[QUOTE=TheOneThatBleeds]i scream by kinda closing off this one part of my throat. i dont think its falsetto but i dont think its full voice or w/e. cuz it doesnt hurt and i can do it for a long time and not lose my voice at all. its kinda of this part of my throat if i push hard enuf it wud make me throw up. is this rite at all? it sounds kinda of like older avenged sevenfold screams. please help me out.[/QUOTE]

Post a sample.
That sounds like the way I do it, but I don't feel like I'm ever gonna throw up. I can also alternate between singing and screaming easily.

i can go back forth between the 2 easily also. how/where do shud i post a sample? and i only feel like throwing up if i push really hard and m doin it for a while.

My problem is, is that even when I'm by myself and try it, I still hold back. Is there anything I can do about this? Or is it just in my head?

Ur Crazy Thats Wut!!!!!!!!!!!!

In response to the technique on the first page there are only a few things I'd have to dissagree with:

1. You don't have to use falsetto to scream. If you slowly build your way up with your gut, you will have it. I actually do a mix between my gut and my throat ever since my voice changed and I get James Hetfield like grunts.

2. I would never ever depend on a mic for loudness, I mean you use it during concerts and stuff so the back rows can hear ya loud and clear... but man if you can't scream loud without a mic... well I don't think thats right.

And remember, no matter how much technique you got in your singing it can never live up to how much heart you have for it. Peace out dudes! :wave:

it shouldnt matter if you cant scream loud.
The more you push for most people would mean more pressure and it just means more damage if your using the wrong technique by just yelling as loud as you can.

[QUOTE=Moneener]My problem is, is that even when I'm by myself and try it, I still hold back. Is there anything I can do about this? Or is it just in my head?[/QUOTE]

I was like that at first. Think of a small barrier infront of you... you can easily shatter it away and you'll never have to worry about it again. Pretty much, I couldn't scream at all until I was so angry one day and I was singing and I just let it out with all the anger and everything. Ever since that, I didn't feel like I was holding back anymore. It might just be me, but you can try it.

Thanks man, I'll keep trying.

What I'm personally saying is that you dont have to scream at the top of your lungs. Screaming is kind of like a technique in music, but what I don't agree with in Silver's tutorial (no offense man) is when he said that you HAVE to use falsetto. I don't use falsetto and I don't ever hear James Hetfield using it (except in like kill em all and ride the lightning and maybe even master of puppets) the rest of the cd's he didn't use falsetto. There are different ways of going about it is all im saying. If everyone was forced to scream using falsetto wouldn't everyone sound the same? I think that's a problem in the music industry these days is that a bunch of rock/metal bands' singers sound nearly the same.

Oh yea ,sorry dude.
I think that right aswell that you dont have to scream in falsetto but i think the reason behind screaming in falsetto is because you use your false chords (or something??? am i right?) in your falsetto range and then it does less damage to your voice.
I never scream in falsetto and iv never had any damage so i guess it doesnt affect all people as bad.

I noticed that if u dont scream in falsetto it starts to hurt after like 5 or 6 songs b/c my voice starts getting really dry. I'll take a nice drink of water and be back in action for about 5 or 6 more songs. I'd just like to know how James Hetfield screams on the Ride The Lightning album (especially on for whom the bell tolls). That'd be great.

u just need to grow a *****

Make sure you avoid glottal attacks, when singing/screaming.
Good way to get nodes in a hurry.

what are glottal attacks?

I would like to learn to scream like PETE LOEFFLER from Chevelle. Any pointers. Sorry if this has allready been answered, just guide me in the right direction if it has. I am having a hard time screaming all together. One scream and my throat hurts, i am standing up strait with my head back and making that stupid face. It feels really dry. Hmm water...

because your not really suppose to scream.......you have to make the sound of a scream wothout using all the force your normally would to really scream out loud.

glotal attack= shot powerfull sound like hmm hard to explain...
it's bad to do much so if you know what i ment avoid it

As far as the falsetto vs true voice debate it doesnt matter. If youre screaming youre gonna be either scrapping the sound off the back of the throat , or pushing so hard in tru e voice that your cords are flapping. Of course one is better than the other and between the two there is a whole myriad of technical things that one can work on to prolong their vocal health, perfomance stamina, and general longevity. But you dont sing "falsetto" with low notes. So its really just a preference in style and what range you want to try to sing in or go into. Hetfield doesnt use alot of falsetto, Cornell does. Both are great, different styles/approaches. The technique is generally the same: Diaphragm supported vocal activation, THEN throat interference with the airflow. Again, most people dont know how to workout the cords. One of the most important things to remember is that if youre using incorrect tecnique youre going to fatigue the cords and muscles before you have a chance to work them. its like waking up in the morning and trying to run sprints. You can do it but youre not going to gain as much as you would if you warmed up, stretched, jogged for a while, and then did sprints, and you'd be able to do the sprints for longer which would help the muscles, as opposed to not being able to sprint because you quickly fatigued the cold tissues. So warm up properly and dont start off singing hard or screaming for a while.

Merkaba-1,

I've noticed your technique of producing rasp is "scraping it off the back of your throat". I know your trained by Mark also; is this something he taught you? What sensations do you personally feel when you scrape the air off the back of your throat? I still don't really understand how you do this. I've heard your samples and you have a very strong voice and the rasp is good, but what do you feel and how do you prepare for one of these screams. Do you tighten your stomach muscles?

I scream more in the style of high notes with just a little rasp thrown in (Tim Ripper Owens,Steven Tyler,Rob Halford,Sebastian Bach). I struggled for a year or more with producing this, and finally Mark told me just to add a little more volume and a little more push until I got the rasp, and to only quit when my throat tickled. Then, I could keep testing it out, and learn how far I can take it before I do damage or my throat begins to tickle(which is what I use as a meter on if im pushing too hard). The way I produce it now is I only scream in falsetto, so I sing a falsetto note like always, and I sing it with a tiny bit extra push, nothing big, and the main thing is I sing it somewhat louder than I sing my clear falsettos. This brings the rasp to the note and it sounds good and I can do it for quite sometime.

My main vocal problem though is I sing too loud which is causing everything to go into chest voice instead of switching to head like it's supposed to. So for that i've been working on singing no louder than my speaking voice at practice and always wearing ear plugs and it works great. Point is, the only time I ever really go hoarse is when I sing too loudly, and I never really lose my voice except for when I have laryngitis from a cold. I think this shows my screaming technique isnt too damaging, and im always paranoid about damage to my cords and Mark guarantees everything im doing is fine. So I was just curious for a description somewhat like i've given you on how you make your screams. Thanks man

Well unless youre clossing off pretty tight, one might think that its coming from the cords. but the cords wont flap at a low push. So if you practice at a low push you can get the rasp and be sure its not a damaging flailing of the cords. You can get the cords to relax a bit as well and actually add to the distortion but i wont attempt to explain how to do this. Its kinda like whispering and singing at the same time, at a minimal push.
If you make the ANNNKKK sound like if you were the buzzer for a game show and someone got the wrong answer, you can feel it pretty much. The thing is that most people will squeeze the larynx up when making that sound so be careful not to carry that over into anything else. And no, the stomach shouldnt tighten up. You should actually try to keep it relaxed and if youre holding a note, it should feel like youre trying to inhale again. In other words keep the stomach relaxed and everything open and soft, regardless of the emotion. its really not that a big feeling or big muscular contraction that youre looking for. Of course the more you close up the more pressure you'll have on the cords, so its good to remember to stay relaxed. I would say sing hard and its easier to find...then over time back off. You just cant squeeze anything in the throat when you sing hard, and let it come from the diaphragm. If you stay relaxed the cords will tend to vent when anything other than optimal balance is pushed. so this extra air passes off the throat. The trouble is when you dont relax and try to hold the cords together against all this extra pressure. its like twice the work, if not more. The flip side of this coin is that the work makes you stronger. You have to find what fatigues you the most and work with your own limits over time. Rasping is kinda natural if you relax. The air will have nowhere else to go. squeezing and tensing gives less extra air and more need to push and again its a downward spiral. Everyone should remember to just try to go limp all over your body when trying this stuff out. Over time you can manipulate it later.
And of course i would agree with mark. I mean you sound like youre just working around getting a feel for your limits and stuff. Its actually pretty hard to do permanent damage if youre careful, but why even head off towards that direction at all, ya know. The best thing that happened to me is when i went to try out for a band and the guy told me to sing harder. I never talked to the guys again, but i realize soon after that at that point, the only reason I was supposed to meet up with them was for him to tell me that. theres been times where I would actually try to feel pain and discomfort just to see my limits. The only time I've felt any was after i had a three week respiratory infection with lots of coughing. I actually think the work and stress from coughing added about a half step note to my full voice range. :lol: Take it easy

Cool thanks Merk

Yeah, it took me a little while to figure out how to get a rasp in my voice. It basically just takes more power and volume, and you have to have confidence in doing it. Now I can get rasp in all 3 of my singing voices... but I still have to work on screaming.

a newbie
 

i have never screamed before in my life, i have done backup singing for my band but normallyi just play keyboards and samples. But our screamer is terrible. He sounds like a f***ing storm outside. What would u recommend to a guy who has no idea what the vocal ranges are? I wanna try to get kinda like a Union Underground type scream, what kinda scream is this?

...suppose I'm a bit of a screamer.
I have no trouble hitting high notes without using falsetto.
All I did to practise until I could hit all the notes I wanted to hit, was to scream into the pillow, so the neighbors wouldn't call the cops on me.

I just had one rule, if it hurts, find another way.

In the end though, I realized that when I relaxed the throatmuscles, and focused on the abdomen and the lungs, the notes were much easier to hit than when I tried to push it from the throat.

Right here [url]http://music.download.com/roybratbakken[/url] are 4 songs to illustrate!

Rock On!
Roy.

[QUOTE=robonez]...suppose I'm a bit of a screamer.
I have no trouble hitting high notes without using falsetto.
All I did to practise until I could hit all the notes I wanted to hit, was to scream into the pillow, so the neighbors wouldn't call the cops on me.

I just had one rule, if it hurts, find another way.

In the end though, I realized that when I relaxed the throatmuscles, and focused on the abdomen and the lungs, the notes were much easier to hit than when I tried to push it from the throat.

Right here [url]http://music.download.com/roybratbakken[/url] are 4 songs to illustrate!

Rock On!
Roy.[/QUOTE]

Good job dude. I checked out shameless....the "whatever comes my way" part is in my head. Keep up the good work. And you played all the instruments? You motherfvckers make me sick with that. I really am thinking about taking guitar lessons at least. I can play rhythm ...kinda...ok..barely. hehe. keep up the good work.

[QUOTE=robonez]...suppose I'm a bit of a screamer.
I have no trouble hitting high notes without using falsetto.
All I did to practise until I could hit all the notes I wanted to hit, was to scream into the pillow, so the neighbors wouldn't call the cops on me.

I just had one rule, if it hurts, find another way.

In the end though, I realized that when I relaxed the throatmuscles, and focused on the abdomen and the lungs, the notes were much easier to hit than when I tried to push it from the throat.

Right here [url]http://music.download.com/roybratbakken[/url] are 4 songs to illustrate!

Rock On!
Roy.[/QUOTE]

I listened to shameless.. Man, that's pure quality!.. Good job! :thumb:

Merkaba could you please listen to this sample of me singing december flower by in flames and come with some tips? [url]http://s25.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=0XIYNVEG15CK70H81QSCUW54B3[/url]

I didn't feel much discomfort singing like that for half an hour.. Other than the fact that my stomach muscles started to hurt like hell afterwards.. hehe, but I guess that's a sign that I'm singing from my gut and that's a good thing right?
(And a sign that I don't work out enough!)

is inward screaming bad for u in anyway?

[QUOTE=Merkaba-1]Good job dude. I checked out shameless....the "whatever comes my way" part is in my head. Keep up the good work. And you played all the instruments? You motherfvckers make me sick with that. I really am thinking about taking guitar lessons at least. I can play rhythm ...kinda...ok..barely. hehe. keep up the good work.[/QUOTE]


Hey, Merkaba-1!
Thanx for giving it a listen!
Yeah, I sing and play everything on those tunes.

And keep practising!!!!
Lessons..? Dunno, I never took any, not guitar, singing or anything else, but obviously it can be a good thing for lotsa folks!
Seems though, that a lot of my favorite guitarists and singers never took any lessons.

Keep Rockin'!
Roy.

[QUOTE=Knifeboy]I listened to shameless.. Man, that's pure quality!.. Good job! :thumb:[/QUOTE]

Hey, Knifeboy!

Thanx for the kind words, dude!

Keep Rockin'!
Roy.

[QUOTE=SevenDeadlySins]is inward screaming bad for u in anyway?[/QUOTE]

I don't know why. But yeah, it can damage your vocal chords

well robonez, whats a good way or whatever to learn guitar without a teacher. Any dvd's thats good or whatever? how did you learn. I want to be able to solo and build my own style. I mean i can play power cords and baic barre cords, but i come up with all of these songs in my head but i cant play the guitar to go along with them! Anyways. Coolstuff.

[QUOTE=SevenDeadlySins]is inward screaming bad for u in anyway?[/QUOTE]
its basically kinda like bending your elbow the wrong way. Over time you can get away with it and build up some flexibility ...moresore than the average, and you might become or naturally be what we might called double jointed. but putting a lot of pressure on them in this manner can greatly increase problematic effects. Its not really in my style, but i would say be careful. and treat it as any other technique. And for god sakes warmdown if youre going to be doing this. If you need warmdown stuff check out my voichelp hotline thread in the communities thread. Why they moved it off of the front page and put it in typed up urls beats me. I'll have to keep a copy of the link so i can just paste it in when i make reference to it.

[QUOTE=Knifeboy]Merkaba could you please listen to this sample of me singing december flower by in flames and come with some tips? [url]http://s25.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=0XIYNVEG15CK70H81QSCUW54B3[/url]

I didn't feel much discomfort singing like that for half an hour.. Other than the fact that my stomach muscles started to hurt like hell afterwards.. hehe, but I guess that's a sign that I'm singing from my gut and that's a good thing right?
(And a sign that I don't work out enough!)[/QUOTE] You've got the rasp at least you'll know how to do it. But youre stomach shouldnt be hurting ever, not to mention after just thirty or so minutes. You dont want to squeeze with them unless you've been holding a note or scream and youre at the end of your support. This is why your stomach is feeling it. The stomach will of course have to tighten a bit, but you dont want to crunch it much. I would say practice relaxing. It sounds like your squeezing the throat a bit in an attempt to get the rasp and pressure youre losing by squeezing with stomach. Try to open up the throat, not just the mouth, and relax more when youre just practicing. I think you can eventually find the point where you get a better rasp and tone without the work you seem to be doing and feeling. But youre right there. Keep practicing. And remember that you wont need to push that hard with proper support from the stomach. It shouldnt be a squeeze. Take a breath and begin to say Uh like youre dissapointed but hold it before anything comes out. This can help you feel the pressure. you have to maintain the pressure by not opening up the cords too much. If you do then you'll lose more air instead of vibrating the cords with it and it will be more work to get the sound, this is why i tell people to practice at like half push and force, to make sure that you activate the cords first. Try to sing the notes when you practice...then continue to do this an add a little rasp and push over a period of time, so that you concentrated on the cords keeping the pressure behind them instead of pushing it out to get that raspy sound. Sing the notes first. even for a heavier grittier sound. You'll thankyourself later.

Dude youre doing it to me.
"I'll take whatever comes my way....lean on whoever wants to stay...." (guessin i heard that correctly)

Now I shall burn it to cd and sing it on my way to work! The miracles of technology. I shall check out another one of your songs now. I'll try them all...but im on friggin dial up so its like twenty minutes a piece.
:thumb:

underOATH screaming and cold
 

hey whats up guys,

i've read the whole thread and all the posts about screaming emocore style, but i

1) Can anyone give me directtips on how to scream like spencer of underoath

2) whenever i try to scream it has a thin tone, how do i thicken it up?

3) i notice whenever i have a head/chest cold my singing and screaming quality decreses? is it just me or is this common?

bump
i think this one is more imformative than the other...

Okay, I tried posting on the other one of these...got no help whatsoever so far, except being told to go to a doctor. I have a strong singing voice, very similar to Danzig during the Lucifuge and How the Gods Kill albums. I'm doing harder music right now, with guitars inspired from death and black metal styles. I want to get a scream like Devin Townsend's of Strapping Young Lad, albeit within the confines of my own voice to go with the more aggressive music and lyrics I've been generating. He's got a wide range of sounds he produces and he can still sing, that is pretty much what I want.

Here's the problem. I tried the methods detailed in a a couple of forums on screaming and for me it just doesn't work. Even if I get a scream started, it phases back into a strong clean tone.

I used to do growling death metal type stuff, probably overly throat projecting. I have no gag reflex anymore. Still, my voice is far stronger then it used to be while singing, I just can't get a scream out. Any ideas?

I tried t used the technique at the very beginning of this thread, but it sounds like a lot of air and a tiny bit of girly sounding scream coming out. Any ideas for me?

how does the guy from hawthorne heights do it?