REAL, ORIGINAL HARDCORE: Bands that had the punk sound and attitude, but with faster and slightly heavier guitars. The songs were usually very short and more brutal than punk. Vocals were usually shouted, fast guitars, usually 3 chords, and very quick basslines. The drumming is very frenetic and wild, and the movement began in Washington D.C. in the early 80s. Key Bands: Black Flag, Cro Mags, Minor Threat, Discharge, Crass etc.

"NU-HARDCORE": Get BuddyBigsby to write you a defintion, hes the new hardcore guru.

EDIT: The new hardcore music is the opposite of what the original hardcore set out to do..it was to bring music back to the basic 1 minute songs (punk anyone?). Newer hardcore encompasses 4 minute songs (usually) with heavy growls and heavier guitars. NH is known for it's use of "breakdowns", which usually involve swirling guitars, and softer vocals, as a replacement for solos, in some instances. NH is very popular with teenagers (mostly male) now a days.

That clears up alot.

Are you being sarcastic..or..?

[QUOTE=morten][url]http://www.metal-reference.com/preface.html[/url][/QUOTE]

Good reference. I think that if anyone still has questions, this site explains it very well. Dargon, I think they mentioned Dark Angel in Thrash, so don't worry.

^ He may have added it. It wasn't there before.

I just don't want the greatest thrash band of all time to be left out.+

Tangy:


These are some bands which I consider alternative metal. Correct me if you disagree
Tomahawk, Deftones, A Perfect Circle, Tool, Fantomas, Helmet, Faith No More, Mr Bungle, (early) Incubus, Oceansize(sometimes), System of A Down.

Faith No more and Incubus ( yes the early) are funk metal definately

Deftones and SOAD fit more into nu-metal if you ask me. Please don't sap nu-metal of the few good artists it has by classifying them as something else.

[QUOTE=epifreak2002]Deftones and SOAD fit more into nu-metal if you ask me. Please don't sap nu-metal of the few good artists it has by classifying them as something else.[/QUOTE]
This is a problem I have with the way people view nu-metal. They see it as an insult to be labelled nu-metal, and any bands they like that fit the nu-metal criteria they automatically label as something else. There are good nu-metal bands, just like there are bad ones, accept it and move on.

I wouldnt put Slipknot and Mudvayne in the Nu-Metal catagory. Even tho they are newer bands, they both have Talent, unlike System of a Down, Linkin Park and P.O.D. I like to think of them as different, not crap.

^^^ I disagree :thumb:

Deftones, whilst retaining the "typical" song structure, can be more brutal, and also more articulate than standard nu-metal. This has won Maynard over for them, who's a big fan. Deftones also draw from more obscure influences: ie the Smiths, Depeche Mode etc.

I would put Slipknot and Mudvayne as nu-metal, even though Mudvayne is more technical than say, Linkin Park, their fan base is pretty much the same. This is unfortunately why Deftones are lumped as nu-metal, but Deftones are still a step above the rest :thumb:

I call Deftones [I]alternative-metal[/I], I hate to see them in the same category as Linkin Park, Trapt, Nickelback etc...

Yeah I do too, but I'm explaining why most people call them nu-metal :( Because unfortunately their fan base is similar. Deftones are more complex, artistic, lyrically binded, and more talented than Linkin Park etc. :thumb: I know you've always been a big Deftones fan!

The Black Metal one was perfect.

[QUOTE=deftoned]Yeah I do too, but I'm explaining why most people call them nu-metal :( Because unfortunately their fan base is similar. Deftones are more complex, artistic, lyrically binded, and more talented than Linkin Park etc. :thumb: I know you've always been a big Deftones fan![/QUOTE]


That's why I said [B]don't[/B] take away the few good nu-metal bands out there because that's what Deftones are, nu-metal. Like it or not, nu-metal is a valid genre, and refusing to label a band as nu-metal simply because they are technically proficient, creative, or intelligent lyrically defies the very genre system to its roots. There have always been genre benders, bands who fit best into a particular genre but stray outside of it, and that's essentially what Deftones are for nu-metal. Also, listen to Slipknot, Deftones, and then Incubus and tell me that the Deftones fit better with Incubus than Slipknot.

^^^ Some good points.

The Deftones do fit bitter with Incubus than Slipknot..(I'm being serious here). Deftones and Incubus are move innovative than bands such as Slipknot, and while they're not the same, they're closer than Deftones and Slipknot. I know Deftones fit into nu-metal, but also break out of the traditional mould, so it's what you call it.

really good list. thanx a lot Legions!!
where would a band like orphaned land fit in the genres?

wow I'm learning a lot here... can anyone classify what genre Finger Eleven fits into? I know their latest album leans towards nu-metal, but their older stuff is quite different...

[QUOTE=deftoned]I consider them to be power, and I was saying that they don't sound like neo classical, ie early Ozzy.[/QUOTE]Ozzy is neoclassical? I beg to differ. His music sounds nothing like Yngwie Malmsteen.

What about Childeren of Bodom, Unearth, Soil Work, Lullacry!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[QUOTE=JustCoolMusic]What about Childeren of Bodom, Unearth, Soil Work, Lullacry!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!![/QUOTE]

CoB = Power metal with melodic death vocals

Unearth = Metalcore

Soilwork = Formerly melodic death, now hard rock/metal

Lullacry = If I recall correctly, power metal, but it's been a long time since I last listened to them.

[QUOTE=JustCoolMusic]What about Childeren of Bodom, Unearth, Soil Work, Lullacry!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!![/QUOTE]

Leave some exclamation marks for the rest of us, junior

:rolleyes:

[QUOTE=deftoned]REAL, ORIGINAL HARDCORE: Bands that had the punk sound and attitude, but with faster and slightly heavier guitars. The songs were usually very short and more brutal than punk. Vocals were usually shouted, fast guitars, usually 3 chords, and very quick basslines. The drumming is very frenetic and wild, and the movement began in Washington D.C. in the early 80s. Key Bands: Black Flag, Cro Mags, Minor Threat, Discharge, Crass etc.

"NU-HARDCORE": Get BuddyBigsby to write you a defintion, hes the new hardcore guru.

EDIT: The new hardcore music is the opposite of what the original hardcore set out to do..it was to bring music back to the basic 1 minute songs (punk anyone?). Newer hardcore encompasses 4 minute songs (usually) with heavy growls and heavier guitars. NH is known for it's use of "breakdowns", which usually involve swirling guitars, and softer vocals, as a replacement for solos, in some instances. NH is very popular with teenagers (mostly male) now a days.[/QUOTE]

Hahaha, thanks Deftoned. You did a nice job on the OG hardcore definition. Cro-Mags are the shizzy.

Modern hardcore = Similar to the earlier hardcore likes of Black Flag, Minor Threat and such, but since then the genre has matured to have longer song times (usually 2-4 minutes), more of a metal influence (but it's not metalcore, I'll touch on that in a bit), and sometimes screaming vocals. Also, modern hardcore has one key ingredient that can not be found in the original incarnation of hardcore: The Breakdown. Breakdown's are usually made up of open chord palm muting, and are intended for moshing. Download "The Great Red Shift" by Most Precious Blood and listen to the ending for a perfect example of this. There are however, many modern hardcore bands that still play hardcore the way it used to be, such as Good Clean Fun and Hit the Deck. Modern hardcore bands: Most Precious Blood, old Hatebreed (they can still be considered hardcore, but it must be noted they have a STRONG metal presence in their music with galloping riffs, Slayer-like leads, and double bass), Bane, Comeback Kid, Throwdown, Count Me Out, Bury Your Dead, 100 Demons, Give Up the Ghost/American Nightmare, Stretch Armstrong, Walls of Jericho (same thing as Hatebreed, though), The Hope Conspiracy, Terror, etc.

Metalcore = The most popular spin-off of hardcore, metalcore takes the sound of modern hardcore, and basically adds [I]more[/I] metal to the sound. However, the majority of metalcore has much more in common with death metal and melodic death metal than it does with traditional hardcore, and there is usually STRONG European-metal influence. It should also be noted that metal bands can are often mistakenly grouped into metalcore simply because of who their members are and who they tour with, or because they have the occasional breakdown (so did Pantera, so are they metalcore?). These metal bands are the likes of Lamb of God, Shadows Fall, Avenged Sevenfold (though their first CD had metalcore influence), and so on. Metalcore bands: As I Lay Dying, Bleeding Through, Blood Has Been Shed, Killswitch Engage, Zao, Dead to Fall, Atreyu, On Broken Wings, Remembering Never, Symphony In Peril, Norma Jean.

Noisecore = Pretty self-explanatory. Very chaotic metalcore that is all over the place and is often very technical. Noisecore bands: Dillinger Escape Plan, Converge (on their last album), Every Time I Die (moreso on [I]Last Night In Town[/I] than on [/I]Hot Dam[font=verdana]n![/font][/I]

Emocore (modern) = Takes the root sound of either hardcore or metalcore, and adds artsy, clean guitar parts, clean vocals, lyrics dealing with lost love and such, etc. etc. For example, Poison the Well is emocore with a root sound of hardcore, while From Autumn to Ashes is emocore with a root sound of metalcore. This genre is often confused with screamo, which I will get to later. Emocore bands: Underoath (new stuff), Poison the Well, From Autumn to Ashes, Alexisonfire, Across Five Aprils, A Static Lullaby, Hopesfall, Thrice (more or less).

Screamo = And so here we are, the genre that everybody confuses with emocore. Screamo is in fact the extreme opposite of Emocore, as it is extremely chaotic. So what sets it apart from noisecore? Screamo has an underlying sense of beauty and a certain artsiness that is simply not found in noisecore. Like Black metal with death metal, this is one of those genres where you have to listen to to understand the difference. Screamo bands: Pg. 99, Kaospilot, Circle Takes the Square, Neil Perry, Love Lost But Not Forgotten, Saetia.

I think that pretty much covers the "-core's". There's some smaller sub-genres like Straight Edge hardcore, NYHC, Tough guy, and melodic hardcore.

[QUOTE=TheMetalWorks]Ozzy is neoclassical? I beg to differ. His music sounds nothing like Yngwie Malmsteen.[/QUOTE]
The earliest incarnation of Ozzy..Randy Rhoads...His guitarwork is so dåmn neo-classical, it's not funny. Try and tell me theres not a large hint of classical influence upon the first two albums?

[QUOTE=BuddyBigsby]Hahaha, thanks Deftoned. You did a nice job on the OG hardcore definition. Cro-Mags are the shizzy.
[/QUOTE]
Cheers :thumb: Gotta love the old hardcore, can't really dig the newer stuff, although I'm kinda into Zao. At least I took a shot at defining newer hardcore! lol

another key progressive band would be Rush :thumb:

[QUOTE=The Digital Pimp]wow I'm learning a lot here... can anyone classify what genre Finger Eleven fits into? I know their latest album leans towards nu-metal, but their older stuff is quite different...[/QUOTE]

I'd still call their older stuff nu-metal. It tended more towards sullen than angsty or overtly angry, and they did some pseudo-non-commercial sounding stuff in a couple of songs, but they're still nu-metal. Granted, their older two were better (Greyest of Blue Skies enjoyed regular play time for over a year with me.) On a pseudo-related note, am I the only one who has noticed that Finger Eleven makes the absolute worst videos ever? (They also try to release their least commercial songs as singles.) Good Times has some interresting camerawork, but all of their videos (except for First Time) just show them playing the song. They never show any story or anything along those lines.

^ Well..All videos Adam Jones' are involved in are incredible, and make fück all sense to everyone. :thumb:

[QUOTE=Disarm1979]another key progressive band would be Rush :thumb:[/QUOTE]

Rush are progressive, but definetly *not* progressive metal...this thread is about [b]metal[/b] subgenres.