The punk lifestyle, philosophy, and its culture and subcultures

[pedro durruti]

You know, I don't come here as much as I used to, but I don't think that punk as a movement (its ideas, art, etc.) is discussed enough, whether we participate in it or just enjoy the music. There's the DIY thread, but although doing it yourself is an important principle within punk culture, that thread is more about fashion and there's not much discussion about the culture itself (you'll have to correct me if I'm wrong, because I rarely go into that thread). I see another thread on the first page about punk magazines, which often do in themselves discuss music and culture, but in the actual thread, music seems to be the only concern. Bits and pieces of culture discussion seep into our threads, but for the most part the focus is just punk music.

So, what are everyone's thoughts on anarchism?

[Flagjacket]

It's coming sometime.

[Special Brew]

Anarchism is an interesting idea, but I have very limited knwoledge on it. It seems completely impossible, and it's just a nice idea.

[pedro durruti]

Ah! Already two separate predictions, and one forum.

So Kevin, you believe that humans are progressing towards something perfect? And what about you Oh, the horror!?

[Flagjacket]

And maybe I give a wrong time, stop a traffic line.

[Snoisrucxe]

Punk is all about religion.

Or least it should be.

[pedro durruti]

Where'd you come up with that misconception/notion?
And maybe I give a wrong time, stop a traffic line.
Pardon me?!? :o

[Flagjacket]

Your future dream is a shopping scheme!

[AIRIC]

I wish I understood anarchism better. It's an interesting topic.

I wish I was more a part of my local punk scene. I'm not sure if it's like "Reinventing Axl Rose" but if it is that would be an amazing thing to be a part of.

Also Kevin if you're not going to stay on topic just don't post here. Go to TCT.

[pedro durruti]

Your future dream is a shopping scheme!
O.k. Kevin now this is just pure nonsense.

[Flagjacket]

Local punk scenes are nothing like Reinventing Axl Rose, they're more like SLC Punk.

[AIRIC]

I'm almost positive that scene exists. It's all about finding it.

[Permanent Solution]

Anarchism is impossible to achieve in modern society. It does contain some interesting ideas although I much prefer Anarcho-Communism to pure Anarchism.

[Flagjacket]

O.k. Kevin now this is just pure nonsense.

I wanna be anarchy!

[pedro durruti]

I think it differs. In some scenes beer is the life of the party, while some are more like the Against Me! ideal. For instance, I was going to a Blues festival over the summer, and along the water front, several drunk punks were sitting on the sidewalk laughing at $3 fireworks.

[AIRIC]

I have not yet met a group of people where beer was not the life of the party and emotion was not looked down upon. It's something I crave though. Someday hopefully.

Were those drunk punks about the beer or the bonding/friendship/fun/whatever?

[Flagjacket]

Yeah Eric where beer is nott he lfie of the party and honesty and emotionar enot looked down upon is a place I'm trying to find too, and I've sort of found in some people here.

[Ghostfire3]

I don't know what Reinventing Axl Rose makes out a local punk scene to be like because I don't listen to Against Me! but mine has it's fair share of assholes and morons but also some really nice people.

[Ghostfire3]

I have not yet met a group of people where beer was not the life of the party and emotion was not looked down upon. It's something I crave though. Someday hopefully.

Straight-edge people

[Permanent Solution]

although the discussion has already drifted from anarchism, for those of you interested in learning a little bit more about it:
http://www.sputnikmusic.com/forums/showthread.php?t=288507

[Flagjacket]

I think what Eric means is that he wants sometihng where beer and drugs and stuff aren't CENTRAL to pleasure.

[AIRIC]

Yes that's what I mean Kevin. I enjoy beer and drugs and I think that they should be used and enjoyed within the punk scene but there is something beyond that which I yearn for.

[Flagjacket]

I do too, and I chose to abstain from such substances because I think they perpetuate a state of shallowness and hedonism.

After typing that post: I realized that's probably the best sentence I've ever said about why I'm edge.

[Ghostfire3]

Yes that's what I mean Kevin. I enjoy beer and drugs and I think that they should be used and enjoyed within the punk scene but there is something beyond that which I yearn for.

Do your friends not feel the same way?

[AIRIC]

Well that is fine I respect your decision to do so. Though I'm sure drugs may perpetuate a shallowness in people I am far from shallow. I almost wish I was more shallow.

And why shouldn't happiness be the greatest good?

Aaron: My friends are not into punk rock like you and I and everyone here is. I think if they were to read Against Me! lyrics they would not get something even similar to the feeling it gives me.

[Flagjacket]

Well that is fine I respect your decision to do so. Though I'm sure drugs may perpetuate a shallowness in people I am far from shallow. I almost wish I was more shallow.

And why shouldn't happiness be the greatest good?

By hedonism I was referring to subtance abuse over substance of mind and stupidity over being mentally awake. Basically a "yeah party hard get durnk" type of mentality is what I meant. Pretty much everyone I've been hanging out with is like that so I'm trying to get away from that.

Why would you wish more shallowness upon yourself?

[Ghostfire3]

Aaron: My friends are not into punk rock like you and I and everyone here is. I think if they were to read Against Me! lyrics they would not get something even similar to the feeling it gives me.

I'm in the same boat as you. I have a couple friends who are into punk but the vast majority of my friends listen completely different types of music (which I don't have a problem with). And like you said, if my friends were to read the lyrics of bands I listen to, they would feel entirely different about it than I would.

[pedro durruti]

I'm high right now. Do I come off as shallow right now, or hint at being more shallow because I use drugs?

[Flagjacket]

I don't take people seriously when they're high, because it barely counts as thinking at all.

[AIRIC]

Why would you wish more shallowness upon yourself?

For example. I have a thing with a girl that one of my best friends in the world just ****ed. I've hung out with her 3 times and talked to her online quite a bit. If I were a bit more shallow I could easily stick it to this girl and never talk to her again, but I cannot do that. I'm all ready falling for this girl even though my friend likes her and I know that I will not use her and that I will treat her well.

This is a great trait to have but at the same time I wouldn't mind being able to just break her heart.

And Kevin, I can see where you would think that not being a drug user. Eventually marijuana is no different than a cigarette though. Not I, and I'm sure not Peter is any less mentally sharp than we would be sober. Just a bit more silly and hungry.

[pedro durruti]

I don't take people seriously when they're high, because it barely counts as thinking at all.
Are you to tell me that I am mentally incapacitated right now?

[Flagjacket]

For example. I have a thing with a girl that one of my best friends in the world just ****ed. I've hung out with her 3 times and talked to her online quite a bit. If I were a bit more shallow I could easily stick it to this girl and never talk to her again, but I cannot do that. I'm all ready falling for this girl even though my friend likes her and I know that I will not use her and that I will treat her well.

This is a great trait to have but at the same time I wouldn't mind being able to just break her heart.

What happened to "where honesty and emotion are not looked down upon?"

But I kind of understand how you feel...

[AIRIC]

Like I said. I'm very happy that I have this trait. Things would just be easier if I didn't.

Temptation is not a sin, acting on it is. I think that applies here.

[pedro durruti]

For example. I have a thing with a girl that one of my best friends in the world just ****ed. I've hung out with her 3 times and talked to her online quite a bit. If I were a bit more shallow I could easily stick it to this girl and never talk to her again, but I cannot do that. I'm all ready falling for this girl even though my friend likes her and I know that I will not use her and that I will treat her well.

This is a great trait to have but at the same time I wouldn't mind being able to just break her heart.

And Kevin, I can see where you would think that not being a drug user. Eventually marijuana is no different than a cigarette though. Not I, and I'm sure not Peter is any less mentally sharp than we would be sober. Just a bit more silly and hungry.
You would break her heart if you got high more often.

And yes, I'll admit that being high does not exactly help your intellect, but let me ask you this: How much thinking do you do when you play a sport, and are really into it? Really into any activity for that matter?

[AIRIC]

The only time I find myself thinking very hard is in real life situations with consequence. Other than that not very often.

[Flagjacket]

I don't mean intellectually, I just mean when you put yourself under the influence of any substance, what's operating your body is no longer yourself but a chemical outsider.

I think a lot of the time, when I write, when I read, and when I speak with other people. When I go biking, my mind is almost detached from my body and it drifts everywhere.

[pedro durruti]

So now drugs eliminate free will?

[AIRIC]

You're right about the chemical outsider point. That holds merit. Who's to say that is bad for you though? What's wrong with your mind running on auto-pilot for a bit?

[Flagjacket]

@Peter: Drugs are known to impair judgement. There are things that some people would never do sober that they will do while intoxicated.

@Skruunch: I feel it's better to be 100% grounded in a reality, be in control and responsible for all my actions whether they are good or bad. I'd rather be upset and aware of it than happy and vacant.

[The Ska Man]

I, while not truly believing the oh so cliched slogan that is "punk is dead" I find myself wondering 'bout it. I mean, you can easily see that punk's ideals and basically what set it apart is being softened to being something acceptable to the media and/or general public. others can say that it has just evolved into pop-punk. I think that if we can say we're "punk", than it should be represented in our daily lives.

[AIRIC]

I agree 100%. That's why I don't use drugs that **** me up so bad that I can't be responsible for myself. Marijuana ****s with you just as much as cigs.

[pedro durruti]

@Peter: Drugs are known to impair judgement. There are things that some people would never do sober that they will do while intoxicated.

@Skruunch: I feel it's better to be 100% grounded in a reality, be in control and responsible for all my actions whether they are good or bad. I'd rather be upset and aware of it than happy and vacant.
They are also known to be inhibitors. You do things, yes, that you wouldn't do when sober, but they also make you do things you wouldn't normally do because of external constraints, for example, society. They can reveal something about the person, or make them do something stupid, which in itself may be somethign revealing about the true self. Remember, there's a difference between drug use and excessive drug use.

What is reality? Is internet chatting reality? TV? Books?

[Flagjacket]

I think that just because marijuana and beer fu'ck you up less doesn't make them any better than the other drugs. Use of drugs prepetuates a shallowness among youth and an attitude that doing drugs is badass. I'd maybe have less of a problem if doing drugs wasn't treated like someone just socked a cop in the jaw.

[pedro durruti]

I think you're dodging the point.
I, while not truly believing the oh so cliched slogan that is "punk is dead" I find myself wondering 'bout it. I mean, you can easily see that punk's ideals and basically what set it apart is being softened to being something acceptable to the media and/or general public. others can say that it has just evolved into pop-punk. I think that if we can say we're "punk", than it should be represented in our daily lives.
There are definitely many people out there living what we would clearly call the punk lifestyle.

[Flagjacket]

They are also known to be inhibitors. You do things, yes, that you wouldn't do when sober, but they also make you do things you wouldn't normally do because of external constraints, for example, society. They can reveal something about the person, or make them do something stupid, which in itself may be somethign revealing about the true self. Remember, there's a difference between drug use and excessive drug use.

What is reality? Is internet chatting reality? TV? Books?

Peter you don't need drugs tob reakf ree from societal constraint. That's the type of silly thinking that I'm against, that drugs somehow "free" you.

And this isn't an existentialism debate, both internet chatting and TV are part of reality, but neither are reality itself.

[AIRIC]

It's really person to person then I guess. I am not a badass. I'll admit it. I'm a momma's boy, I'm weak physically and weak willed. I smoke and drink because it drops the chains, like Peter said.

[pedro durruti]

Peter you don't need drugs tob reakf ree from societal constraint. That's the type of silly thinking that I'm against, that drugs somehow "free" you.

And this isn't an existentialism debate, both internet chatting and TV are part of reality, but neither are reality itself.
I know that you don't need them, but that doesn't prevent them from being inhibitors. And of course there are other ways to free yourself, but that's not why I do drugs, I just don't mind the inhibiting benefits.

Just like drugs.

[Flagjacket]

It's really person to person then I guess. I am not a badass. I'll admit it. I'm a momma's boy, I'm weak physically and weak willed. I smoke and drink because it drops the chains, like Peter said.

I find it silly that it's still considered rebellious to do drugs when so many kids do it already. And as for the inhibitions thing, I guess like, one of the main factors for me coming out of my shell was going to this summer camp regularly, and it helped me become more open with peers, and also I just went and found people who were more like me, and even though I didn't like them before I got to know them, now they're my really good friends.

[AIRIC]

I think it's silly that rebellious is something that people strive to be. Whether it be drugs, clothes or just being an asshole.

[Flagjacket]

Yeah, today my friend Jamie yelled at a kid for bringing his guitar to school and a girl in all black with those meathook Hot Topic pants came up to her from nowhere and said "**** you, we don't have to conform to your standards."

[SantaDuJuan]

I miss believing I was an Anarcho Punkrocker.
I MISS YOU CRASS!

Woe to me, if only Ratatat wasn't so good.
In all seriousness, punk rock changed my life, and I'll never forget how much fun it was to grow a mohawk and spend an hour to put it up at first.
Or trying to rip your shirt to make it look cool, or your jeans.

I think Punk still has alot of life in it. I just believe it's gotten old.

[Flagjacket]

Through punk rock I have discovered multiple other things that are way less gay.

[DaveToopes]

Guys I have just been participating in hockey and my cognitive function is not very high right now but this thread rules I will contribute later.

[Anxious]

I still don't see how veganism/anarchism and the like got associated with punk in the first place. It was always about musical revolution and now its the norm for punk to be associated with these topics.

[pedro durruti]

Well, it has always been an outcast culture. Punk culture, even when it was a trend, it was still considered rebellious, antisocial, and even revolutionary. As is anarchism, a very radical idea, just as veganism is such a huge divergent from the norm of meat eating in many regional cultures.
Guys I have just been participating in hockey and my cognitive function is not very high right now but this thread rules I will contribute later.
If Ethan is serious, then you see how physical activity can restrict thinking. But the advantage physical activity has over drugs is that it's only temporary, and wears off. So Kevin, I guess in that respect you are right that drugs are controlling, but consciousness is intact and the mind still works properly, although more slowly and differently. Different thoughts. Assuming that you don't cross over the lines of intoxication, of course, but can still be called high. Like feeling the effects of drugs but being able to control yourself.

[Bajs]

I dont give a **** about anyone and i dont care about my future.


Im not punk, im just 16.

[coheneran]

For all the people who want to understand anarchism better, and for those who think it can never work, print this out and read it: http://www.crimethincx.com/ffol//fightingforourlives_lo.pdf

It's really short, like a 45 minute read, at most.

[Jon]

eranarchy cohen pretty much killed the credibility of anarchism.

meth ****s you up badly; like one line will leave you feeling awful for a week afterwards. after the huge rush of euphoria that is.

the only drugs I try and stay away from are hallucinogens, because they are really, really dangerous, and weed, because I don't want to be a ****ing hippy.

[coheneran]

Yeah, shrooms and acid are super-dangerous, you've no idea how many times I've jumped off the roof of my house to try to fly.:rolleyes:

But pills are fine, it's not like we need our brains intact or anything.

The fact is all drugs are intensely bad for you, but it's your choice in the end, and it's possible to have loads of fun without drugs.

Anyway I'm going clean for a bit to regain some braincells and better coherency.:p

[lynch_me]

They tried to turn the opera into a punk rock stage.

[coheneran]

Making punk a threat again, again.

[Jon]

lol coherency more liek cohenerancy i'm funny.

yeah even I can see how many braincells MDMA has ravaged, but at least its only mental damage as opposed to physical damage as you get with shrooms.

who the hell uses their brains anyway?

[pedro durruti]

They tried to turn the opera into a punk rock stage.
WHAT? :mad:

[AIRIC]

Jon is clearly ****ed up from his drug use and Eran is just goofy.

[Jon]

damn ****ing right I'm ****ed up :D

[World Burns To Death]

And maybe I give a wrong time, stop a traffic line.
hahah

[superskankinactionhero]

i haven't been here in ages, but good job on this thread peter i'll be coming back to make a decent post!

[AIRIC]

MY FAVORITE POSTER EVER.

[Spenser]

I think that just because marijuana and beer fu'ck you up less doesn't make them any better than the other drugs. Use of drugs prepetuates a shallowness among youth and an attitude that doing drugs is badass. I'd maybe have less of a problem if doing drugs wasn't treated like someone just socked a cop in the jaw.

I used to think the same way, until I met the group of friends I smoke with now. I believe that drug use and drug abuse can be differentiated between by knowing the motivation behind the use. For my friends and me, we smoke because we feel it's a natural thing that can be benefitial for the right people. Marijuana is not the most important aspect of our lives, but it is definitely part of our lifestyles. I think if you can use a drug without losing sight of more important things, like say, taking care of your family, then it is not a bad thing and can be benefitial.

Some people will also say that drugs can make you do bad things you wouldn't do sober, but I believe that it is more dependant upon the will of the person to determine whether or not a certain action is acceptable, at least in the case of lighter drugs, such as marijuana.

BTW, I kind of take a more hippy approach when it comes to drugs, I try to use as little man-made drugs as possible, such as pills, meth, acid, etc. I'm totally accepting of natural drugs though, such as shrooms, opium, and marijuana. :chug:

[coheneran]

I was like that, only did natural stuff, until I discovered the beauty of ecstacy and the badassness of acid.

[Bajs]

Im almost straight edge lawl.

or well, i dont drink couse i eat too much medecines (medecines wich people uses as drugs anyway).

[Bajs]

BTW, I kind of take a more hippy approach when it comes to drugs, I try to use as little man-made drugs as possible, such as pills, meth, acid, etc. I'm totally accepting of natural drugs though, such as shrooms, opium, and marijuana. :chug:


Yeah, couse nature doesnt do as much mistakes as humans. ......




(...)

[coheneran]

It doesn't...

Nature, as far as we know, doesn't think, so can't make mistakes.

[Bajs]

Humans doesnt think either. All we do is purely based on instincts, we only believe that we have a choice.

[coheneran]

That's silly. We get a goal in mind, what we intend to do, and we undertake a course of action to achieve that goal. A mistake is when something other than that goal is achieved.

[Pirate Satellite]

Drugs and punk were a perfect fit when things were still fresh and arty, but now most serious drug user 'punks' I see are indistinguishable from juggaloes. It's a shopping mall scene.


That said, I do drugs and like them. So don't listen to me.

[RCVA]

I feel no affinity to people who dress like punks, you know..mohawks and leather jackets.


I just don't wanna be like that and when i say i listen to punk i have a feeling to them punk means the casualties whereas for me i mainly listen to hardcore punk and while it's a form of punk i feel kinda like i don't fit in at punk shows i've been to which is totally opposite from when i'm at a hardcore show.

[Pirate Satellite]

I feel no affinity to people who dress like punks, you know..mohawks and leather jackets.


I just don't wanna be like that and when i say i listen to punk i have a feeling to them punk means the casualties whereas for me i mainly listen to hardcore punk and while it's a form of punk i feel kinda like i don't fit in at punk shows i've been to which is totally opposite from when i'm at a hardcore show.

Seconded, except I get a lot of crap at punk shows and hardcore shows because I don't play dress-up. I say, **** the biters. Any punk who cares about what someone else looks like has missed the point so entirely that I probably don't want to be around them anyways.

Most of the buddies I've met at shows have come up to me asking for drugs, so I guess it pays off in its own way to look like a dirty hippie sometimes.

[DBoons Ghost]

Just to clarify, straight edge is a hardcore movement started in the early 80s and only fits into that scope.

Punk was riddled with drug use.. Live fast die young.. etc etc.. Every band who started punk as a genre or lifestyle were drug addicts and alcholics.

Don't confuse anything here guys. Just wanted to clarify that for everyone.

[coheneran]

Straight edge has evolved, people go straight edge now for any number of reasons.

[pedro durruti]

Some sections within the punk scene have adapted straight edge, though. But for the most part, yeah, drug use is pretty rampant.

[DBoons Ghost]

Straight edge has evolved, people go straight edge now for any number of reasons.

Yes this is true.

Is it still straight edge till 21 or has it evolved past that as well?

[smokersdieyounger]

Seconded, except I get a lot of crap at punk shows and hardcore shows because I don't play dress-up. I say, **** the biters. Any punk who cares about what someone else looks like has missed the point so entirely that I probably don't want to be around them anyways.

Most of the buddies I've met at shows have come up to me asking for drugs, so I guess it pays off in its own way to look like a dirty hippie sometimes.

I dress like a punk, but I really make the effort to put my own spin on the look, and punk means so much more to me than the casualties. I don't just dress up for gigs I go too, I always introduce myself to other punk rocker types at concerts, even if they are obviously into **** bands, so I'm not a fashion nazi.

[RCVA]

Yes this is true.

Is it still straight edge till 21 or has it evolved past that as well?

I think a lot of people see it as a lifelong committment but usually people either stop claiming or just break because they don't feel it's necessary anymore. I'm sure there are a few people that do live like it for most of their lives though.

I'm not planning on taking drugs anytime soon but that's a personal choice and i'm not gonna claim edge because i don't want to be associated with that and, hey, i might change my mind.

[Jon]

BTW, I kind of take a more hippy approach when it comes to drugs, I try to use as little man-made drugs as possible, such as pills, meth, acid, etc. I'm totally accepting of natural drugs though, such as shrooms, opium, and marijuana. :chug:
My friend hit the nail on the head the other day.

Natural drugs aren't meant for human consumption. Would you eat a pile of dog **** if someone told you it made your dick grow? no you wouldn't. you would take viagra though, because its been designed by humans to do exactly what they want it to do.

That goes for weed, shrooms, opium etc vs. e, speed, meth, acid.

we couldn't decide which side coke and heroin go on.

but in general, stay away from all substances if you can't handle them, whether its caffeine or cocaine, smirnoff ice or skunk.

[Boilermaker]

But that can also make the drugs a hell of a lot stronger and more addicting.

You're saying you'd rather do meth than smoke mary jane? You deserve to die then.

[Jon]

At the moment I'd prefer to actually just have a Red Bull or Guinness and see my girlfriend.

Stoners are just as annoying as Methheads, and don't pretend that weed doesn't damage your brain. Saying that, there are odd occasions that I like a spliff, and odd occasions that I like a (literally, one) rail.

I dunno, recently my whole view on substances is changing.

Just do what you want, stay safe, and DON'T TALK TO PEOPLE WHEN YOU ARE ON COKE

[Spenser]

My friend hit the nail on the head the other day.

Natural drugs aren't meant for human consumption. Would you eat a pile of dog **** if someone told you it made your dick grow? no you wouldn't. you would take viagra though, because its been designed by humans to do exactly what they want it to do.

That goes for weed, shrooms, opium etc vs. e, speed, meth, acid.

we couldn't decide which side coke and heroin go on.

but in general, stay away from all substances if you can't handle them, whether its caffeine or cocaine, smirnoff ice or skunk.

I didn't mean natural drugs were the only way to go, I just meant that right now I'm into more natural things. And tru dat on your last statement.

[Flagjacket]

Not a drug thread please not a drug thread.

[AK47]

oh noes! people talking about drugz!! run to the hills my brothers!

[DBoons Ghost]

Oh come on. It's beloved irony.

Punk was founded on drugs. It's only fitting.

[DBoons Ghost]

Not a drug thread please not a drug thread.

Pfft! Flagjacket moar like I'maFagandIlikeit

[Flagjacket]

Pfft! Flagjacket moar like I'maFagandIlikeit

That barely makes sense, but you get points for not using the Fagjacket cop out.

But seriously no more drug threads please.

[DBoons Ghost]

Punk and drugs is like peas and carrots!

And thanks.. I almost used Fagjacket but I assumed you'd heard it enough.

I was creative on your behalf good sir and I thank you for small accolades.

[Flagjacket]

Yeah but the punk forum on MX and drug threads are like if you told one half that drugs strengthened your bones and organs and told the other side that drug threads are gay.

[AIRIC]

That didn't make sense at all.

[DBoons Ghost]

That didn't make sense at all.

I thought it was me failing internets lingo again.

I'm relieved.

[AK47]

:lol:

[pedro durruti]

Kevin, you helped make this a drug thread when you made this ignorant statement:

I do too, and I chose to abstain from such substances because I think they perpetuate a state of shallowness and hedonism.

[lynch_me]

It's Kevin.

[DBoons Ghost]

What's wrong with being shallow and hedonist? Devotion of pleasure as a way of life? Shiiiitt.. sign me the **** up for another twenny years beeyatch! We should replace christianity with hedonism and make everyone sterile, and just make babies from DNA.

Woohoo!

[lynch_me]

And that was the story of punk.

[Flagjacket]

Kevin, you helped make this a drug thread when you made this ignorant statement:

Actually I was talking with Eric about how he wants to find something beyond beer every Saturday night.

And my statement isn't ignorant, because drugs do help perpetuate a state of shallowness the same way that the presence of guns helps to perpetuate violence. It's not a main cause, but the effect is there. Whatever though, you're a big dick when it comes to these things and if you even want to talk about it you can take it on Soulseek.

[pedro durruti]

It still helped in creating a discussion about drugs...

Actually, you've been a pretty big dick about these discussions. Last time we talked about it on soulseek you got mad after Eric, Ethan and I questioned your claim that smoking a joint to a beautiful view after a long hike would ruin the entire hike, or something like that, and you "stormed out" of the room.

And not only is that a horrible analogy (not everyone with guns are violent people, nor does violence occur as a result of possessing a gun), but this whole "perpetuation of shallowness" is utter ****. Well actually that is a decent analogy, but the claim is still ****.

[lynch_me]

Clearly this is now going against the rules of Brain Toad's Constitution Section 15. Line 10.

[jimmy spalding]

hi, new here so please dont destroy me if i slip up.

im from a smallish town in the UK. The "punk" scene (minus scene kids) is more just all punk hardcore/punk/emo/crust/grind/whatever together, we make up about 30ish people there is a strong friendship connection there is big differences in personalities and habits, some people dont drink some do class A drugs, but we all get on for most of the time.

when i go to big city punk gigs there i dont find much unity theres nearly always a fight and there is a bunch of abnoxious (sp?) street punks which i just dont want to be friends with, i'm sure they are nice people i just would rather talk to my friends i have now. This is probably part of the problem of no unity but i just dont see how there can be with people like that.

I prefer smaller gigs in other towns where there is clearly a scene full of friends a good example is Boston UK if anyone has been its awesome there, they put on great gigs once or twice a week, loads of local people support the shows and its just a good atmosphere

I dont really know what point im getting accross but i think its something on the lies of i dont appreciate the whole punk scene in general but locally its brilliant

[Ghostfire3]

K, thanx 4 the info.

[Buzzbomb]

For all the people who want to understand anarchism better, and for those who think it can never work, print this out and read it: http://www.crimethincx.com/ffol//fightingforourlives_lo.pdf

It's really short, like a 45 minute read, at most.

I printed that out and gave it a read. Pretty good stuff you have access to. Thanks.

[AIRIC]

Ugh don't even bring up this hiking bullshit I don't watn to discuss that ridiculousness again.