Should The Mentally Challenged Be Held To The Same Laws As The Rest Of Us

[Iscariot]

i vote yes

http://www.katu.com/news/local/7449201.html

PORTLAND, Ore. (AP) - The guardian of a disabled Clackamas High School student has filed a federal lawsuit claiming the girl was raped in a school bathroom by a student who had previously assaulted another disabled girl.

The lawsuit, filed Thursday in U.S. District Court, names the North Clackamas School District, Superintendent Ron Naso, Clackamas High principal Jan Miner and teacher Angela Tucker.

School district officials could not comment on the pending litigation, a spokesman said.

The guardian alleges that the child, described in the suit as having "significant mental disabilities," was a student in Tucker's class when her best friend, another disabled girl, was raped by a special education student in a girls' restroom at the school in October 2004.

The suit says the parents of the second girl reported the attack to school officials, who in turn "assured them and the rest of the parents" that the male student would not be allowed to be alone with any female students. They also said they would protect the boy "who did not have the capacity to understand or control his behavior," the suit said.

In June 2005, the teacher sent the girl out of the "secure classroom," according to the lawsuit. No one supervised her, and, according to the suit, the male student followed her, took her into a girl's bathroom and raped her.

The guardian said the child suffered physical and emotional injuries. The suit seeks up to $1 million in damages.

do you think that in cases like this where someone with a mental handicap commits multiple acts of violent crime they should be held as accountable as someone with a full mental capacity

[Der Übermensch]

Fully accountable? No....

Should they be institutionalized? Yes.

[Iscariot]

Fully accountable? No....

Should they be institutionalized? Yes.

see this is where i run into a dilemma

i can understand not wanting to hold them fully accountable because of the fact that they're handicapped

but you have to think this kid committed two acts of rape

you have to have some sort of understanding of what you're doing in order to commit a crime like this

also the fact that he followed both girls to a suitable location before committing the crime shows that he had not only thought about it but had planned his attacks beforehand as well

[Der Übermensch]

I think he understands what he is doing... just not how bad it is to do so...

Either way, he should not be in a place where he can substantially interact with other people, let alone women...

[Iscariot]

i can agree with that but how is someone supposed to know if a person in his condition is suitable to be around others

you can't really psycho-analyze someone with a severe mental disability there's no way of knowing

so would the best solution be to put these kids on lock down during school hours under continuous supervision or take them out of the public school system entirely where it might cost the parents more for the schooling but the teachers can guarantee total supervision

[Der Übermensch]

Well I think thats obvious... the kid shouldn't have been allowed to continue in school after that, or at least not without constant supervision.

[Iscariot]

yes but i'm wondering how do you spot these things before they happen

sitting around waiting for a crime like this to occur seems pretty irresponsible to me

and the fact that he wasn't reprimanded after the first incident because he's mentally challenged shows glaring flaws in the legal system regarding people of his condition as well

[pedro durruti]

One exception does not mean putting all retarded students under "lockdown."

[Iscariot]

One exception does not mean putting all retarded students under "lockdown."

i can't cite anything off the top of my head but i'm sure this isn't the first time this has happened

[pedro durruti]

I don't think so either, because there have been many instances where the mentally disabled will commit legal crimes. But certainly not enough to keep them under constant surveillance. They are already under enough supervision enough as it is, and most of them understand common norms in society.

[Charlie Daniels]

Rediculous that he didnt get expelled the first time...

[c0mpt0n4ss]

I don't think so either, because there have been many instances where the mentally disabled will commit legal crimes. But certainly not enough to keep them under constant surveillance. They are already under enough supervision enough as it is, and most of them understand common norms in society.

That depends. I'm no psychologist, but I recall hearing that mildly retarded individuals will mimic social 'norms' in order to blend in. I assume that this guy was probably a little more of a severe case than that, but of course you can't really know for sure. I don't think you could expect retarded individual to fully understand the ramifications of something like rape. It doesn't have the immideacy of something like murder. So it's hard to say. I think the more pressing issue is how the school handled it. I understand that special education is extremely difficult (does anyone remember "tardblog.com"), but the case was extreme enough to warrant more than a promise, much less one that wasn't even kept.

[GreyHam]

you cant imprison a handicapped person, obviously

but if he cant control or understand his behaviour then hes a danger to people around him and something needs to be done about that. just because he cant understand that its wrong doesnt mean thatit should be allowed to continue

[PerpetualBurn]

The mentally handicapped are held to the same laws as everyone else. It's just that our laws recognise that a punishment should be appropriate, and sticking a mentally handicapped person in with a bunch of real criminals would be stupid.

[Swill_Merchant]

yes but i'm wondering how do you spot these things before they happen

sitting around waiting for a crime like this to occur seems pretty irresponsible to me

and the fact that he wasn't reprimanded after the first incident because he's mentally challenged shows glaring flaws in the legal system regarding people of his condition as well

I think of it like this: When you were a kid and you swore, got into a fight, or hit somebody, you did it knowing it wasn't the best thing to do, but you didn't have any idea of the ramifications that it could possibley entail.
I think this is similar to this. Although the intensities are far apart it is the same idea. I think that instead of going to jail he should go to an institution so he can get help where he can understand why what he did was wrong, instead of going to jail and coming out without learning anything.

[GreyHam]

i think its safe to say hed find out what its like to be on the recieving end of a raping...