Habeas corpus--going the way of the Buffalo

[Hababi]

By a 51-48 vote, the Senate today came up just short of rejecting the so-called habeas corpus provision in the GOP detainee bill.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/09/28/AR2006092800824.html

It doesn't apply to American citizens, though.

Your thoughts?

[LittlePound]

mxpx has a cd called "slowly going the way of the buffalo".....
Anyways, i really don't have any particular thoughts on the topic/article.

[ringworm]

Some of the likely campaign rhetoric was foreshadowed yesterday when House Speaker J. Dennis Hastert (R-Ill.) charged after the mostly party-line House vote that Democrats who opposed the bill voted "in favor of more rights for terrorists" and that terrorists "would be coddled" if the Democrats had their way.

House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) denounced Hastert's "false and inflammatory rhetoric" and said Democrats opposed the bill because it could endanger U.S. troops, exposing them to similar treatment by enemy captors, and because it was likely to be struck down by the Supreme Court.

I can agree with both sides on this issue. Either way…

[Hababi]

mxpx has a cd called "slowly going the way of the buffalo".....


That's where I derived this title from :p

Back in the day (early high school) I was a big mxpx fan.

[RicheyIs4Real]

you should vote green instead

[griftadan]

is this for people in gitmo?

you should vote green instead

if i'm going to throw away my vote i'm throwing it away to a less lame party.

[griftadan]

can't really say i'm surprised.

[Jaded]

Beyond that. Any non-US citizen can now be held indefinitely without charge upon the command of the executive branch. It's really quite extraordinary.
Holy **** that's bad.

[AmericanWeiner]

There's no such thing as throwing away a vote, unless you don't use it.

take politics 101 for christi's sake

[Smokey D]

What the hell are you talking about? In a first past the post system, voting for a party that can't possibly win is throwing away your vote. Don't be so idealistic.

For example, if you have two left wing parties that each gain 30% of the vote, but one right wing party that gains 40% of the vote, the right wing wins the election and forms the government This is despite the fact that the majority of the country voted for a left wing party.

[Reaganista]

it's a high probability that every vote you ever cast will be completely pointless

[Hababi]

I'm surprised this hasn't caught more attention :p

I've seen a lot of disinformation passed around about this, namely that it applies to native born Americans. On one hand, I think it could be dangerous, but also, you have to keep in mind that a defense attorney tactic is to not wave the right of a speedy trial. So, say all of a sudden the defense attorneys of everyone in Gitmo refuses to wave the right of a speedy trial (most attorneys wave the right to prepare for a trial)--all of a sudden, US attorneys must prepare hundreds, maybe thousands of cases in two weeks. That's impossible.

[AmericanWeiner]

What the hell are you talking about? In a first past the post system, voting for a party that can't possibly win is throwing away your vote. Don't be so idealistic.

For example, if you have two left wing parties that each gain 30% of the vote, but one right wing party that gains 40% of the vote, the right wing wins the election and forms the government This is despite the fact that the majority of the country voted for a left wing party.

I don't care about winning elections, I care about party representation.

If 49% of the votes go to the democrats, they still lose, but I'll bet you that the republican victor will consider the fact that only 2% more of the population agreed with him when he goes to policy making.

I live in georgia for christ's sake, don't you think I know by now my vote only counts if it's red?

ps. except when we consider today's polarized politics. When times are more moderate, it's much more evident.

[Erik6387]

If you know neither of the major parties are doing any good, why vote for them? Just because a tiny liberal party isn't going to win? You'd still be giving the only party that actually cares about the working and lower class you're vote. And you are most likely working class yourself. Ever think that with your support that this party could slowly gain some power?

[AmericanWeiner]

The only minor party that ever became a major party is the republican party, and it took an issue like federalizing the government from a confederacy to do it (I might be mistaken on this).

So...good luck with that.

[Erik6387]

I don't expect it to happen, but it'd be a welcome change. IMO, the last good thing to happen to the average citizen in this country was The New Deal...

[griftadan]

should i take the bait? no i won't kill the thread

[ATC]

I'm surprised this hasn't caught more attention :p

I've seen a lot of disinformation passed around about this, namely that it applies to native born Americans. On one hand, I think it could be dangerous, but also, you have to keep in mind that a defense attorney tactic is to not wave the right of a speedy trial. So, say all of a sudden the defense attorneys of everyone in Gitmo refuses to wave the right of a speedy trial (most attorneys wave the right to prepare for a trial)--all of a sudden, US attorneys must prepare hundreds, maybe thousands of cases in two weeks. That's impossible.

That's a weak justification as well as not the motivation for this.

[Reaganista]

I live in georgia for christ's sake, don't you think I know by now my vote only counts if it's red?
no your vote still doesn't matter even if you vote for the winner
unless he wins by 1

[Smokey D]

I don't care about winning elections, I care about party representation.

If 49% of the votes go to the democrats, they still lose, but I'll bet you that the republican victor will consider the fact that only 2% more of the population agreed with him when he goes to policy making.

I live in georgia for christ's sake, don't you think I know by now my vote only counts if it's red?

Er, Bush never won a convincing majority, but he still adopted rightwing policies.

And party representation doesn't matter unless it's something other than first past the post. If 50% vote one way, 40% another, the last 10% can be easily excluded in an FFP system.

ps. except when we consider today's polarized politics. When times are more moderate, it's much more evident.

This is just you saying that you're wrong.

[Reaganista]

Er, Bush never won a convincing majority
yeah he did
both bushes did

[gregulus]

If you look back throughout all of the wars we have been in, those captured in said wars have never been able to use the nation's court system or the writ of Habeas Corpus to challenge their imprisonment.

I do believe, however, that all of the necessary precautions should be taken to make sure we are going after the right guys.

[neal_672]

Wow, i'm stunned the American people/congress would ever even consider this.

What scary times we live in.