For my lower frequency friends:

[Amit]

A present. (http://www.marriedtothesea.com/060206/bum-bum-buppa-bum.gif)

Anyway, what do you guys think about Stanley Clarke and Jonas Hellborg?

[burtonbassist_101]

that's a good picture.

i think that they're extremely talented musicians who know what to do on a bass guitar.

[Amit]

Sweet, Alaska.

[burtonbassist_101]

yup yup

[ChimPz]

Hey, what brand bass is that angel using, cuz i want one!:p

[Chris K]

Anyway, what do you guys think about Stanley Clarke and Jonas Hellborg?

They both brilliant musicians, however, both are hideously underrated around here. I'm a big fan of Stanley Clarke (His "If this bass could only talk" album is one of the best records made in the 80's imo) and a massive fan of Hellborg.

I must say that I don't have a "favourite" period of Jonas Hellborg's work, as most fans do. I love his early Electric solo work like "Elegant Punk", and his duo stuff with John McLaughlin (and then the trio stuff with Billy Cobham/John McLaughlin). Very cool.

I also love his newer "Indian fusion" stuff. It as usually him and Shawn Lane, and V Selvaganesh on the Kanjeera, making some very cool indian influenced music. Also, on "Icon" which was very heavy in a sense, the sons of two Shakti members sang on the album, which adds a whole new dimension to the sound (although Selvagnesh did have coule of vocal/Kanjeera solo on "Good people in times of evil").

Also, I feel Jonas is an amazing fusion bassist in general, his trio work in the late 90's with Shawn Lane and Jeff Sipe was amazing, especially the live album "Personae" and "Temporal Analogues of Paradise", which was an hour long live show, cut into two tracks. Very cool stuff.

I'm also digging the myriad of other things Hellborg has done, stuff like the Jonas Hellborg group albums, very much "written" in a drum and bass sense (listen to the way the bass and the drums lock together and lay in unison at times) but the keyboard sounds over the top are largely improvised. The hellborg Group albums, especially "E", feature fast, heavy slap bass playing.

All in all, phenomenal, definatley in my "big 4" of favourite bassists.

[Az_Holl]

Hey Chris, my history teacher burnt me a copy of School Days, and whilst i didnt liek School Days the song that much, the album is quite good. I esspecially like the track he does with McLaughlin, playing the upright.

Stan defiantely has some monster chops.

[FunkMetalBass]

Quite honestly, I have yet to hear either of them. Nobody posts music for either of them around here, so it's almost IMPOSSIBLE for them to spread.

[Chris K]

yeah, the Desert Song, very cool stuff, especially once he starts playing with his fingers. That said, I think Hot Fun and School Days are my favourite tracks on that album, Hot Fun is seriously funky and has some very cool muting in it. Great stuff!

One thing thats especially cool about Clarke in the 80's is that the production on his albums got way better, allowing us to hear his lovely tone with a great deal of ease!

[Az_Holl]

yeah, the Desert Song, very cool stuff, especially once he starts playing with his fingers. That said, I think Hot Fun and School Days are my favourite tracks on that album, Hot Fun is seriously funky and has some very cool muting in it. Great stuff!

One thing thats especially cool about Clarke in the 80's is that the production on his albums got way better, allowing us to hear his lovely tone with a great deal of ease!
I learnt the chord part to School Days, i enjoy that, but the guitars annoy me.

My teacher said he was going to get me some more stuff as well, but i have no idea what...

Still, new respect for Clarke.

[Chris K]

yeah, at first I found the keyboard lick in School Days to be irritating, but now I love it!

Also, compare the fingertsyle interlude in School Days with Dune Tune by Level 42. It's easy to see Stan was a huge influence on Mark, Dune tune sounds so damn similar!

[Az_Holl]

Recommed any Level 42 albums in particular?

[Chris K]

Recommed any Level 42 albums in particular?

A Physical Presence, Guaranteed and World Machine. All three are awesome, and contain some great bass playing. Plus, Guaranteed has some prety nifty guitar playing courtesy of Allan Holdsworth.

[Az_Holl]

A Physical Presence, Guaranteed and World Machine. All three are awesome, and contain some great bass playing. Plus, Guaranteed has some prety nifty guitar playing courtesy of Allan Holdsworth.
Thanks, mate, I'll check them out sometime.

[Chris K]

Good good, always happy to get people listening to the good stuff!

[Chris K]

Stanley Clarke n00bs: Watch this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3MaUSbaqlg

Hellborg n00bs watch this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HVI5GhtllYM&search=Jonas%20Hellborg%20

[lateralus423]

Life is just a game is awesome!

[Chris K]

Life is just a game is awesome!

It is, but I find the violin intro very irritating for some reason! However, once the song gets going, it's very cool, and the second movement is ace.

With all this talk of School Days and If This Bass Could Only Talk, we have almost overlooked Stan's eponymous debut! That is one hell of a jam album.

However, I'd still rather listen to Hellborg than Clarke, but I'd much rather listen to Clarke than jaco.

[naut]

both are hideously underrated around here.

and with good reason.

[Chris K]

and with good reason.

How can anything be a "good reason" for them being underrated?

if you're trying to say that you think they suck, would you not be better off saying "They're overrated"?

To be underrated is to be deserving of recognition and commendation but not receiving it, and so in this forum, they are most certainly underrated. You say they they're "(underrated) and with good reason", so does this not imply that you appreciate them as musicians? To claim that they are "underrated" in the first place is tantamount to admitting you like them!

[kilian]

Stanley Clarke n00bs: Watch this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3MaUSbaqlg

Hellborg n00bs watch this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HVI5GhtllYM&search=Jonas%20Hellborg%20
After 1 minute of fretboard wanking, there came this nice piece around 1:04. And we do get another piece at 1:35. And that's aboute it with Hellborg. Fretboard wanking to teh max :smash: Too bad, because he shows some nice ideas around the pieces I mentioned.

Stanley Clarke.. Hmm nothing really special, although he uses super thin strings? :amaze:

[katana_manatee]

I'm not much of a fan of Clarke, I hate his tone... Love his upright playing though although some of his playing on electric I like. Still to hear Hellborg, I've read a couple of articles on him and I am defo gonna check him out.

Oh, albums wise by Level 42, get their eponymous debut. More fusion based than the later poppy stuff.

[kilian]

^^Check the link above your post and check if you agree with my comments.

[katana_manatee]

^^Check the link above your post and check if you agree with my comments.

No time, I am just off out.

[Chris K]

Aft And that's aboute it with Hellborg. Fretboard wanking to teh max

Oh dear oh dear.

I'd like to remind you that this video is not at all indicative of his career. His albums, at an estimate, contain about 10-20% slap bass. It's quite a rarity to see him do such a thing!

[naut]

How can anything be a "good reason" for them being underrated?

if you're trying to say that you think they suck, would you not be better off saying "They're overrated"?

To be underrated is to be deserving of recognition and commendation but not receiving it, and so in this forum, they are most certainly underrated. You say they they're "(underrated) and with good reason", so does this not imply that you appreciate them as musicians? To claim that they are "underrated" in the first place is tantamount to admitting you like them!

LOMYALE.

well, that was quite a time pisser eh?

[naut]

Stanley Clarke n00bs: Watch this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3MaUSbaqlg

Hellborg n00bs watch this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HVI5GhtllYM&search=Jonas%20Hellborg%20

pffffff i can masturbate too, but at least i jizz at the end.

[bottlerocket]

Hey Amit. Good to see you in our humble forum. :D

Hellborg's pretty cool. I prefer Clarke to Hellborg but I'm not a big fan of either. Solo bassists don't appeal to me much.

-Gav

[peeted]

hmm yes stanley clarke is a god amongst men, hellborg is pretty good too.

[moghes69]

Oh dear oh dear.

I'd like to remind you that this video is not at all indicative of his career. His albums, at an estimate, contain about 10-20% slap bass. It's quite a rarity to see him do such a thing!
then why would you choose that video as an example of his playing...?

[Amit]

They both brilliant musicians, however, both are hideously underrated around here. I'm a big fan of Stanley Clarke (His "If this bass could only talk" album is one of the best records made in the 80's imo) and a massive fan of Hellborg.

I must say that I don't have a "favourite" period of Jonas Hellborg's work, as most fans do. I love his early Electric solo work like "Elegant Punk", and his duo stuff with John McLaughlin (and then the trio stuff with Billy Cobham/John McLaughlin). Very cool.

I also love his newer "Indian fusion" stuff. It as usually him and Shawn Lane, and V Selvaganesh on the Kanjeera, making some very cool indian influenced music. Also, on "Icon" which was very heavy in a sense, the sons of two Shakti members sang on the album, which adds a whole new dimension to the sound (although Selvagnesh did have coule of vocal/Kanjeera solo on "Good people in times of evil").

Also, I feel Jonas is an amazing fusion bassist in general, his trio work in the late 90's with Shawn Lane and Jeff Sipe was amazing, especially the live album "Personae" and "Temporal Analogues of Paradise", which was an hour long live show, cut into two tracks. Very cool stuff.

I'm also digging the myriad of other things Hellborg has done, stuff like the Jonas Hellborg group albums, very much "written" in a drum and bass sense (listen to the way the bass and the drums lock together and lay in unison at times) but the keyboard sounds over the top are largely improvised. The hellborg Group albums, especially "E", feature fast, heavy slap bass playing.

All in all, phenomenal, definatley in my "big 4" of favourite bassists.

I definitely like the way you think :-D

After 1 minute of fretboard wanking, there came this nice piece around 1:04. And we do get another piece at 1:35. And that's aboute it with Hellborg. Fretboard wanking to teh max :smash: Too bad, because he shows some nice ideas around the pieces I mentioned.

Stanley Clarke.. Hmm nothing really special, although he uses super thin strings? :amaze:

Haha, Hellborg is so much more than "wanking." The guitar/bass duo stuff he did with McLaughlin was so incredibly beautiful and spiritual...And it was just two instruments!

Hey Amit. Good to see you in our humble forum. :D

Hellborg's pretty cool. I prefer Clarke to Hellborg but I'm not a big fan of either. Solo bassists don't appeal to me much.

-Gav

Nice of you guys to have me :-D

Hmm...I don't like solo <musicians> in general, really. A very unique and exceptionally tight group is so much more appealing for me. Some exceptions have to be made though (Coltrane, McLaughlin, Davis, Indian classical artists, etc).

[Chris K]

then why would you choose that video as an example of his playing...?

Because it's just about the only video of him around, at least that demonstrates him as a bassist on a level that is appreciable in a video.

"Beautiful" and "Spiritual" are two words Amit uses to describe the music Hellborg makes. I'd say he hit the nail on the head there.

[katana_manatee]

I liked that Hellborg video, flashy but had some tasty licks in there. Was he influenced by Stanley at all? Nearer the end it had some very Stanley like elements.

I think I am gonna have to hunt down some of his tunes... Download a few see what I think then if I likey I'll see about getting an album. Any suggestions Chris?

[Esp Griffyn]

I liked that Hellborg video, flashy but had some tasty licks in there. Was he influenced by Stanley at all? Nearer the end it had some very Stanley like elements.

I think I am gonna have to hunt down some of his tunes... Download a few see what I think then if I likey I'll see about getting an album. Any suggestions Chris?

Chris takes a strong stand against downloading.

But if you really must, Kali Ghat, Rice with the angels, Time is the enemy, glad to be back from Paris.

[Esp Griffyn]

then why would you choose that video as an example of his playing...?

Because if someone posted a video of his Raga styled live improv, then someone would just say "wtf his fretless intonation is terrible he keeps going sharp and flat over the notes of the progression i own Hellborg at improvising"

[katana_manatee]

Chris takes a strong stand against downloading.

But if you really must, Kali Ghat, Rice with the angels, Time is the enemy, glad to be back from Paris.

I usually only download a few tracks to get a taste of an artist then it helps me decide if I want to buy an album. There are a lot of artists I would not have gotten albums of had it not been for mp3s so it does them a favour if you don't abuse it.

[Esp Griffyn]

Chris understands and supports such downloading :chug:

[naut]

Chris supports amnesty for illegal aliens. Chris wants better healthcare and improved education. Chris wants your vote.:chug:

[katana_manatee]

Chris you should have showed the McLaughlin with Hellborg video, that kicks arse. I am definately getting an album.

[nicatterberry]

I have the record version of I Wanna Play for You. 2 records, it's pretty sweet.

[bleeding_fingers]

The Stanley Clarke video confirms the fact that you can't look cool playing a keytar.

[BassVirtuoso]

I only like them in bands like Mahavisnhu and Return to Forever, I can't really bare their solo/side project stuff.

[moghes69]

i didn't know who to beleive about hellborg's talent. so i searched for some videos and i found this.
there was a lot less of the blatant wanking going on. i liked it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HDGFitisHJQ&search=jonas%20hellborg

[Mailman]

A present. (http://www.marriedtothesea.com/060206/bum-bum-buppa-bum.gif)

Anyway, what do you guys think about Stanley Clarke and Jonas Hellborg?
Hey eggo, whats all the stuff in your avatar? What album covers and stuff?

[Chris K]

Chris you should have showed the McLaughlin with Hellborg video, that kicks arse. I am definately getting an album.

Good stuff :thumb:

[Chris K]

btw, this is music that is spiritual...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FR9vZ02Rg90&search=jonas%20hellborg

it's kind of a shame, Youtube used to have some videos of Hellborg and McLaughlin playing as a duet in 1994 I think it was, for a show that was televised by Channel 4. There were videos of Electric Dreams and Goodbye Pork Pie Hat, it was ace.

[Amit]

Yeah, I was definitely thinking about Hellborg's solo in Goodbye Pork Pie Hat when some guy talked about fretboard wankery, heh :-)

[Chris K]

Good news, the Goodbye Pork Pie Hat and Electric Dreams videos are still there.

[katana_manatee]

Chris, advise me on a good Hellborg album to start off with please. :)

[Chris K]

If you dig the Ohne Filter:Musik Pur video of Hellborg and McLaughlin then Elegant Punk is the best place to start, but be aware, it is "true" solo bass, as bass is the only instrument used on the album (apart from solo guitar arrangement of the Elegant Punk theme). It's a brilliant album, certainly one of my favourites. It's done in three separate cuts, each with their own sound and feeling. Very cool, but out of print, so expect to pay a lot for it.

A good place to start for his fusion trio stuff would be Personae with Jeff Sipe and Shawn Lane, it demonstrates how he interacts in a band setting, as well as showcasing his talent and improvisational skills.

The easiest way to get into his Indian Fusion is with kali's Son, his newest solo record out on Bardo. He is the focus, but Nildari Kumar lays down some very cool sitar/zitar stuff. He runs them through a guitar effects pedal and amp and gets some really cool sounds.

I could go on all day about how all of Hellborg's work is brilliant, but these are all good starting points. I think it's time for some Elegant Punk now.

[katana_manatee]

Nice one, I'll try and hunt that down. I wish I had checked him out a long time ago, great player but few people on the boards seem to have heard of him or want to check him out. :confused:

I love the video of him playing with Trilok Gurtu, some awesome stuff there.

[Chris K]

Good stuff, always happy to spread the word of Hellborg.

[Chris K]

This should keep you all entertained...

Hows this for some truely beautiful playing...(this is an excerpt from "Rice with the angels" from the Abstract Logix album, the version of Rice With The Angels on Personae is a speedy fusion number)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MoqRENuuLrs&search=Hellborg


And here is some of the Lane/Sipe/Hellborg trio, although this song is mislabelled, it's acutally Time Is The Enemy, the first track on Personae. The song Jonas starts playing at the end is Personae.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kc8ANMawM5E&search=Hellborg

[baggagebassman]

Stanley Clarke is a MONSTER.

[Led_Zeppelin678]

Stanley Clarke and George Duke are coming to Buffalo in 8 days. I'm still contemplating going, though, but only because the venue's in an area where people tend to get shot often. (The Tralf)

[Led_Zeppelin678]

This should keep you all entertained...

Hows this for some truely beautiful playing...(this is an excerpt from "Rice with the angels" from the Abstract Logix album, the version of Rice With The Angels on Personae is a speedy fusion number)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MoqRENuuLrs&search=Hellborg

I am officially buying that album. Shawn Lane was freaking amazing.

[HaVIC5]

Stanley Clarke's upright playing is why I like him, not his electric playing. His electric stuff overall is pretty meh, save for maybe his self titled and school days, but him jamming on the upright is definitely a sound to behold. His work with Return to Forever is very innovative and exciting and really sets the standard for fusion upright players. I've also been digging the stuff he does with Al Di Meola and Jean-Luc Ponty with the Rite of Strings. He's also one of the only people I've ever known to hold a crowd with completely solo upright bass playing, quite an interesting feat.

[bottlerocket]

Hmm...I don't like solo <musicians> in general, really. A very unique and exceptionally tight group is so much more appealing for me. Some exceptions have to be made though (Coltrane, McLaughlin, Davis, Indian classical artists, etc).

Me neither, man...I really can't get into a lot of solo musicians. I can totally appreciate them and dig them in small quantities but I don't drool over them like I guess I'm supposed to. :p

-Gav

[Chris K]

I am officially buying that album. Shawn Lane was freaking amazing.

Well, Amazon has the Abstract Logic album for sale at $55. Kinda pricey.

[Amit]

And that's why we have Soulseek :-D