Do you have to be a Music Freak to be a good drummer?

[TheCallOfKtulu1993]

Whats up everyone, I am 14 and pretty much don't know crap about sheet music, or a lot of drum terms. I may be clueless about that stuff but I CAN play kickass. I am self tought and have been playing for about 1 year and a half, so... I know this doesn't really matter but would it make me look stupid? I know it is about how I play, not my background and stuff but still....

I mean, Lars Ulrich didn't really know crap about sheet music and stuff either, like he said before. Sure, maybe Cliff taugh him a thing or two but he still didn't rely on it... AND he is a respected drummer in the Metal World (besides the whole Napster thing and stuff, no one hates him for not knowing sheet music that well)

So do you think I could get by as being the Metal Neil Peart without know much?


KTULU

[crazyguy832]

No, you don't. There are many drummers who don't know sheet music.

However, in this day and age, there's really no excuse.

http://www.musictheory.com

Nowadays, you're not going to get many gigs if you can't read sheet music properly. And, after a year and a half of self-taught... it takes more time than that, buddy. Get yourself a teacher. Also, don't say Lars Ulrich is a respected drummer... he isn't here.

XD

Also, you'll never be like Neil Peart. No one has been and EVER will be.

[Brokensticks]

Sure, I mean it helps a whole hell of a lot if you can read sheet music and have a teacher. If you're very motivated you can teach yourself and hopefully become really good. You won't be a Neil Peart anytime soon bud :thumb: Welcome to the forums.

[o_zo]

You COULD get by and be a decent player without knowing much about music theory but it is more than worth it to learn. It's not that hard, especially for drums as compared to something like piano or guitar. It really pays off to practise rudiments(especially to a metronome) and apply them to your playing as well. As far I see it, if you're going to be playing drums, why not learn some of this stuff? It can't hurt.

[Leprechauns1021]

While it is not NECCESARY to know how to read, it is still a very good tool for advancing you drumming. It doesnt take long to learn, and its not that hard either. Just learn it and you wont have any of these troubles :thumb:

[lmldrummer]

First off, don't say you can play kickass, you prob. aren't near as good as you think you are. I know I thought I was the best in the world (exageration) when I got on here the first time, and seeing all these people shows me how good I really am, which isn't that much at all. Yes, you should prob. know more about thing, such as rudiments if you don't know them. http://www.vicfirth.com/education/rudiments.html

that's them for ya, they will make you better, and I don't know that much about sheetmusic either, but I am trying to get better. Don't just sit there and say that your good, even if you are, you can still get better, so you should get up and try, instead of relying on other examples that you think you can live your life of of.

[TheCallOfKtulu1993]

Cool :) Thanks everyone. I don't know about a teacher, maybe looking stuff up online and getting a metronome could help. I'm just kinda shy so it would be weird having a teacher. I know, I would get used to him but I am determined, I think it would be cool to teach myself ;) Also I know I will have to get over my shyness for gigs lol, but I slowly am. I did a small Drum Solo type thing for a banquet I went to (a school class I was in where we did an Economics Program). also I was in REACH class for gifted students so it should be somewhat easy :D Thanks for the advice everyone *KTULU*

[TheCallOfKtulu1993]

Also, Kickass is an exageration (sp) lol

[Leprechauns1021]

Just some advice though. If you want to be a respected member of these forums, try to be humble. Also dont force your opinions on everyone else (although you havent done it yet), its ok to have an opinion just dont flame ppl who have different ideas. And on the reverse side, make sure you are open to new ideas and suggestions. And for some added help, post pics of your kit on the "Lets see those sets" thread, people here can help on your setup ALOT. Welcome to the forums anyways!

[othankheavenfor311]

Lars Ulrich is GOD at drums!!! :amaze: :rolleyes: :amaze: :rolleyes:


not...

[crazyguy832]

omgURt3hl0s3r

*slays othankheaven*

:p

[rohbit]

And if Damo hits you with a belt, it's because he cares.

[Janeway]

Isn't Lars the most hated member of metallica? And the least talented?

Not something to really aim for.

[Ethan.]

I love Metallica. Call of Ktulu is such a cool song.

I bet there is and/or will be someone as good as Neil Peart that just might not get nearly as much attention. He might be a local drummer that plays at the club down the street in Witchita.

Welcome to the forums. Learning theory would be a great idea if you want to be a better drummer.

[Skin Beater]

If you can't read rhythmic notation, you are just flat out lazy. People use all these famous drummers who may not be able to read as an excuse to be lazy. If you can't read, you aren't going to amount to much of a musician 99.999%

[LittlePound]

Isn't Lars the most hated member of metallica? And the least talented?

Not something to really aim for.
Kinda along the lines of what i thinking.


BUt to TS, yes you can be good w/o be completey knowledgable about how to play/read/etc.
You just become more proficient at your instrument if you learn how to read music and such. It makes it easier to play with others as well as open other oppurtunities for you. Yes, you can be good w/o it, but definetely learn it if you can, it couldn't hurt to learn at all.

[Carn]

Whats the connection between "being a music freak" and "being able to read sheet"

- I know some great musicians who cant read ****.
- I know some guys who can read great but arent all that.
- I know some guys who are great musicans and are able to read music.


Being able to read music is just another tool in the toolbox. It can and will help.

[gastery6]

I cant read sheet music and dont intend to learn it anytime soon, you don't need to learn to be good.

[crazyguy832]

How lazy have people become?

*shakes head slowly*

Where's Jos when you want someone to kill someone else?

V_V

[moogoogaipan]

it's just like this 60 second abs bull****. Everyone is looking for a quick way to the top without the effort and hardwork.

let me tell you point blank. You are going to have to spend years and years to become good. Do not expect to become spectacular in just a few short years... it takes time and effort... two words that send most people running.
"Waahhh!!! I want instant success,.. why do I have to work!!"

[CARMEN77]

Drum notation helps me visualize what im playing...

You think your good because of your ignorance. Find a teacher.

[GooseFilms.net]

I mean, Lars Ulrich didn't really know crap about sheet music and stuff either

Lars Ulrich still doesn't know **** about shat.

ED: Oh, and you need to be a music freak to be a good musician, plain and simple.

[Ethan.]

Jees guys that was rough.

[TheCallOfKtulu1993]

Okay thanks guys. I am not trying to ignorant, and kickass WAS a huge exaggaration. I am just saying that I am playing better than I thought I would at this point. I know it takes years of effort and pratice, and I am up to that :D I'm not really lazy, it's just that I am wondering about how to approach it. I do think it would help greatly, I just want to know where to start now. Thanks *KTULU*

[moogoogaipan]

well to be truly helpful I'll say this.

Be gung-ho. You might as well learn everything there is to learn about it because what harm is there. It's not really as difficult as you might perceive it to be, and to be honest, it's downright simple. It just takes a little practice.

[EdBanger]

Yes you do.

[Zildjian]

you dont have to read sheet music in order to be good, but its a good idea to learn how

For example: You want to join a band and they give you drum notation of one of there songs, you cant read it so your screwed. (true story, but happened to a bassest)

But reading sheet music is not to hard to learn, its essiancial for you to progress as a drummer

and about you saying how lars is really respected..Well i guess he is but listen to his live stuff, he cant keep tempo to save his life, which is the worst thing a drummer can do ( i have know idea how the rest of the band keeps up with his up and down tempo, its kinda scary)

[Bant]

man in 15 and i play drums, i can play kickass but once u start getting in a band or whatever your gunna have to stay in perfect time n whatnot. my drum teacher also said that u gotta learn sheet music and stayin in time. itll help in the long run bud.

[Cheungman]

you dont have to read sheet music in order to be good, but its a good idea to learn how

For example: You want to join a band and they give you drum notation of one of there songs, you cant read it so your screwed. (true story, but happened to a bassest)

its WAY more likely that a band will give tabs or something to a new guitarist or bassist. New drummers are generally given sheet music.

and even giving tabs to the guitarists or bassists doesn't happen too often. If someones new to the band you take the time and tell them what was up. Plus they might not like the old bass riff or something and change it a bit.

[sid121]

I dont think its vital to be able to know sheet music, but it is a good idea. It shows you are a good musician and that you know about timings ect. I only really like sheet music and tab has never really appealed to me. I still use it if im looking for a couple of beats to learn or jotting down a drum beat.

[Electric Requiem]

Books provide a wealth of information, and you dont buy them for the pretty pictures. Reading is very valuable, however as long as you can play in time its not that big of a deal. Your practicing is just that much more efficient, and like everyone said, if a new band gives you sheet music or tab or whatever and you cant read it, goodbye audition.

[Loser]

You will advance much quicker if you are able to read. As Electric Requiem said, there's tons of information in books.
Information + Practice = progression. I know if I weren't able to read music, I would be quite a bit behind where I am.

[DillingerEscp]

i have know idea how the rest of the band keeps up with his up and down tempo, its kinda scary)
easy ... the rest of the band is very talented. Lars is god-awful.

[pitchfork]

I don't know where to start, I won't I would probably get banned for the amount of cursing I would use.

[Ethan.]

Cause you don't like Lars?

[rohbit]

easy ... the rest of the band is very talented. Lars is god-awful.

Uh.. we've discussed all this before, and I'd just like to say, S&M anyone?

[Phototropic]

Step 1: Take a pin and deflate that monstrous ego of yours

Step 2: Do what you want, I'm happy enough to go on without reading sheet music, my friend on the other hand is trying to teach the guitarist in my band as they both think it'll make it better

[pitchfork]

Sheet music makes your life a hell of a lot easier when keeping time and learning things, just learn it man.

[red n black]

I don't understand. If you don't know music theory, learn it.

[Retarded Chipple]

The way I see it is that you can become a successful drummer without theory and rudiments etc through a band. People like Dave Lombardo of Slayer, Lars Ulrich, that guy from Arctic Monkeys don't know any theory and/or are self taught. Do you think they'd be successful drummers if they weren't in a band? Would they make it as session players or hold clinics through they're own talent? Basically, a drummer who doesn't learn theory and rudiments is more of a hobbyist who owns a drum kit than an actual musician. The guys i mentioned before are practically hobbyists that got rich!

I guess the answer is that if you don't want to learn theory but want to become a good drummer in the sense of being successfull, you'd have to make it in a band!

TS, you also implied that people who can read music are "music freaks". They're not freaks, they're people who know how and what to practice and play and are more focused, devoted and driven than you my friend!

[Panopticon]

Sheet music makes your life a hell of a lot easier when keeping time and learning things, just learn it man.

Sheet music doesn't help you keep time. A metronome does. Sheet music helps you see whats coming up in a song.

[Skin Beater]

Yes it is vital to be able to read and be a good musician. It's like not being able to read the english language and wanting to be an author, sure in a freak occurrence it could happen, but in reality its not realistic.

[Bl4ck3n3D]

The way I see it is that you can become a successful drummer without theory and rudiments etc through a band. People like Dave Lombardo of Slayer, Lars Ulrich, that guy from Arctic Monkeys don't know any theory and/or are self taught. Do you think they'd be successful drummers if they weren't in a band? Would they make it as session players or hold clinics through they're own talent? Basically, a drummer who doesn't learn theory and rudiments is more of a hobbyist who owns a drum kit than an actual musician. The guys i mentioned before are practically hobbyists that got rich!

I guess the answer is that if you don't want to learn theory but want to become a good drummer in the sense of being successfull, you'd have to make it in a band!

TS, you also implied that people who can read music are "music freaks". They're not freaks, they're people who know how and what to practice and play and are more focused, devoted and driven than you my friend!


Except Lombardo actually loves playing drums, it's his job, his life. He holds clinics every so often, and he's a very well rounded drummer. He is a musician. Now someone like Lars Ulrich, is a hobbyist

[drumindave]

Do what you want to do. I know a few people who have been playing for like 10 years without being able to read and they are amazing musicians. They're naturals though. It depends what you want to do. Look at the punk bands through the 70's and hardcore through the 80's those kids didn't read music but their playing fit the music.
In the end make the choice your self. I will say that being able to read is gonna help practice out of books and become accepted among other musicians.

[CARMEN77]

Yes it is vital to be able to read and be a good musician. It's like not being able to read the english language and wanting to be an author, sure in a freak occurrence it could happen, but in reality its not realistic.
threAD

[FockerTheLopper]

If you want to make it as a drummer you need to learn music. If your in a band and you just play out of your *** your band might make it but you won't be respected in the drumming community.

[pitchfork]

Sheet music doesn't help you keep time. A metronome does. Sheet music helps you see whats coming up in a song.
What I mean is learning note values helps you keep time, thats part of reading sheet music.

[FockerTheLopper]

Sheet music doesn't help you keep time. A metronome does. Sheet music helps you see whats coming up in a song.
I respect you as a member but thats completely stupid. If you don't know about sheet music and subdivisions how in the world are you going to use a click?

[Jaxom_of_the_Lambs]

And, after a year and a half of self-taught... it takes more time than that, buddy.

I have a friend and brother who were both really good at drums (mostly metal) after two years of self-teaching. wooo.

[White Riot!]

Sheet music helps you become a better musician.

There is no way anyone can self learn how to make crazy advanced elvin or vinnie type licks and grooves, you might be able to emulate them but you'll never understand how they work in order to create your own.

[Carn]

I have a friend and brother who were both really good at drums (mostly metal) after two years of self-teaching. wooo.

says more about metal :thumb:

[drummer_mp3]

As my first post here in a long time,

Welcome to the forums. Now as previously stated drumming is like Counter Strike. You learn to become better with loads of practice. You can't just naturally pick up the sticks and expect to pwn. Look at me, I suck at drums (mainly because I haven't played seriously in ages(because of this mac)).

That reminds me I have to play some drums. (might make a vid for you folks who are like "yeah it be great to hear you even tho you suck")

[sportsfan4427]

yea if you want respect i'd learn sheet music or else your just sorta hitting stuff without knowing really what your doing

[Electric Requiem]

I think a more appropriate analogy would be a public speaker who could not read or write.

[jcreamer89]

You cant be a succesful drummer unless you know as much as everyone else in the music industry.

[DuckinFutch8]

Get a teacher. It'll save you tons of hassles here and in your general musical experience.

And there are better drummers than Neil Pert. Imo...

[some jive turkey]

You cant be a succesful drummer unless you know as much as everyone else in the music industry.

That's saying nothing. I'm sure there are plenty of people in very active bands who have barely any ability, and wouldn't know if a piece of sheet music was upside down. I see them all the time on mtv2. "The industry" is not necessarily so closely related to musicianship. Though, knowing how to play certainly couldn't hurt.
__________________________________________________ ________

Think of it this way. It's a question of literacy. Metaphorically: if you learn to read words on a page, you can read any book/magazine/newspaper/journal/website you want. if you can find it in the library, you can learn about it. It's easier to become self-educated. it's a kind of intellectual freedom.

If you don't learn to read, you're stuck with whatever anyone will bother to show you:crap on TV(inbetween time wasting commercials that tell you what to buy), movies,....etc. More like an intellectual prison.

Musical literacy is the same way.
The straight fact is you'll never be able to learn as much if you don't learn to read, because it will take you much longer to learn things.
If your goal is to become a good drummer, I don't know why you would avoid learning to read. it's like handicapping yourself if you never learn it.

[burgeoningdrummer]

Do you guys think that sight-reading is extremely important? I know that in some professions of percussion it is required and extremely important. (Independant percissionists?) Anyway, I can read music, but I am poor at sight-reading it. Is this bad? Do I need to practice it?

[Tommy-r]

sight reading (IMO) is only really important if you have to play a show imediatly.
I can sight read pretty good, but if I have the time I'll sit at a table and just read over the sheets a couple of times and memorise them.

[some jive turkey]

In a practical sense, what you said about knowing to read charts-to play a show immediately-....it just seems to me like one of those things that doesn't happen often.

In my experience a lot of musicians, and most especially rock musicians do not want to write charts. They're lazy. I always have to make my own charts after they "teach" me the song. I think sometimes it's like an ego thing for them. Most songwriters don't write out drum set parts anyway.

And then there's the opposite with jazz musicians, who expect you to already know entire books book of standards by heart and not need a chart-and thankfully most of the time I don't.

A lot of it just depends on the form of a tune. A lot of jazz is very melodic and has simpler song structures, so as soon as i memorize the melody, I know where the changes are.
Since the popularity of bands like Radiohead and Tool, more rock and pop songwriting has become more complex with odd times and weirder structures. That stuff I always want charts for, because the less crap I have to memorize (which i eventually do anyway), the more material I can play,...it's really just that simple.

Learning to read music is most helpful for making your own charts and doing what Steve Gadd did.

[burgeoningdrummer]

Ok. Thanks a lot!