Respect

[PerpetualBurn]

This is an issue I thought would be interesting to discuss since the term is thrown around so freely. It is usually thrown at me as an imperative - that I should respect people's opinions. For those who read a lot of my posts, it should be quite obvious that I have very little respect for a lot of the opinions that are different to my own.

I think it may be interesting to discuss why that is. And I mean without referring to the events that made me bitter and twisted. I mean why I don't respect these opinions that everyone is supposedly entitled to.

Respect, by definition, has a hierarchy. To respect means to hold something in higher esteem than something else. That I respect an opinion my indicates that that opinion is to be more highly thought of than others.

My point is, if I respected everything, I would respect nothing. In having minimal respect for the opinions I consider to be wrong, I am in fact showing greater respect for those that are acceptable. The posters on this forum that I do have respect for are in fact held comparatively higher than anyone who espouse the notion of respecting everything (which is quite meaningless).

Discuss.

[Krabsworth]

To GET respect, you have to GIVE respect.

[PerpetualBurn]

That's inane and crap, with all due respect.

I don't have to respect anyone for them to think that I should be held in higher esteem than others.

[YDtoad]

R-E-S-P-E-C-T
Find out what it means to me

I somewhat agree with you. I respect some users on here who I deeply agree with on core issues. I also don't have much respect for some who I agree moreso with. But I most respect those who I agree with though, I suppose.

[PerpetualBurn]

How can you respect an opinion if you think it's wrong?

[YDtoad]

How can you respect an opinion if you think it's wrong?

If it is well formed and coherently presented. It depends the issue--I don't care how 'well presented' a Holocaust denial point is, I won't respect it. But if we're talking about something that doesn't fall into those moral absolutes, then why not respect someone capable of presenting a well informed, cogent point? I may disagree with someone on net neutrality, but if they present their point well enough, I still will respect them for it.

[coe]

How can you respect an opinion if you think it's wrong?

This.

[Rabbi]

I can respect an opinion if I think its wrong if it is scholarly, but when people judge others then its potentially harmful... and thats where the line should be drawn.


I somewhat agree with you. I respect some users on here who I deeply agree with on core issues. I also don't have much respect for some who I agree moreso with. But I most respect those who I agree with though, I suppose.

So in conclusion you respect people who agree with you, and sometimes don't even respect the people who agree with you.

Respect is about who agrees with your opinions then right?

[Mr. Ron]

I respect people I like.


I don't buy into this "well thats your opinion and even though I totally think you're a moron for believing it, I respect that!" Nope, sorry.

[RockAndRoll]

How can you respect an opinion if you think it's wrong?

I respect someone who disagrees with me but has well a well formed opinion and decent arguments more than I respect someone who agrees with me, but is a complete idiot, only happened to trip over their opinion by chance and can't formulate a half decent argument to save their life.

[Mr. Ron]

I respect someone who disagrees with me but has well a well formed opinion and decent arguments more than I respect someone who agrees with me, but is a complete idiot, only happened to trip over their opinion by chance and can't formulate a half decent argument to save their life.

Thats respecting the fact that you can disagree to disagree and not be hateful about it, not their ideas.

[YDtoad]

I can respect an opinion if I think its wrong if it is scholarly, but when people judge others then its potentially harmful... and thats where the line should be drawn.



So in conclusion you respect people who agree with you, and sometimes don't even respect the people who agree with you.

Respect is about who agrees with your opinions then right?

Well it's like this:

1 (least respect) people who I disagree with and who don't state their points coherently and cogently. Like you :D

2 People who I agree with but who don't state their opinions well or form them too well, either.

3) People who I disagree with but who form their opinions in an intelligent manner. Like Dropper.

4) People who I agree with AND who form their opinions coherently and cogently.

Both three and four get respect. 4 just gets a lil' more.

[RockAndRoll]

Thats respecting the fact that you can disagree to disagree and not be hateful about it, not their ideas.

No, I can still respect the ideas of someone whom I disagree with. If for example they have a different set of information then me, but based on the information they have their conclusion is logical then I'll disagree with them, but respect their opinion.

[pedro durruti]

I think respect can be given to opinions that you disagree with, so long as they aren't absurd opinions that have no logical basis and are clearly wrong. And I think many other posters have just as much respect for some ridiculous opinion as you do, you're just more blunt in your disagreement.

[Rabbi]

Respect should be less about agreement and more about how scholarly an argument they make, and sorry, I'm not writing a thesis paper on sputnik so you will respect me.

[Mr. Ron]

No, I can still respect the ideas of someone whom I disagree with. If for example they have a different set of information then me, but based on the information they have their conclusion is logical then I'll disagree with them, but respect their opinion.

I would say that I can appreciate someone coming up with good arguments, but if I think their idea is totally insane I just can't see how I can dignify their insanity with my respect.

[RockAndRoll]

I would say that I can appreciate someone coming up with good arguments, but if I think their idea is totally insane I just can't see how I can dignify their insanity with my respect.

Well, yes, but there's a difference between disagreeing with someone and thinking they're insane.

[Mr. Ron]

Well, yes, but there's a difference between disagreeing with someone and thinking they're insane.

Clearly. But I'm talking about if someone's ideas are extreme or moronic.

[RockAndRoll]

Clearly. But I'm talking about if someone's ideas are extreme or moronic.

Oh, well that's different.

[griftadan]

How can you respect an opinion if you think it's wrong?

respect their right to have it and espouse it?

[BassRevelation]

Respect, by definition, has a hierarchy. To respect means to hold something in higher esteem than something else. That I respect an opinion my indicates that that opinion is to be more highly thought of than others.

wrong usage of respect. Respect is simply having consideration for another. One couldnt be more childish than to flat out disrespect an opinion of another for the simple reason that it is different from theirs.

with that said, respect is a two way street. It is possible for one's belief to be disrespectful, however. Someone who expresses their view as "I dont like your country" is different from someone who says "your country sucks."

[Diluted]

Opinion - 1. a belief or judgment that rests on grounds insufficient to
produce complete certainty.
2. a personal view, attitude, or appraisal.

If you are using one of those definitions how can an opinion be right or wrong?

Even if I don't agree with someones opinion I can still respect that person for having an opinion.

[RockAndRoll]

Opinion - 1. a belief or judgment that rests on grounds insufficient to
produce complete certainty.
2. a personal view, attitude, or appraisal.

If you are using one of those definitions how can an opinion be right or wrong?

Even if I don't agree with someones opinion I can still respect that person for having an opinion.

It's pretty simple:
For the first one your judgement is wrong.
For the second one your view, or appraisal is wrong.

[Diluted]

It's pretty simple:
For the first one your judgement is wrong.
For the second one your view, or appraisal is wrong.

First a judgement that rests on gounds insufficient to produce complete certainty cannot be right or wrong

Second, personal view cannot be right or wrong

example: If I said my opinion of a certain band was that they are good and your opinion of the same band was that they were not than neither of our opinions would be right or wrong, just different.

[RockAndRoll]

First a judgement that rests on gounds insufficient to produce complete certainty cannot be right or wrongYes, it can, just because you're not certain about something doesn't mean you're not wrong about it.

Second, personal view cannot be right or wrong
Well what's a 'personal' view and how does it differ from any other type of view?

example: If I said my opinion of a certain band was that they are good and your opinion of the same band was that they were not than neither of our opinions would be right or wrong, just different.

That all depends on what good means.

[Krabsworth]

i dont know man respect in my life has always been just bein nice

[Diluted]

An opinion is a person's ideas and thoughts towards something. It is an assessment, judgment or evaluation of something. An opinion is not a fact, because opinions are either not falsifiable, or the opinion has not been proven or verified.

What good means?...well good is subjective, something that is subjective can not be right or wrong.

subjective: particular to a given person

[RockAndRoll]

An opinion is a person's ideas and thoughts towards something. It is an assessment, judgment or evaluation of something. An opinion is not a fact, because opinions are either not falsifiable, or the opinion has not been proven or verified.
So what you're saying is it can't be wrong because it has not been proven or verified? Because that clearly doesn't make any sense.
What good means?...well good is subjective, something that is subjective can not be right or wrong.

subjective: particular to a given person
That's a cop out.

[thedeadwalk!]

When people say you need to respect others' ideas I think they mean tolerate.

At the very least they may just want you to shut up or not show signs of annoyance.

In my opinion, all you can do is present your side with all the facts you have. If they have their own facts or refuse to listen to yours, there's nothing you can do to change their mind. I imagine a lot of people have their beliefs and perhaps secondly look to facts that support them, while disregarding all opposing facts. It is one of our greatest endeavors to change our minds as the facts come and can be terribly difficult for even the truest scientist.

[MegaPhony]

I think respect is something that is based on the actions of others, in kind of a respect 'vicious cycle' if you will.
Everybody would like to think that others hold them in high esteem.
When someone comes a long, and says something that you find intriguing, intelligent, thoughtful, considerate or what not, you tend to respect them.
In order to gain a higher level for respect, you replicate or duplicate those actions for which you respect others for. In turn, by this replication you will have developed similar respect for yourself (in many cases)
It turns out also I think, that people are only respected by people who are similar to themselves.
Just like a devout Catholic respects the Pope and their pastor,
An aspiring guitarist might respect Jimi Hendrix and his guitar teacher.
Respect is subjective in many ways, but at it's core it comes from the general existance of natural law within humans.

[italic zero]

when people say respect they mean be polite because they're afraid of conflict

[Apollyon]

How can you respect an opinion if you think it's wrong?

because not everyone uses the same thought process as a four-year old tbh you're kind of an exception

declaring respect in street terms is declaring trust and understanding

if i say that i respect x person that means i trust them and i trust their ability to make decisions and i trust that they're going to think things through before they act

so in turn i respect that person because they meet my minimal expectations of how a person should act

you can also respect an opinion you don't agree with by accepting that the thought process behind the idea holds good merit but the train doesn't necessarily stop at your station

it takes a certain level of maturity to actually understand the concept of respect but it takes a much lower one to refer to it as a ridiculous platform of hierarchy

[MegaPhony]

Respect can't be a platform of hierarchy.
Respect is subjective.
You could be respected by 1000 people or 1 person.
Does the hierarchy base itself upon quantity or quality?
I'd say fame is a ridiculous platform of hierarchy, not respect.

[the_uber_penguin]

I like the "respect" thing in principle, but I don't like the fact that Blair obviously ripped it off from Da Ali G movie.

[-1up!-]

How can you respect an opinion if you think it's wrong?

I disagree on your very definition of respect. I see respect more in an egalitarian manner; disrespecting someone, IMO, is showing the arrogance that you consider yourself somehow superior to that "someone" in terms of intelligence. In my sense, respecting someone with whom I disagree actually means I am not willing to dig into his opinions, but I reassert he is my equal in nature as a human being and would be foolish to think he is not superior to me in any other field of activity, or even any other field of thought.

Although I can easily understand arguments made against my opinions, which will trigger my respect,if the opposing point is 1.against my opinion 2. beyond my understanding or logic, respect is harder to show.

If you disagree with this then **** off. :p

[ringworm]

Respect, by definition, has a hierarchy. To respect means to hold something in higher esteem than something else. That I respect an opinion my indicates that that opinion is to be more highly thought of than others.
why would respecting someone elses belief hold it to a higher level?

"I know you're wrong, but I respect your right be"



But respect is earned in most cases, in debatable items, less so, but in society & culture, you get what you give.

[PerpetualBurn]

If they're wrong and I'm right, then in that sense I am superior to them.

[Auberge le Mouton Noir]

I have respect for people that form their arguments in a well formed, far sighted, intelligent way, even when i don't agree with it. However, i think there is always a tendency to feel more respect towards those people you agree with.

[BassRevelation]

That's a cop out.
its actually right. If there was an absolute standard for good, then it would be fact, not opinion.

[Nick]

I thought you were supposed to respect the person's ability to hold whichever opinion they choose

[RockAndRoll]

its actually right. If there was an absolute standard for good, then it would be fact, not opinion.

I didn't say it was wrong, I said it's a cop out. You can be entirely right and still avoid the question. Whether what he said is correct or not isn't the issue.

[BassRevelation]

I didn't say it was wrong, I said it's a cop out. You can be entirely right and still avoid the question. Whether what he said is correct or not isn't the issue.

there's not much more you could add to that without getting into a heated, senseless debate over semantics. I know thats your fav :p

[RockAndRoll]

I wouldn't call attributing some meaning to the word good semantics.