[QUOTE=Shady Ultima]I want to know something. I'm a smoker, I smoke a pack in 2 days. I'm thinkin about trying to quit, and I want to know if my body will recover? I'm a singer, and I've noticed a slight difference in my range lately. Also, when I do quit, is there any songs/vocal excercises to work on my throat to aid in the recovery process?[/QUOTE]
carry on smoking and you sing like matt skiba in "radio", whether thats good or not, i'll leave to you. depends how old you are, teenagers can recover quickest, take about 6 months to a year

I'm almost 19, and I'm going to quit shortly.

quitting will be the best thing for your cords regardless. Plenty of exercises in the voicehelp hotline.

[QUOTE=Shady Ultima]I'm almost 19, and I'm going to quit shortly.[/QUOTE]
yeah it shouldnt take too long to recover, but best to start asap:thumb:

Ok I just screamed along with the entire Black Dahlia Murder Miasma C.D. except for the second to last song that I couldn't get the vocal pattern down on. I only feel stress in my neck (like muscle stress) from pulling my grr thing back to make the rasp. I am pretty sure that is normal, since I have never really screamed that long before. But all in all I feel pretty damn good. My voice is a tinie tiny bit hoarse but that is proboably expected from being a n00b at screaming. Their songs consist of higher screams and growling. So does it sound like I am doing everything correct?

I have two questions about screaming. When you clear your throat, making the "ahem" sound, if you sustain the "ahh", is that close to what it feels like to properly scream? And should it make me go very red in the face, to the point where I can feel the blood vessels in my face bulging, to hold screams for a long time or to scream very rapid-fire lines?

Thank you to anyone who replies.

Sometimes I wonder if anybody noticed my post on the previous page...but I'm sure Mr.Merkaba did.

[QUOTE=Toaster]I have two questions about screaming. When you clear your throat, making the "ahem" sound, if you sustain the "ahh", is that close to what it feels like to properly scream? And should it make me go very red in the face, to the point where I can feel the blood vessels in my face bulging, to hold screams for a long time or to scream very rapid-fire lines?

Thank you to anyone who replies.[/QUOTE]



Nope. I often use 'clearing your throat' as an example of the wrong way to scream. When you clear your throat, you're closing it off, so you can get all the phlegm off the sides. This is bad for screaming, because when you scream, your throat should be pretty damn wide open. The fact that you're trying to push a scream through a closed throat, the resisitance, is what is causing you to go red. This is all bad.

[QUOTE=healthylw]Mr.Merkaba:

In my pursuit of "vocalism" I have been making steady progress, with both your insights and perspectives alongside the instruction that I have aquired through my formal singing lessons. Inspiring my style the most, is Raine Maida from Our Lady Peace. This leads me to my current Waterloo, as I am struggling to achieve decent falsetto, like Raine has. When I do sing in falsetto it fails to sound as "crisp" as his does and instead sounds somewhat "flat" (not pitchwise, but tonewise). Though I think it may be due to either improper amounts of airflow, or mucous, I am boggled by the idea of actually sounding good while singing in this range. Thanks for reading this, I apologise if I strung it out too far with my superlative grammer.[/QUOTE]
Haven't been on in a while. The thing about falsetto is that there is a point of diminishing returns when it comes to pressure, that the average singer will overpass. You can get relatively loud and crisp with half the push, usually, or in many cases, than it does for normal voice. However we don't know if this is your problem. But it is something to keep in mind. You should post a sample. And remember that if youre trying to sing like someone else, especially if youre still learning, (which we all are) then it can really hamper your technique. Remember that alot of baritones can have superior falsetto when compared to a tenor, and sometimes you might be a baritone trying to sing what a tenor does which is fast track for trouble. Do you know what you are?

[QUOTE=Toaster]I have two questions about screaming. When you clear your throat, making the "ahem" sound, if you sustain the "ahh", is that close to what it feels like to properly scream? And should it make me go very red in the face, to the point where I can feel the blood vessels in my face bulging, to hold screams for a long time or to scream very rapid-fire lines?

Thank you to anyone who replies.[/QUOTE]
If you make the Annnnk sounds as in the buzzer for a wrong answer, play with that on Ahh, and play with a light dog bark. However alot of times when one opens their mouth extra wide and hard, it will create tension and squeeze the larynx, a no no. So think more about dropping the bottom jaw, as opposed to just opening up as wide as all outside. The mouth isnt too connected to the larynx but if youre not carefull you'll put it,your larynx, and the cords all in the same group, which leaves you trying to squeeze everything when you only need to squeeze the cords. This is what we mean by "isolation". Isolating the cords from the rest of your body. Relax and move as little as possible when practicing or experimenting. Drop the bottom jaw and thats about it.

Thanks for the ideas, I am a baritone. I have been taking singing lessons, and my teacher told me that in order to achieve falsetto, I need to push larger amounts of air through. Is this the case? Also, do you think the shape of my mouth is causing the flatness in tone? Should the pallet be raised? What shape should the opening of the mouth be? Thanks.

Me and a friend are trying to start singing, but we are having trouble figuring out how to sing from the "gut", or diaphragm instead of the throat. So, how do we sing from the "gut", and how will we know when we are doing it right?
Also, will singing from the gut make it easier to control pitch, and will it extend range any, compared to singing from the throat (which we know is not proper) Thanks.

EDIT: Also, my friend wants to know if there is any specific way to do Nile/Necrophagist vocals.

[url]http://www.vocalist.org.uk/breathing_cp.html[/url]

I think this website should answer all your questions.

[QUOTE=healthylw]Thanks for the ideas, I am a baritone. I have been taking singing lessons, and my teacher told me that in order to achieve falsetto, I need to push larger amounts of air through. Is this the case? Also, do you think the shape of my mouth is causing the flatness in tone? Should the pallet be raised? What shape should the opening of the mouth be? Thanks.[/QUOTE]
Well not to go against your teacher but I wouldnt say that you need larger amounts of air to achieve a good falsetto. At least it doesnt need to feel that way. I think thats a misleading thing to say, if thats what they said. The shape of the mouth can cause flatness in vowels and in the case of E can actually change the vowel altogether. Its hard to talk about palet on the internet. And are you referring to flatness in your falsetto notes or in general? Keep the bottom jaw loose. Getting differences in tone is a hard subject without hearing a sample or knowing exactly what youre looking for. Have you discussed this idea with your teacher and do they agree you lack tone or something? If its falsetto, don't over push it. Theres a middle of the road where you can kinda back off and achieve good clarity and tone but it involves alot less push than most people think....unless youre training for some christ cornell type falsetto.

[QUOTE=Forlorn Hope]Me and a friend are trying to start singing, but we are having trouble figuring out how to sing from the "gut", or diaphragm instead of the throat. So, how do we sing from the "gut", and how will we know when we are doing it right?
Also, will singing from the gut make it easier to control pitch, and will it extend range any, compared to singing from the throat (which we know is not proper) Thanks.

EDIT: Also, my friend wants to know if there is any specific way to do Nile/Necrophagist vocals.[/QUOTE]
[URL="http://www.sputnikmusic.com/forums/showthread.php?t=219911"]Merkaba's Voicehelp Hotline[/URL]

Me and my bandmates have been practicing a lot lately, like every day... anyhow, lately I've been getting a whole lot more intense and putting more energy into my screaming than I ever have before... I haven't had any problems with pain in a long time and I think I sound better than I ever have before, but today I feel like I over-extended myself... in the sense that I almost passed out while practicing today, I'm not sure if it's related to how much I'm getting, "into it," or if I'm just really exhausted, but I'd like to know if after a while it should be so draining.

[quote=Eleventeen]Me and my bandmates have been practicing a lot lately, like every day... anyhow, lately I've been getting a whole lot more intense and putting more energy into my screaming than I ever have before... I haven't had any problems with pain in a long time and I think I sound better than I ever have before, but today I feel like I over-extended myself... in the sense that I almost passed out while practicing today, I'm not sure if it's related to how much I'm getting, "into it," or if I'm just really exhausted, but I'd like to know if after a while it should be so draining.[/quote]

When I first started doing harsh vocals, I would have dizzy and pass-out spells constantly. Now, while that is in part due to other health issues of mine, the major thing that your body is telling you is that [B]you are not getting enough oxygen to your brain.[/B][I] It is essential[/I] that you keep an even flow of air into your body....you have to remember to breathe evenly even when you are screaming.......

However, [B]do not [/B]go overboard....you'll end up hyperventilating, i.e., getting too much oxygen at once.......remember....even flow.

I normally don't have breathing troubles, but I guess I might be getting a little out of hand lately :p.

does anyone know of any online free video singing lessons?? i've recently been playing more acoustic and realized i wanna be able to sing and i realized i cant sing good.

hey merkaba...

here's what i sound like when i scream.. i don't know if i'm doing it right at all, or if it's any good... so if not then can you give me any tips, please?

[URL="http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=538625"]http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=538625[/URL]

thanks.

It kinda sounds like you're forcing it from the back of the throat dude...

[QUOTE=Toaster]I have two questions about screaming. When you clear your throat, making the "ahem" sound, if you sustain the "ahh", is that close to what it feels like to properly scream? And should it make me go very red in the face, to the point where I can feel the blood vessels in my face bulging, to hold screams for a long time or to scream very rapid-fire lines?

Thank you to anyone who replies.[/QUOTE]

Screaming is the same as growling (unless we're talking gutterals here, and those are inhaled), but higher pitched. It's all in the diaphragm. The air you push out with your diaphragm interacts with the tissue in your throat, not your actual vocal chords. It's alright if your throat is just a little irritated from all the air pasing through, but it shouldn't be too bad. If you're going horse, you're doing something wrong.

[QUOTE=Sever]Screaming is the same as growling (unless we're talking gutterals here, and those are inhaled), but higher pitched. It's all in the diaphragm. The air you push out with your diaphragm interacts with the tissue in your throat, not your actual vocal chords. It's alright if your throat is just a little irritated from all the air pasing through, but it shouldn't be too bad. If you're going horse, you're doing something wrong.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, I know this. The thing is, I recently learned that I am growling wrong, and I discovered this because I couldn't scream well using the same technique. I know you're supposed to use the diaphraghm.. but I don't really like this advice becuase you use the diaphragm when you sing, when you talk, even when you breathe. I've been trying to relearn my technique from scratch, and I just don't understand how you get from a exhaled breath to a harsh rasp without closing your throat. I can't find anything else that creates that sort of vibrating, rasping effect.

The most frustrating part is that I know how to properly "rasp" a note, and I'm a pretty fair singer. I just can't go from normal raspy pitched singing to thicker, more raspy growling.

Well try this if you haven't already: Consciously push a steady light stream of air out with your diaphragm while you quietly "ah." When you can do that, push the air out faster and harder. The increased quantity of air should make the "ah" sound more gargle-ier (if you know what I mean) and louder, without you having to manually increase the volume of your voice. If you can do this, you're golden.

Motorboat slides up and down.

Merkaba....


"it doesnt matter. Do what you can. Start off in your normal speaking range and try to sing notes in that range. That and the lip trills/motorboats to get your diaphragm working in coordination with your breath support and larynx. Basically you want to make your lips flutter like youre a kid making a motor sound. Now you do this on all vowels(ay,ee,ah,oh,uu,I) yes your mouth will be closed but still position your cords for the vowel and make it, keep your teeth together at first if you need to then work on doing them with your teeth far apart, mouth still closed..but you want to keep the lips fluttering with no breaks. They will increase and decrease with pitch, but you want them to be consistent. This is a very important exercise for a beginner. Mix it up and have fun with it but remember the feeling, so you can translate into regular notes."



are you supposed to say all the vowels in one breath while keeping your lips fluttering? or are you supposed to do them all in separate breaths holding one note? and the way that feels is how it should feel using your diaphragm? then what? Where do i go from there to learn to scream?

I just thought I'd throw in my two cents on the last question.

I don't believe vowel shapes can be produced that way. From what I have come to understand through study and my own voice, you really can't produce vowels with the cords, as all they do is is vibrate, get longer, and 'capo' at various lengths to become shorter and vibrate faster and faster. What the exercise he gave you will end up doing is good though; it'll teach you not to overexagerate to produce vowels. Your mouth will be closed, you'll be thinking the vowel and getting the proper amount of space. And all you REALLY need is that much space. A gaping jaw is usually just for effect or bad technique. And when it comes down to it, this exercise will not be effected by whether or not you do it all on one breath. Just as long as you are breathing in with your diaphragm, engaging the intercostal muscles to expand your ribcage, and pushing the hair out really really slowly, you will see gains in your ability to sustain notes.

Oooh, and on top of that, if you do that exercise without the lip trills, you can work on feeling out the position of the tongue when speaking certain vowels. You want to keep the tongue relaxed and down (not stiff, never stiffen anything up, ESPECIALLY the tongue as it'll constrict airflow in your mouth and pull your larynx up).

[QUOTE=Ryan983]Merkaba....


"it doesnt matter. Do what you can. Start off in your normal speaking range and try to sing notes in that range. That and the lip trills/motorboats to get your diaphragm working in coordination with your breath support and larynx. Basically you want to make your lips flutter like youre a kid making a motor sound. Now you do this on all vowels(ay,ee,ah,oh,uu,I) yes your mouth will be closed but still position your cords for the vowel and make it, keep your teeth together at first if you need to then work on doing them with your teeth far apart, mouth still closed..but you want to keep the lips fluttering with no breaks. They will increase and decrease with pitch, but you want them to be consistent. This is a very important exercise for a beginner. Mix it up and have fun with it but remember the feeling, so you can translate into regular notes."



are you supposed to say all the vowels in one breath while keeping your lips fluttering? or are you supposed to do them all in separate breaths holding one note? and the way that feels is how it should feel using your diaphragm? then what? Where do i go from there to learn to scream?[/QUOTE]
Seperate breaths, one note at a time. then you can start rising up in pitch. Or do whatever you like.
After you can hold a medium pitch lip trill for about ten to fifteen seconds you should be in touch with your diaphragm. You cant breather without it but learning to slowly release it and keep the tension on it is what holding long notes helps you do. After that, you need to start singing notes cleanly, with that same pressure, adding a bit more push/pressure from the gut, not the throat. (you can't push from the throat but you can tighten it up and close things off in order to feel added pressure which is what we mean here.That's A no-no) you should only be thinking about your gut and not your throat. Think about not feeling much going on in your throat...until you start adding rasp that is.

this has probably been asked thousands of time, but i cant be bothered to read through it all:rolleyes: .

can someone take me through the basics of singing (stance, head position etc) and little tricks which will help me improve. i mean, i sing every night for hours (accompanied by my guitar) but i dont seem to get any better, so can i have a little help please?:wave:

thank you for your time

A problem.
 

Okay, I already posted this problem to another forum, but the people there seem to be pretty quiet so I searched for a better music-forum and found this. :) (I love it already :p) *clears throat*


I have sang since I can only remember and it has always been my favourite doing/hobby/or whatever and I guess I used to be good at it. I could sing pretty high notes and stuff. I usually sang Christina Aguilera's, Celine Dion's or Britney Spears's songs. But then about 2 years ago a baby was born in our family and of course my mom had to stayn at home. I am very shy and afraid that someone will hear me singing and I've been "caught" singing a few times when I was little and I got so embarresed. <x) So, because I couldn't be home alone that much anymore, I couldn't sing so often. Then in the beginning of this year my mom went back to work and I could be home alone more often again. (Though not as much as I used to) I started to sing again [B]properly[/B] and GOD I SUCK! I mean, I can't hit the high notes anymore and I feel so sad. :( First I thought that I was just rusty and with some training I will get better again, but no change yet (well, maybe a small change). Will my voice get better anymore or will it just take so much time to get better? Or could it be because my voice has changed or something? (I'm now 15-years-old)

Any help/answers/or anything is very welcome and I would appreciate it very much if someone could replay to my post! :)
(Sorry if this has been posted earlier, I'm too lazy/busy to go through this whole thread.. <; ) )

[QUOTE=jonnyward]this has probably been asked thousands of time, but i cant be bothered to read through it all:rolleyes: .

can someone take me through the basics of singing (stance, head position etc) and little tricks which will help me improve. i mean, i sing every night for hours (accompanied by my guitar) but i dont seem to get any better, so can i have a little help please?:wave:

thank you for your time[/QUOTE]
yet you want others to be bothered to repeat it all?

[QUOTE=Elizabeth]Okay, I already posted this problem to another forum, but the people there seem to be pretty quiet so I searched for a better music-forum and found this. :) (I love it already :p) *clears throat*


I have sang since I can only remember and it has always been my favourite doing/hobby/or whatever and I guess I used to be good at it. I could sing pretty high notes and stuff. I usually sang Christina Aguilera's, Celine Dion's or Britney Spears's songs. But then about 2 years ago a baby was born in our family and of course my mom had to stayn at home. I am very shy and afraid that someone will hear me singing and I've been "caught" singing a few times when I was little and I got so embarresed. <x) So, because I couldn't be home alone that much anymore, I couldn't sing so often. Then in the beginning of this year my mom went back to work and I could be home alone more often again. (Though not as much as I used to) I started to sing again [B]properly[/B] and GOD I SUCK! I mean, I can't hit the high notes anymore and I feel so sad. :( First I thought that I was just rusty and with some training I will get better again, but no change yet (well, maybe a small change). Will my voice get better anymore or will it just take so much time to get better? Or could it be because my voice has changed or something? (I'm now 15-years-old)

Any help/answers/or anything is very welcome and I would appreciate it very much if someone could replay to my post! :)
(Sorry if this has been posted earlier, I'm too lazy/busy to go through this whole thread.. <; ) )[/QUOTE]
age is going to change your voice regardless, especially for young people and their range. If youre just now 15 expect it to change again possibly. Keep practicing and I'm sure you'll gain most back. The good thing is that the voice usually gets stronger as you age...to a certain point.

[QUOTE=Merkaba]age is going to change your voice regardless, especially for young people and their range. If youre just now 15 expect it to change again possibly. Keep practicing and I'm sure you'll gain most back. The good thing is that the voice usually gets stronger as you age...to a certain point.[/QUOTE]
Okay, thanks for your replay. :)

I've found that to be contradictory. Your voice mechanism will not get stronger if you abuse it through bad speaking and singing habits for years and years. Puberty will bring on thicker vocal folds (MOST of the time) for boys and girls, which will mean deeper voices. The thing is though, that you'll meet very few people who are not stigmatized by society into speaking lower (in the case of most men) or higher (in the case of most women). That alone will screw you up pretty bad. It's perfectly fine to sing notes, to conciously produce pitch, just not for the time a person will usually talk every day. All in all, age will only help you in one area aside from being able to achieve a lower range; the amount of time you have to practice. It's the same reason you don't see many 10 year old body builders, nor do you see many amazing singers at a young age (though there are a few exceptions, people mastering their voice/instrument by the age of 16-17 and such.).

Oh, and from what I know, there is no real limit on ANY human being with a healthy set of vocal folds' ability to hit notes unless you're talking about notes below a C2 or so. If you put the time and dedication into it and do it properly, your range will come back eventually. You said you were singing properly, though...That tends to have an effect on it. Singing is driven partially by emotion and when you are just 'singing' and not paying attention to it, you can sometimes go a wee bit higher. I recommend that you PRACTICE properly, but when you perform, let yourself go just a bit. Or better yet, a few teachers I know of integrate phrases and words into practice, have their students practice with the same passion that they'd have when performing, which generally makes the actual performance much easier.

I thought I'd add an example of what I described: Do you sing "I love you" the same as you'd speak about something bored? Do you sing "Hey!" as though you're trying to get someone's attention, or is it just 'coming out'? When practicing, try using phrases you can connect to. If you're REALLY mad one day, run "I hate you I wish that you'd die" through a major scale. FEEL angry, let it carry through, but don't scream it or yell it. Just try and relate singing with emotion just as much as you would with speech.

Another good example, that would be particularly useful for screaming, would be pain; when someone drops something on your toe or your slam your finger in the car door, do you utter an "Ouch!" as though you're Ben Stein and you didn't feel a thing, or do you yelp it out? Scream "Ouch!" to a scalar exercise and take a deep breath before each utterance.

Exercises like this will, in many cases, make you sound much more connected to what you're singing. Use any emotion and try and connect it with words. Or, easiest of all, pick a song you really, really feel, and sing with as much balls as the person who originally sang it did. That's oftentimes the biggest difference between a professional singer and an amateur; passion. You've gotta believe in what you're saying when you sing just as much as you would when you speak.

[QUOTE=Jomey Banurm]I've found that to be contradictory. Your voice mechanism will not get stronger if you abuse it through bad speaking and singing habits for years and years. Puberty will bring on thicker vocal folds (MOST of the time) for boys and girls, which will mean deeper voices. The thing is though, that you'll meet very few people who are not stigmatized by society into speaking lower (in the case of most men) or higher (in the case of most women). That alone will screw you up pretty bad. It's perfectly fine to sing notes, to conciously produce pitch, just not for the time a person will usually talk every day. All in all, age will only help you in one area aside from being able to achieve a lower range; the amount of time you have to practice. It's the same reason you don't see many 10 year old body builders, nor do you see many amazing singers at a young age (though there are a few exceptions, people mastering their voice/instrument by the age of 16-17 and such.).[/QUOTE]
Well of course if you add in abuse and bad habits over years. Thats not what I said. I was referring to someong being 15 years old. Youre not at your strongest anything at 15, except maybe facial oil secretion!

I'm very curious as to how you would describe vocal mechanism when you say there is no "real" limit to note production...especially full voice or even falsetto with resonance. If you dont have rooom to pull anymore, youre not going to produce a higher pitch.

The way I've been taught, the vocal cords stretch horizontally parallel to eachother until a certain point, as far as they should really be stretched, while the person is still in their chest voice. After this, they begin to vibrate only at about 3/4 of their length, then about 1/4 and then about 1/10, the pitch getting higher and higher as they switch how much is vibrating. So they go from vibrating the full length (which is 'round 3/4 of an inch for most men) to vibrating about the size of a needle. This means, generally, that any person, male or female, should be able to hit whistle notes all the way up to the 7th octave unless they have some abnormality that will prevent proper adduction and stretching of the vocal cords.

Now, whether this is in full voice or not is a matter of terminology. Do you classify full voice by resonant qualities or by what's physically going on? The latter would only attribute a full voice to 'belting', ie, stretching the cords farther than they should and not allowing them to zip up, which is oftentimes a bad, bad thing. But if you go by resonance...You can, though it takes years of serious work, take a light head voice up to make it sound as though it's being belted, and you can even make whistle notes come out with the same connection and bottom-end that you would hear in chest. Falsetto is another term that applies to different things when it comes to different people, but what I consider falsetto is a completely false use of the voice mechanism; ie, almost no pressure on the vocal cords, only getting them close enough so that passing air vibrates the folds. So it has a breathy, hissy, light, quiet, small sound. If you bring the cords together tighter and start adding in resonance from other places, you're going to be mixing and then eventually producing a full-voice tone.

[QUOTE=Merkaba]age is going to change your voice regardless, especially for young people and their range. If youre just now 15 expect it to change again possibly. Keep practicing and I'm sure you'll gain most back. The good thing is that the voice usually gets stronger as you age...to a certain point.[/QUOTE]
And hey btw, I forgot to mension one pretty important thing: during the sining-break I smoked for about 1,5 years. :S Could that be also why my voice is badder now..? I haven't smoked now for over 1,5 months except sometimes when I have been drinking, but not much.

Smoking and drinking are really, really bad for you. Your vocal cords (at least the parts that come together and buzz) are a thin mucus membrane. You're basically curing your vocal cords, removing moisture from them whenever you inhale cigarette or marijuana smoke. If the smoke is hot, that is even worse. Alcohol on the other hand will not usually make direct contact with your vocal cords, but will dehydrate your body. You piss a lot when you drink because your body has to filter more garbage out. So all that moisture is lost, and the first place you'll notice it is in the throat (and if you become very aware of it, you can actually feel your vocal cords being 'scratchy' when they connect as you swallow or speak/stop speaking).

One and a half years of smoking is probably not too bad. You'll likely be able to salvage yourself without too much effort. Just, if you want to sing, don't smoke heavily, or at all. You'll hear people talk about how they smoke because they're going to die anyway, but singing is one of those things that is going to suffer because of it; you're taking years off your ability to sing the longer you smoke, and the more you do it now, the longer it will take you to master your voice.

Actually I stopped smoking cuase I noticed my voice was getting bad.. Thanks you Jomey Banurm for your reply. :)