[QUOTE=Kurtz]Exactly.

You sort of get a feeling of power too, like you're some kind of head of authority, or a big businessman.

Or that just might be me :-\[/QUOTE]

Definently. You feel really important, and like James Bond.


NP: Bob Dylan - Baby, Let Me Follow You Down

[QUOTE=Kurtz]Exactly.

You sort of get a feeling of power too, like you're some kind of head of authority, or a big businessman.

Or that just might be me :-\[/QUOTE]
No, it's me too. I love putting on suits once in a while even when it's uncomfortable.

I always hate putting on a suit or anything similar. It always makes me feel like a pretensious jackass. Maybe it's just me. :(

I enjoy a suit every now and again. I look like I'd make a great James Bond villain.

Vital Remains are awesome, anyone into them?

[QUOTE=Kurtz]I'm with Ray here.

Wear a suit if you want to look somewhat respectable dude. [b]Society just runs that way. [/b]

I love wearing suits though, so meh.[/QUOTE]
That's exactly what I was arguing against. Doing something just because everyone else does is so dumb, but so American. The thing is, you can't stop people judging you by your looks, but usually I avoid people in suits because I find they're the most boring and unenjoyable people around. That's one reason I prefer the internet. People can't judge you on stupid unimportant crap like looks, it's more who you are. Kinda.

Basically though I can't stand that mindset of "Society does ___ so I should too." If enough people lose that mindset society will change for the better and a lot of good things will come of it. People who can't force themselves to see outside the box bring the whole of humanity down :-\

[QUOTE=zeppelinfan2k3]That's exactly what I was arguing against. Doing something just because everyone else does is so dumb, but so American. The thing is, you can't stop people judging you by your looks, but usually I avoid people in suits because I find they're the most boring and unenjoyable people around. That's one reason I prefer the internet. People can't judge you on stupid unimportant crap like looks, it's more who you are. Kinda.

Basically though I can't stand that mindset of "Society does ___ so I should too." If enough people lose that mindset society will change for the better and a lot of good things will come of it. People who can't force themselves to see outside the box bring the whole of humanity down :-\[/QUOTE]
So basically, be different? Be unique? Don't be a conformist?

You'd eventually have to go with the flow though. No matter what you think, if try to go into a job interview, for a serious career, in street clothes, your boss will not hire you if you walk in there with a pair of jeans and a t shirt on. Your boss would expect a suit because he demands respect, and a suit is a respectable kind of apparel. You have to dress for success, and to impress in life.

The world isn't going to look outside the box (wearing street clothes for a job interview, ect.) for a long while. It's just become custom, and a default, over time to do so.

[QUOTE=Kurtz]So basically, be different? Be unique? Don't be a conformist?

You'd eventually have to go with the flow though. No matter what you think, if try to go into a job interview, for a serious career, in street clothes, your boss will not hire you if you walk in there with a pair of jeans and a t shirt on. Your boss would expect a suit because he demands respect, and a suit is a respectable kind of apparel. You have to dress for success, and to impress in life.

The world isn't going to look outside the box (wearing street clothes for a job interview, ect.) for a long while. It's just become custom, and a default, over time to do so.[/QUOTE]
Nope, just be yourself. If it's the same as everyone else, fine, I'm not too unique myself, just don't do things because other people do.

Maybe I won't try to ever get a "serious" career. I certainly have no intention of wroking at a place I'm required to wear a suit as daily attire. If I have to do it once in the interview, maybe, though I intend to avoid it if I can. "Dress for success" is one of the phrases that most bothers me. Ever. It implies you can't be successful without good clothing. It's a lie.

I know they aren't, but it changes one person at a time. It used to be a custom to sacrifice people to gods, that changed. Customs change.

[QUOTE=zeppelinfan2k3]Nope, just be yourself. If it's the same as everyone else, fine, I'm not too unique myself, just don't do things because other people do.

Maybe I won't try to ever get a "serious" career. I certainly have no intention of wroking at a place I'm required to wear a suit as daily attire. If I have to do it once in the interview, maybe, though I intend to avoid it if I can. "Dress for success" is one of the phrases that most bothers me. Ever. It implies you can't be successful without good clothing. It's a lie.

I know they aren't, but it changes one person at a time. It used to be a custom to sacrifice people to gods, that changed. Customs change.[/QUOTE]
Be an induvidual, pretty much. Don't let anyone change who you are.

I don't see the probelm with suits. Maybe you've just worn cheap ones? Also, I've noticed that some of the most desired jobs are ones intended for suits. I don't know about you, but I want a good paying job when I'm older, and I definitely don't want a career in music, because I want a better chance at being successful in life. I want a family. I want a good house. You know, all that crap. Sure, a career as a bassist or a guitarist wouldn't be bad, but do you think I could actually support a family with that kind of job? It's a dangerous risk, being in an band, not knowing if you'll make it or not, possibly wasting years of your life and end up with nothing.

That's true, but human sacrifices aren't even in the same ballpark as dressing out for a suit. Hell, it isn't even the same sport. But I think people have always been dressing in their best for their jobs.

[QUOTE=Moses]Vital Remains are awesome, anyone into them?[/QUOTE]
Absolutely. A friend told me about Dechristianize a while back - it's one of the most insane albums I've ever heard.

[QUOTE=Kurtz]Be an induvidual, pretty much. Don't let anyone change who you are.

I don't see the probelm with suits. Maybe you've just worn cheap ones? Also, I've noticed that some of the most desired jobs are ones intended for suits. I don't know about you, but I want a good paying job when I'm older, and I definitely don't want a career in music, because I want a better chance at being successful in life. I want a family. I want a good house. You know, all that crap. Sure, a career as a bassist or a guitarist wouldn't be bad, but do you think I could actually support a family with that kind of job? It's a dangerous risk, being in an band, not knowing if you'll make it or not, possibly wasting years of your life and end up with nothing.

That's true, but human sacrifices aren't even in the same ballpark as dressing out for a suit. Hell, it isn't even the same sport. But I think people have always been dressing in their best for their jobs.[/QUOTE]
Right, I don't think it's too individual to conform, but if your activities/choices/etc coincide with the norm go for it. Whatever makes you happy.

No, I assure you that the tux I got at prom was anything but cheap. I still wasn't comfortable in it. Mind you, I never wear long pants and rarely long sleeves, so that may be part of it. It's too constrictive of your movement too though. I like wearing clothes I'd be comfortable doing karate in. You say most desired, but that's a matter of opinion. Jobs requiring suits are not on my list of most desirable. I actually don't care too much about a good paying job. I know that if I need to make money I can, but it's not a priority, I can be happy with less material possessions. I want a career in music because happiness can't be bought, I guarantee it. I won't be happy in most other professions, and I'm unhappy enough without a job I hate, so I refuse to put up with that. Plus, the only music careers aren't bands, there are plenty that are steady jobs. Journalism, production, engineering...all steady jobs with no more risk than say, being a doctor, in fact, much less. I don't know that I'll have a family to support either way, and if I do, I wouldn't be married to them if they didn't see things the same as me. I don't think you can end with nothing though. Experience is more valuable than money. Fact.

You say it isn't, but I say it is. It used to be seen as normal, and now it's barbaric, but maybe dressing up will be seen as barbaric in a few millenia, you can't say. Saying they're that far apart is very close-minded. Actually, I'm pretty sure people didn't dress up for their jobs until pay came into play and clothing became a sign of status, and you dressed up to show you had a good job. But social status doesn't concern me either.

[QUOTE=zeppelinfan2k3]No, I assure you that the tux I got at prom was anything but cheap. I still wasn't comfortable in it. Mind you, I never wear long pants and rarely long sleeves, so that may be part of it. It's too constrictive of your movement too though. I like wearing clothes I'd be comfortable doing karate in. You say most desired, but that's a matter of opinion. Jobs requiring suits are not on my list of most desirable. I actually don't care too much about a good paying job. I know that if I need to make money I can, but it's not a priority, I can be happy with less material possessions. I want a career in music because happiness can't be bought, I guarantee it. I won't be happy in most other professions, and I'm unhappy enough without a job I hate, so I refuse to put up with that. Plus, the only music careers aren't bands, there are plenty that are steady jobs. Journalism, production, engineering...all steady jobs with no more risk than say, being a doctor, in fact, much less. I don't know that I'll have a family to support either way, and if I do, I wouldn't be married to them if they didn't see things the same as me. I don't think you can end with nothing though. Experience is more valuable than money. Fact.

You say it isn't, but I say it is. It used to be seen as normal, and now it's barbaric, but maybe dressing up will be seen as barbaric in a few millenia, you can't say. Saying they're that far apart is very close-minded. Actually, I'm pretty sure people didn't dress up for their jobs until pay came into play and clothing became a sign of status, and you dressed up to show you had a good job. But social status doesn't concern me either.[/QUOTE]
That's true. A cousin of mine is actually an editor for a small indie rock magazine here in Orange County, I forgot the name of it though. For me, having a good paying job isn't just for materialistic crap, it's so my kids could have a good upbringing and good future. I could care less if I have the most expensive Benz on the block or if I have the nicest house, it's so my kids have something in life to look foward to.

Sure I could make some good pay as a producer, but the field of business has me interested the most, because it's so versitle. Hell, I could work for a production label, ESPN, Wall Street, wherever. I don't know, I still have a lot of time to think about it.

It's jsut that suits give me a good feeling. I almost get cocky because I think I look so sharp in them. Sure I love a shirt and jeans, but a suit just makes you feel respectable, and powerful. Wouldn't you think if you bumped into somebody on the street wearing a suit, that they have a respectable position, or their respectable themselves?

[QUOTE=Kurtz]That's true. A cousin of mine is actually an editor for a small indie rock magazine here in Orange County, I forgot the name of it though. For me, having a good paying job isn't just for materialistic crap, it's so my kids could have a good upbringing and good future. I could care less if I have the most expensive Benz on the block or if I have the nicest house, it's so my kids have something in life to look foward to.

Sure I could make some good pay as a producer, but the field of business has me interested the most, because it's so versitle. Hell, I could work for a production label, ESPN, Wall Street, wherever. I don't know, I still have a lot of time to think about it.

It's jsut that suits give me a good feeling. I almost get cocky because I think I look so sharp in them. Sure I love a shirt and jeans, but a suit just makes you feel respectable, and powerful. Wouldn't you think if you bumped into somebody on the street wearing a suit, that they have a respectable position, or their respectable themselves?[/QUOTE]
I totally respect that, but I'm very very unsure I'm having kids, to say the least. In fact to better say it is I'm pretty sure I don't want them right now, though i admit it could change. The thing is, I know that if I do have kids, they'll be high-achieving, because I am and I wouldn't marry someone who isn't. By high-achieving I mean with the potential to go far, not necessarily actually achieving a lot. I have faith I wouldn't need to provide for them, they'll provide for themselves.

Eh, I may end up doing things on the business side of it, all I know is I won't be happy not doing music. I hope to move from sound engineering to production, but I know it may not work out. I just know what's important to me. And it's not a high-paying job. My (theoretical) wife would definitely know that too.

I wouldn't think a guy is respectable, but I'd assume he has a higher end job. I don't think people are respectable until they give me a reason to respect then, until then they're just another human, and I don't think highly of them regardless of how they look. In fact, I usually loathe people who look that great if I don't think they're worth respecting.

[QUOTE=zeppelinfan2k3]I wouldn't think a guy is respectable, but I'd assume he has a higher end job. I don't think people are respectable until they give me a reason to respect then, until then they're just another human, and I don't think highly of them regardless of how they look. In fact, I usually loathe people who look that great if I don't think they're worth respecting.[/QUOTE]
I meant that in a way so to think that maybe that guy earn his way to wear that suit. Most people just don't go out there and wear a suit for the sake of it, they most likely have job that requires it. I was saying it out of stereotype, like thinking businessmen are respectable, but they don't mean a thing to you if you don't know their personality. You put it perect.

Sorry if that sounds like a bunch of nonsense, I'm a bit out of it.

I'm out. It was good to have an actual discussion in here :)

[QUOTE=Kurtz]I meant that in a way so to think that maybe that guy earn his way to wear that suit. Most people just don't go out there and wear a suit for the sake of it, they most likely have job that requires it. I was saying it out of stereotype, like thinking businessmen are respectable, but they don't mean a thing to you if you don't know their personality. You put it perect.

Sorry if that sounds like a bunch of nonsense, I'm a bit out of it.

I'm out. It was good to have an actual discussion in here :)[/QUOTE]
It's cool, I'm always glad to debate things I'm passionate about. I personally don't think many guys have worked harder than my dad, and he dresses well, but not suits. I respect him more than anyone else in the world. Poverty->Rocket Scientist :thumb: Yet, based on looks I wouldn't say he looks overly respectable, so, *shrug*

[QUOTE=zeppelinfan2k3]It's cool, I'm always glad to debate things I'm passionate about. I personally don't think many guys have worked harder than my dad, and he dresses well, but not suits. I respect him more than anyone else in the world. Poverty->Rocket Scientist :thumb: Yet, based on looks I wouldn't say he looks overly respectable, so, *shrug*[/QUOTE]
That's cool man. You're dad definitely worked hard to get where he is, he deserves whatever he earns (guessing he gets great pay).

Don't get me wrong, I hope I didn't come off as snooty when I said the whole thing about suits and jobs.

I also respect my dad the most more than anybody else. He earned his way to the top through hard work, from being an nothing to something. My grandparents came to America so that their kids could have a better life than they lived in Europe, and it worked. My dad is a widely respected man where he works, and I'm not rich, I'm middle class, but I could say I'm well off compared to some other people I know.

Yeah, we're pretty much in the same situation, that's just why I don't feel clothes matter. My dad is the most respectable guy I know and can dress well, but doesn't have to for me to respect him, and that's the great thing. :)

this is an interessting argument.
and I can get quite angry sometimes
with the nice clothes <--> Status argument
I don't dreass in a suit, I wear clothes that are comfortable on me, but that doesn't mean I'm a bum or an ignorant unintelligent person.
if you get a job somewhere you get the job because you are good at it, and not because you suck at it(or not this isn't really relevant), but have niice clothes (unless you're a model:p)
people should be a bit more thoughtfull when having prejusdices about certain things, but than again, it's society and we're all a bunch of sheeps following the rest of the herd. so I doubt it will ever make a difference

I like dressing in suits, i own several nice shirts and a Ralph Lauren suit, but thats mainly because i like to look my best at formal occasions, i don't want to look like i would if was just dressing normally. Its a special occasion, especially if its a wedding, you want it to be as good as possible for the bride and groom, if ya know what i mean.

About the job thing, you have to wear a suit eventually man, its all part of growing into an adult lifestyle :p

I think I will have to 'get in to the adult attitude' indeed. I'm 19 already :amaze:
I don't think there's really a way of stopping that, but despite that, I still do not agree with it.

and dressing nice is nice, I like to wear nice clothes too from time to time.
although I do not own any suits myself.
and if all goes well, I will only be wearing a suit on my job interview, and maybe on some formal jobmeeting.
but for the rest of the day that I work I wont have to dress in a suit.
I'm studying to become weird social psychiatric ward dude.

on a sidenote: something that I've always found amusing is that the police have this clip on tie,ty?(sp?)
those own normal tie's, I suck at making the knot for a tie :(

I'm personally with Ray. His opinions on dressing smartly match mine totally, so go Ray!

Not much action around this part of town.

[URL=http://www.musicianforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=392191]omgz thred[/URL]

Well I wore a suit for two years, and a uniform strongly resembling a suit for the five before that. So for now, I'm done with suits.

I have my school formal soon. I will be in a suit :cool:

shall be fun

Just listened to the new Arsis track from Diamond for Disease. F[size=2]u[/size]cking awesome stuff. \m/

So I'm now posting live from Manchester. The move was ridiculously easy and apparently my internet works. The hardest part of the move by far was trying to stop my mother mothering me to death. The only bad thing is that I still have a bad hangover from last night.

[url=http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v282/atouchofgenius/DSCF0124.jpg]my room[/url]

[url=http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v282/atouchofgenius/DSCF0125.jpg]Room 2[/url]

[url=http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v282/atouchofgenius/DSCF0126.jpg]Kitchen[/url]

[url=http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v282/atouchofgenius/DSCF0127.jpg]kitchen 2[/url]

Very nice! Your guitar too. :)

Nice pad man, also nice Irn Bru. I bought 4 two litre bottles of it for 3 quid yesterday. I've got through 2.5 already :(

And Leah : I made a thread on it. Its so awesome isn't it :D

I was talking to my mom about the same thing the other day. She says that I have to wear khakis and a polo shirt for my cousins wedding reception. It's not even the actualy wedding, it's the party the night before.

I told her that I think it's wierd that khakis are somehow considered nice and formal. The most important thing should be that everyone shows up to suppourt the bride and groom, not what they wear.

When I see a bunch of guys walking down the street all wearing suits, they look like a bunch of clones. Why should a suit be a required thing for so many jobs? Making your male employees all wear suits is stupid, IMO.

Nice place you've got there, Ali.

I might go see the Easy Dub All Stars tonight :cool:

They are the band that made Dub Side of the Moon.

Regret Not is the only good song All That Remains have ever done, mainly because of the lack of crappy lyrics.

Have any of you guys heard the Tony Danza Tap Dance Extravaganza?

[QUOTE=munky_magik]So I'm now posting live from Manchester. The move was ridiculously easy and apparently my internet works. The hardest part of the move by far was trying to stop my mother mothering me to death. The only bad thing is that I still have a bad hangover from last night.

[url=http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v282/atouchofgenius/DSCF0124.jpg]my room[/url]

[url=http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v282/atouchofgenius/DSCF0125.jpg]Room 2[/url]

[url=http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v282/atouchofgenius/DSCF0126.jpg]Kitchen[/url]

[url=http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v282/atouchofgenius/DSCF0127.jpg]kitchen 2[/url][/QUOTE]
Are you living in one where you have to share the bathroom/kitchen with everyone? I am loving the amount of Irn Bru :p.

[QUOTE=Arucard]Regret Not is the only good song All That Remains have ever done, mainly because of the lack of crappy lyrics.[/QUOTE]
Do you mean crappy vocals? Phil's not the greatest, but their music is good.

No, the lyrics. I just think they are terrible. I do like 'This Darkned Heart' though.

I like their instrumental parts. The guitarists have a weird style of soloing. They're probably the only "metalcore" band I can actually somewhat enjoy.

Yes, the guitarist do have a very nice mothod of soloing. Its like Wintersun and Ensiferum, they have beatufiully sweeped styles.

Ensiferum's cool. I've never heard Wintersun though, and I've heard they're amazing.

They are, they are like a cross between Bodom and Ensiferum, then put on speed.