DD,
I like the change in your song now that you submitted it to this.
That line is alot better than the one you had before and compliments the mood so well

[QUOTE=DFelon204409]Scarred, check out who voted this forum. The veteran of the challenges was Disco Dragon. DISCO DRAGON. Everybody was focusing on flow and how well the lyrics would work as a song and not if they're great lyrics or not. I sense because people like pixies and SDagger listen to music that is more alternative, they've experienced how songs that don't appear to flow, really can but in a more complex way, like with CTTS. This last challenge was just very n00bish so the voting reflected it. I don't think he deserved to win a challenge with that song. It just wasn't up to the caliber of other ones that have beaten other amazing lyrics in more massive and brutal challenges.

Ya corupt, truce. I've been here since 2001. Never been banned. I understand the line between just being a dick, which I am, and being immoral or bad.[/QUOTE]
Man, your musical elitism is so overbearing it's sickening. I listen to alot of the music you listen to, and a lot that you don't, and of course you listen to a lot that I don't. Your taste is not superior to anyone else's. CTTS do not write the best lyrics of all time. It's all subjective, so understand people have different opinions and move on.

I have included flow in my ratings sice I got here and will always do so because it's an important part of the music for me. Scarred and I were the ones who voted Corrupt the lowest, so don't act like you're out alone in a field. The voting was pretty even among many pieces, but about half the people loved Corrupt's piece so it won. No vets voted...cry a river, it happened and it's not going to change. I don't think any of the entries were stellar really, and I have seen better, but I'm not bitching about it because it happens. I didn't like Corrupt's piece and I voted accordingly, some people disagreed and he won. Good on him, his writing appeals to other people and I can appreciate that. You should work on that whole appreciating other people's opinions.

[QUOTE=zeppelinfan2k3]
No vets voted...cry a river, it happened and it's not going to change.[/QUOTE]

Heh Hehm. One vet DID vote in this challenge. How can no one see that????

[QUOTE=Disco Dragon]Heh Hehm. One vet DID vote in this challenge. How can no one see that????[/QUOTE]
I was addressing his complaint, not the fact of the matter.

whats so good about being a "vet" anyway? Most of the time all I hear is them whinging about how good the forums used to be and now they suck. Its like hearing an old man whinging about the "back in my day" bull****.

i will f[b]u[/b]ck you all with my lyrical genius.. so you all can shut up now.

why is everyone in the lyrical photo album so hairy?

[QUOTE=k.s.e.]why is everyone in the lyrical photo album so hairy?[/QUOTE]
It's the "artist look"

You're just jealous cos marines cant grow their hair and have ..uh..Drill..uh sergeants to cope with.

:)

[QUOTE=addicted_tochaos]You're just jealous cos marines cant grow their hair and have ..uh..Drill..uh [b]sergeants[/b] to cope with.

:)[/QUOTE]
bah that an insult because that's the Army
Marines are trained by Drill Instructors!

Wait, wasn't I the vet on that one?

[QUOTE=A_Perfect_Sonnet]Wait, wasn't I the vet on that one?[/QUOTE]
Or maybe Scarred4Life?

Okay whatever.

[QUOTE=RunAmokRampant]whats so good about being a "vet" anyway? Most of the time all I hear is them whinging about how good the forums used to be and now they suck. Its like hearing an old man whinging about the "back in my day" bull****.[/QUOTE]


So true .... Like the time I caught the ferry over to Shelbyville. I needed a new heel for my shoe. So, I decided to go to Morganville, which is what they called Shelbyville in those days. So I tied an onion to my belt, which was the style at the time. Now, to take the ferry cost a nickel, and in those days nickels had pictures of bumblebees on them. 'Give me five bees for a quarter', you'd say. Now, where were we? Oh, yeah...the important thing was that I had an onion on my belt, which was the style at the time. They didn't have white onions because of the war; the only thing you could get was those big yellow ones

Who gives a f.uck about vets, ok they might be more respected but their opinion shouldn't be more important. i've been performing music ranging from classical to death metal for a longer time than most of you, i have worked with large bands such as Within Temptation, Sikth and Skindred and i am Hampshire musician of the year for 3 years running and i am concidered to be one of Hampshires TOP bassists. I've got a grade 8 certificate in bass, cello, piano, grade 6 for guitar and percussion i have a grade 5 music theory certificate, a GCSE in Music, Music technology and performing arts. My first big performance was when i was eight and have 20 sold out gigs on my name since i was 16, SO F.UCKING WHAT THAT DOESN'T MAKE ME MORE IMPORTANT THAN ANYONE ELSE.
I think corupt's entry was very good, it had a lot of meaning to it, he deserved winning the challenge. Bloody conservatives piss me off, THINGS ARE NOT LIKE THE OLD DAYS so live with it.

I'm as liberal as you get and I didn't like Corrupt's piece. I think the best days were when we lived in caves, those were the days.

Anyways, that list of achievements has nothing to do with knowledge of lyrics, so it really is irrelevant in this case. DFelon is respected because he is very knowledgeable. Vets usually are more knowledgeable because if you hang out here long enough you'd have to be a moron not to learn. People like Blockhead prove it is possible though. You can have all the experience you do and still learn tons from vets because they earn that status due to their knowledge and from being around a long time. I respect most people who are referred to as vets because they usually earn that status. At the same time it can cause an elitism, but there are reasons they are vets, and it's not just join date.

i fully agree mate even vets learn a lot, and i've got a s'hitload to learn (i'm going to see Brian May soon for some lessons really excited), but lyrics is something you can't really critisize on except for when you actually know what the authors aim is.

What i was saying was that it doesn't matter how good someone is, their opinion is just as important as someone who is not as good.
in the argument above it seems to be that everyone is inferior to the 'vets' maybe in skill but theyr opinion couints just as much as like me or Mr. Hankie.
Its the idea of democracy

Yea, interesting point zepp...some ppl just look at the join date and say pfff n00b and automatically give no respect. I'm as vet as it gets in this forum but not under this name. But I tell you what, the attitude in the crits I got, using the same writing, sure changed when I post under 6945 instead of XXXXX.

[QUOTE=6945]Yea, interesting point zepp...some ppl just look at the join date and say pfff n00b and automatically give no respect. I'm as vet as it gets in this forum but not under this name. But I tell you what, the attitude in the crits I got, using the same writing, sure changed when I post under 6945 instead of XXXXX.[/QUOTE]
Hmm...well that's what it is to me at least, I do realize some people are not mature enough to employ that, but I believe I do, and I have no problem with a n00b winning.

Necroses: I can only agree with you to an extent. Many n00bs wouldn't know good writing if it slapped them in the face. Read half the comments in S&L proper if you disagree. Usually the Vets are more immune to this because the knowledge of what makes it good is there. Liking writing is subjective, but this contest is about good writing as well as what you like, and it's important to blend the two in your critique. I also have to disagree when you say you can't critique lyrics without knowing the author's aim. That to me is entirely false. There are lyrical attributes which you can judge without knowing the author's aim. I also won't lie, I respect the views of the vets more than of the n00bs here. It's a matter of experience really. They have seen more and I believe they have a better grasp of what makes good writing. You can disagree but I do value high rankings by vets more than I do by n00bs.

[QUOTE=DFelon204409]See, you're in a lyrical challenge section. I've won this thing many times, I'm currently taking poetry class from a revered American poet, and I'm published in a poetry anthology. This speaks to why my opinion is respected here. It's not just because I've been here since 2001.[/QUOTE]
If you're opinion counts more, then at least justify it
I'm not denying skill at all, i really enjoyed reading you work but i just got the impression that what the more recent members (like me) thought of something didn't count because the vets said something else.
but i think you'll find that at one point you might actually learn something of a 'noob' its in everyones riht to express theyr opinion and they should be getting lair because of that.
I'm here to learn and really wouldn't even think of giving you advice on the subject of poetry, but looking at the work of a noob or someone without the experience you got might actually slightly change the way you look at things.

i'm talking about simple things like i found out not that long ago that leaving the lead in a guitar with humbuckers drains the batteries. Its a bit of an off topic example but it should do.

[QUOTE=zeppelinfan2k3] also have to disagree when you say you can't critique lyrics without knowing the author's aim. That to me is entirely false[/QUOTE]
do the words 'modern art' tell u anything, it kind of involves bending the rules and create something new

*gets bowl of popcorn, sits infront of computer*

...Ah internet fights, I love watching these...














and your thinking, **** noob, aren't you!

[QUOTE=Necroses-bass]
do the words 'modern art' tell u anything, it kind of involves bending the rules and create something new[/QUOTE]
Most modern art is terrible and only called art because people act pretentious and give it meanings that aren't even there.

Wow, you guys are really taking this whole veterans vs. new people thing to an extreme. I was just joshin' with you when I talked about wanting to be recognized as a vet. I could honestly care less about a title.

And what's the deal with rambling on about all of your achievements? I guess I just don't get why being ranked well as a guitarist/percussionist or being published in a poetry anthology is all that important. Soooo........good for you guys?

But in all honesty, there are people I respect on this forum more than others. Is it because they're vets? Perhaps. Or it could be that they are great writers, and that's what really counts anyways. And generally speaking, the vets are usually more talented than the new people. It's just how it goes. People get better the longer they write. Some of the new people are fantastic writers and might be better than a lot of the vets, but that's a rare case.

So I guess what I'm trying to say is this: Don't f[I]u[/I]ck a virgin just to say you broke a hymen..........

I can actually see no point to the back and forth arguing going on. To be honest, who gives a sh it. And just out of curiosity, why the name vet? I can think of about 20 names/titles to give an expierenced song writer/poet that sound cooler than that.

[QUOTE=Necroses-bass]
but i think you'll find that at one point you might actually learn something of a 'noob' its in everyones riht to express theyr opinion and they should be getting [b]laid[/b] because of that. [/quote]

No, you cannot get laid on the interweb. :p
[quote]
I'm here to learn and really wouldn't even think of giving you advice on the subject of poetry, but looking at the work of a noob or someone without the experience you got might actually slightly change the way you look at things.
[/quote]

UBC believes that lyrics and libretto are poetry if there is no music associated with it. When you crit here, its, for the most part, critting poetry.
You're right though. Its better if you look at the pieces as separate from the writer. Most pieces will reflect the experience but still.
Personally, I'd value the opinions of someone who I think writes well than someone who's starting out but that isnt really a statement on whose opinion is more valid.
You wont be considered a noob after awhile and then you can talk about how good it was back in the day. Its all good.

the other thing that pisses me off is that a lot of people tend to forget that they had to start at some point

I agree with DD.

Super_D has not been here for a long time, but she is considered a vet because she is a good writer and also knows good writing.

Necroses-bass, being in Cradle of Filth PT. 2 does not make you an intelligent person. K?

[QUOTE=DFelon204409]See, you're in a lyrical challenge section. I've won this thing many times, I'm currently taking poetry class from a revered American poet, and I'm published in a poetry anthology. This speaks to why my opinion is respected here. It's not just because I've been here since 2001.[/QUOTE]
I've had 4 poems put on tracks in "Sound of Poetry" and 3 Editor's Choice Awards and have had nearly all my poems published in anthology's all from poetry.com
yet my writing sucks obviously shows how much you know
anyways I don't wanna start an argument agian I just wanted to throw in my references since you were bragging about yours :thumb:

[QUOTE=Disco Dragon]
But in all honesty, there are people I respect on this forum more than others. Is it because they're vets? Perhaps. Or it could be that they are great writers, and that's what really counts anyways. And generally speaking, the vets are usually more talented than the new people. It's just how it goes. People get better the longer they write. Some of the new people are fantastic writers and might be better than a lot of the vets, but that's a rare case.
[/QUOTE]
I totally agree with this

[QUOTE=DFelon204409]I'm currently taking poetry class from a revered American poet, .[/QUOTE]

Now you're talking. I'd be interested in hearing about what you've learned...without having to help with your tuition of course!