unassailable masterpieces that you don't like

[metalicajaymz]

Born to Run, My Aim is True, and Ready to Die come to mind.

[Tangy zizzle]

Born To Run is great, if you're a Boss fan.

[metalicajaymz]

I don't apply.

[stevensonmat2]

Born to run just doesnt have a distinct enough sound for me. =\ Ill still rock out to it though.

[Tangy zizzle]

I don't apply.

Leave it alone then.

[BillCosby]

Illmatic just doesn't do it for me.

[metalicajaymz]

BillCosby wtf

[pixiesfanyo]

more like Niggacosby.

[Kayetan]

Spiderland
Anything by the Beatles

[Happymeal]

VU + Nico

[Tangy zizzle]

Yeah I'm the same with Spiderland. Sure it's a good listen, but why do people see it as such a groundbreaking and classic record? It's so slow and (not in a good way) disjointed.

[Robert Crumb]

Pearl
Straight Outta Compton
Blue
We're Only In It for the Money
Every Sonic Youth album I've heard outside of Daydream Nation and scattered songs
Every Simon and Garfunkel album I've heard outside of Bridge Over Troubled Water and scattered songs

Probably others. I don't hate these albums, just kinda apathetic to them. Some have really great songs that I love, and so I'm glad I've checked them out in spite of the fact I don't care much for 'em.

[Zebra]

In the Aeroplane Over the Sea
In the Court of the Crimson King
Pink Flag

I don't detest these albums, I just don't find them that great.

[Schyma]

This is certainly a more polite way to say something is overrated. :)

Remain in Light ~ Talking Heads
Disraeli Gears ~ Cream
Mingus Ah Um ~ Charles Mingus
A Takes a Nation of Millions ~ Public Enemy
Animals ~ Pink Floyd
Velvet Underground and Nico

[Otherside]

I know it's not alt/indie but all of metallica's albums

[BillCosby]

Straight Outta Compton

That too.

[Little Man being Erased]

Public Enemy - It Takes A Nation of Millions to Hold Us Back
Joy Division - Closer

That's about all that come to mind at the moment. And I don't hate those albums, I just don't think they're all that good.

[metalicajaymz]

yeah I agree with both of LMBE's.

[Sam]

Disraeli Gears ~ Cream
Velvet Underground and Nico

I concur to the max.

[Dave de Sylvia]

Straight Outta Compton, All Eyes On Me, The Low End Theory, Illinois, In An Aeroplane Over The Sea, Never Mind The Bollocks

[pulseczar]

Born To Run, The Joshua Tree, Nevermind the Bollocks, Closer

[metalicajaymz]

Bollocks isn't really considered an unassailable masterpiece.

[Dave de Sylvia]

It is by idiots.

[rocknrollstar5]

I hate Ok Computer

[Otherside]

Bollocks isn't really considered an unassailable masterpiece.

Well neither is Illinoise...

[ATM]

How come?

edit: to rocknrollstar

[metalicajaymz]

I hate Ok Computer

don't tell England, it might break up with you

[ATM]

lololol owned

[Zappa]

Most of the ones in this thread plus more. Tago Mago is one I didn't see mentioned.

[ATM]

I'm yet to hear Tago Mago.

[Little Man being Erased]

^ Me too. 'Cause I heard one song from it and pretty much thought it sucked.

[I'm The Face]

Most of these records aren't ****e, and if you dig 'em, that's great. I just cannot get into them...

The Beatles' entire catalogue
MBV's Loveless
The Wall by Pink Floyd
DSOTM "
Wilco's YHF
Radiohead OK Computer, and everything after that. Heck, lets just make it everything by Radiohead.
The Kinks' Lola vs. The Powerman...
Everything the Stones have done except for Beggar's ---> Sticky Fingers
Everything by U2
and so on....

[mr_jackalope]

Virtually everything by the Doors, Pink Floyd, or Frank Zappa (sorry Alex). Three "classics" I could never find any interest in.

The Bends, which I don't rate much higher than Pablo Honey. It picks up after that, though.

[Scuba_Steve]

most if not all radiohead.

its okay, not something I'd choose to listen to though.

[pixiesfanyo]

Yeah.

The Bends is just trite shitty brit rock.

[mr_jackalope]

I wouldn't go *quite* so far as that, but it's definitely not worthy of the attention it gets. Take away My Iron Lung, Just, and Street Spirit, and it's flimsy as hell.

[bleep_bloop]

DSOTM "

I have no idea what this stands for.

Pink Floyd - The Wall: I just cant get into it. It sounds like **** to me.

[I'm The Face]

I have no idea what this stands for.

Pink Floyd - The Wall: I just cant get into it. It sounds like **** to me.

Dark Side Of The Moon, ditto marks ;)

[Zappa]

I'm amazed Bitches Brew hasn't come up. I always feel like, despite all its critical praise, I'm the only one that actually loves that album.

[Daniel!]

The only one that comes to mind is Talking Heads - Remain In Light. That is some uninteresting music. I love 77, though.

[asymm]

Wire - Pink Flag

I still enjoy it, but I greatly prefer Chairs Missing and 154 over the debut.

[sgrevs]

I've never been impressed by anything Sonic Youth

or the Pixies. And I actually don't like them.

[br3ad_man]

In The Airplane Over The Sea, Closer, Entertainment!, Q: Are We Not Men? A: We Are Devo!

I like all of those but don't see the big deal. Except NMH, I find that album acceptable at best.

I'm amazed Bitches Brew hasn't come up. I always feel like, despite all its critical praise, I'm the only one that actually loves that album.

I love it too. But I don't really count.

[mr_jackalope]

I'm amazed Bitches Brew hasn't come up. I always feel like, despite all its critical praise, I'm the only one that actually loves that album.

Well I'm a huge fan, if that means anything.

Wire - Pink Flag

I still enjoy it, but I greatly prefer Chairs Missing and 154 over the debut.

I can get with you there. 154 is definitely my favorite Wire album.

[Crazy and Stupid]

I don't like Daydream Nation very much at all (or anything by Sonic Youth, for that matter). Loveless by My Bloody Valentine is alright, but no more than a mediocre album (as is Psychocandy for me these days). I generally like most alt/indie "masterpieces" though. Except full albums by The Cure. I still haven't been able to find a full studio album by them that I ever really want to listen to. :-/
I would have to agree with you on those ones.

[br3ad_man]

I find Disintegration, Boys Don't Cry and Pronography to be albums I listen to often.

[JonM]

I hate Tupac.

[Bukowski]

I feel like I should like Devo given my tastes, but they just annoy me. So anything by them.

XO and Either/Or by Elliott Smith are another two. I don't dislike them, but they get boring SO quickly for me.

[sketchyjoe]

most if not all radiohead.

its okay, not something I'd choose to listen to though.
Word.

The Sex Pistols - Nevermind the Bollocks
Joy Division
Most of The Smiths

[team_racket]

as mentioned, Loveless by My Bloody Valentine (yawn) and also ok computer.

[I'm The Face]

Matthew Sweet's Girlfriend. An OK album, but honestly I prefer his post-girlfriend
albums. Not quite sure why this one still gets so much praise.

I've listened to Dylan's Blood on the Tracks maybe 5 times in total, but Blonde on Blonde and Highway 61 Rev. at least 50. It's good, but it doesn't wow me as much as I think it should.

[Zebra]

My Bloody Valentine - Loveless

This is one of the worst albums that I have ever heard and I am a casual fan of shoegaze music.

[BringHomeTheBacon]

Manic Street Preachers- The Holy Bible
It's good but not near a classic for me.

[Sepstrup]

Daydream Nation. First two tracks aside, it's average or worse all the way through.

[AlienEater]

Yeah, Daydream Nation is way overrated.

Anything by Talking Heads as well.

[mr_jackalope]

My Bloody Valentine - Loveless

This is one of the worst albums that I have ever heard and I am a casual fan of shoegaze music.

Are you sure you know what shoegaze is?

[The_Passenger]

The praise that In an Aeroplane Over the Sea gets is beyond me. Loveless is another album I've never really liked, but everyoen else seems to love. And although I like It Takes a Nation of Millions to Hold us back, I've always felt that Fear of a Black Planet was superior, which doesn't seem to be the general opinion.

[Sepstrup]

Of all the albums I really really love, In the Aeroplane over the Sea is the album I can understand that a lot of people don't like. In fact, I don't know why I like it.

[AlienEater]

Anything by Talking Heads? I always thought of them as one of those bands that would have something that virtually everyone would like. But then again I'm a huge Talking Heads fanboy, so my opinion is massively biased.

The only thing I like related to them is Brian Eno and David Byrne - My Life in the Bush of Ghosts. I don't like any TH album I've heard, at all.

[The Great Decay]

I haven't been able to get into Tom Waits.

[pulseczar]

Are you sure you know what shoegaze is?
Ride's Nowhere has actually been getting more praise on Sputnik lately.

[team_racket]

I haven't been able to get into Tom Waits.


did you listen to all of it? theres a large contrast of styles in his stuff.

[metalicajaymz]

Blood on the Tracks has one good song so I guess that applies.

[rocknrollstar5]

How come?

edit: to rocknrollstar

it just does nothing for me, i never have liked radiohead

[ATM]

I can't get into Brian Eno.

[Little Man being Erased]

In The Airplane Over The Sea, Closer, Entertainment!, Q: Are We Not Men? A: We Are Devo!

I like all of those but don't see the big deal. Except NMH, I find that album acceptable at best.
It took me quite a while to get into Entertainment!, but I ****ing love it now. In one listen it went from "eh, it's okay" to "holy ****, this is fantastic!"

[sketchyjoe]

Blood on the Tracks has one good song so I guess that applies.Which one are you talking about?

[Kaden]

I agree with Blood on the Tracks, I'm a huge Dylan fan and I haven't been able to get into that album. Plus, I've never been into Public Enemy.

Btw, I love Bitches Brew.

[br3ad_man]

It took me quite a while to get into Entertainment!, but I ****ing love it now. In one listen it went from "eh, it's okay" to "holy ****, this is fantastic!"

I seem to like it more and more with each listen, but it's really tiring to listen to. It has a lot of songs.

[sketchyjoe]

The Stone Roses

[mr_jackalope]

Ride's Nowhere has actually been getting more praise on Sputnik lately.

Weird, to me it's quite obviously the weaker album, though one of the best of the (sub-)genre. It's like they're just inches away from getting it, but they never quite get over that edge.

[br3ad_man]

The Stone Roses

Agreed, I hate that album.

[sketchyjoe]

Oasis

[Little Man being Erased]

I seem to like it more and more with each listen, but it's really tiring to listen to. It has a lot of songs.
Have you got the version with the bonus tracks? Because the original is only 12 tracks and 40 minutes. So just stop it after track 12. :)

[Dog]

I feel like I should like Devo given my tastes, but they just annoy me. So anything by them.

XO and Either/Or by Elliott Smith are another two. I don't dislike them, but they get boring SO quickly for me.
Either/Or is the only Elliott Smith album i can listen to without getting bored. i can listen to it for days at a time before getting tired of it.

[YDload]

Nacho, are you tryin to steal the attention from my discussion on the Overrated book :mad:

but that's okay because the book has mentioned almost every band here (except the Pixies because they ARE unassailable :angry: )

[Zappa]

A Love Supreme is mostly unlistenable.

[pixiesfanyo]

Pixies are probably the new Beatles.

[stevensonmat2]

Id like it if it were true.

[br3ad_man]

Have you got the version with the bonus tracks? Because the original is only 12 tracks and 40 minutes. So just stop it after track 12. :)

heh. I always assumed it was 16 tracks. Cheers.

[metalicajaymz]

A Love Supreme is mostly unlistenable.

The only jazz album I like is the only jazz album you dislike.

[Matt?]

mona lisa

[cbmartinez]

Diary by Sunny Day Real Estate.

I never got that album.

[Sepstrup]

Blood on the Tracks has one good song so I guess that applies.

Uhh... Which one is that?

[metalicajaymz]

"Tangled Up in Blue" obviously.

[sketchyjoe]

That is the best song on the album but I love the rest of it too (except perhaps Meet Me in the Morning). I think it's Dylan's most cohesive album.

[Sepstrup]

"Tangled Up in Blue" obviously.

"Obviously" doesn't exist when someone doesn't like Blood on the Tracks. Good choice though, it's easily the best song.

[Dave de Sylvia]

Good choice though, it's easily the best song ever.
Indeed.

So how come Dylan's last two albums are my favourites by him, yet I still refuse to believe the hype about this one?

Put down Dylan - Modern Times for me. I haven't heard it, but you know.

[rocknrollstar5]

Anything by Coldplay, if anyone is stupid enough to cal anything they have done a masterpiece

[Dave de Sylvia]

Says Noel Gallagher.

I just downloaded a cover of Born to Run by Frankie Goes to Hollywood and it confirmed my suspicion that Springsteen sucks even if he did write an awesome song.

[mr_jackalope]

Diary by Sunny Day Real Estate.

I never got that album.

Right there with ya. It's definitely not my thing.

I heard someone call If You're Feeling Sinister a masterpiece the other day, so I'm throwing that in here.

Have you guys bothered to listen to Springsteen's two albums before Born to Run? They destroy it so bad.

[asdf]

Diary by Sunny Day Real Estate.

I never got that album.
I'm going to agree with you on that one. My friend bought this and we listened to it, and I really, really did not like it.

[Interstate]

Daydream Nation, The Doors, The Joshua Tree are the only ones that come to mind atm.

[metalicajaymz]

I forgot Odelay.

[Interstate]

I forgot Odelay.

Ah, it's not that bad.

[metalicajaymz]

neither are the ones you posted.

[EightMilesHigh]

I forgot Odelay.

I love Odelay :cool: but I can see why people wouldnt like it

I choose Daydream Nation because I never really got into Sonic Youth. Also, Is This It because I never got into The Strokes, though I openly admit I like Last Nite.

[The Great Decay]

did you listen to all of it? theres a large contrast of styles in his stuff.

I've sampled Rain Dogs and Swordfishtrombones.

[metalicajaymz]

Is This It has terrible production; it's dull, lifeless, and kills the songs. Room on Fire is five times better.

[Little Man being Erased]

I think Is This It is great. Better than Room on Fire.

[Matt?]

aeroplane over the sea is my main one

[The Great Decay]

I like that album, a lot.

[Kayetan]

I guess I just don't get Pink Moon. It's a pretty good album and I enjoy listening to it, but it seems like some people make it out to be the greatest thing in the world, which i disagree with.

[br3ad_man]

How could I have forgotten Emergency & I?

[metalicajaymz]

dude 123 so hard

I raped that album on Sputnik to the nth degree

[br3ad_man]

I remember that, I thought "oh good i'm not the only one".

[ATM]

Is that by the Dismemberment Plan?

[metalicajaymz]

yes

[ATM]

:eek:

From what I have heard of that album was awesome. And they are a local band.

[mr_jackalope]

Haha, oh man, that review. I'm pretty sure I went all wild in the comments section.

I forgot Odelay.

And I somehow agree with you.

[Sam]

Is This It has terrible production; it's dull, lifeless, and kills the songs. Room on Fire is five times better.

How about we settle for saying that they both suck?

[metalicajaymz]

Despite that not being what I believe, yes.

[Dave de Sylvia]

I think Is This It is great. Better than Room on Fire.
I agree. I love ITI? but Room on Fire is one of the worst albums ever.

[Daniel!]

Room on Fire and Is This It are more or less the same album. There are no notable differences in the style of the music or production. I never understand how people can hate one and love the other.

[Little Man being Erased]

There is a difference in the quality of the songs. I also think there is a difference in Production.

[Dave de Sylvia]

Room on Fire and Is This It are more or less the same album. There are no notable differences in the style of the music or production. I never understand how people can hate one and love the other.
Is This It? has good songs and Room on Fire doesn't. That's what I usually use to decide whether I like something or not.

[br3ad_man]

Yeah. Although Room on Fire has "12:51" which is their best song.

[Little Man being Erased]

no wai

[Zmev]

Hard to Explain is the best Strokes song ever

[Sepstrup]

I love Odelay :cool: but I can see why people wouldnt like it

I choose Daydream Nation because I never really got into Sonic Youth. Also, Is This It because I never got into The Strokes, though I openly admit I like Last Nite.

I feel the same way about Sonic Youth and The Strokes. Last Nite is their only great song.

[I'm The Face]

Not a Strokes fanboy by any means, but put me down as thinking Room On Fire is better than Is This It? Love the cheesy keys on 12:51, and Reptilia is a great song. I didn't care for First Impressions Of Earth - the drumming just sounded wrong, and the hooks and song composition just wasn't doing it for me. Juicebox was a rotten first single, and a rotten song in general.

[Happymeal]

If Blueberry Boat by The Fiery Furnaces counts, then that.

[knox]

If Blueberry Boat by The Fiery Furnaces counts, then that.

That's what I was about to say. God I hate that album. Maybe I should give it another listen

[mr_jackalope]

If Blueberry Boat by The Fiery Furnaces counts, then that.

YES.

[Little Man being Erased]

Yeah, The Fiery Furnaces suck balls.

[YDload]

Hard to Explain is the best Strokes song ever

tied with Reptilia

i dont see how every one of their songs can sound the same, yet there are still some that are clearly better regardless

:confused:

[asymm]

You guys all suck, Blueberry Boat is incredible. Sure, I'm tired of Friedberger's excessive output, but that album is terrific.

It's hardly an unassailable masterpiece anyway, I hear more people hate it than love it.

[Bartender]

My Bloody Valentine - Loveless
The Stone Roses - The Stone Roses

Particularly and especially The Stone Roses.

EDIT: Suppose you could throw in London's Calling. I don't hate it, though. I like it - or at least I like most of the songs on it if they're on their own - but I don't like it much at all as an album.

[rocknrollstar5]

Says Noel Gallagher.

Noel Gallagher likes Coldplay

[Kyle]

Trying Your Luck is the best Strokes song, actually.

[br3ad_man]

Blueberry Boat is awesome.

[Eliminator]

Anyone that says Daydream Nation is sort of dead inside.

[Little Man being Erased]

"New York City Cops" is really the best Strokes song.

[br3ad_man]

You know, I was listening to it the other day and I still like it, it's an ok album and all, but I think I'm going to say Endtroducing.

[YDload]

You know, I was listening to it the other day and I still like it, it's an ok album and all, but I think I'm going to say Endtroducing.

its kinda pleasant, but also dull

[Zmev]

I agree with people who say Blueberry Boat

[Quirky Turkey]

I have an aversion towards any Oasis album that is called a 'masterpiece'

[Sepstrup]

Anyone that says Daydream Nation is sort of dead inside.

Of all "classic" albums I've listened to. Daydream Nation is the worst.

[asymm]

You'll eventually come around. When I first heard it, I didn't fall in love either. But on the other hand, it's not my favorite Sonic Youth album anyway.

[Kyle]

The Smiths - The Queen is Dead

[Sepstrup]

You'll eventually come around. When I first heard it, I didn't fall in love either. But on the other hand, it's not my favorite Sonic Youth album anyway.

I gave it a bunch of chances. I really wanted to like it. The first two tracks are great. The rest is average or worse. There are some parts where his voice really, really annoys me.

I'll try again in a few years and see if I've gotten smarter in the meantime :)

[Sam]

The Smiths - The Queen is Dead

123

Also, I'd like to say that my second favorite song on Daydream Nation is Providence.

[Bukowski]

Sister is overrated

Daydream Nation is as perfect as music gets

IMO

[W.M.A]

L.A Woman- The Doors

[Zmev]

blood on the tracks
f#a#oo

[Eliminator]

I gave it a bunch of chances. I really wanted to like it. The first two tracks are great. The rest is average or worse. There are some parts where his voice really, really annoys me. I would think you would be used to horrible voices.

[I Was A Kaleidoscope]

In The Aeroplane Over The Sea isn't all that great

[team_racket]

i really didnt think f#a#oo was as good as everyone said.

[AlienEater]

I would think you would be used to horrible voices.

I really hate his voice in "Candle". It pisses me off so much.

[Sepstrup]

I would think you would be used to horrible voices.

What's that supposed to mean?

[The_Passenger]

I think he might be referring to Neutral Milk Hotel (who you said you liked earlier on), their singer is awful.

[Sepstrup]

Probably. Awful voices are often hit or miss... Sonic Youth is a miss for me.

[BringHomeTheBacon]

I wanna knoooow, should I stay or gooooooooo.
The vocals on Daydream Nation (mostly Kim and Lee) kind of bothered me at first but it's something I got over quickly.

[AlienEater]

I really like Kim vocals.

[Tyrion]

I really like Kim's vocals in the intro to Teenage Riot. The whole section is better than the rest of the song.

[plebeian scum]

I've never been able to understand what's so great about Led Zeppelin.

Three other well-recieved groups I can't stand: Ramones, Sex Pistols, U2. There's a lot of classic and class rock groups I don't really dig, I guess.

I've always felt like I should like the Sonic Youth more than I do. I saw them last week, and that did a lot less for them than I thought it would. Though Kim was good.

[asymm]

I've always felt like I should like the Sonic Youth more than I do. I saw them last week, and that did a lot less for them than I thought it would. Though Kim was good.
At the MN state fair? I saw them there as well. It was my first time seeing them, and I teared up a little. I've found myself doing that somewhat regularly at live shows now, but I'm trying to stop it and avoid public embarrassment. Can't quite explain why it's been happening, but it has.

[plebeian scum]

At the MN state fair? I saw them there as well. It was my first time seeing them, and I teared up a little. I've found myself doing that somewhat regularly at live shows now, but I'm trying to stop it and avoid public embarrassment. Can't quite explain why it's been happening, but it has.
Yeah. Despite the rain, it was absolutely fantastic. Though I actually got there late enough that I avoided it. My friend was working til 8 at the fair, and since the concert got delayed, we didn't miss anything. :P

It's strange; I don't remember most of the Sonic Youth set. I remember Teenage Riot and the guitar duel, I remember Kim's dancing, and I remember Thurston playing a guitar with a drumstick ... but that's all. Maybe because I was still trying to get my bearings & stuff. But the Flaming Lips ... oh man. That's where I just about cried.

[Pirate Satellite]

Give Up by the Postal Service.

[ToolBox]

Give Up by the Postal Service.

I don't think Give Up counts as an unassailable masterpiece...

[EightMilesHigh]

Give Up by the Postal Service.

I like The Postal Service, but I don't think anyone here would call that a masterpiece.

Then again, I can't speak for everyone, can I...

[br3ad_man]

A couple of the songs on there are masterpieces, but as an album it's really really average.

[Bukowski]

Havin listened to him tonite, Eliott Smith is one overrated muther****er.

seriously , sooooo boring

[I'm blue dabadeedabadie]

Wars of the Future isn't as great as everyone says they are.

[The Great Decay]

Havin listened to him tonite, Eliott Smith is one overrated muther****er.

seriously , sooooo boring

Quit music.

[asymm]

I'm glad I didn't go watch Destroyer with you

I didn't need my new shirt drenched
Haha! Don't worry, my appreciation of Destroyer isn't to that level yet...

[Converge]

All the Radiohead albums i've heard, OK Computer, The Bends, Kid A and Pablo Honey, & *awaits flaming*

Also, if anything Mike Patton related is considered a masterpiece, then those also.

[Rams]

Minutemen's Double Nickels On The Dime falls under my **** I wish I didn't actually pay for. Alongside Jeff Buckley's Grace. Other than that there is Nas' Illmatic, Radiohead's OK Computer, Pink Floyd's Dark Side Of The Moon, and a plethora of lackluster jazz albums people love to inflate.

[perriwinkle]

i don't like the smiths

not very much at all, really

[Little Man being Erased]

stop using huge text, ****wit.

[I Was A Kaleidoscope]

i don't like the smiths

not very much at all, really

yeah, me neither

[SailAway]

I'm not a fan of loveless.

[Sepstrup]

Minutemen's Double Nickels On The Dime falls under my **** I wish I didn't actually pay for. Alongside Jeff Buckley's Grace. Other than that there is Nas' Illmatic, Radiohead's OK Computer, Pink Floyd's Dark Side Of The Moon, and a plethora of lackluster jazz albums people love to inflate.

...

[I'm blue dabadeedabadie]

Kayetan Rezentes' following is just a bunch of condescending elitists. While I agree that he is a genius I can't stand his fans.

[JonM]

Who the **** is that, and what unassailable masterpiece did he make?

[PECOAE]

In An Aeroplane Over The Sea

[Happymeal]

Who the **** is that, and what unassailable masterpiece did he make?

Nothing came up when I tried googling him, so he doesn't exist. That or he's probably that guy's uncle or something

[Bukowski]

Quit music.

Why should I let Elliott Smith's mediocrity destroy my passion for music?

[Eliminator]

Maybe that's why he kicked his own bucket.

[sobelecta]

Born to Run, My Aim is True, and Ready to Die come to mind.

Born to Run is great, but Born in the USA is ****.

[br3ad_man]

sif

Dancing in the Dark > all