ITT: Dour Rockism Kills Rock and Roll

[A Spoonful Supreme]

http://allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&sql=61::68AP

I'm posting this here because this is most likely the place that "dour rockism" takes place. The article is about the transformation of rock from communal riteousness to wallowing singularity, so what do you think? Rock dieing? This article writer is a deuche? Probably read the whole article before you comment or don't comment at all.

[Zappa]

I don't agree with anything in that article.

[sketchyjoe]

I agree that modern rock music has a tendency to be bloody depressing and generally shite as there are a lot of confused, angry teenagers around that the music industry will willingly exploit and the general mood of today is far removed from the post-war optimism of the 50s but there are plenty of upbeat, fun bands around today though that shun the tired angst-rock formula and it'll only take one happy-sounding band selling a million for everybody to jump on the bandwagon.

[A Spoonful Supreme]

I don't agree with anything in that article.
Elaborate, I'll read what you type.
I agree that modern rock music has a tendency to be bloody depressing and generally shite as there are a lot of confused, angry teenagers around that the music industry will willingly exploit and the general mood of today is far removed from the post-war optimism of the 50s but there are plenty of upbeat, fun bands around today though that shun the tired angst-rock formula and it'll only take one happy-sounding band selling a million for everybody to jump on the bandwagon.
Pretty much how I feel.

[Robert Crumb]

Staff writer Thom Jurek was born in 1958.

Article reeks of old man.

[Zappa]

I feel like the whole concept of "community" and "escape" created by music is a sham, no matter how you slice it. It's so completely superficial. Appealing to the "individual" can actually help people to feel less alienated and out of step, whereas pulling them into a false group of people that like to escape reality just like them is just absurd.

I also feel like his timeline is majorly ****ed up, and that a band like the Doors or The Velvet Underground were doing "dour" music in the heyday of rock togetherness. Saying that rock is dead because of Guns'n'Roses is just so completely silly.

[Dave de Sylvia]

It's funny he mentions hair rock as being from the before/community era seeing as it was pretty much the most individualistic music ever created. Besides, I've seen AFI, who he cites among the negatives, and Bon Jovi, who he cites among the positives, and there was far more community spirit and joyful expression at the former.

Article stinks of desparation to appear knowing when he's hopelessly out of touch.

[EightMilesHigh]

there are plenty of upbeat, fun bands around today though that shun the tired angst-rock formula and it'll only take one happy-sounding band selling a million for everybody to jump on the bandwagon.

Yeah, like The Flaming Lips, or The Polyphonic Spree.

My conclusion: The article is make broad generalizations, kinda saying all rock is doom and gloom. Hell, if I liked Nickelback, I'd be depressed as well.

[Dave de Sylvia]

Yeah, like The Flaming Lips, or The Polyphonic Spree.
Proof some people will listen to anything.

[Robert Crumb]

"Dourist rockism" is the worst phrase I've heard all week, guys.

And I've come up with some pretty bad ones.

Edit: Like, "musical personage."

"populist folkisms."

[A Spoonful Supreme]

I feel like the whole concept of "community" and "escape" created by music is a sham, no matter how you slice it. It's so completely superficial. Appealing to the "individual" can actually help people to feel less alienated and out of step, whereas pulling them into a false group of people that like to escape reality just like them is just absurd.

Blues was a musical escape... jazz was a musical escape. Well actually, these people want to escape before hand but it reflects in the music. Now what is reflecting in the music? Things have become increasingly conservative since the end of vietnam and that is reflecting in the music today. So maybe it is not the music but rather society that is killing the traditional perception of rock and roll. But I would definitely say you're wrong about community and escape.

[Zappa]

Blues and jazz were musical escape? Are you insane? Blues is some of the most down-to-earth, real music out there.

The rest of your post was incoherent.

[Zappa]

Another thing I've noticed is that a lot of forms of music seem to have begun with harmless fun and jocularity, but as they progressed got more "serious," angry and sad in their themes. Look at the transformation from "Rapper's Delight" to Straight Outta Compton, the swing era to bebop to the avant garde.

It's a natural thing that happened to rock music just the same.

The only style of music I can think of that moved backwards is electronica, which started in the laboratory with classical-minded composers, and now is geared towards spikey-haired dorks with glowsticks.

[masada]

Allmusic really need to look into getting better writers.

[masada]

But then you have retards like Leftover Crack.

[masada]

street punx <3<3<3<3

[Rams]

Nothing quite says hedonist jubilee as well as Ozzy Osbourne show in the mid '80s.

[A Spoonful Supreme]

Blues and jazz were musical escape? Are you insane? Blues is some of the most down-to-earth, real music out there.

Yes it was down to earth but it served as escape in that people escaped in the music and the music did not escape them. They had something that they could genuinely call theirs and that is a form of escape.

[Zappa]

But not at all in the same way as "party all the time" mentality of the hair bands the article deals with.

[Zappa]

Punk moved backwards too. The MC5 wanted to overthrow society, Iggy Pop cut himself with glass on stage, the Sex Pistols wanted to kill the queen, and now Blink 182 and Green Day just want to run around naked.

I'm talking a bit broader here. Punk is still rock.

[A Spoonful Supreme]

But not at all in the same way as "party all the time" mentality of the hair bands the article deals with.
True.

[YDload]

I don't like "dour" modern-rock bands either, but you can't deny that happy music still rules the airwaves. Pop punk/power pop and hip-hop are what usually brightens the mood of the radio instead of regular old rock, but you still have occasions like the "The" bands and post-punk revivals that come along as well.

Much of the more popular modern-rock bands are just following grunge's lead (sometimes it's called post-grunge for that very reason), but there are just as many great bands making upbeat music as well. It's just that they tend to show up in smaller groups as some sort of "antidote" to the post-grunge music, whose bands come in larger waves.

[Rams]

The only style of music I can think of that moved backwards is electronica, which started in the laboratory with classical-minded composers, and now is geared towards spikey-haired dorks with glowsticks.

Reggae (from Roots Reggae to Dancehall) is another one, but most genres I can think of don't follow your trend at all. Blues has pretty much the same throughout, becoming a bit more polished up to be more energetic and less horrowing. Folk did have it's periods where it was more serious with political stances, but it's still been based mainly on it's traditional roots. Country has generally been serious but there still leads to Garth Brooks' in the world. And then there are the countless classical stylings across the world. Has the Indian Raga gotten any more or less serious? Has it ever been serious? I personally can't tell. And there a whole bunch of styles I've never listened to.

The people who make up the different styles of music can be so different that to say there is a natural progression of for styles of music seems far off.

[Zappa]

Reggae (from Roots Reggae to Dancehall) is another one, but most genres I can think of don't follow your trend at all. Blues has pretty much the same throughout, becoming a bit more polished up to be more energetic and less horrowing. Folk did have it's periods where it was more serious with political stances, but it's still been based mainly on it's traditional roots. Country has generally been serious but there still leads to Garth Brooks' in the world. And then there are the countless classical stylings across the world. Has the Indian Raga gotten any more or less serious? Has it ever been serious? I personally can't tell. And there a whole bunch of styles I've never listened to.

The people who make up the different styles of music can be so different that to say there is a natural progression of for styles of music seems far off.

Eh, it seemed like a decent concept/theory for the couple of minutes of thought I put into it. Thanks a lot, buddy.

[Dave de Sylvia]

The obvious point to be made here is that with all genres there will be people who want to put across a serious message and people who don't want to put one across at all. The article guy's problem seems to be that he thinks unless a band is singing about screwing groupies in elevators it's impossible for their fans to have fun.

[masada]

So wait, you're saying there's more to music than screwing groupies?

My life now has no point. :(

[sr800bkBassist]

people write music.
people listen to it.
music stays around as long as people write it.
the end.

[A Spoonful Supreme]

Brilliant ^^

[Tangy zizzle]

I oft say that rock (and it's subs) is dead, but it really isn't. Since the start there has always been good groups making good grooves, regardless of how many people are paying attention. It's not going to change anytime soon either.