Hi, I was just wondering if there was any place I could get a beginners version, or something that may have examlpes along with it, as I am a new musician. any of your tips would be appreciated.

I also would like to compliment you guys on your superb knowledge. especially at such a young age.

[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by TonyChoyIsGod [/i]
[B]Hi, my name's Walker, I'm too tired to talk to Ian yet I will write up a Lesson so I can be hailed throughout the land. [/B][/QUOTE]


;)


That lesson took me half an hour to write, when during the day it would have only taken me 5 minutes. :p

Circle of 4ths / 5ths, Basic Major Scale Theory, Chord Symbols, & Dom7 Chord
 

Circle of 4ths, that is, the next scale begins a 4th above the previous scale:

C -> F -> Bb -> Eb -> Ab -> C#/Db -> F#/Gb -> B/Cb -> E -> A -> D -> G -> C

Circle of 5ths, same as above, only the scale is a 5th above the previous

C -> G -> D -> A -> E -> B/Cb -> F#/Gb -> C#/Db -> Ab -> Eb -> Bb -> F -> C

If you notice, one is just a reversal of the other, therefore, in a Blues in C, the I IV V is

C F G

Basic Major Scale Theory

A Major Scale is not composed of 8 notes as much as it is composed of 2 sets of four, known as tetrachords. For example,

C D E F G A B C, the standard C major scale, is composed of the

C D E F
G A B C

tetrachords. When you look at the steps in betwen the notes, something interesting appears:
W = Whole Step
H = Half Step

C-----D-----E-----F
---W-----W----H---

G-----A-----B-----C
---W-----W----H---

The two tetrachords are tied together by a whole step, so the end result looks like

C-----D-----E-----F-----G-----A-----B-----C
---W-----W----H----W-----W----W----H---

Why is this important? Because it sounds the most "normal" to human ears. But why?

Play a from C to B and hold the B - you should notice that it feels incomplete, that there is something missing. Now play the C, and it will sound right - the B resolves or "pulls" to the C (note that there is a halfstep between C and B)

Now play C and play down to F and hold the F - you should notice the same thing, only backwards. Play the E, and you'll feel the resolution.

So what does this mean? That in the 2nd tetrachord, the resolution is from the 3rd to the 4th, and in the first tetrachord, the resolution is the opposite, from the 4th to the 3rd, or, in more general terms:

When playing, remember your two options for resolution are always (in terms of major scales): 7th (or derivation thereof, ie 15th) to tonic (either octave) or 4th to 3rd (or a derivation thereof, ie 11th).

Chord Symbols, what they mean

(C is root)

(Chord Symbol - Name - Which Notes of the Scale to Play - Scale Mode it belongs to (which degree the scale you start on))

C - C Major Triad - 1, 3, 5 - Ionian (1st degree)

Cmaj7 - C Major 7 - 1, 3, 5, 7 - Ionian (1st degree)

C6 - C Major 6 - 1, 3, 5, 6 - Ionian (1st degree)

C7 - C Dominant 7 - 1 , 3, 5, b7 - Mixolydian (5th degree)

Caug7, C+7 - Augmented 7 - 1, 3, #5, b7 - Phrygian (3rd degree) with a major third and a major 2nd (?)

Cm, Cmin, C- - Minor Triad - 1, b3 , 5 - Aeolian (6th degree)

Cm7, Cmin7, C-7 - Minor 7 - 1, b3, 5, b7 - Dorian (2nd degree)

Cmin6, C-6 - Minor 6 - 1, b3, 5, 6th - Aeolian (6th degree)

Cm7b5, C-7b5 - Minor 7 flat 5 or Half-Diminished - 1, b3, b5, b7 - Locrian (7th degree)

Co7, Cdim7 - Diminished 7 - 1, b3, b5, bb7 (6) - Lydian (4th degree) with a minor third (?)

Csus7 - Suspended 7 - 1, 4 (#3), 5, b7 - Mixolydian (5th degree) with an augmented 3rd (?)

See Previous Posts by Spastic for an explanation of Scale Modes

Dominant 7th Chord

In music, there is the basic idea of tension and release. One note/chord will build tension, then the next note/chord will release it. One of the most basic examples is the progression of the Dominant 7th chord (V7 chord) to the tonic chord (I). Whether arpeggiated or played as a chord, the effect is the same (for best results, play on a piano or guitar, or a similar chorded instrument):

G7
G B D F

resolves to

C
C E G

Theory on why this works:
*This is my theory, so it might not be correct*

The G7 chord contains the 4th of the C chord, so, therefore, when the G7 resolves to the C, there is a resolution from the 4th to the third. Also note that a G chord, without an F, will not pull to the C, but when the F is added, the pull is very noticeable.


Thats all for tonight, folks

:thumb: :thumb:

ok NONE of this makes ANY sense to me

[QUOTE=sternj20]ok NONE of this makes ANY sense to me[/QUOTE]


[URL=http://www.musicianforums.com/forums/login.php?do=logout]This will help you.[/URL]

[QUOTE=Maveryck][URL=http://www.musicianforums.com/forums/login.php?do=logout]This will help you.[/URL][/QUOTE]

that just logged me out

i think that was the whole point

[QUOTE=Zoroaster]Spastic:


I'm sorry to have to burst your bubble, but your grasp of music theory is as primitive as a rock. You fail to even touch upon the surface of enharmonic intervals; an imperative in jazz, and how it can be interrelated with tritone substitution. I suggest that you comprehend musical theory in its entirety beforehand you elevate yourself to the status of "Theory Guru".

P.S:
I have listened to your 'compositions' and I can only designate them with the term: pretentious. Your music is solely comprised of incoherent and dampening injections whose singular purpose is to impress upon the audience a sense of superiority. That, sir, is the mark of failure.[/QUOTE]


A dated argument I know, but what spastic is doing is giving a structured series of theory lessons to someone who knows the basics but needs to elaborate on their knowledge of theory if they want to expand into jazz. These threads of his have been totally invaluable to me, as have the suggestions, and probably also to dozens of other people. And youre talking about trying to impress a 'sense of superiority.' If you see something you think aught to be here, like enharmonic intervals, post an article.

Speaking of which, im not sure if triads and inversions have been covered, they are kind of important. I can probably get a fairly simplistic article done and up if you fancy sharing the thread.

Ok... I don't know if this is the right forum for this... but ok. I need some notes translated from trumpet to alto sax. Then if you have time maybe explain how you do it as well. We'll figure out the octaves and other thing and change some stuff ourselves, but my friend and I are doing a little side project from our band since he plays sax. I need

G B D C F# A Bb and E

translated from trumpet to alto saxamaphone.

Thanks for further help.

any one no how to make up some sick *** slap bass lines? any tips would help

Question about Minor 6 chords:

If you were to play a Cmin6 chord, would you be playing Aeolian or Dorian? I was told by my bass teacher to play as if it were Dorian, but the lesson a few posts above says play it in Aeolian. So, do I play CEbGAb or CEbGA? Thanks.

Oh, and good work on all these lessons, they're really helping out a lot!

Never mind about my question I dont need it answered anymore.

Obsolute - Dorian. It has an A in it, not an Ab.

Yep:

[QUOTE]
Cmin6, C-6 - Minor 6 - 1, b3, 5, 6th - Aeolian (6th degree)
[/QUOTE]


That's wrong. For it to be Aeolian the 6th needs to be flat.


Haven't posted in a while :thumb: but I can't let my theory thread down. :p

Fag muffin

:-*

Ah, there's nothing like the Jazz Forum.

To make this worth while: I was quite close to going to see Sean Malone do a Stick performance this summer, but it's 549 miles away :upset: . Who knows though, I might still go :cool:

Spastic, that's what... your first post in jazz in two months?

You've let us down...

:upset:

Stupid and simple question...What exactly does "vamp" mean?

"Not Found In This Thread - "Vamp""

[QUOTE=Eggo]Stupid and simple question...What exactly does "vamp" mean?[/QUOTE]
A vamp is essentially a repeated phrase, chord, or very short chord progression that is used to introduce a song, or to solo over.

[QUOTE=HaVIC5]A vamp is essentially a repeated phrase, chord, or very short chord progression that is used to introduce a song, or to solo over.[/QUOTE]

Oh cool...thanks!

Like in Meeting of Spirits or Birds of Fire...mmm.

:naughty:

I was just wondering if anyone could give me some ideas to improve my jazz improvization. i've improved a lot since i first started, but i'd like some tips maybe on how to further improve my skills. thanks.

1) Learn your modes.
2) Pratice your modes.
3) Learn chord shapes, construction, etc.
4) Solo using chord tones.
5) Eventually learn other tricks, like flat picking techniques, etc.
6) Pratice, pratice, pratice.

Theres so many different articles on modes why don't you point out a good one?
Before I got to them with my guitar teacher (he did chord construction and a few other things first) I had to stop taking lessons cause the money and I've read a few different articles which contradicted each other and am not sure exactly what to do with modes.

Pratice them. Learn the relations they all hold to each other. (i.e., if you're playing in C dorian, you can move one step up to D phrygian.) Eventually, learn the relationships between all the scales on the neck. You'll be able to solo anywhere.

(That's it in a very basic nutshell)

How am I supposed to learn that....no teacher and I've seen articles that contradict each other so I don't know whats right. Do you know a good site/lesson?

(Isn't there more to it than just memorizing it?)

[QUOTE=Prowler01]How am I supposed to learn that....no teacher and I've seen articles that contradict each other so I don't know whats right. Do you know a good site/lesson?

(Isn't there more to it than just memorizing it?)[/QUOTE]

There are multiple places to play any note on the guitar...Expand on that and you will realize you can easily connect all the modes of a scale throughout the fretboard. You are not limited to playing in the key of 1 sharp (G Major) to the 3rd position (G Major). Take it to the 7th position, while maintaining the key of 1 sharp, and you have your B phyrgian. Then go to the 5th position and you're at A mixolydian.

It's so much easier to show than explain...I hope that (kind of) helped.

EDIT AGAIN:

I understand the point of modes now...and I already know the notes all over the fretboard, I don't really use shapes to remember stuff (eggo)

[url]http://www.ibreathemusic.com/article/106/2[/url] explains it real good, I just saw the link under favorites and realized I never read it before

Anyone know anything about substituting more complex chords in for simpler ones and how to know what extensions will sound good? I know how to figure out what will be in key but is there anything else that I can learn about that without just expirimenting?

[QUOTE=Prowler01]EDIT AGAIN:

I understand the point of modes now...and I already know the notes all over the fretboard, I don't really use shapes to remember stuff (eggo)

[url]http://www.ibreathemusic.com/article/106/2[/url] explains it real good, I just saw the link under favorites and realized I never read it before[/QUOTE]

on the site what do the M's and P's mean

[QUOTE=Prowler01]EDIT AGAIN:

I understand the point of modes now...and I already know the notes all over the fretboard, I don't really use shapes to remember stuff (eggo)

[url]http://www.ibreathemusic.com/article/106/2[/url] explains it real good, I just saw the link under favorites and realized I never read it before[/QUOTE]

on the site what do the M's and P's mean

They're about intervals.

P = Perfect
M = Major

In the Ionian Mode (Major Scale), the 1st, 4th and 5th are Perfect intervals; the 2nd, 3rd, 6th and 7th are Major intervals. So it's like this:

Perfect 1
Major 2
Major 3
Perfect 4
Perfect 5
Major 6
Major 7

Which is why the site shows:

P1, M2, M3, P4, P5, M6, M7

From there, you can flatten and sharpen different intervals to produce different scales. These new intervals are called Minor, Diminished and Augmented intervals. The site shows these as b, bb, and #, although they're sometimes written as m, o and +.

That part is quite confusing, but once you know what the M's and P's are about, you should be able to figure it out from the site.

hmm
 

[QUOTE=spastic]Wow, man. I put "Theory Guru" as a joke, only because I know more theory than a lot of people here, and try to help anyone that asks me. I don't believe I know everything about theory. But I also didn't post everything I know in this thread.

And I'm glad you enjoyed my songs :rolleyes:[/QUOTE]

- can i first say i have only just started learning jazz theory, i have learnt the scales ect, but not touched on the really difficult stuff. i can play joe satrinai stuff - surfing with the alien ect, so i think i am an ok guitairst for 16, because a lot of my friends think they have learnt songs when they have half learnt them :rolleyes: , i learn them fully, as i did with the satriani stuff. i love playing guitar and although i have covered some of the things in your article i havent covered them all. I think it was helpful and as long as it helps some one i think you have achieved your goal. however this twat who wrote too you is too obnoxious, and if he is such a great guiatist, or musican, would not bother with such petty coments. not every 1 likes the same type of music so dont take it personal about your songs. i'm not a great jazz fan, i like a trange of music from coldplay to metallica, to machine head, to ocationaly some jazz and songs like my sharona by the knack is classic rock. i learn jazz to broaden my playiny. And i think someone who has such petty remarks is just a twat really :D

i think your aticle was good and that guy should get his head out of his arse and smell the roses, sorry if not every 1 is as good as you, but am sure there is someone out there, and i hopfully will be a lot better than you when i get older so there :p

to original article writer - nice article :D

have fun playing guitar, and although i havnt listened too your songs yet i will, i will send you the cover of joe satriani i made (to a bakcing track from guitar port - with some soloing for like the last minute of the songs :D if you e-mail me. nice article and keep writing, cos this guy is a snob :wave:

Ive hear ray brown (an amazing bassist) say that its sometimes bad to get stuck in patterns on a fretboard because somtimes you can find all of you lines repetitive and sound like your other songs. He said it is better to work on paper before you play, and then work it out. And to not concentrate on the patterns but the notes. What do you guys think of this?

and also is there anyone who would mind talking to me privitaly and giving me theroy lessons (i read sheet music, but i know little about chords and modes) if so my email is [email]Dylanhouse420@hotmail.com[/email] or aim at Rastahstojah

message

I agree with trying to avoid playing patterns, but I don't like writing music without my instrument in hand (unless it is a composition or something similar).

I know one guitarist (and it is killing me that I don't remember his name...Ah dammit, he even taught a class at Berklee) that would randomly retune his guitar so the patterns he was used to didn't work anymore, and he only played the notes that sounded good to his ears, not his fingers, so to speak.

Is it absolutely necessary to learn modes if you want to be good at improvisation? I have knowledge of them, and know the formulas, names, and patterns for each of the modes, but never really practice them or use them. When playing over chords, I think more of just what sounds good, and altering the major scale to fit the chord tones. Should I keep going on with that, or should I start practicing the modes?

wow, cool thread. I'm going to school for this stuff right now so its interesting to see everyone so interested in the stuff that gives me so much headache. This stuff is definitly worth it.

wow laying it all out
 

hey dude after the scales you might want to add chord progressions
like for instance an easy 4 chord circle progression is vi-ii-V-I
maybe even add some fun stuff like soloing techniques

depends
 

consequently jazz is an interpretation and you can really play anything. however to become a successfull jazz soloist LEARN EVERYTHING! modes scales flowing chords and notes and above all stay in school.

could someone (maybe that pretentious guy near the start of the thread since he knows so much and is so helpful) explain tritone substitution and how it is used?
that would be great, thanks