Greats Who Play Behind The Beat.

[Retarded Chipple]

Hey guys :)

Below is waveform of a recording I did earlier. The top line is the groove I was playing to, the bottom line (purple) is me. As you can see, I seem to sit ever so slightly behind the beat.

http://i128.photobucket.com/albums/p173/smurfinjoe/wave.jpg


So I was wondering, how many of the greats (if any!) play/played just behind the beat like this?



Also, any tips for shifting my time centre forwards by many fractions of a second would be welcome. I already try to bury the click by making it disappear but somehow I still gravitate towards the back of the pulse.


Thanks guys :)

[billdrum]

I don't know that its a good thing to ALWAYS be behind the beat. To me it depends on the style of music you're playing, or the specific feel of the song. Some are meant to be played somewhat behind the beat, others aren't. A drummer should be able to adjust accordingly.

[Seafroggys]

I tend to play behind the beat as well.

I think Ringo was a laid back player as well.

[ant_182]

It all depends how you're playing. Think of it as an elastic band. You can stretch it or let it shrink. But its no use snapped or too loose. so when you're playing fast punk etc. just drive the music and sit infront of the click, pop etc try to stay tight on the beat. when you're chilling back with a song, then just be right behind the beep?

[We_Love_Lime]

Probably Those funk clowns.
Stubblefield
Dunbar
Purdie

[Seafroggys]

Yeah, I would say funk is gonna be behind the beat, and aggresive punk and metal is gonna be ahead of the beat.

[Damo]

You sure its not recording latency that is causing the issue?

[Aaron]

I tend to play behind the beat as well.

I think Ringo was a laid back player as well.
It's not about being a laid back player, it's about playing appropriately for the song.

[(*The Noonward Race*)]

j dilla questlove flying lotus

[We_Love_Lime]

Questlove.
What
A
Joke.

Chad Smith plays behind the beat too....

[(*The Noonward Race*)]

questlove is an awesome drummer

[We_Love_Lime]

Hardly.
Only thing impressive about him, is his attention span to play the same loop for 4 minutes.
And then play another 4 minute song incorporating a different, yet vaguely similar drum pattern.
And I'm being dead serious about that attention span (that's pretty hard actually if you think about it)

Granted, I've never seen them live so...
But I mean.
When Drum Solo's apparently consist of this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vp6866n-Ci0
Then I don't know man...

He's solid. Probably an excellent Entrepreneur as well,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BgQdWoIkbCk&feature=related

But.
If you find something amazing from his legendary "You Got Me" drumming, then tell me what it is... Because I have no idea..

[(*The Noonward Race*)]

yeah he plays in a hiphop r&b group dude

his drumming is heavily influenced by beat makers and he's one of the few who get it right

okay heres someone

karriem riggins

[Sabian4015]

Questlove is a good drummer. He's not a great soloist, so what? He is an extremely solid drummer, and a great R&B drummer.

[-TGP-]

are you actually raggin' on my boy q-l?

you're actually ****ed in the head.

pocket playing is the hardest thing to do..... questlove takes a simple 2-4 groove and makes it oh so hip, unlike anything you're small brain is capable of.

[(*The Noonward Race*)]

guys if you like q get on j dilla thats his man right there no homo

[-TGP-]

oh man, been there and back

dilla
quest
p rock
people under the stairs
knaww mean

[(*The Noonward Race*)]

all drummers

get on this swing it's the future

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CybO7XtYpdU

[We_Love_Lime]

Lol
Pocket Playing's the hardest thing to do?
Please.

He's a great drummer in that he fills his roll excellently.
He knows his space, his limits, and he plays within his parameters.

But so does Meg White.

[(*The Noonward Race*)]

it's not that simple, there are whole genres devoted to "pocket playing" (groove)

q is hiphop shi

there's a difference between some random drumkit guy's perception of pocket and the average hip hop beat makers perception of syncopation coherence

just like there's a difference between zakir hussein or dennis chambers' idea

[We_Love_Lime]

Lol
Who dubbed me "random drumkit guy's" and you "average hip hop beat maker"?

I see no validity in your arguments other than the fact that you and TGB are slandering me with insults. And no duh there's a difference between Zakir Hussein and Dennis Chambers.

But give me one impressive Questlove video, And I'll be quiet.

Noonward, TGP, Sabian, I've already hopped on the Questlove dick.
And frankly I wasn't pleased.

If you're so concerned with perception, can't you see that I have a perception, that's equally as accurate as yours?
But I'm glad we're handling this somewhat civil.

[(*The Noonward Race*)]

Who dubbed me "random drumkit guy's" and you "average hip hop beat maker"?um no im not that or you're not that either
But give me one impressive Questlove video, And I'll be quiet. his playing and collaboration and interviews show he's got good ideas and i don't have to give any proof he is good by the way, i just like his music/drumming

If you're so concerned with perception, can't you see that I have a perception, that's equally as accurate as yours?
But I'm glad we're handling this somewhat civil.that's the whole idea, we can be precocious with our arguments validity in relation to others for the sake of refining our own ideas, it's the internet, no prob dude

[We_Love_Lime]

It was mostly directed towards TGP, who I thought was being somewhat ... I don't even know.


Fair enough.
But look at Gerald Heyward. R and B/Hip-Hop drummer right?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7sGDqVHGvj8
There's a version playing with Jay-Z's "Show Me What You Got" and it's pretty straightforward. He doesn't go all out like Royster or anybody. He holds the pocket pretty well, questlove like caliber.

But here's another video of him just killingg it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uP5nLHoSjdc

The second's more unrealistically of what he should do on a destiny's child song, but it demonstrates his technical ability correct?

I've yet to see Questlove demonstrate technical ability that's even half of that of Aaron Spears, Teddy Cambell, Gerald Heyward, etc...

They know when to groove. To keep it simple, because after all it is a Hip-Hop/R and B track right?
But when the time calls for it they'll take a measure break to just go silly. Think of Aaron Spears when he played with Usher
http://www.drummerworld.com/Videos/aaronspearsslow.html

I think that's it.
I mean. Pretty straightforward before that, definitely a bit more busy than Questlove usually gets, but you see my point.

These other guys can choose when to use it. Either they do or they don't, and it all calls for the music, which is respectable and understandable.

Questlove doesn't. And to my knowledge, from what I've seen and heard, does not possess the technical ability. Which makes him only 1/2 the players the aforementioned are.

[Moon Flavor]

You sure its not recording latency that is causing the issue?

I'm gonna go with this guy...

[sLarkin20]

Questlove plays on Late Night with Jimmy Fallon, so he's obviously amazing.

[coventrydrummer]

I've tried playing one eighth note late one songs like Suck My Kiss, and the result is quite interesting. While I don't think the solid funk of Suck My Kiss is the best song to really try this on, it's an interesting method to use nonetheless.

[-TGP-]

I really don't care enough to write a book, like you seem to want to do.

You suck, your opinions are wrong, and I will say whatever I wanna say.

Questlove is the best hip hop drummer out there, like it or not.

:)

[DrumIntoTheNight]

I've tried playing one eighth note late one songs like Suck My Kiss, and the result is quite interesting. While I don't think the solid funk of Suck My Kiss is the best song to really try this on, it's an interesting method to use nonetheless.


Displacement =/= a laid back feel.

[We_Love_Lime]

I really don't care enough to write a book, like you seem to want to do.

You suck, your opinions are wrong, and I will say whatever I wanna say.

Questlove is the best hip hop drummer out there, like it or not.

:)

Ahh
You got me :p

[-TGP-]

blah blah blah blah blah
Why does he need to blow his chops to be the best hiphop drummer?
I mean yeah, shedding is sick but sometimes it's just too much.
Show me one oldschool hip hop song where it has a drummer shedding... questlove is oldschool, it's straight groove and it's pocket... the guy has phenomenal timing and rhythm.

also,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ptIj5Bpi4so&feature=related

grooving, and singing james brown? oh yeah, impressive.

[We_Love_Lime]

I think you might have missed my point.
I didn't say you need to "blow your chops to be the best hip hop drummer"
I'm saying as a drummer, you need to possess some technical ability whether you use it or not. Or else you're not really that good. Am I right here?

I'd just rather see Questlove be able to shred and not, as apposed to not shredding because he can't.

[-TGP-]

How do you know he can't though?

I mean you're correct, there are no videos that show him shedding, but there are also no videos of him doing it, so you really don't know.

[We_Love_Lime]

It just seems that there have been some certain instances when he could be shredding.
The Drum N Bass thing at the end of "You Got Me"
Certainly for live shows he could do something remarkable for that? Because if you just have him and like "Knuckles" or whoever the **** plays bongos just playing Jungle beats on every live video...It gets kind of old you know?

I mean I know there isn't much room for Hip Hop to get non-repetitive, especially live stuff when you just have a DJ spinning a vinyl. But the Roots are at an advantage that they have LIVE instrumentation, so I'd hope they'd (or at least Questlove considering he might be the most talented musician out of the lot) would just go silly from time to time.
Maybe I just haven't seen this live concert/album yet.

Or Maybe I might just be asking too much.

I'm probably just jealous of his wicked hair.

[(*The Noonward Race*)]

Or Maybe I might just be asking too much. you're asking something which is weird

[some jive turkey]

The most playing I have heard from questlove is on The Philadelphia experiement.
It's enjoyable.

[We_Love_Lime]

you're asking something which is weird

Such as?

[EADGCF]

questlove is an awesome drummer

Yes.

[Sponer]

I'm probably just jealous of his wicked hair.

i know i am.

[ExquisiteGhost]

It just seems that there have been some certain instances when he could be shredding.
The Drum N Bass thing at the end of "You Got Me"
Certainly for live shows he could do something remarkable for that? Because if you just have him and like "Knuckles" or whoever the **** plays bongos just playing Jungle beats on every live video...It gets kind of old you know?

I mean I know there isn't much room for Hip Hop to get non-repetitive, especially live stuff when you just have a DJ spinning a vinyl. But the Roots are at an advantage that they have LIVE instrumentation, so I'd hope they'd (or at least Questlove considering he might be the most talented musician out of the lot) would just go silly from time to time.
Maybe I just haven't seen this live concert/album yet.

Or Maybe I might just be asking too much.

I'm probably just jealous of his wicked hair.
this is you:

i don't like ?love he doesnt shred he plays the music he plays

[We_Love_Lime]

Lol.
Fair enough.

[Det_Nosnip]

I've tried playing one eighth note late one songs like Suck My Kiss, and the result is quite interesting. While I don't think the solid funk of Suck My Kiss is the best song to really try this on, it's an interesting method to use nonetheless.

An 8th note?!

That is WAAY too behind the beat. Anything that qualifies as a useful note value (32nd up, for average tempos) is not "behind the beat," it's "out of time." There's a subtle, but very important difference between the two.

[billdrum]

An 8th note behind is not "playing behind the beat". That's called beat displacement...totally different concept.