Re: Deftones
 

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Bleached515 [/i]
[B]I heard someone say Chino screams inward,how do you do that?(BTW I thought he dropped a lung...)I can scream like Chad Gray(Mudvayne),but I can't figure out screaming inward....any help?:smoke: :smoke: :smoke: [/B][/QUOTE]



mudvayne screaming rules dude.......... but theres just one thing. me and my backing vocalist have been trying to do this for quite some time now, and still cant. i mena, the screaming itself is easy, but how do you hit the high notes like on dig "every thing that i AAAAAAAM!". some help would greatly be apreciated

*shoots self in head*

Hey Rayce,I really don't know what to tell about the scream...It just kinda happens,like its my natural scream pushed to its limits.I don't know dude....I like doing Nothing to Gein and -1,they are just awesome to sing to.(that had nothing to do with anything,I just like those songs :D )

my scream sounds a bit like the from autumn to ashes scream, however i want it to sound like joe's from a static lullaby. do you have any tips for me?

also, when you feel the soreness after, is it supposed to be like how when you feel when you were yelling alot?

Rayce: Ok, first off never scream like Mudvayne. He permanantly blew his voice from doing it. Thats why they used to be a trio and now theyre a quartet. Its a new vocalist. Im sure once in a great while people can do it and be fine, but thats a rare 2%. The lead singer of Disturbed also had to stop screaming from his gut cuz it was pushing stomach acid into his esophogus and eating away at it. So ya, if you dont care about your body and voice, go for it. I personally value my voice too much.

Radio_flyer: Whatever scream you have is pretty much what youre stuck with. Ive been working on mine for like a month solid now with my vocal instructer and although i can kinda change the way it sounds, for the most part im stuck sounding like Geoff from thursay and Bert from The Used. I myself wanted a Nate Barcelow scream. So im slowly accepting the fact that ive got what i got, you should too. But keep practicing and you can at least kind of get it to sound like what you want and hey, maybe youll prove me wrong. Cuz hell, ive only been doing it a little over a month, lol. Oh and it shouldnt hurt if you do it right. Mine only hurt the 1st time cuz it wasnt used to using my falsetta that much. But not a stinging soreness, more of a worked out muscle kind of sore. If its the stinging kind, then youre tearing up your voice and youre doing it wrong. Laters

Oh and my friend can inward scream like a madman but ya, it does ruin your singing voice for a good day and its hard to form words with it. Just work at the falsetta scream. Its like anything else, youre not gonna get it right away. Its gonna take ALOT of practice. Just like singing. SO GET TO IT!!!

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Bleached515 [/i]
[B]Hey Rayce,I really don't know what to tell about the scream...It just kinda happens,like its my natural scream pushed to its limits.I don't know dude....I like doing Nothing to Gein and -1,they are just awesome to sing to.(that had nothing to do with anything,I just like those songs :D ) [/B][/QUOTE]


dude, mudvayne is tough sh*t. i heard the guy used to gargle a combo of water and gravel (ya right) to get his voice that way. the the whole trio/quartet thing, then that must mean that the guitarist (Gurg, or Güüg, depending on which era you go by) must have done the screaming. honest to go truth, they must not have been a trio, on acounta the fact that my friend jesse got ahold of the VERY first mudvayne CD, right before they hit it big (thats right, its a demo CD) and kud (or Chüd......... whatever) did the vocals on that too. besides, i can scream like normal mudvayne stuff, but when it comes to the higher stuff (like internal primates forever where he scream the last part of addictions..... making it "adicTIONS!") is all i'm having trouble with. os for the david draiman comment above, yes he did have to stop. but i can get an equal sounding scream just by yelling, (pantera did this) so i dont see why david just did this :confused:

I wanna scream like Ian MacKaye...

Ok, whenever I started screaming I couldn't do it for more than ten minutes because my throat would start hurting. It only took me a couple of days to be able to do it without my throat hurting but now whenever I do it, after about twenty minutes I get this funny feeling in the back of my throat whenever I do the higher notes. It doesn't hurt but it feels like I've swallowed something but it hasn't gone all the way down. It just kind of rests there in the back of my throat. Is this normal?

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Doll [/i]
[B]Ok, whenever I started screaming I couldn't do it for more than ten minutes because my throat would start hurting. It only took me a couple of days to be able to do it without my throat hurting but now whenever I do it, after about twenty minutes I get this funny feeling in the back of my throat whenever I do the higher notes. It doesn't hurt but it feels like I've swallowed something but it hasn't gone all the way down. It just kind of rests there in the back of my throat. Is this normal? [/B][/QUOTE]


ok, i'm not sure, because i was self taught, but i'd say improper form. how do you scream?

Ok, I guess it's not really screaming but aggressive singing. I'm doing it the way you guys instructed. At least that's what it seems like.

I've noticed when i was teaching some begginer singing classes that people have the tendancy to lean there neck back when they sing the higher notes, watch yourself and practise with a mirror... you may THINK you're using proper technique but there are probably times when you get lazy and forget.

If you are still have strain 1 of 2 things are happening:

1) you are singing outside of your normal range, you MAY be able to work and get that note but not by straining yourself trying to reach that note... instead I recomend singing the highest note you can sing without having to strain yourself and practise that, eventually this could help you develope your higher range.

2) you are not doing the technique properly, in this case if you can't do it yourself save up some money and take some lessons... remember every teacher has different methods, ask your teacher to sing for you, if she/he can't produce i wouldn't waste money on it.

Doing my best attempt to emulate your technique I sound like a retarded duck apparently. Do you think it is because I am doing it improperly, that I suffer some strange form of retardation, or that maybe I just haven't practiced enough.

most of the time it is confidence... its like skateboarding, if you doubt you're gonna make the jump, you're not going to make it. how do you gain confidence? practise, thats all man!

Ian Mackaye, yeah. The chorus to "Filler" is pretty intense, he always sounds so sincere. ("It's in your head! It's in your head!") But as far as the sound goes, I wanna mix a lot different influences together with my own special ingredient to have my own unique voice. Just place them in right context of whatever song I'm writing, and try to keep up the emotional sincerity throughout. The Blood Brothers have cool screams, can anyone emulate their style? Anyways, I was wondering if I quit smoking now will my voice get better, or just not get worse? If it's not gonna make my screaming much better I don't care, I've been smoking for like 5 or 6 years.

dude, i'm trying to do the poison the well screaming now........ any pointers? not the old stuff like "lost in silence" but the screams on "slice paper wrists" or "nerdy"

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Moroii [/i]
[B]Ian Mackaye, yeah. The chorus to "Filler" is pretty intense, he always sounds so sincere. ("It's in your head! It's in your head!") But as far as the sound goes, I wanna mix a lot different influences together with my own special ingredient to have my own unique voice. Just place them in right context of whatever song I'm writing, and try to keep up the emotional sincerity throughout. The Blood Brothers have cool screams, can anyone emulate their style? Anyways, I was wondering if I quit smoking now will my voice get better, or just not get worse? If it's not gonna make my screaming much better I don't care, I've been smoking for like 5 or 6 years. [/B][/QUOTE]

Smoking takes away your vocal range, and also weakens your lungs. So yes, you will find it much easier to breathe and sing and will find your longivity for singing is much longer if you quit smoking. In the long run smoking will kill your higher vocal range, and will decrease the strength of your voice.

wow, first off all.... thanks for the tips Thee Unsound.

Before... i would think to myself it was in the gut.. and when after a couple songs or so i'd really feel it ;\

I have this song that I can't describe and I realyl want to learn to scream like this guy. If you'd check it out and give some pointers I'd greatly appreciate it. The song is Zao - Parade of Chaos

Ok you say.. open your mouth or else no one can hear, then get a mic cuz u dont wanna push it out to be loud. Umm.. about how far wold u say id be to hear it without a mic.

Also: "Practise your breathing every night put a book on your chest and lift it up with your stomach as you breathe in" is what you said.. But.. I read on that your not using your stomach more of your throat. Wouldnt that exercise just exercise ur stomach sort of push so u could scream better from it.

Okay first of all let me say most people probably won't like doing inward screams because they can be painful, I can do it and it resembles the sound of Dani Filth from Cradle of Filth. But for the most part I yell/scream sing and I remember when I started out I wouldn't be able to do it for long and I would lose my voice for a couple of days at a time. Yes of course my methods were bad, but here is something this thread is all wrong about.....
NO MATTER WHAT METHODS YOU USE SCREAMING IS HURTING YOUR VOCAL CHORDS!!! WHETHER IT HAPPENS SOON OR A YEARS AWAY, IT IS NOT GOOD FOR YOU! This has come from many proffesionals, and I know it is true. You can take all the precautions you want, it is inevitable. Although I don't care, but I just figured others would like to know, and be careful because if you do something wrong while screaming you could be making a trip to the hospital to have surgery on your vocal chords.

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by -sandman- [/i]
[B]Ok you say.. open your mouth or else no one can hear, then get a mic cuz u dont wanna push it out to be loud. Umm.. about how far wold u say id be to hear it without a mic.

Also: "Practise your breathing every night put a book on your chest and lift it up with your stomach as you breathe in" is what you said.. But.. I read on that your not using your stomach more of your throat. Wouldnt that exercise just exercise ur stomach sort of push so u could scream better from it. [/B][/QUOTE]

As you get more comfortable and better at it you'll find out how far or close you want the mic to your face... its really personal preference. The closer you hold it to your mouth the more distorted and bassy it will be... the further the more trebly and more clear.

No matter if you are singing or screaming from your diaphram or your throat, you need breath. The less breath you need the less you will strain your voice... the breathing exercises will help.

And yes Anternicy1 is right, no matter how good your technique is, screaming will damage your throat and vocal chords... I am just putting this up so at least if people DO choose to scream (cause they will whether or not I say its bad) they do it right, to prevent serious damage. If you want longivity I would reccomend never going nuts with it, one you get the technique down... you don't have to practise hours on end everyday you're throat isn't going to get stronger and used to it. Practise for 5 minutes and then stop... and maybe start again 3 hours later, save it for a show.

Well, **** thats kinda depressing. So Thee what do your vocal teachers say about your screaming? And what do you think the lon term effects will be? I do plan to be a vocalist for a long time so i really dont want my voice to be gone in like 10 years. Will it just give me a nodule or cist or something? O, and how can Corey Taylor from slipknot scream like he does but then sing very clean in Stonesour? Next week i begin trying out different vocal instructors so ill ask them too, but i just want to know. Someone plz tell me cuz my voice is VERY important to me and its not like my guitar where i can just go out and get another one. If i ruin this one, im ****ed. I have noticed this method is less harsh then many others and sounds quite good and i would like to keep doing it, but day in and day out of gigging i think will tear me up if this is even the SLIGHTEST bit abrasive. I have heard singers say that it will get harder and HEAL over, but then ive also heard it wont. Maybe its all varied on the person. JESUS!!!!! SOMEONE TELL ME!!!!!!

Chill dude, I have been using this technique about 2 or 3 years I'm 20 right now, and my voice isn't dammaged or scratchy (unless i want it to be)... its a pretty good way of screaming, all I was saying is be carefull, if you don't know what you are doing and you think you MAY be doing it wrong you probably are, I mean unless I am doing it for more than 15 minutes straight I don't get any strain. My old teacher ( I don't take lessons anymore) was 29 and he had been doing it since he was 18 and his voice was still REALLY good... its all about moderation... different people are different as well some people will experiance more or less strain from screaming. Don't get discouraged, think about it like this... When you walk you are wearing away the rubbery parts in between your joints... does that mean you suddenly stop walking? For the most part if you use this technique and remember to scream in moderation I don't see why you can't be screaming until your 50 or something or who knows... look at the guy from aerosmith.

that what happened ti cannibal corpse. its such raw screaming they've gone through 2 or 3 vocalists......... something like that.

ok i need a nice step by step instruction to sing like dustin from thrice or bert from the used...only bert sounds like hes shredding his voice chords. i dont want as raspy and all as bert, but the high pitched scream. mainly i need to know cuz i sing/play on my own. otherwise dustin from thrice is the type of scream i want. could i get step by step please?

i went to this church thing and at this talent show, this band called like the smiley guys or something did the song Until The Day I Die-Story of the Year.....they were offbeat everyonce in a while, and i was like they're ok, but they gained some respect from me when the lead singer did the screaming part...he made it look so easy and he sounded a hell a lot like the guy

[QUOTE=chris4aker]ok i need a nice step by step instruction to sing like dustin from thrice or bert from the used...only bert sounds like hes shredding his voice chords. i dont want as raspy and all as bert, but the high pitched scream. mainly i need to know cuz i sing/play on my own. otherwise dustin from thrice is the type of scream i want. could i get step by step please?[/QUOTE]

nobody can teach you style dude, thats like asking me "teach me to sing like louie armstrong!" If you follow the guide you can figure out how to scream, but style is something you just have to figure out on yourself... if you figure out how to scream effectively you should be able to emulate styles simular to the guy in the used.

ive been working on screaming lately
i like your method...but ive heard that singing from your throut is harmful and that you should sing from your gut
but i find your method better and less painful
right now i can manage around a fear before the march of flames scream
which is pretty mid tone, now very low, not really high
when i get it right there is little pain

ya people you shouldnt feel a scratching in your thought when you scream, it should just come out clean'

btw thanks a ton for the tips, you helped me so much!

true i understand your point silver, it wouldnt be me if i was trying to copy someone else. i should have my own style..but i still dunno how to scream even from the instructions...i can get like a scream in a whisper but when i push more air out it gets all weird sounding. i can also get growls very well and none of this hurts, but other peoples screams seem louder than a whisper so what am i doing wrong?

Just Curious
 

I was just wondering when Corey Taylor screams is it raspy? Like does anyone hear it as raspy? Cos' I do and my friend(guitarist in my band)says its not....and he wants me to not sound to raspy and its killing me trying to do that. He is the only person who has ever had a problem with it...I mean I can scream like Corey(everyone else but the guitarist seems to think so,oh yea and like Chad Gray :D )and I can go back into a smooth melody like Corey,isn't that enough! :confused:

[QUOTE=StepsAscending_]ive been working on screaming lately
i like your method...but ive heard that singing from your throut is harmful and that you should sing from your gut
but i find your method better and less painful
right now i can manage around a fear before the march of flames scream
which is pretty mid tone, now very low, not really high
when i get it right there is little pain

ya people you shouldnt feel a scratching in your thought when you scream, it should just come out clean'

btw thanks a ton for the tips, you helped me so much![/QUOTE]


Very true... it is harmful to SING from your throat... however you are not singing here you are screaming = its apples and oranges. Screaming from your gut is INSANE you will destroy your vocal chords and probably throw up or cough up blood after every show. :lol: practise makes perfect with time you should be able to do any kinda scream you want.

[QUOTE=chris4aker]true i understand your point silver, it wouldnt be me if i was trying to copy someone else. i should have my own style..but i still dunno how to scream even from the instructions...i can get like a scream in a whisper but when i push more air out it gets all weird sounding. i can also get growls very well and none of this hurts, but other peoples screams seem louder than a whisper so what am i doing wrong?[/QUOTE]

Are you using a microphone? If not start using one, then you will be able to gauage how loud and how much you have to push your voice.

Secondly, screaming takes time, confidence and practise. Don't kill yourself, practise in moderation and eventually you will get better and louder. BE CONFIDENT.

However If you still can't "get it" I advise you to look around and get some voice lessons. My advice is to find a male instructor who actualy listens to the same kind of music you listen to... and make sure he can actualy scream. Ask him "can you teach me to scream?" AND "can you yourself scream?" if the dude won't scream for you then fuk it; he doesn't know what he is talking about. Sign up for about 5 lessons, pay attention, bring a tape recorder, right things down... just so you can get the basic technique and practise on your own. Unless your a rich bastard singing lessons are unaffordable.

Good luck :thumb:

[QUOTE=Bleached515]I was just wondering when Corey Taylor screams is it raspy? Like does anyone hear it as raspy? Cos' I do and my friend(guitarist in my band)says its not....and he wants me to not sound to raspy and its killing me trying to do that. He is the only person who has ever had a problem with it...I mean I can scream like Corey(everyone else but the guitarist seems to think so,oh yea and like Chad Gray :D )and I can go back into a smooth melody like Corey,isn't that enough! :confused:[/QUOTE]

It's difficult for me to say whether or not corey taylors voice is naturaly raspy and strained or if he does it stylistically. Since he is a proffesional and has been able to manage it for a few years I would guess he does it stylistically and uses technique. If you want to get less strain in your voice, go take some lessons or practise through the technique I posted. Once you get the technique down cold, you can determine yourself how much "rasp" you want to put into your voice and stream.

ps. you should choose your own singing style, IF you like the raspier voice better tell your guitar player to fack off... its not like you are telling him how to play guitar. However if you would yourself rather get a less raspy voice then go for it man, its possible with practise.

PS. Did anyone happen to save my original thread "singing some pointers"... if so could you post it in another thread. I tried searching for it but it got deleted when they upgraded the new site... it could be usefull for this guy :thumb:

thank you silver, i practice atleast once aday while im in the shower and im sure i will get it sometime or other but if not, voice lessons might be cool. until then im going to be working on regular singing and guitar...it sucks being the best singer and guitarist outta your band cuz the other guy on guitar isnt good enough to play the good intricate riffs and nobody can sing ALL that well, its hard singing and playing. but anyways thank you, i will study the instructions from the thread carefully

i have never gotten to scream from my gut, i can scream from my throat and it doesnt hurt, its just soft and sounds like a cow is dieing or something. its terrible

*edit* i have tried using a microphone and it does make it louder but it doesnt sound like there is much emotion behind it because its so soft but turned up..its hard to explain but its like the sound of a whisper

ok, my voice is deep and when i try to scream it is low and as i try to get it higher it just cracks to something really high.. is there a way i can get something in between there, because when i sing its the same way..

oh yea and i was wondering if theres a certain way to be able to distort your scream or voice or whatever, without making it too loud.. like i have to scream really loud before it even gets slightly distorted, it just sounds like im talking loudly, haha eh i think i should read some more tips...

Hey I thought I'd just throw in something I've noticed while listening to some bands...

I think that the beginning letter to what [i]word[/i] youre screaming is important, as some sounds are "easier" to scream than others.

In the song "Maybe Memories" by The Used, when Bert is screaming the word "Back" he actually sounds like he's screaming "Rack". It's acceptable to do this I think because from the rest of the song we can tell that Back is actually the word as it fits with the song. So unless there's confusion as to what you're screaming has to do with the song, I think that it's okay to substitue letters to make it easier.

i myself am a beginner when it comes to rock vocals as my only experience was in choir where I was a tenor...but the sounds I can tell are relatively easy to scream are :
Rah
Wah
Yah
Ah

Generally, letters that don't require pressing your lips together. Does any of this help at all, or am I a total idiot? :D

[QUOTE]that what happened ti cannibal corpse. its such raw screaming they've gone through 2 or 3 vocalists......... something like that.[/QUOTE] Theyve had two vocalists, and their old one was kicked out, and has been in another death metal band for the past 8 or so years (six feet under), and hes still doing good i suppose.

Thee, i was wondering if you can help me out with some death metal-ish vocals. Sort of like Steve Tucker of Morbid Angelm and mids and highs like the guy from In Flames or Dani Filth. Thanks

i just have 1 question... i recorded my scream today and it just sounds like raspy whispering. is there a way to give my scream more "body"?

[QUOTE=skatehippie]Hey I thought I'd just throw in something I've noticed while listening to some bands...

I think that the beginning letter to what [i]word[/i] youre screaming is important, as some sounds are "easier" to scream than others.

In the song "Maybe Memories" by The Used, when Bert is screaming the word "Back" he actually sounds like he's screaming "Rack". It's acceptable to do this I think because from the rest of the song we can tell that Back is actually the word as it fits with the song. So unless there's confusion as to what you're screaming has to do with the song, I think that it's okay to substitue letters to make it easier.

i myself am a beginner when it comes to rock vocals as my only experience was in choir where I was a tenor...but the sounds I can tell are relatively easy to scream are :
Rah
Wah
Yah
Ah

Generally, letters that don't require pressing your lips together. Does any of this help at all, or am I a total idiot? :D[/QUOTE]

Hey yes, good point man... you are totally right dude some certain words or letters are easier to sing than others I should have remembered that :thumb:

Wah is probably the hardest of those 4, Kah is easy so is Nah.

Yeah...if your not too careful you could end up paralyzing your vocal chords or something...