anyone box?

[A Spoonful Supreme]

anyone box here? ive only gotten in a few street fights but it was like the greatest thing ever. the other day i glove boxed my 160 lb weightlifting buddy whose got 20 lbs on me, and he pretty much pwned me out of sheer mass and experience but i got some good ones in and he said I hit pretty hard, i have a pretty broad muscular back and shoulders so my punches could be pretty viscous. nevertheless is was a blast fighting and idk the first thing about boxing or how to go about doing it or what training you need. i should be about 150 lbs by next year and that would be a pretty choice weight for fighting i think. i think there is a boxing club or someting in my small town but im kind sketch on the idea of just going down there i want to hit the bags and train more not sure what i should do tho, any boxers?

[Rams]

Boxing is bad for street fighting, just fyi.

Go to a boxing gym and get a trainer. Shadow boxing is key for starting up.

[A Spoonful Supreme]

the street fights were a mix of punching and wrestling of course, whats shadow boxing, just imagining another fighter? does it cost money to get a trainer

[loathed]

the street fights were a mix of punching and wrestling of course, whats shadow boxing, just imagining another fighter? does it cost money to get a trainer

surely it does cost money to get a trainer...but try taking up a martial art if youre interested in say MMA. and if you really have a good hard punch/heavy hand on you. you might want to take up some grappling and ground tactics in case the fight goes to the ground. but you should make use of your strikes standing up. so i say learn the sprawl fast, and the brawl standing up. sprawl and brawl...

[:amaze:]

i spar with my buddies occasionally. pretty much just boxing with no gloves (no face hits, though) ... gets pretty intense sometimes. always better when not sober.




:amaze:

[KKKKKocaine]

Boxing is bad for street fighting, just fyi.

Go to a boxing gym and get a trainer. Shadow boxing is key for starting up.

Not quite true.
Closed hand strikes aren't great in street fights (because the lack of glove means you're more likely you injure your knuckles and hand on face strikes) but boxing is very effective in a street fight.
The fact is though, there's practicly no martial art that teaches open hand strikes that bothers to focus on 'real' conditioning.
A boxer who's been training adequately for a year will be in great physical shape and will possess plenty of power, speed and endurance which all carry greatly in street fights* Also arts like boxing and Muay Thai place great emphasis on frequent sparring and body conditioning (Which is things like taking strikes to the ribs, solar plexus and other body areas from an opponent wearing pads on their arms).
This means a boxer is much better psychologically prepared for a fight. The more punches you've seen flying at your face, the better you can handle them. Everyone who has ever sparred will remember the first few times where they inevitably turned their back or ducked down under blows to the face eventually though they get to a point where they become used to it and they can stand up and trade blows without giving into their fear as much as normal people.


*This where family friendly martial arts like Wing Chun, Karate, Tae Kwon Do etc. tend to fall down, the techniques are good in theory, but a lack of sparring, body conditioning, intense cardio and lots of training on heavy bags means they often don't have the power or experience against a fully resisting hostile opponent to apply them correctly in a street fight.

In short I'm basicly saying 'Yeah, if you box on the streets, you're probably going to break something in your hand. But the fitness, power, speed and experience will give you a massive advantage in most street fights and that blow that does break one of your bones, is going to hurt whoever it connects with as well'

I'd try and get a bit of training in a ground based art as well. But please don't let anyone fill your head with dangerous nonsense like 'Oh streetfights go to the ground 90% of the time'. It's probably quite true, but they forget to explain that most of those street fights involve someones friends stamping the **** out of the guy on the ground. I wouldn't concentrate your groundfighting on getting the perfect armbar, concentrate on how to escape from the ground. If you get good at escaping from a trained groundfighters guard, you can escape from a streetfighters groundfighting faster and back on your feet.
If he has two buddies there, you'll still get ****ed if you fight all 3, but it's alot easier to run away when you're not o nthe ground.

So in summary, if you want to help yourself in street fights look at the following things,

1. Take a good non-family friendly striking art such as Western Boxing, or Muay Thai.

2. Take your conditioning seriously, you can't apply the techniques effectively if you're not in good shape.

3. Compliment your striking with some groundfighting training so you can escape off the floor as quickly as possible.

4. (Probably best to do this one first) I don't know you personaly, so don't take this the wrong way, remember that in almost all cases it's alot better to just walk away from a streetfight, or run away from people than it is to stand and fight, even if you know you could kick the guys ***. For starters you can get in legal trouble, secondly if you beat up someone, there's a chance he'll hold a grudge and jump you with his buddies, the situation could get worse and it could end up with you in hospital, or the morgue.

whats shadow boxing, just imagining another fighter?

Yep. You basicly get into your guard and throw combos and blocks against an imaginary opponent. It's good for warming up whilst practicing your techniques. It also takes alot more stamina than you'd think!

And yes it'll cost money to get a trainer, the boxing gyms I've been to however, you didn't need to have your own trainer. You could just pay and go along to 'classes' you'd get training in a group and you'd eventually develop more freedom as your skills increased, so you could start training individually. If you get a trainer now, you might be throwing money at something you might not want to do, if you work hard and show you're determined the guys running the club will take interest in you and might not even charge you to do training with you. But first you have to prove you're worth their time.

Sorry it's such a long post, but I didn't just want to give you a few lines of a response and leave you hanging.
Just for the record, I've done American Kickboxing, Western Boxing and I'm currently training in Muay Thai. So you're more than welcome to shoot any more questions you have about the following to me. I'm not an expert so I can't answer everything, but I can answer most of the 'beginner' questions.

Hope that helped though :)

[nitzguy]

Not quite true.
Closed hand strikes aren't great in street fights (because the lack of glove means you're more likely you injure your knuckles and hand on face strikes) but boxing is very effective in a street fight.
The fact is though, there's practicly no martial art that teaches open hand strikes that bothers to focus on 'real' conditioning.
A boxer who's been training adequately for a year will be in great physical shape and will possess plenty of power, speed and endurance which all carry greatly in street fights* Also arts like boxing and Muay Thai place great emphasis on frequent sparring and body conditioning (Which is things like taking strikes to the ribs, solar plexus and other body areas from an opponent wearing pads on their arms).
This means a boxer is much better psychologically prepared for a fight. The more punches you've seen flying at your face, the better you can handle them. Everyone who has ever sparred will remember the first few times where they inevitably turned their back or ducked down under blows to the face eventually though they get to a point where they become used to it and they can stand up and trade blows without giving into their fear as much as normal people.


*This where family friendly martial arts like Wing Chun, Karate, Tae Kwon Do etc. tend to fall down, the techniques are good in theory, but a lack of sparring, body conditioning, intense cardio and lots of training on heavy bags means they often don't have the power or experience against a fully resisting hostile opponent to apply them correctly in a street fight.

In short I'm basicly saying 'Yeah, if you box on the streets, you're probably going to break something in your hand. But the fitness, power, speed and experience will give you a massive advantage in most street fights and that blow that does break one of your bones, is going to hurt whoever it connects with as well'

I'd try and get a bit of training in a ground based art as well. But please don't let anyone fill your head with dangerous nonsense like 'Oh streetfights go to the ground 90% of the time'. It's probably quite true, but they forget to explain that most of those street fights involve someones friends stamping the **** out of the guy on the ground. I wouldn't concentrate your groundfighting on getting the perfect armbar, concentrate on how to escape from the ground. If you get good at escaping from a trained groundfighters guard, you can escape from a streetfighters groundfighting faster and back on your feet.
If he has two buddies there, you'll still get ****ed if you fight all 3, but it's alot easier to run away when you're not o nthe ground.

So in summary, if you want to help yourself in street fights look at the following things,

1. Take a good non-family friendly striking art such as Western Boxing, or Muay Thai.

2. Take your conditioning seriously, you can't apply the techniques effectively if you're not in good shape.

3. Compliment your striking with some groundfighting training so you can escape off the floor as quickly as possible.

4. (Probably best to do this one first) I don't know you personaly, so don't take this the wrong way, remember that in almost all cases it's alot better to just walk away from a streetfight, or run away from people than it is to stand and fight, even if you know you could kick the guys ***. For starters you can get in legal trouble, secondly if you beat up someone, there's a chance he'll hold a grudge and jump you with his buddies, the situation could get worse and it could end up with you in hospital, or the morgue.



Yep. You basicly get into your guard and throw combos and blocks against an imaginary opponent. It's good for warming up whilst practicing your techniques. It also takes alot more stamina than you'd think!

And yes it'll cost money to get a trainer, the boxing gyms I've been to however, you didn't need to have your own trainer. You could just pay and go along to 'classes' you'd get training in a group and you'd eventually develop more freedom as your skills increased, so you could start training individually. If you get a trainer now, you might be throwing money at something you might not want to do, if you work hard and show you're determined the guys running the club will take interest in you and might not even charge you to do training with you. But first you have to prove you're worth their time.

Sorry it's such a long post, but I didn't just want to give you a few lines of a response and leave you hanging.
Just for the record, I've done American Kickboxing, Western Boxing and I'm currently training in Muay Thai. So you're more than welcome to shoot any more questions you have about the following to me. I'm not an expert so I can't answer everything, but I can answer most of the 'beginner' questions.

Hope that helped though :)

GREAT POST! if i could Rep you i would.

[KurtCobain2902]

Not quite true.
Closed hand strikes aren't great in street fights (because the lack of glove means you're more likely you injure your knuckles and hand on face strikes) but boxing is very effective in a street fight.
The fact is though, there's practicly no martial art that teaches open hand strikes that bothers to focus on 'real' conditioning.
A boxer who's been training adequately for a year will be in great physical shape and will possess plenty of power, speed and endurance which all carry greatly in street fights* Also arts like boxing and Muay Thai place great emphasis on frequent sparring and body conditioning (Which is things like taking strikes to the ribs, solar plexus and other body areas from an opponent wearing pads on their arms).
This means a boxer is much better psychologically prepared for a fight. The more punches you've seen flying at your face, the better you can handle them. Everyone who has ever sparred will remember the first few times where they inevitably turned their back or ducked down under blows to the face eventually though they get to a point where they become used to it and they can stand up and trade blows without giving into their fear as much as normal people.


*This where family friendly martial arts like Wing Chun, Karate, Tae Kwon Do etc. tend to fall down, the techniques are good in theory, but a lack of sparring, body conditioning, intense cardio and lots of training on heavy bags means they often don't have the power or experience against a fully resisting hostile opponent to apply them correctly in a street fight.

In short I'm basicly saying 'Yeah, if you box on the streets, you're probably going to break something in your hand. But the fitness, power, speed and experience will give you a massive advantage in most street fights and that blow that does break one of your bones, is going to hurt whoever it connects with as well'

I'd try and get a bit of training in a ground based art as well. But please don't let anyone fill your head with dangerous nonsense like 'Oh streetfights go to the ground 90% of the time'. It's probably quite true, but they forget to explain that most of those street fights involve someones friends stamping the **** out of the guy on the ground. I wouldn't concentrate your groundfighting on getting the perfect armbar, concentrate on how to escape from the ground. If you get good at escaping from a trained groundfighters guard, you can escape from a streetfighters groundfighting faster and back on your feet.
If he has two buddies there, you'll still get ****ed if you fight all 3, but it's alot easier to run away when you're not o nthe ground.

So in summary, if you want to help yourself in street fights look at the following things,

1. Take a good non-family friendly striking art such as Western Boxing, or Muay Thai.

2. Take your conditioning seriously, you can't apply the techniques effectively if you're not in good shape.

3. Compliment your striking with some groundfighting training so you can escape off the floor as quickly as possible.

4. (Probably best to do this one first) I don't know you personaly, so don't take this the wrong way, remember that in almost all cases it's alot better to just walk away from a streetfight, or run away from people than it is to stand and fight, even if you know you could kick the guys ***. For starters you can get in legal trouble, secondly if you beat up someone, there's a chance he'll hold a grudge and jump you with his buddies, the situation could get worse and it could end up with you in hospital, or the morgue.



Yep. You basicly get into your guard and throw combos and blocks against an imaginary opponent. It's good for warming up whilst practicing your techniques. It also takes alot more stamina than you'd think!

And yes it'll cost money to get a trainer, the boxing gyms I've been to however, you didn't need to have your own trainer. You could just pay and go along to 'classes' you'd get training in a group and you'd eventually develop more freedom as your skills increased, so you could start training individually. If you get a trainer now, you might be throwing money at something you might not want to do, if you work hard and show you're determined the guys running the club will take interest in you and might not even charge you to do training with you. But first you have to prove you're worth their time.

Sorry it's such a long post, but I didn't just want to give you a few lines of a response and leave you hanging.
Just for the record, I've done American Kickboxing, Western Boxing and I'm currently training in Muay Thai. So you're more than welcome to shoot any more questions you have about the following to me. I'm not an expert so I can't answer everything, but I can answer most of the 'beginner' questions.

Hope that helped though :)

Yes, but what's a boxer going to do when a wrestler drops down(since if he's been in wrestling as long as the boxer's been in boxing, he's in just as good of physical shape, has learned to read eyes and body movements, and is just as strong) and picks his ankle or picks him up by his legs/hamstrings or does any number of takedowns/locks that are taught? Not only will the actual process of doing the move throw the boxer WAY off(because the boxer's only mentally prepared for blocking punches and only punches, unless trained in another art) he will also have no defense while he's on the ground, unless, once again, he's trained in wrestling or grappling of some sort. I'm not saying boxer's can't fight, I just believe that wrestling is pretty dominant do to the fact that they are just as well trained, fast and powerful, so if they wanted, they could use their ability to read eyes and body movements to throw punches instead of wrestling. Not to mention most fights end up on the ground any way. They are versatile. But of course that doesnt mean boxers arent

[KKKKKocaine]

Yes, but what's a boxer going to do when a wrestler drops down(since if he's been in wrestling as long as the boxer's been in boxing, he's in just as good of physical shape, has learned to read eyes and body movements, and is just as strong) and picks his ankle or picks him up by his legs/hamstrings or does any number of takedowns/locks that are taught? Not only will the actual process of doing the move throw the boxer WAY off(because the boxer's only mentally prepared for blocking punches and only punches, unless trained in another art) he will also have no defense while he's on the ground, unless, once again, he's trained in wrestling or grappling of some sort. I'm not saying boxer's can't fight, I just believe that wrestling is pretty dominant do to the fact that they are just as well trained, fast and powerful, so if they wanted, they could use their ability to read eyes and body movements to throw punches instead of wrestling. Not to mention most fights end up on the ground any way. They are versatile. But of course that doesnt mean boxers arent


Well if the wrestler gets the shoot in, then it is pretty much over.
I don't know if you've read my entire post though, whilst most fights go to the ground, most fights also end up with someones friends stamping the **** out of someone who's trying to wrestle on the ground. This is why I reccomended training in groundfighting so you can escape your opponents guard and get off the ground.
I've not trained in wrestling (As much as I'd like to, it's not a very active sport in the UK) so this is just conjecture, but I really doubt a wrestler can read punches anywhere near the level you seem to think. Most boxers are capable of demolishing most other striking arts, when you only work with a few techniques you get very good at not telegraphing them, not to mention the incredible striking power developed by boxers. A wrestler won't have the experience in being hit in the face that a boxer does, even if they had equal striking power and technique, the boxer can take more punishment from strikes and chances are the wrestler can take more pain on the ground. Someone just trained in wrestling won't be able to stand up and strike against a boxer, just like a boxer won't be able to grapple with a wrestler.

Now if you're reccomending wrestling over boxing for streetfights, this is where I'm going to have to heavily disagree with you. I'll definately admit that most people will have next to no idea how to fight on the ground, BJJ and wrestling can quickly dominate untrained opponents. However, that's provided it's one on one. If you have no choice other than fighting two guys and you go to the ground, it's over, you've lost and you're chances of escape are fairly slim unless you can pick yourself off the ground.
If you're standing up and trading blows, you'll still probably won't beat the two guys, but you have a better chance and being hit whilst standing is alot less dangerous than being hit with your body pressed against the ground.


Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying wrestling can't work in a streetfight, but groundfighting is generally a very bad idea against multiple opponents.
Also your argument relies on a boxer getting into a streetfight with a trained and physically equal wrestler, not everyone you fight is going to be a proficient martial artist, or a martial artist at all.
I did reccomend taking groundfighting training to supplement the boxing, so the boxer might not be at the wrestlers skill level but he'll be somewhat trained against the shoot and how to escape it.

Now if the threadstarter decides to open his avenues even more and takes Muay Thai then it unbalances things even more, Muay Thai guys can still fall victim to ground fighters but Muay Thai fighters have a few advantages the boxer doesn't have.

1. If he opens with a Thai lowkick into your thigh/back of thigh/just above the knee/the side of the knee. You're going to be in alot of pain and if he's trained well and has good conditioning, there's a chance you might not be able to keep your balance and stand up.

2. If you watch the K1 highlights for Mirko Cro-Cop an MMA fighter goes for the shoot. As his arms come round the back of Mirkos legs the MMA fighters head comes close to Mirkos knees. In Muay Thai if you lower your head or duck with the same technique boxers duck with you'll catch a knee. This is what happened to the MMA fighter. I only saw the highlight so I have no idea what happened after. But I saw the guys face at the end of the round. He had a pretty big cut over his eyebrow and had bled a fair bit.

No offense intended to you, or anyone who does BJJ or a groundfighting art. But alot of ground fighters seem to be under the impression that their opponent won't make a move until they've gone for the shoot and taken them to the ground. You have to be open to the fact that whilst you could shoot a Muay Thai guy, he could equal launch into the clinch and cut your eyebrow with an elbow.
It could go either way so I could easily counter your question with 'Yeah but what's the wrester going to do whilst he's counting stars after a side elbow leaves him needing stiches?' or 'What's the wrester going to do whilst the boxer throws massive hooks into his lower ribs?' See my point? A striker can beat a wrestler and a wrestler can beat a striker. You're just assuming the wrestler will get the shoot in, likewise in my example questions above I'm assuming the Thai fighter gets close enough to elbow and the boxer gets opens up your guard.
:)

[KurtCobain2902]

Well if the wrestler gets the shoot in, then it is pretty much over.
I don't know if you've read my entire post though, whilst most fights go to the ground, most fights also end up with someones friends stamping the **** out of someone who's trying to wrestle on the ground. This is why I reccomended training in groundfighting so you can escape your opponents guard and get off the ground.
I've not trained in wrestling (As much as I'd like to, it's not a very active sport in the UK) so this is just conjecture, but I really doubt a wrestler can read punches anywhere near the level you seem to think. Most boxers are capable of demolishing most other striking arts, when you only work with a few techniques you get very good at not telegraphing them, not to mention the incredible striking power developed by boxers. A wrestler won't have the experience in being hit in the face that a boxer does, even if they had equal striking power and technique, the boxer can take more punishment from strikes and chances are the wrestler can take more pain on the ground. Someone just trained in wrestling won't be able to stand up and strike against a boxer, just like a boxer won't be able to grapple with a wrestler.

Now if you're reccomending wrestling over boxing for streetfights, this is where I'm going to have to heavily disagree with you. I'll definately admit that most people will have next to no idea how to fight on the ground, BJJ and wrestling can quickly dominate untrained opponents. However, that's provided it's one on one. If you have no choice other than fighting two guys and you go to the ground, it's over, you've lost and you're chances of escape are fairly slim unless you can pick yourself off the ground.
If you're standing up and trading blows, you'll still probably won't beat the two guys, but you have a better chance and being hit whilst standing is alot less dangerous than being hit with your body pressed against the ground.


Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying wrestling can't work in a streetfight, but groundfighting is generally a very bad idea against multiple opponents.
Also your argument relies on a boxer getting into a streetfight with a trained and physically equal wrestler, not everyone you fight is going to be a proficient martial artist, or a martial artist at all.
I did reccomend taking groundfighting training to supplement the boxing, so the boxer might not be at the wrestlers skill level but he'll be somewhat trained against the shoot and how to escape it.

Now if the threadstarter decides to open his avenues even more and takes Muay Thai then it unbalances things even more, Muay Thai guys can still fall victim to ground fighters but Muay Thai fighters have a few advantages the boxer doesn't have.

1. If he opens with a Thai lowkick into your thigh/back of thigh/just above the knee/the side of the knee. You're going to be in alot of pain and if he's trained well and has good conditioning, there's a chance you might not be able to keep your balance and stand up.

2. If you watch the K1 highlights for Mirko Cro-Cop an MMA fighter goes for the shoot. As his arms come round the back of Mirkos legs the MMA fighters head comes close to Mirkos knees. In Muay Thai if you lower your head or duck with the same technique boxers duck with you'll catch a knee. This is what happened to the MMA fighter. I only saw the highlight so I have no idea what happened after. But I saw the guys face at the end of the round. He had a pretty big cut over his eyebrow and had bled a fair bit.

No offense intended to you, or anyone who does BJJ or a groundfighting art. But alot of ground fighters seem to be under the impression that their opponent won't make a move until they've gone for the shoot and taken them to the ground. You have to be open to the fact that whilst you could shoot a Muay Thai guy, he could equal launch into the clinch and cut your eyebrow with an elbow.
It could go either way so I could easily counter your question with 'Yeah but what's the wrester going to do whilst he's counting stars after a side elbow leaves him needing stiches?' or 'What's the wrester going to do whilst the boxer throws massive hooks into his lower ribs?' See my point? A striker can beat a wrestler and a wrestler can beat a striker. You're just assuming the wrestler will get the shoot in, likewise in my example questions above I'm assuming the Thai fighter gets close enough to elbow and the boxer gets opens up your guard.
:)

I didnt mean it like that, though. I didnt mean to say a wrestler ALWAYS has the advantage. I was speaking if physical abilities are even, and the time in
each style is the same. And even then, there's to many factors.

[Rams]

Not quite true.
Closed hand strikes aren't great in street fights (because the lack of glove means you're more likely you injure your knuckles and hand on face strikes) but boxing is very effective in a street fight.
The fact is though, there's practicly no martial art that teaches open hand strikes that bothers to focus on 'real' conditioning.
A boxer who's been training adequately for a year will be in great physical shape and will possess plenty of power, speed and endurance which all carry greatly in street fights* Also arts like boxing and Muay Thai place great emphasis on frequent sparring and body conditioning (Which is things like taking strikes to the ribs, solar plexus and other body areas from an opponent wearing pads on their arms).
This means a boxer is much better psychologically prepared for a fight. The more punches you've seen flying at your face, the better you can handle them. Everyone who has ever sparred will remember the first few times where they inevitably turned their back or ducked down under blows to the face eventually though they get to a point where they become used to it and they can stand up and trade blows without giving into their fear as much as normal people.

I said nothing of Muy Thai or even Kick Boxing. Muy Thai I have the upmost respect for. But boxing in general is just not very good for street fighting. I train in BJJ first and foremost, but I also help a friend train in Krav Maga. I've sparred with Krav Maga, Muy Thai, Tae Kwon Do, Judo, Japanese Jiu-Jitsu, and some Shodokon Karate students as well as boxers. I've picked up a fair amount, most importantly is defensive techniques which you simply don't learn from boxing. Boxing can teach you some really bad defensive moves if you don't have gloves on, namely covering your face with your hands to "block" some punches. It aint pretty to watch in person. Boxing also doesn't deal with kicks. Or elbows. Or headbutts. Or any of the other nasty stuff that people may actually do. Do boxers learn how to fall? (I honestly don't know, never seen a boxer fall correctly). You make yourself a lot less dangerous when all you have at your desposal is punches. It's not just the open hands aspect that makes it less than ideal for street fighting.

If you watch the K1 highlights for Mirko Cro-Cop an MMA fighter goes for the shoot. As his arms come round the back of Mirkos legs the MMA fighters head comes close to Mirkos knees. In Muay Thai if you lower your head or duck with the same technique boxers duck with you'll catch a knee. This is what happened to the MMA fighter. I only saw the highlight so I have no idea what happened after. But I saw the guys face at the end of the round. He had a pretty big cut over his eyebrow and had bled a fair bit.

Cro-Cop is also an experience MMA fighter and has seen (and adapted) from lots of styles. You learn, that whenever someone shoots in that you either sprawl or knee him in the face.

[Lufnoops]

Good stuff going on here thanks guys.

[Reaganista]

Not quite true.
Closed hand strikes aren't great in street fights (because the lack of glove means you're more likely you injure your knuckles and hand on face strikes) but boxing is very effective in a street fight.

depends on the rules
MT fighters, sure
but western boxers don't hit from the clinch

Yes, but what's a boxer going to do when a wrestler drops down(since if he's been in wrestling as long as the boxer's been in boxing, he's in just as good of physical shape, has learned to read eyes and body movements, and is just as strong) and picks his ankle or picks him up by his legs/hamstrings or does any number of takedowns/locks that are taught?
watch Royce Gracie and Dan Severn's early fights in the UFC to see what happens when a pure-stand up fighter fights a ground specialist
but really there's no reason not to cross train
except time and expense

[KKKKKocaine]

I said nothing of Muy Thai or even Kick Boxing. Muy Thai I have the upmost respect for. But boxing in general is just not very good for street fighting. I train in BJJ first and foremost, but I also help a friend train in Krav Maga. I've sparred with Krav Maga, Muy Thai, Tae Kwon Do, Judo, Japanese Jiu-Jitsu, and some Shodokon Karate students as well as boxers. I've picked up a fair amount, most importantly is defensive techniques which you simply don't learn from boxing. Boxing can teach you some really bad defensive moves if you don't have gloves on, namely covering your face with your hands to "block" some punches. It aint pretty to watch in person. Boxing also doesn't deal with kicks. Or elbows. Or headbutts. Or any of the other nasty stuff that people may actually do. Do boxers learn how to fall? (I honestly don't know, never seen a boxer fall correctly). You make yourself a lot less dangerous when all you have at your desposal is punches. It's not just the open hands aspect that makes it less than ideal for street fighting.


What defensive moves are you talking about? If you're talking about moves like deflecting blows by pushing the arm in another direction then those still aren't ideal either, I'll admit that without gloves on a boxer, kickboxer and Muay Thai. The only real deflection techniques I've managed to use is knocking someones jab out the way with my rear hand. Boxers will have very good footwork however so they don't have to stand toe to toe and take everything , especially if you consider that in a street fight the untrained guy is going to have an even tougher time blocking the boxers faster hits.

Boxers don't learn how to take kicks, or elbows or headbutts. But as far as I know, TaekwonDo and most Karate disciplines don't learn how to take elbows or headbutts either, they might do some self defense combos but usually these aren't trained very effectively and fall into the catogory of presumptios (i.e. if I kick here, the attacker will let you of my shirt allowing my do strike him in the neck with a ridgehand).
Your average street fighter isn't trained in kicks either so it somewhat lessens the important of needing to know how to defend against kicks.

I'll agree that it helps to know more than punches in a streetfight, but it depends what expense this incurs. A Tae Kwon Do guy might be able to punch and kick, but very few have the conditioning, power and full contact experience to pull it off.

Cro-Cop is also an experience MMA fighter and has seen (and adapted) from lots of styles. You learn, that whenever someone shoots in that you either sprawl or knee him in the face.

My point was that when someone lowers their head, Muay Thai guys usually take the oppertunity to throw knees, which is why alot of boxers have trouble fighting close with them because boxers tend to go lower for the ribs.

depends on the rules
MT fighters, sure
but western boxers don't hit from the clinch

They could do, but the main reason they don't are the rules of the match and it's not massively effective. MT guys go for the clinch and throw knees and elbows up close, boxers tend to try and open up the ribs and throw short hooks when they get in close.

watch Royce Gracie and Dan Severn's early fights in the UFC to see what happens when a pure-stand up fighter fights a ground specialist
but really there's no reason not to cross train
except time and expense

I agree, the more experience the better. But I still don't think the grounds a great place to go in streetfight unless you know it's definately one on one.

[Rams]

What defensive moves are you talking about? If you're talking about moves like deflecting blows by pushing the arm in another direction then those still aren't ideal either, I'll admit that without gloves on a boxer, kickboxer and Muay Thai. The only real deflection techniques I've managed to use is knocking someones jab out the way with my rear hand. Boxers will have very good footwork however so they don't have to stand toe to toe and take everything , especially if you consider that in a street fight the untrained guy is going to have an even tougher time blocking the boxers faster hits.

I am talking about simple stuff like guiding punches and attacking punches. Ideally you don't want to be hit, which is true in boxing, so head movement is key. Sometimes you are too late or too early though, so you need some other form of defense on top of that to make it effective. Also, learning how to fall (I'm still not sure if boxers are trained in falling or not) is quite important in a street fight.

[KurtCobain2902]

I dont see why people are saying oyu can hurt your hand punching without a glove. That has honestly never happened to me. Ive scraped some skin off, but that's nothing. If you make a tight fist, and twist your last three knuckles, there isn't any give, so you are much less likely to hurt it. That actually originated in boxing(the twisting of the fingers). I think not hurting your hand when punching comes from practice with wrist wraps and conditioning of the knuckles.

[Reaganista]

I agree, the more experience the better. But I still don't think the grounds a great place to go in streetfight unless you know it's definately one on one.
running is the best defense against multiple attackers
or a gun

[Noyana]

my friend boxes and he's pretty awful at it.

he always brags, but when you get the real details from him, he basically gets mauled by skinny puerto-rican kids all the time

[Dinosawesome]

I did a boxing circuit for junior school, which was pretty fun. I was quite good, maybe the 4th best in my year group but I didn't like constantly having a cut lip or black eye.

[Rawb]

Boxing is bad for street fighting, just fyi.

Oh no you didn't.

See for yourself.


http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4190938042466443086&hl=en


Excuse me, let me reiterate. Boxing is great for street fighting just as long as the boxer lands his punches and just as long as it doesn't go to the ground. The boxer in the vid above showed showed great accuracy and landed almost every punch he threw. He also didn't allow it to get to the ground, where he probably knew he'd get kicked in the head by the other guy.

They boxer in the vid showed a great example of how to box in a street fight. His power, his accurace, his punches were all great and worked very well in his favor.

Whatever just watch the vid!

[Liquid Force]

i have spared a few times...its a hell of a workout

[Rams]

Oh no you didn't.

See for yourself.


http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4190938042466443086&hl=en


Excuse me, let me reiterate. Boxing is great for street fighting just as long as the boxer lands his punches and just as long as it doesn't go to the ground. The boxer in the vid above showed showed great accuracy and landed almost every punch he threw. He also didn't allow it to get to the ground, where he probably knew he'd get kicked in the head by the other guy.

They boxer in the vid showed a great example of how to box in a street fight. His power, his accurace, his punches were all great and worked very well in his favor.

Whatever just watch the vid!

The other guys didn't throw a single strike, even when the boxer was leaving himself wide open while hitting the first moron. I also like how he didn't keep his hands up to protect his face, that would be a bit less effective if someone was actually fighting back. He did, for the most part, throw straight punches to the face, which is always nice to see as opposed to the wild haymakers people love to swing.

[Liquid Force]

Oh no you didn't.

See for yourself.


http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4190938042466443086&hl=en


Excuse me, let me reiterate. Boxing is great for street fighting just as long as the boxer lands his punches and just as long as it doesn't go to the ground. The boxer in the vid above showed showed great accuracy and landed almost every punch he threw. He also didn't allow it to get to the ground, where he probably knew he'd get kicked in the head by the other guy.

They boxer in the vid showed a great example of how to box in a street fight. His power, his accurace, his punches were all great and worked very well in his favor.

Whatever just watch the vid!


for some reason that fight seemed staged...like that one guy just like came outta nowhere and hit that girl...and that guy liked flipped..idk w/e those other guys just didn't know how to fight

[Rawb]

for some reason that fight seemed staged...like that one guy just like came outta nowhere and hit that girl...and that guy liked flipped..idk w/e those other guys just didn't know how to fight

Staged? I doubt it. Those two guys took way too many clean, hard shots to the face to be staged. The boxer just reacted quickly and didn't talk, he just went for it and the two guys didn't expect it. So that might have been why they didn't fight back because they were too 'wtf?'

[Liquid Force]

Staged? I doubt it. Those two guys took way too many clean, hard shots to the face to be staged. The boxer just reacted quickly and didn't talk, he just went for it and the two guys didn't expect it. So that might have been why they didn't fight back because they were too 'wtf?'

mabye but i don't see why the guy flipped on them so much when the guy accidentally bumped into his girlfriend but idk he might have done it on purpose

[KKKKKocaine]

I am talking about simple stuff like guiding punches and attacking punches. Ideally you don't want to be hit, which is true in boxing, so head movement is key. Sometimes you are too late or too early though, so you need some other form of defense on top of that to make it effective. Also, learning how to fall (I'm still not sure if boxers are trained in falling or not) is quite important in a street fight.

Ooops, sorry :/ I forgot about this thread and got a little too engrossed in my cutting phase.

Boxers definately don't get trained how to fall (at least not in a normal boxing gym) I'm a little curious about this though, what kind of situation are you thinking about? Because if someone smashes an elbow into your jaw and you see stars, I don't think falling training will help you at all, wheras being hit lightly whilst off balance will be a more practical application.

I dont see why people are saying oyu can hurt your hand punching without a glove. That has honestly never happened to me. Ive scraped some skin off, but that's nothing. If you make a tight fist, and twist your last three knuckles, there isn't any give, so you are much less likely to hurt it. That actually originated in boxing(the twisting of the fingers). I think not hurting your hand when punching comes from practice with wrist wraps and conditioning of the knuckles.

The main problem is regardless of conditioning or your pain tolerance, you can break your knuckles and damage your hand when punching people in the jaw and skull because the bone is stronger than the bones in your hands.

[Rams]

Boxers definately don't get trained how to fall (at least not in a normal boxing gym) I'm a little curious about this though, what kind of situation are you thinking about? Because if someone smashes an elbow into your jaw and you see stars, I don't think falling training will help you at all, wheras being hit lightly whilst off balance will be a more practical application.

Being thrown/dragged/pushed/tripped/etc. and planting your hand down and breaking your arm.