This thread is used for discussion of Hardcore/Metalcore/Similar Genre bands.

[QUOTE=PUNK181]anyone here like rancid,NOFX,thrice or the used[/QUOTE]

If you like Thrice, check out [URL=http://www.purevolume.com/underminded]Underminded[/URL]

[QUOTE=shane italian]**Decided to bring this into the Punk Forum. If it turns into a spam/agrument thread then close it as soon as possible. It's meant for education and actual discussion.


This is for those of you who throw around the the phrase hardcore far too often.

Metalcore is often mistaken for Hardcore on these boards. Here's the difference.

Hardcore is punk influenced music that sometimes has a heavier sound and sometime's doesn't. It sometimes have breakdowns and some don't, this depends more on the age of the band. Some are straight edge, some aren't. But most have honest sincere lyrics about issues that they themselves face.

Metalcore is obviously metal influenced and because they're of this there is more complexity in the writings of guitar, more noted riffs added to it than hardcore has.. Some say that it has punk influences...but that depends on what band you are talking about. Metalcore has a lot of breakdowns, most of which have the "JUN JUN JUN" sound which some double bass. Metalcore was a lot better a couple years ago before more and more band's started learning that you can tune into drop-C, use only thin picks, and get a drummer who knows his double bass.

Hardcore bands:
Blood For Blood, Chain Of Strength, American Nightmare, Death Threat, Judge, Gorilla Biscuits, 7 Seconds, Champion, Count Me Out, Carry On, Terror

Metalcore bands:
Hatebreed, 100 Demons, Bury Your Dead, Black My Heart, On Broken Wings, Hoods, North Side Kings, Walls Of Jericho, Clenched Fist

[B]MORE BY SK8SKANJ[/B]

Grindcore in its purest form consisted of short, apocalyptic blasts of noise played on standard heavy metal instrumentation (distorted guitar, bass, drums). Although grindcore wasn't just randomly improvised, it certainly didn't follow conventional structure, either; while riffs could sometimes be picked out, pure grindcore never featured verses, choruses, or even melodies. Grindcore vocals sounded torturous, ranging from high-pitched shrieks to low, throat-shredding growls and barks; although the lyrics were usually quite verbose, they were very rarely intelligible. Some bands in this catagory can also be known as Mathcore. Meaning they're more complex in the musical writings.

Grindcore bands:
Napalm Death, Dillinger Escape Plan, Death, Carcass, The Locust, The Tony Danza Tap Dance Extravaganza, **** and Ball Torture, Pig Destroyer, Agoraphobic Nosebleed...

Emo style has become broader over the years. In the beginning, these bands consisted mostly of people who played in hardcore punk bands, got burned out its limited forms, and moved to a guitar-oriented, midtempo rock-based sound with emotional punk vocals (i.e., no posed soulful crooning like pop music). The central aspect here is the guitars - distorted, strummed mostly in duo unison, with occasional catchy riff highlights. This becomes known as the classic "D.C. sound," along with the octave chords that show up in later "emo" music. Later bands bring in more pop elements, like catchy-riff based songs, pop song structures (listen to Jawbreaker's "Chesterfield King" to illustrate this), and less-punk, more-smoothly-sung high-register singing (less yelling, straining, throatiness). Listen to Elliot or Chamberlain for an example of how alternative-pop this music has become. Yet those bands are undeniably still emocore. Also note most emo bands play Gibson Les Paul guitars, with a few SGs, and use mostly Marshall JCM-800 amps...Emo has recently evolved into something more complex since the D.C. era. Bands have adopted to more obscure lyrics along with intricate riffs and interesting vocals.

Emo bands:
Rites of Spring, Embrace, Gray Matter, Ignition, Dag Nasty, Monsula, Fugazi kind of, Fuel, Samiam, Jawbreaker, Hot Water Music, Elliot, Friction, Soulside, early Lifetime, Split Lip/Chamberlain, Kerosene 454

Post-Hardcore
In the early-to-mid '80s, several bands in the United States came to life that were inspired by the do-it-yourself ethics and the cathartic, guitar-heavy material characterized by the hardcore punk bands that predated them. These newer bands, termed post-hardcore, often found complex and dynamic ways of blowing off steam that generally went outside the strict hardcore realm of "loud fast rules." These bands often used more than three chords and they also creatively built and released tension rather than airing their dirty laundry in short, sharp, frenetic bursts. Additionally, many of these bands' vocalists were just as likely to deliver their lyrics with a whispered croon as they were a maniacal yelp. Along with Hüsker Dü, Naked Raygun was one of the first U.S. post-punk bands of the early '80s that merged melodic influences with punk/hardcore. These were the first two bands (Husker and Naked Raygun) in 1981. With other bands in the Chicago scene such as the Effigies, Breaking Circus and Man Sized Action followed by later bands such as Fugazi, Quicksand, Dag Nasty and Mission Of Burma. Another important influence on many of these bands was U.K. post-punk from the late '70s and early '80s; Gang of Four, Public Image Limited, Joy Division, and Wire played a significant role in many of the bands' musical growth.[/QUOTE]


How about you idiots stop trying to put everything in a nice neat little box, and just listen to music. You pigeon hole everything. Its funny how this dudes definition of hardcore barely touches on the original hardcore bands. Do you really think the punks of the 70s and the hardcore kids in the 80s sat around deabating which genre to pigeon hole every band into? Are you kidding me? Anyone who talked like that would have gotten their *** kicked. The kids these days sit around debating how to classify every single band but back in the day no one cared about that. Are there any other punks in here in their mid 30s or so that agress with this that was actually around in the early 80s?

Well thats what we do here talk about music and specific genres. F'uck off fag.

[QUOTE=noneed66]F'uck off fag.[/QUOTE]
^^^

[QUOTE=noneed66]Well thats what we do here talk about music and specific genres. F'uck off fag.[/QUOTE]

Um...theres a difference between talking about music and pigeon holing everything you ignoramous. Being a moron you missed my point. First off I was stating the dude who made the original post left out the original hardcore bands out og his description of hardcore which I found odd, second this whole pigeon holing (emo, metalcore, street punk, d-beat, screamo) kind of crap never happened back then. No one sat around talking like that. Its retarded. What dont you get.

Face it, you need genre classification to make music work. Hardcore has evolved since the eighties and everyone acknowledges the orginal hardcore bands. But the fact is, hardcore has changed and in the process created various subgenres.

[QUOTE=punkforlife]Um...theres a difference between talking about music and pigeon holing everything you ignoramous.[/QUOTE]

Theres a difference between stating an opinion and being an as[SIZE=2]s[/SIZE]hole. You picked the less mature one. And to think, you say you are thirty?

[QUOTE=capri sun junkie]Theres a difference between stating an opinion and being an as[SIZE=2]s[/SIZE]hole. You picked the less mature one. And to think, you say you are thirty?[/QUOTE]

Actually I am 36. I stated a fact. No one used to sit around talking like that. It is the new breed that does that sh'it.

I think Glassjaw broke up officially. Their site is gone and the header at the top says RIP GlassjAw.

[QUOTE=punkforlife]Um...theres a difference between talking about music and pigeon holing everything you ignoramous. Being a moron you missed my point. First off I was stating the dude who made the original post left out the original hardcore bands out og his description of hardcore which I found odd, second this whole pigeon holing (emo, metalcore, street punk, d-beat, screamo) kind of crap never happened back then. No one sat around talking like that. Its retarded. What dont you get.[/QUOTE]


The reason kids in the early hardcore kids in the 80's didn't talk about:

Street Punk: Started with the Exploited in the UK, early hardcore started in the US, they probably didn't know about it.

Emo: Evolved from early hardcore, thus couldn't have even existed then.

Metalcore: Probably weren't any metalcore bands back then.

Screamo: No screamo back then.

D-Beat: Not a real genre?

f'uck off :rolleyes:

[url]http://www.trustkill.com/multimedia/videos/terror_overcome.html[/url]

New Terror Music Video.

[QUOTE=noneed66][url]http://www.trustkill.com/multimedia/videos/terror_overcome.html[/url]

New Terror Music Video.[/QUOTE]
That's a pretty sweet video. Good song too.

That's the video shoot I missed out on because I didn't have a ride to LA. Walls Of Jericho was there too.

[QUOTE=Skrunnch 3]The reason kids in the early hardcore kids in the 80's didn't talk about:

Street Punk: Started with the Exploited in the UK, early hardcore started in the US, they probably didn't know about it.

Emo: Evolved from early hardcore, thus couldn't have even existed then.

Metalcore: Probably weren't any metalcore bands back then.

Screamo: No screamo back then.

D-Beat: Not a real genre?

f'uck off :rolleyes:[/QUOTE]

You are a complete moron. The point I was making is that punks and hardcore kids in the early days didnt try to pigeon hole bands into tiny little safe compartments like they do today. I highly doubt you were around then. I was using examples of the genres you people pigeon hole bands into today - AS EXAMPLES. I understand these safe little compartments did not exist then. Instead you had different genres. In the early 80s you had the straight edge movement start popping up. The hardcore kids didnt sit around discussing which bands were and were not straight edge. The same kids who were going to see Black Flag sing about siz packs of beer were going to Minor Threat shows. In New York you had the experimental punk bands who were part of the NO-WAVE movement such as Teenage Jesus and The Jerks and The Contortions. The kids who were listening to them also were listening to bands like The Plugz and The Weirdos. There were plenty of sub genres then. They just had different names, and a different sound then the ones today. No one gave a **** then about this stuff. i wouldnt expect you to understand if YOU WERE NOT THERE.

This bro must have just seen "pigeon hole" on TV and is going hogwild with it.

Oh and, I touched on both newer and older hardcore bands FYI. Don't be such a little douche. It's the internet, I thought a 36 year old man would be able to get that...but I guess not.

:lol:

[QUOTE=punkforlife]You are a complete moron. The point I was making is that punks and hardcore kids in the early days didnt try to pigeon hole bands into tiny little safe compartments like they do today. I highly doubt you were around then. I was using examples of the genres you people pigeon hole bands into today - AS EXAMPLES. I understand these safe little compartments did not exist then. Instead you had different genres. In the early 80s you had the straight edge movement start popping up. The hardcore kids didnt sit around discussing which bands were and were not straight edge. The same kids who were going to see Black Flag sing about siz packs of beer were going to Minor Threat shows. In New York you had the experimental punk bands who were part of the NO-WAVE movement such as Teenage Jesus and The Jerks and The Contortions. The kids who were listening to them also were listening to bands like The Plugz and The Weirdos. There were plenty of sub genres then. They just had different names, and a different sound then the ones today. No one gave a **** then about this stuff. i wouldnt expect you to understand if YOU WERE NOT THERE.[/QUOTE]

I hear ya man - you are 100% correct. I am 38 myself and have been going to shows since 1980. These kids dont know a thing, and back in the day the younger punks respected older punks. These days the kids think they know it all, and half of them will be gone in a couple years so screw them. Punks back then didnt care about what genre a band was labeled. If these kids cant understand that then they are morons and scew them.

[QUOTE=shane italian]That's the video shoot I missed out on because I didn't have a ride to LA. Walls Of Jericho was there too.[/QUOTE]
Was it an open call for anyone to go?

I'd bet money that SPLATTER PUNX and punk for life are the same person.

[QUOTE=shane italian]Oh and, I touched on both newer and older hardcore bands FYI. Don't be such a little douche. It's the internet, I thought a 36 year old man would be able to get that...but I guess not.[/QUOTE]

...UM heres the bands you put:
Blood For Blood, Chain Of Strength, American Nightmare, Death Threat, Judge, Gorilla Biscuits, 7 Seconds, Champion, Count Me Out, Carry On, Terror


Now out of that list, I see only one (7 seconds) first wave 80s hardcore band. Now you tell me who else out of that list was playing prior to 1984 and was playing hardcore.

[QUOTE=noneed66]Was it an open call for anyone to go?[/QUOTE]Yep, it was free.

[QUOTE=40 oz 2 freedom]I'd bet money that SPLATTER PUNX and punk for life are the same person.[/QUOTE]

What are you talking about. Never met the guy. I was around then and so was he. I know what he is talking about.

[QUOTE=punkforlife]...UM heres the bands you put:
Blood For Blood, Chain Of Strength, American Nightmare, Death Threat, Judge, Gorilla Biscuits, 7 Seconds, Champion, Count Me Out, Carry On, Terror


Now out of that list, I see only one (7 seconds) first wave 80s hardcore band. Now you tell me who else out of that list was playing prior to 1984 and was playing hardcore.[/QUOTE]Judge and Gorilla biscuits helped build the hardcore scene...

Chain of Strength helped bring back the old school sound.
B4B were there when Boston was back on the map.

[QUOTE=punkforlife]...UM heres the bands you put:
Blood For Blood, Chain Of Strength, American Nightmare, Death Threat, Judge, [B]Gorilla Biscuits[/B], 7 Seconds, Champion, Count Me Out, Carry On, Terror


Now out of that list, I see only one (7 seconds) first wave 80s hardcore band. Now you tell me who else out of that list was playing prior to 1984 and was playing hardcore.[/QUOTE]
Gorilla Biscuits was also mentioned

[QUOTE=shane italian]Judge and Gorilla biscuits helped build the hardcore scene...

Chain of Strength helped bring back the old school sound.
B4B were there when Boston was back on the map.[/QUOTE]

If you consider Chain of Strength of Gorilla Biscuits a first wave hardcore band (meaning one of the pioneers of hardcore from the early pre 84 era) you are insane. Check your history. I remember when Gorilla Biscuits started playing around with Youth Of Today, No For An Answer, etc. they were not a band until 1987 or so. You really need to learn your history dude.

Im pretty sure he knows more about the history of hardcore than you...

[QUOTE=SPLATTER PUNX]If you consider Chain of Strength of Gorilla Biscuits a first wave hardcore band (meaning one of the pioneers of hardcore from the early pre 84 era) you are insane. Check your history. I remember when Gorilla Biscuits started playing around with Youth Of Today, No For An Answer, etc. they were not a band until 1987 or so. You really need to learn your history dude.[/QUOTE]I didn't say Chain of Strength helped start the scene. But GB and Judge both revolutionized hardcore and helped build the actual scene we have today. Black Flag and 7 Seconds just started playing a new form of punk.

And GB and Judge are around 88...4 years isn't a huge span of time man.

[QUOTE=SPLATTER PUNX]If you consider Chain of Strength of Gorilla Biscuits a first wave hardcore band (meaning one of the pioneers of hardcore from the early pre 84 era) you are insane. Check your history. I remember when Gorilla Biscuits started playing around with Youth Of Today, No For An Answer, etc. they were not a band until 1987 or so. You really need to learn your history dude.[/QUOTE]

why are you guys arguing about this crap? that shane posted like years ago? at the beginning of the thread!!!! yay, you guys were there when it started, you know everything about the history of hardcore and everything about the bands and we are all stupid little kids. hooray for you

[QUOTE=noneed66]Im pretty sure he knows more about the history of hardcore than you...[/QUOTE]

I dont think so dude. If you knew what you were talking about - pioneers of hardcore would be bands like Bad Brains who were playing hardcore music in 1979 - 1980 or a band like Middle Class who released probably the first true hadcore record ever made. I do not think you can consider 1987 or 1988 the beginnings of hardcore music.

Hardcore music was reborn with the likes of GB. As Shane has been telling you.

[QUOTE=noneed66]Hardcore music was reborn with the likes of GB. As Shane has been telling you.[/QUOTE]

The original argument by PunkForLife was that the guy did NOT post any classic (meaning pre 84) hardcore bands in his description - other than 7 seconds. Then the guy was trying to say that Gorilla Biscuits and Judge were pioneers of hardcore which is NOT the case. Did they help REVIVE the movement in the late 80s - YES. And I am aware of this. The two statements have nothing to do with each other.

[QUOTE=SPLATTER PUNX]The original argument by PunkForLife was that the guy did NOT post any classic (meaning pre 84) hardcore bands in his description - other than 7 seconds. Then the guy was trying to say that Gorilla Biscuits and Judge were pioneers of hardcore which is NOT the case. Did they help REVIVE the movement in the late 80s - YES. And I am aware of this. The two statements have nothing to do with each other.[/QUOTE]There wasn't an actual hardcore movement before 87-88. Bad Brains and 7 Seconds were just punk bands to the kids. And I never said GB were pioneers of hardcore...but they did start/open the scene up.

[QUOTE=shane italian]Judge and Gorilla biscuits helped build the hardcore scene...

Chain of Strength helped bring back the old school sound.
B4B were there when Boston was back on the map.[/QUOTE]

No where in there did he say Judge and GB pioneered hardcore.

[QUOTE=shane italian]There wasn't an actual hardcore movement before 87-88. Bad Brains and 7 Seconds were just punk bands to the kids. And I never said GB were pioneers of hardcore...but they did start/open the scene up.[/QUOTE]

WHAT?????Are you smoking crack? There was no hardcore movement in the early 80s????Oh my god... You dont think SSD, Minor Threat, Jerrys Kids, Poison Idea, Wasted Youth were hardcore bands???? Are you an imbecile? What about Negative Approach - were they not a hardcore band?????

[QUOTE=SPLATTER PUNX]WHAT?????Are you smoking crack? There was no hardcore movement in the early 80s????Oh my god... You dont think SSD, Minor Threat, Jerrys Kids, Poison Idea, Wasted Youth were hardcore bands???? Are you an imbecile? What about Negative Approach - were they not a hardcore band?????[/QUOTE]

He didn't say there were no hardcore bands in the early 80's, he said that there wasn't the kind of hardcore movement in the early 80's as there was in the late 80's

Early 80's hardcore was so much different than late 80's.

[QUOTE=SPLATTER PUNX]WHAT?????Are you smoking crack? There was no hardcore movement in the early 80s????Oh my god... You dont think SSD, Minor Threat, Jerrys Kids, Poison Idea, Wasted Youth were hardcore bands???? Are you an imbecile? What about Negative Approach - were they not a hardcore band?????[/QUOTE]Take some English Comprehension class...you need it.

Kids in the early 80s didn't exactly go around saying "Hey, I'm going to a rad hardcore show tonight" when they talked about Minor Threat. Just as people didn't refer to Moss Icon as an emo band when they were starting up.

Early 80's was more punkish.