Ask Hunted By A Freak About Going To College For Music

[Hunted By a Freak]

I have attended both a more traditional conservatory styled music college, Northern Michigan University, and now am attending a more modern one, Berklee College of Music.

Feel free to ask any questions about my experiences or advice if you plan on attending school for music. I will answer to the best of my ability and according to my knowledge of both the schools I have attended and my general knowledge of music schools in the US. :thumb:

I also have had many drummer friends with varying financial situations and playing levels who I've talked to about this stuff, so that should help. Also I have talked plenty with professors about it at the respective schools.

[GooseFilms.net]

$10 says you won't last 2 years at Berklee

[poopoogaypoonn]

I guess ill start it out, with something simple

Postive things about Berklee:


Negative things about Berklee:

[Hunted By a Freak]

Auditions:

Thought this would be a good place to start.

First off, this can easily be broken down into what kind of drummer/percussionist you are. Do you play drumset only, or do you have a background in all of the percussion instruments? (orchestral as well as drumset).

I am assuming from experience that most here will be entering college with drum set as their principle instrument, but I would be happy to go into what orchestral excerpts and solo repertoire would be appropriate for all percussion, if someone wants. I auditioned for NMU as a total percussionist, I did my scholarship audition for Berklee as a total percussionist, and I did an assessment audition at Berklee after switching over to playing only drum set for my principle.

The Breakdown:

Basically stuff you will find useful in preparing for any audition:

- Reading: Know how to read music. Practice reading both rudimental snare drum parts as well as charts and interpreting lead sheets. Be sure to practice your butt off setting up and kicking ensemble and section hits on big band style charts, especially. (Some good books for this: Portraits in Rhythm by Anthony Cirone, The All-American Drummer by Charlie Wilcoxin, Studio and Big Band Drumming by Steve Houghton, Contemporary Drummer +1 by Dave Weckl)

- Styles: Learn as many styles as possible, simply put. Do not, I stress, do not, only learn to play a simple pattern. Learn the specific time feel appropriate and really get inside the style you are working on. They will ask you for some basic styles, like Bossa Nova, Samba, Shuffle, Swing, Funk. If you do those sufficiently, you might be asked to play more, like Mambo, Soca, Songo, 3/4 Swing, Swing with Brushes, etc. Play along with tons of music to really familiarize yourself with the time feels. I also suggest Tommy Igoe's Groove Essentials as prepratory material, as well as Steve Houghton's Essential Styles 1 + 2 books.

- Performance/Improvisation: This is where you will be asked to play a prepared piece. Though somewhere like Berklee, for instance, is open minded about styles, I strongly suggest you do something in the Jazz vein. If you don't play jazz at all, do as all the professors here would urge you, and play something that really emphasizes your best attributes, regardless of style. I do not suggest a drum solo, from speaking with other drummers who have done scholarship auditions and failed. Try a playalong recording, as the auditioners will have a CD player with speakers. I believe you can also have headphones on while playing along too. If not that, a good tried-and-true method people do is play a standard tune (something out of the real book perhaps) while singing the melody (try a blues form or 32 bar form, or something more complex if you're up to it). Then take a chorus of solo. This is very important while you solo over the form: do not lose your place! do not fluctaute the time or lose the groove! come back into time after 1 chorus! Practice practice practice your forms and phrasing in different phrase amounts. This will show them that you can play with other people as well as improvise. Both are very important. If you have a playalong I suggest getting one with a vamp to solo over or something similar. I know a couple of my friends even brought in another instumentalist (my friend brought in a saxophonist and played a chris potter tune in 11 for his scholarship audition and did very well) but do not fumble around setting up, and know exactly what you are going to do.

So that is pretty basic seeming stuff, but get it down. The key is preperation. Know exactly in your mind what you will do and in what order. I will keep updating this page as questions come and as I feel like typing a ton :p

[Hunted By a Freak]

$10 says you won't last 2 years at Berklee

Why?:confused:

[The Philosopher]

Why?:confused:

A lot of people aren't dedicated enough to make it through. You'll do fine if you work hard, :p

[Hunted By a Freak]

More About Auditions

Things to keep in mind:

There are variables when it comes to doing your audition, and there are things you can control.

Variables:

- whether the auditions are going on schedule or not. This may force you to wait or even possibly go ahead of schedule. They may also rush you if they are behind. Most auditions around around 10-20 minutes. Berklee takes generally 15 minutes, though the auditioners are really allowed to do what they want. I did my total percussion audition at Berklee and I played part of a marimba solo, a concert snare solo, part of a rudimental snare solo, styles on drum set, a timpani etude, most of a Dave Weckl play along on drum set, reading on drum set, reading on snare drum, and just barely fit everything in. You might be asked to stop and start at their whim, so be prepared.

- equipment. usually for drum set students there are several differing drum sets in the room and you are allowed to choose. Choose wisely, and don't waste time. Adjust things so you are comfortable, but do not do a whole overhaul. The tuning may not be to your liking, or cymbal positions, but do not waste your audition time being picky. Adjust your seat height and maybe some angles and get to business. This will also look better to the judges.

- the judges themselves. Different judges have different musical backgrounds and will be looking for different things in your playing. Knowing who your auditioners are by simply asking someone on staff can help you know what their reaction might be. I am aware of what several drum professors here want to hear specifically and will list that later.

Controls:

- your prepared piece. practice practice practice! make sure you can play the tune and form in your sleep. read anything and everything. The best way to get better at reading is by doing it ALL THE TIME.

- your state of mind. Sounds dumb, perhaps, but eat a good meal well before your audition and get there very early. Do deep breathing exercises and try perhaps meditating if you feel uneasy.

- your improvisation. by definition, improvisation shouldn't REALLY be under you control... but I'm not saying plan out a solo. I'm saying solo over the form or over the vamp enough so you have a strong vocabulary to fall back on and have some good sounding licks in your memory bank.


More later..

[Hunted By a Freak]

A lot of people aren't dedicated enough to make it through. You'll do fine if you work hard, :p

I am well aware of said people... I hear them in my classes. I am not worried, because I am the one who gets A's and is set as a good example for the class. :thumb:

[Hunted By a Freak]

Postive things about Berklee:

- Simply put, the best place to study contemporary music in the US, and possibly the world. It is no secret that it is one of the top music schools, regardless of what people "have heard". There is a reason why people come from Brazil or Switzerland or Australia or South Africa, etc. come here to study music.

- Awesome faculty. Tons of big name players with tons of experience and a history of legendary teachers and methods passed down. If there's something you want to learn, despite how specific or obscure, someone will be into it and can show you.

- Resources. Awesome library with any musical literature, scores, or sheet music you could ever want. Same with the media center, which has tons and tons of albums and videos. Kickin' learning center and computer labs where you can learn to use your music software or just work on projects with top of the line equipment. State of the art recording studios and film scoring labs.

- Good musicians to play with. Chances are, whatever you're into, from bebop to rap-rock, you will find someone to play with. There are many very good musicians here of all sorts of different backgrounds.

- Atmosphere. Maybe sounds lame, but you are doing music 24/7. Most people get their general education (math, english, etc) out of the way at another college before coming here, so you are basically doing music all day. Practicing, jamming, rehearsing, classes, etc. Great for musical growth and education, and really puts you in a place where, if you want, you can excell and really focus.

Negative things about Berklee:

- Admissions. Basically, the strictness of admissions has gone down. Probably just due to the school wanting money. If you can pay the tuition you can come here. That means, while there are good musicians here, there are also very bad ones. There is generally some frusteration and some of the asian kids, for example, who can't play their instruments very well or speak english. It is maddening to have them in classes with you. There is a girl from Japan in my ensemble, and while a great classical piano player, cannot improvise or play any other styles at all. Why waste our time and come here?

- Majors. Don't come here if you want to do performance, most would say, and I support it. You have to do all the same core music classes, and then just take mostly private lessons and a couple labs to give you the performance major. If you want to get better at drums, your money and time would be best spent finding a good teacher and just practicing your butt off. I do want to be a pro drummer, but I also want to expand my horizons, so I am going to be a composition major. If this were not the case, I could simply study privately with someone like Gary Chaffee here in Boston and not pay tuition to come here. There are many many great and diverse majors to get into here, I suggest you take advantage of it.

I'll probably build on this later, it's a lot to get out in a few posts.

[static]

I was at Berklee today.

[Josiah]

There is a girl from Japan in my ensemble, and while a great classical piano player, cannot improvise or play any other styles at all. Why waste our time and come here?



...

If this were not the case, I could simply study privately with someone like Gary Chaffee here in Boston and not pay tuition to come here.



She came to learn how? (Wasn't that the point of school?)



Thought you didn't pay tuition and were on scholarship?

[Hunted By a Freak]

I was at Berklee today.

Really? Cool, man. What'd you do?

Josiah: I meant, if I was someone paying to come here to be a performance major, which I am not. Phrasing from a different point of view, buddy.

She came to learn, which is admirable, but there should be a higher standard which the students are held to. Basically I'm saying she should go to a less musically intense school, or a more classicaly based one.

[static]

Well I dunno if you know about it, but they're sponsoring a Battle Of The Bands that I played in.

[Hunted By a Freak]

Well I dunno if you know about it, but they're sponsoring a Battle Of The Bands that I played in.

Nope. I knew Harvard was having a battle sometime soon, and that the all-female battle of the bands was going on, I believe, but I doubt you are part of that.

[Josiah]

Really? Cool, man. What'd you do?

Josiah: I meant, if I was someone paying to come here to be a performance major, which I am not. Phrasing from a different point of view, buddy.

She came to learn, which is admirable, but there should be a higher standard which the students are held to. Basically I'm saying she should go to a less musically intense school, or a more classicaly based one.

Well there is a difference between not making the grade demanded by the instructor. And learning.

It's a what, 4 year program? You are in your first semester? less then 1/8th the way through, just a noob in the school, lets allow some time for the learning curve now...

[static]

Cam -


Don't be so quick to judge, my friend.




>.>

[Hunted By a Freak]

There is a difference, though, when she is incompetant at basic piano tasks that even I know how to do. Even my teacher has come up to me and apologized that there aren't better players in my ensemble to me. I was asked for my opinion and experiences at school and have simply provided such.

I am not a noob. It is my first semester, but with the amount of credits I have transfered and the classes I have tested out of already (keyboard for percussionists, drum lab 1 and 2, timpani, music technology, harmony 1, etc.) I really have a 3rd semester standing at least. If I wanted to pursue performance degree I could really possibly have all my requirements done except for some private instruction credits in a couple more semesters.

[moogoogaipan]

Postive things about Berklee:

- Simply put, the best place to study contemporary music in the US, and possibly the world.


I think that's wishful thinking on your part. Kenwood Dennard isn't exactly amazing.

It's been said before... it's riding on the coat-tails of its predecessors. That statement you made is so vague and is only your opinion

[FockerTheLopper]

After learning some other instruments I realized that drums are very easy. Now, to be incredible is a totally different story, but if you want to make music you don't need to work on all these crazy things. For instance, you have all these styles and time feels to learn but nothing is too hard. Modern drumset is definately the most incredible instrument though, because there is so much freedom that you can tell a player by what they play, how they play it despite the sound of the instrument and more so then any other instrument. If you hear two trumpet players playing the same solo you'll be able to tell who is who but if you listen to two drummers playing the same chart, you'll easily know whos who...

Pretty interesting stuff you wrote though about having a prepared peice on the drums though. Little useless rant but I was just thinking that I don't think its worth it to go through college for just a percussion major(of course other theory and other stuff is a different story). In my opinion the hardest thing about playing the drums is time(standard) and style. As Gary said, its not about playing the notes, its about grooving in that style, I can play you a songo and its pretty authentic, but ask me to fill or play a songo groove in a song it really won't sound too good. Luckily I'm in a highschool band so I can afford to play a latin song and practice my songo in there.

[Hunted By a Freak]

After learning some other instruments I realized that drums are very easy. Now, to be incredible is a totally different story, but if you want to make music you don't need to work on all these crazy things. For instance, you have all these styles and time feels to learn but nothing is too hard. Modern drumset is definately the most incredible instrument though, because there is so much freedom that you can tell a player by what they play, how they play it despite the sound of the instrument and more so then any other instrument. If you hear two trumpet players playing the same solo you'll be able to tell who is who but if you listen to two drummers playing the same chart, you'll easily know whos who...

Pretty interesting stuff you wrote though about having a prepared peice on the drums though. Little useless rant but I was just thinking that I don't think its worth it to go through college for just a percussion major(of course other theory and other stuff is a different story). In my opinion the hardest thing about playing the drums is time(standard) and style. As Gary said, its not about playing the notes, its about grooving in that style, I can play you a songo and its pretty authentic, but ask me to fill or play a songo groove in a song it really won't sound too good. Luckily I'm in a highschool band so I can afford to play a latin song and practice my songo in there.

Very nice post, Focker!

[Hunted By a Freak]

I think that's wishful thinking on your part. Kenwood Dennard isn't exactly amazing.

It's been said before... it's riding on the coat-tails of its predecessors. That statement you made is so vague and is only your opinion

Have you ever heard Kenwood on Maceo Parker's "Live From Planet Groove"? Simply awesome groove funk playing.

check this stuff out, too, before totally bashing a player:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VLxNIMeaq_k (playing drums while rapping 80's rap style heh heh, and playing keyboard with one hand)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1STtKtJtbE

And that's just one of our professors. Don't mean to be rude, but what school do you go to and what teachers do you study with? I would like to know what it takes to impress someone of such taste. It was stated in the first post that this thread would be me giving advice and opinons based on my experience here. Nothing less or more. You sound a little butthurt, my friend. Hope school is working out well for you. :wave:

[FockerTheLopper]

Very nice post, Focker!

Thanks, I was actually thinking about going to music for college but then I realized that I don't want to teach, but there really isn't anything else I want to do(unless theres a foosball major somewhere) but I want to study music because theory really interests me, as you might know I've been getting into Greek music(and clarinet) and they use flat 2's and 6's which gives it that middle eastern sound, I've been doing some discovering of my own because I don't think they teach that but I love classic music(when I understand it) and the older greek music(which believe it or not had some genious melody/chord combinations despite the fact that almost nobody had knowledge of theory back then). Next year I'll probably be attending somewhere going for a buisness major, that or maybe nutrition(my sister is doing it and although I don't like chemistry I enjoy knowning about health/nutrition and its a job I wouldn't mind doing).

Edit: Yeah I see alot of critisism about Berklee and while they say that it isn't what it used to be, how many other schools can say that they have that many world renounded professors.(although I do agree that it is very expensive)

[Hunted By a Freak]

What kind of classical music are you into? I've been really studying romantic stuff for use in film scoring ideas lately.

[FockerTheLopper]

What kind of classical music are you into? I've been really studying romantic stuff for use in film scoring ideas lately.

I'm actually not sure how to catogorize it, just the stuff I'm exposed to at school, which is Haydan Wood, Morton Gould, Mozart, Tscicafski(I def messed that one up) and marches. I when I say classical I pretty much mean orchestra music which every instrument has an important role, so even things like showtunes(which isn't classic). I love jazz but I feel that most the time there is no meaning behind that fast improvisation(with many exceptions Coltrane and Dolphy being number 1). Thats why I love greek music, its so similar to jazz as that its improvised but instead of playing more notes with those jazz articulations, you play whatever sounds good and there is so much natural movement of the notes... The tonicizations are even improvised in greek(because it always ends in the same key as what it started in), and they can tonicize by accident to make the scale the soloist is in be a different scale and give it a totally different feel, but being dance music noone cares.

Truely beautiful.

[Hunted By a Freak]

You should check out Masada... jazz mixed with Jewish Klezmer music. You might like it.

[White Riot!]

She came to learn, which is admirable, but there should be a higher standard which the students are held to. Basically I'm saying she should go to a less musically intense school, or a more classicaly based one.

How about we gas chamber everyone not up to standards , then right?

There were a whole bunch of people who did that.....they were the Nazis.

[Hunted By a Freak]

http://www.justadvance.com/a_record.html

Oh, here's some albums Kenwood has played on if anyone is interested. Kind of sad, bashing him like this you guys.

[FockerTheLopper]

You should check out Masada... jazz mixed with Jewish Klezmer music. You might like it.

Yeah, this guy who comes to my restaurant actually gave me a jewish CD yesterday I still didn't get to listening to it. Masada is the band? Jewish music is very similar to greek music(when I say greek I mean from the islands especially near the middle east since they're music rubbed off)

[Hunted By a Freak]

How about we gas chamber everyone not up to standards , then right?

There were a whole bunch of people who did that.....they were the Nazis.

:lol:

I am confused, buddy. I merely said perhaps she should think about going into a more laid back program or school, or perhaps practice more. When did I mention killing her? :confused:

I fail to see how this thread revolves around this girl, but okay. Perhaps people are showing their own insecurities?

[Hunted By a Freak]

Yeah, this guy who comes to my restaurant actually gave me a jewish CD yesterday I still didn't get to listening to it. Masada is the band? Jewish music is very similar to greek music(when I say greek I mean from the islands especially near the middle east since they're music rubbed off)

Yeah, Masada is a group led by saxaphonist John Zorn with Joey Baron on drums. Joey actually came here too, one of my teachers, Skip, was telling me about him. Awesome drummer. John has some other related jewish music projects like Bar Kokhba, Electric Masada, and Masada String Trio.

Here is a video of him in action:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWYWEaDpUNc

Fantastic musician.

[White Riot!]

:lol:

I am confused, buddy. I merely said perhaps she should think about going into a more laid back program or school, or perhaps practice more. When did I mention killing her? :confused:

I fail to see how this thread revolves around this girl, but okay. Perhaps people are showing their own insecurities?

Hmmm.........?

Why waste our time and come here?

You dont decide who is allowed in the school , nor are you part of the teachers so I think

http://www.voidspace.org.uk/gallery/silly/big_cup_of_STFU.jpg

[Hunted By a Freak]

What I said previously backs up what I said thereafter. She should not be here. As stated, previously, if you had read it, the professor himself apologized to me for not having a better piano player in the group, and I didn't even mention anything about it. Obviously she has money, so she could come here, as discussed previously.


If you have nothing to add to the thread but old memes that only idiots laugh at, please leave.

[Win A Rabbit]

How about we gas chamber everyone not up to standards , then right?

There were a whole bunch of people who did that.....they were the Nazis.
http://www.voidspace.org.uk/gallery/silly/big_cup_of_STFU.jpg
:lol: @ irony.

[Hunted By a Freak]

Well, I'm gonna get some sleep. Gotta lecture and jam session to attend featuring Stanton Moore tomorrow. :wave:

[Patrick323]

chill out everybody..

how come this girl got put in the same ensemble as you if you're a competant player and she's not, in terms of improvising? not trying to be hostile here

[White Riot!]

It is maddening to have them in classes with you. There is a girl from Japan in my ensemble, and while a great classical piano player, cannot improvise or play any other styles at all. Why waste our time and come here?

Obviously you're a long , long way away from being a hireable musician. With that attitude you simply wont be getting hired or be staying hired in a group.

If shes a great classical player all it will take is some re-direction to pick up other styles , its not as though chops you learn in classical wont give you a head start to learn other things , because playing piano is playing piano. furthermore why are YOU bitching about it? Its non of your business , its not your job to play keys or lead the group.

If you have trouble playing drums because the piano player cant improvise , you should really quit at drums TBQH.

You miss the point of a school. You sound like one of those kids that goes into special achievers school and think the sun shines out of your arse. I know your type.

[alvyn]

Obviously you're a long , long way away from being a hireable musician. With that attitude you simply wont be getting hired or be staying hired in a group.

If shes a great classical player all it will take is some re-direction to pick up other styles , its not as though chops you learn in classical wont give you a head start to learn other things , because playing piano is playing piano. furthermore why are YOU bitching about it? Its non of your business , its not your job to play keys or lead the group.

If you have trouble playing drums because the piano player cant improvise , you should really quit at drums TBQH.

You miss the point of a school. You sound like one of those kids that goes into special achievers school and think the sun shines out of your arse. I know your type.

and why is he not allowed to express his views? shrug.

:chug:

anw to TS, berklee sure sounds like fun... my colleague's heading over there this september. im not too sure what he's going to major in, but apparantly he said that the audition criteria for students in Singapore seems to be very lax, especially for percussions, any idea if what he said has any merit?

my colleague's a guitarist, and his theory, though good, isn't outstanding. any drawbacks to that?

:) have fun at berklee!

[Sunshine]

I know a chick at Berklee, but not for music.
Is it just me, or is there more than one?
Because from the sounds of it, this particular Berklee is not in California, but the one I know of is.
But I could be reading funny, it's a silly question anyway.

I don't pay attention to colleges really, except mine, Webster Uni.

And yes, I got in because I could pay the full price, and checked the "no" box under the question "Do you plan to apply for financial aid or student loans?"

Because schools are run like businesses.

And, little as I know, I'd just like to say:
This piano chick who has caused the big ole fuss, most likely did not buy her way into the ensemble.
She's there for a reason.

[Futuro]

Your thinking of Berkley in CA, Which isnt for music.

[rohbit]

That vid of kenwood rapping and drumming was ****ing class!

[Josiah]

http://www.justadvance.com/a_record.html

Oh, here's some albums Kenwood has played on if anyone is interested. Kind of sad, bashing him like this you guys.

Nobody is bashing him. Simply stating he's not amazing to them, wich is a vaild opinion.

Though no 1 man makes a school, so even if he is totally amazing, radical, awesome, it doesn't make the school so.

To say that school is the best for contemporary music is a pretty absurd statement really. Music is no technical study, there's no way of showing achievement from year to year by schools, nor to my knowledge do any of the musical schools cross compete with any form of bands.
There's no CIF banners to hang in the gym here buddy, put that thing back in your pants. It's not highschool anymore.



how come this girl got put in the same ensemble as you if you're a competant player and she's not, in terms of improvising? not trying to be hostile here


Good point. And considering the radical differences, and difficulty level in improving on a piano in jazz and a drumset... yes, someone say drums are harder....

[Egggo]

so it's okay for moogoo to have an opinion about a drummer

but it's not okay for cameron to have an opinion about a school

ok cool

[Josiah]

No, it's totally fine. Was just pointing out MooGoo's opinion was not "bashing" Kenward.
Totally fine for Cameron to have an opinion about his school as well. Being he publicly posts it, it's up for public debate.

Reality and Opinion may often clash though -
There however does exist various ranking and competitions that DO rank schools in subjects. Berklee however does not compete in any with any other music school.

Where as we can point to other fine schools and say, these people have the best band program. Why? Because they compete and can say the Blue Devils Marching Band has won the most DCI events, or whatever, blah blah..

Actually ranked and judged. Then you can make statements like "we are the best." and have something to fall back on.

[Egggo]

so if someone said they didn't exactly find you intelligent

that's not bashing?

[Josiah]

Nope, different. Saying you don't find someone intelligent, is far different from saying you don't find someone to be amazing (or actually their music was the reference).

[Seafroggys]

so if someone said they didn't exactly find you intelligent

that's not bashing?

now you're just trolling. Josiah has some really good points, as does Cameron. Maybe you can add some as well?

[Egggo]

Nope, different. Saying you don't find someone intelligent, is far different from saying you don't find someone to be amazing (or actually their music was the reference).

please explain

now you're just trolling. Josiah has some really good points, as does Cameron. Maybe you can add some as well?

my point is that if people don't have any questions about going to berklee then they probably shouldn't post in this thread

instead of trolling cameron all the god damn time

i've helped cameron when i can be of assistance and i'll continue to do so

what have any of you done for him other than some of you baiting him incessantly like cowards

[Seafroggys]

hey man I have had no part in this. I'm just pointing out something as an observor.

To contribute to this thread: I think music schools are overrated. If you want to be a teacher, then you have to go. If you really want to get technical instruction on your instrument, then go. But for me, music is art, and no school in the entire Earth can teach art, if you get what I'm saying.

[Josiah]

^I would agree there.. 40k/year for 4 years seems an absurd price to pay.
One could easily go to a regular 4 year school, get a 4 year degree, go to any number of other perucussion or music schools and still have more then half the cost of berklee left over.

hmm Baiting eh..

Saying your school is - "Simply put, the best place to study contemporary music in the US, and possibly the world."
When there are other people who go to other music schools, have or will here? Hmmmm seems like that one was asking for it.
Besides, it's very obvious many people find the conduct of a student of one of the "worlds best" music schools disturbingly dark, bashing a fellow student for not being on par with improvising... etc

[Egggo]

Besides, it's very obvious many people find the conduct of a student of one of the "worlds best" music schools disturbingly dark, bashing a fellow student for not being on par with improvising... etc

then you haven't gone to an academic school with very high standards

because it happens all the time where i go

hey man I have had no part in this. I'm just pointing out something as an observor.

To contribute to this thread: I think music schools are overrated. If you want to be a teacher, then you have to go. If you really want to get technical instruction on your instrument, then go. But for me, music is art, and no school in the entire Earth can teach art, if you get what I'm saying.

then how do you feel about teachers, gurus, and you know

like everyone who has been passing down music since music has existed

you can't learn art or creativity but you can certainly learn to embrace, engage, and harness what you already have through education

i've learned music formally, by myself, and via a guru so i think i have a pretty nice range of experiences to draw upon and compare; what about you?

but maybe the instruments and styles i play and play in require some form of education to get a decent handle of

whatever

[Seafroggys]

I've had plenty of 'formal' education. I've had private instruction, and had gone through the entire music system from grade school to graduation. Last year I took a 1 year music technology program, and some of my electives included college jazz band and concert band. So I can speak somewhat from the inside.

I have nothing against teachers and gurus, they love what they do, so they do. But I don't want to go that route, thus music college would be a waste.

[Josiah]

Egggo i would agree that in many situations in schools with high standards that stuff does go on. However that still doesn't make it ok.

And I have been to schools of pretty high standards both private musical and state university.

In regular studies, ya, ton of pricks it's pretty dog eat dog actually.

At music school, everyone was super cool and supportive. Watching people from other countries play was awesome, they had such different takes on our (american) music.

[Egggo]

there's nothing unreasonable with going to a place with rigorous standards and expecting people not to waste one's time with incompetence

state schools, with the exception of a select couple, like to coddle their gentle minded undergraduate population too much for that kind of academic molestations ^_^

you're just dealing with a completely different culture tbh

[Josiah]

We are agreeing there.

Berklee is however no school that falls under "rigorous standards". Even cameron himself has stated he hasn't learned anything new there. And there's no doubt he's got alot of free time.


Schools with rigorous standards - Juilliard, Vienna Conservatory, WestPoint, Johns Hopkins, MIT

[White Riot!]

there's nothing unreasonable with going to a place with rigorous standards and expecting people not to waste one's time with incompetence

The thing is YOUR NOT PAYING THE STUDENTS. So you really have no say or word about them in most situations ...... Cameron isnt there to learn piano of a student is he?

Nor does the school guarantee you awesome students.


Are you bringing a "can do" attitude to the school? No. The reality is rather , than wasting his time bitching , cameron should make the most of the situation.

As a session drumset player without a "can do" attitude , you simply wont get hired for gigs.

[Egggo]

The thing is YOUR NOT PAYING THE STUDENTS. So you really have no say or word about them in most situations ...... Cameron isnt there to learn piano of a student is he?

Nor does the school guarantee you awesome students.

i don't see a problem with him having the right to complain about people not cutting it

do you?

We are agreeing there.

Berklee is however no school that falls under "rigorous standards". Even cameron himself has stated he hasn't learned anything new there. And there's no doubt he's got alot of free time.


Schools with rigorous standards - Juilliard, Vienna Conservatory, WestPoint, Johns Hopkins, MIT

you're paying for connections and the benefits of going to a place as famous as berklee

and in the end that matters a shitload more than rigorous standards unless you're in a field like i am in

[White Riot!]

i don't see a problem with him having the right to complain about people not cutting it

do you?



Its his attitude and what he is saying in his complaint that screams "I am an arsehole". His complaint offers no contructive criticism , and just negativity. "Waste of time?" No I disagree. The girl must be able to play classical well in order to be put in such a class.


you're paying for connections and the benefits of going to a place as famous as berklee

and in the end that matters a poopload more than rigorous standards unless you're in a field like i am in

The connections can help , but TBH people dont care about whether you went to berklee or not when it comes to playing music. If you can play well , you can play well. They will hire you for two reasons and two reasons only.

-Ability to play
-Can do , No BS , work together attitude

[Egggo]

Its his attitude and what he is saying in his complaint that screams "I am an arsehole". His complaint offers no contructive criticism , and just negativity. "Waste of time?" No I disagree. The girl must be able to play classical well in order to be put in such a class.

i have met plenty of classically accomplished people who simply can't improvise or interpret and interpret beyond lead sheet

The connections can help , but TBH people dont care about whether you went to berklee or not when it comes to playing music. If you can play well , you can play well. They will hire you for two reasons and two reasons only.

-Ability to play
-Can do , No BS , work together attitude

that's a rather simplistic and naive way of looking at the world

especially in a business as utterly convoluted and twisted as the music one

[White Riot!]

i have met plenty of classically accomplished people who simply can't improvise or interpret and interpret beyond lead sheet


Thats why shes going to berklee eh? Learn something new?


that's a rather simplistic and naive way of looking at the world

especially in a business as utterly convoluted and twisted as the music one

Let me ask you , have you ever been payed for a drumming session?

If you give them BS , you simply don't get called in again. Trust me. The music industry is tight knit. If you rub people the wrong way , word gets around.

[Egggo]

Thats why shes going to berklee eh? Learn something new?

you learn something new on your own time or with a private teacher

unless you have more money than brains, you go to a school to get a degree and make connections in the hope of getting a job that will justify your however many years spent in school

Let me ask you , have you ever been payed for a drumming session?

nope

but let me ask you

do you think drumming sessions are the only activities done in the music business

If you give them BS , you simply don't get called in again. Trust me. The music industry is tight knit. If you rub people the wrong way , word gets around.

maybe things are different in australia

but there is a reason why any half decent school in america has an extensive alumni association for undergrads and grads to network with

[White Riot!]

you learn something new on your own time or with a private teacher


http://img224.imageshack.us/img224/8653/berkrk6.jpg

Teach and Education. Go find what connection THOSE words have with learn. (i.e A hell of a lot.)


unless you have more money than brains, you go to a school to get a degree and make connections in the hope of getting a job that will justify your however many years spent in school


You dont exclusively need some high brow school to make connections. This is fools talk.

They dont care if you got a fancy degree on the wall. Your playing as a drummer is what is on offer and what is being judged. Do you think the music punter cares if the drummer went to berklee? No , not a ****ing chance..


but let me ask you

do you think drumming sessions are the only activities done in the music business

We are talking in context. A professional drummer drums. It is his art . Simple stuff huh?

What can a drummer do other than drum? maybe make drum arrangements and maybe make a book , but that is not your bread and butter.


maybe things are different in australia

but there is a reason why any half decent school in america has an extensive alumni association for undergrads and grads to network with

Alumni is less revelvant in music. Trust me on this one.

The Grads of berklee dont run the studios , nor the bands. Even then , using them to get gigs , if your an arsehole theres only so many bridges to burn. Word gets around. You cant keeping jump from one to another , eventually you'll run aground

[White Riot!]

Hmm see could do this module perhaps?

http://www.berklee.edu/courses/details.php?id=394&department=Piano&viewbydept=1&sort=

[Suck My Squirrel 438]

The idea with the kind of universities Cameron would prefer, is that they only accept extremely talented musicians. This means the concepts discussed in the modules etc. can be of a more advanced level than a university that accepts plebby players.

A degree from this university will count for something, as having been allowed to attend would say alot about the quality of your playing.

Players will be more likely sourced from these universities because there is no chaff to be seperated from the wheat.

[White Riot!]

The idea with the kind of universities Cameron would prefer, is that they only accept extremely talented musicians. This means the concepts discussed in the modules etc. can be of a more advanced level than a university that accepts plebby players.

A degree from this university will count for something, as having been allowed to attend would say alot about the quality of your playing.

Players will be more likely sourced from these universities because there is no chaff to be seperated from the wheat.

They accepted portnoy , though>?

How about we send berklee an email and see what their thoughts are.

" I am a talented classical pianist , wanting to attend berklee to study other styles of the instruments , do you offer to educate students who have no previous knowledge of other styles?"

A degree from this university will count for something, as having been allowed to attend would say alot about the quality of your playing

Not really.

I disagree with your and camerons thoughts on elitist universities. Its a stupid concept. University means everything. Not "for elitists"

[Josiah]

A degree from this university will count for something, as having been allowed to attend would say alot about the quality of your playing.

Players will be more likely sourced from these universities because there is no chaff to be seperated from the wheat.


Not sure what country you are from.


But musicians in the United States audition for their gigs. They don't submit resumes.

[Suck My Squirrel 438]

Not sure what country you are from.


But musicians in the United States audition for their gigs. They don't submit resumes.

Don't know where your from, but previous experience often comes into whether or not you get a gig. Not everybody who would like to get a gig will be auditioned. Infact, positions as drummers rarely get advertised. Musicial directors will already know alot of musicians and generally will offer the spot to people they already know (without a formal audition).

[Josiah]

Musical Directors? Are we talking about playing contemporary drumset or classical percussion for shows?


Drumset - sessions, touring gigs, etc, etc you audition to get those parts. Later in life, when you have esstablished a name for yourself, by knocking down 100's of gigs and albums. Then people simply know who you are. Most people only reach that point on a local level after many years of playing.

That's really all besides the point it's Union here in the U.S. so that really overrides a lot. Doesn't matter who you are, you are touching a major label recording, tour or act if you aren't in the union, and that's just step #1.


Musicial Directors don't exist for contemporary drumset players, unless you are playing for a circus of broadway shows.
People drumset players deal with are Producers, A&R, Reps, Managers and Engineers. And of course bands and artists.

Stick to your guns.

[Hunted By a Freak]

The ensemble placement system is very strange and not very efficient. The best playing experiences are the ones you make yourself, typically. The girl has been here 3 semesters I believe, and she can't play worth a damn. I still go to my ensemble and play my *** off. It is obvious that in the real world you will deal with musicians of differing caliber all the time. That said, there is still a certain amount of competency and skills required to simply get through a tune. Most of the time it's me and my professor playing and trying to guide her through the tune. Sorry, but it's the truth. I don't think there's much else to argue.

I have said that there has been little to nothing I have learned at Berklee, as far as drumming goes. But keep in mind it is the simple truth that I have most likely practiced more, gigged more, learned more, etc. then 99% of people on this board. I was very well prepared to come here, where as others were not. That is why I am a composition major, though. I would also say that going to school for music, an art, seems somewhat silly at times, but really, with majors like Music Synthesis, Contemporary Writing & Production, Film Scoring, etc. I would say good luck at trying to become good at those. If you can afford it or get a good scholarship, and want to pursue more than just playing your instrument, I would say weigh the options and try and come.


To the guy who asked about theory and the auditions: I have not participated in an international audition, being a US citizen. I have heard that they are somewhat more open, but I would suggest still following my guidelines, if you are a drummer or percussionist.

As far as the theory goes, the more theory you know before you come here, the more basic harmony classes you can possibly test out of, and the more time and money you could save.

Any more questions?

I skimmed through some of the arguments and don't really see anything else worth giving any more response to. I think it is a bit silly that you are defending a girl who you have never heard, and I have. Truth be told, I am a better jazz/contemporary music pianist than her, and have studied piano more than most of you, I would imagine. I don't really care what some random people on the internet have to say about the matter, to be honest.

Call me arrogant, but whatever. It is kind of silly. I mean, perhaps I would take your opinions more seriously if you had more credentials than say, some music trade school, or your high school. Or if you played with any sort of musical act of any repute, beside your high school band, or in some cases, a fictional church. Or EVEN if you posted some audio/video of any worth or merit. But no one has really done any of this, sorry to say.

I know that in most cases, as in judging a piece of music, let's say, you do not need any special quailifications to have an opinion. That is not what I'm saying.

I AM saying that in the case of judging a school you have not been to, or a piano player you have not heard, etc. etc. you should probably have some sort of expertise or credentials, because otherwise you are just making things up. A bit silly, giving advice about something you know nothing about.

Before anyone asks for it, do a search. You probably won't even have to. I have provided plenty of audio and video through the years here.

Ok, time for practice then class. Have fun trolling, Josiah. :wave:

[Josiah]

Truth be told, I am a better jazz/contemporary music pianist than her, and have studied piano more than most of you, I would imagine. I don't really care what some random people on the internet have to say about the matter, to be honest.



A better jazz pianist then a Berklee pianist student, and you are a drum student....

[Charlie Daniels]

Musical Directors? Are we talking about playing contemporary drumset or classical percussion for shows?


Drumset - sessions, touring gigs, etc, etc you audition to get those parts. Later in life, when you have esstablished a name for yourself, by knocking down 100's of gigs and albums. Then people simply know who you are. Most people only reach that point on a local level after many years of playing.

That's really all besides the point it's Union here in the U.S. so that really overrides a lot. Doesn't matter who you are, you are touching a major label recording, tour or act if you aren't in the union, and that's just step #1.


Musicial Directors don't exist for contemporary drumset players, unless you are playing for a circus of broadway shows.
People drumset players deal with are Producers, A&R, Reps, Managers and Engineers. And of course bands and artists.

Stick to your guns.
what you must call them something else in america or something. a Musical Director is the person responsible for hiring the musicians and directing them toward what is required by them.

it's kind of like the producer except they are only concentrating on the band, where as the producer will be concentrating on staging/lighting/advertising etc. etc. ???

[Hunted By a Freak]

Did I stutter?

I have already said that there is a portion of the Berklee student body, in my opinion and in the opinions of others here, that is lacking. She falls into this group.

Believe it or not, some of us study other instruments. If you are interested in finding out more, I would suggest maybe looking into buying Mark Levine's Jazz Piano Book, which while lacking in a name, is a literal compendium of voicing techniques, reharmonization, comping techniques, improvisation, chords scales, etc. Pretty much anything you need to know to get yourself on track to become a competant jazz piano player. Also, obviously, things like the Hanon book will help your finger chops too! :thumb:

[Hunted By a Freak]

what you must call them something else in america or something. a Musical Director is the person responsible for hiring the musicians and directing them toward what is required by them.

it's kind of like the producer except they are only concentrating on the band, where as the producer will be concentrating on staging/lighting/advertising etc. etc. ???

No, it is not different here. My Country/Western drumming teacher talks about playing for musical directors all of the time, how to please them, what not to do, how to make good impressions, etc. But then again he has worked on tons of recording sessions, jingles, live performances, etc. Maybe when Josiah gets to play more gigs than The Chuch Of Questionable Existence he will familiriaze himself with such situations.


That is all. :wave:

[Charlie Daniels]

Did I stutter?

I have already said that there is a portion of the Berklee student body, in my opinion and in the opinions of others here, that is lacking. She falls into this group.

Believe it or not, some of us study other instruments. If you are interested in finding out more, I would suggest maybe looking into buying Mark Levine's Jazz Piano Book, which while lacking in a name, is a literal compendium of voicing techniques, reharmonization, comping techniques, improvisation, chords scales, etc. Pretty much anything you need to know to get yourself on track to become a competant jazz piano player. Also, obviously, things like the Hanon book will help your finger chops too! :thumb:



yeah it's quite common for people who play tuned percussion to have atleast some piano skills.

[Charlie Daniels]

No, it is not different here. My Country/Western drumming teacher talks about playing for musical directors all of the time, how to please them, what not to do, how to make good impressions, etc. But then again he has worked on tons of recording sessions, jingles, live performances, etc. Maybe when Josiah gets to play more gigs than The Chuch Of Questionable Existence he will familiriaze himself with such situations.


That is all. :wave:

yeah that makes alot of sense.

i just can't see how a producer (who often has little techniqual musical ability) could put together an ensemble of quality musicians.

and i don't see how that ensemble could all just sit down in a room and start playing perfectly without someone in charge of it :-(

[Josiah]

^That's too bad really. Hopefully someday you can enjoy good musicians.

Never heard of Charts? I've seen tons of people sit down and play without needing overbearing guidence. If you mean in charge as too "Hey, this is the tune.. here's the chart." *hands them out* then yes of course.
Everyone looks at the chart, the drummer counts it off.. and away we go. if "in charge of" constitutes handing out the charts and calling off the tunes, well ok!

BTW Most producers, composers and song writers are very adept musicially, but more importantly are smart. And smart people know that it takes a team, and you hire a team of people, who each have a speciality at what they do, to complete the job.


what you must call them something else in america or something. a Musical Director is the person responsible for hiring the musicians and directing them toward what is required by them.

it's kind of like the producer except they are only concentrating on the band, where as the producer will be concentrating on staging/lighting/advertising etc. etc. ???

Oh I suppose.. there are always those people.


However... of course, as I said, it doesn't matter who you know, playing is always the bottom line.

And if a better player shows up. Well, guess who gets the gig most the time?


It is the music business the laws of hiring, firing and fair employment do apply. As does the Musicians Union.


Cameron can talk about his teachers all he wants, who no doubt have played for extensive amounts and variety of artists and such. I studied under a guy who played for 'The Bird' and was personal friends of Mr. Rich. I got lots of his stories!!!
Cameron himself has not.. and 3rd party information is well just that.

There are however many people here who do play for a living. And if we are to talk about the application of education to making a living playing drums - those are the people who are to be asked.



It's ironic you would use your musical administrative system to lean on as example for professionalism, and at the same time complain about how poor your country does economically.

[Charlie Daniels]

Cameron can talk about his teachers all he wants, who no doubt have played for extensive amounts and variety of artists and such. I studied under a guy who played for 'The Bird' and was personal friends of Mr. Rich. I got lots of his stories!!!
Cameron himself has not.. and 3rd party information is well just that.
Hmm you finish by saying Cameron has third party information, just after you've been bragging about having a teacher who was friends with Buddy Rich? That hardly makes you a more reliable source of information... especially as it's been shown you were BS'ing about knowing Johnny Rabb personally.

[Josiah]

Oh no.. don't confuse things now. That's what you just did.. I didn't use my teachers stories as evidence of the music industry. I simply stated I studied under the guy and he had them!!

My experience and tellings about the industry come first hand.


It was shown? How was it shown again...? Some random person under an internet persona said they know JB and they say JB says he never heard of me... hardly "been shown". Let along like 80 fantasy steps away from reality.

[Charlie Daniels]

oh, and lol if you think charts subsitute for a musical director :lol:

and more lol if you think a musical director can substitute for charts! :lol: :lol:

lol so you think that the producer auditions all the muso's, and gives them all the charts and then the muso's will work out everything (including the logistics of rehearsals, liasing with the vocalist, and to have the authorative say should problems arise with anything?)

[Charlie Daniels]

Oh no.. don't confuse things now. That's what you just did.. I didn't use my teachers stories as evidence of the music industry. I simply stated I studied under the guy and he had them!!


Haha not it's not. I have boxes and sticks. There is no BS there.

funny that a student of Johnney Rabb, whom posts on this forum, asked Mr Rabb if he knew of you and Mr. Rabb was most adament he didn't.

Those privacy laws again, eh?

[Josiah]

I don't think son. I know.. remember, you live in the remote region of the world. I live in one of the music epicenters.

People here make money playing music, we don't just like sit around thinking about it then posting. Just accept you live in a radically different place then most the people here.


Where I live.. there's like.. I dunno 3 or 4 House of Blues, 25+ 65,000 seat venues... it's just "slightly" different here. And when you grow up, playing music, only 20 miles from the majority of record labels main office buildings.
Well, you know.. proximity effect.



A student of.. because he says so? Oh please.
Oooh I'm a student of Vinnies!! Look Vinnie said Matt sucks. There, same "proof".

*Mr Rabb wasn't addement about anything, because it was 3rd party information, from someone else.

This "proof" is just as much proof as what I say is. Except of course.. I actually have a bunch of JR sticks, in fact, there are pictures I posted years ago with JR sticks in them.

[Charlie Daniels]

I don't think son. I know.. remember, you live in the remote region of the world. I live in one of the music epicenters.

People here make money playing music, we don't just like sit around thinking about it then posting. Just accept you live in a radically different place then most the people here.

Look wtf are you on about. the fact that I live in Australia and you live in America hardly makes you more of a musician or a more authorative source. I have posted videos of myself playing in high profile pop acts, and videos (that received quite abit of praise forum wide) of my mallet percussion skills as well.

you have posted flams.mp3 and some phony "live" audio that you later admitted (when challenged) was actually a playalong CD. :-|

Drop the act, it's getting really lame. You may have have walked past, or seen in person, some famous drummers. It doesn't mean you "know" them and it doesn't make you an authoriative source on drums.

This thread was meant to be a 'helpful' thread about a university whom many members will ask questions about. gtfo and go back to kidding yourself that because you live in a close geographic proximity to a recording studio that you are some famed drummer.

[Damo]

"Hunted By a Freak" - What an amazing opportunity you are creating for yourself !

Just make sure you learn about the workings of the industry as much as you are focusing on the technical aspect and the grades. When you leave, they wont be nearly as important as you think! Technical ability and musical knowledge counts for nothing if you dont develop the awesome contacts that places like Berklee provide. You are in a truly opportune position there!

If youre looking to make this your career, then at some point you'll need to dig deep and find what assets separate you from any of your challengers, and work them to the n'th degree. Loads of people are talented, but few are unique enough to be remembered, and your success will depend on you being remembered when the call is being placed.

The things you are learning now are merely tools for you to develop your future. Its what you do with these tools that count. Forget about the other people in your class - Its your money, your time and your career. The less motivated and less apt students will not slow you down unless you let them. Keep your eyes on the greater goal.

Best of Luck!

[Hunted By a Freak]

Very good post, Damo. I think now is a good time to get things in this thread back on a positive note. :)

I know exactly what you mean, man. I went through high school practicing my as[COLOR="White"]s[/COLOR off, and it wasn't until my first year of college that I made the realization you are talking about. There are tons and tons and tons of drummers who can play part X in Band Y. But what determines who gets the gig? That is when things beside technical skill matter, and I would say they matter THE MOST in the professional world. It is expected that you can lay it down and read, etc. when you are in a professional setting. What really matters is who you are, how you act, who you know, etc.

Berklee has been a great place for meeting people. People I think will help me build a career in the future.

[billdrum]

A professional attitude is a must. Be early, not just on time. Be prepared, with all of the necessary sticks, mallets, equipment to do whatever the producer asks for. Know something about the gig before you get there. And be prepared to take constructive criticism/direction, and do exactly what the producer wants.....be easy to work with.

Those things will get you re-hired (as long as you can handle the musical demands of the job).

Those habits and your reputation are formed now, while you're in school. You never know when you'll meet up with someone who either taught or attended school while you were there and remember you.

[Hunted By a Freak]

A professional attitude is a must. Be early, not just on time. Be prepared, with all of the necessary sticks, mallets, equipment to do whatever the producer asks for. Know something about the gig before you get there. And be prepared to take constructive criticism/direction, and do exactly what the producer wants.....be easy to work with.

Those things will get you re-hired (as long as you can handle the musical demands of the job).

Those habits and your reputation are formed now, while you're in school. You never know when you'll meet up with someone who either taught or attended school while you were there and remember you.

Exactly. If you're early you're on time. If you're on time you're late. If you're late, you're forgotten.

[dairyairman]

i would think the best part of going to a place like berklee would be the people you meet there. you'd be meeting all kinds of outstanding musicians with great ideas, both among your fellow students and your teachers, as well as guest artists and clinicians. the opportunity for making connections would be endless!

[Josiah]

This thread was meant to be a 'helpful' thread about a university whom many members will ask questions about. gtfo and go back to kidding yourself that because you live in a close geographic proximity to a recording studio that you are some famed drummer.

Ooh haha what playing timp? Haha all right "drummer".

Funny you skipped over the tons of pictures, album audio and other such things I've posted over the years.

Besides you failed to also notice, I was refering to many people.

And yes, little child, you are a timp player, in a very small and remote country. You constently compain about your countries economically issues that plagued musicians - Want me to link to threads YOU have made just to whine about prices for musicians?

Now you are saying living in Australia provides the identical economical and musical landscape as America. Secondly attempting to cross over your VERY limited expereince as a classical percussionist to playing drumset as living in the United States.

Ya, I play drums for a living kid.. even if you don't like it and want to try and discredit me. Between the pictures from music fesitvals, huge churches and album audio on my site. I also teach privately. And in fact dear plexiglass... there are people on this site, numerous, who have met me in person.

You don't know nothing about me. Nor can you "prove" anything about me. What is proof, there are people here who have met me in person and even seen me play in person.


For you though to call somebody a fake is pretty funny.. aren't you the master faker? The kid with the big time illiness? The ultimate spammer? Internet board terrorizer?

Hard to call someone "fake" when you have 80 some odd accounts for yourself.




I dunno what you guys are talking about, showing up early is manditory for drummers! It's the dang carting that takes so much time.
Indeed dairyairman - that's why there is the joke, the best drummers never graduate from berklee. They just go for a year make connections then leave. Guys like Vinnie and Mayer go there.. then everyone goes whoo raw about the place, cept you know, they only went for like less then a year.

[dairyairman]

Indeed dairyairman - that's why there is the joke, the best drummers never graduate from berklee. They just go for a year make connections then leave. Guys like Vinnie and Mayer go there.. then everyone goes whoo raw about the place, cept you know, they only went for like less then a year.

haha! yes, i see what you mean. it'd be interesting to compare the graduation rate of that school with a regular university. probably the smartest students are the ones who leave early because they quickly learn it's personal connections and references that matter more than a degree when it comes to music.

[poopoogaypoonn]

lol another mxdp thread down the drain.

[dairyairman]

i don't mean to discourage our student, but you gotta admit, the opportunity to meet fellow musicians at berklee has got to be awesome whether you choose to stick it out or not.

[stevensonmat2]

jos gtfo man wow

[Josiah]

..hmm no.

i don't mean to discourage our student, but you gotta admit, the opportunity to meet fellow musicians at berklee has got to be awesome whether you choose to stick it out or not.

Totally, those situations can be amazing for growth if you keep an open mind. I really dug talking with people from other countries and seeing their approach to music and playing.

[White Riot!]

Any more questions?

I skimmed through some of the arguments and don't really see anything else worth giving any more response to. I think it is a bit silly that you are defending a girl who you have never heard, and I have. Truth be told, I am a better jazz/contemporary music pianist than her, and have studied piano more than most of you, I would imagine. I don't really care what some random people on the internet have to say about the matter, to be honest.

Call me arrogant, but whatever. It is kind of silly. I mean, perhaps I would take your opinions more seriously if you had more credentials than say, some music trade school, or your high school. Or if you played with any sort of musical act of any repute, beside your high school band, or in some cases, a fictional church. Or EVEN if you posted some audio/video of any worth or merit. But no one has really done any of this, sorry to say.


Its kind of silly that you are more concerned about other students than yourself. Im sure berklee has some tissues somewhere cameron :p . Im sure theres plenty of "credentials" types who are ego patted princesses such as yourself.

[The Ska Man]

I think we should all chill and talk about kitties.

/exits thread.

[poopoogaypoonn]

ERR body has got to chill, smoke a blunt and read this article
http://www.cs.cf.ac.uk/Dave/mclaughlin/art/final.html

[Charlie Daniels]

Funny you skipped over the tons of pictures, album audio and other such things I've posted over the years.
You know I hear you often refferring to these, so why won't you repost them up? Or are you refering to flams.mp3? :lol:

As for the rest of your post: :rolleyes:

[-TGP-]

Awsome points on the first page, HBAF.
Although I am not considering Berklee as the school where I would like to attend to further my knowledge in music, I will take your points into consideration when I apply at other schools of music. (Aka. Humber!)

[Josiah]

You know I hear you often refferring to these, so why won't you repost them up? Or are you refering to flams.mp3? :lol:

As for the rest of your post: :rolleyes:

If you want to see them so bad. Go search for yourself.

Audio? There's like 5 or 6 clips on my site from albums.

[Hunted By a Freak]

5 or 6? From albums? The drum n bass and songo are both drums only. The jazz is a chick corea play along from the dave weckl contemporary drummer +1 package. The "solo" is "live". The acoustic is so out of time that I would imagine it being an already existing track you stole somewhere and recorded onto. The Rock 1 & 2 are both so sloppy I doubt they are professional recordings. Maybe something you did on a meager home studio with your buddies. :p

White Riot: I'm not so concerned with her or anyone else. I used her as an example in like one sentence and you guys made it into a big deal. Maybe when you become an accomplished or skilled musician you will know how aggravating it is playing with less than adequate musicians.



Anyway, I practiced for 7 hours so far today, gonna shed on the pad for another hour or more. Also had a drum lesson, went to 5 classes, went to a Stanton Moore clinic, and finished a track i was sequencing yesterday. What did you do today, Josiah? :smoke:

[stevensonmat2]

I saw you and BB use the term "shed"; Ive never heard it before though. Is it a fairly common term?

[Hunted By a Freak]

Yeah it is common lingo short for 'woodshed', like go out to the woodshed and practice :p

[(*The Noonward Race*)]

Hey Josiah can you pleasssssse stop nitpicking and trolling Cameron? He made a good thread and is answering questions very succinctly and is spending his own time to offer his own advice, do not attempt to give him advice on that you ***.

[Hunted By a Freak]

I dunno what you guys are talking about, showing up early is manditory for drummers! It's the dang carting that takes so much time.
Indeed dairyairman - that's why there is the joke, the best drummers never graduate from berklee. They just go for a year make connections then leave. Guys like Vinnie and Mayer go there.. then everyone goes whoo raw about the place, cept you know, they only went for like less then a year.

We said that it is mandatory to show up early; read please. :confused:

Some people don't graduate berklee, but Vinnie was here for 3 semesters. There are plenty of great drummers who have stayed and graduated, though. Maybe you have heard of some of these guys:

http://www.drummerworld.com/drummers/John_Robinson.html (one of the most recorded drummers in history)

http://www.drummerworld.com/drummers/Antonio_Sanchez.html

http://www.drummerworld.com/drummers/John_Blackwell.html

http://www.drummerworld.com/drummers/Steve_Hass.html

http://www.drummerworld.com/drummers/Todd_Sucherman.html

http://www.drummerworld.com/drummers/Terry_Lyne_Carrington.html

just a few off the top of my head

I guess they are not up to Josiah Michelleti or MI standards tho :amaze:

[DrummingBen]

Damn, I was looking forward to reading this thread. But lo and behold, another potentially D&P great thread down the drain. And again it seems to center around Josiah versus everybody. Has anyone else noticed that no one has really sided with Josie? Pretty much him vs everybody. And in the time I've been here I for one have never seen Josie post up any decent audio, that is supposedly everywhere. But I mean, Josie lives in the great USA while I just live in crappy Australia, so why would I know anything?
By the way, hows the Iraq war going?









Australia rules

[some jive turkey]

Politics and nationality issues aside, ...I have to agree.
I am sick of these Josiah vs. the forum threads-Sick of Josiah's bogus claims, and fraudulent bragging.

Dude, just stop,...it's so old., and so pointless. Get a life.
No one's going to sift through 18,000+ posts of trite, meaningless arguments to find all this alleged pics and audio you're constantly referring to. If it was of any genuine importance, you would have it on your website.(...if it actually existed)

Judging by the responses from others I've read over time, most of the forum considers you a argumentative pest, and the others don't know any better yet.

You would be cool if you just stuck to contributing to this forum in a positive way, but you create an enormous ammount of unproductive, and uninteresting dissent.

you have posted flams.mp3 and some phony "live" audio that you later admitted (when challenged) was actually a playalong CD. :-|


...finally admitted to it huh?

[Josiah]

^

Really? That's fascinating. You know, we had a public forum poll not more then a few months ago.
I was voted most helpful and most friendly, or something else I forget...

For like the, hmm 3rd or 4th year in a row.

BTW if "most the forum.. finds me.. a pest".

Explain the absurd amount of positive rep I have? And literal list's of 100's of comments from multitudes of users saying various positive things.

Generally people despised by the majority are not in the top listings for reputation ranking, a publically administered ranking.

Hey Josiah can you pleasssssse stop nitpicking and trolling Cameron? He made a good thread and is answering questions very succinctly and is spending his own time to offer his own advice, do not attempt to give him advice on that you ***.

Yes, that must be why he's banned constently....



I can give advice on anything I want. Notice Cameron right off the bat professed being the best in the world (the school) and then at the same time insults a student of a different instrument.



You know, I doubt the people who contributed money to the scholarship that pays for camerons tutition intended it to be used by him to spend his time trolling and harrassing internet forums.
Anyone want to argue his bannings? Anyone? What is this, his 7th account now?

Or am I the Mods too.. another of my secret accounts, really, I'm just the whole freaking site!!!


I've been here for years, my posting habits have not changed. Commons sense says look at the variables... gee, who has been posting more, and been getting banned all the time?

Golly gee.

[some jive turkey]

^


Generally people despised by the majority are not in the top listings for reputation ranking, a publically administered ranking.



Yep, believe whatever you want man.

[Josiah]

.. or reality?

[oops]

If i may break in and ask some questions????

I started studying Music Performance this year too. At a place called Victoria University in Melbourne, Australia. Nice place. Not really reknowned for being amazing, heck the music faculty has only been around for like 10 years, but i'm not worried.

I just love that pretty much everything i learn has to do with music.

Do you get private lessons every week as a part of your fees, i'd guess you would... what do they teach you?

My teachers have been stressing groove. Playing with feeling and locking in with the rest of the band, and i love it. We've got 2 metal head drummers here, and they're always at odds with the teachers. But they bring something different to the course, and its great.

Does your course cover the business side of things as well? mine does.

How much time gets devoted to improv?

our improv teacher is amazing. he throws stuff at us that we would have never thought of. he made us jam on a G7 chord for half an hour, and it was actually some of the most fun i've had playing with other people.

Do you enjoy your course?

I find that i'm loving mine. and i'm practicing a lot. I set up a practice pad by my computer, and i play on it till like 12 at night.

It's great. anyway. I wish you the best of luck.

[Hunted By a Freak]

I'm guessing by "course" you mean my schooling in general, as I'm taking 12 "courses" right now, meaning classes. :)

I enjoy it greatly. All I do has to do with music. Improvisation, groove, harmony, etc. are all pretty standards things, requisite for any succesful music program. We have quite a bit of different classes to study these... everything from classes based on the styles of Art Blakey and The Meters to Atonal Solfege, Music Law, Microtonal Improvisation, etc. Anything you could possibly want. Music business courses are available to all, and we even have a seperate music business major, which owns its own record label here. I know a guy who just applied to be Artist Relations with Vic Firth through that, actually.

Lessons are of course part of tuition, though some people take additional lessonos on the side. You are expected to meet certain criteria at your playing assesment at the end of the semester, so you can work on those things (groove, improv, styles, reading, etc) or whatever you want. It also depends on the teacher. My teacher is really into latin, so he has been working on that with me. It has been great. He has played with everyone from Carribean Jazz Orchestra and Romera Lobamba to Paquito D'rivera and Michel Camilo, so he really knows his stuff.

Courses I am taking this semester, for those curious:

Harmony (theory)
Ear Training (ear training and sight singing)
Drum Lab (technique, styles, etc.)
Double Bass Lab (self explanatory)
Jazz Drumming Styles (analysis of players, transcriptions, audio, video, etc.)
World Drumming Styles (same as jazz but different genre of music)
Arranging (self explanatory)
Bop Masters (jazz history class)
Lesson (self explanatory)
Country & Western Drumming (deals with playing stylistically correct and learning about what is expected in the studio, from music directors, etc. and general tips for studio and live performance, locking into the groove)
Broken 8th Note Feel Jazz Drumming (playing in the "straight 8th" jazz style, or ECM style of playing, analysis of techniques, transcriptions, etc.)
Contemporary Styles Ensemble (ensemble where you play a variety of styles and learn repertoire)

Plus, Tuesday-Saturday I go to different jam sessions of different styles every night hosted by the jam club, jazz society, etc. where I meet new players all the time. Sunday I generally practice with a prog/art rock band I formed here, and Monday is when my new fusion group is going to start practicing. Also me and some buddies are going to be preparing a Steely Dan caf show (there are concerts in the cafeteria at night often where students submit a demo and perform... some original music some just covers or tributes for fun) and some other friends are organizing an Allman Brothers tribute band and want me to play.

Besides that I go to seminars and clnics a lot, to learn about everything from music technology to film scoring to drumming to whatever.

I keep busy!

Glad to hear things are going well for you!

[dairyairman]

sheesh! that's pretty intensive. what are you planning to do for a career?

[mattsmith]

^

Really? That's fascinating. You know, we had a public forum poll not more then a few months ago.
I was voted most helpful and most friendly, or something else I forget...

For like the, hmm 3rd or 4th year in a row.

BTW if "most the forum.. finds me.. a pest".

Explain the absurd amount of positive rep I have? And literal list's of 100's of comments from multitudes of users saying various positive things.

Generally people despised by the majority are not in the top listings for reputation ranking, a publically administered ranking.



Yes, that must be why he's banned constently....




Yeah, I've seen this guy go to that well many times. Some 13 year old decides to stage an unofficial poll every three months or so, and out of thousands of forum members he wins some vote 12 noob votes to 8, and then in his usual spirit of misrepresentation thinks that by saying it again and again it becomes some sort of absurd mandate. Actually, the fact that he keeps going to this only reaffirms his small time status, when it is obvious by any reasonable person that these so called polls are a joke. Besides after his flaming of a large number of those younger guys a couple of weeks ago, he doesn't even have this anymore.

As to rep, even Damo has said to him about a billion times that rep means nothing. In fact there are probably thousands of posters who could care less about stupid rep. Again, more affirmation of small time status, along with amazing constant trolling and spamming of a moderator's help thread.

Again, this is a thread about Berklee, nothing else. But I remain beyond amazed at how long this is allowed to continue when anyone can see this is harrassment by one member and a small handful of noob sidekicks to hijack threads.

MXDP members, this one guy who can't prove a thing he's ever said about himself is giving you an unnecessary bad rep all over the Internet. And before he comes back to say this is the most respected drum forum on the Internet, read this...

http://www.answers.com/topic/sputnikmusic

I found the comments and quotes about the percussion forum to be especially illuminating. And I don't think they reflect on most forum memebrs. But I think we can assume the source. This thread is a typical example.

Don't allow him to continue to do this. Allow yourself to be able to discuss the topics as they are actually listed. Don't empower this behavior, because that's all he's got. I would personally like to hear more first hand anecdotes about Berklee before making my own choices in the coming year.

[Hunted By a Freak]

sheesh! that's pretty intensive. what are you planning to do for a career?

I am going for a composition major, but I am considering contemporary writing and production. I was originally going to do film scoring, but I hear a lot of it is technical rather than writing. Jazz composition would be cool, but I have a very strong jazz background, and want to learn more about classical composition. I can still take a mixture of courses from each.

I don't really have plans for a career. I diversify and sort of plant seeds, like any wise musician does. Be versatile and good at what you do and something will happen. I would love to be a sideman or studio guy, but failing that I would be just as happy writing or arranging.

[kdizze]

why does everyone keep biacthing at each other??

mattsmith, do you just come on this forum to whine at josiah? why do you care? and if you don't like the forums..don't post, your not helping the bad situation (that you point to) anyway.

josiah, hunted by a freak, why are you acting like you are? who actually cares? if you are both as respectable and as great at music than you both claim, then why would you be on internet forums whimpering and moaning at each other..?
come on..grow up a bit. you both are as bad as each other (as well as other people, your cronies if you will) constantly abusing each other and ruining thread after thread. one of you just take a back seat, and resist sniping and bitching..
these forums can be a happy place :)

[Hunted By a Freak]

why does everyone keep biacthing at each other??

mattsmith, do you just come on this forum to whine at josiah? why do you care? and if you don't like the forums..don't post, your not helping the bad situation (that you point to) anyway.

josiah, hunted by a freak, why are you acting like you are? who actually cares? if you are both as respectable and as great at music than you both claim, then why would you be on internet forums whimpering and moaning at each other..?
come on..grow up a bit. you both are as bad as each other (as well as other people, your cronies if you will) constantly abusing each other and ruining thread after thread. one of you just take a back seat, and resist sniping and bitching..
these forums can be a happy place :)

I made a thread at the request of several people. The thread was littered with insults and attacks on me. I don't have 'cronies' or any agenda. I was just trying to make a helpful thread. How are you helping anything by fanning the flames? Just don't post and let the argument die. I did.

[kdizze]

it is very commendable that you made the thread and the fact that you are helping people out. very good for you!
in other threads as well, negativity seems to resolve around you (as well as other accounts) as well as other users. Not singling you out. By cronies I meant the people that always jump in to defend you during arguments, usually mainly between you and josiah. They seem to offer nothing else to the d&p forum..
but it is good that you let the argument die:) sorry if i was fanning the flames, it just seemed that it was a good thread that didn't deserve to get destroyed like many before it.

[dairyairman]

I don't really have plans for a career. I diversify and sort of plant seeds, like any wise musician does. Be versatile and good at what you do and something will happen. I would love to be a sideman or studio guy, but failing that I would be just as happy writing or arranging.

i think with all your training, experience, and connections something is bound to happen. it'll be interesting to see where all this leads.

[Zildjian]

(this kid rambling about usless stuff)

Shut up dude, Jos has done more for this forum then you ever have.. Read around the Advanced, begginer thread...he knows his stuff

----------

Hunted By A Freak, first of all I think its sweet you're going to berklee, those classes you posted seem awesome. Do they also have other classes apart from just instruments such as Music history, recording etc? How much you pay a semester (with Fin aid)? Im guessing its a insain amount of money because its not a community or state college (or is it?). Do you get like a bachelors/ assoiates degree for completing the full corse or is it something different. Do you dourm there? do they have dorms?

Im seriously considering going to college for music after I get a degree in physical therapy.

[Hunted By a Freak]

Yeah, we will see. There are plenty of jobless and very talented musicians out there. :p

I am only 19, though, so I have plenty of time I suppose. Sometimes I regret I was not a Tony Williams (playing with Miles at 17) or a Mozart but things like that really don't happen today. The music industry is different as a whole. Tony Royster Jr. Was moderately succesful, I suppose, at a young age... had some videos and stuff, but I don't know that he has really done much recording or touring, though I could be wrong. I know he was playing with some Disney band or something when he was younger; but whatever you need to get by, right? But the whole child prodigy thing is an entirely different subject, I digress.

I'm confident that with the connections I make here and the skills I posess I will be able to achieve what I want. :)

[Hunted By a Freak]

Shut up dude, Jos has done more for this forum then you ever have.. Read around the Advanced, begginer thread...he knows his stuff

----------

Hunted By A Freak, first of all I think its sweet you're going to berklee, those classes you posted seem awesome. Do they also have other classes apart from just instruments such as Music history, recording etc? How much you pay a semester (with Fin aid)? Im guessing its a insain amount of money because its not a community or state college (or is it?). Do you get like a bachelors/ assoiates degree for completing the full corse or is it something different. Do you dourm there? do they have dorms?

Im seriously considering going to college for music after I get a degree in physical therapy.

Ok, lots of questions. I'll do my best... ask more if I am unclear. :)

- They have classes on pretty much anything you would want. Yes there are music history courses, both mandatory ones and courses that go into very fine detail in certain time periods. For instance, there is a class each on Miles Davis Acoustic and Miles Electric. There are also tons of recording and engineering classes, though I don't know what you meant specifically. If you are talking about engineering and production, you can major in that and take a ton of courses. If you mean recording from a performer's standpoint, there are studio drumming classes, and others geared toward that type of playing.

- http://www.berklee.edu/tuition/ and click "schedule of tuition and related fees". I didn't really have to pay much for tuition (I got close to a full ride), but I did have to pay dorm fees and buy my laptop/software. So depending on your semester and situation it may vary. Berklee is a private school.

- Berklee is a fully acredited school, so you get a bachelors. You can optionally sign up for the diploma program rather than the degree, which takes out the liberal studies (science, english, etc). But you can take a maximum of 12 credits rather than 16 with the degree program. You can also pursue master's studies, I believe, in conjunction with New England Conservatory, which is close by, though I am unfamiliar with the details on that.

- I live in the dorms. There is limited housing, though, and it is more expensive than living off campus, unless you rent really expensive, obviously. They have a lottery to see if you can reserve a room for after your first year, so you may be able to keep living there or not. I already made the decision to get an apartment next summer. The dorms have practice rooms at the end of each floor, and are pretty nice. Most have 2 people, though I know some have 3 and are bigger. They also vary as far as if you share a bathroom with another room or have your own.

Hope this helped!

Glad to hear you are considering going someday. There are people here from all walks of life... I have a lot of friends my age, and some that are in their late 20's, a few in their early 30's.

[Hunted By a Freak]

it is very commendable that you made the thread and the fact that you are helping people out. very good for you!
in other threads as well, negativity seems to resolve around you (as well as other accounts) as well as other users. Not singling you out. By cronies I meant the people that always jump in to defend you during arguments, usually mainly between you and josiah. They seem to offer nothing else to the d&p forum..
but it is good that you let the argument die:) sorry if i was fanning the flames, it just seemed that it was a good thread that didn't deserve to get destroyed like many before it.

I do not know why negativity revolves around me. I do not know why Josiah has this burning hatred for me and feels the need to dispute petty things for no reason. I really have stopped caring.

Regarding "other accounts": I have two other accounts. One is my original, which got banned because I posted pictures of naked breasts in the drum stronghold. :lol: The other is Gary Lover, which I created before that one got banned in order to enter the drumoff anonymously. I don't use that one anymore. This talk about me having 7 accounts and getting banned all the time is nonsense. I got banned, and I admit it was goofy. But I like joking around, and I am not the only one to post naked pictures in the stronghold. Just one that got caught. :)

In reference to my "cronies"... they are all respectable users, and though I may have a bias, I think they differ from Josiah's "cronies" in that they aren't trying to stir up trouble, just right a wrong and expose a phony. Regardless, I didn't ask them to post, despite whether or not I agree. But I think you will find more and more people are on my side of things lately, as they are seeing how Josiah just harasses me. These are not "cronies", merely people fed up with this destroying D/P.

[Hunted By a Freak]

Shut up dude, Jos has done more for this forum then you ever have.. Read around the Advanced, begginer thread...he knows his stuff


Do not attack matt. He may be critiquing the forum, but if you have read any other posts you would know that many others feel the same way. The forums are in a slump and are just going down hill. Is it wrong to address problems in an attempt to improve them?

Josiah knows a decent amount about drumming, which is boosted by his ego and 13 boys who worship him. There are many users who know more, play better, post more maturely, etc.

I don't feel he offers much to the forum that it doesn't already get.

[kdizze]

^thats cool mate, no personal attack of course.
i think part of the reason that the forums are in a slump is due to the fact that you and/or the people i described as cronies are trying to 'expose a phony' in josiah. everyone is now aware of his disputable situation, everyone knows what you and others think about him.
whether or not people believe what you say or what he says doesn't really matter does it? if you believe that he has lied on this forum or whatever, youve definitely made your point. Theres no point in carrying on with it, why are you really bothered? even he has lied, on whatever scale, who cares. he wouldn't be the first to embellish things over the internet + he does contribute a lot of good to the forum.
i hope you carry on posting really helpful comments and great audio etc. And i actually do think the standards of the forums discussion is on the rise rather than a downward slope. Lets stop the biatching!

[Sunshine]

Sooo...college for music, huh.

[(*The Noonward Race*)]

Explain the absurd amount of positive rep I have? And literal list's of 100's of comments from multitudes of users saying various positive things.i have more rep than you it''s not that hard, i have almost 20,000 reputation.

[Patrick323]

I propose that we have a Rep. electorate that get's to decide a High Chancellor of the forums.

[Seafroggys]

how bout not?

[(*The Noonward Race*)]

I propose that we have a Rep. electorate that get's to decide a High Chancellor of the forums.
haha

[FL3P]

Am I dreaming or was there a mattsmith post here yesterday that has disappeared?

[Hunted By a Freak]

I believe so... maybe he deleted it? Maybe some strange censorship going on here?

[Charlie Daniels]

Yes, I can see a post has been deleted. I am not sure who the poster was though.

[FL3P]

It was mattsmith and it was what I thought was a good post. I know it isn't necessary for everyone to keep going on about their experiences with certain people here but his seemed worthwhile and certainly wasn't negative.

[GooseFilms.net]

So today I found out I'm getting a $15,000 yearly scholarship from NYU for trumpet. **** is sick. Looks like I'll either be going there or Carnegie Mellon.

I was thinking about applying to Berklee back in the summer, but we decided that the whole place didn't seem... professional enough. They have by far the lowest retention rate (which I think hovers somewhere around 34%), and I'm not about to confine myself solely to jazz and funk music. I had a lesson with Tiger Okoshi (I'm primarily a trumpet player, remember) when I visited, and i just didn't have a great connection with the guy. Plus I was running late and sprinted to the building, so was completely winded by the time I got to his building and horribly fumbled through some of Smith's Top Tones. Ha, what a horrible lesson.

[Gary Lover]

That is good to hear, man. Congrats. Yes, Berklee does have a low retention rate, which is more around 50% I believe, no joke.

But that is for a number of reasons. While some musicians finish out their degree and go onto other things a lot get connections, calls, etc. to go on tour or go record or whatever may be.

Vinnie Colaiuta is one example... couldn't afford it anymore, haha. But look at him now! Probably the best drummer out there, in my honest opinion.

But yeah, there are definitely more than Jazz and Funk here. There are tons of styles. I know plenty of Latin guys from many different countries, Gospel cats, metal guys, pop, rock, etc. You name it, it is going on here. We have a bluegrass ensemble, a techno/rave ensemble even. People scratch here. It is awesome for me, but I understand if you just didn't feel comfortable here. It is definitely different than any other school I've checked out, while many other music schools have a lot of similarities. I wouldn't say it is unprofessional at all, more "real world" than anything. :)

[SpinController]

good stuff, the good stuff that is. gary, schools like that, huge, big openings, new worlds, new directions.

how has this experience changed your future perspectives? has it changed your views on playing music for a living, or not? do new directions seem like more exciting, plausible opportunities, or maybe something else all together?
do you see yourself sticking out the time or would you leave if the right opportunity came along, aside from the obvious of course, what would be the line of decision for you?

[Gary Lover]

It has made the future look brighter. All sorts of opportunities are opening... just yesterday I was at a jam session when this awesome guitarist came in, gave us all fusion charts and we read through Proto Cosmos. He really ripped it up! I was very very impressed, and we're gonna get together on our own sometime to do some playing. Same thing has happened with tons of people... my phonebook is a lot bigger now, let's say! :)

Anyway, as far as leaving school, I would certainly leave if I thought the gig I was offered would supply me with a sustainable income or would lead to other gigs, etc. You can always go back to school later, if at all, but certain opportunities only show themselves rarely.

[rohbit]

Gary, if you'd mistyped your name and missed the 'r' in it, would you have kept the account anyways?

[The Ska Man]

Got this thing from Berklee today. Funny thing, though, I didn't ask for anything, nor did the 'rents. It's telling me about some summer program and offering me a spot on there.

[Gary Lover]

Yeah, I know a couple of guys who did that, it is a pretty good program.

[MNdrummer21]

It has made the future look brighter. All sorts of opportunities are opening... just yesterday I was at a jam session when this awesome guitarist came in, gave us all fusion charts and we read through Proto Cosmos. He really ripped it up! I was very very impressed, and we're gonna get together on our own sometime to do some playing. Same thing has happened with tons of people... my phonebook is a lot bigger now, let's say! :)

Anyway, as far as leaving school, I would certainly leave if I thought the gig I was offered would supply me with a sustainable income or would lead to other gigs, etc. You can always go back to school later, if at all, but certain opportunities only show themselves rarely.

Proto Cosmos? Damn! Thats not exactly an easy tune to cold read(not the hardest, but still). That's awesome, I love that tune.