Active ingredietns in marijuana found to spread and prolong pain

[1338 h4x0r]

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/08/090813170848.htm

:lol:

I hope the stoners come out of the woodwork for this one

[fafafafa]

you're such a square

no honestly

[fafafafa]

were you at the prom and afterwards you were in a van with the slightly chubby girl with braces that you liked so much and she was like hey christopher have some of this and you were like uhhhhhhhh and she was like no go on go on and so you did it and you felt all dizzy and wet yourself and you ran from the van crying as everyone else in the group laughed

?

[fafafafa]

thats just one possible version of events

[Jaundice]

Who cares?

if you're actually experiencing some sort of physical pain then you're obviously in trouble anyway

[fafafafa]

the girls name was elaine

that was her name

[1338 h4x0r]

you're such a square

no honestly

/takes out measuring tape

no I'm not a square I just checked

[fafafafa]

she played marimba in band

[1338 h4x0r]

I'm not even homeomorphic to a square

put the bong down chad

[fafafafa]

/takes out measuring tape

no I'm not a square I just checked
technically your arm span is your height so

you could fit snugly through a square hole

[Jaundice]

What's a marimba?

[fafafafa]

but thats just the thing i dont do drugs man

but i also dont care if people do them

because i dont care

[fafafafa]

What's a marimba?

a musical instrument obv

[1338 h4x0r]

technically your arm span is your height so

you could fit snugly through a square hole

lots of things that aren't square could

What's a marimba?

It's a kind of tonal percussion instrument

[1338 h4x0r]

but thats just the thing i dont do drugs man

but i also dont care if people do them

because i dont care

cool

[RNR]

As I know it it's best used to relieve nausea, loss of appetite and the symptoms from chronic illness rather than sharp, inflammatory pain.

As I remember it it really depends on the dosage. Back when I used to smoke it and I hurt my back I found that a low dosage would relieve the pain somewhat but a moderate to high dose would make it worse.

[1338 h4x0r]

As I know it it's best used to relieve nausea, loss of appetite and the symptoms from chronic illness rather than sharp, inflammatory pain.

As I remember it it really depends on the dosage. Back when I used to smoke it and I hurt my back I found that a low dosage would relieve the pain somewhat but a moderate to high dose would make it worse.

Interesting analysis, doctor

I concur

[suspect device]

i've always found that smoking nicotine increases pain. like i get a bad back. i have some blow to relieve the pain. blow on its own is ok, blow rolled in a tobacco spliff increases pain, ciggie on its own increases pain. or maybe it just increases my awareness of pain. is increased awareness of pain the same as more pain?

[1338 h4x0r]

well cocaine does have an anesthetic effect

but it also eats up your heart

so idk

[fafafafa]

we'll be able to grow new hearts soon dont worry

[1338 h4x0r]

until then best to lay off the nose candy

[fafafafa]

what else is going to kill people once we start regrowing organs

not much

old people ruin everything im not sure if this is a good thing

[gregulus]

Death panels are the only solution.

[fafafafa]

i guess its a good thing it'll mean an end to social programs faster once people start living longer

this thread is now about libertarianism

[suspect device]

don't they all end up that way

[McP3000]

cocaine is sooo stupid

[stevensonmat2]

its fun from time to time

[suspect device]

cocaine is sooo stupid

nooooo, stupid people take cocaine from time to time. i know lots of people who take it and enjoy it and good for them. then there are those who should never touch the stuff, just like certain people shouldn't eat papa johns or drink beer.

personally, i can't ever touch the stuff again because it nearly got me

[RNR]

The appeal of cocaine is kind of lost on me. I mean there's LSD, mushrooms, ecstasy, ketamine, alcohol, etc to choose from. I prefer all of those in the moment and definitely in the long-term.

[Smokey D]

I'm gonna say that if people perceive a reduction in pain then it doesn't really matter whether there is an actual reduction in pain.

[1338 h4x0r]

huh

[Smokey D]

The experience of pain is the most subjective thing ever.

If I think my cancer wracked body hurts less when I'm high, it's probably at least as beneficial as if my body did actually hurt less.

This is why doctors and stuff will not prompt you when you are describing pain symptoms to them. They understand it's what you're feeling that's important.

[ridethelib]

less pain = better feeling = happier

[1338 h4x0r]

The experience of pain is the most subjective thing ever.

If I think my cancer wracked body hurts less when I'm high, it's probably at least as beneficial as if my body did actually hurt less.

This is why doctors and stuff will not prompt you when you are describing pain symptoms to them. They understand it's what you're feeling that's important.

yeah but the idea is that marijuana can make you feel more pain

[Already_Taken]

yeah but the idea is that marijuana can make you feel more pain

thank you doctor

i'm sure you're well learned from your many experiments with the substance.

[1338 h4x0r]

please try to read the article

assuming it isn't totally over your head

[1338 h4x0r]

I didn't do coke either but I guess I'm not allowed to say that it causes cardiac damage

[fafafafa]

being alive causes cardiac damage too bro

[1338 h4x0r]

that's different

[fafafafa]

how so

being alive is pleasurable therefore we continue despite the damage to our organs

taking coke is also pleasurable


protip: preventing bodily harm isnt the only thing thats important to humans

[1338 h4x0r]

the heart wears out much much faster under the influence of coke

hurr durr

[fafafafa]

you also get much more pleasure

hurr durr

[fafafafa]

its called a tradeoff bro

difficult concept, i know

[1338 h4x0r]

idk why do a lot of people who get into cocaine end up regretting it

[fafafafa]

because they didnt understand the tradeoff but that doesnt make it bad it just makes them stupid

[1338 h4x0r]

it's a pretty shitty tradeoff if you ask me

[fafafafa]

ya thats called subjectivity

[1338 h4x0r]

which means I get to have opinions too

strange how that works

[fafafafa]

ya but opinions arent immune to criticism

yours is arbitrary

[Smokey D]

yeah but the idea is that marijuana can make you feel more pain

It should be determined on a case by case basis in consultation with the doctor like any other treatment.

[1338 h4x0r]

ya but opinions arent immune to criticism

did I say they were

why do you think I air my opinions where they're like to be criticized

hurr durr

It should be determined on a case by case basis in consultation with the doctor like any other treatment.

but yeah anyway I look at the marijuana news in my RSS feeds and lol there's more and more bad **** every time

[fafafafa]

well you havent responded to the claim that your opinion is arbitrary thats even worse than having a dumb opinion in the first place

but yeah anyway I look at the marijuana news in my RSS feeds and lol there's more and more bad **** every time
how scientific

[1338 h4x0r]

well you havent responded to the claim that your opinion is arbitrary thats even worse than having a dumb opinion in the first place

it is arbitrary

I make no secret of that

how scientific

well yeah it is science daily after all

[fafafafa]

then its a stupid opinion to hold

[1338 h4x0r]

why

[fafafafa]

because believing stuff you just made up isnt cool

[1338 h4x0r]

same can be said of libertarianism

[fafafafa]

not really dont change the subject

[1338 h4x0r]

this thread is now about libertarianism

libertarianism is arbitrary

[fafafafa]

not really its based on logical principles

even if you dont agree with them you cant claim its arbitrary

inventing an acceptable level of pleasure/sacrifice on the other hand, is

[1338 h4x0r]

what logical principles

[fafafafa]

you own yourself you own the product of your labour etc

[1338 h4x0r]

those are axioms

[fafafafa]

not really

condensed:

you own yourself because you have greatest control over your mind and actions, nobody has a higher claim

and you own the results of your labour as you are responsible for the results of punching someone in the face

[1338 h4x0r]

other economic systems are based on "logical principles" then too

"logic" isn't just an opinion you hold strongly

[fafafafa]

not really i see no logical justification for entitlement to anything from other people (which is what most others are based on) because you exist

unless you want to make one

ps im a voluntarist, i dont intend to force people to be capitalists, self ownership isnt an economic principle

[1338 h4x0r]

utilitarianism

[fafafafa]

voluntarism and utilitarianism arent mutually exclusive

actually voluntarism means everyone can choose individually whats subjectively best for them

[1338 h4x0r]

utilitarianism as per Bentham or Mill is contrary to voluntarism

[fafafafa]

utilitarianism is a well defined thing it cant be as per anyone

greatest good for the greatest number

since good is subjective only the subjects can determine it for themselves

[1338 h4x0r]

yes but what if the majority of people require taxes to maximize their utility

huh

huh

[fafafafa]

then they can choose to live in a commune with taxes

point is they have to let people leave too

[1338 h4x0r]

or they can just choose to force it down other people's throats because doing so maximizes utility more than living on a commune

the "soda tax" is the most cruel of all

how dare the collectivists levy a heinous fee on that sugary staple of basement libertarians everywhere

[fafafafa]

we just went over how utility is subjective and only individuals can decide what is most useful to themselves

unless you're going to tell me utility is objective

and i dont drink soda

[1338 h4x0r]

deal

(and I don't watch animé)

maybe some individuals decide that coercing money out of people is useful to themselves

maybe many do

[fafafafa]

and maybe the coerced decide its good too

but right now they dont have that choice

and thats the problem

[1338 h4x0r]

deal with it

[Already_Taken]

i drink soda alcohol and smoke marijuana. i'm a fukin rebel!

[1338 h4x0r]

sorry no you're a conformist douche indulging in prepackaged "rebellion"

[Already_Taken]

oh i just meant a rebel on this page of this thread. marijuana eases my pains pretty much 100% of the time. from being sick to hungover to a headache or upset stomach it helps me.

maybe it's only a placebo effect, but it helps.

[fafafafa]

does it ease the pain of being a failure

[wartomods]

Opium doesnt spread or prolong pain

[Already_Taken]

no if i use marijuana after failing at something normally i just dwell on it even more while i'm high and ask myself why i'm smoking instead of doing something that will help me succeed next time.

just my personal experience tho

[fafafafa]

how many promotions has pot got you at mcdonalds so far

[1338 h4x0r]

Opium doesnt spread or prolong pain

when were we talking about opium

[McP3000]

sorry no you're a conformist douche indulging in prepackaged "rebellion"
or he could be doing it because all of it is fun

even though he is ironically a TV show rebel

[wartomods]

Seriously we should all do opium instead of marijuana.

[McP3000]

what does opium have to do with my post

[1338 h4x0r]

Seriously we should all do opium instead of marijuana.

let's use opium to enslave an entire country

come on you know you wanna

[1338 h4x0r]

I've got dibs on Romania

[McP3000]

opium is so much safer than alcohol and pot duhhh

[wartomods]

opium is so much safer than alcohol and pot duhhh

People praise marijuana , because there is a strong domestic production and commerce. it is a mistake to think marijuana is the drug that is "misunderstood" or the miracle of drugs , the inofensive drug or bullshit. Well its just the usual bullshit what happened to alchohol and tobacco, marijuana is becoming more acceptable socially and people ignore other drugs.

[Berner]

I read the article and I'm not convinced. They are describing endocannabinoids and their effect on the CNS. It sounds like they are assuming because they are in the same functional group family that they will have a similar effect. However this is not always the case. There are times when two enantiomers of the same compound will have a totally different effect on the body than each other ie the S enantiomer for Thalidomide caused birth defects while the R enantiomer helped cure morning sickness.

If they are really interested in concluding that THC and the other cannabinoids found in marijuana are capable of the results they found with the endocannabinoids then they should be researching exactly that. Until that time, the conclusion that marijuana increases pain perception is dubious at best.

[RNR]

That's downright reasonable.

I think that a high dosage of Marijuana aggravates inflammatory pain from personal experience. That's not its medical use though. It's used to relieve nausea and stimulate the appetite in people suffering of chronic illness.

edit: by aggravates I mean that it hurts more while you're high, but not afterwards.

[Chu]

I got bored of reading the thread after a while.

If you smoke to get high, you're so ****ing out of it you're not going to feel amplified pain - in fact I'm numb and I think it's from the pot smoking.
I would think eating is the same, but no experience etc.

Chad, I remember you saying before you don't do drugs, and I'm not here to preach, but, would you? In saying that I basically mean would you have a spliffie?

[siva_chair]

If I didn't have to occasionally take a piss test for my company I would probably be doing bong rips for liberty on a fairly regular basis.

[gregulus]

Weed's overrated. I'd rather drink a good beer.

[Berner]

I'd rather have the weed then drink the good beer.

[gregulus]

I'd rather have the weed then drink the good beer.

fight me.

[gregulus]

no jk ilu.

[Berner]

I <3 u

[Mr. Ron]

I'd rather have the weed then drink the good beer.
Ok I've had both and I have to say a high quality beer is much more satisfying.

[Berner]

But the beer tastes better after a nice joint.

[stevensonmat2]

Ok I've had both and I have to say a high quality beer is much more satisfying.

truth

[fafafafa]

Chad, I remember you saying before you don't do drugs, and I'm not here to preach, but, would you? In saying that I basically mean would you have a spliffie?
well idk what you mean

if i wanted to do it i would do it without hesitation, im not opposed to taking drugs for my pleasure but i havent felt the need so far i guess

i'd be more inclined to do something other than pot though

[Mr. Ron]

chad i think you need to find christ

[fafafafa]

but jesus hates fun

[Mr. Ron]

You mean a 34 year old jew that still lived home with his mom doesn't sound like fun!?

[fafafafa]

hey, alexander is only 20

[gregulus]

ok that was actually kind of funny. sorry alex.

[Berner]

hey, alexander is only 20


I lol'd.

[1338 h4x0r]

I read the article and I'm not convinced. They are describing endocannabinoids and their effect on the CNS. It sounds like they are assuming because they are in the same functional group family that they will have a similar effect. However this is not always the case.

yeah but as far as I know if it looks like a neurotransmitter it generally acts like that neurotransmitter

[Berner]

They still need to investigate it to make the claim. Until then that conclusion isn't necessarily correct.

[1338 h4x0r]

it's very likely to be correct

[Berner]

Still need to verify it. Until then it's only conjecture at best.

lrn2science

[Chu]

I don't actually drink any alcohol, I just smoke heaps.

I can't stand beer, and nearly every-time I touch spirits* I end up hurling.

*I haven't had a drink for 5 years+.

More people should get high imo. :p

[1338 h4x0r]

Still need to verify it. Until then it's only conjecture at best.

lrn2science

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/832447

"Pain detection thresholds were altered unpredictably with high THC doses, but analgesia as indicated by pain tolerance was less than that after diazepam and placebo."

great, unpredictable, just like everything else involving illicit drugs

the research is just as good as stoner anecdotes

[Smokey D]

As we have established, it ought to be determined on a case by case basis in close consultation between a doctor and patient with a view to the best interests of the patient.

If the patient experiences benefit, it is not for you to tell him or her that he or she is wrong.

[1338 h4x0r]

deal with it

[Smokey D]

Er, surely you're the one who needs to learn to deal with things that do not concern you.

[1338 h4x0r]

I wonder whether I should rat out my sister on her MDMA use

[1338 h4x0r]

there were pictures of her on fb that said "rollin on e"

[cobert]

Definitely.

[1338 h4x0r]

or should I just let her keep using ecstasy

I'm not sure which outcome will be more hilarious

[gregulus]

I dunno. Ratting her out will probably just strain your relationship with her (though I have no idea how it is presently).

[cobert]

If he's willing to let his sister do ecstasy for lols, then it's probably not too great.

[1338 h4x0r]

we all die alone

[gregulus]

we all die alone

It's true.

[1338 h4x0r]

pretty cold

but then again so is the world

[fafafafa]

rat her out to who

ecstasy isnt that bad, but you should be sure before snitching, you should post the pictures so that we can verify