The Official Fitness Training / Weightlifting Thread

***DFelon204409*** · 07-05-2007, 11:50 AM

The is meant to be independent of guide to the elusive six-pack. This thread is for people to chat about what the thread title implies. Here are some resources we use for demos, training schedules etc.

http://www.gymjones.com
http://www.crossfit.com
http://www.bodybuilding.com

Jawaharal · 07-05-2007, 04:51 PM

Sweet.

Today I did an evil bear crawl with 35# kb down a football field and I wanted to die. Added in some tabata squats and windmills and I was feeling oh so sick, but didn't puke cause I'm a champ.

Also did well on my 100 burpee challenge with a time of 7:12 (I do burpees with the added pushup)

***DFelon204409*** · 07-05-2007, 05:04 PM

Jesus that's intense. I'm going on vacation this weekend to altitude so hopefully I can capitalize on the diminished 02.

Scooch · 07-06-2007, 02:02 PM

I'm looking to get back into working out after a I stopped last summer, but I'm looking to do it properly this time.

I'm extremely skinny (6'-3" 145lbs)

I heard that the book "From Scrawny to Brawny" would be a good guide to help someone of my stature. Does anyone have experience this book or could recommend me a different book intended for an ectomorph like myself?

Cybergasm · 07-07-2007, 07:51 PM

If you want to add mass Sooch, your workout will differ greatly from workouts catered to physical fitness (the like of which always includes dynamic exercises meant to work explosive motions to build conditioning).

Any workout program designed to add mass works on the principal of continued stress, meaning you keep your muscles-as the name suggests- under the greatest endurable stress levels for greater amount of time to increase the amount of tissue that is torn (and, likewise, later repaired to add mass). This translates into a workout system that has you using weights at about 85%-95% of your maximum and lifting from anywhere between 4-8 reps at 3-4 sets at a steady pace.

This sort of workout does not mesh well with 'fitness training' because to workout in a manner appropriate to that goal requires a method that meshes moderate weight amounts, with quick motions, over a sustained amount of time. This method lends to greater muscle conditioning but does not foster muscle growth (in terms of size).

A great example is Renzo Gracie (http://www.parisischool.com/_images/photos/Renzo-Gracie.jpg) who trains for fitness and conditioning as opposed to, say, Shawn Phillips (http://www.betterfitnessproducts.com/images/shawn-phillips.jpg) who works for mass and physique.

As for a book, I would recommend ABSolution by Mr. Phillips.

***DFelon204409*** · 07-07-2007, 08:14 PM

Scooch when I was ending high school I was in a similar position to you. 6'3" 155. From a summer of casually lifting 3 days a week and doing bench, incline bench, leg press, skullchrushers, and situps, all at 3x10, I gained 15 pounds right there from 2 months. I'd say justing doing 3x10 on those and also adding 4x5 on power cleans will get you pretty far in terms of beginning to add mass and muscle.

Cybergasm · 07-07-2007, 08:49 PM

I can't believe I let this slip my mind. If you're looking for a structured, and proven program focused around mass, then you HAVE to look into Max Growth:
http://weight-training.realsolutionsmag.com/ebook.html

This book is supported by years of feedback and testing, most of which can be found on the real solutions board. It is extremely effective because it utilizes the concept of the growth window, which tells us that certain muscle (like biceps) benefit greatly from more constant excercise that occurs within a certain window of time(the 'optimum' time, so to speak, when to workout a muscle after the last workout).

The program comes with a structured day-by-day approach to what exercises to do, how often to them, and has sheets to track program. Right, it is also free.

You said you were "...looking to do it properly this time..." and this is the best place to start, especially for mass.

robbyxrawks1 · 07-08-2007, 12:15 PM

Not sure if this is where these go but I had some questions.

How will pullups affect my upper body?
Is the lower body equivalent squats?

What will they work? (i.e. Biceps, chest, thighs, butt)

Jawaharal · 07-08-2007, 01:01 PM

Pull-Ups
Target Muscles

* Latissimus Dorsi

Synergists (Helps Target muscle accomplish movement).

* Brachialis
* Brachioradialis
* Biceps Brachii
* Teres Major
* Rhomboids Levator Scapulae
* Trapezius, Lower
* Pectoralis Major, Sternal
* Pectoralis Minor

Its hard to really compare squats to pull ups but I could say they are somewhat equivalent since pull-ups show great total upper body strength and squats show great lower body strength.

Cybergasm · 07-08-2007, 01:06 PM

Pull-ups are great for targeting lats, and the Latissimus Dorsi (http://www.exrx.net/Muscles/LatissimusDorsi.html) & Teres Major (http://www.exrx.net/Muscles/TeresMajor.html). Many people think pull-ups are meant as a great chest exercise, but the strain put on the chest is actually minimal (but of course like with most excercises, there will be strain on other muscles, however, strain =/= (always) a good workout for the body part. So you may feel your triceps or biceps getting sore, but you most likely won't see any changes to them).

I'm not certain what would make any excercise equivalent to another, so I don't know how to answer that question.

robbyxrawks1 · 07-08-2007, 02:52 PM

Would they make you lose a cup size if you did enough?

Cybergasm · 07-08-2007, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robbyxrawks1

Would they make you lose a cup size if you did enough?

No, nothing would other then a stable workout plan that works your entire body to promote fat loss, because, as I'm sure you've heard thousands of times, you can NOT spot reduce. If anything doing alot of them would make you gain a cup size from added mass.

You're gonna have to incorporate cardio. workout (I recommend the HIIT program, because anaerobic excercise has been shown to boost metabolic activity) and a weight plan that has you working at about 75% of your max at 12 reps for 4 sets.

Let's not forget the most important ingredient: diet. Eat 6 times a day, avoiding sugars, simple carbs (white bread and white pasta), while putting in complex carbs (wheat based products), protein (fish, white meat), and fatty acids.

I'm not going to go into detail, because I did that here: http://www.sputnikmusic.com/forums/showthread.php?t=374454

If you're talking about 'cup sizes' then you want a different workout plan then you would use to promote overall fitness (strength, endurance, and speed).

***DFelon204409*** · 07-08-2007, 11:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jawaharal

Pull-Ups
Target Muscles

* Latissimus Dorsi

Synergists (Helps Target muscle accomplish movement).

* Brachialis
* Brachioradialis
* Biceps Brachii
* Teres Major
* Rhomboids Levator Scapulae
* Trapezius, Lower
* Pectoralis Major, Sternal
* Pectoralis Minor

Its hard to really compare squats to pull ups but I could say they are somewhat equivalent since pull-ups show great total upper body strength and squats show great lower body strength.

I think about pullups in terms of the bolded muscles because I know with my lats I can pull down a certain amount of weight but to support my body and to maintain balance and keep my motion smooth, I just die in all of the auxilliary muscles. I like pull-ups because they fill in the cracks you know?

Cybergasm · 07-09-2007, 01:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DFelon204409

I think about pullups in terms of the bolded muscles because I know with my lats I can pull down a certain amount of weight but to support my body and to maintain balance and keep my motion smooth, I just die in all of the auxilliary muscles. I like pull-ups because they fill in the cracks you know?

Have you ever tried replacing your bench with a swiss ball? I think doing so helps to accomplish the same thing because it adds a whole new level of control to all of your exercises. I'm a big fan of "filling in the cracks," and while I never though of pull-ups as such (although, I like that way of thinking now

), replacing a set solid surface with a ball really lets me integrate that aspect of excercise to every muscle group I hit.

***DFelon204409*** · 07-09-2007, 01:33 AM

Hmm. That's interesting. The thing is after this week I'm shifting out of my rapid muscle strength increase portion of my workout plan and moving towards doing full-body aerobic weight training a la crossfit or gymjones with certain maintenance lifts everyday. The bench may be only a once a week thing just to go through the motions and maintain that specific motion while I work on other stuff, namely body weight strength and cardio. I have about eight more weeks until I need to be in great cardio shape so this should be good timing.

Jawaharal · 07-09-2007, 08:39 AM

blah. Football started again today. The ran us alot.

joshmac · 07-09-2007, 12:15 PM

ive beent training for football for a good 2 months now. Practices start in a month and a half or so. Ive gotten A LOT stronger already.

***DFelon204409*** · 07-09-2007, 12:27 PM

I wish I had been allowed to play football as a kid. I'd be good now. I would have actully lifted in high school instead of after I graduated. Damns.

Cybergasm · 07-09-2007, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DFelon204409

Hmm. That's interesting. The thing is after this week I'm shifting out of my rapid muscle strength increase portion of my workout plan and moving towards doing full-body aerobic weight training a la crossfit or gymjones with certain maintenance lifts everyday. The bench may be only a once a week thing just to go through the motions and maintain that specific motion while I work on other stuff, namely body weight strength and cardio. I have about eight more weeks until I need to be in great cardio shape so this should be good timing.

I really need to do something like that. It's hit me recently that I have not done a dedicated cardio. session in about 9 months. I'm going to Germany in a couple of hours, and your post made me realize that this is the best opportunity for me to brush up on that aspect of working out.

I won't have access to a gym, so I think for three weeks I'm going to work with traditional body-weight exercises while incorporating running (both long distance and sprinting) and some biking.

This should be fun.

***DFelon204409*** · 07-09-2007, 06:18 PM

Hey everybody (as in only us three) let's design crossfit/gym jones full body workouts for each other. I usually make my own modified version of crossfit workouts anyways so I think it'd be cool to do cruel things to each other instead of just to ourselves. I know I'm probably in the worst shape of all 3 of us but the beautiful thing about crossfit is that you do you best, pushing through the failure, and just have a worst time or load for a workout of the day that everybody else does. Jawa I imagine you're down though Cyber maybe not because of Germany. How about we each design 4 roughly 12-15 minute workouts and we chop them up so that each do 2 of them a day. This could be used as a supplement for say, football pre-season, or maybe just a supplement for a normal lifting day. I think it'd be fun. How about it?

07-05-2007, 11:50 AM	#1
*DFelon204409* i want tha gold Supermod Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: San Francisco Posts: 15,433	The Official Fitness Training / Weightlifting Thread The is meant to be independent of guide to the elusive six-pack. This thread is for people to chat about what the thread title implies. Here are some resources we use for demos, training schedules etc. http://www.gymjones.com http://www.crossfit.com http://www.bodybuilding.com

07-07-2007, 07:51 PM	#5
Cybergasm Rear them dont claim them Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: sitter här i venten och spelar Dota Posts: 13,139	If you want to add mass Sooch, your workout will differ greatly from workouts catered to physical fitness (the like of which always includes dynamic exercises meant to work explosive motions to build conditioning). Any workout program designed to add mass works on the principal of continued stress, meaning you keep your muscles-as the name suggests- under the greatest endurable stress levels for greater amount of time to increase the amount of tissue that is torn (and, likewise, later repaired to add mass). This translates into a workout system that has you using weights at about 85%-95% of your maximum and lifting from anywhere between 4-8 reps at 3-4 sets at a steady pace. This sort of workout does not mesh well with 'fitness training' because to workout in a manner appropriate to that goal requires a method that meshes moderate weight amounts, with quick motions, over a sustained amount of time. This method lends to greater muscle conditioning but does not foster muscle growth (in terms of size). A great example is Renzo Gracie (http://www.parisischool.com/_images/photos/Renzo-Gracie.jpg) who trains for fitness and conditioning as opposed to, say, Shawn Phillips (http://www.betterfitnessproducts.com/images/shawn-phillips.jpg) who works for mass and physique. As for a book, I would recommend ABSolution by Mr. Phillips. Last edited by Cybergasm; 07-07-2007 at 08:39 PM.

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07-05-2007, 04:51 PM	#2
Jawaharal whats that smell like Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 5,471	Sweet. Today I did an evil bear crawl with 35# kb down a football field and I wanted to die. Added in some tabata squats and windmills and I was feeling oh so sick, but didn't puke cause I'm a champ. Also did well on my 100 burpee challenge with a time of 7:12 (I do burpees with the added pushup)

07-05-2007, 05:04 PM	#3
*DFelon204409* i want tha gold Supermod Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: San Francisco Posts: 15,433	Jesus that's intense. I'm going on vacation this weekend to altitude so hopefully I can capitalize on the diminished 02.

07-06-2007, 02:02 PM	#4
Scooch Registered User Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 673	I'm looking to get back into working out after a I stopped last summer, but I'm looking to do it properly this time. I'm extremely skinny (6'-3" 145lbs) I heard that the book "From Scrawny to Brawny" would be a good guide to help someone of my stature. Does anyone have experience this book or could recommend me a different book intended for an ectomorph like myself?

07-07-2007, 08:14 PM	#6
*DFelon204409* i want tha gold Supermod Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: San Francisco Posts: 15,433	Scooch when I was ending high school I was in a similar position to you. 6'3" 155. From a summer of casually lifting 3 days a week and doing bench, incline bench, leg press, skullchrushers, and situps, all at 3x10, I gained 15 pounds right there from 2 months. I'd say justing doing 3x10 on those and also adding 4x5 on power cleans will get you pretty far in terms of beginning to add mass and muscle.

07-07-2007, 08:49 PM	#7
Cybergasm Rear them dont claim them Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: sitter här i venten och spelar Dota Posts: 13,139	I can't believe I let this slip my mind. If you're looking for a structured, and proven program focused around mass, then you HAVE to look into Max Growth: http://weight-training.realsolutionsmag.com/ebook.html This book is supported by years of feedback and testing, most of which can be found on the real solutions board. It is extremely effective because it utilizes the concept of the growth window, which tells us that certain muscle (like biceps) benefit greatly from more constant excercise that occurs within a certain window of time(the 'optimum' time, so to speak, when to workout a muscle after the last workout). The program comes with a structured day-by-day approach to what exercises to do, how often to them, and has sheets to track program. Right, it is also free. You said you were "...looking to do it properly this time..." and this is the best place to start, especially for mass.

07-08-2007, 12:15 PM	#8
robbyxrawks1 Medford Falling Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 3,181	Not sure if this is where these go but I had some questions. How will pullups affect my upper body? Is the lower body equivalent squats? What will they work? (i.e. Biceps, chest, thighs, butt)

07-08-2007, 01:01 PM	#9
Jawaharal whats that smell like Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 5,471	Pull-Ups Target Muscles * Latissimus Dorsi Synergists (Helps Target muscle accomplish movement). * Brachialis * Brachioradialis * Biceps Brachii * Teres Major * Rhomboids Levator Scapulae * Trapezius, Lower * Pectoralis Major, Sternal * Pectoralis Minor Its hard to really compare squats to pull ups but I could say they are somewhat equivalent since pull-ups show great total upper body strength and squats show great lower body strength.

07-08-2007, 01:06 PM	#10
Cybergasm Rear them dont claim them Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: sitter här i venten och spelar Dota Posts: 13,139	Pull-ups are great for targeting lats, and the Latissimus Dorsi (http://www.exrx.net/Muscles/LatissimusDorsi.html) & Teres Major (http://www.exrx.net/Muscles/TeresMajor.html). Many people think pull-ups are meant as a great chest exercise, but the strain put on the chest is actually minimal (but of course like with most excercises, there will be strain on other muscles, however, strain =/= (always) a good workout for the body part. So you may feel your triceps or biceps getting sore, but you most likely won't see any changes to them). I'm not certain what would make any excercise equivalent to another, so I don't know how to answer that question.

07-08-2007, 02:52 PM	#11
robbyxrawks1 Medford Falling Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 3,181	Would they make you lose a cup size if you did enough?

07-09-2007, 01:33 AM	#15
*DFelon204409* i want tha gold Supermod Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: San Francisco Posts: 15,433	Hmm. That's interesting. The thing is after this week I'm shifting out of my rapid muscle strength increase portion of my workout plan and moving towards doing full-body aerobic weight training a la crossfit or gymjones with certain maintenance lifts everyday. The bench may be only a once a week thing just to go through the motions and maintain that specific motion while I work on other stuff, namely body weight strength and cardio. I have about eight more weeks until I need to be in great cardio shape so this should be good timing.

07-09-2007, 08:39 AM	#16
Jawaharal whats that smell like Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 5,471	blah. Football started again today. The ran us alot.

07-09-2007, 12:15 PM	#17
joshmac Jawsome Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Ottawa Posts: 1,779	ive beent training for football for a good 2 months now. Practices start in a month and a half or so. Ive gotten A LOT stronger already.

07-09-2007, 12:27 PM	#18
*DFelon204409* i want tha gold Supermod Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: San Francisco Posts: 15,433	I wish I had been allowed to play football as a kid. I'd be good now. I would have actully lifted in high school instead of after I graduated. Damns.

07-09-2007, 06:18 PM	#20
*DFelon204409* i want tha gold Supermod Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: San Francisco Posts: 15,433	Hey everybody (as in only us three) let's design crossfit/gym jones full body workouts for each other. I usually make my own modified version of crossfit workouts anyways so I think it'd be cool to do cruel things to each other instead of just to ourselves. I know I'm probably in the worst shape of all 3 of us but the beautiful thing about crossfit is that you do you best, pushing through the failure, and just have a worst time or load for a workout of the day that everybody else does. Jawa I imagine you're down though Cyber maybe not because of Germany. How about we each design 4 roughly 12-15 minute workouts and we chop them up so that each do 2 of them a day. This could be used as a supplement for say, football pre-season, or maybe just a supplement for a normal lifting day. I think it'd be fun. How about it?