin of Parthenon I think) and Da Vinci searched for the ratio in people (look for that picture of the outstretched man in a rectangle, it should be in the golden ratio).

As the noise of Mantra - I heard it was a slowed down recording of Maynard's siamese cat.