hi

[Iskandar]

Well, here it is, Wotan. If you're willing, tell us about your racial and religious beliefs; and we'll have a little discussion.

[B Radd]

i have no "religous beliefs" but i am Christian if that makes since ta ya

[The_Passenger]

i have no "religous beliefs" but i am Christian if that makes since ta ya

No, it really doesn't.

EDIT: I don't really think this is the right thread to discuss it in tough.

[Ghoul Hunter]

:)

What exactly do you want to know though? I'm not sure where to start.

For some info about the religious part, Wotanism is closely related to Asatru and Odinism

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/asatru
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/odinism

Wotanism is BASICALLY the German translation of Odinism.

[Mr. Ron]

Ohhhhh this thread is going to be good.


/sets up camp.

[Iskandar]

:)

What exactly do you want to know though? I'm not sure where to start.

For some info about the religious part, Wotanism is closely related to Asatru and Odinism

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/asatru
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/odinism

Wotanism is BASICALLY the German translation of Odinism.
I'm interested in the following:

1) More information about Wotanism, in your own words.
2) Your reasons for following it.
3) Your ideology on racial purity. You mentioned that you hope to have a white wife and children (well, it's hard to have another race of children with a white wife :p) and that you hope other whites would as well. Unless you consider other races to be inferior, why would you think that?

[Timm]

:)

What exactly do you want to know though? I'm not sure where to start.

For some info about the religious part, Wotanism is closely related to Asatru and Odinism

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/asatru
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/odinism

Wotanism is BASICALLY the German translation of Odinism.
0_<

wotan =/= odin

[Ghoul Hunter]

I'm interested in the following:

1) More information about Wotanism, in your own words.
2) Your reasons for following it.
3) Your ideology on racial purity. You mentioned that you hope to have a white wife and children (well, it's hard to have another race of children with a white wife :p) and that you hope other whites would as well. Unless you consider other races to be inferior, why would you think that?

1) Wotanism is a Pagan religion that has been around for many years (pre-christian). It along with many euro-pagan religions was nearly completely wiped out my christianity, but is slowly returning. It is a religion that focuses on the intelligence and potential strength of the follower. Meditation is very, VERY, important to all Wotanists. It is a way to expand the mind and become more spiritually connected to nature and the Gods. That brings me to the next point, nature. The main point of Wotanism is to abide by nature's law, and respect it above everything else.

2) My reason is the same as most true Wotanists, the belief has always been in me. I read a book about the religion, and realised that everything about thte religion had always been in me, just not awakened. It's a feeling so intense that I nearly didn't want to accept it, mainly because I held fairly agnostic/atheist views before.

3) I will never call any race inferior, just different. Wotanism is DIRECTLY tied to your ancestors and heritage, and simply wouldn't work with mixed races. The religion keeps strong because of heritage and it's true people. If the race dies out, so do the God's strength and the religions power.

Sorry this is scattered. MX messed up when I tried to reply and deleted what I had.

[Mr. Ron]

1) Wotanism is a Pagan religion that has been around for many years (pre-christian). It along with many euro-pagan religions was nearly completely wiped out my christianity, but is slowly returning. It is a religion that focuses on the intelligence and potential strength of the follower. Meditation is very, VERY, important to all Wotanists. It is a way to expand the mind and become more spiritually connected to nature and the Gods. That brings me to the next point, nature. The main point of Wotanism is to abide by nature's law, and respect it above everything else.

2) My reason is the same as most true Wotanists, the belief has always been in me. I read a book about the religion, and realised that everything about thte religion had always been in me, just not awakened. It's a feeling so intense that I nearly didn't want to accept it, mainly because I held fairly agnostic/atheist views before.

3) I will never call any race inferior, just different. Wotanism is DIRECTLY tied to your ancestors and heritage, and simply wouldn't work with mixed races. The religion keeps strong because of heritage and it's true people. If the race dies out, so do the God's strength and the religions power.

Sorry this is scattered. MX messed up when I tried to reply and deleted what I had.

Well said.

[Loser]

Gods



"god" is only capitalized when talking about a monotheistic god named God.

[Mr. Ron]

"god" is only capitalized when talking about a monotheistic god named God.
Kind of silly when the title of "god" was used well before monotheistic believers ever used it.

[Amit]

3) I will never call any race inferior, just different. Wotanism is DIRECTLY tied to your ancestors and heritage, and simply wouldn't work with mixed races. The religion keeps strong because of heritage and it's true people. If the race dies out, so do the God's strength and the religions power.

Err uhh, you do realize that all the races and cultures are inherently mixtures right?

I love it when people ignore this.

[nowhesingsnowhesobs]

Why don't you just come out as an all out racist because you clearly are one?

All races should be separate but equal!

[B Radd]

yo is anyone Christian here?

[Mr. Ron]

Err uhh, you do realize that all the races and cultures are inherently mixtures right?

I love it when people ignore this.
I think he means regional purity. Like, it's ok if people from Europe mix, because they all have similarities between them in culture and people even though they are different in other ways.

[Ghoul Hunter]

Err uhh, you do realize that all the races and cultures are inherently mixtures right?

I love it when people ignore this.
I know what you mean, but I believe you get my point.

Ron pretty much summed it up.
Kind of silly when the title of "god" was used well before monotheistic believers ever used it.
Exactly.

[Amit]

Seperate but equal worked really well for African Americans before that fangled Martin Luther King stepped in with his retterick, let me tell you!

I think he means regional purity. Like, it's ok if people from Europe mix, because they all have similarities between them in culture and people even though they are different in other ways.

Haha, regional purity.

This is hilarious.

[B Radd]

well i guess wotan isnt Christian cause of the inverted cross-lol but is there anyone here that is Christian?!

[Timm]

3) I will never call any race inferior, just different. Wotanism is DIRECTLY tied to your ancestors and heritage, and simply wouldn't work with mixed races. The religion keeps strong because of heritage and it's true people. If the race dies out, so do the God's strength and the religions power.

so where does one race stop and the next starts?
I'm being pedantic now: the only way to achieve what you described there would be incest.
that's against nature though and going by the biological termonolgy a is are a group of individuals that can procreate fertile offspring. well at least that's what race means in the german biological sense, maybe it means something different in english.

yeah I'm late

[nowhesingsnowhesobs]

well i guess wotan isnt Christian cause of the inverted cross-lol but is there anyone here that is Christian?!you're in a den of infidels, omg

[Ghoul Hunter]

well i guess wotan isnt Christian cause of the inverted cross-lol but is there anyone here that is Christian?!
Just stop. It's not witty/funny/etc.

[Amit]

you're in a den of infidels, omg

get out before you're sacrificed to the gods of purity zomgz

[Mr. Ron]

Seperate but equal worked really well for African Americans before that fangled Martin Luther King stepped in with his retterick, let me tell you!



Haha, regional purity.

This is hilarious.
Explain.



Guys, don't turn this into a flame war. (not aimed at you Amit. ;-*)

[nowhesingsnowhesobs]

um does he really need to?
get out before you're sacrificed to the gods of purity zomgzgtfo your excess melanin content is sullying the purity of this thread

[Ghoul Hunter]

Guys, don't turn this into a flame war. (not aimed at you Amit. ;-*)
Just as I thought though, it will.

[Cocaine]

well i guess wotan isnt Christian cause of the inverted cross-lol but is there anyone here that is Christian?!
You fail at everything. The inverted cross is a symbol of Christianity and no less Christian than a traditional cross.

[Mr. Ron]

um does he really need to?
I don't think it's that crazy of an idea.

[nowhesingsnowhesobs]

well it is

how exactly does regional purity work in practise? and why would you pursue such a racist and evidently retarded policy?

[B Radd]

You fail at everything. The inverted cross is a symbol of Christianity and no less Christian than a traditional cross.

i dont know if anywhere in the bible it says that an inverted cross is bad, but it is traditional to invert the cross to show that ur against Jesus, who is and was and will be the new testament

[Cocaine]

Tradition according to?

It's the Cross of Saint Peter.

I dont really understand why he has it as his avatar, but it's in no way related to Wotanism.

[Mr. Ron]

well it is

how exactly does regional purity work in practise? and why would you pursue such a racist and evidently retarded policy?
It's been done before.

[Amit]

Explain.

No one has as of yet given me a good reason why heterogenity leads to the loss of heritage.

And then you guys keep changing it from race to skin colour to region. Make up your mind before you fire up the ovens!

Guys, don't turn this into a flame war.

That's the inevitable end product of irrationality.

[Iskandar]

Well, thank you for your prompt reply, Wotan. I have some more questions, primarily about the theology of Wotanism:

1) What gods do you worship and how?
2) To be blunt, why do you believe in these gods?

[Cocaine]

It will only turn into a flame war if you guys allow it. If someone posts something to start flaming, just ignore it.

[Mr. Ron]

No one has as of yet given me a good reason why heterogenity leads to the loss of heritage.

And then you guys keep changing it from race to skin colour to region. Make up your mind before you fire up the ovens!



That's the inevitable end product of irrationality.
Ok, the oven joke is a bit much. I'm not some genocidal maniac. Ok? Good.

Once you have such a mixture of heritage to the point of where people don't even know what they are anymore, this will progressively degrade one's aspect of their own heritage in most cases.

[B Radd]

Tradition according to?

It's the Cross of Saint Peter.

I dont really understand why he has it as his avatar, but it's in no way related to Wotanism.

tradition is called religion, thats why Christianity is considered as a religion, u can understand more about religion all the way back to Adam and Eve's sons: Abel and Cain.
so its tradition to the world, when the bible talks about the "world" its talking about sinners

[Mr. Ron]

Well, thank you for your prompt reply, Wotan. I have some more questions, primarily about the theology of Wotanism:

1) What gods do you worship and how?
2) To be blunt, why do you believe in these gods?
To help you, here is a list of Nordic gods/goddesses/giants. I think some are missing....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Norse_gods

[Amit]

Ok, the oven joke is a bit much. I'm not some genocidal maniac. Ok? Good.

That's been the only end product of the arbitrary seperation and identification of people. Maybe not ovens all the time, since machetes and machine guns are also in the vogue these days.

Once you have such a mixture of heritage to the point of where people don't even know what they are anymore, this will progressively degrade one's aspect of their own heritage in most cases.

You honestly think this?

Haha.

[Cocaine]

tradition is called religion, thats why Christianity is considered as a religion, u can understand more about religion all the way back to Adam and Eve's sons: Abel and Cain.
so its tradition to the world, when the bible talks about the "world" its talking about sinners
Doesn't change the fact the Cross of Saint Peter doesn't represent anti-Christian ideas in any traditional way. Either way, this thread is about Wotanism.

[nowhesingsnowhesobs]

Ok, the oven joke is a bit much. I'm not some genocidal maniac. Ok? Good.Actually the oven joke is quite justified, as both of you were defending your friend Adolf before.

[Iskandar]

To help you, here is a list of Nordic gods/goddesses/giants. I think some are missing....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Norse_gods
Oh, I see. I'm familiar with Norse mythlogy to some degree, so it's not wholly new to me. Thank you!

[Amit]

This is a nice achievements list of identity politics. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pogrom)

[Ghoul Hunter]

Well, thank you for your prompt reply, Wotan. I have some more questions, primarily about the theology of Wotanism:

1) What gods do you worship and how?
2) To be blunt, why do you believe in these gods?
1) I worship every God that I can identify myself with and strengthen my spirituality.
2) I believe in the gods because they help me set myself on a steady path, and support me in doing good. I sense them in everything good that I do.

The actual "gods" are not what most people think though, same with myths. They are the archetypes of the followers that we strive to identify ourselves with to better us. For example, Thor is not some huge muscular god that wields a hammer and lightning. He is a symbol of our strength and protection. If we read and understand the myths, runes, and gods, we come closer to understanding who we are and what we need to do.

[Mr. Ron]

Actually the oven joke is quite justified, as both of you were defending your friend Adolf before.
OUR adolf? Seriously, don't even try that with me.


I wasn't defending him at all. I was pointing out some positive qualities he had.

[B Radd]

Doesn't change the fact the Cross of Saint Peter doesn't represent anti-Christian ideas in any traditional way. Either way, this thread is about Wotanism.

dude i dun know why u keep mentioning da cross of Peter, i was talkin about da dude with da inverted(upside down) cross, not Peter

Peter is one of the 12 pillars of the church and is greatly blessed by God.

[Cocaine]

dude i dun know why u keep mentioning da cross of Peter, i was talkin about da dude with da inverted(upside down) cross, not Peter


Because the Inverted Cross is known as the Cross of Saint Peter.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cross_of_St._Peter

The actual "gods" are not what most people think though, same with myths. They are the archetypes of the followers that we strive to identify ourselves with to better us. For example, Thor is not some huge muscular god that wields a hammer and lightning. He is a symbol of our strength and protection. If we read and understand the myths, runes, and gods, we come closer to understanding who we are and what we need to do.

This is one thing I like about the Pagan Gods, they're not so much a personification of rules as they are a representation of ideas.

[Amit]

OUR adolf? Seriously, don't even try that with me.


I wasn't defending him at all. I was pointing out some positive qualities he had.

Hitler was a sensitive man, or at least, a certain band told me so.

[Bartender]

3) I will never call any race inferior, just different. Wotanism is DIRECTLY tied to your ancestors and heritage, and simply wouldn't work with mixed races. The religion keeps strong because of heritage and it's true people.

How would you/Wotanism deal with something like all races having, ultimately, the same origin (/ancestors/heritage/etc)? Or do you just think that's not true.

/actually interested

[Iskandar]

The actual "gods" are not what most people think though, same with myths. They are the archetypes of the followers that we strive to identify ourselves with to better us. For example, Thor is not some huge muscular god that wields a hammer and lightning. He is a symbol of our strength and protection. If we read and understand the myths, runes, and gods, we come closer to understanding who we are and what we need to do.
Ok, I begin to get this a little better now.

So are your gods metaphysical beings, though? Or are they purely conceptual?

[Mr. Ron]

Hitler was a sensitive man, or at least, a certain band told me so.
You're doing a great job at wrecking the objective of this thread.

[Ghoul Hunter]

How would you/Wotanism deal with something like all races having, ultimately, the same origin (/ancestors/heritage/etc)? Or do you just think that's not true.

/actually interested
The answer to that is something none of us directly know. I'm not sure how to expand on that really. We know it's possible for everyone to have the same beginning, but things have branched out to how they are now.

[nowhesingsnowhesobs]

I wasn't defending him at all. I was pointing out some positive qualities he hadno you were pulling the 'stalin was worse' trick, when it was completely irrelevant.

its a good example of how overbearing 'cultural identity' makes people stupid.

[Amit]

You're doing a great job at wrecking the objective of this thread.

And no one is doing a very good job defending racial/regional/skin colour/cultural/whatever-the-hell-it-is-now seperation and purity.

[Mr. Ron]

no you were pulling the 'stalin was worse' trick, when it was completely irrelevant.

its a good example of how overbearing 'cultural identity' makes people stupid.
I was saying that stalin and people like him are rarely mentioned on the level of Hitler based on atrocities.

But whatever, lets stay on topic please....

[B Radd]

[QUOTE=CocaineAndCrucifixes]Because the Inverted Cross is known as the Cross of Saint Peter.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cross_of_St._Peter

Oh! okay i get what ur sayin now ( yah) Peter was (i think) crucified upside down, but when something (anything) is inverted it usually means ur against it, so alot of people will have the cross upside down to show that their against Jesus, cause the cross represents Him.

[Iskandar]

You're doing a great job at wrecking the objective of this thread.
Thank you.

Atman, I respect you as a member of this forum; but please, don't bring down my thread. We all know racism and apartheid are bad. This thread was created as a place to discuss Wotanism, and other users besides me are interested in it, too.

[Cocaine]

Bringing a good question forward to continue an ON TOPIC discussion.
How would you/Wotanism deal with something like all races having, ultimately, the same origin (/ancestors/heritage/etc)? Or do you just think that's not true.

/actually interested

[Ghoul Hunter]

Ok, I begin to get this a little better now.

So are your gods metaphysical beings, though? Or are they purely conceptual?
The gods like I said, are very real to the point of being archetypes deeply imbedded into the psyche of the people. The only way to understand 100% what they really are, is through practicing Wotanism and becoming more like the gods yourself.

[Amit]

We'd stay on topic but no one's giving us anything to respond to.

Thank you.

Atman, I respect you as a member of this forum; but please, don't bring down my thread. We all know racism and apartheid are bad. This thread was created as a place to discuss Wotanism, and other users besides me are interested in it, too.

Heh, woops. I thought this thread was created to discuss the user Wotan, not Wotanism...

My apologies.

[Mr. Ron]

And no one is doing a very good job defending racial/regional/skin colour/cultural/whatever-the-hell-it-is-now seperation and purity.
Patients is a virtue, my friend.

[-1up!-]

Ok, the oven joke is a bit much. I'm not some genocidal maniac. Ok? Good.

Once you have such a mixture of heritage to the point of where people don't even know what they are anymore, this will progressively degrade one's aspect of their own heritage in most cases.

I don't get how you think heritage is only recognizable when it is pure.

And I don't get whatever importance man gives to his heritage. What should I care about what people in the past have done or come from solely from the fact their blood runs in me? It's only nature :confused:

[Amit]

/makes new thread

[B Radd]

what da freak is wotanism i dun feel like readin all that stuff

[-1up!-]

what da freak is wotanism i dun feel like readin all that stuff

Your IQ level is no match for this forum, leave.
/elitism

[Cocaine]

That's honesty, not elitism.

[Bartender]

The answer to that is something none of us directly know. I'm not sure how to expand on that really. We know it's possible for everyone to have the same beginning, but things have branched out to how they are now.

But if all of them can be traced back to the same beginning, at what point does it stop being one group and start being several separate groups (which must now stay separate)? Just some arbitrary point where Wotanism kicks in? It sounds like you're just headed towards a kind of Sorites paradox.

[nowhesingsnowhesobs]

I was saying that stalin and people like him are rarely mentioned on the level of Hitler based on atrocities.
That may be so, but you were levelling that charge in the wrong place and with no justification. It wasn't a poll on your 'top 3 totalitarian dictators' thread, it wasa thread specifically about dein Fuhrer.

[Mr. Ron]

I don't get how you think heritage is only recognizable when it is pure.

And I don't get whatever importance man gives to his heritage. What should I care about what people in the past have done or come from solely from the fact their blood runs in me? It's only nature :confused:
This sentence is the attitude of many today, and this is bad. You should be aware of where you came from and who you are. Everyone must take pride in something in life, why not take pride in who you are as a person and folk?

[Mr. Ron]

That may be so, but you were levelling that charge in the wrong place and with no justification. It wasn't a poll on your 'top 3 totalitarian dictators' thread, it wasa thread specifically about dein Fuhrer.
Again, stop with the "your hitler" garbage or get out.

[B Radd]

Your IQ level is no match for this forum, leave.
/elitism

its okay u dont got ta get so freakin crazy, B-Radd dont know ur stuff, so if ya want ta know Christianity, just ask me in da thread im about ta make, cause ur right, my IQ level doesnt match this stuff Im Christian and know about that,

[Ghoul Hunter]

But if all of them can be traced back to the same beginning, at what point does it stop being one group and start being several separate groups (which must now stay separate)? Just some arbitrary point where Wotanism kicks in? It sounds like you're just headed towards a kind of Sorites paradox.
Well, we know of course that there are different races now, and before. Wotanism is in the blood and beliefs of the people it started with.

[nowhesingsnowhesobs]

Again, stop with the "your hitler" garbage or get out.hey just admit you were being an idiot

[Mr. Ron]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norse_mythology

This one answers a lot.

[Bartender]

This sentence is the attitude of many today, and this is bad. You should be aware of where you came from and who you are. Everyone must take pride in something in life, why not take pride in who you are as a person and folk?

But why does such pride automatically mean restricting yourself to one race? The concept of "heritage" makes no reference to purity; a bloodline is just that, a line of blood traced back through generations. It doesn't stop being a bloodline because more than one race is a part of it.

[Mr. Ron]

hey just admit you were being an idiot
After you, child.

[Ghoul Hunter]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norse_mythology

This one answers a lot.
Yeah, that's a very good link.

[-1up!-]

This sentence is the attitude of many today, and this is bad. You should be aware of where you came from and who you are. Everyone must take pride in something in life, why not take pride in who you are as a person and folk?

No I take pride in what I do, the choices I make, the way I choose to live. Those, to me, make up what I am, not my biological identity or genes or fingerprint or whatever factors which are completely out of my control.

Taking pride in something I did not achieve by myself, but rather was given to me through natural phenomena doesn't sound right. If anything, I take pride in the society in which I grew because I can retrace some traits in my character from the social environment I lived in. Hence the only attachment of "heritage" I feel is my sense of belonging to the Quebecois society.

Personally I don't really care about my family or bloodline beyond my own parents. Blood is nothing more than blood. I'm your post-modern kind of man, what can I say.

[Ghoul Hunter]

But why does such pride automatically mean restricting yourself to one race? The concept of "heritage" makes no reference to purity; a bloodline is just that, a line of blood traced back through generations. It doesn't stop being a bloodline because more than one race is a part of it.
Wotanism is in the blood of the people. It wouldn't make sense if say, asians practiced it.

[Timm]

This sentence is the attitude of many today, and this is bad. You should be aware of where you came from and who you are. Everyone must take pride in something in life, why not take pride in who you are as a person and folk?
it doesn't make much sense to me to be aware of myself by looking at "where I came from". it seems to me you're trying to fill up your emptiness by taking pride in something you had no influence on because that's everything you think you have

[Mr. Ron]

But why does such pride automatically mean restricting yourself to one race? The concept of "heritage" makes no reference to purity; a bloodline is just that, a line of blood traced back through generations. It doesn't stop being a bloodline because more than one race is a part of it.
It's not restiction, just staying close to who you are.

[Amit]

This sentence is the attitude of many today, and this is bad. You should be aware of where you came from and who you are. Everyone must take pride in something in life, why not take pride in who you are as a person and folk?

I'm a North Indian/Bengali Hindu going out with a girl whose family was French Royalty. We're both fully aware and appreciative of our complex and rich "heritages."

Do you think we forget by hanging out with each other? No, that's not how it works. We end up learning more about each other's cultures and even our own "heritages."

Anyway, can we take this particular discussion to my thread? I like The Dropper a lot and I don't want to disrespect him by going off topic in his thread :-)

[Mr. Ron]

No I take pride in what I do, the choices I make, the way I choose to live. Those, to me, make up what I am, not my biological identity or genes or fingerprint or whatever factors which are completely out of my control.

Taking pride in something I did not achieve by myself, but rather was given to me through natural phenomena doesn't sound right. If anything, I take pride in the society in which I grew because I can retrace some traits in my character from the social environment I lived in. Hence the only attachment of "heritage" I feel is my sense of belonging to the Quebecois society.

Personally I don't really care about my family or bloodline beyond my own parents. Blood is nothing more than blood. I'm your post-modern kind of man, what can I say.
What I mean is, looking back at your ancestors and gaining pride through what they did to inspire you to do good and remain industrious

[B Radd]

YO Wotan if u guys dont get all mad at me (this thread seems like it hates me) even if this was already answered before, can u tell me why u chose wotanism and not Christianity?

[Chrysostom]

1) The actual "gods" are not what most people think though, same with myths. They are the archetypes of the followers that we strive to identify ourselves with to better us. For example, Thor is not some huge muscular god that wields a hammer and lightning. He is a symbol of our strength and protection. If we read and understand the myths, runes, and gods, we come closer to understanding who we are and what we need to do.

That's a rather Jungian approach.

[Mr. Ron]

I'm a North Indian/Bengali Hindu going out with a girl whose family was French Royalty. We're both fully aware and appreciative of our complex and rich "heritages."

Do you think we forget by hanging out with each other? No, that's not how it works. We end up learning more about each other's cultures and even our own "heritages."

Anyway, can we take this particular discussion to my thread? I like The Dropper a lot and I don't want to disrespect him by going off topic in his thread :-)
You may not forget now, but if you had children, and they had children and they had children and so on, it only makes sense that most cultural identity would become confused or even lost.

[Timm]

What I mean is, looking back at your ancestors and gaining pride through what they did to inspire you to do good and remain industrious
and how can you not do this when, let's say your grandmother was from japan :confused:

I don't get you guys with that blood stuff, it makes zero sense to me.

[-1up!-]

It's not restiction, just staying close to who you are.
Isn't "who you are" more accurately defined by what you do as an individual, rather than who's sexual relationships you came out of?

Actually our fundamental disagreement on what "heritage" is stimulates my sociology-loving spirit. Yum. I'm guessing very different values (from both family and society) fuel our definitions of heritage, and the debate would have to be taken to a broader level...

[Ghoul Hunter]

YO Wotan if u guys dont get all mad at me (this thread seems like it hates me) even if this was already answered before, can u tell me why u chose wotanism and not Christianity?
Christianity doesn't affect me at all, that's why. Religion is about the person's inner feelings, and my inner feelings are tied to Wotanism. It betters me as a person.

[Iskandar]

We'd stay on topic but no one's giving us anything to respond to.



Heh, woops. I thought this thread was created to discuss the user Wotan, not Wotanism...

My apologies.
I'm asking him about Wotanism because he's the only person I've ever heard of who practices it. I wouldn't start a thread just to roast another member.

It's fine, though. No need to apologize. :thumb:

[Amit]

You may not forget now, but if you had children, and they had children and they had children and so on, it only makes sense that most cultural identity would become confused or even lost.

No, they wouldn't. Unless I was a terrible parent.

As I've said before, my experiences with so many different demographics throughout my life make me conclude that this strange cultural insecurity and phobia of cultural loss seems to only pervade with Caucasian Americans.

Which is hilariously ironic really, since nearly all of them come from such mixed cultural backgrounds.

[B Radd]

Christianity doesn't affect me at all, that's why. Religion is about the person's inner feelings, and my inner feelings are tied to Wotanism.

Do u know what becoming born again is?

[Mr. Ron]

Isn't "who you are" more accurately defined by what you do as an individual, rather than who's sexual relationships you came out of?

Actually our fundamental disagreement on what "heritage" is stimulates my sociology-loving spirit. Yum. I'm guessing very different values (from both family and society) fuel our definitions of heritage, and the debate would have to be taken to a broader level...
"Who you are" is a mixture of both, but ultimately, where you come from and who you are raised by GREATLY effects who you are down the road.

[Ghoul Hunter]

Do u know what becoming born again is?
Yes, why?

[Mr. Ron]

Do u know what becoming born again is?
Ok Pat Robertson, clam down.

[-1up!-]

"Who you are" is a mixture of both, but ultimately, where you come from and who you are raised by GREATLY effects who you are down the road.

Yes, where I come from is the society in which I live in and who raised me was my parents. Now, why should I care about my great-great-grandfather?

[Ghoul Hunter]

Because they raised you parents, who directly affect how you're raised.

[Chrysostom]

Ok Pat Robertson, clam down.

:lol: It's funny because it's true. Damn evangelists.

[Mr. Ron]

Yes, where I come from is the society in which I live in and who raised me was my parents. Now, why should I care about my great-great-grandfather?
Well, if he had good qualities, then why not look back at them and try to do the same?

[Timm]

Because they raised you parents, who directly affect how you're raised.
I don't think his great great grandparents raised his parents.
while there is influence from his great great grandparents on him indirectly the influence of society is greater over so many generations.
Well, if he had good qualities, then why not look back at them and try to do the same?
well why not do this with any other person you're not directly linked to?

[-1up!-]

Because they raised you parents, who directly affect how you're raised.

My grandfather was strict, almost authoritarian, Christian, and pretty much got the "patriarcal" thing going on as he was raising my mom.

I'm on the deep left end of the political spectrum, have a negative reaction to the concept of authority in itself/borderline anarchist, anti-Christianism, and "morality" is, to me, a tool of repression wielded by conservatism which I despise more than anything.

Whatever values my grandfather spilled down to my mom and then to me were heavily diluted by the social context I grew in.

[Ghoul Hunter]

I don't think his great great grandparents raised his parents.
while there is influence from his great great grandparents on him indirectly the influence of society is greater over so many generations.
I meant his great great grandparents raised his great grandparents, and so on.

[Ghoul Hunter]

My grandfather was strict, almost authoritarian, Christian, and pretty much got the "patriarcal" thing going on as he was raising my mom.

I'm on the deep left end of the political spectrum, have a negative reaction to the concept of authority in itself/borderline anarchist, anti-Christianism, and "morality" is, to me, a tool of repression wielded by conservatism which I despise more than anything. Where's the link.
Influence doesn't mean always positive.

[Amit]

Could you guys take this to my thread?

[Ghoul Hunter]

^I agree.

With that said, if anyone has questions relating to Wotanism, ask me here. That's all.

[-1up!-]

Influence doesn't mean always positive.

You mean my mom would've had a negative experience from her father's values, inspiring her to break out from those values to the exact opposite, which then made me into the hardcore anti-authority leftist I am?

This sounds better. Actually it is my theory on how I came out on an ideological level. In any case, it eliminates the need for me to take pride in authority beyond my parents' education on me. I have no pride to take in a Christian, strict and authoritarian grandfather.

[Iskandar]

Could you guys take this to my thread?
Thank you for creating it. It was a good idea irrelevant of this thread, actually.

[Ghoul Hunter]

You mean my mom would've had a negative experience from her father's values, inspiring her to break out from those values to the exact opposite, which then made me into the hardcore anti-authority leftist I am?

This sounds better. Actually it is my theory on how I came out on an ideological level. In any case, it eliminates the need for me to take pride in authority beyond my parents' education on me. I have no pride to take in a Christian, strict and authoritarian grandfather.
That's what I was saying, so yes.

[Bartender]

It's not restiction, just staying close to who you are.

How is it not a restriction? It reads almost like the definition of a restriction.


What I mean is, looking back at your ancestors and gaining pride through what they did to inspire you to do good and remain industrious

Which is fair enough, but I don't see how it follows that (to avoid typing out multi-caveated sentences whenever this is referenced) 'race should stick to race'.

[Cain]

The idea that someone could hold this philosophy in the modern world, with legion-sized evidence of the negative consequences of putting such behavior to practice, truly boggles my mind. Regardless of whether the ideal that's buried underneath the concept is attractive, looked at objectively and in the context of history it has led to nothing but epic atrocity, inequality, and war. No doubt the reason I have not seen a single convincing reason (just a lot of rhetorical justification) in defense of this mindset is because in actual practice the concept is covered in the blood of billions of murdered people.

There is no evidence to suggest that obsessive preservation of cultural "heritage" (which is an oxymoron in the first place) leads to anything other than stagnation, while there's reams of evidence to suggest that any attempt to preserve such a heritage leads to actions and events that are the very antithesis of human morality. This is because the fight to preserve heritage is an inherently flawed battle since all cultures depend on heterogeneous input to both stay relevant and survive as an entity, and to fight that means to fight other men and often to be drawn into a system of discriminatory hatred and bloodspilling. Just because it's a belief, a religion, whatever, it doesn't matter: it's idiotic and has absolutely nothing to reccommend it unless you completely ignore the reality of our history and our world.