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Old 03-22-2010, 01:26 PM   #1
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Genres

If you had to design the perfect genre system for the site, what would it be?
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Old 03-22-2010, 03:08 PM   #2
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That's actually a really tough question, and for that reason alone I understand why you haven't implemented too many changes so far.

I would probably have a system that's halfway between "primary genres and no more" and "every genre you can name". So, essentially, what we have now except with a few more added (Drum 'n' Bass for example). I recognise that probably didn't help you much, lol, but that is my two cents.
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Old 03-22-2010, 03:17 PM   #3
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Come up with a really solid genre list, and then let users tag/vote on genres on band pages.
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Old 03-22-2010, 03:29 PM   #4
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I would have the vital over-reaching genres included in the system we have now, but I would also add a tagging system for people to get as specific as they like. This, ideally, could operate the way that tags do on What.cd (I'll screen-grab an example if you haven't seen it). Those tags would then be linked to pages with every release that's got the same tag, hopefully with a top ten or top twenty album chart (a la Last.fm) and maybe a list of the people who use the tag most often.

For the over-arching genres, I think this is the bare minimum we need:

- Hip-hop
- World music (as much as I hate the term....)
- Classical
- Soul
- Metal
- Rock
- Alt/Indie
- Electronica
- Folk
- Jazz/Funk (maybe it's better to split these)
- Pop
- Punk
- Blues
- Reggae & Dub
- Country

Tags could then deal with the sub-genres - 'drum'n'bass', 'singer/songwriter', 'Romantic period', 'doom metal', 'prog rock', 'new wave', 'dream pop', whatever you like.
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Old 03-22-2010, 03:29 PM   #5
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.....so bascially what Skyler jumped in and said while I was typing all that out.
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Old 03-22-2010, 03:42 PM   #6
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Yeah, that's actually a really good idea
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Old 03-22-2010, 03:54 PM   #7
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overarching genres with a tagging system to pinpoint the finer details is the way to go

Ambient
Bluegrass
Disco
Lounge
Musical
Post Punk
New Wave
Noise

to add to Iai's list here are some other niche categories that are probably needed
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Old 03-22-2010, 05:19 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Skyler View Post
Come up with a really solid genre list, and then let users tag/vote on genres on band pages.
This, but hip-hop needs more subgenres, at least, but not limited to, the same number of subgenres of metal.

Last edited by Bulldog; 03-22-2010 at 05:50 PM.
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Old 03-22-2010, 05:22 PM   #9
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Bulldog, I think the point of the tagging system is so that you can go into as much sub-genre detail as you like under an overarching more general genre like hip-hop or metal.
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Old 03-22-2010, 05:51 PM   #10
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Well, then we need to at least add regional based subgenres. Because in hip-hop, sound is highly determined based on region.

Dirty South Hip-Hop
East Coast Hip-Hop
West Coast Hip-Hop
Midwest Hip-Hop
International Hip-Hop

At least.
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Old 03-22-2010, 06:06 PM   #11
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The only thing I want is a doom genre, because I'm sick of having death metal on my pie chart (I don't like most death metal).
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Old 03-22-2010, 07:17 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bulldog View Post
Well, then we need to at least add regional based subgenres. Because in hip-hop, sound is highly determined based on region.

Dirty South Hip-Hop
East Coast Hip-Hop
West Coast Hip-Hop
Midwest Hip-Hop
International Hip-Hop

At least.
totally unnecessary
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Old 03-22-2010, 07:40 PM   #13
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Here's what I'm thinking in terms of splitting up the whole Industrial genre:

Synthpop
Futurepop
EBM
IDM
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Old 03-22-2010, 07:51 PM   #14
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totally unnecessary
Why do you hate me so?
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Old 03-22-2010, 07:55 PM   #15
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its not that i hate you (totally) but i mean hip hop doesn't need to be that broken down. would you break down indie into surf pop and freak folk? there are plenty of acts in both categories but it's unnecessary to label them as such. Same with hip hop. It's largely the same cloth but with different aesthetics. Splitting the genre that thinly is pretty unnecessary
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Old 03-22-2010, 07:59 PM   #16
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Doom genre is a must.
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Old 03-22-2010, 08:13 PM   #17
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sound is highly determined based on region.
Sorry man but this seems like a really crappy system. A genre should be determined by its sound, not the place it is played.

Or am I misinterpreting?
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Old 03-22-2010, 08:14 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Electric City View Post
its not that i hate you (totally) but i mean hip hop doesn't need to be that broken down. would you break down indie into surf pop and freak folk? there are plenty of acts in both categories but it's unnecessary to label them as such. Same with hip hop. It's largely the same cloth but with different aesthetics. Splitting the genre that thinly is pretty unnecessary
Well, mx is looking to get the "listeners also liked..." thing down to a T. So, the more genres the better, I think. Just my opinion.
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Old 03-22-2010, 09:07 PM   #19
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overarching genres with a tagging system to pinpoint the finer details is the way to go
this
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Old 03-22-2010, 11:56 PM   #20
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bloc's is good but it could even get a bit more specific possibly.
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Old 03-23-2010, 12:15 AM   #21
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frankly I agree with the tagging idea. However, how would this work with the pie chart?
Yeah, it does seem pretty good. With the pie chart, have it so the main genres are on the pie chart and anything that's tagged doesn't count.
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Old 03-23-2010, 12:58 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by Bulldog View Post
Dirty South Hip-Hop
East Coast Hip-Hop
West Coast Hip-Hop
Midwest Hip-Hop
International Hip-Hop
The only way I could see this working is with a tags system.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bloc View Post
Here's what I'm thinking in terms of splitting up the whole Industrial genre:

Synthpop
Futurepop
EBM
IDM
I hope you are not serious
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Old 03-23-2010, 07:13 AM   #23
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I hope you are not serious
Okay, maybe it would be best to just add tags.
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Old 03-23-2010, 03:18 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by eclectic View Post
Yeah, it does seem pretty good. With the pie chart, have it so the main genres are on the pie chart and anything that's tagged doesn't count.
Yes, exactly what I was thinking.
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Old 03-23-2010, 03:30 PM   #25
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Also, to play Devil's advocate, while bearing in mind any artist could be given up to three of the main genres I suggested...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meatplow View Post
Ambient
Bluegrass
Disco
Lounge
Musical
Post Punk
New Wave
Noise
Definitely not saying these are horrible ideas, but I just want to avoid getting into niche genres - somebody could come along and ask why we have 'noise' but not, say, 'opera' or 'drum'n'bass' or 'synth pop', despite the latter three being much more popular and important. And they'd have a very good point. I just think we should be as minimal as possible with the overarching genres. Of those I think musical's a good shout, and you could definitely argue the case for ambient, but the rest are either hybrid genres (bluegrass could be folk + country), are too small/unpopular to be worth adding (lounge), are dangerously vague as genres anyway (post-punk, noise), or are easily covered by what we'd have anyway (new wave). Any thoughts from anyone else?

The term 'experimental' makes me vomit as much as 'world music', but maybe we need it....we'd have to be vigilant that nobody added it to the likes of motW or Opeth though. I'd much prefer that to be a tag though.

Does anybody think 'soundtrack' deserves to stay, or do you think it's largely meaningless?
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Old 03-23-2010, 04:08 PM   #26
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Also, to play Devil's advocate, while bearing in mind any artist could be given up to three of the main genres I suggested...

Definitely not saying these are horrible ideas, but I just want to avoid getting into niche genres - somebody could come along and ask why we have 'noise' but not, say, 'opera' or 'drum'n'bass' or 'synth pop', despite the latter three being much more popular and important. And they'd have a very good point. I just think we should be as minimal as possible with the overarching genres. Of those I think musical's a good shout, and you could definitely argue the case for ambient, but the rest are either hybrid genres (bluegrass could be folk + country), are too small/unpopular to be worth adding (lounge), are dangerously vague as genres anyway (post-punk, noise), or are easily covered by what we'd have anyway (new wave). Any thoughts from anyone else?

The term 'experimental' makes me vomit as much as 'world music', but maybe we need it....we'd have to be vigilant that nobody added it to the likes of motW or Opeth though. I'd much prefer that to be a tag though.

Does anybody think 'soundtrack' deserves to stay, or do you think it's largely meaningless?
I agree that cutting down the amount of overarching genres is essential for the tagging system.
Soundtrack is necessary, we can't remove it completely. I admit the soundtrack page is an absolute mess, but there's not much we can really do about that. I can't think of a system that works as well as that does (I suppose that says something doesn't it).
I mean, the alternative is having it so that the artist is the company that made the album (i.e paramount pictures etc.) and I don't think that would work at all.
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Old 03-23-2010, 04:10 PM   #27
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hey guys can we have an experimental genre
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Old 03-23-2010, 04:21 PM   #28
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The genre list on this site is quite poor, but let's just wait for mx before we start getting into specifics. I imagine we have a long, cluster**** of a discussion ahead of us.
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Old 03-23-2010, 05:58 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by eclectic View Post
I agree that cutting down the amount of overarching genres is essential for the tagging system.
Soundtrack is necessary, we can't remove it completely. I admit the soundtrack page is an absolute mess, but there's not much we can really do about that. I can't think of a system that works as well as that does (I suppose that says something doesn't it).
I mean, the alternative is having it so that the artist is the company that made the album (i.e paramount pictures etc.) and I don't think that would work at all.
Oh no, I meant 'soundtrack' as a genre, not an artist.
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Old 03-23-2010, 06:14 PM   #30
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yeah, i like the idea of a broad genre for what page to place it under on the site, and then a tag system to expand upon it. I'm pretty sure there would be a way for the pie charts to compile the tags.
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