jazz is for people with little weiners

[QUOTE=owlz r fun 4 every1]jazz is for people with little weiners[/QUOTE]
Dude, you're completely right. I'm going to stop listening and playing jazz from now on.

I fail to realize what people think they are going to accomplish by posting things like that.

[QUOTE=owlz r fun 4 every1]jazz is for people with little weiners[/QUOTE]

Jazz is and was predominantly made up of black musicians. Enough said.

[url]http://members.aol.com/chordmaps/mapAb.htm[/url]

Someone wanna explain how do comprehend that to me?

[QUOTE=AmericanWeiner][url]http://members.aol.com/chordmaps/mapAb.htm[/url]

Someone wanna explain how do comprehend that to me?[/QUOTE]
It's a chart saying how chords relate to the key of Ab. Or more, which chords resolve best to each other chord.

For instance the Eb7 to Abmaj is one of the strongest resolutions. I'm guessing the larger they are the stronger they are.

Although I've never seen a "chord chart' written that way, and it's probably overly complicated. So if you look at that and say to yourself "wtf" don't worry.

[QUOTE=spastic]Although I've never seen a "chord chart' written that way, and it's probably overly complicated. So if you look at that and say to yourself "wtf" don't worry.[/QUOTE]


this is an amazing post and to think that a lot of you are 15 years old.. I wish I would have started with the bass and not the drums. I'd have a lot of this theory stuff down pack.


But i had a non-theory question. Are there any classes available at city colleges? I don't want to major in music so I just wanted to take some classes on the side to improve my bass playing and of course dive into jazz

[QUOTE=dragonzmad]this is an amazing post and to think that a lot of you are 15 years old.. I wish I would have started with the bass and not the drums. I'd have a lot of this theory stuff down pack.


But i had a non-theory question. Are there any classes available at city colleges? I don't want to major in music so I just wanted to take some classes on the side to improve my bass playing and of course dive into jazz[/QUOTE]

I think this question is best answered by telling you to check into it yourself.

I know my local community college has a jazz band and classical guitar courses, though.

Okay, I know lots of theory, and am just having trouble improvising melodically. I understand tritone sub., altered chords + scales, other substitutions, modal playing, tonal centers, chromaticism, etc...

But I find it really hard to phrase well. Do you guys have any special tips for motivic and melodic phrasing, besides listening to others?

Thanks, any answers would be really helpful..

what scales (for bass) or notes are most often associated in funk\(maroon 5) type songs. I've observed that the 7th (usually minor) and 5th can be a big part as well as the octave but are those all?

First, if you're considering Maroon 5 to be funk, then you're deeply misguided my friend.

Second, you're pretty much good to start off with the blues scale/minor pentatonic scale, but the Dorian mode is used heavily in funk, since the major 6 adds a nice bit of tritone tension with the minor third.

[QUOTE=ParaRiddleDiddle]Okay, I know lots of theory, and am just having trouble improvising melodically. I understand tritone sub., altered chords + scales, other substitutions, modal playing, tonal centers, chromaticism, etc...

But I find it really hard to phrase well. Do you guys have any special tips for motivic and melodic phrasing, besides listening to others?

Thanks, any answers would be really helpful..[/QUOTE]
Sing along with what you're playing. No joke, this works, it forces you to keep your phrases within a managable length, and also to keep them simple. They will end up sounding so much better.

Spastic, you are the man! I'm 15 and thanks to your eloquent explanations I've actually been able to expand my playing beyond pentatonic blues and simple tapping shapes. As for that jackass and his infamous post on your 'pretentious' recordings... :lol:

Just wondering...anybody have any opinion on what is best to use for a sexy/sultry kind of sound? Yeah, that's half the vibe given off by jazz, but I just can't seem to capture it and I was wondering if any particular modes give off that kind of feel. :confused:

[QUOTE=HaVIC5]First, if you're considering Maroon 5 to be funk, then you're deeply misguided my friend.

Second, you're pretty much good to start off with the blues scale/minor pentatonic scale, but the Dorian mode is used heavily in funk, since the major 6 adds a nice bit of tritone tension with the minor third.[/QUOTE]


haha. no i dont consider maroon 5 to be funk. I should have said " maroon 5 type songs and funk songs"

Whenever I try to voice a minor 7 chord with the third and the seventh in my left hand and the 1 and the 5 in my right, it sounds like an Eb6. I understand that the bass fills in the 1, but for solo purpases is playing the 1 and the 5 in the right and the 3 and the 7 in the right hand the best way to voice?

I thought with jazz piano you used mainly the third and seventh, and dropped the root because the bass handles it?

That's what I've been told at least. You could always add on your own extensions, of course, to give it life. But, the third and seventh in the right is correct (I believe), and drop the root. Anyone who thinks I'm wrong, feel free to correct me. :p :)

Alright thank you, thats what I thought.

It seems that you must be schooled? I have been playing jazz for 45 years. I never have time to think of what scale to play over which chord. You can learn all the theory you want, but it won't help you play jazz. Most of the guitarists that I know or knew. Kenny Burrell, Joe Pass, Howard roberts all played from feel. The best way is to take one model scale. The dorian scale is probably the best scale to use. Try playing the a dorian against the following chords. Ami7 D7 Gma7, and you will be suprised what you can come up with. playing the G scale starting with A is the dorian for those not familier with scales. Learn other peoples solos is one of the best way to learn jazz.

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sorry not even close.

gosh this thread is almost dead.

anyone know what happened to spastic?

I come and go.

Spastic:

Can you explain secondary dominants?

thanks

[QUOTE=spastic]I come and go.[/QUOTE]

what are you doing now?

[quote] Spastic:

Can you explain secondary dominants?

thanks[/quote]

Secondary dominants are dominant chords that don't resolve to the tonic, but another chord in the scale. In the progression G7 - Cmaj7, the G7 is just a normal dominant chord. However, you can add a secondary dominant chord to make it D7 - G7 - Cmaj7. The D7 acts as the V7 chord of the G7; however, the G7 is not acting as a tonic chord.

Usually secondary dominant chords are used as a V chord of other dominant chords, but in practice any dominant chord that resolve to a chord besides the tonic is a secondary dominant chord. In this progression: A7 - Dmin7 - G7 - Cmaj7, the A7 is a secondary dominant chord.

(By the way "secondary dominant" isn't a commonly used term (at least I rarely have heard it). However, the concept behind that term is often used and makes for much more interesting progressions)


[quote] what are you doing now?[/quote]

Not much, just finishing sophomore year of high school. Once school is over, I'll be able to focus much more on music. This summer I'm taking the 5 week performance course at Berklee, hopefully that will be a good experience.

Thanks, that made perfect sense.

Hello I'm a theory newbie and I found something contradictory to what I've learnt and I hope someone has an easy and clear answer for this:

I wanted to know why minor pentatonic sounds better with 7th chords rather than major pentatonic.

Let's say I'm soloing over a C7 which is C, E, G, Bb

Cmin pentatonic is C Eb F G Bb C
Cmaj pentatonic is C D E G A C

In Cmin, Eb falls out whilst Cmaj matches C7 perfectly. (I don't know how to put this down in words, but I guess you get what I mean) So according to what I've learnt, it makes more sense that Cmaj pentatonic sound better over C7 than Cmin pentatonic. But in reality it's not it.

So, WHY?!

Step outside of all of the complicated jazz theory for a second. When soloing, you shouldn't always be thinking, "what scale should I play over this chord"

A C7, as you said, contains the notes C E G Bb, so obviously any of those notes would sound good over a C7. Neither the Cmin pentatonic or Cmaj pentatonic follows those specifications. The Cmaj pentatonic works, but is not going to sound as good. Maybe you arent looking for either of those pentatonic scales. I would suggest a C blues scale.
A Cmin7 has the notes C Eb G Bb, that is where you would play the Cmin pentatonic. You are correct that the Cmin pentatonic scale does not sound good over a C7, because the E from the C7 clashes with the Eb from the Pentatonic scale. A Cmaj7 is where the Cmaj pentatonic scale would work best. adding a B to the Cmaj pentatonic would sound nice too.

Hope that helped!

[QUOTE=pianoplyr77]Step outside of all of the complicated jazz theory for a second. When soloing, you shouldn't always be thinking, "what scale should I play over this chord"

A C7, as you said, contains the notes C E G Bb, so obviously any of those notes would sound good over a C7. Neither the Cmin pentatonic or Cmaj pentatonic follows those specifications. The Cmaj pentatonic works, but is not going to sound as good. Maybe you arent looking for either of those pentatonic scales. I would suggest a C blues scale.
A Cmin7 has the notes C Eb G Bb, that is where you would play the Cmin pentatonic. You are correct that the Cmin pentatonic scale does not sound good over a C7, because the E from the C7 clashes with the Eb from the Pentatonic scale. A Cmaj7 is where the Cmaj pentatonic scale would work best. adding a B to the Cmaj pentatonic would sound nice too.

Hope that helped![/QUOTE]

I'm sorry but that didn't answer my question. I was asking why Cmin pentatonic sounded good with C7, which is contradictory to the theory.

Simply, C7 is used a lot in blues...The flatted seventh (in this case), was a dominant (haha, pun) note in the chord C, and perhaps one of the more important melodic notes in blues, because often it is not at the exact pitch of the seventh (for example, guitarists often bend the b3, b5, b7 degrees of the blues scale, because it sounds bluesy).

You see that Cmin pentatonic contains C, Eb, G, Bb. The important thing is that it contains Bb, which is an important chord tone, and completely changes the sound of the chord; it makes the difference between Cmaj7 and C7, and this tritone tension (in C7) can make all the difference in the world.

Strangely, Eb can be used against C7, as Spastic mentioned: in the blues scale, which is (my form, anyway):

C Eb F Gb G Bb

1 b3 4 b5 5 b7

The blues sound is quite prevalent in jazz, as the two genres often mix and match together...However, my advice would be not to hold the Eb against the C7; a minor 2nd interval IS very dissonant. Just use the Eb as a passing tone, if you use the blues scale.