For all those who said Metallica wasn't one of the best bands ever, in I think it was '89 Metallica toured supporting Ozzy Osbourne, and people were going to see them, because they were better. If you don't believe me it's on Binge and Purge.

They got MTV Icon. Kirk Hammett was named number 11 on the Rolling Stones top 100 guitarists. There are 3 of their solos in the Top 100 greatest solos, including One which is number 7.

They played in stadiums in front of over 50,000 fans. The Black Album, which was released in '91 still sells at least 1 million copies a year. They're still going strong after over 20 years and 5 lineup changes.

Many artists said that a Metallica album changed their life in this years Holiday Edition of Guitar World magazine.

Now I'm not saying they're the best, who can say who the best band truly is, but to say that they're not even any good, you've got to be ****ing joking.

1.Yes, Metallica is one of the best bands around.
2.No, they aren't the best heavy metal/thrash or general band in the world.
3.They are freaking overrated.
4.Technically Jason and Rob owns Cliff, but musically don't (at least on Metallica)
5. Marty Friedman is way better than Kirk, Dave Mustaine is also better.
6.I said Harris was overrated, not that he was worse than Cliff.
7.Rolling Stone's list are crap.
8. Metallica Haters are as stupid as fanboys.

But I still love Metallica, and they are probably my favorite band.

Hey guys can someone here with guitar pro lend me hand. I' learning Orion. I'm on this riff:
|---------------------------------|
|---------------------------------|
|--------2----------4----------5--|
|--------2----------4----------5--|
|--------0----------2----------3--|
|0--0-0----0-0-0-0----0-0-0-0----|

You know the one? Well, when I'm playing along with it, I can play that part i just tabbed, but the 0-0-0-0-0-0-1-0-0-0-0 or whatever it is after it, I just don't get. The tab of orion I got from MSB, I dunno, its wrong because when I try it it doesn't sound write. can anyone upload a small gp4 file of that riff? It would be much appretiated <3

[QUOTE=blackthorne]dont wanna sound like a dumbass but whats UG?[/QUOTE]Ultimate Guitar

[QUOTE=vashts80]

You're obviously deaf then, since Cliff wasn't Metallica's best.
[/QUOTE]
Can't you comprehend the idea of opinions?

[QUOTE=blackthorne]dont wanna sound like a dumbass but whats UG?[/QUOTE]
its Ultimate guitar

[url]http://www.ultimate-guitar.com[/url]
Crappy forums good tabs.

[QUOTE=vashts80]Mustaine [i]is[/i] better than Wylde. Pinch harmonics and a wah pedal doesn't make somebody good.[/QUOTE]

And mustaine is better because you like him more? Sorry, but Zakk destroys mustaine easily. But as always, there is no best in guitarists, especially when both kick ***, so yes, that is obviously my opinion.

[QUOTE=vashts80]Metallica isn't anywhere near on of the best bands ever, not in metal, nor in any genre. Death? Pink Floyd? Yes? Rush? King Crimson? etc etc?[/QUOTE]

It's all opinion, I don't see why you guys are even arguing. THERE IS NO BEST BAND and THERE WILL NEVER BE ONE. Unless you're looking at from technicality point of view which is true, but really doesn't mean anything.

[QUOTE=vashts80]You're obviously deaf then, since Cliff wasn't Metallica's best.[/QUOTE]

So load and reload are better than RTL and MoP? Ok, whatever you say. lol

[QUOTE=vashts80]Jason never got the chance to write anything. It's been well d0cumented that they didn't let him write jack until Load/Reload, besides My Friend of Misery (which he didn't even get writing credits for, iirc) and Blackened.[/QUOTE]

Why didn't he write something amazing during load/reload? Those just accidently happen to be metallica's worse albums. When Jason left, they made better metrial without him. St Anger > load/reload. Besides, if he wrote anything spectacular, do you really think they would just ignore great work and not use it? I don't think so.

[QUOTE=vashts80]Jason is better than Cliff. Tr00f. It's a fact that Jason was a better [b]bass player[/b] than Cliff was. People can't distinguish between being a good [b]bass player[/b] and being a good [b]songwriter.[/b] Roger Waters was an amazing songwriter, but that doesn't mean he was a good bassist.[/QUOTE]

Again, good bassists are supposed to be good composers. Unless you're going on technicality again, which still and will never mean anything. Playing good sounding basslines > playing bad sounding technical basslines. Afterall, most people listen because it sounds good, not cause it's technical.

Just give up, Cliff would easily destroy Jason if he was still alive. Cliff during 80s was better than Jason right now.

[QUOTE=Happy]Can't you comprehend the idea of opinions?[/QUOTE]

Last time when we argued, we have decided that he doesn't understand what opinion is.

[QUOTE=PepsiMetal]And mustaine is better because you like him more? Sorry, but Zakk destroys mustaine easily. But as always, there is no best in guitarists, especially when both kick ***, so yes, that is obviously my opinion.[/quote]
Opinions can be wrong. And no, Mustaine isn't better because I like him more; Mustaine is better because he's written better songs, both from a technical point of view and from a "listening" point of view.



[quote]It's all opinion, I don't see why you guys are even arguing. THERE IS NO BEST BAND and THERE WILL NEVER BE ONE. Unless you're looking at from technicality point of view which is true, but really doesn't mean anything.[/quote]
The best band ever is Pink Floyd. Tr00f.


[quote]So load and reload are better than RTL and MoP? Ok, whatever you say. lol[/quote]
You're missing my point: Cliff's BASSLINES were not anything more than average. On the other hand, Jason's BASSLINES, in Metallica, weren't much better than Cliffs. But they were better. They stood out more. They did more.


[quote]Why didn't he write something amazing during load/reload? Those just accidently happen to be metallica's worse albums. When Jason left, they made better metrial without him. St Anger > load/reload. Besides, if he wrote anything spectacular, do you really think they would just ignore great work and not use it? I don't think so. [/quote]
Since opinions are so subjective, Load and Reload aren't Metallica's worst. And better material? Hardly. I like St. Anger just as much as Master of Puppets, however the songs on St. Anger drag along.
Why didn't he write something amazing during Load/Reload? I'm not psychic, I wouldn't know.

[quote]Again, good bassists are supposed to be good composers. Unless you're going on technicality again, which still and will never mean anything. Playing good sounding basslines > playing bad sounding technical basslines. Afterall, most people listen because it sounds good, not cause it's technical.

Just give up, Cliff would easily destroy Jason if he was still alive. Cliff during 80s was better than Jason right now.[/quote]
Cliff during the 80s, as a songwriter, was just slightly better than Jason. As a [b]bass player[/b], Jason easliy destroyed him. You'll never know what Cliff could have been, because he's dead. He could have left Metallica after the Puppets tour and become a homeless drunk, for all you know.

As far as good sounding basslines > bad sounding technical basslines, listen to some Necrophagist or some Death or Atheist or Cynic or even Jaco Pastorius. Thanks.


[quote]Last time when we argued, we have decided that he doesn't understand what opinion is.[/QUOTE]
I perfectly understand what opinion is. That's why I choose to argue mine, which comes mostly from facts. Your opinions, however, are wrong, simply because they aren't correct.

Saying Cliff Burton was better than Rob Trujillo or Jason Newsted is like saying Mark Hoppus is better than Jaco Pastorius was, or better than Marcus Miller is. Saying Kirk Hammett is better than Dave Mustaine is like saying that Travis Barker is better than Gene Hoglan. It makes no sense, because it's wrong.

[QUOTE=.:Thrasher:.]teach me oh great master[/QUOTE]
master of puppetz hes pullin ur strngs lol

[QUOTE=Apocalyptic Raids]master of puppetz hes pullin ur strngs lol[/QUOTE]
Twisting your mind and Smashing your dreams!

Hey guys, I know this isn't allowed, but I need to show this. I just made a new forum. I'd like some new members, so if anyone's interested, have a look

[url]http://www.entertainmentsource.cjb.net[/url]

[QUOTE=Animosity]Hey guys, I know this isn't allowed, but I need to show this. I just made a new forum. I'd like some new members, so if anyone's interested, have a look

[url]http://www.entertainmentsource.cjb.net[/url][/QUOTE]
but isn't it just MX?

Edit - I'll join if I can be a Mod.

[QUOTE=vashts80]Opinions can be wrong. And no, Mustaine isn't better because I like him more; Mustaine is better because he's written better songs, both from a technical point of view and from a "listening" point of view.[/QUOTE]

"Listening" point of view is what you think sounds best. Which is an opinion. And opinions aren't wrong or right. They're basically what you like/think is best/worse.

[QUOTE=vashts80]You're missing my point: Cliff's BASSLINES were not anything more than average. On the other hand, Jason's BASSLINES, in Metallica, weren't much better than Cliffs. But they were better. They stood out more. They did more.[/QUOTE]

They were better at what? Technicality? How they sound? Speed? I mean what were they better at? If it's how they sound, then again, this CAN'T be used as a fact. Because one person will like one better and other will like other.

[QUOTE=vashts80]As far as good sounding basslines > bad sounding technical basslines, listen to some Necrophagist or some Death or Atheist or Cynic or even Jaco Pastorius. Thanks.[/QUOTE]

Are you trying to say that some bands have better basslines than metallica? As I never said such thing doesn't exist.

[QUOTE=vashts80]I perfectly understand what opinion is. That's why I choose to argue mine, which comes mostly from facts. Your opinions, however, are wrong, simply because they aren't correct.[/QUOTE]

Opinions about which bassist sounds better can't be TRUE or FALSE. That's why it's opinion. Ask millions of people that think britney spears is best musician. You can't come and tell them iron maiden [B]sounds[/B] better, because it obviously doesn't for them. So you don't seem to understand this.

[QUOTE=vashts80]Saying Cliff Burton was better than Rob Trujillo or Jason Newsted is like saying Mark Hoppus is better than Jaco Pastorius was, or better than Marcus Miller is. Saying Kirk Hammett is better than Dave Mustaine is like saying that Travis Barker is better than Gene Hoglan. It makes no sense, because it's wrong.[/QUOTE]

Again, sounding wise, there is no right or wrong because it depends on every individual and their music taste. Technicality, speed, or other things like that can be right or wrong because obviously we humans can listen to 2 songs and hear which one is faster and which one is slower. The speed will remain same to all humans. Is doom metal faster than speed metal to anyone? No. Can doom metal be better than speed metal? Yes, because some people prefer that type of music. That's is OPINION and different music taste than you.

[QUOTE=Doctor Night]but isn't it just MX?

Edit - I'll join if I can be a Mod.[/QUOTE]
If you stick around and contribute, once I get around to making mods than yeh, I'll porbably mod you.

[QUOTE=Animosity]If you stick around and contribute, once I get around to making mods than yeh, I'll porbably mod you.[/QUOTE]
I've put forward my 'resume'

[QUOTE=PepsiMetal]"Listening" point of view is what you think sounds best. Which is an opinion. And opinions aren't wrong or right. They're basically what you like/think is best/worse. [/quote]
Opinions can most certainly be right and wrong.


[quote]They were better at what? Technicality? How they sound? Speed? I mean what were they better at? If it's how they sound, then again, this CAN'T be used as a fact. Because one person will like one better and other will like other. [/quote]
From what I remember of most of the basslines, they stood out more, and the ones that didn't stand out meshed with the drums better, providing an actual rhythm section, something that was sorely missing during the Burton-era because he was trying to be a guitar player on a 4 string bass.



[quote]Are you trying to say that some bands have better basslines than metallica? As I never said such thing doesn't exist. [/quote]
Once again, misunderstandings are the best thing in the world. You said, and I quote, "Playing good sounding basslines > playing bad sounding technical basslines. Afterall, most people listen because it sounds good, not cause it's technical."

What I was implying by listing those bands is that they have very technical, good sounding basslines.



[quote]Opinions about which bassist sounds better can't be TRUE or FALSE. That's why it's opinion. Ask millions of people that think britney spears is best musician. You can't come and tell them iron maiden [B]sounds[/B] better, because it obviously doesn't for them. So you don't seem to understand this.[/quote]
I can tell them that they're horrendously wrong, and that Britney Spears doesn't play any instruments other than her voice, thereby making her not the best musician in the world, because they are many other vocalists that are better on a technical basis, not to mention there are many other musicians who play guitar and vocals, or bass and vocals, or even drums and vocals (Chris Reifert)



[quote]Again, sounding wise, there is no right or wrong because it depends on every individual and their music taste. Technicality, speed, or other things like that can be right or wrong because obviously we humans can listen to 2 songs and hear which one is faster and which one is slower. The speed will remain same to all humans. Is doom metal faster than speed metal to anyone? No. Can doom metal be better than speed metal? Yes, because some people prefer that type of music. That's is OPINION and different music taste than you.[/QUOTE]
I'm not arguing that.

People seem to misinterpret what I'm saying.

There are certain facts, such as:

Dave Mustaine and/or Marty Friedman, in Megadeth, are better guitar players than Kirk Hammett, in Metallica.

Jason Newsted, in Metallica, was a better [b]bass player[/b], than Cliff Burton was, in Metallica.

Gene Hoglan, in Death, was a better drummer than Lars Ulrich is, in Metallica.

You cannot change facts, folks. The facts are, that as a bassplayer, Jason Newsted is better than Cliff Burton was. You're not going to change that fact.

Metallica is a pretentious, 1 dimensional band that could only cohesively make such an impact in America...thats about it.

[QUOTE=SugarCoatedSour]Metallica is a pretentious, 1 dimensional band that could only cohesively make such an impact in America...thats about it.[/QUOTE]
Man, don't do that, heh.

As much as I can't stand Metallica fanboys, at least give the thread the respect to not come in and flame them

[QUOTE=Doctor Night]Twisting your mind and Smashing your dreams![/QUOTE]

Blinded by me you cant see a thing

did anyone reliase that when Jason joined they did one metal album(AJFA) because Cliff had some of his stuff on it. then they did rock(load/reload). then when he left they turned metal

It's a coincidence, since Jason was, well, the main songwriter in a thrash metal band.

[QUOTE=vashts80]Man, don't do that, heh.

As much as I can't stand Metallica fanboys, at least give the thread the respect to not come in and flame them[/QUOTE]

respect peoples FUKING opinions

What was that in reply to, me telling SugarCoatedSour to not flame the thread?

[QUOTE=vashts80]It's a coincidence, since Jason was, well, the main songwriter in a thrash metal band.[/QUOTE]

are you refering to Metallica or the band he used to be in?

I dont think its coincidence

I'm referring to Flotsam and Jetsam, the band he was in before he joined Metallica. The band he wrote 80% of their first album alone, which is pure thrash. It's a coincidence. James and Lars made the decision to go hard rock, not Jason.

[QUOTE=vashts80]I'm referring to Flotsam and Jetsam, the band he was in before he joined Metallica. The band he wrote 80% of their first album alone, which is pure thrash. It's a coincidence. James and Lars made the decision to go hard rock, not Jason.[/QUOTE]

im guessing that james dident want to but lars did and Lars had the extra backup if you get what i mean

If anything, I'd think Lars wouldn't and James would, since James's voice exceled at hard rockish/countryish singing (such as on Fixxxer, or Low Man's Lyrics)

[QUOTE=iluvkirkhammett]Kirk Hammett is better then Dave Mustaine though.[/QUOTE]
No fkn way.

[QUOTE=Apocalyptic Raids]Harris owns Cliff on his songwriting alone.

If Cliff Burton had written as many heavy metal classics as Steve Harris has, then maybe I'll start listening. Not to mention his basslines in the songs actually stand out.[/QUOTE]
Maybe if Burton was around for long as Harris, it is for this reason I find it funny that people compare artists, everyone's different.
Personally I think Burton is one of the best bassists, definately not for being technically elite ('Cause you know, not everyone's favourite artists are the most technical, personally I couldn't give a **** for technicality if it works, that's fine imo), but because he wrote bass which I LOVE, I don't really care that Malone composes more technical music, when Cliff's (simple?) basslines work so well in my mind, no one is ever going to be able to tell me otherwise.

There are a few songs for which Cliff's bassline really stands out, although I'm going to say I cannot convince you Burton has anything on Harris, so I can't be bothered listing them. :p

Mustaine would be a much better artist if he wasn't putting himself down all the time.

[QUOTE=iluvkirkhammett]Mustaine would be a much better artist if he wasn't putting himself down all the time.[/QUOTE]

WHAT THE HELL YOU TALKING ABOUT

Mustain isint worse cause of the put downs

Mustain is a hell of a guitarist and the putdowns dont make him ****ter:smash:

[QUOTE=timmySmi]The ownly good songs to emerge from Load & Reload are as follows:

Fuel
Memory Remains
Hero Of The Day
Outlaw Torn
Wasting My Hate[/QUOTE]


How did you not like Unforgiven 2, Prince Charming, and Fixxxer? Low Man's Lyric is a very important song...if you cant find sleep...put that song on...its ridiculous how great it works. I played it for my friend, dude passed out on the couch.