[QUOTE=gaslight;18542123]I'm not trying to prove that am I?[/QUOTE]

you're certainly arguing that its preferable if possible, no?

[QUOTE=The Transporter;18542120]if they shit up bass when they hop on it as you described there is no way they are a great guitarist

but then again thats subjective[/QUOTE]

I suppose it depends on how shit you're assuming they are. I just mean you wouldn't assume anything special.

I play bass mainly, but I've also spent years playing guitar so I'm comfortable on both. The point I'm getting at though is if a guitarist had been playing for ten years and literally never, ever touched a bass guitar before, you wouldn't expect fireworks from them when they hopped on one for the first time.

why would you not expect that

[QUOTE=Epidemechanical;18542125]you're certainly arguing that its preferable if possible, no?[/QUOTE]

If it'll make the finished product sound better, it's preferable to do it yeah.

There's plenty of cases where you can just keyboard in the bass, or do something else like that.

If there is as you say, absolutely no reason to hire a bassist ever, then why do people do it? Because you can't deny that they do.

[quote=Epidemechanical;18542115]that's not an argument

[I]"I"[/I] can't come up with a bassline when I wrote guitar =/= [I]"Nobody"[/I] can come up with a bassline when they wrote the guitar.

There are literally thousands of examples of awesome basslines written by the composer and not an instrumentalist. See: any classical piece, for example. In fact, the rise of instrumentalism (really with the rise of jazz and blues in the early 20th century) arguably dumbed down the role of bass and supportive instruments in favor of soloist focuses improvisation.

Also,

[I]"I've"[/I] never seen a guitar player write a good bassline =/= [I]"No guitar player"[/I] can write a good bassline.

Pro example of excellent cross-functional band: Protest the Hero.[/quote]

I never said it couldn't be done, I was merely stating my experience, and I'm sure I'm not alone.

again i never said that bro

you can't [I]absolutely prove[/I] that you should never do it

that doesnt make sense

Oh, so, to clarify, can your point be summarised as:

[i]It's not always necessary to hire a bassist.[/i]

Because I can agree with that 100%.

If your point is "[i]it is never necessary to hire a bassist[/i]" then that is not really the kind of question that can be proved either way.

[quote=gaslight;18542149]Oh, so, to clarify, can your point be summarised as:

[I]It's not always necessary to hire a bassist.[/I]

Because I can agree with that 100%.

If your point is "[I]it is never necessary to hire a bassist[/I]" then that is not really the kind of question that can be proved either way.[/quote]

This.

no im asking you to provide adequate illustration as to why it better to a hire a bassist

you havent done this

So,

Option A) Hire a bassist

but what is

Option B)

do it yourself or something idk

[quote=Epidemechanical;18542168]no im asking you to provide adequate illustration as to why it better to a hire a bassist

you havent done this[/quote]

What are the circumstances?

Pop singer that is autotuned and doesn't write her own music - cheaper and quicker to hire the bassist.

Metal band seeking bassist - not necessary because the guitarists probably want the bass following the guitar riff exactly and LPF'd at 300Hz.

Swing, Fusion, Bebop, etc. Jazz - much of jazz is written with only comp chords, so having a bassist that improvises walking lines and does it well is preferable



There is always influence from the studio or label too. If you need a moderately intricate bassline and have never picked up a bass before, they are going to suggest bringing in outside help because someone who is trained in the field will take up less time and money than you, who has to get somewhat accustomed to the instrument with numerous takes and retakes.

It's not absolutely necessary, but there are times when it's more fiscally responsible to outsource the job.

What if you can't do it yourself?

why would you hire a session bassist just for the studio when you could audition for a bassist to join the band?

you'd need one for live performance anyway, right? if you do that sort of thing

i guess there are opportunities to hire somebody for sessions because not everbody can function on a guitar-based stringed instrument but still, if you're in a jazz band how the fuck do you not have a bassist already

isnt that like kind of important

so maybe if the bassist quit or had to leave or was sick during tracking or something, idk i guess

i find it hard to believe that musical groups where basslines are demanding, complex, and forefront would lack a person who can adequately perform that role. that doesn't really make sense. if it's what i think it is and like a rock band situation or heavier music (the situation FMB described) then there's no reason the guitar player can't track the bass or write interesting or appropriate basslines.

EDIT:

and of course we can discuss different styles of recording where every role is "session" based (see: nearly all of pop music) but what i was getting at is regular dudes like us

I don't question the market, I just acknowledge that it exists and exploit it.

right i guess

i mean dont get me wrong bro thats awesome i'd love to session bass for a band that'd be sick

i'd prolly do it for free lol but getting paid is gravy

PS you know what bass i miss? my 6 string schecter studio, i think you had one too. i loved that bass.

[quote=Epidemechanical;18542189]right i guess

i mean dont get me wrong bro thats awesome i'd love to session bass for a band that'd be sick

i'd prolly do it for free lol but getting paid is gravy

PS you know what bass i miss? my 6 string schecter studio, i think you had one too. i loved that bass.[/quote]

I still do, and I love it. I keep it in ADADGC tuning for drop D stuff, and I've considered getting another for standard BEADGC or F#BEADG tuning. Seriously great bass for the money. They've gone up in price since I originally bought mine, which is a damn shame.

[QUOTE=Epidemechanical;18542184]EDIT:

and of course we can discuss different styles of recording where every role is "session" based (see: nearly all of pop music) but what i was getting at is regular dudes like us[/QUOTE]

Oh for fuck's...

I thought that was the entire thing we were discussing.

That's why we love this guy.

I saw Rush last night. I've never heard a Fender Jazz sound like that. It was incredible. Other than that, I hate Fenders, but Geddy's tone was amazing.

The show was amazing too. **Eargasm**

Yeah that is a top notch group of musicians. Wish they'd head over this way. I saw Ron Carter Trio the other night and that was the most amazing thing I've ever seen.

No, this chick is the most amazing thing I've ever seen. I wish I had her technique and control on the theremin:

[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VHOGW5MDsz8[/url]

Walking bassline w/ a theremin = secks

Haha that is pretty sick. Some funny sounding patches in there but it's crazy how much it looks like her left hand is playing a bass.

I don't think I'll ever see a better gig than Ron Carter Trio, not for a long time at least. The man himself, plus Mulgrew Miller and Russell Malone. The three best musicians I've ever seen in person, playing in the same trio to boot.

Filter Twin is a fucking enjoyable stompbox I must add.

[quote=gaslight;18544432]Haha that is pretty sick. Some funny sounding patches in there but it's crazy how much it looks like her left hand is playing a bass.

I don't think I'll ever see a better gig than Ron Carter Trio, not for a long time at least. The man himself, plus Mulgrew Miller and Russell Malone. The three best musicians I've ever seen in person, playing in the same trio to boot.

Filter Twin is a fucking enjoyable stompbox I must add.[/quote]

I've always wanted to see Ron Carter. His improvisation skills are amazing. One day, I'll see him. One day...

Filter Twin, is that like a dual envelope filter?

The whole trio are amazing improvisers, amazing at everything else too mind.

A 74 year old man sliding fifth, sixth and even fucking octave double stops on an upright, just blew my mind. I drove home with the car stereo off because, what the fuck do you listen to after that.

Yeah that's it, two controllable filters sweeping opposite directions.

[quote=gaslight;18544582]The whole trio are amazing improvisers, amazing at everything else too mind.

A 74 year old man sliding fifth, sixth and even fucking octave double stops on an upright, just blew my mind. I drove home with the car stereo off because, what the fuck do you listen to after that.

Yeah that's it, two controllable filters sweeping opposite directions.[/quote]

What is the technical definition of a double-stop? I didn't know that octaves counted.

I do the same thing after most concerts - I just sit in silence and drive home happy.

Oh, like the pre-/post- sweep? (I think that's how they refer to them, I know what you mean.) That's pretty cool. I have seen some envelope filters that have a switch to select between, but never one that has both. **runs off to yubtub**

A double stop is just playing two notes at once on your instrument, triple stop is three notes, quadruple stop four, so on.

Double stops are a technique term not a theory term like a diad.

The different filters are a downwards moving and upwards moving one. You can get some real tasty Jamiroquai kind of tones and other funkiness.

And yeah man, very happy after that gig. Even after walking around the city for 30 minutes in the pouring rain looking for my damn car. GPS is a lie.

So I traded in my 6 string and got an acoustic, awesome. Probably shouldn't be throwing money about when I'm planning to move interstate very shortly hahaha.

On the plus side, the guy who I always see at the music shop gave me two free tickets to see a little workshop thing Page Hamilton is doing there while Helmet are on tour down here. The only one they're doing in Australia apparently. I don't even really like Helmet, but fuck that!

how did you guys get to be such faggots

What kind of acoustic did you get?

[QUOTE=gaslight;18545985]What kind of acoustic did you get?[/QUOTE]

[URL]http://www.ibanez.com/BassGuitars/model-AEB10ENT[/URL]

This one yo. Much more useful to have around and practise without my monstrous amp and with the band acoustically. Considering I never even used my 6 string live, a think it's a good trade off.

I think I'll probably look into getting a decent 5 string if things go well over the next year or so. If not I'll probably build a p special or something.