The dilemma with the community thread

[Damrod]

I mentioned it in the thread itself, we discussed it among the mods:

The Community thread is kinda going down currently

Why that? Well, basically, it's all just AIM/MSN like conversation between the same three or four people, there is not really a lot of substance in the posts in the first place. At least not in 90% of em. Which could be called a spam-fest. I personally lost all motivation to post in it, and in it's current state probably will not.

That's what the situation is now. Question is, what can be done to change that. To make it clear from the start: it will not go on like that anymore. We/I don't want to directly close it or swing the ban hammer. We might have to eventually, but want to avoid that with all possible means, as it would be a solution we would not be really happy with. Which calls for you folks!

What do we have to change? Enforce stronger post-restrictions? Delete posts, or should users be threatened with short time bans (not more than three days) for going spam in the community thread? What are your ideas and thoughts on the subject?

[FlawedPerfection]

I feel that the community thread was slowly becoming better, most noticeably last night, talking about music theory and later college plans. I realize I am one of these constant posters but I do try to avoid the spam if possible. If I should try to stay out of the thread a little more then I will. Anyway, I feel the reason for this is that the rules on the thread kind of just say "don't be a whiny b*tch or a noob" and you can post, which kind of allows for the spam. If we just restrict the rules to getting away from spam and discussing real things, then the community thread may be worth it. I happen to like the idea of the community thread a lot, as I've gotten to know a lot of people through it, so any way that the thread can stay would be much appreciated. Thank you.

[masada]

What bassist said, basically.

And I think the thread has improved in the last day or so.

[Hep Kat]

You're right. I really don't think it's that bad yet, but you are right. I constantly go in there and resist the urge not to spam/reply to a spam-like topic. But then again, can you honestly blame me/them/us or whatever? I mean, there really aren't too many people who actually regularly contribute to the discussion in the community thread (or this forum itself). Eventually, people just run out of things to talk about.

And, hey, I won't be stepping on bugs on any dates for a long time :p

Threatening with bans may not work with some people (okay, Eliminator) and deleting posts...well, I've never liked that practice unless it's absolutely necessary, but if you must, you must. Personally, I think we should work on getting more regulars on Sputnik over on the forums (because believe it or not, most of them would fit in just fine here on Mx). I think the community/contact/etc. links should be put on top of the main page as opposed to the bottom. Hopefully people will take note of it a little more often, and come to post on the forums (not just Sputnik, but everywhere).

[Damrod]

I feel that the community thread was slowly becoming better, most noticeably last night, talking about music theory and later college plans. I realize I am one of these constant posters but I do try to avoid the spam if possible. If I should try to stay out of the thread a little more then I will.

Good to hear that. It looked still kinda AIM-ish to me though. The most recent page at least. And, we don't want to drive the regs away from the thread, no need to run away.

Anyway, I feel the reason for this is that the rules on the thread kind of just say "don't be a whiny b*tch or a noob" and you can post, which kind of allows for the spam. If we just restrict the rules to getting away from spam and discussing real things, then the community thread may be worth it. I happen to like the idea of the community thread a lot, as I've gotten to know a lot of people through it, so any way that the thread can stay would be much appreciated. Thank you.

Hm, tighter, clearer rules are a logical step. Will think of something

You're right. I really don't think it's that bad yet, but you are right. I constantly go in there and resist the urge not to spam/reply to a spam-like topic.

That's the reason why I posted this, we should not just act when it's all down on the ground, but rather prevent that, hm? ;)

But then again, can you honestly blame me/them/us or whatever? I mean, there really aren't too many people who actually regularly contribute to the discussion in the community thread (or this forum itself). Eventually, people just run out of things to talk about.

And, hey, I won't be stepping on bugs on any dates for a long time :p

Hm, question must be asked, how does that come? There were more users in the past, at least I thought there were. Why have people left, or why do no new users jump in to participat?

Threatening with bans may not work with some people (okay, Eliminator) and deleting posts...well, I've never liked that practice unless it's absolutely necessary, but if you must, you must. Personally, I think we should work on getting more regulars on Sputnik over on the forums (because believe it or not, most of them would fit in just fine here on Mx). I think the community/contact/etc. links should be put on top of the main page as opposed to the bottom. Hopefully people will take note of it a little more often, and come to post on the forums (not just Sputnik, but everywhere).

Well, rules have to be enforced, so we have to do something to convince people to follow them. But like I said, we rather would like to find a solution how we can solve this without directly wielding ye olde ban hammer.

The linkage thing would be something mx would have to consider and evaluate

[Jom]

What do we have to change? Enforce stronger post-restrictions? Delete posts, or should users be threatened with short time bans (not more than three days) for going spam in the community thread? What are your ideas and thoughts on the subject?

The fact that there's no community in a community thread speaks for itself.

I took a hardline stance in the first community thread and early on in the second, so that's something you should consider.

For double-posts: do what Bartender usually does and merge them. But, if you have to keep merging posts, then ban for three days. If a user comes back and is a bitch about it, extend the primary and perm the back-up.

Just because GD is closed doesn't give people the perogative to post complete crap in the community thread.

If we just restrict the rules to getting away from spam and discussing real things, then the community thread may be worth it.

WHAT! How long have you been sitting on this conclusion!

The community thread has NEVER been a "Spam is A-OK ITT" thread.

I think the thread has improved in the last day or so.

Yeah, because Moz and Jens gave a warning.

I can guarantee you that things would still be crappy in there had they not. It's like as soon as the second one closed, the third one just became a continuation of it. Six-hundred posts in a couple days?

But then again, can you honestly blame me/them/us or whatever? I mean, there really aren't too many people who actually regularly contribute to the discussion in the community thread (or this forum itself). Eventually, people just run out of things to talk about.

Abysmal excuses.

If people run out of things to talk about, then don't freakin' post! Take the dog for a walk. Go running. Read a book. But by all means, if you want to carry on with a conversation, take it to a medium that requires static conversation, not the community thread.

[Hep Kat]

Hm, tighter, clearer rules are a logical step. Will think of something

Start by not posting "No Drama" three or four times in the rules, in your quest to generate e-laughs :p

That's the reason why I posted this, we should not just act when it's all down on the ground, but rather prevent that, hm? ;)

If only the rest of the world worked that way :(

Hm, question must be asked, how does that come? There were more users in the past, at least I thought there were. Why have people left, or why do no new users jump in to participat?

/shrugs

I dunno. See below:

Well, rules have to be enforced, so we have to do something to convince people to follow them. But like I said, we rather would like to find a solution how we can solve this without directly wielding ye olde ban hammer.

The linkage thing would be something mx would have to consider and evaluate

Right, right, right. Well, I'll leave all of this up to you guys.

Abysmal excuses.

If people run out of things to talk about, then don't freakin' post! Take the dog for a walk. Go running. Read a book. But by all means, if you want to carry on with a conversation, take it to a medium that requires static conversation, not the community thread.

Hey, I have a life!



Not too sure about the other guys, tho'...

[Jom]

Start by not posting "No Drama" three or four times in the rules, in your quest to generate e-laughs :p

Yeah, that was me. I closed the first community thread because everyone was being a whiny bitch about who-knows-what-'cause-I-don't-remember, so I got sick of it, closed the first one, and warned people not to be such crabs in the second.

People didn't even listen, as you can tell in the first couple pages where I was actually editing posts to try to curb the whining/ranting.

And, since people are a bit slow sometimes, I had to emphasize the no-drama rule to make sure that it clicked for people.

Hey, I have a life!

Yes, I know.

[FlawedPerfection]

WHAT! How long have you been sitting on this conclusion! The community thread has NEVER been a "Spam is A-OK ITT" thread.What I mean is for a long period of time, even though it was asked to not be there, it was never enforced, therefore giving people the idea that no one really cares.

[Bron-Yr-Aur]

I was/am relatively new to the concept of a community thread. Quite honestly, I didn't know there were any rules except for the ones mentioned on the first page, and more or less rolled with the topic at hand until I caught on to what the thread was about. Apparently I was wrong. I realize that page long discussions about Nickelodeon shows and scatological humor were perhaps not the thread's original purpose, but quite frankly I still don't know what is. If pointless discussions aren't allowed (and I personally enjoyed some of them) then I'll quit taking part in them, but I would honestly like to know what we are supposed to discuss in the community thread.

[Damrod]

The community thread is purposed to be for what it says: to form a community. Talking about random stuff basically is what the thread is for. But stuff like these:

Did you get any Godspeed yet Hep?
Amazon, help out Sputnik.
Kim-Jong-il is awesome.
I'm awesome.
Gc Omgomgomgomgomgomgomg


are not what we have in mind. It just seems like a page long AIM conversation than real discussion to me and others. It reads more like spam.

[FlawedPerfection]

The final three posts I do see a problem with. However, the first two I see as perfectly fine posts. We're talking about music and new site features. What's the problem there?

[mynameischan]

I don't see the problem with a little good natured fun in the Community Thread. Obviously sometimes things get out of hand (sexual comments, racial comments, etc.), and those posts should be deleted, I agree with that. But something like stricter rules, deleting posts that are otherwise unharmful, and banning people will only discourage posters in the thread, when there's only a few to begin with.

[Zebra]

I don't see the problem with a little good natured fun in the Community Thread. Obviously sometimes things get out of hand (sexual comments, racial comments, etc.), and those posts should be deleted, I agree with that. But something like stricter rules, deleting posts that are otherwise unharmful, and banning people will only discourage posters in the thread, when there's only a few to begin with.

The community thread is a place where you can go to discuss things. You're just upset because you never add anything useful to a conversation and make a lot of stupid posts.

[Hep Kat]

The community thread is a place where you can go to discuss things. You're just upset because you never add anything useful to a conversation and make a lot of stupid posts.

Come on, arguing amongst ourselves won't solve anything. Everyone makes a stupid post now and then. I think we can all easily compromise and shape up our actions in that thread (and in the forum in general, I suppose).

[masada]

Why can't weeee beee frieendssssss

[mynameischan]

The community thread is a place where you can go to discuss things. You're just upset because you never add anything useful to a conversation and make a lot of stupid posts.
I'm not upset. I just don't see what the big deal is.

[Dave de Sylvia]

I don't see the problem with a little good natured fun in the Community Thread. Obviously sometimes things get out of hand (sexual comments, racial comments, etc.), and those posts should be deleted, I agree with that. But something like stricter rules, deleting posts that are otherwise unharmful, and banning people will only discourage posters in the thread, when there's only a few to begin with.
The problem is that long-time members of the community and users of the thread have been complaining and have been discouraged from posting in there because they're not prepared to wade through 10 pages of crap to read a reply to their posts. The fact that there were four users over 50 posts within a couple of hours of the new thread going up is kind of telling.

[mynameischan]

Well alright then. I see the problem now.

[JohnXDoe]

I don't see much wrong with it. Get rid of blatent spam or warn the spammer. Fact of the matter is when some users are using it and basically posting the same kind of crap they don't complain. But when they aren't posting in it they start complaining and then say they don't post there because the quality has "gone down". If you don't like the quality start posting there and lift the quality if you think you can. Otherwise let the posters post and bring the ban hammer or whatever you have to do. You make the rules. You seem to want to set the standard. So enforce the rules and set the standard by action and example. Not by asking users and contributers to sputnik to clean up their posting. Nothing is really wrong with it. If you think the thread has dimished, everyone complaining can either start posting in it again or just let it be.

I don't post there much. But when I do it's a good place to post and I always find what I'm looking for by way of conversation, advice, or some e funnies. If you can be more specific about what kind of "quality" or what kind of discussion you want there that would help. But I see a busy thread that works pretty well. Perhaps leave well enough alone. And to the mods, just do what you have to. This "quality" thing is too vague. And not all of you were exactly brilliant all the time when you posted there more, either.

[mynameischan]

You make some great points there, JXD.

[JohnXDoe]

The problem is that long-time members of the community and users of the thread have been complaining and have been discouraged from posting in there because they're not prepared to wade through 10 pages of crap to read a reply to their posts. The fact that there were four users over 50 posts within a couple of hours of the new thread going up is kind of telling.
Well then do something about it. Why blame the user? Everyone wants sputnik to expand. Everyone wants new users. But when they get here the vets and "long time members" are going to complain. Too bad...

[Storm In A Teacup]

"I want your babies, Eliminator"

"Nobody cares for me, all I have are pandas"

"Custis is a ghey name"

These are the things that make me not want to go into the community thread anymore.

[Dave de Sylvia]

Well then do something about it. Why blame the user? Everyone wants sputnik to expand. Everyone wants new users. But when they get here the vets and "long time members" are going to complain. Too bad...
I don't know if you've read the thread we made about it.

[JohnXDoe]

"I want your babies, Eliminator"

"Nobody cares for me, all I have are pandas"

"Custis is a ghey name"

These are the things that make me not want to go into the community thread anymore.
Well then make some rules and enforce them. Don't ask contributers to this site to do more. Everyone here writes reviews. We all talk about music in that thread, too. Give us a break, make yourselves clear, or come back to the thread and help make it a better place.
I don't know if you've read the thread we made about it.
I don't think I have. I haven't been around the last few days. Point me there and I'll have a look.

[Storm In A Teacup]

It's the community thread, er, duh. :-\

[mynameischan]

"I want your babies, Eliminator"

"Nobody cares for me, all I have are pandas"

"Custis is a ghey name"

These are the things that make me not want to go into the community thread anymore.
People are always going to post like that. Even if you start banning everybody who does it, more people will come along and do it anyway. That's how people are. Personally, stuff like that makes me want to look at the community thread. It just depends on who you are. Some people like things like that and think it's funny, and some people think it's pointless and stupid. But I don't think posts like that should make you avoid the community thread. If posts like that were harming the site in some way other than they don't "contribute anything positive," then I would see the problem. But it seems to me that the only point you're making is "I don't like to read stuff like that so stop it."

[Storm In A Teacup]

/post

Dude, that kind of talk is for aim, or msn. Don't take that stupid, spammy, annoying **** onto the community thread when you could just do it on instant messanger.

Some people want to have intellegant conversations, I know it's shocking, but it's true.

[Zebra]

Dude, that kind of talk is for aim, or msn. Don't take that stupid, spammy, annoying **** onto the community thread when you could just do it on instant messanger.

Some people want to have intellegant conversations, I know it's shocking, but it's true.

I completely agree with this.

[JohnXDoe]

I really do think it's being exaggerated guys. The sputnik community thread is not out of hand. It's not a cesspool. It's not the Pit. I'm all for quality posting. But we'll not all the same people here. Let's just all do our part to make it a close and strong community. One of tolerance and understanding and a "room for everybody" kind of appeal. We have no real problems at sputnik. So don't think it's all that bad. Because it's not. And post, post, POST!. It won't kill you to step around the silliness.

[mynameischan]

I see your point. I am in no way saying that the community thread shouldn't be an intelligent place for smart conversation. But the thing is, a truly intelligent conversation only comes around, like, once a week in the community thread. What's wrong with talking about, for example, cartoons? Most users gladly take part in conversations about their favorite past/present cartoons. And that conversation is essentially pointless and for the most part unintelligent.

You make a good point, and I realize that. I'm just saying that we need to take into consideration both sides of the argument. Some people don't have a problem with "spam" in a thread that is essentially for discussion about anything, and some people do. Maybe there isn't a solution that will appease both sides, but if there is, I think we need to find it.

[FlawedPerfection]

I think the compromise needs to be made here. There needs to be an allowance for "unintelligent" conversations such as the cartoon conversations. No matter what, they won't end. However, they certainly need to be lessened. We have nearly 20 pages in the new thread of pretty much pointless drivel. That number should be less than that. Right now, what's going on in there is perfectly fine. I think some people (including me) just needed a bit of a warning.

[Storm In A Teacup]

Okay, it is about discussion of anything, you are right, but those first ten pages made in one day weren't really about anything, but wasting time and showing off how many posts you can make in a day. It was ridiculous.

And no one said talking about cartoons didn't count as spam, just as long as it's nice.

And intellegant conversations would take place every single day if half of you didn't drive people away with the spammy posts.

[mynameischan]

Good points are being made from both sides. I'll do my part and lessen my spamming.

[Dave de Sylvia]

We just want the community thread to work for everyone. If a minority are dominating it and people are complaining, there's a problem. Personally, I don't really care but we can't ignore a section of the community.

[Damrod]

Suggestion for the whole thingy: We have agreed on the fact that the community thread kinda went down and lost users. We have cleared that some kind of spam is going on. I personally don't want to keep this going on for ever and ever, as this thread turns out exactly as the discussion around the Pit.

Soooo, I would say, if people can agree on it, let's kick the current Community thread, and start anew. We all try to not let it slip into AIM-like convo stuff, and actually try to discuss about stuff. I would set the rules clearer in the first post in the renewed one, and we will keep a closer eye on it.

Can we agree on this, or are you all against it?

[FlawedPerfection]

Sounds good :thumb:.

[Hep Kat]

You just want an excuse to make another thread, don't you? :p



In all seriousness, go ahead. Starting with a clean slate seems like the best idea to me.

[mynameischan]

Well, I don't think you necessarily have to start a new one, but hey you're the mod. Do what you think is best.

[morrissey]

A lot of people are missing the point here. The problem isn't discussing cartoons, it's the ten plus pages of this stuff:

"I want your babies, Eliminator"

"Nobody cares for me, all I have are pandas"

"Custis is a ghey name"

There is no drastic change being implemented here nor are we trying to restrict conversation, but let's all try to be sensible when posting. I know I'm as guilty of retarded inside-joke community thread posts as anyone, but I think if people are complaining the least we could do is try to measure our behaviour.

I know as well as anyone that these kind of inside discussions are great fun for the people participating, but suck to read for everyone else. So let's please consider other people's wishes. That's what a community is about, after all.

[masada]

And anyway, wanting my babies is a perfectly natural and common post.

[mynameischan]

I never even said that.

[morrissey]

Suggestion for the whole thingy: We have agreed on the fact that the community thread kinda went down and lost users. We have cleared that some kind of spam is going on. I personally don't want to keep this going on for ever and ever, as this thread turns out exactly as the discussion around the Pit.

Soooo, I would say, if people can agree on it, let's kick the current Community thread, and start anew. We all try to not let it slip into AIM-like convo stuff, and actually try to discuss about stuff. I would set the rules clearer in the first post in the renewed one, and we will keep a closer eye on it.

Can we agree on this, or are you all against it?
Sounds good to me.

[Damrod]

Up and running :thumb:

[Te Karanga]

Thanks for deleting my 'I'm back' post with it.

Seems as though everything is decided before I even get on these days.

[Te Karanga]

The problem is that long-time members of the community and users of the thread have been complaining and have been discouraged from posting in there because they're not prepared to wade through 10 pages of crap to read a reply to their posts. The fact that there were four users over 50 posts within a couple of hours of the new thread going up is kind of telling.
But then again it sucks seeing you, moz, amit and jom in a little elitist circle jerk. Which is what the thread was like earlier this year.

I was friends with all of you guys, and still am. But it bored me.
I really do think it's being exaggerated guys. The sputnik community thread is not out of hand. It's not a cesspool. It's not the Pit
123

We have agreed on the fact that the community thread kinda went down and lost users.
I disagree, seems to have gone up in users to me. The group of people have changed slightly as of late, but I've been seeing new faces, more groups and more of a unified community.

[Dave de Sylvia]

Well I think we've all admitted that at some point, but noone ever complained, to the best of my knowledge, and it wasn't on the massive scale (20 pages a day) that it is now. I mean, it doesn't really bother me, I just don't read the thread unless I see the last post is by someone who interests me but we have to respond to complaints.