Should Automatic Weapons Be Banned From Being Sold?

[adb]

I just don't understand why they are allowed to be purchased or sold, no matter how strict the gun laws are and how hard they are to attain.

Why would an average human being need one, aside from readying for a ****ing zombie attack or something.

[kattunlover69]

this is a stupid ****ing question, why would you keep people having fun with auto matic weapons for?

[Mr. Ron]

No.

Mainly because there are thousands of them (all legal) in the US already in legal hands and no problems have come out of it.

[Jaymz Hetfield]

no average citizen NEEDS automatic weapons for anything. but ideally, you'd be able to get one and do what you wanted with it...of course you know some dumbass redneck or gangster or suicidal guy who hates his job would just ruin the fun for everyone

[Charlie Daniels]

How are the automatic weapons manufacturers meant to make a living if they can only give their products away?

And a country's military need to be able to buy these weapons to defend themselves (or attack another a country). Not to mention law enforcement make good use of these weapons.

And believe me as soon as you ban them from being sold, the manufacturers aren't going to keep producing them. I mean why would they? You are pretty naive to think they'll just start giving them away for free!

[McP3000]

no average citizen NEEDS automatic weapons for anything. but ideally, you'd be able to get one and do what you wanted with it...of course you know some dumbass redneck or gangster or suicidal guy who hates his job would just ruin the fun for everyone
you are so ****ing stupid.

First of all, no body needs anything. People don't need alcohol, hunting knifes, or even cds. That is a preposterous sentiment

Also, almost all homicides and murders are done with handguns or rifles. Not to mention that rednecks never, and i mean never go "crazy". Its usually emotionally disturbed late teens, early twenties kids.
Plus "gangsters" only kill other "gangsters".

This anti-automatic weapon idea is nothing but ignorance of the subject and fear-mongering.

[Mr. Ron]

this is perfectly legal in America

and its awesome

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8rNNXkOCi0

[Jaymz Hetfield]

you are so ****ing stupid. Almost all homicides and murders are done with handguns or rifles. Not to mention that rednecks never, and i mean never go "crazy". Its usually emotionally disturbed late teens, early twenties kids.
Plus "gangsters" only kill other "gangsters".

This anti-automatic weapon idea is nothing but ignorance of the subject and fear-mongering.

Really? Handguns and rifles are responsible for most homicides? Are they also the only legal and readily available type of gun to your average citizen? They sure are! I'm not against them, but like I said some dumbasses would misuse them just like any other awesome toy and they'd get rebanned.

In reference to the rednecks....i'm just saying they'd be more likely to just get drunk and accidently do something dumb. Gangsters will use them for whatever gets them money, and yes on other gangsters. And some pathetic, depressed SOB will just use them to go postal on his entire office. It sucks, but it's the world we live in.

[McP3000]

Really? Handguns and rifles are responsible for most homicides? Are they also the only legal and readily available type of gun to your average citizen? They sure are! I'm not against them, but like I said some dumbasses would misuse them just like any other awesome toy and they'd get rebanned.
The rifles to a certain extent, but most crimes are done with illegally owned handguns.

In reference to the rednecks....i'm just saying they'd be more likely to just get drunk and accidently do something dumb.
You are stereotyping so badly it makes my blood swell you prejudice prick

Gangsters will use them for whatever gets them money, and yes on other gangsters. And some pathetic, depressed SOB will just use them to go postal on his entire office. It sucks, but it's the world we live in.
im sorry you are appealing to emotion but i dont care. Our government shouldn't be ran on emotion, it should be ran on justice, practicality, and above all, the rights of the individual.

[adb]

How are the automatic weapons manufacturers meant to make a living if they can only give their products away?

And a country's military need to be able to buy these weapons to defend themselves (or attack another a country). Not to mention law enforcement make good use of these weapons.

And believe me as soon as you ban them from being sold, the manufacturers aren't going to keep producing them. I mean why would they? You are pretty naive to think they'll just start giving them away for free!

I'm not saying ban them from the military, but for the average joe. I just don't see how they help in anyway. Anytime you hear anything about them is when some teen shoots up a school with one.

[griftadan]

there's little evidence to say that it's a big problem at all

[McP3000]

I'm not saying ban them from the military, but for the average joe. I just don't see how they help in anyway. Anytime you hear anything about them is when some teen shoots up a school with one.
Thats also the same time when i hear how DEATH METAL bands are polluting our youths minds with hate

whats your point? The news corporations like to instill fear in its viewers to raise their ratings.

[Mr. Ron]

I'm not saying ban them from the military, but for the average joe. I just don't see how they help in anyway. Anytime you hear anything about them is when some teen shoots up a school with one.

why do you have to have some utilitarian use for something for people to own them?

btw there has never been a school shooting that involved an automatic fire arms.

[adb]

Thats also the same time when i hear how DEATH METAL bands are polluting our youths minds with hate

whats your point? The news corporations like to instill fear in its viewers to raise their ratings.

not really, auto weapons can kill multiple people with ease, death metal can't.



btw there has never been a school shooting that involved an automatic fire arms.
oh really? I just read about some guy in Finland who used an auto pistol

[McP3000]

its because of all the FINNISH DEATH METAL HATE MUSIC

edit: he probably got it illegally anyway, finland has much stronger gun laws that the US im fairly sure

[Jaymz Hetfield]

The rifles to a certain extent, but most crimes are done with illegally owned handguns.


You are stereotyping so badly it makes my blood swell you prejudice prick


im sorry you are appealing to emotion but i dont care. Our government shouldn't be ran on emotion, it should be ran on justice, practicality, and above all, the rights of the individual.

Lol you really shouldn't be angry at me, I pretty much agree with you. BTW I've grown up and live in south Georgia...I know many many rednecks and it would not surprise me AT ALL if one of them did something completely ridiculous with any kind of gun. But of course it'd cause so much more of a ruckus if it were an automatic weapon. I'd like to think people would know how to handle themselves with such responsibilities, but the fact is they won't....and enough stupid incidents will probably always happen to ruin the fun for everyone.

[Mr. Ron]

not really, auto weapons can kill multiple people with ease, death metal can't.


oh really? I just read about some guy in Finland who used an auto pistol

ok so do you know the difference between semi-auto and full auto?

[adb]

ok so do you know the difference between semi-auto and full auto?
uhh yeah, I don't recall if it was a semi or full the guy was using, but I'm pretty sure that someone has used auto before in a shooting

@and yeah the rights of an individual blah blah blah. But seriously, is there any good things that comes of people owning auto weapons other that "omg its cool and shi"

[Mr. Ron]

and yeah the rights of an individual blah blah blah. But seriously, is there any good things that comes of people owning auto weapons other that "omg its cool and shi"

why does something good have to come from something to be legitimate or ok to own?

[adb]

because auto guns have no uses in society's hands. They have zero practical use. Any blunt object or even a handgun/rifle can have a practical use. auto weapons don't have any.

[Krabsworth]

NO they shouldn't. They have never been used for mass shootings, and if you want one, and you are qualified, not a felon, etc. you mine as well be allowed to have one.

[Mr. Ron]

because auto guns have no uses in society's hands. They have zero practical use. Any blunt object or even a handgun/rifle can have a practical use. auto weapons don't have any.

Thats not a reason not to own a fully automatic weapon. Again, most violent gun-related crimes are done with semi-automatic weapons. I think there has been one incident with a LEGAL fully automatic weapon in the US and it was done by a disgruntled police officer.

Actually, if you want to talk about practicality a weapon with an auto setting is much more useful for home defense than one that doesn't.


I still don't think you know the difference between semi-automatic and fully automatic is.

[FallingSnow]

its because of all the FINNISH DEATH METAL HATE MUSIC

edit: he probably got it illegally anyway, finland has much stronger gun laws that the US im fairly sure

This, in its entireity. Actually, my sentiment for point number two was "where are your gun control laws now?". I'm sure that wasn't your point exactly, but that's my expansion of the subject.

Regardless:

1. A great many things can be harmful if used in the wrong way, including anything ranging from bathroom cleaner to nuclear missles.

2. Banning things not only rarely solves an issue, but can (and does) often backfire.

3. You cannot ban everything that is capable of doing harm. It's physically and theoretically impossible.

4. As we continue to see, making something illegal never prevents it from being manufactured or distributed in various ways.

5. Automatic weapons have very many constructive (and constructively destructive) uses.

[Krabsworth]

Actually, if you want to talk about practicality a weapon with an auto setting is much more useful for home defense than one that doesn't.

I kinda would like to have an automatic just to go shoot at a range. I would never want to live in my house again after spraying a guy with an automatic weapon in it. lol.

[Mr. Ron]

Plus many states (like mine) have INCREDIBLY strict rules against civilians owning fully-automatic firearms. You need a special license to even touch one legally. So its not like bubba can go down to Wal-Mart and buy an M60.


I kinda would like to have an automatic just to go shoot at a range. I would never want to live in my house again after spraying a guy with an automatic weapon in it. lol.

Not spraying

short, controlled bursts.

[adb]

please tell me uses for them. Home defense isn't valid, you don't need a full auto weapon to protect you

[Krabsworth]

You're right. You need two. One concealed in every room perhaps.

[Mr. Ron]

please tell me uses for them. Home defense isn't valid, you don't need a full auto weapon to protect you

I don't need to have any specific uses for a firearm tbh.

I don't need a full auto weapon to protect me, but I don't see why someone shouldn't be able to have one for such a purpose.

[FallingSnow]

please tell me uses for them. Home defense isn't valid, you don't need a full auto weapon to protect you

That's not the point. If you really want to preach about only the necessities, humans only need food, water, shelter, and air. Nobody needs a whole **** of a lot.

However, automatic weapons can be used for self or home defense. They can also be of use to the military, law enforcement, and security organisations.

[McP3000]

Lol you really shouldn't be angry at me, I pretty much agree with you. BTW I've grown up and live in south Georgia...I know many many rednecks and it would not surprise me AT ALL if one of them did something completely ridiculous with any kind of gun. But of course it'd cause so much more of a ruckus if it were an automatic weapon. I'd like to think people would know how to handle themselves with such responsibilities, but the fact is they won't....and enough stupid incidents will probably always happen to ruin the fun for everyone.
Im a Texas born and fed kid. I moved out a month ago for college, but im still a Texan at heart.

I get rowdy because so many people here are so ignorant about the modern day southern lifestyle.

[BridgeToSolace]

Plus "gangsters" only kill other "gangsters".

Oh, and innocent bystanders.

And you're much less likely to miss when you're using an automatic weapon.

Especially if you're an untrained gung-ho idiot who doesn't understand that short bursts are necessary for accuracy!

[griftadan]

because auto guns have no uses in society's hands. They have zero practical use. Any blunt object or even a handgun/rifle can have a practical use. auto weapons don't have any.

they actually have the same use, the auto weapon is just better at it

and really how many things have no use in society that could be potentially harmful but we still tolerate because some people get enjoyment out of it?

[McP3000]

Oh, and innocent bystanders.

And you're much less likely to miss when you're using an automatic weapon.

Especially if you're an untrained gung-ho idiot who doesn't understand that short bursts are necessary for accuracy!
you're stupid
i mean really. It was a half baked attempt at humor, you took it seriously. "Gangsters" dont kill each other in open daylight like they do in the movies.

[Krabsworth]

I don't see why people try so hard to ban automatic firearms. There is no major incidents of anyone doing huge mass shootings with autos. In fact, (Virginia Tech comes to mind), major shootings have been done with relatively "weak" 9mm type handguns and what not...so, I think as long as it is well regulated (hoho), and no shmuck can walk into Gander mtn and buy some serious ***, full autos mine as well be legal.

[McP3000]

they actually have the same use, the auto weapon is just better at it

and really how many things have no use in society that could be potentially harmful but we still tolerate because some people get enjoyment out of it?
Literally everything that isnt food, water, or clothing

[Cellophane]

Happiness is a Warm Gun

[Mr. Ron]

Now, with all of this being said, I think there should be strict laws governing the misuse of all firearms.

[Against Miik!]

No they shouldn't be illegal. The people who are gonna do harm with them are going to get them regardless.

And its not like you can walk into a Wal Mart and walk about with a M4.

[Mr. Ron]

inb4 cocksleeves

[Krabsworth]

And its not like you can walk into a Wal Mart and walk about with a M4.

yeah that just sounds too much like counterstrike

[Cellophane]

You can only "govern" the misuse of guns until after they've been misused.

[Krabsworth]

You can only "govern" the misuse of guns until after they've been misused.

really. then what is it when some crazy ****er isn't allowed to buy one?

[Der Übermensch]

Trick question. They ARE illegal to be sold! No new automatic weapons (with a few exceptions I assume) have been allowed on the market since 1986. Only those that already were in private hands at that point are still out there and the private transfer of such weapons requires an extreme vetting process by the government for approval.

[guitrguy]

you are so ****ing stupid.

First of all, no body needs anything. People don't need alcohol, hunting knifes, or even cds. That is a preposterous sentiment

Also, almost all homicides and murders are done with handguns or rifles. Not to mention that rednecks never, and i mean never go "crazy". Its usually emotionally disturbed late teens, early twenties kids.
Plus "gangsters" only kill other "gangsters".

This anti-automatic weapon idea is nothing but ignorance of the subject and fear-mongering.
this would be a great argument if the the comparisons you tried to make were on the same level as an assault weapon.

[FallingSnow]

this would be a great argument if the the comparisons you tried to make were on the same level as an assault weapon.

What determines the "level" of an assault rifle? Many things are just as deadly by virtue of end result: death.

[Against Miik!]

Trick question. They ARE illegal to be sold! No new automatic weapons (with a few exceptions I assume) have been allowed on the market since 1986. Only those that already were in private hands at that point are still out there and the private transfer of such weapons requires an extreme vetting process by the government for approval.

Good call. I honestly didn't know that applied to all automatics across the board, I thought it was just some specific ones.

Even still, the question can easily be modified to make sense, like, should civilians be allowed to own automatic weapons.

[BridgeToSolace]

you're stupid
i mean really. It was a half baked attempt at humor, you took it seriously and made me realize how dumb you are. "Gangsters" dont kill each other in open daylight like they do in the movies.

oh noes, u think im dumb :(

Which point do you disagree with:

1) Innocent bystanders get shot as a result of gang violence

2) Gang members are poorly trained in proper shooting tactics and are thus more likely to just hold the trigger down until the target drops.

3) Holding the trigger down results in more bullets fired in the same amount of time than the average semi-automatic and the decrease in accuracy due to recoil results bullets that do not hit the target.

http://www.nicaso.com/pages/doc_page196.html

"They (gang killers today) tend to shoot more and are less accurate when they do shoot," said Antonio Nicaso, a senior partner in the Soave Consulting Group and the author of several books on organized crime.

Today's gangland killers are often far younger and more impulsive than the Pot of Gold gunmen, experts say.

"It seems to me they're just randomly firing away," says Mike Davis, who was on the Toronto police homicide squad for 16 years before becoming a crime consultant in Mendelson Davis Consulting Partners.

That makes them far more prone to hit bystanders, like the Boxing Day gunfire on Yonge St. that killed 15-year-old Jane Creba and injured six others.

Nicaso notes that as many as 15 people were involved in the Boxing Day gunfire, and yet no gang members were believed to be among the seven people who were hit by bullets.

If the gang thing was just a joke, don't blame me because your shitty paragraph structure and unnecessarily aggressive style of "discussion" makes it impossible to tell when you're kidding.

[FallingSnow]

If automatic weapons didn't exist, gang members would be forced to aquire better aim, which would make deaths less by chance, more by intention. Result: more accurate killing. How is that better?

[Cellophane]

really. then what is it when some crazy ****er isn't allowed to buy one?

Preventing misuse.

[Der Übermensch]

Good call. I honestly didn't know that applied to all automatics across the board, I thought it was just some specific ones.
All Class III weapons (Any thing with auto fire, short rifles/shotguns, silencers, destructive devices) are NFA items.

Even still, the question can easily be modified to make sense, like, should civilians be allowed to own automatic weapons.
Quite true, in which I am fully in support of their legality, within reason of course. As I've said before, the entire system of buying firearms in this country needs to be revamped.

[Krabsworth]

Preventing misuse.

Isn't that governing?

[Sk0rpi0n]

We need automatic weapons and we need to support the rights of others to own them. If any single person is ever going to beat the 30+ murders from Virginia Tech and finally get something interesting back on the news, we need to start giving these away to people on medication for depression. And Schizophrenia. And PMSing.

In conclusion it should be mandatory that everyone own a fully loaded, fully automatic weapon with the safety broken, the serial numbers filed off, a good butt stock and the expertise to use it with deadly accuracy.
(Sarcasm)

[BridgeToSolace]

If automatic weapons didn't exist, gang members would be forced to aquire better aim, which would make deaths less by chance, more by intention. Result: more accurate killing. How is that better?

Well, by this line, I think there are two scenarios being weighed.

1) Less Accurate Killing - You kill the guy you want to kill, but other people end up dying in the process.

2) More Accurate Killing - You kill the guy you want to kill.

So yes, between those two, more accurate killing is better.

[FallingSnow]

Well, by this line, I think there are two scenarios being weighed.

1) Less Accurate Killing - You kill the guy you want to kill, but other people end up dying in the process.

2) More Accurate Killing - You kill the guy you want to kill.

So yes, between those two, more accurate killing is better.

No, because success at targeting breeds more targets. Confidence in one's ability goes up, and thus so does one's desire to accomplish the task more often, knowing his heightened ability to annihilate those he doesn't like/has disputes with. So it is no better in my opinion.

[guitrguy]

What determines the "level" of an assault rifle? Many things are just as deadly by virtue of end result: death.

one out of those has much more dangerous potential than the rest

[Cellophane]

Isn't that governing?

Why not?

[FallingSnow]

one out of those has much more dangerous potential than the rest

How one can get much more dangerous in potential than death is beyond me.

[Sk0rpi0n]

We need automatic weapons and we need to support the rights of others to own them. If any single person is ever going to beat the 30+ murders from Virginia Tech and finally get something interesting back on the news, we need to start giving these away to people on medication for depression. And Schizophrenia. And PMSing.

In conclusion it should be mandatory that everyone own a fully loaded, fully automatic weapon with the safety broken, the serial numbers filed off, a good butt stock and the expertise to use it with deadly accuracy.
(Sarcasm)

Damn. You are so right. i never thought of it this way before. Thank you so much for enlightening me.

[BridgeToSolace]

No, because success at targeting breeds more targets. Confidence in one's ability goes up, and thus so does one's desire to accomplish the task more often, knowing his heightened ability to annihilate those he doesn't like/has disputes with. So it is no better in my opinion.

I doubt this is the case, to be honest, but I don't know enough about the psychology of gang members to know how much they luv killin'.

I don't think you know either, but oh well.

How one can get much more dangerous in potential than death is beyond me.

uhhhhhhhh, potential for more death?

[Amit]

this is perfectly legal in America

and its awesome

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8rNNXkOCi0

i really want a mimigun

remember her

http://multiplepersonalitess.files.wordpress.com/2008/03/bobeck_mimi2.jpg

automatic weapons are gay as hell tbh

H&K G3 ftw

[FallingSnow]

I doubt this is the case, to be honest, but I don't know enough about the psychology of gang members to know how much they luv killin'.

I don't think you know either, but oh well.

I don't believe either one of us is qualified to do a valid psychoanalysis of a gang member either; I was just stating a very real possibility in my mind.

Regardless, one death isn't better than 10 in my opinion. No one should have to die needlessly. I just don't believe legislation like that really does any good.

[guitrguy]

How one can get much more dangerous in potential than death is beyond me.

the ease of causing multiple deaths is more dangerous than being capable of causing one death. Do you need me to hold your hand?

[Sk0rpi0n]

No, because success at targeting breeds more targets. Confidence in one's ability goes up, and thus so does one's desire to accomplish the task more often, knowing his heightened ability to annihilate those he doesn't like/has disputes with. So it is no better in my opinion.

As one person gets better at it though, the police tend to get more involved, more gang members get put away and gang wars tend to die off. Doing a dime isn't the best way to 'hone' your shooting skills.

[Mr. Ron]

i really want a mimigun

remember her

http://multiplepersonalitess.files.wordpress.com/2008/03/bobeck_mimi2.jpg

automatic weapons are gay as hell tbh

H&K G3 ftw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xC7Wokz36I

[FallingSnow]

the ease of causing multiple deaths is more dangerous than being capable of causing one death. Do you need me to hold your hand?


I can just as easily make a pipe bomb out of household materials and knock off plenty of people at once. Do we need to ban most household chemicals/materials too? Blowing **** up is pretty easy, tbh.

And no, you don't. I'm quite capable of having an independant thought; it's just that my thought doesn't coincide with yours. No need to get snippy about it.

[BridgeToSolace]

Regardless, one death isn't better than 10 in my opinion. No one should have to die needlessly. I just don't believe legislation like that really does any good.

One death is better than ten, in my opinion. Although I guess it matters who's dying, I suppose. Brownies are expendable, and Catholics replaceable.

[guitrguy]

I can just as easily make a pipe bomb out of household materials and knock off plenty of people at once. Do we need to ban most household chemicals/materials too? Blowing **** up is pretty easy, tbh.

so? I'm not saying anything about banning materials that could be used to make a gun

[BridgeToSolace]

I can just as easily make a pipe bomb out of household materials and knock off plenty of people at once. Do we need to ban most household chemicals/materials too? Blowing **** up is pretty easy, tbh.

Household chemicals have far more benign and realistic uses than firearms.

For example, I'm pretty sure can't just buy c4 at the store. I couldn't find anything about it being illegal for citizens to own, though >_>

[FallingSnow]

so? I'm not saying anything about banning materials that could be used to make a gun

That's not my point. My point is guns will always be just as accessible, just then through illegal channels. Instead of buying them on main street, we'll have to buy them through the black market.

Also, not to nitpick, but how is allowing people the means to make guns any better than allowing an actual company to manufacture them? Even if I agreed with your opinion, the result you want via the legislation you support isn't possible.

[FallingSnow]

Household chemicals have far more benign and realistic uses than firearms.

For example, I'm pretty sure can't just buy c4 at the store. I couldn't find anything about it being illegal for citizens to own, though >_>

Many gun stores can order materials similar to c4, though I don't know about c4 specifically, either.

[Reaganista]

Also, almost all homicides and murders are done with handguns or rifles. Not to mention that rednecks never, and i mean never go "crazy".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbine_High_School_massacre

Also, not to nitpick, but how is allowing people the means to make guns any better than allowing an actual company to manufacture them?
you can make it illegal to make guns without banning the materials

[Mr. Ron]

Many gun stores can order materials similar to c4, though I don't know about c4 specifically, either.

lol, no they can't. They can order gunpowder for those who reload their own ammo though.

[BridgeToSolace]

That's not my point. My point is guns will always be just as accessible, just then through illegal channels. Instead of buying them on main street, we'll have to buy them through the black market.

I always hear this argument, but for some reason I never hear "Hey, can we divert some attention to stop underground trafficking?"

I'm 100% for changing the war on drugs to war on illegal firearms.

And once we get rid of the illegal firearms, we can make mandatory the system that makes it so only the purchaser (and maybe direct family or something) of a firearm can actually fire it. That way the gun nuts who legally own guns can keep their stupid hobby and no one is going to bother stealing their guns and using them illegally.

Gun problem solved :)

[Shell]

I'd like to be able to shoot an automatic weapon.

[Reaganista]

i'd like to be able to demolish a church
hopefully to build a animal photographs shop in its place

[Mr. Ron]

i'd like to be able to demolish a church
hopefully to build a animal photographs shop in its place

Completely agree.

[Reaganista]

That's not my point. My point is guns will always be just as accessible, just then through illegal channels. Instead of buying them on main street, we'll have to buy them through the black market.
we cant make murder illegal because then people will just murder illegally

Completely agree.
if i ever make it to the gathering investors stage of that project ill let u know stay alert

[Der Übermensch]

automatic weapons are gay as hell tbh

H&K G3 ftw

CoD4 aside, G3 is an automatic weapon...

[guitrguy]

That's not my point. My point is guns will always be just as accessible, just then through illegal channels. Instead of buying them on main street, we'll have to buy them through the black market.

Also, not to nitpick, but how is allowing people the means to make guns any better than allowing an actual company to manufacture them? Even if I agreed with your opinion, the result you want via the legislation you support isn't possible.

lol you might want to figure out my opinion first

[adb]

Trick question. They ARE illegal to be sold! No new automatic weapons (with a few exceptions I assume) have been allowed on the market since 1986. Only those that already were in private hands at that point are still out there and the private transfer of such weapons requires an extreme vetting process by the government for approval.

Hmm, I didn't know that, do you have a link?

[Der Übermensch]

Well, here is how it was explained to me by a guy at my local gun shop who deals in Class III.

Such weapons (class iii) have been highly controlled by the US government since 1934, when the National Firearms Act was passed (thus they are often termed NFA items). Although it was possible for private purchase of NFA items, it was very expensive (transfer tax of 200 was a small fortune at the time), and the vetting process was intense. The market for certain NFA items (mainly automatic firearms) was locked in 1986 and since that point it has been effectively impossible to buy new automatic weapons. Every NFA item has it's own paperwork and transfer certificate. To purchase such an item (from someone else that is...) you must procure a new transfer request from the ATF (used to be the Treasury department that handled this) who will issue you the transfer. This takes up to three months, as an extensive state and federal level background check must be done on you (and I mean EXTENSIVE). This must be done for EVERY CLASS III ITEM YOU PURCHASE. All the paperwork for an item goes with the ITEM not the person.

[Amit]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xC7Wokz36I

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler_&_Koch_G3#Law_enforcement_and_civilian_models

[Iscariot]

of course automatic weapons shouldn't be banned why should we be disallowed from using something that has minimal criminal history

automatic weapons are fun to shoot targets with, they're enjoyable to maintain and repair, and they are very good looking firearms

TBH the people who want firearms banned are those who have never used one, are afraid of them for absolutely no logical reason what so ever, and are in disfavor of the right to bear arms because they are nazi fags

[BridgeToSolace]

large bundle of stickss of a feather flock together, so how am I supposed to find someone to go shooting with?

I'm not afraid of guns. Although I've lost enough of my hearing as it is.

[guitrguy]

of course automatic weapons shouldn't be banned why should we be disallowed from using something that has minimal criminal history

automatic weapons are fun to shoot targets with, they're enjoyable to maintain and repair, and they are very good looking firearms

TBH the people who want firearms banned are those who have never used one, are afraid of them for absolutely no logical reason what so ever, and are in disfavor of the right to bear arms because they are nazi fags

it probably has a minimal criminal history due to the restrictions. idk less access to assualt weapons = less usuage in crimes.

[Iscariot]

if someone wanted an automatic weapon to commit a crime with they could find one

my friend ratu got an ak-47 for $150 from a mexican friend it's not like they're difficult to obtain

they have little criminal use because they're large and difficult to wield and most criminals point a gun without actually shooting it and if you want something to intimidate another person with a handgun is a lot easier to hide/use

[Iscariot]

large bundle of stickss of a feather flock together, so how am I supposed to find someone to go shooting with?

idk find someone that owns a gun? i can go shooting with any one of my friends because we all own a firearm

we take out empty liquor bottles or paper targets to shoot at and go have a couple of beers and fire a few rounds

the image of a bandanna strapped redneck blowing off 500 rounds in 10 minutes is hilarious to me

I'm not afraid of guns. Although I've lost enough of my hearing as it is.

use earplugs mang

[BridgeToSolace]

Earplugs distort sound; takes out too much of the high end, so I don't generally use them when jamming.

And alcohol + guns seems like a terrible idea. If you can't drink and drive, you shouldn't be able to drink and shoot :p

[Iscariot]

it's not like we get drunk, we just split a six-pack between three or four of us and shoot some targets and then go home

[Charlie Daniels]

Earplugs distort sound; takes out too much of the high end, so I don't generally use them when jamming.

And alcohol + guns seems like a terrible idea. If you can't drink and drive, you shouldn't be able to drink and shoot :p

Earphones, the kind tradesmen wear, don't distort the sound much at all... no where near like ear plugs.
You just look daggy wearing them >_<

[BridgeToSolace]

Pfft, I wear daggy without obnoxious headphones. I bet they're expensive though >_>

[Iscariot]

not terribly expensive

http://earplugstore.stores.yahoo.net/walkers-range-ear-muffs.html

$30 isn't bad for a one-time investment

[Sk0rpi0n]

of course automatic weapons shouldn't be banned why should we be disallowed from using something that has minimal criminal history

automatic weapons are fun to shoot targets with, they're enjoyable to maintain and repair, and they are very good looking firearms

TBH the people who want firearms banned are those who have never used one, are afraid of them for absolutely no logical reason what so ever, and are in disfavor of the right to bear arms because they are nazi fags

I agree with you completely, and I would like to go further.
We need automatic weapons for the survival of the species. If any single person is ever going to beat the 30+ murders from Virginia Tech and finally get something interesting back on the news, we need to start giving these away to people on medication for depression and schizophrenia. Polar bears are now endangered species, so they should also be given automatic weapons for self defense.

In conclusion it should be mandatory that everyone own a fully loaded, fully automatic weapon with the safety broken, the serial numbers filed off, a good butt stock, at least 35 seconds of training on how to fire it, and a sweet reflex scope to aid in aiming.

Remember: Guns don't kill people, bullets do.

[Amit]

if everyone at vtech had an automatic weapon then no one would have been killed by henry cho except for mebbe henry cho you dumb ****ing hippy

[Iscariot]

i cannot think of anything more exciting and arousing than polar bears with rifles

[Amit]

maybe henry cho riddled with bullets for being a dumb ****

js

[Iscariot]

that's pretty arousing too

[GreyHam]

personally im against it, but i was brought up in a country with very strict firearms legislation so guns have never been a part of my life

firearms offences (with no stats to hand) seem to be caused more by handguns or at least small, concealable weapons, than ak-47s or whatnot. i dont see any need for automatic weapons, but far too many people value the fun of squeezing off that ammo so who am i to decide for them

in all honesty, theyre probably no less necesery than any other firearm

[Der Übermensch]

if someone wanted an automatic weapon to commit a crime with they could find one

my friend ratu got an ak-47 for $150 from a mexican friend it's not like they're difficult to obtain

they have little criminal use because they're large and difficult to wield and most criminals point a gun without actually shooting it and if you want something to intimidate another person with a handgun is a lot easier to hide/use

When I bought my SKS, a bunch of extra **** came with it.... including a Full-Auto conversion guide. Pretty much any blowback semi-auto can be converted to full auto, but SKS is especially easy... literally less than an hour...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler_&_Koch_G3#Law_enforcement_and_civilian_models
Point being? A G3 is still a full auto weapon...

[Raayl]

gun control is essentially one of the dumbest implementations of regulation ever published. i mean, the stupidity and backwards thinking is jaw-dropping and downright stunning.

i am 100% in favor of being able to own and operate weapons of ANY KIND. gun control to me is "I'll control my gun, you control yours."

unarming law-abiding citizens makes no sense. outlawing assault weapons doesn't mean anything to a criminal advanced enough to need the use of one. they aren't that difficult to obtain illegally.

gun control is a waste of paper and tax dollars.

[Reaganista]

that would be a great idea if 'law abiding citizens' were incapable of breaking the law
or of being stolen from or losing things

[Raayl]

that would be a great idea if 'law abiding citizens' were incapable of breaking the law
or of being stolen from or losing things

i see what you did there

and im all for it

[Reaganista]

um ok

[Already_Taken]

TBH the people who want firearms banned are those who have never used one, are afraid of them for absolutely no logical reason what so ever

except for the fact that they have had guns pointed at them.

[Reaganista]

you dont have to have any experience with guns to have logical reasons to be afraid of them

[Already_Taken]

yes you do cause you never know how fun it is till you shoot something

[FallingSnow]

we cant make murder illegal because then people will just murder illegally


Funny you should mention that....

Think about the truth of what you just said. The large majority of legislation does not prevent the action from being done. It simply makes it illegal now where it was legal before.

With things as extreme as murder, legislation needs to be implemented so that those who commit it can be put away so as to never accomplish the task again. But with anything other than the most extreme of actions, legislation is largely useless.


that would be a great idea if 'law abiding citizens' were incapable of breaking the law
or of being stolen from or losing things

The definition of "law abiding" is usually people that don't break the law, regardless of whether they are capable or not.

[Reaganista]

With things as extreme as gun ownership, legislation needs to be implemented so that those who commit it can be put away so as to never accomplish the task again. But with anything other than the most extreme of actions, legislation is largely useless.

[FallingSnow]

Lol@ gun ownership being extreme.

People would take your posts more seriously if you weren't such an ***.

[Reaganista]

depending on the gun and on priors it's punishable by up to life in prison how is that not extreme

[FallingSnow]

It shouldn't have anything to do with the type of gun, and if priors include murder then the person shouldn't be on the street anyway. It's not the gun's fault the dude has priors. It's not the manufacturer's fault, it's not the person's fault that owns the same type of gun and uses it wisely or doesn't use it at all.

[Reaganista]

depending on the gun and on priors it's punishable by up to life in prison how is that not extreme? question mark added because that was a question

[FallingSnow]

I answered the question. To say that the gun ownership itself is both extreme and the problem to begin with is pretty naive.

[Serenity]

Gun ownership isn't "extreme", nor is it the problem.

The problem is when people don't know when to not pull the trigger, or people with ridiculously harmful intent.

[Iscariot]

except for the fact that they have had guns pointed at them.

find me someone on the street who has had an automatic rifle pointed at them that wasn't in the military and armed with one of their own

[sLarkin20]

Hey guys, knives have been used to kill people before, so lets ban them from being sold.

Also, I think someone has used a vehicle to kill someone before,so we better stop selling those, too.

But, on a serious note, when would a person ever "need" an automatic weapon?

The L.A. riots would be a prime example. You can easily find videos on YouTube of shop owners standing outside their places of business trying to protect them from hundreds of rioters.

A semi-automatic anything isn't going to do a whole lot in that situation.

[DBoons Ghost]

I think everyone should have an automatic weapon over their shoulder and a pistol in their pockets at all times.

I bet we'd see a massive reduction in crime, with no esclation in murder stats. Eh? Eh?

[Iscariot]

of course we would who would be stupid enough to shoot someone when everyone around them has a gun

[sLarkin20]

think everyone should have an automatic weapon over their shoulder and a pistol in their pockets at all times.

I bet we'd see a massive reduction in crime, with no esclation in murder stats. Eh? Eh?

You must not know the correlation between gun control and gun violence.

[DBoons Ghost]

You must not know the correlation between gun control and gun violence.

I think you and I have had this very arguement before.

Not this time! See, I recoginize the shiny bauble from the last time you came fishing in this lake. This time, I am swimming away.

I want one of two things:

Ban all guns, remove them from existence! (lol, yeah right)

Or

Give them to everyone. Even kids. Everyone like the wild west. Like Jared said, who would be stupid enought to shoot someone when they fear getting shot themself?

[EarthLadenFingers]

Plus "gangsters" only kill other "gangsters".


so you're saying it's ok to kill someone as long as theyre a "gangster""

[Reaganista]

that's gangster

[P13]

only if they are both gangsta
Does anyone really need automatic weapons?

[sLarkin20]

Yes.

[Babble]

Give them to everyone. Even kids. Everyone like the wild west. Like Jared said, who would be stupid enought to shoot someone when they fear getting shot themself?

Psychos looking to start mass chaos and/or people who were dumb enough to think they can avoid retribution, like, I dunno, a majority of criminals.

Either way, I think it's a state issue, not a federal one. Let california or somewhere toy with it and if it works, the federal gov't can adopt it.

I can't see it making much of a difference besides pissing off the NRA who really do need to shoot 400 rounds/minute or whatever those things do.

[P13]

Give them to everyone. Even kids. Everyone like the wild west. Like Jared said, who would be stupid enought to shoot someone when they fear getting shot themself?
lots of people got shot in the wild west.

[iamjoe2]

gun laws are pretty stupid. you should restrict who can buy one, not what they can buy. lets face it, if someone decides to **** up there office with a gun, does it really matter what kind it is, every gun, knife, nail gun, and phone cable. is capable of killing somthing.


for instance.

say one of your coworkers walks into your office, and wips out a gun. does it really matter if that shits automatic? no, people are gonna get greased eaither way. theirs nothing you can do about it.

btw newsflash. its really ****ing easy to get a semi-auto rife converted to fully auto. just take it to any gun smith. there will always be poeple who will do it for you.

weeds illegal, all kinds of people still buy/sell it. how will making automatic weapons illegal make any difference. the poeple that want them will still get their hands on them

[iamjoe2]

gun laws are pretty stupid. you should restrict who can buy one, not what they can buy. lets face it, if someone decides to **** up there office with a gun, does it really matter what kind it is, every gun, knife, nail gun, and phone cable. is capable of killing somthing.


for instance.

say one of your coworkers walks into your office, and wips out a gun. does it really matter if that shits automatic? no, people are gonna get greased eaither way. theirs nothing you can do about it.

btw newsflash. its really ****ing easy to get a semi-auto rife converted to fully auto. just take it to any gun smith. there will always be poeple who will do it for you.

weeds illegal, all kinds of people still buy/sell it. how will making automatic weapons illegal make any difference. the poeple that want them will still get their hands on them

[Babble]

murder is still illegal, all kinds of people still kill. how will making murder illegal make any difference. the people that want people dead will still kill.

the fact of the matter is that all laws have been broken. it's a matter of how much the law has benefited society by reducing the occurrence rate of the action that we dislike.

[sLarkin20]

Banning automatic weapons simply because they have been used to kill people is useless because if someone has it in their mind to kill a bunch of people, the fact that it would now be "illegal" for them to have or get a fully automatic weapon isn't going to change anything.

Laws only affect law-abiding citizens.

[Babble]

you're an idiot.

[sLarkin20]

Thanks, sweetheart.

[adb]

comparing knives and handguns to auto weapons is simply invalid. Yes, those instruments can kill a human in a simple motion, but auto weapons can kill at much higher rate in less time. Handguns and knives both have general uses, auto weapons do not.

[sLarkin20]

So, the argument is not that an automatic weapon can kill people, but that it can kill more people in a shorter amount of time than you'd like?

[adb]

and auto weapons have no use. Please, name one. Do it.

[Babble]

for the millionth time, items do not need a utilitarian purpose to be legal to use legally.

Most violent crime is not done with automatic weapons.

it's whether or not there is enough of a trend to universally categorize something as detrimental to society. if it is, then we criminalize it. Can you show me enough of a trend that automatic weapons are detrimental to society?

Where is your evidence? Where are your studies? If we based everything on whether or not people just heard it was bad, or heuristically decided a thing is bad, we end up with ridiculous laws like marijuana bans.

[Reaganista]

of course they do nothing that serves no purpose or serves a bad purpose should be legal

[Babble]

I assume you're kidding.

[adb]

for the millionth time, items do not need a utilitarian purpose to be legal to use legally.

Most violent crime is not done with automatic weapons.

it's whether or not there is enough of a trend to universally categorize something as detrimental to society. if it is, then we criminalize it. Can you show me enough of a trend that automatic weapons are detrimental to society?

Where is your evidence? Where are your studies? If we based everything on whether or not people just heard it was bad, or heuristically decided a thing is bad, we end up with ridiculous laws like marijuana bans.

Well, here is how it was explained to me by a guy at my local gun shop who deals in Class III.

Such weapons (class iii) have been highly controlled by the US government since 1934, when the National Firearms Act was passed (thus they are often termed NFA items). Although it was possible for private purchase of NFA items, it was very expensive (transfer tax of 200 was a small fortune at the time), and the vetting process was intense. The market for certain NFA items (mainly automatic firearms) was locked in 1986 and since that point it has been effectively impossible to buy new automatic weapons. Every NFA item has it's own paperwork and transfer certificate. To purchase such an item (from someone else that is...) you must procure a new transfer request from the ATF (used to be the Treasury department that handled this) who will issue you the transfer. This takes up to three months, as an extensive state and federal level background check must be done on you (and I mean EXTENSIVE). This must be done for EVERY CLASS III ITEM YOU PURCHASE. All the paperwork for an item goes with the ITEM not the person.

This shows why auto weapons have not caused much violent crime.

[Reaganista]

i didnt put in a bunch of smileys so im obviously not kidding

[Babble]

I'm not arguing for a lack of restriction, or for legalization for that matter. I'm simply trying to demonstrate why the arguments being presented are faulty.

But that law isn't the reason they are rarely used. These are:

1. They are much more expensive.
2. They are designed for assault. Such violent crimes (rampages) are relatively rare. Most crime is personal or opportunistic.
3. They're bulky and nearly impossible to conceal.
4. And yeah, they're harder to get.

[Reaganista]

they should be illegal because people dont like them

[sLarkin20]

Well, here is how it was explained to me by a guy at my local gun shop who deals in Class III.

Such weapons (class iii) have been highly controlled by the US government since 1934, when the National Firearms Act was passed (thus they are often termed NFA items). Although it was possible for private purchase of NFA items, it was very expensive (transfer tax of 200 was a small fortune at the time), and the vetting process was intense. The market for certain NFA items (mainly automatic firearms) was locked in 1986 and since that point it has been effectively impossible to buy new automatic weapons. Every NFA item has it's own paperwork and transfer certificate. To purchase such an item (from someone else that is...) you must procure a new transfer request from the ATF (used to be the Treasury department that handled this) who will issue you the transfer. This takes up to three months, as an extensive state and federal level background check must be done on you (and I mean EXTENSIVE). This must be done for EVERY CLASS III ITEM YOU PURCHASE. All the paperwork for an item goes with the ITEM not the person.

This shows why auto weapons have not caused much violent crime.

Class 3 weapons are only ****ing MACHINE GUNS, not every single automatic weapons there is.

[Babble]

they should be illegal because people dont like them

that's how it works

[GreyHam]

i am drunk, and so my explantation may be ****

however

my thinking is, gun crime has nothing to do with the law, but with the culture. if people think that to get ahead, they have to kill, then it doesnt matter how they do it. Knife, fist, gun, automatic gun, theyll do it. murders of passion - theyll do it, however they have the ability to

on occasion, firearms will cause a man to kill when they may not have otherwsie done so. thats a given

similarly, the threat of firearm may save someones life

either way - gun control somewhat works in countries that established it, and doesnt in the ones that didnt. in the UK, im more scared of beatings than shootings, and tbh thats fine with me

a midnight shop involves fists, not guns

thats why i love livin in the UK

i wish the US chaps felt this safe/felt this fafe without a 9mm strapped to their sides

either way - whatever works





we all agree that getting guns away from R-Tards who like tho slaughter children is good at least, ya?

[GreyHam]

the cat disagrees but...

hes a cat

he knows v little about firearms legistaltion

pasta is awesome

vive la garlic bread

[Sk0rpi0n]

we all agree that getting guns away from R-Tards who like tho slaughter children is good at least, ya?

I agree. But what the hell is an R-tard and where did you encounter this terminology?

[Serenity]

You have never heard the term R-tard?

Wow. You must be an R-tard, tbh.

[Iskandar]

You have never heard the term R-tard?

Wow. You must be an R-tard, tbh.Is it a retard who's also a Republican?:confused:

[Serenity]

Haha, no. It's just another term for retard; I believe it was taken from South Park (not sure though).

[Reaganista]

zero why are you being so weird

[beso negro]

i told you thats not steve

Is it a retard who's also a Republican?:confused:

lol is there a difference

[Reaganista]

i dont believe it i want him to explain himself

[Already_Taken]

it's obviously steve.

[Serenity]

Who the piss is this steve guy you guys keep talking about whenever I post? It's really annoying, to be honest.

[Reaganista]

Who the piss is this steve guy you guys keep talking about whenever I post? It's really annoying, to be honest.

obviously him dead giveaway

[Serenity]

You guys think I'm this Steve dude, then...I see. Well, I'm most definitely not a Steve, lol.

Does this dude not post here anymore or what? And what would be the correlation between us?

[808]

He had the username Serenity.

[hismajestythepope]

automatic weapons should be available for hunters who like to drive around in hummers and shoot moose and caribou

[Illmatic]

TBH the people who want firearms banned are those who have never used one, are afraid of them for absolutely no logical reason what so ever, and are in disfavor of the right to bear arms because they are nazi fags

123


One death is better than ten, in my opinion

"kill one man or kill ten, it's all the same. after all, they can only hang you once."

[beso negro]

dude it's obviously jay, and props to him for fooling you guys

[Already_Taken]

jay is too stupid to use correct grammar

[Reaganista]

You guys think I'm this Steve dude, then...I see. Well, I'm most definitely not a Steve, lol.

Does this dude not post here anymore or what? And what would be the correlation between us?

no zero u still post here u just posted this

[Iskandar]

http://www.sputnikmusic.com/forums/showthread.php?p=16739265#post16739265

Now I am really confused.

[McP3000]

http://www.sputnikmusic.com/forums/showthread.php?p=16739265#post16739265

Now I am really confused.
i think he's legitimately a different person

or the single greatest troll in mx history

[Reaganista]

how did u get zero's acct

[McP3000]

excuse me

[GUTS]

Automatic weapons DO have a use. They keep the balance of power between the police and citizens. we have the right to keep and bear arms for a reason.

if the police have access to them, the citizens should have access to them. period.

[mph4ever]

Automatic weapons DO have a use. They keep the balance of power between the police and citizens. we have the right to keep and bear arms for a reason.

if the police have access to them, the citizens should have access to them. period.


yeah, and we should be licensed to kill police

[GUTS]

if they get out of line.

[mph4ever]

if they get out of line.

which lots of them do, from time to time

if they can carry them, then we should too

[McP3000]

we can carry guns in public, just concealed
well with a license that is

[Jaymz Hetfield]

Ya that's why they make me wear long sleeves.

[Der Übermensch]

we can carry guns in public, just concealed
well with a license that is

In most states you can carry openly without a license.

Class 3 weapons are only ****ing MACHINE GUNS, not every single automatic weapons there is.

Idiot. I already posted a list of Class III items. "Any thing with auto fire, short rifles/shotguns, silencers, destructive devices."

And although yes, technically Machine Gun is not always synonymous with automatic, i.e. does not include Assault Rifles, Sub-Machine gun, (True)Auto-pistols etc, when one refers to 'Machine Guns' in relation to either the NFA or the later 1986 law (I wish I could remember the name) they mean it to encompass any weapon capable of firing multiple rounds with one pull of the trigger as that is what the laws dealt with.


This shows why auto weapons have not caused much violent crime.
But is also show's why banning them is ****ing stupid. The 1986 blanket ban on new entries to the market had zero effect on the crime rate, and merely made it more expensive for legitimate collectors to purchase as the total number out there was capped. I'm all for logical legal safeguards on their ownership, but the blanket banning on civilian marketing is absurd.

[GUTS]

automatics aren't the problem. if someone is going to kill someone else, they're gonna do it, the weapon is rather irrelevant. a normal joe who knows how to fire and reload a semi automatic rifle like a M1 Garand or an M14 could take out just as many, if not more people then with an AK47. Semi autos are easier to control, more user friendly, and generally more presice in the hands of a novice.

if there were no guns, we'd still use swords, either way people are gonna kill if thats what they want to do. the weapon is of almost no significants. Sure, there is generally less honor and less courage involved in gunfights then in a fight with a blade, but either way people will get the job done with anything.

[Der Übermensch]

An M14 is an automatic weapon... But other then that, yeah. I'd use a 30.06 Bolt action if I wanted to kill people, not some ****ing spray and pray.

[Reaganista]

crime rate isnt the only reason for gun control not liking them is also acceptable

[GUTS]

An M14 is an automatic weapon... But other then that, yeah. I'd use a 30.06 Bolt action if I wanted to kill people, not some ****ing spray and pray.

m14: really? im almost positive that it is semi....perhaps im thinking of another gun.

i'd have to go with a .45 usp. Compact, light weight, powerful.

if i was REALLY going to go on a rampage:

vs. people without guns close proximity: P90 submachine gun
vs. people without guns far distance: 30-30 bolt action or maybe even one of those nifty semi atuo ones
vs. other people with guns: Ak47. it truely cant be beat for accuracy, power, and reliability.

now your turn, so i dont feel like a murderer.

in truth though, i wish we still used swords.

[GUTS]

why dont you like them?

[Reaganista]

i dont like them because a cocksleeve is a more honest way of serving all the same purposes of a gun besides the nefarious ones

[McP3000]

what the hell

[GUTS]

cocksleeve? i need an internet stooge translator. is that a condom? a tube sock? seriously what the **** are you talking about ya douche?

[Der Übermensch]

m14: really? im almost positive that it is semi....perhaps im thinking of another gun.
CoD4 is full of ****. It's a selective fire weapon, although with 7.62 NATO rounds, I assume the recoil is uncontrollable for magazine discharge...

now your turn, so i dont feel like a murderer.

vs. people without guns close proximity: MP5SD Never shot one, but I've heard they are a wetdream come to life.
vs. people without guns far distance: M1903
vs. other people with guns: Well, I'd take an SKS before an AK as it's more accurate for the same power (and better range) but no matter how much I disparage them, an Armalite would be the one to take. M4 I would say. Those things are killer to the max.

in truth though, i wish we still used swords.
I'm hoping dueling comes into fashion again, ie why I took up fencing.

[GUTS]

i build wooden broad swords. im a hude fan of blades. my current sword definatley isn't pretty. its more of a 6 foot club that i train with. its way to heavy to actually use. if i got a hit in it would break bone without a doubt though :p.

i want to have a sword built for me though, that would be dope.

the only thing i dont like about the m4 or m16 is the sissy .223 round. it was manufactured to WOUND for christsake. but yeah at full auto medium or close range they're tough to beat.

[Der Übermensch]

Yeah, I hate 5.56 but it is sooo much more controllable for a close range firefight.

[GUTS]

totally. i've never shot the p90 but i have shot an mp5 full auto before. it was butter. 5 round burst at 10 meters and scored at least 1 lethal shot and 2 serious wounds. thats the only full auto i've ever shot. i like revolvers myself. my pops has got a .44 mag, a .45 remington and a few others, they're fun to fool with. mellons and water jugs and such.

[Der Übermensch]

I like full caliber battle rifles :)
If you don't have a bruised shoulder after shooting, you aren't shooting something big enough.

[Reaganista]

i dont even have to change the words of that post really

[GUTS]

lol. i've got a .300 winchester as well. Light as a feather, kicks like a bull. the biggest i've shot was a 30-06, or maybe my dad's buddies [mp5 guy] 10 gauge when we went hunting for geese. thats pretty fun, laying down in the cold with your cover over you half alseep. HONK HONK HONK sit up BANG!!!!!!! BANG!!!!! gun throws you back down :p

[Der Übermensch]

i dont even have to change the words of that post really

Turned on?

[Reaganista]

lol. i've got a .300 winchester as well. Light as a feather, kicks like a bull. the biggest i've shot was a 30-06, or maybe my dad's buddies [mp5 guy] 10 gauge when we went hunting for geese. thats pretty fun, laying down in the cold with your cover over you half alseep. HONK HONK HONK sit up BANG!!!!!!! BANG!!!!! gun throws you back down :p

this thread is now about gay sex

[GUTS]

...i dont think im mistaken when i say, YOU'RE all about gay sex amirte

[Reaganista]

cocksleeve? i need an internet stooge translator. is that a condom? a tube sock? seriously what the **** are you talking about ya douche?
a cocksleeve is a **** you put on your **** it renders guns functionally obsolete for all recreational purposes

[GUTS]

a ****, that you put on your ****? seriously man, im not getting it. are we shooting bullets out of our penises? are our balls mini grenades? what exactly are we getting at. what are you doing with your life?

[Der Übermensch]

He has a penile fixation... don't give him any attention.

[GUTS]

interesting. that....things make more sense now. god i need to get off this computer.

[Der Übermensch]

Seriously. Tway is best left alone. I have a very very bad troll feeding habit, but you would best not even get started.

[GUTS]

too bad. he's smart. just wastes his energy on bullpoop.

hey man, im like...5/8 the way through Thus spoke Tharathustra and i cant get through the sad part. does it get less depressing? it seriously gets me down when the beginning of the book was so enlightening and positive.

[Der Übermensch]

Thats why I think he's awesome. He's like Socrates. He's smart enough to know your argument, but doesn't actually argue against it, but rather just bedevils you with all kinds of **** about it. It's fun, cause he always has a valid point to a degree, but generally it's because he nitpicks your phrasing rather then the argument en masse. Makes you have to think about each word.

[Reaganista]

i am like socrates

[GUTS]

get off the internet and go **** with people at coffee shops. its the same thing, but with body language.

[Reaganista]

i used to have that kind of personality in public but as ive gotten more depressed ive gotten to be less like that

[Der Übermensch]

i am like socrates

Thought you'd appreciate the comparison :p

i used to have that kind of personality in public but as ive gotten more depressed ive gotten to be less like that
Try Tryst out in Adams Morgan.

[GUTS]

seriously dude. the internet is a good training ground, but theres no glory in this ****. no honor. im only here cause im an ignorant bastard and people who pick apart semantics make my blood boil, but being angry fits me better then being sad. especially when i can just unload on a faceless, nameless entity that i cant even be sure exists. keeps me from doing it in real life.

[aria999]

do you realise how shi t of a user you are guts

[GUTS]

yeah. i just admitted it ya ****. i totally use this place as anger management. im not being funny here. im having a really good day if im nice to people on the internet.

[Der Übermensch]

do you realise how shi t of a user you are guts

Coming from you thats a compliment!

[Reaganista]

a ****, that you put on your ****?

ya it's a lot more direct than a gun which is a **** you put in ur hand/belt/waistband/shoulder/watev

seriously man, im not getting it. are we shooting bullets out of our penises? are our balls mini grenades? what exactly are we getting at.
gun collectors = penis collectors

what are you doing with your life?
im a lawl student/aspiring amatuer gay porn star and i post online a lot :wave:

[Amit]

hey tway i wanna go ot lawl school what do i have to do other than do well on my lolsat?

[Reaganista]

not much

[Amit]

do i have to have good grades

[Reaganista]

helps

[Amit]

****

[ringworm]

I just don't understand why they are allowed to be purchased or sold

because an overwhelming portion properly own them

0.9% go on killing sprees, so lets ban them all?

[Reaganista]

even if no one went on killing sprees the theoretical potential would justify banning them

[ringworm]

well lets just start theoretically thinking of other things we can ban then because miniscule percentages that cant properly operate them

[Der Übermensch]

Does anyone else get the top ad on this page as bulletproof vests available on eBay?

[Reaganista]

well lets just start theoretically thinking of other things we can ban then because miniscule percentages that cant properly operate them
actually if we want we could just stop with guns but im not opposed to banning other things if it would make you angst more

[beso negro]

cocksleeve? i need an internet stooge translator. is that a condom? a tube sock? seriously what the **** are you talking about ya douche?

he's trying to say that men only guns because they think it makes them more manly. but the size of a mans **** is a much better way the measure how much a man someone is and i agree.

[Mr. Ron]

I have a massive **** and I own guns


THEORY DISPROVED

[808]

I am so manly I don't have to go out and buy **** to ****ing prove it.

[Reaganista]

he's trying to say that men only guns because they think it makes them more manly. but the size of a mans **** is a much better way the measure how much a man someone is and i agree.

no that's not what im trying to say what im trying to say is that a cocksleeve serves all the same purposes as a gun except the bad ones
and that guns are penises
you dont have to have a small penis to want more penises

[Amit]

more penes are better than less penes

[EarthLadenFingers]

amit how many peens them crazy hindu gods packn

[adb]

because an overwhelming portion properly own them

0.9% go on killing sprees, so lets ban them all?

link

[Amit]

amit How Many Peens Them Crazy Hindu Gods Packn

4309

[EarthLadenFingers]

das allota dikz

[Amit]

word up my nig

[siva_chair]

because auto guns have no uses in society's hands. They have zero practical use. Any blunt object or even a handgun/rifle can have a practical use. auto weapons don't have any.

I didn't realize something had to have an inherent practical use to be considered legal. We should ban sports cars or fireworks or private swimming pools or any other form of fun.

Also, they do have a practical purpose: Overthrowing a tyrannical government. (lol tranny gov't)

Of course they should be legal. They should be legal to everyone who isn't a violent felon and isn't deemed mentally ill by the mental health profession.

[Amit]

yeah but the mental health profession is a tyranny in itself

[siva_chair]

Probably.

You could overthrow that with automatic weapons.

[Amit]

you'd have to be crazy to do that!

(lol get it)

[siva_chair]

you'd have to be crazy to do that!

(lol get it)

Bad puns rule.

And maybe crazy is the new sane. Think about that for a while...

Or don't it doesn't matter.

[Chu]

because an overwhelming portion properly own them

0.9% go on killing sprees, so lets ban them all?
What is the point in having a gun though?

They exist solely for a very very malicious reason.

[siva_chair]

What is the point in having a gun though?

To shoot bullets at things obviously.

They exist solely for a very very malicious reason.

No they don't.

Well I suppose it depends on which definition of malice you are using.

[Chu]

So you can shoot [kill] ****?
What a productive world we live in.

[siva_chair]

So you can shoot [kill] ****?

Yes.

What a productive world we live in.

Yes because everyone knows that no killing = a productive world.

Oh wait we have to kill things to survive.

[Amit]

yea but there's more to modern human life than just survival

[siva_chair]

yea but there's more to modern human life than just survival

Yeah and....?

[Chu]

What do you have to "kill to survive"?

[Amit]

Yeah and....?

so that's a poor argument to use

[siva_chair]

What do you have to "kill to survive"?

Well you have to kill food to survive.

And people who are trying to take your life/your loved one's lives.

so that's a poor argument to use

Not really as survival is still a valid thing in today's society.

[Chu]

Well you have to kill food to survive.
Not really, go to the store get food.

**** what did I kill? Maybe an ant? I'm going to survive on an ant!

Really, there is no point to having guns in this day and age.

[horseypie]

you can kill food with a non-automatic weapon though

i mean, sure Chu is taking the argument kind of to the extreme by saying guns arent necessary at all, i agree that automatic weapons shouldnt be sold to the public.

sure go fire them at the range for kicks, but civilians have no need for an automatic weapon

[Chu]

I don't understand how it's extreme.

When someone can give me one reason for needing a gun, perhaps I will understand.

As far as I can tell, the only purpose guns serve is to kill ****.
These days, if you want to kill something, a gun isn't worth the effort.

Other than that, what is there - "Oh the power of shooting one of these things is raw!"

Come on, people honestly get "fun" from shooting a gun? I will never be able to understand.

[siva_chair]

Not really, go to the store get food.

That food had to come from somewhere.

**** what did I kill? Maybe an ant? I'm going to survive on an ant!

Do you eat meat? Do you eat plants? Both of these things involve killing living organisms, so your argument about killing being non-progressive is stupid.

Really, there is no point to having guns in this day and age.

Actually there are lots of points to having guns in this day and age. Just because the idea of them makes you feel icky doesn't mean there isn't a point.

you can kill food with a non-automatic weapon though

So what?

Killing food with an automatic weapon would be silly anyway, but that isn't the reason for having an automatic weapon to begin with.

i mean, sure Chu is taking the argument kind of to the extreme by saying guns arent necessary at all, i agree that automatic weapons shouldnt be sold to the public.

sure go fire them at the range for kicks, but civilians have no need for an automatic weapon

Why should the state have a monopoly on automatic weapons? I'd say they use them far more irresponsibly on average than civilians that own them.

Also, we have lots of things that there is no real "need" for. There are very few instances where a person "needs" more than one vehicle, but that doesn't mean they should be barred from owning more than one of them.

I don't understand how it's extreme.

When someone can give me one reason for needing a gun, perhaps I will understand.

People have given you lots of reasons, you just choose to ignore them.

Self-defense
Hobby
Hunting
Collecting
Overthrowing governments
Crime deterrent
Because they can

Also, once again, basing the legality on something over an inherent "need" for it is a stupid argument to begin with.

As far as I can tell, the only purpose guns serve is to kill ****.
These days, if you want to kill something, a gun isn't worth the effort.

And you have yet to show how killing something is inherently bad.

Isn't worth the effort? What the hell is that supposed to mean?

Other than that, what is there - "Oh the power of shooting one of these things is raw!"

Come on, people honestly get "fun" from shooting a gun? I will never be able to understand.

That is probably because you have never shot one before.

And what may not be fun to you may be very fun to other people. I don't find tennis very "fun" but I don't see why people shouldn't be allowed to participate in enjoying it.

[Reaganista]

more like tennis played with a grenade

[siva_chair]

more like tennis played with a grenade

No because that would be actually fun.

[Chu]

Believe it or not, I actually have shot a gun (Just not in the past 10 years or so).

The only reason I was given, was "Overthrowing governments" - which I did ignore, I just figured it was meant as a joke, honestly, there are far more productive and effective ways of overthrowing a government. - and we have seen how effective this method is...

How many animals do people kill with a gun that becomes food, be it Cows, Sheep, Chicken, whatever? I think it's very little, more often than not it's probably a blade to the throat?

Do you eat meat? Do you eat plants? Both of these things involve killing living organisms, so your argument about killing being non-progressive is stupid.
Yes, because that's exactly what I meant....

I can understand collecting guns, in which case, my argument shifts from the removal of guns, to the removal of ammunition for said guns.

If you want to hunt, why not lose the slightly confuzzled sea lion-factor and use a bow and arrow, or at least something to give the prey a chance?
Saying "I use my gun for hunting" is an oxymoron, it should be more "I use my gun for killing".

Hunting implies there is a chance you can be defeated, or at least lose the prey.

If you want to kill something, and I meant in the context of killing something for food, you are more than likely going to use a knife or a bludgeoning weapon, rather than a 25c bullet.

I understand there is a point to guns, in some small way, however, the negative affects of guns severely outweighs any positive effects owning a gun has.

You can give me the self-defense/protection bullpoop, but honestly, if there weren't any guns, the chances of someone being a risk to you would be a lot less.

I understand "Oh what if they have a knife/syringe/hammer etc." but you can deal with them easily if you are properly trained.

If you honestly cared for people that much, the effort involved in becoming trained wouldn't be an issue.

[P13]

guh guh guh guh guh guh guh

Only use for guns is to kill those mother****ing Taliban.

and Nazi's