[QUOTE=Brewer14]Im taking a jazz improv class this year, and while trying to get prepared for it, I came across this site. Its really helpful for playing jazz, and learning theory.

[url]http://www.outsideshore.com/primer/primer/[/url][/QUOTE]

Ah man beaten to it. I was just about to post that as well. That is a very helpful site. Full of theory, history and improv lessons as well.

Does anyone know where I can find some good backing tracks for jazz ,and some rock/blues

The Jamey Aebersold series is very good and has backing tracks for a lot of standards. You might want to check those out.

is there a chance thats on soulseek

suppose I played Cm7-F7-G9-Amb5
could I play C Dorian-F Mixolydian-G Mixolydian-A Locrian


but this would this be technically
Bb Ionian with emphasis on Cm chord tones
Bb Ionian with emphasis on F7 chord tones
C Ionian with emphasis on G chord tones
and A# Ionian with emphasis on Amb5 chord tones

or I could I also play Cm Penta- F Blues- G Penta- A Locrian

^It's best not to look at a chord and think "corresponding mode"...

You should first look at chord tones.

C Dorian is good for any ii-V change (in this case, Cm7-F7). However, you should concentrate more on changing your C Dorian to a Dorian-related chord outline and include other notes more as passing tones. You should also include various chromatics... altered tones... whatever. But if you want to retain the idea of Dorian, include Cm7 as well as A (6) and Gb (b5) and also F (4). So it will be more Dorian-sounding than anything else (at least it's easier to gain a Dorian sound).

But playing A Locrian over Am7b5 isn't a sure bet, surprisingly. Your efficeincy in outlining chord tones is compromised, and the sounds left for that scale to deliver are more Bb Ionian than A Locrian, IMO.

The fact of the matter is, if you just play a series of modes that are all relative to eachother (the only non relative mode is G7), then your playing will be less involved, and sound more like you're just playing Bb Ionian (minus the G Mixolydian).

I'm not trying to say that you must move in this way with the chords without fail... I don't do that at all in my playing... but you're obviously going on a chord outlining flight, so you may as well do it more efficiently.

Also, B Ionian is not C Dorian. You should disasociate modes with the corresponding major scale. However, if you play a series of relative modes, it will sound more like the relative Ionian than anything.

Over that G9, you have a ton of options... I'd work around the coressponding arpeggio as well as G Dorian.

But, for the Cm7-F7 bit, I'd do something like this: Over Cm7, try an Ebmaj7 idea. And over F7, try an Emaj7 idea that's identical to the Ebmaj7 idea, but a half step up. This delivers the Aeolian, then Altered sound. If you were to resolve to a Bb instead of G9, you might also try the original Ebmaj7 idea, but for Fmaj7 instead, to deliver a Lydian feel.

thanks ill try some of those ideas

What would be the best scale to use over 13th and 9th chords?

I got a question. I been looking for standards to learn and the problem i've encountered is that they all seem to have too many chords or too little for my purposes. Dave Brubeck's Take 5 is a good example. Cool song but no real sense of chords changing to play with. At the other extreme is I got rhythm where you change chord about 40 times before you reach the end and I can't memorize all that. Any solutions to my problem, or just examples of standards with less changes will be much appreciated.

[QUOTE=ColdShotStrat]What would be the best scale to use over 13th and 9th chords?[/QUOTE]
a 9th is a 2nd, and a 13th is a 6th, so anything that would display the correct 13th, and the correct 9th. if it says C major 9, play a C major 7arpeggio and include the 9th in it. the C major scale is the best bet over that chord. if its b9, most likely its going to be C7b9 and your best bet would be the spanish phrygian. if it says #9 you're going to play you're most likely going to play a Lydian #9 meaning the chord is a C major #9. just add the correct 9th on to the triad you already play over a major chord. same with 13ths, C13 is a domiant chord with all the scale degrees of C dominant, C major 13 is a major chord with a major 13th added. hope that helps

[QUOTE=Tarquin1986]I got a question. I been looking for standards to learn and the problem i've encountered is that they all seem to have too many chords or too little for my purposes. Dave Brubeck's Take 5 is a good example. Cool song but no real sense of chords changing to play with. At the other extreme is I got rhythm where you change chord about 40 times before you reach the end and I can't memorize all that. Any solutions to my problem, or just examples of standards with less changes will be much appreciated.[/QUOTE]
i have this same problem, i'm just now learning how to get out of it. You cant recognize chords individualy, you have to look at the context of the chord. In jazz there are a tone of 2,5,1's, if you can rocognize these patturns you can describe an entire song to your self by only using scale degrees. a 2,5,1 in the key of C is a Dmin7, G7, Cmaj. any minor chord folowed by a dominant chord a 4th away is a 2-5 even if it dosent conclude into the right chord. so now that we've established that we're in C maj let think of it like this.

2-5 into C, 6 dom ,2-5 of 1 into 3,2-5 into 2, 2-5 into C.
that is 13 chord, but how much easier is that than to remember each individual chord.

Thanks, I'll try that.

when is anybody gonna figure out that posting this **** isn't helping anyone and it's only creating an "i know more than you" competition? posting one simple scale suggestion for a chord doesn't help anyone. it just adds more confusion. that person will not be able to get away from that one scale when he/she sees that one chord now.

my suggestion, stop giving your "lessons" and leave the teaching to the professionals - or to someone that knows what they're talking about, not what they picked up one day in theory class.

of course, simple questions and answers are ok, but the other stuff is just a bunch of cocky bull****.

i just thought i'd add that C.O. sullivan knows what he's talkin about :thumb: don't think chord=scale.

[QUOTE=Saxamassima3]

my suggestion, stop giving your "lessons" and leave the teaching to the professionals - or to someone that knows what they're talking about, not what they picked up one day in theory class.[/QUOTE]


I thought that was what the thread was for, to give tips. Obviously there are very few professionals on these message boards, so I think everyone should be free to post what they know.

[QUOTE=ColdShotStrat]What would be the best scale to use over 13th and 9th chords?[/QUOTE]

They're just dominant chords, in essence... so you have countless options. First, you should look at what a dominant chord is--

Dominant chords in basic non-jazz theory are generally meant to be used in a "tension/resolution" context. This means that a G7 is most logically followed by a C major chord. However, in jazz, dominant chords are used for many reasons. They're commonly used as the I, IV, V, and VI chords (that is, in the key of C, that C F, G, and A would be C7, F7, G7, and A7, usually). In jazz, dominant chords also work as substitutes for minor chords. At other times, they are used for tritone substitution. Also, they are used for the tension/resolution idea... you might have G7 #9 #5 lead into Cm7, a harmonic minor movement. So basically, dominant chords are used in many contexts in jazz.

Now, if you're using, say, G13 in the key of C, then you could use G Dorian ideas, G Mixolydian, C# Lydian Dominant (Melodic tritone substitution), as well as altered scale ideas.

The key to soloing while following harmonic form is to have a good idea of what notes work consistently... this would be the corresponding mode, chord tones, etc... so you'd work around those in the beginning. Then you could consider other things like the altered scale... and creating ideas.

For example, if you have G7 followed by Cm7, you could play Abm7 tones followed by Db7 tones over the G7 chord. So melodic substitutions should be considered.

Just some things to look at.

Im really having trouble memorizing all the notes on the fret board and it seems when i get into an improvising situation i cant remember where notes are and when i do im already a few bars behind and it sounds bad. So I was wondering if anyone had any ways they could tell me on how they got used to improvising and thinking about the notes at the same time easily and also how did they memorize the notes on the fretboard.

[QUOTE=ColdShotStrat]Im really having trouble memorizing all the notes on the fret board and it seems when i get into an improvising situation i cant remember where notes are and when i do im already a few bars behind and it sounds bad. So I was wondering if anyone had any ways they could tell me on how they got used to improvising and thinking about the notes at the same time easily and also how did they memorize the notes on the fretboard.[/QUOTE]


that just takes work, memorizing the notes. in time you will know them anyways if you just keep playing in that setting.

but as far as improvising and knowing the notes- learn your scales and say them aloud.

but if you just keep playing it becomes second nature. so give it some time i guess.

Nicee

Heres a question---

Does anyone know of any theory books that take you all the way from baby steps to the most complex stuff and every detail in between?

play metal lol jazz is boring

[QUOTE=the untolf]play metal lol jazz is boring[/QUOTE]

Leave.

[QUOTE]play metal lol jazz is boring[/QUOTE]lol mate dont worry we already know your queer.

hello could someone give a list of jazz chords

E7sharp9, dunno if theres any others













theres friggin millions.

[url]http://www.apassion4jazz.net/chords.html[/url]

The basics with no alterations (#9, b5, etc.)

Soprano Sax Theory
 

I played soprano sax in college. Recently decided to revisit the soprano sax and purchased one a couple months ago - and have been getting used to the horn (as well as allowing the horn to get used to me ;-). Although I put down the sax for years I have been playing the C Flute non-stop. I have rediscovered the transposition factor between C and B flat instruments in this process.

Do you know of a resource that can help me find theory notes and sheet music for this B flat instrument?

Thanks!

can someone explain tritone substitution and give an example of a song or make a few bars that use it

II-V-I variations?
 

In Jazz the most utilized chord progression is the II-V-I, usually incorporating the Minor-Dominant-Major format. My question is can there be any variations to this rule?

[QUOTE=badasspanda]In Jazz the most utilized chord progression is the II-V-I, usually incorporating the Minor-Dominant-Major format. My question is can there be any variations to this rule?[/QUOTE]


What do you mean by "rule"? You definitely can mix up the II-V-I, it doesn't have to be minor-dominant-major, though that is the most common. A minor II-V-I usually looks like half-diminished-dominant(b9)-minor(major7). You can pretty much do whatever you want, though.

[QUOTE=dhelix33]I played soprano sax in college. Recently decided to revisit the soprano sax and purchased one a couple months ago - and have been getting used to the horn (as well as allowing the horn to get used to me ;-). Although I put down the sax for years I have been playing the C Flute non-stop. I have rediscovered the transposition factor between C and B flat instruments in this process.

Do you know of a resource that can help me find theory notes and sheet music for this B flat instrument?

Thanks![/QUOTE]
You know, B flat isn't a note for horn players, it's a way of life ;).

/I love you Austin.

hey guys im fairly new to this. ive been playing bass for bout a yr and a half, i had a great teacher who taught me a bunch of jaco pastorius, red hot chili peppers n such. im playing bass in a jazz band for school, so im studying the proper approach to jazz bass as well as taking music theory courses in high school. i understood most of the stuff thats in here, n i have to say i appreciate the info. i was wondering, does ne1 suggest any drills so i can better my playing?

thanks

[QUOTE=Zoroaster]Spastic:


I'm sorry to have to burst your bubble, but your grasp of music theory is as primitive as a rock. You fail to even touch upon the surface of enharmonic intervals; an imperative in jazz, and how it can be interrelated with tritone substitution. I suggest that you comprehend musical theory in its entirety beforehand you elevate yourself to the status of "Theory Guru".

P.S:
I have listened to your 'compositions' and I can only designate them with the term: pretentious. Your music is solely comprised of incoherent and dampening injections whose singular purpose is to impress upon the audience a sense of superiority. That, sir, is the mark of failure.[/QUOTE]

chill out...

[QUOTE=the untolf]play metal lol jazz is boring[/QUOTE]

*sigh*

What scale degrees are the best for tension and release? I know the tonic and dominant notes are best for release but I often end up abusing them and then my phrases start to sound boring. So which notes are the best to build the tension and which will give me the highest tension? So i guess im asking for a chart in a way of the scale degrees starting from least the ones that will give the least tension up to the notes that will create the most.

[QUOTE=pkwiatek0222]hey guys im fairly new to this. ive been playing bass for bout a yr and a half, i had a great teacher who taught me a bunch of jaco pastorius, red hot chili peppers n such. im playing bass in a jazz band for school, so im studying the proper approach to jazz bass as well as taking music theory courses in high school. i understood most of the stuff thats in here, n i have to say i appreciate the info. i was wondering, does ne1 suggest any drills so i can better my playing?

thanks[/QUOTE]

hmmm not sure what you mean by 'drills'.. but meh...

some technical work that has helped me alot in many areas of my jazz playing includes..

-playing chord arpeggios and scales over 2 or more octaves ascending and descending. it helps to get out of that trap that most bass players fall into by just playing within a 'pattern'... this exercise will help you learn the fingerboard so that your improv and walking walking bass is alot more interesting.

-for rhythm and timing, practice playing scales/arpeggios/licks/whatever VERY slowly with a metronone or drum machine (60bpm or less). most people can play competently at mid-tempo, and most can bluff quite well at high speeds, but its quite hard to get your playing absolutley on time when your playing at 35 bpm. working at this skill will improve your ability to anticipate where the beat will fall at 'normal' speeds. in jazz, and especially walking bass it is great to be able to play SLIGHTLY after the beat (not faster, just place the note differntly) toi create that 'driving' feeling you need from walking bass. timing is one of the most inportant aspects of jazz bass.

-ummm im getting bored of writing and ill come back to this later.

[QUOTE=pkwiatek0222]hey guys im fairly new to this. ive been playing bass for bout a yr and a half, i had a great teacher who taught me a bunch of jaco pastorius, red hot chili peppers n such. im playing bass in a jazz band for school, so im studying the proper approach to jazz bass as well as taking music theory courses in high school. i understood most of the stuff thats in here, n i have to say i appreciate the info. i was wondering, does ne1 suggest any drills so i can better my playing?

thanks[/QUOTE]

I have one that I use on my upright. I play the G major scale (starting on open G going all the way up on the G string), putting two open D's and an open A between each degree of the scale, and 1 D after. The excercise is in 3/4, each note being an eight note. The D's land on every upbeat, and each degree of the scale lands on 1 and 3.

1 and 2 and 3 and 1 and 2 and 3 and 1 and 2 and 3 and
G D A D G D A D A D A D B D A D B D
0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 1 0 2 0 0 0 2 0

This greatly improved my right hand, thus improving my tone and chops tremendously. I know I didn't explain it very well, but it's a great exercise. It can be used for upright or electric.

EDIT: Goddam it, it isn't lining up right. Ah well, each consecutive beat correspnds to each consecutive note and fingering.

[QUOTE=ani_starkiller]chill out...[/QUOTE]

:lol:

That post was like two years old. I think he's chilled out by now...

hey... i just registerd!! oh guess what!!! i was looking forward to having a flute lesson today (cos i was gonna get some new music off my teacher, beside the fact i had a truely horrible art CRT teaching us at the same time...) and i went there and my Flute teacher was on some camp!! *grrr* so i had to go back to class and the CRT was sooooo mean!!! *double grr!* and i neva ended up getin more music!! :(

anyway, there was a point!! does anyone know where i can find some good flute music that it sort of jazzy??

that is not tooo expensive anways