Fender check out the first page of this thread.

Merkaba
 

[U]Merkaba[/U]

I've recorded a new clip of my singing. Could you please check it out? (its under test)

[url]http://www.soundclick.com/artist/1/mikeyess_music.htm[/url]

I've just been reading through a lot of your posts, and with this clip i sang at a fairly low volume, 'robot faced', and in a relaxed and upright position in an attempt to create good air flow and keep a relaxed and open throat. My range isn't great at the moment so you'll notice some breakage at high notes. Could you give me some feedback on it? thanks!

>>Also, i've been trying a lot of variations in my screaming using the advice you've given, but its been to no avail. I listened to the rasp 101 instruction for example, trying a high note and adding rasp in an attempt to get a falsetto scream and it comes out... well... kinda f***ed up. Even with lower screams, when i sing and add rasp it just comes out as more of a super loud growl...

[QUOTE=lloydapalooza]


alright so i recorded some growls and it would be cool if you could give me some input on them , see if im doing them right etc


[URL=http://www.soundclick.com/bands/0/lloydapalooza_music.htm]link[/URL][/QUOTE]

in case you missed it

Hey MikeyEss,

I listened to your new scream, and I can definitely say you're doing what I thought was screaming at first. I'm 99% sure you're tightening your throat up and just pushing some air through it; do you feel tense when you do it, does it hurt, and is it quiet? If you said yes to any of those, then that's what you're doing. Before I found this thread, I never really knew how to scream and I remember I used to "scream" along with some CDs in my car... I could sound pretty close to them, but, it was always quiet and it hurt.

Same goes for your singing, before I knew ANYTHING about singing, I used to "sing" like you. All soft and crap. I don't want to offend you, but it's true. What you're doing is just "singing" with little to no breath support, so it ends up like a soft whisper. To get past that, you just need to put some volume behind it. Don't be scared to belt it out. If it helps, try just yelling to get in the mood. I can't really recommend yelling too much, because that can hurt your voice, but it taught me how to put some diaphragm behind my singing, and how use the back of your throat for rasp. Using the back of your throat should be somewhat natural too, don't think about it and try to tense up your throat. Like Merk said, it's like the aaannnk sound, the incorrect buzzer sound on game shows and stuff.

Just keep reading Merk's advice in the previous pages of this thread. Keep working on your falsetto, and warm up beforehand. Instead of just thinking to yourself "I'm going to scream!" just work on falsetto. I would recommend learning to sing with rasp first, but you may be able to figure out how to scream if you just keep pushing your falsetto harder and harder. Don't hit an exceptionally high note, but hit a generally "low" falsetto note, and try to just push it and let the air "scrape" your back throat. It might just take some experimenting to figure out.

[QUOTE=lloydapalooza]in case you missed it[/QUOTE]

They sounded pretty good. I was impressed that you did them soft, that's a key thing with guttoral screaming, at least I think so.
If it hurts at all, then I think you need to figure something else out. But if you're warming up beforehand and it's not hurting, congratulations.
The last one in "growl2" definitely sounded the best. Just make sure you're isolating and try to keep it soft and "airy." It's a little hard to explain. Or you could try using the gargling tecnique that Kristina showed me, but it's hard to form any words while doing that... yeah, growling is kind of a hit or miss thing, I can sort of do two different kinds of growls but I'm not sure if I've quite perfected it or not.

Merk, you need to post some more sh|t. :thumb: I went to your soundclick hoping you'd have some new stuff. Take a day off work and record a bunch of falsetto screaming, and some singing, and some chest voice singing, and some whistle notes (I really wanna hear this.. and learn it), and some guttoral stuff if you can... do it for MX, man! :p Haha.

I want to figure out inward screaming too man, how'd you do that, that one on your soundclick? aaahh, I don't even know where to start to figure something like that out.

I was actually just thinking of recording some more stuff as i read the posts...I'll have to sit down and go through what people are having trouble with and post some stuff related to it. Inner screaming..I dont know...I dont do it but i guess I can if i want. And you say you wanna hear the whistle stuff...I posted it a while back...or are you saying that you want more? The new shift I work really limits my time but I'll try to get around to it, and listening to any samples soon. Its 8 in the morning, and I just got home from work...gotta sleep. Then be back to work at six in the evening til six.

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Loyd, the growls sound pretty good. If its comfortable then keep practicing. Is that the lowest you can go? If not try to go lower and practice singing low notes and alos mid as well, as it helps strengthen the muslces that keep the cords held together. Are you gonna be trying to do wods that low or just a growling? If words...then try all vowels and see how well you can growl through them all....ay,ee, I , Oh, U, ah.
-------------------------------------------------
Ah....Mike...I heard that song twice on like Conan or Leno reruns. The chorus I loved...and I had to look up the lyrics and found that I liked that song more. Its not my usual genre or style but I'm finnicky.

I say youre trying too hard. Sounds like you have a good voice. I say youre trying too hard because you've altered the approach, and youre singing slow and airy. Post a sample of you trying to sing this song the way they sing it. Just relax when you do it. Youre in falsetto and I dont think you have to be...bust I can tell youre holding back. The best thing that happened to me was someone said..."you've got good tone but you could sing harder" . Fallout boy, whoever the singer is, just basically sings this chorus hard. I think if you did you could find out alot about yourself and rasp because its not a high song and if you push it a little you might surprise yourself. Now I know I always say be careful and all but you will eventually have to push. Now I would recommend you try that with this song instead of a higher scream because its not too high at least most of the chorus isnt. Try to push the chorus and sound like he does...you dont have to worry about the Higher parts of it...if you cant do it all just practice the "sugar were going down swinging" part. And just relax and do it like you were singing it at someone across the street, to somebody, yet kinda yelling it, frankly. There should be a slight position as if you were talking it. That keeps you in true voice, or keeps the resonance close to true voice even when you go to falsetto so that people cant really tell that its falsetto. I can sing almost all of my falsetto range and sound like its true voice, due to that. Its basically the power falsetto, supported falsetto, or mixed voice, etc,blah blah position. Kinda like singing both and the same time. It kinda makes it louder by default. When youre in the soft airy falsetto, it creates more tension because youre opening up the cords when they dont really need to be. So when you try to go louder youre more prone to recreate that tension. Sing it normally.

Relax...but push it...not maximum...but go ahead and sing it loud and hard, and shift the feel til you get a sound and way that feels good and comfortable. Its awkward because you dont really feel much of a strain when youre clamping your cords around big air...the muscles are small...what most of us feel is the strain of our throats as we tense them up. The cords, you dont really feel them as much and alot of the faces you see from singers is straining to open the throat and keep the larynx from slamming up...Its not coming so much from straining for the note itself, although over time as you start driving your voice many times youre doing both. After a while it will come natural but youre not gonna get there singing soft in falsetto. You're gonna be more prone to letting your cords not hold tension if you sing soft which will make it harder to get stronger. I know from experience.

p.s. if you can upload that song I would like to have it. :)

Merk
 

[QUOTE=Merkaba-1]

p.s. if you can upload that song I would like to have it. :)[/QUOTE]

Hey its the least i can do after your help. Its on my soundclick page :thumb:

Thanks a lot for the advice, i'll attempt what you suggested and post it later today if possible. Tty soon

Hey Merk, I was wondering if you could check out our song on My Space (sorry for posting in another thread) but I just need an opinion.

I didn't make lyrics for the song, I was just trying to test my scream, I find the second half is more efficent then the first half... you can check it out here at: [url]www.myspace.com/SeiryuRock[/url] (Its called "Evermore")

Also man, I just wanna thank you for making those sound clips, they helped me so much, yesturday, I couldn't scream, I used your clips.. practice for about 4 hours last night (untill like 1 am) and I have made a big step, I still need to practice beyond belief (same with vocals) but you have been a BIG help to me, and I just want to say thanks.

mikey, i listened to your soundclicks. you sound like you have the same problems as my friend who sings for my band. you still sound like your holding back and your just staying in your falsetto. i dont really know what to say because i dont know much about singing. but it sound like your afriad of someone hearing you at your house. i dont think you supposed to use your falsetto through the enite song. you have to use your true voice.

whenever i scream(lower falsetto) i can barely manage a 3 sec scream or so. it sounds fairly good when i record and play it back. how do i do longer screams? am i doing something wrong? and how does puting a book and breathing help? also, my friend(good singer, got awards from choir) said to "hiss" like go tsssssssssss for as long as i can. how would that help?

[QUOTE=brainproof]whenever i scream(lower falsetto) i can barely manage a 3 sec scream or so. it sounds fairly good when i record and play it back. how do i do longer screams? am i doing something wrong? and how does puting a book and breathing help? also, my friend(good singer, got awards from choir) said to "hiss" like go tsssssssssss for as long as i can. how would that help?[/QUOTE]
I gave this same advice yesterday in another post. Holding a zzz or ssss sound. I say try to hold it for thirty seconds or more. Because it teaches you breath control. You cant sing without the diaphragm. You have to tense it instead of just relaxing like youre exhaling from a normal breath. You have to push a bit but not that much. ...depending on the sound you want. But by holding a sound that long it will teach you to not just let all your air out. You will have to get your diaphragm involved. So practice it.
Putting a book on your stomach(I guess thats what you were gonna say) and breathing helps you inhale correctly. The book should rise as you inhale. Its no big deal..you could use your hand. Some people breathe incorrectly and suck in their stomach some. But you stomach should rise first...then at about 75% your chest should start to rise a bit. Not as much as your stomach...but a little.

Hey Merkaba, can you check out my new version of fallout boy? Thanks!

hey merkaba i can do this thing where i make clicks with my vocal cords but at the same time hiss air. its pretty wierd. i was just wondering if there was any relevance to it. i uploaded an mp3 [URL=http://www.soundclick.com/artist/0/lloydapalooza_music.htm]here[/URL]

its titled wierd

[QUOTE=lloydapalooza]hey merkaba i can do this thing where i make clicks with my vocal cords but at the same time hiss air. its pretty wierd. i was just wondering if there was any relevance to it. i uploaded an mp3 [URL=http://www.soundclick.com/artist/0/lloydapalooza_music.htm]here[/URL]

its titled wierd[/QUOTE]
Yea I've been doing this since I was a kid. Youre using the false cords for the click. And thats pretty much the area you use for rasp. If you listen to my samples you can hear me kinda do this louder as I was starting off some of those rasp screams.

If you have trouble rasping try doing it, and slowly adding more sound and "click" and seperating them in and out from clean to not raspy will help learn some isolation.

[QUOTE=Bass_Guy_Jay]Hey Merk, I was wondering if you could check out our song on My Space (sorry for posting in another thread) but I just need an opinion.

I didn't make lyrics for the song, I was just trying to test my scream, I find the second half is more efficent then the first half... you can check it out here at: [url]www.myspace.com/SeiryuRock[/url] (Its called "Evermore")

Also man, I just wanna thank you for making those sound clips, they helped me so much, yesturday, I couldn't scream, I used your clips.. practice for about 4 hours last night (untill like 1 am) and I have made a big step, I still need to practice beyond belief (same with vocals) but you have been a BIG help to me, and I just want to say thanks.[/QUOTE]
Ahhh..thought I had listened to that one before and thought it was instrumental since the vocals kinda took a while to start. I like it though. Sounds like Linkin park mixed with some deftones. Some of my influences in those....I like it. I was looking for a link to download it. I was coming up with some melodies and things myself...I'd love to do little mix in there with you just for "play play" hehe.

I think you could sound almost twice as better...not that it sounds that bad. You did go a little flat sometimes...but I still do that when just fartin off. How does your voice feel after the screams? Because it sounds really pushy...but if you cant handle it then fine. But too much push robs you of your tone. I think you would sound better with more tone. At least in certain parts. If i were you I would take an instrumental if you have one....give one to me...hehe...and then ride around and sing those parts that you were doing, or whatever parts you come up with.....sing them like you were gonna sing them in opera. Back off of the push. Even the screaming note...sing it, I think its "no", or sounded like it. But for instance just sing it normally without so much push, and dont rasp any part of it. It will help you i think, to close up some of those notes and get the muscle memory to stay right on key. I do like the falling melody of you singing "Ehhh verrr morrre". Keep that. I can really hear that with a little reverb or something melting off...sounding like a dream or something. REally sounds like something I would do so I love that part. hehe. Maybe draw it out a little more. Just a little....and like I say, just a little more controlled...which I think would come from less push...for now at least. Thats my two cents. But then again you were just testing the song a bit...so whatever, no big deal. Keep me posted on this one.

OH yea...the second half ...maybe around the 2:40 mark the screams sound better. I'm on dialup. So my deal stops and buffers every ten seconds or so. sux.

[QUOTE=MikeyEss]Hey Merkaba, can you check out my new version of fallout boy? Thanks![/QUOTE]
Mike, still sounds like youre scared. Or not wanting to be loud for fear of something. If thats the case then wait til you have the house or whatever to yourself. If thats not the case then....

Do you have to be in falsetto to sing this high? I dont think you do. I would like you to sing it about three notes lower. Do this... right now...without thinking of any specific note or pitch or anything..just sing and EEEEEE. Now sing this song in that same pitch even if its not the same key. It will give you practice anyways. It might sound like something from a lounge bar or a restaraunt but thats not important. So give it a try. And I dont think your pressurizing your lungs much with the diaphragm either. Dont fret...its just around the corner.

Maybe I'll post a sample if I can get around to it.

thanks for the explaination, but your forgot one question, is it normal to for beginning screamers to have realyl short screams or am i doing something wrong?

Well yea...Youre not using enough breath control...i.e. diaphragm. I dont think its a matter of normalcy. But if you want to hold any sound long you have to take in a deep proper breath...and then be able to control how much your diaphgragm pushes up against your lungs. Thats why holding the ZZZ kinda gets you working with that. Because it will be hard to hold any sound without a good breath, and the diaphragm. Now you will have to manipulate it over time but thats second nature once you know how it feels. I might post another sample kinda dealing with this soon.

Hey Merk, thanks buddy for the help, I am glad that you (from what I gathered) like the instrumental for the song "Evermore" This is my favourite song so far.

When you say it sounds like I am pushing to hard, I think your right, cause when I try to do the more aggressive screams, I do push harder (Probably around 50% push) which, from what I have gathered is not good, I could easily get the same effect with less push right?

What does my throat feel like after doing these, well we played the song a lot that one practice, and my throat felt fine, didn't hurt, but I did notice it was harder for me to sing higher, so the screams maybe effecting my vocal chords, probably from pushing to hard. Also, when we start practice, at the beginning I have some tea, then always have 2 waters on hand (i drink so much water... lol)

When your talking about tone of the scream, could you give an example (on the song Evermore... if you can) what’s good tone, and what’s bad tone. Or maybe all my tone was bad, so how would I control this? How do I know if the tone is correct?

The only instrumental version of Evermore me have (that is the whole song) our Rhythm guitarist was to loud, and he has trouble with timing, so its quite messy. If you want it, you can find it here: [B][URL=http://www.franticgames.com/seriyu/Music/Evermore_instrumental.mp3]"Evermore" Instrumental[/URL] [/B] (its about 8 mbs)

So feel free to record over it or whatever, put a little Merk touch on it, ha ha... basically what I want to do is just follow the rhythm of the tune.

I think that’s it for now Merk, you have been a big help to me buddy :)

Thanks Merkaba
Yeah a post of it from you would be very helpful if you have the time.
Much appreciated.

I'm just not exactly sure what the feeling would be if i were using correct diaphragm support... I breathe correctly, but you say it still sounds like i'm not getting correct support. Also what should the 'push' on a note feel like?

Oh, and how is singing really loud going to help me? Is it to find the true voiceor something? I attempted singing the song pushing hard and loud and it just sounded quite bad... lol

Hey everyone. I've always wanted a raspy voice. Kinda like Foo Fighters raspy. Any tips? Also, can your voice ever become permanently raspy?

Yes, by smoking 10 packs of cigarettes a day... lol

I never post due to a lack of time. But..

To anyone who wants to learn the falsetto scream...

..first, read most theory found in this topic. SERIOUSLY. That's important.

But, theory is not all. It's just as much mentality towards your singing itself, as it is actual technique. I'll make a little guide to actually learning how to use it. Most assumptions here are from experience. It's nothing big, but heh, I guess any help is useful.

You don't have to force a falsetto scream. You just do it. I gave a similar tip before, but these past few weeks, I've been practicing for hours every day while showering, cleaning my room, etc. Every free time I kind find.

So you got something that sounds like a falsetto scream. Thing is, you're probably tensing it too much at first. So you'll work on that, just relax, don't move a muscle on your face, and just do those "screams". Just to get a feel for it. Just to improve your technique and such.

Right well. Singing with your raspened falsetto can be a bitch at first. It sounds and feels very unnatural. Hell, you probably can't even pronounce words yet, I sure as hell can't. That's fine at first.

So after having warmed up, listen to a song with falsetto screams. Let's say, Laid To Rest by Lamb Of God or I'm Broken by Pantera. I picked those because I didn't have to scream several sylables with one breath.

In laid to rest there is a 12 second falsetto scream where Randy scramed the "ure" part of "failure". It's quite easy.

In I'm Broken, Phil Anselmo screamed "Too young for" with a falsetto scream. Again, I picked those because I could scream a sylable at a time.

..to be honest, the only reason I listen to those songs is just to practice to them.

If you figured those out - which is [i]very[/i] easy...

..I'd suggest just talking with added rasp. Just talk to yourself, or sing along songs with added rasp. Also to get used to it. Just get used to rasping your voice.

I couldn't do **** with my falsetto scream at first because it felt so alien. So I just tried to get used to it that way. And it worked.

I'd also suggest to stop using your chest voice to scream for the time you're learning to use your falsetto scream. Just fully focus on it. 'cause getting a feel for it as important as the technique.

Right. So you can sing with a raspened voice by now and talk with it, too. Now.. just practice some random screams as much as you can and see if you got more control over them, if not, keep trying.

ALSO. Force yourself to do stuff you thought you couldn't before. I got a better feel for my scream when I tried to scream along Aqua Dementia by Mastodon (what a brilliant song, by the way). And hey, I could do it immediately. Plus, it's very fun to scream along to.

The last, and probably most important tip is;
DON'T WORRY IF YOU DON'T SOUND LIKE WHATSHISNAME FROM WHATSTHEBAND. You have your own voice. Strop wanting to sound like let's say Jacob Bannon and accept your voice for what it is, unique. You might not be able to sound like..Greg Puciato from The Dillinger Escape Plan, but hey, he might not be able to sound like you either.

Hope that was even slightly useful.

Merkaba (or anyone else who knows)- I haven't exactly read all of this thread yet, so hopefully you haven't answered my question already. Dave Grohl, from Foo Fighters, sings aggressively, according to definitions of that kind of singing I've found. I'm wondering how he sings like that, because I have a very nice normal singing voice (kind of like Chester from Linkin Park, when he sings normal) but I can't get much rasp in it at all. Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks Merkaba
Yeah a post of it from you would be very helpful if you have the time.
Much appreciated.

I'm just not exactly sure what the feeling would be if i were using correct diaphragm support... I breathe correctly, but you say it still sounds like i'm not getting correct support. Also what should the 'push' on a note feel like?

Oh, and how is singing really loud going to help me? Is it to find the true voiceor something? I attempted singing the song pushing hard and loud and it just sounded quite bad... lol

[QUOTE=The Dylanettes]Merkaba (or anyone else who knows)- I haven't exactly read all of this thread yet, so hopefully you haven't answered my question already. Dave Grohl, from Foo Fighters, sings aggressively, according to definitions of that kind of singing I've found. I'm wondering how he sings like that, because I have a very nice normal singing voice (kind of like Chester from Linkin Park, when he sings normal) but I can't get much rasp in it at all. Any help would be greatly appreciated![/QUOTE]
Well yea...we've all answered that before. Its all the same thing. Unfortunately at this time I dont wish to repeat it...nothing personal but I'm about to go eat. But if you read around.....you'll read what I would write anyways so...

Louis Armstrong, Wonderful World.

Good post Kosta...

Oh ok sorry for bugging you then. I'll look around.

[QUOTE=MikeyEss]Thanks Merkaba
Yeah a post of it from you would be very helpful if you have the time.
Much appreciated.

I'm just not exactly sure what the feeling would be if i were using correct diaphragm support... I breathe correctly, but you say it still sounds like i'm not getting correct support. Also what should the 'push' on a note feel like?

Oh, and how is singing really loud going to help me? Is it to find the true voiceor something? I attempted singing the song pushing hard and loud and it just sounded quite bad... lol[/QUOTE]

Talk to someone, at a normal volume. That's your true voice. Yell really loud at someone. That's your true voice. Scream like a girl, or like you're on a roller coaster. That's falsetto. Falsetto isn't bad of course, but it isn't proper singing if you're singing a whole song in falsetto, really softly.
So, try just talking loud, or yelling for that matter, and try to make notes out of it. Use a guitar or piano, it helps. It's not going to sound good at first, but you need to discover how to use your head voice in singing.

Cool, thanks CD

I'll record some new stuff soon and post it.