Merkaba
 

Sorry for posting this again, but i think you didn't see it b4 merkaba

I was reading through the isolation post again, and practicing singing and screaming while holding my fingers to my larynx. I can sing all the time without movement from my adams apple, but whenever i scream it moves up. I listened to the falsetto scream lesson one you posted as well, and noticed that my adams apple moves whenever i make the grunt... the ha! or hu! sounds.

Do you have any suggestions??

[QUOTE=lloydapalooza]how do you falsetto scream mikeyess and kosta? is there any way that you can describe it in words for me? ive wanted to learn to falsetto scream for the longest time but i never knew how to get that sort of rasp.[/QUOTE]

All that i can recommend is reading through the isolation, rasp, warm-up, and a variety of the screaming posts... try each thing serparately and then try to bring it together. Kosta is right tho, you'll probably just try it one time and it'll come to you. Its pretty much what happened to me anyway...

Oh, and i don't think my screams are falsetto (could be wrong though?)

New screams
 

I decided to try a mid - low - high scream... heres the link

[url]http://www.soundclick.com/bands/1/mikeyess_music.htm[/url]

The low one was bad... lol

Mike, it will move a bit...but especially doing ha at a mid level you should be able to keep it. You'll have to find the muscles that hold it. Now when youre going way up it will want to move up a bit...and if you relax it will be ok but you just dont want to equate the squeeze of those muscles to the pull of the cords...and thus slam your apple up with all the force youre using to do your vocalizing. Swallow and feel it and how it goes up and locks to prevent choking, to block the airway. So you wouldnt want to be blocking your airway when youre singing would you? hehe. Off to work for now...

Cool!
 

Awesome thanks Merkaba, i thought i was doing something wrong. It does just move up and down a little bit, its nothing like swallowing.
I appreciate the help, thanks again!

Nice
 

Good new falsetto Kosta :thumb:

Kosta...
 

Hey Kosta, are you able to scream words yet, or in tune with something? If you can post it

Merkaba I have another problem... lol

You know how kids hold their breath and push to get the blood all rushed to their faces and it can make them blow blood vessels or pass out? Well i can only scream when i'm pushing like that... hahahaha. What am I doing wrong (if you even know, this is kinda strange)?

And one more thing, how do I get a cleaner scream? If you've listened to any of my recordings, the scream sounds as though i have spit gurgling in the back of my throat or something.

Thanks a lot buddy!

I was sorda screaming today. I cant really scream so I just sing at about speech loudness and add a lot of rasp, sometimes I go a little louder. Anyway I was "screaming" along with a band today and after I did a scream my throat started hurting so I immediatly stopped. I drank some water, and drank some more later. My throat still hurts. I almost feel sick. When will this go away and what am I dont wrong with my screaming. I know im not doing it right. I dont want to paralyze my vocals or have a ****ty voice.

[QUOTE=fuzzyhair]I was sorda screaming today. I cant really scream so I just sing at about speech loudness and add a lot of rasp, sometimes I go a little louder. Anyway I was "screaming" along with a band today and after I did a scream my throat started hurting so I immediatly stopped. I drank some water, and drank some more later. My throat still hurts. I almost feel sick. When will this go away and what am I dont wrong with my screaming. I know im not doing it right. I dont want to paralyze my vocals or have a ****ty voice.[/QUOTE]


Same thing happened to me when i started trying... you're probably trying too much through your throat without pushing with your diaphragm. You need to use the air from your gut rather than making the noise in your throat. The pain and irritation probably won't last more than a day, or two at the most.

Hey Merkaba, you told me to post this here, so here I go.

I was wondering if any one could give me any points on how to make my voice a little better. My voice is preatty bad, and even when it comes out good its just really dull and boring. I want my voice to be a little more cooler, and better haha. I saw before your style of music matters so the style of music im going for is like punk. I want my voice to sound like not exactly raspy but soething like that, like Tom Delonge's voice sort of. Can any one please give me any pointers?

[QUOTE=MikeyEss]Same thing happened to me when i started trying... you're probably trying too much through your throat without pushing with your diaphragm. You need to use the air from your gut rather than making the noise in your throat. The pain and irritation probably won't last more than a day, or two at the most.[/QUOTE]
thanks very much. It feels much better today.

[QUOTE=MikeyEss]Good new falsetto Kosta :thumb:[/QUOTE]

Thanks a lot! You've been making progress as well!

[QUOTE=MikeyEss]Hey Kosta, are you able to scream words yet, or in tune with something? If you can post it[/QUOTE]

I've made me a little archive of all of my screams so far. Scream for is me basically trying to scream "reminds" like Jake from Converge did in "The Broken Vow".

[url=http://www.soundclick.com/myvocals]Boo-yah![/url]

I can't sing with it, though. I'm still learning that.

[QUOTE=MikeyEss]Merkaba I have another problem... lol

You know how kids hold their breath and push to get the blood all rushed to their faces and it can make them blow blood vessels or pass out? Well i can only scream when i'm pushing like that... hahahaha. What am I doing wrong (if you even know, this is kinda strange)?

And one more thing, how do I get a cleaner scream? If you've listened to any of my recordings, the scream sounds as though i have spit gurgling in the back of my throat or something.

Thanks a lot buddy![/QUOTE]
I couldnt say, but I would bet that youre clamping off your throat too much. Its part of the purpose of the cords and false cords, when you need to strain, to keep the air in give support to your inner organs. All i can tell you is to practice singing the note normally. Whatever the pitch and note is just sing it normally without trying to scream it. Then try to add a tiny bit of rasp, which would come from the same mechanism that you clamp down with to pass out or blow vessels. Theres just not many ways you can create that kind of pressure. Well really, you cant do that without closing up your throat. Practice singing and the scream will come, as clean or as raspy as you want it to be, when you can isolate the cords from the larynx and that area you use to blow vessels and pass out with.

[QUOTE=fuzzyhair]I was sorda screaming today. I cant really scream so I just sing at about speech loudness and add a lot of rasp, sometimes I go a little louder. Anyway I was "screaming" along with a band today and after I did a scream my throat started hurting so I immediatly stopped. I drank some water, and drank some more later. My throat still hurts. I almost feel sick. When will this go away and what am I dont wrong with my screaming. I know im not doing it right. I dont want to paralyze my vocals or have a ****ty voice.[/QUOTE]
Well youre well on your way! hehe. Just kidding. But yea, like mike said, if youre not doing it properly youre gonna be squeezing your throat off to get the pressure you need to rasp. This creates an imbalance between the air flow and the cords and they cant vibrate as well. If the cords are pushed more than they and their muslces can handle then they bow up and cant close to vibrate, and over time youre just shooting air over them more and pushing them up more and this can lead to overstressing the structure and down the spiral you go. You could be feeling sick because of the added pressure you exert when youre doing alot of pushing on your internal organs and brain and the increased blood pressure, especially if you were closing your throat up alot... yes, its real. Or you could have irritated the larynx and cords enough to open them up for pathogens, thus youre getting a "cold". Now with it coming on that quickly, I would probably guess its the former, all of the internal pressure. It sounds funny but why else would you feel so crappy from singing or screaming? Obviously you did some incorrect stuff. I wouldnt sing until the pain goes away. Maybe just hold some EE's at a low push. Concentrating more on lower notes and glissing up some to higher True voice notes,EE's, and back down. Then keep doing moderate to low ee's to finish off. Singing with swollen cords(and yours are) can lead to nodes because it certain pitches the cords dont clamp together evenly because they are puffy and swollen. Right in that spot or spots where its uneven the air will shoot through and over time just roughen that spot, leaving you a node. What fun!

Vitamin C, Zinc, potassium(bananas,OJ,) and water, while you recover and you'll have time to read through the first page of links in this thread, especially the isolation threads.
Cheerio

[QUOTE=PunkSkater163]Hey Merkaba, you told me to post this here, so here I go.

I was wondering if any one could give me any points on how to make my voice a little better. My voice is preatty bad, and even when it comes out good its just really dull and boring. I want my voice to be a little more cooler, and better haha. I saw before your style of music matters so the style of music im going for is like punk. I want my voice to sound like not exactly raspy but soething like that, like Tom Delonge's voice sort of. Can any one please give me any pointers?[/QUOTE]
Well thats not really a good question. As far as we know your voice might sound fine and you just dont like it, or you want it to sound more like someone elses. Raspiness comes from the position of your throat. If you dont have good strength or stamina you can chalk it out. But you get that from practice with proper technique and breath control. I think we need a little more specific question. I dont think the style of music matters, as far as learning to sing goes. Now punk is usually higher pitch, so naturally you have some issues their if youre not born a tenor or with that ability. But Delonge doesnt go extremely high so I wouldnt sweat it. Just practice and dont try to run before you walk because you only get one set of cords.

Ok, simple question I guess. Whats the best way to tell if you're singing the right note? I'm just learning how to sing and I'm trying to train my voice by playing along with my guitar. However, when I'm singing, it might sound ok but if I record myself I can tell it's pretty far off. Should I get some sort of voice tuner type thing?

[QUOTE=Merkaba-1]
If the cords are pushed more than they can handle then they bow up and cant close to vibrate, and over time youre just shooting air over them more and pushing them up more and this can lead to overstressing the structure and down the spiral you go.

[/QUOTE]


but if you had strong vocal cords, wouldn't the air shoot past it and hit your soft pallate, thus, producing rasp?

also i have another side question

generally how strong do your vocal cords need to be to be able to scream?

and what exactly is happening when someone is growling? is it just like screaming except at a lower pitch or is it something different?

[QUOTE=lloydapalooza]but if you had strong vocal cords, wouldn't the air shoot past it and hit your soft pallate, thus, producing rasp? [/quote]
Nah, you forgot how the cords work. When you push air up and close the cords it restricts the air flow, but they roll open in a certain shape, depending on the pitch, then they close, then they do that again, then they close. hundred or so times a second. So if your cords and the muscles arent able to hold the cords tight to resist a bigger airflow they wont stay together to vibrate the air and you get a break, a lot of breaks, just a plane old shltty sounding bad note, or pretty much nothing at all. Ever blown up a balloon and then squeezee the opening with your fingers and pull it and make it make sounds? Then when you pull it tight it gets higher, but if you pull too much the air just flaps out. Its working the same way. So you need to have your muscles strong enough to be able to hold the folds together to resist the air. Anything shooting past your cords is nothing but extra air, which means you cant hold the note as long, and it means more stress on the cords and a quicker drying thus more heat thus more swelling, because they arent vibrating from the air. It has to vibrate the cords to get a sound, or a note that is.
[quote]
also i have another side question

generally how strong do your vocal cords need to be to be able to scream?

and what exactly is happening when someone is growling? is it just like screaming except at a lower pitch or is it something different?[/QUOTE]Well how could I answer the strength question? YOu have to be able to resist at least 35 psi.....etc. ??? It will depend on the person. Some people can get a scream at 60% push that it might take me 90% to imitate. There just is no setpoint, and it depends on your makeup. But with a little practice and good technique, I always say anyone can do any type of sound with no more than 80% of their maximum push if that, especially when you start to add in a Mic.You dont have to be the loudest or strongest, just have good technique toget a clean sound.
Growls are the same, just the cords are thicker at lower notes, and youre using alot of the glottis, or back of the throat. Like I say....theres really not any other way to get rasp. THeres just not enough things in your path to alter. But there are enough so that you can do it wrong. But when you hear a high shrill... a good mid tone raspy note, or a low growl, theres really only one way to get that rasp consistently.

[QUOTE=kaotic3]Ok, simple question I guess. Whats the best way to tell if you're singing the right note? I'm just learning how to sing and I'm trying to train my voice by playing along with my guitar. However, when I'm singing, it might sound ok but if I record myself I can tell it's pretty far off. Should I get some sort of voice tuner type thing?[/QUOTE]
Keep practicing is all i can tell ya. Be sure to start on low notes. And do octaves from a low note youre comfortable with up to its next higher cousin. sing A, then play and sing the next higher A. then move up one half step and repeat and so on. Then do a low note, the perfect fifth up, then the next octave(from the first low note, tonic, etc.) Practice without cords, just a single string.

My songs
 

Hey Merkaba
Thanks for the info earlier. I was reading the rest of the posts and noticed the one you replied to for punkskater... about how his voice might sound find and he may just not like it. I'm kinda interested in seeing if thats the case for me, because i've always enjoyed singing but never liked my voice. I sent a recording to my sister, and she said that she was totally surprised i could sing. Could you check out the two songs I posted on soundclick --->

[url]http://www.soundclick.com/bands/1/mikeyess_music.htm[/url]

One is Cemetery Drive by My Chemical Romance, the other is an acoustic (I believe you but my tommy gun don't) by Brand New

Let me know what you think, be brutally honest, and thanks a lot!

edit>> I'm adding 1 more song as well 'soco amaretto lime' by Brand New, could you please check it out as well?

Also a new scream, which i personally think is my best so far, for anyone who wants to check it out.
Wait nevermind soundclick is down atm... i'll put it up as soon as possible

I've just recently started screaming for my band. When I do, it starts to really hurt after a couple of songs. I know this is really bad, and I'm trying to fix it, but I don't really understand how to make the sound come from my gut, and not from my throat. Can anybody elaborate so I can start screaming again? Oh yeah, I'm 16, and I scream for like a death metal type band. I don't really know who to compare it to, It's just a deep, raspy scream...

[QUOTE=spaztik]I've just recently started screaming for my band. When I do, it starts to really hurt after a couple of songs. I know this is really bad, and I'm trying to fix it, but I don't really understand how to make the sound come from my gut, and not from my throat. Can anybody elaborate so I can start screaming again? Oh yeah, I'm 16, and I scream for like a death metal type band. I don't really know who to compare it to, It's just a deep, raspy scream...[/QUOTE]
Its gonna come from your throat, you just need to make sure your air support comes from your diaphragm....otherwise you will squeeze your throat up in an attempt to gain the pressure you need to scream. Thats where the problem comes in at.

My songs
 

Hey Merkaba
Thanks for the info earlier. I was reading the rest of the posts and noticed the one you replied to for punkskater... about how his voice might sound find and he may just not like it. I'm kinda interested in seeing if thats the case for me, because i've always enjoyed singing but never liked my voice. I sent a recording to my sister, and she said that she was totally surprised i could sing. Could you check out the two songs I posted on soundclick --->

[url]http://www.soundclick.com/bands/1/mikeyess_music.htm[/url]

One is Cemetery Drive by My Chemical Romance, the other is an acoustic (I believe you but my tommy gun don't) by Brand New

Let me know what you think, be brutally honest, and thanks a lot!

edit>> I'm adding 1 more song as well 'soco amaretto lime' by Brand New, could you please check it out as well?

Also a new scream, which i personally think is my best so far, for anyone who wants to check it out.

Well, I don't know the original songs, so I'm not really sure what to say about the singing. However, it was very soft and sounded pretty good, aside from a few pitch problems, but that's fine considering you weren't singing to anything (at least I don't think you would have been).
I'm not sure about the screams though man, sounds like you're tightening things up. I can't really be sure though. My falsetto scream sounds so much different from the typical "american hardcore" scream, so I really don't know.

Would singing along with a CD do anything to improve my voice?

[QUOTE=kaotic3]Would singing along with a CD do anything to improve my voice?[/QUOTE]
Thats basically how i learned to sing and still how I practice. Just be careful that you dont try to compete your acoustic instrument with the electrically amplified stereo! This can be dangerous.

[QUOTE=MikeyEss]Hey Merkaba
Thanks for the info earlier. I was reading the rest of the posts and noticed the one you replied to for punkskater... about how his voice might sound find and he may just not like it. I'm kinda interested in seeing if thats the case for me, because i've always enjoyed singing but never liked my voice. I sent a recording to my sister, and she said that she was totally surprised i could sing. Could you check out the two songs I posted on soundclick --->

[url]http://www.soundclick.com/bands/1/mikeyess_music.htm[/url]

One is Cemetery Drive by My Chemical Romance, the other is an acoustic (I believe you but my tommy gun don't) by Brand New

Let me know what you think, be brutally honest, and thanks a lot!

edit>> I'm adding 1 more song as well 'soco amaretto lime' by Brand New, could you please check it out as well?

Also a new scream, which i personally think is my best so far, for anyone who wants to check it out.[/QUOTE]
I thought I had replied a few days ago....oh well.
The screams sound ok...but like CD said it sounds like youre closing up too much....maybe as youre first trying to find that area of rasp...then you kinda let it back off more and let it flow out. The First scream sounds a little better.

The songs...well it sounds like youre not singing. Probably trying to hard, and you dont have breath support. It sounds like youre trying to sing parts in head or falsetto that should be done in maybe a lower head or higher chest. ...thats why it sounds soft and the cords arent buzzing the sound out. I would recommend you try the song an octave lower...even if its way deep....then sing it like like two notes lower from the orgininal. Just to get a feel for keeping the cords closed and relaxed. Also just sing the song like you were talking. Even if its in a different key.

Hey, I just started singing a month ago...I don't have a vocal coach or anything, but the singer that i'm TRYING to mimic is Freddie Mercury....Well first off when I wake up and try to sing along with Queen songs I can't hit certain notes because of flem blockage in my through. How do i get rid of the flem....and could u tell me some warm-ups that u guys use to prepare for singing. And did Freddy Mercury use his head voice in the song "Killer Queen". Oh and another thing...Sometimes when i try to hit some really high notes I end up sounding like Kurmet the Frog...Does anyone know how to stop that from happening? Thanks

to fenderplayer: links to warmups are posted on the first page of this post


alright so i recorded some growls and it would be cool if you could give me some input on them , see if im doing them right etc


[URL=http://www.soundclick.com/bands/0/lloydapalooza_music.htm]link[/URL]

[QUOTE=Rats]sounding good man. nice upper register. it suonds like you're straining to hit the highest ones but just keep practicing and it will get easier. i think you should work on your pronunciation/articulation because i can barely understand what you're singing or if its even english.[/QUOTE]

thanxs, man!!!

i'll work harder.

btw, i am not a native english speaker... is it too evident????

[b]The Natives Are Restless[/b]

[QUOTE=luciano]btw, i am not a native english speaker... is it too evident????[/QUOTE]
Yes. Your words are properly spelled and your grammar is too precise. [b]^:p^[/b]

Mispell your words, use excessively opaque, esoteric slang and post in incoherent sentence fragments and -- us Americans, anyway -- will assume you're a product of the U.S. public school system, and therefore a native speaker. [b]^;)^[/b]

[QUOTE=Majic][b]The Natives Are Restless[/b]


Yes. Your words are properly spelled and your grammar is too precise. [b]^:p^[/b]

Mispell your words, use excessively opaque, esoteric slang and post in incoherent sentence fragments and -- us Americans, anyway -- will assume you're a product of the U.S. public school system, and therefore a native speaker. [b]^;)^[/b][/QUOTE]

:D lol :D thanx :D

i was actually referring to my singing rather than my writing. anyway, i didn't write the lyrics, and in case you need them, you can find them here:

[url]http://www.darklyrics.com/lyrics/helloween/keeperofthesevenkeyspartii.html#5[/url]

if you haven't heard the song i sang, here is the rapidshare link:

[url]http://rapidshare.de/files/3598880/dr_stein_lu.ogg.html[/url]

any comments appreciated
(thanx rats and merka :) )