PNWI Community Thread version 3.0 (KEEP REFRIGERATED AT ALL TIMES)

[siva_chair]

are you suggesting that it was done on purpose? by design?

What does that matter at all?

oh that time

Yes, that time.

they found it hard to rule over thr irish because they really didn't take it seriously and the irish are a bunch of nutjobs

Or, they took it plenty serious and there was just no ruling governmental structure to keep treaties, transmit orders, etc. through. This is probably the reason the English always denounced the Irish as "wild" and "uncivilized" because they wouldn't keep treaties with their English conquerers.

you said see above and i did and saw nothing. should i put my fog lamps on?

No just open your eyes. I gave you several instances of how the Irish were far from barbaric, uncultured tribesman.

Another important thing to point out is that the Irish monks were probably the most sophisticated proselytizers of Christianity. They almost singlehandedly spread Christianity to the Alpine Slavs. The Franks tried to do that by the sword and failed, then the Irish simply came in and suceeded with the more conventional method of preaching. :)

[mph4ever]

What does that matter at all?

i thought you were a supporter of it

Yes, that time.

england were just worried that they had a catholic country outside of them that could be used against them. the only thing that really made them hurry was the massive oak forests which they needed to take to the high seas and fight the spanish

Or, they took it plenty serious and there was just no ruling governmental structure to keep treaties, transmit orders, etc. through. This is probably the reason the English always denounced the Irish as "wild" and "uncivilized" because they wouldn't keep treaties with their English conquerers.

nah. in the most part the irish were just too cute for the english and there was no material gain for such a long time

No just open your eyes. I gave you several instances of how the Irish were far from barbaric, uncultured tribesman.

nope, can't see it. the cultured were few and far between when it came to output

Another important thing to point out is that the Irish monks were probably the most sophisticated proselytizers of Christianity. They almost singlehandedly spread Christianity to the Alpine Slavs. The Franks tried to do that by the sword and failed, then the Irish simply came in and suceeded with the more conventional method of preaching. :)
slav children with sore holes no doubt because that is the main export of irish missions. rectal rash

[siva_chair]

i thought you were a supporter of it

It hardly matters whether it was "designed" that way or not, as the whole purpose of the example was to show polycentric law has a historical precedent. Whether it was designed or if it randomly came to be is immaterial to that purpose.

england were just worried that they had a catholic country outside of them that could be used against them. the only thing that really made them hurry was the massive oak forests which they needed to take to the high seas and fight the spanish

Ok but it still took them about 5 centuries to do it, and they must have been somewhat serious to continually waste resources on its conquest.

And actually, one of the first reasons the Irish were invaded is because they rejected the role of the Papacy and paid no tithes to Rome. The first English Pope gave Henry the II permission to invade Ireland because of this.

nah. in the most part the irish were just too cute for the english and there was no material gain for such a long time

Then why did they try for that long?

nope, can't see it. the cultured were few and far between when it came to output

Well you are going to have to dispute that with more than bare assertions, because Ireland put out quite a bit of historical records, musical contributions (hell, poets were considered a profession), and so on and so forth. I mean, you can keep claiming that it wasn't much, but you are going to have to back it up with something if you expect me give you any credence on the issue.

[gregulus]

Yes.

Hey man do you want the Feynman lectures?

Absolutely I do.

[siva_chair]

Absolutely I do.

What is your email?

[mph4ever]

It hardly matters whether it was "designed" that way or not, as the whole purpose of the example was to show polycentric law has a historical precedent. Whether it was designed or if it randomly came to be is immaterial to that purpose.

but it has no relevence since it was not designed and imposed. it evolved until it failed. the more important precedent is that it failed. its failure gives it no credit

Ok but it still took them about 5 centuries to do it, and they must have been somewhat serious to continually waste resources on its conquest.

best training ground they ever had. and when they really wanted it then they got it quick. fell out with rome, were being messed about by the spanish and had exhausted most of their own wood resources.

And actually, one of the first reasons the Irish were invaded is because they rejected the role of the Papacy and paid no tithes to Rome. The first English Pope gave Henry the II permission to invade Ireland because of this.

a penny a head - until henry 8 decided to throw his willie around half the women at court

Then why did they try for that long?

i'm not sure they tried for that long. they were preoccupied by all sorts during the years that you mentioned. hibernia was just a distraction. probably the type of bone you would throw to a dog like strongbow to chew on

Well you are going to have to dispute that with more than bare assertions, because Ireland put out quite a bit of historical records, musical contributions (hell, poets were considered a profession), and so on and so forth. I mean, you can keep claiming that it wasn't much, but you are going to have to back it up with something if you expect me give you any credence on the issue.
that romantic idea is long since gone. sure they had bunches of round towers with throw away stairs to keep the vikings out and stuff but they were few and far between. it was an outpost. an iona, if you like. they did produce some fine work which did survive but in the context of what else was happening in the world it was just an island, same as it is now, of little or no consequence, never was and never will be.

[siva_chair]

but it has no relevence since it was not designed and imposed.

Of course it has relevance what are you talking about. Besides, it was obviously designed, as it is a product of man.

it evolved until it failed. the more important precedent is that it failed. its failure gives it no credit

Lol when did it fail? Ireland was conquered and then the English conquerers established their legal system. That says nothing as to whether the Irish system "failed" due to some systematic fault.

best training ground they ever had. and when they really wanted it then they got it quick. fell out with rome, were being messed about by the spanish and had exhausted most of their own wood resources.

Yeah you don't get to just make things up and then pass them off as some sort of fact.

i'm not sure they tried for that long. they were preoccupied by all sorts during the years that you mentioned. hibernia was just a distraction. probably the type of bone you would throw to a dog like strongbow to chew on

And this bare assertion is backed up by?

that romantic idea is long since gone. sure they had bunches of round towers with throw away stairs to keep the vikings out and stuff but they were few and far between. it was an outpost. an iona, if you like. they did produce some fine work which did survive but in the context of what else was happening in the world it was just an island, same as it is now, of little or no consequence, never was and never will be.

Umm ok??

[gregulus]

What is your email?

gregulus0@gmail.com

[mph4ever]

Of course it has relevance what are you talking about. Besides, it was obviously designed, as it is a product of man.

it evolved from celtic tribalism in a forest. there was no intelligent design

Lol when did it fail? Ireland was conquered and then the English conquerers established their legal system. That says nothing as to whether the Irish system "failed" due to some systematic fault.

how can you say that a system that is conquered has not failed. it failed against a better force. it failed to protect its identity, its culture, its people, its resources, it failed.

Yeah you don't get to just make things up and then pass them off as some sort of fact.

which part do you consider to be fabrication?

And this bare assertion is backed up by?

it never really looked like the english made a effort. have you read the history books enough to point out the major assaults? like how well they were prepared and how they were repelled for a 1000 years. be careful not to confuse the occuptants of an island with an island nation.

Umm ok??
good, at least we agree on something

[siva_chair]

it evolved from celtic tribalism in a forest. there was no intelligent design

Umm it was designed through reason and the minds of men.

If that is the case our current law system wasn't "designed" either because it came from tradition of Anglo common law....

how can you say that a system that is conquered has not failed. it failed against a better force. it failed to protect its identity, its culture, its people, its resources, it failed.

It wasn't a failure of the legal system though. You are coming at this from a strange twisted "might makes right" kind of mentality which is quite disturbing.

which part do you consider to be fabrication?

Mainly just your interpretations that aren't really based on anything but your own fancy for storytelling.

If Ireland wasn't that important to the English, they wouldn't have spent 5 centuries conquering it. The fact is, they had a lot of trouble keeping it for the very reasons I described.

it never really looked like the english made a effort.

Oh so you were there?

have you read the history books enough to point out the major assaults? like how well they were prepared and how they were repelled for a 1000 years*. be careful not to confuse the occuptants of an island with an island nation.

*5 centuries

Off the top of my head, no I can't name the names of any of the assaults. So what? It has nothing to do with my point. Either way, regardless of whether the English put their full weight behind conquering it or not, the whole point of bringing this era in Ireland up remains. You are starting to sound like you are trying to get away from that point and go off on some other irrelevant tangent.

good, at least we agree on something

No, I just don't see at all what any of this has to do with anything, really. Whether Ireland made some huge global splash wasn't the point anyway, so I fail to see the relevance of bringing that up.

You've still yet to show how Ireland was some uncivilized, ignorant land of people.

[siva_chair]

gregulus0@gmail.com

check it.

[mph4ever]

Umm it was designed through reason and the minds of men.
[/quotes]
not with a goal. simply their own agenda. tribalism
[QUOTE=siva_chair;16994281]
If that is the case our current law system wasn't "designed" either because it came from tradition of Anglo common law....

sure it was designed for a country. people participated

It wasn't a failure of the legal system though. You are coming at this from a strange twisted "might makes right" kind of mentality which is quite disturbing.

never said it was. getting personal does not aid your cause at all

Mainly just your interpretations that aren't really based on anything but your own fancy for storytelling. if Ireland wasn't that important to the English, they wouldn't have spent 5 centuries conquering it. The fact is, they had a lot of trouble keeping it for the very reasons I described.

they didn't send five years. they did it when they wanted to. when it was important

Oh so you were there?

of course not. were you?

*5 centuries

Off the top of my head, no I can't name the names of any of the assaults. So what? It has nothing to do with my point. Either way, regardless of whether the English put their full weight behind conquering it or not, the whole point of bringing this era in Ireland up remains. You are starting to sound like you are trying to get away from that point and go off on some other irrelevant tangent.

because they never really happened, and sure it does. you say there were 500 years of assaults. i was just wondering which ones you were referring to

No, I just don't see at all what any of this has to do with anything, really. Whether Ireland made some huge global splash wasn't the point anyway, so I fail to see the relevance of bringing that up.
You've still yet to show how Ireland was some uncivilized, ignorant land of people.
never said they were. just meant that they were not the leaders of culture etc in their latin adopted western roman empire part of the world. you have yet to prove they were, among others things

[Iskandar]

What I'm interested in is how on earth medieval Ireland is at all applicable to a modern industrial society.

[Dave de Sylvia]

Yeah except she often didn't have a whole lot of choice who she was forced to be monogamous with.
Well familial pressures exist in every society. I still would have thought monogamy was far more empowering for women than limited divorce rights. Either way, both societies were heavily male-dominated.

Ok where exactly is the evidence that this was common occurrence? Everything I have read has indicated that no individual was bound to a tuath. They were free to, and often did, secede from a tuath and join a competing one.
Does it need to be a common occurrence? It was enshrined in law. There are very few factual records from the time we can actually refer to. What we can do is read between the lines. Outsiders had no rights (not even to life) except when they came from a tuath with which a treaty had been signed. Furthermore, the standard legal unit in early Irish law was not the individual, but the extended family: if a person was to leave to find another tuath, they were essentially walking out on their family, unless it was to marry somebody from a friendly tuath. I mean, mobility surely existed, but it was far more restricted than you're letting on.

What? The Brehons drew from from a body of ancient custom (Much like English common law was, etc). The Brehons had no connection whatsoever with individual tuaths. They were basically arbiters. This is a contrast to the system the English imposed, as the judges were basically political hacks (much like they can be today).
Well the English were bastards. But Brehon Law was designed so that those with higher status (aka authority) were given legal precedence over their underlings. Their testimony was automatically preferred in legal disputes and they received higher compensation for a crime committed against them.

Actually there is, as they were drawn from the reasoning abilities of men, not some divine authority like a king.
So were lots of laws- so what? I'm saying there is no comparison to be made between the natural rights of Locke and Paine and the natural rights of the Brehons.

So I'm not allowed to bring it up when it is indeed a working example of stateless law?
No, but you need to actually prove its relevance in modern society. I mean I know you brought it up in response to somebody saying there would be no laws in a polycentric society, but that person was probably an idiot and didn't deserve to be argued with. I'm just struggling to see how medieval Ireland supports anarchsism in the modern world apart from to say anarchism didn't bring an end to the world.

It served the Irish for about a thousand years and they didn't descend into some primitive barbarism and slaughter each other wholesale like the rest of Feudal Europe seemed to want to do at the time
Of course they did, Irish history is as savage as that of any other country. Henry VIII's completion of the conquest in the 1500s is one of the best things ever to happen to this country, precisely because it rescued us from civil war and barbarism.

Oh so that is why centrally planned economies tend to fail?
Oh come on, you know this point is fallacious.

There are huge advantages to be gained from pooling knowledge and resources. It doesn't imply crude collectivism.

Of course they had a significant intellectual class. They had scholars that preserved Greek and Roman writings (without which a good portion of the Renaissance probably wouldn't have happened)
I see you've read How The Irish Saved Civilisation.

they had professional legal scholars (which were probably more common in Ireland than anywhere else in Europe at the time), and they had plenty of poetry and literature. Compare this with the Europe that was busy being decimated by the Visigoths, Huns, Franks, Angles, Saxons, Ostrogoths, etc at the time.
Well those are all good, but what about scientists? Universities? Ireland was a nice little haven for learning amid the madness of medieval Europe, but its importance and advancements have been vastly overstated.

And? How exactly does this take away from the fact that the state is not necessary for culture and intellectualism to thrive? I've never denied that learning can take place where the state is, I have denied that it cannot develop without the state.
Well you said a change in learning only occurred with the free trade/Italian renaissance thingie. I'm saying there existed many "renaissances" during the middle ages, including the entirely state-sponsored Carolingian renaissance.

[mph4ever]

What I'm interested in is how on earth medieval Ireland is at all applicable to a modern industrial society.

its not but that doesn't seem to make any difference again

[siva_chair]

What I'm interested in is how on earth medieval Ireland is at all applicable to a modern industrial society.

What about modern industrial society prohibits polycentric law?

Remember, I only brought it up in response to the assertion that legal orders require a state. I shouldn't have even bothered to bring it up, because the assumption that something must have existed or functioned in the past in order for it to exist or function in the present or future is fallacious anyhow.

not with a goal. simply their own agenda. tribalism

And this differs from anything else, how?

I'm failing to see how you are levying this as a criticism against polycentric legal systems.

I guess all of Anglo common law (which most of our ideas of law originally come from) is tribalism...

sure it was designed for a country. people participated

The Irish system came about the same way, though. So what exactly is your point here?

And Anglo common law didn't come about through the state originally either.

never said it was.

You certainly implied it. You said that because the Irish eventually were conquered, it was a failure, which is rather silly, as they weren't conquered due to some sort of fault in their legal system.

getting personal does not aid your cause at all

It wasn't intended to be personal, but it is rather disturbing that you would equate the "right" way with the side that happened to win through coercive violence.

they didn't send five years. they did it when they wanted to. when it was important

They kept trying, and failing, pretty consistently, though.

of course not. were you?

Nope, just wondering if you observed the whole thing as you seem to be able to assert the exact psychology and reasoning of the British during this time period so I figured I'd ask.

because they never really happened, and sure it does. you say there were 500 years of assaults. i was just wondering which ones you were referring to

Of course they happened. Read a history book. The fact that I can't name each English assault by name doesn't mean they didn't happen, it just means I don't know the specific names of the assaults.

never said they were. just meant that they were not the leaders of culture etc in their latin adopted western roman empire part of the world. you have yet to prove they were, among others things

Well, their scholarly output rivaled anyone else at the time (and surpassed most), they were masters at metallurgy, their cultural output (art, music, poetry, etc) was plentiful, their legal system was complex and very "progressive" for the time, etc. I'd say that qualifies them as one of the "leaders" of that time period.

Well familial pressures exist in every society. I still would have thought monogamy was far more empowering for women than limited divorce rights. Either way, both societies were heavily male-dominated.

Well there was scarcely a society that was not heavily male-dominated at the time, so I hardly see that as a valid comparative criticism.

Does it need to be a common occurrence? It was enshrined in law.

What was enshrined in law? That they would kill you if you left the tuath? This is counter to everything I have ever seen on the subject. Tuaths were very much voluntary associations. You were free to go join another tuath as you willed, you were not bound by heritage or anything to any of them.

There are very few factual records from the time we can actually refer to. What we can do is read between the lines. Outsiders had no rights (not even to life) except when they came from a tuath with which a treaty had been signed. Furthermore, the standard legal unit in early Irish law was not the individual, but the extended family: if a person was to leave to find another tuath, they were essentially walking out on their family, unless it was to marry somebody from a friendly tuath. I mean, mobility surely existed, but it was far more restricted than you're letting on.

Actually, the standard legal unit was the freeman, or anyone who owned land. This is hardly unique to Ireland, considering the time period.

The important distinction here is that the tuath were voluntarily associations which only comprised the sum total of the properties of it's voluntary members as opposed to the state, which is not voluntary, and holds claim of a territorial area separate from the property rights of it's subjects.

Well the English were bastards. But Brehon Law was designed so that those with higher status (aka authority) were given legal precedence over their underlings. Their testimony was automatically preferred in legal disputes and they received higher compensation for a crime committed against them.

As opposed to English law, where the royalty was essentially untouchable by the law until after the 17th century? At least under the Irish system, the "kings" were actually able to be sued. This was pretty unique given the time period.

So were lots of laws- so what? I'm saying there is no comparison to be made between the natural rights of Locke and Paine and the natural rights of the Brehons.

Never did I say they were identical, but that wasn't the point. The point is that they were not derived from some "divine" authority like a king, but from the application of law passed down through the generations to each circumstance.

No, but you need to actually prove its relevance in modern society. I mean I know you brought it up in response to somebody saying there would be no laws in a polycentric society, but that person was probably an idiot and didn't deserve to be argued with. I'm just struggling to see how medieval Ireland supports anarchsism in the modern world apart from to say anarchism didn't bring an end to the world.

Well since my point was never to argue that the Brehon system should be implemented as is in today's society, I fail to see why I even need to "prove" anything. The point was to point to a specific case study with regard to demonstrating the effectiveness of a decentralized and polycentric legal system, not to defend every aspect of it.

I could easily get into a discussion about possibilities of a modern day polycentric legal order, but that wasn't why the Brehon system was even brought up.

Of course they did, Irish history is as savage as that of any other country.

I disagree. They certainly didn't have the huge and wasteful wars to the degree that devastated mainland Europe at the time. Sure, they weren't some peaceful hippie utopia, but everything must be taken in context.

Henry VIII's completion of the conquest in the 1500s is one of the best things ever to happen to this country, precisely because it rescued us from civil war and barbarism.

Well the completion of conquest didn't occur until the 1600's. Regardless, this has very little to do with what I have said concerning Ireland's scholastic and cultural output.

Oh come on, you know this point is fallacious.

There are huge advantages to be gained from pooling knowledge and resources. It doesn't imply crude collectivism.

No, but individuals tend to voluntarily pool knowledge and resources when it is to their advantage. Forced collectivism suffers from the same economic calculation problems that centralized economies and even monopolies suffer from.

Decentralized economic activity doesn't imply the absence of the pooling of knowledge and resources. In fact, I'd say in encourages it in a more efficient manner.

I see you've read How The Irish Saved Civilisation.

Actually, I've not, though I was curious about it. Have you read it?

Well those are all good, but what about scientists? Universities? Ireland was a nice little haven for learning amid the madness of medieval Europe, but its importance and advancements have been vastly overstated.

Overstated in comparison to what exactly?

Well you said a change in learning only occurred with the free trade/Italian renaissance thingie. I'm saying there existed many "renaissances" during the middle ages, including the entirely state-sponsored Carolingian renaissance.

No, I did not say it only occurred there, I said it was the center of the largest one, and it was spawned primarily by the vast economic freedoms they enjoyed in that area. Not to mention the whole free trade thing spread it to most of the rest of Europe.

The whole point is that culture isn't a product solely of the state, and can develop and flourish in the absence of it's interventions.

[mph4ever]

And this differs from anything else, how?

I'm failing to see how you are levying this as a criticism against polycentric legal systems.

I guess all of Anglo common law (which most of our ideas of law originally come from) is tribalism...

once again you put words in my mouth. i'm not against a polycentric legal system. you are just not making a supporting argument

The Irish system came about the same way, though. So what exactly is your point here?

And Anglo common law didn't come about through the state originally either.

stop. keep it in context. the irish system evolved through people overcoming the challenges presented by the environment. when people came and tried to impose their system upon them then they fought back and failed once the first serious assault was made. cromwell fits in with pol pot, stalin, hitler, blair, churchill, the mongolian, and the like. thats the problem with these systems. there is no collective opposition to an alternative. people can be persuaded through coruption all the time.

You certainly implied it. You said that because the Irish eventually were conquered, it was a failure, which is rather silly, as they weren't conquered due to some sort of fault in their legal system.

never, they were not the irish that were conquered. the irish are the non oppressed people you associate with there now. the tribes were conquered, one by one, either through war or corruption.

It wasn't intended to be personal, but it is rather disturbing that you would equate the "right" way with the side that happened to win through coercive violence.

who won through with violence?

They kept trying, and failing, pretty consistently, though.

sure, without determination

Nope, just wondering if you observed the whole thing as you seem to be able to assert the exact psychology and reasoning of the British during this time period so I figured I'd ask.

no. wasn't there. but all historians base their interpretation on not being there. who says they're right?

Of course they happened. Read a history book. The fact that I can't name each English assault by name doesn't mean they didn't happen, it just means I don't know the specific names of the assaults.

you might if they were named after omaha or places like that

Well, their scholarly output rivaled anyone else at the time (and surpassed most), they were masters at metallurgy, their cultural output (art, music, poetry, etc) was plentiful, their legal system was complex and very "progressive" for the time, etc. I'd say that qualifies them as one of the "leaders" of that time period.

what significant events did they influence exactly

[Already_Taken]

oh wow siva im not the only one claiming Ireland was in CIVIL WAR during the middle ages.

obviously their anarchy failed in the long run and led to what all of the sane people on this board claim anarchy will inevitably lead to because of human nature.

[mph4ever]

i hate human nature

[Hababi]

I finished a screenplay :D

Well actually there's one more scene I have to write, but I have almost all of it written. It'll be around 110 pages.

So happy new year everyone. No I'm not going to be posting regularly.

[Mr. Ron]

what is the screenplay about

[thedeadwalk!]

Hababi, how do you come up with scenes? Like, I think I'm pretty good coming up with the big picture, but when it comes down to the journey I'm at a loss.

Maybe I just need to actually sit down and think through my characters and such, but some advice would certainly be appreciated.

[Pop music sucks]

I finished a screenplay :D

Well actually there's one more scene I have to write, but I have almost all of it written. It'll be around 110 pages.

So happy new year everyone. No I'm not going to be posting regularly.Geez Steve, I haven't even written 10 pages of my book idea:(

glad to see someone finished what they started:thumb:

[Already_Taken]

I finished a screenplay :D

Well actually there's one more scene I have to write, but I have almost all of it written. It'll be around 110 pages.

So happy new year everyone. No I'm not going to be posting regularly.

you're way more entertaining than siva please come back

[Aaron]

what is the screenplay about

Jews, obviously.

[Knifeboy]

I finished a screenplay :D

Well actually there's one more scene I have to write, but I have almost all of it written. It'll be around 110 pages.

So happy new year everyone. No I'm not going to be posting regularly.

Congrats!
How long did it take you?

[Aaron]

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=mMdUBJ5votc&feature=channel

[Hababi]

what is the screenplay about

Picture Deliverance as if written by Tarintino, with characters designed by Woody Allen...only not near as good as any of the aforementioned three :p


Hababi, how do you come up with scenes? Like, I think I'm pretty good coming up with the big picture, but when it comes down to the journey I'm at a loss.

Maybe I just need to actually sit down and think through my characters and such, but some advice would certainly be appreciated.


Sometimes scene ideas come before the big idea for me. At least two ideas I have (neither of them being this current one) are based on dreams I had, so I just took that one scene and then began to base scenes around it. I'm not quite sure how I come up with the scenes themselves. A lot of the time they just naturally follow one another--x leads to y leads to z

For dialog, I have a really awkward way of doing it: Basically method dialog. I try to put myself in the scene and then speak as the characters, and write down what I get. That works out ok if I'm in my room at night, or at my computer, but the other day, I came up with one of my better scenes, which takes place in a diner, between two characters. I came up with it on the bus. So I had to make sure that I'm not actually whispering lines. Then I didn't write down the scene until later that evening, so it wasn't as good :(

Generally, the first time I envision a scene is the best in terms of the dialog. Nice and fresh and natural. When I go over scenes multiple times in my head, things get lost, more forced, artificial.


Geez Steve, I haven't even written 10 pages of my book idea

glad to see someone finished what they started


Don't feel bad, screenplay writing is easier than bookwriting. I tried starting the book version of it and got 4 pages in, then I switched to doing the screenplay.


Congrats!
How long did it take you?


Roughly 5 days of actual writing. It's an idea that I've had in my head since we were stopped for a speeding ticket in West Virginia a year and a half ago.

And ty folks for the congrats :D

[Dr Hooch]

so when can we read it

[siva_chair]

once again you put words in my mouth. i'm not against a polycentric legal system. you are just not making a supporting argument

You said that it failed.

And what argument exactly am I supposed to be making here? We were talking about examples of polycentric legal orders in history, thus the reason I even brought up the issue.

stop. keep it in context. the irish system evolved through people overcoming the challenges presented by the environment.

That is the way all legal systems came to be.

when people came and tried to impose their system upon them then they fought back and failed once the first serious assault was made. cromwell fits in with pol pot, stalin, hitler, blair, churchill, the mongolian, and the like. thats the problem with these systems. there is no collective opposition to an alternative. people can be persuaded through coruption all the time.

Yeah people are dicks, so what? That doesn't mean the systems imposed by dickheads are just or right or "better" or that systems of liberty are worse.

never, they were not the irish that were conquered. the irish are the non oppressed people you associate with there now. the tribes were conquered, one by one, either through war or corruption.

By Irish I mean the people that occupied the area known as Ireland at that time. I would have thought this would have been obvious that I wasn't talking about the modern day Irish people.

who won through with violence?

In this instance, the English violently imposed their rule on the people that inhabited what is now known as Ireland, obviously.

sure, without determination

How exactly can you even begin to know this? You can assert that all you want, but there is no way of you knowing how determined they were at any given time, unless you have some personal window into the specific psychology of the leaders at that time. If you do, I'm all ears.

no. wasn't there. but all historians base their interpretation on not being there. who says they're right?

But historians don't just make bare assertions into the will or psychology of the people they are writing about unless they have evidence to infer from. Do you have King Henry's personal journals or something that you are getting these assertions from?

you might if they were named after omaha or places like that

Yeah and if they only happened 60 or so years ago.

what significant events did they influence exactly

Christianizing lots and lots of people in Europe would be pretty significant I think. Also, I'd think that preserving the Latin and Greek texts of old was pretty significant in helping usher in the Renaissance, so that's pretty important.

Indirectly, it is probably impossible to account for what they influenced.

Oh yeah, and Riverdance. :p

[Knifeboy]

Roughly 5 days of actual writing. It's an idea that I've had in my head since we were stopped for a speeding ticket in West Virginia a year and a half ago.


Very cool that you managed to put it to paper so fast.. So you gonna send the script to a billion people that will all ignore it or do you have a better plan?

[YDtoad]

Very cool that you managed to put it to paper so fast.. So you gonna send the script to a billion people that will all ignore it or do you have a better plan?

I haven't gotten to the stage of actually developing a plan yet. Right now I'm still fleshing out the final scene. Then I'll go back and try to catch all the glaring structural errors in the script (the dialog is mostly there but because I was rushing to get the dialog down, the rest of the writing is lackluster to say the least). Then I'll play the Powerball and dream of winning it and financing the film (I'm not well versed on production costs, but because I include a few medium-level action scenes, my guess is the production costs would run around $15 million. Which happens to be $15 million more than I currently have).


so when can we read it


Sometime :p

[beso negro]

here are some links that might be helpful steve

http://www.writing.org/html/a_screenplay.htm
http://www.askmen.com/money/how_to_150/167_how_to.html

hope this helps good luck

[beso negro]

so when can we read it

he has to register it first otherwise we could steal it

[Bruce E Kinesis]

he has to register it first otherwise we could steal it

Morelike "he can't show us, we'd mock"

[Pop music sucks]

I haven't gotten to the stage of actually developing a plan yet. Right now I'm still fleshing out the final scene. Then I'll go back and try to catch all the glaring structural errors in the script (the dialog is mostly there but because I was rushing to get the dialog down, the rest of the writing is lackluster to say the least). Then I'll play the Powerball and dream of winning it and financing the film (I'm not well versed on production costs, but because I include a few medium-level action scenes, my guess is the production costs would run around $15 million. Which happens to be $15 million more than I currently have).



Sometime :pI'd love to read your rough screenplay, Steve.

[PerpetualBurn]

I daren't mock Steve on this because I suspect he might be very talented and it might end up as a very successful film and then I'd look stupid.



But not really.

[Hababi]

I'd love to read your rough screenplay, Steve.

Are you on AIM? IM me (funnel clouds), or supply an email :)


here are some links that might be helpful steve

http://www.writing.org/html/a_screenplay.htm
http://www.askmen.com/money/how_to_150/167_how_to.html

hope this helps good luck


Thanks for the links.

[Pop music sucks]

Heheh, I have an alt e-mail account that I have incase other people decide to **** with it. So bare with the name, since it came about after watching Clerks 2.

pussytroll@hotmail.com

And in return, I'll send you the rough draft of, whenever it gets completed, my book idea:)

[Hababi]

Heheh, I have an alt e-mail account that I have incase other people decide to **** with it. So bare with the name, since it came about after watching Clerks 2.

pussytroll@hotmail.com

And in return, I'll send you the rough draft of, whenever it gets completed, my book idea:)

Sweet, I shall await it. It should be in your inbox now.

[Pop music sucks]

lol, don't be expecting it anytime soon, though. Considering all the plot points I have plotted, it will take the better part of the year to complete it:(

and don't worry about me stealing your screenplay, it would just not feel right to me.

I'm reading the very first few minutes of the screenplay. The premise is intriguing, and I'm curious as to where it takes me. I do like the interspersal and recounting of Gary's predicament to Dexter, and the subsequent proposal he thinks of.

[Hababi]

lol, don't be expecting it anytime soon, though. Considering all the plot points I have plotted, it will take the better part of the year to complete it:(

and don't worry about me stealing your screenplay, it would just not feel right to me.

Oh don't worry you're the person I'd least be wary of in terms of potential theft ;)

EDIT: Crap you already have review stuff up. Niiice :D

[Pop music sucks]

It seems as though you have the dialogue already planned, but it feels natural, organic. There's just a few very minor changes to make, in a sense to make the wording sound a little more fluid. Like "closetly gay?" would sound better if he said "...you think I'm in the closet?"

I'll be reading through the rest of your screenplay later on today when I go to bed.

Which should be now:p

[Bruce E Kinesis]

steve if i were you

and i'm not

i would leave gays and israelis out of your creative works

[Pop music sucks]

Given the dialogue, I say it was amusing.

I must say this, I do enjoy the scathing observations and retort of Dex.

[Hababi]

Given the dialogue, I say it was amusing.

I must say this, I do enjoy the scathing observations and retort of Dex.

yay :D

[Murdererer]

yo momma got dick drama

[McP3000]

**** why wont i go to bed

[Pop music sucks]

yay :DI did enjoy your screenplay. The convoluted transpirings as the story reaches its apex did not feel murky and tacked on. Everything is resolved that should be resolved. Kudos to an ending that isn't a cop-out (zing!), Steve. There is some memorable imagery at key moments.

However, there are some minor clerical errors (missing letters, minor spelling mistakes), of itself, are easy to fix.

[Hababi]

I did enjoy your screenplay. The convoluted transpirings as the story reaches its apex did not feel murky and tacked on. Everything is resolved that should be resolved. Kudos to an ending that isn't a cop-out (zing!), Steve. There is some memorable imagery at key moments.

However, there are some minor clerical errors (missing letters, minor spelling mistakes), of itself, are easy to fix.

Yeah, I caught some of those after I sent you it. So the most glaring ones have been corrected. And I'm glad you felt the ending wasn't a cop-out; that's exactly what I was going for :D

Did you get a good enough sense of the individual characters?

[Pop music sucks]

I'm going to try and tell you from what only you or I know, since I want to try and keep it between the two of us.

I think I gravitated towards Dex the most, because although he tends to voice his indignation, I at least think of the same retorts and keep mine quiet:p

The gathering and stipulation of what will happen established D, G, and A pretty well. At the moment that A tries to convince B to join in, B doesn't sound fully developed. Which is fine because as the story progresses, so does her development, as she is not the initial character we are meeted with at first. The hook/line/sinker bar scene was also effective in further exploration of A. B really takes off once the **** hits the fan.

There was only one scene that didn't sound completely logical. Between K and G. Baiting with a shirt and running across the road would cause him to be shot 2 seconds later by K. So I would suggest, since G does have a gun, try and make G desperate, like misses his shots, or grazes K long enough for G to finish the scene.

Other than that suggestion, it was all fine. You don't have to change it to something like that, it is, afterall, a suggestion:p

[YDtoad]

I'm going to try and tell you from what only you or I know, since I want to try and keep it between the two of us.

I think I gravitated towards Dex the most, because although he tends to voice his indignation, I at least think of the same retorts and keep mine quiet:p

The gathering and stipulation of what will happen established D, G, and A pretty well. At the moment that A tries to convince B to join in, B doesn't sound fully developed. Which is fine because as the story progresses, so does her development, as she is not the initial character we are meeted with at first. The hook/line/sinker bar scene was also effective in further exploration of A. B really takes off once the **** hits the fan.

There was only one scene that didn't sound completely logical. Between K and G. Baiting with a shirt and running across the road would cause him to be shot 2 seconds later by K. So I would suggest, since G does have a gun, try and make G desperate, like misses his shots, or grazes K long enough for G to finish the scene.

Other than that suggestion, it was all fine. You don't have to change it to something like that, it is, afterall, a suggestion:p

That's a really good suggestion, actually. So was the line rewrite, btw. TYVM. So, I'll be reworking that scene a little bit later on today. If you have any other suggestions or reactions, please please please let me know, you could email them to me alternatively.

:thumb:

[Pop music sucks]

Righty-o, Steve.

Anything I think of, I will e-mail it to you

:thumb:

I e-mailed you a futher detailed suggestion with that showdown.

I'm going to peruse through the screenplay again tomorrow, seeing if find anymore reactions or suggestions.

[Mr. Ron]

Devil's advocate question:


If there is no ultimate meaning to life, but we give our own lives individual meaning, does that individual meaning really mean anything with an overarching meaningless universe?

[Knifeboy]

not to anyone else no

[Iskandar]

Devil's advocate question:


If there is no ultimate meaning to life, but we give our own lives individual meaning, does that individual meaning really mean anything with an overarching meaningless universe?It means something to people. It has no objective meaning though.

And this is a devil's advocate? I thought you'd be totally into existentialism because it's grvm trve cvlt.

[Mr. Ron]

well no, I do think there is no objective meaning to the universe, but I saw this question today and wondered about it. Does the universe need to have an overarching meaning for there to be subjective meaning?


I like existentialism ^__^

[Iskandar]

The answer is: nope.

I don't mind if life only means something to humans, because until we get those hyperdrives working it'll be a while before we discover anyone else out there.

[Mr. Ron]

agreed.

and one day I hope to meet a sexy Klingon

[guitrguy]

well no, I do think there is no objective meaning to the universe, but I saw this question today and wondered about it. Does the universe need to have an overarching meaning for there to be subjective meaning?


I like existentialism ^__^
this

[McP3000]

that shits intense

[(*The Noonward Race*)]

if there is no objective meaning to the universe there is no meaning for words, which what you are using to talking about "meaning". bliss is always on the tip of your mind, your mind is conscious only now and now and now etc you have complete control

i dont get what it is with people and "meaning" why dont you go experience the supreme-ity of your own existence

[guitrguy]

if there is no objective meaning to the universe there is no meaning for words, which what you are using to talking about "meaning". bliss is always on the tip of your mind, your mind is conscious only now and now and now etc you have complete control

i dont get what it is with people and "meaning" why dont you go experience the supreme-ity of your own existence
words are man made, they represent objects and human ideas. They have meaning because we give them meaning. Also keep in mind subjective does not mean arbitrary.

[Pop music sucks]

Steve, I have e-mailed you the first chapter of my book.

I hope you enjoy:thumb:

[Already_Taken]

this forum is nothing more than a god damn semantics war. everyone has too much pride to actually discuss something on the same level as someone they disagree with. fukin blowhards.

[The Stig]

Thank you for that deep observation

[mph4ever]

oxygen please

[Aaron]

We need to chill a bit, I think.

[McP3000]

im already pretty chill idk about yall

[Aaron]

Yeah, you're a good egg. Sup bro?

[gregulus]

Does the Kalam Cosmological Argument beg the question? I'm inclined to say yes.

[Bruce E Kinesis]

Premise 2: The universe began to exist.

Established how?

When the temperature was T>>10^15K we have no physics to describe that kinda temperature

you may refer to this as 'god' if you wish, but we just tend to call it 'the very early universe'.

[Aaron]

we have no physics to describe that kinda temparature
That made me smile for some reason.

[Reaganista]

wait zerokewl wrote a movie about gays

[BlackPeopleLoveMe]

reaganista i love you. come to me when i call u

[fatkidzonmopedz]

hello politics news and world issues ppl, i dont really relate to politics or news but maybe the world issues part sincei have some issues with the world lol.

[mph4ever]

obviously he doesn't realise that he is the grandson of phil the greek

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28595022/

[McP3000]

Yeah, you're a good egg. Sup bro?
a good egg?

and nm just about to go play some video games and maybe go to a party

but prolly not

[BlisteryNixon]

Premise 2: The universe began to exist.

Established how?

When the temperature was T>>10^15K we have no physics to describe that kinda temperature

Impossible.

[gregulus]

Premise 2: The universe began to exist.

Established how?

When the temperature was T>>10^15K we have no physics to describe that kinda temperature

you may refer to this as 'god' if you wish, but we just tend to call it 'the very early universe'.

I think the Kalam argument goes beyond that and is more about where the singularity that became the universe came from, etc. I just don't know what can exist that didn't begin to exist that can be called God. It seems like the whole "not begin to exist" category is just a fancy way of saying God.

[fingers mccoy]

reaganista i love you. come to me when i call u

Stop acting shady on me
And wasting time
Then you can take me on your magic carpet ride

[The Stig]

So did we decide whether or not Nixon is VF or not?

[sweboy]

Finally we have an unbiased and trustworthy alternative to wikipedia! http://www.conservapedia.com

[Iskandar]

Conservapedia is hilarious reading when you're bored.
So did we decide whether or not Nixon is VF or not?Pretty sure he is.

[The Stig]

**** when did you get the modship

dammit we're getting overrun by the conspiracy

[Iskandar]

**** when did you get the modship

dammit we're getting overrun by the conspiracyIt's a leftist conspiracy to take over the highest levels of government and turn MX into a classless utopia.

But I'll let you stick around 'cause I like you.

[The Stig]

Okay i admit i sounded a bit like VF therew

[Iskandar]

After all, who is VF, but every one of us here?

[BlisteryNixon]

After all, who is VF, but every one of us here?

Remember, VF lives inside of us all!!

[beso negro]

lol who made iskandar a mod

pls don't ban me for not being a socialist

[Iskandar]

What ever gave you the indication I'd do that?

[The Stig]

Probably my rants about how oppressive you are.

[Iskandar]

I'm oppressive? That's news to me. I thought I had gained a reputation as one of the most liberal people on here. Liberal in the broad sense of the word, not how conservative radio pundits use it.

[The Stig]

I'd think you know by now that what I say about you in that respect is usually tongue-in-cheek.

[Iskandar]

You got me.

:)

[Knifeboy]

great just what we need
a mod who takes things too seriously


;)

[The Stig]

Paul for mod '12

[big80smullet]

paul/palin 12

anyway this brought some lols. for those who think america has the greatest healthcare system
http://ucatlas.ucsc.edu/health/spend/cost_longlife75.gif

[Dave de Sylvia]

Cubans live longer because they don't have jobs!

[guitrguy]

alex, have you dropped the banhammer yet?

[Iskandar]

alex, have you dropped the banhammer yet?Nope. I closed a thread though. I plan to more or less follow in the laissez-faire tradition around here and only intervene when necessary to keep civil discussion going.

[Dave de Sylvia]

I think it would be best for everyone if you just morphed into Smokey D. He was cool.

[Iskandar]

Yeah that's pretty much how he modded.

Who made me a mod anyway? I just logged on one day and it was there.

[BlisteryNixon]

Yeah that's pretty much how he modded.

Who made me a mod anyway? I just logged on one day and it was there.

You know the subject has often been brought up about me being a mod. Funny thing most people here don't know is I was a mod at Three World Wars. For 3 days. I told them that if they made me a mod there would be an unforeseen flow of traffic come in and the site would become very successful. So they made me a mod! But then after I failed to deliver on my promise they demodded me.

[Already_Taken]

I think it would be best for everyone if you just morphed into Smokey D. He was cool.

that makes me think he's gone. is he gone?

[Dave de Sylvia]

I think he is occupied with real life/a job like I should be.
Yeah that's pretty much how he modded.

Who made me a mod anyway? I just logged on one day and it was there.
It was me.

[Iskandar]

Aw, you shouldn't have.

But now that I have it I will cling to my power to the bitter end. Power! Unlimited power!

[Dave de Sylvia]

Can you get in the mod forum? It should be the first one on the main page.

[BlisteryNixon]

Aw, you shouldn't have.

But now that I have it I will cling to my power to the bitter end. Power! Unlimited power!

The making of a mad man.

[Iskandar]

Yeha.

I expect this will be decent experience in preparation for my eventual rise to power.

[BlisteryNixon]

Yeha.

I expect this will be decent experience in preparation for my eventual rise to power.

Not if Wish has a say in the matter.

[Iskandar]

Huh?

[BlisteryNixon]

Huh?

Wish would never let that happen.

[siva_chair]

Nope. I closed a thread though. I plan to more or less follow in the laissez-faire tradition around here and only intervene when necessary to keep civil discussion going.

Wow there may be hope for you afterall. :p

[Iskandar]

Wow there may be hope for you afterall. :pI am laissez-faire. Well, to a point, beyond which it becomes counterproductive to society.

[Aaron]

a good egg?

and nm just about to go play some video games and maybe go to a party

but prolly not
A good egg is someone with a good egg on their shoulders, aka a good head on them.

[fatkidzonmopedz]

congrats to iskandar for making moderator, i just noticed

[mph4ever]

Can you get in the mod forum? It should be the first one on the main page.

they even have a gold circle lounge...so much for a classless society

and wow iskandar - thats a compliment

[StreetlightRock]

yep, definitely a good choice, 'grats dude

[Iskandar]

:):)

[spitfirejunky]

Who would have ever thought a guy named veggie would make it to the top?

[Bruce E Kinesis]

I am laissez-faire. Well, to a point, beyond which it becomes counterproductive to society.

You're free to say what you like, as long as it isn't offensive, or distasteful, or obscene, or a breach of the peace, or too loud, or if you can't find a website online that agrees, or if you read it on the internet, or if the man just doesn't ****ing like it.

[The Stig]

they even have a gold circle lounge...so much for a classless society

and wow iskandar - thats a compliment

No they don't. Mod forum is a boring place. At least it was the two days the tabmods had access. Then PimpDaddyKabZ complained and got us kicked out.

[Mr. Ron]

what happened to Smokey D?

[The Stig]

He got fired.

Get it.

Where there's Smok(ey) there's fire(d)?

[DBoons Ghost]

Grats to you Dropper! Make us proud.

[Mr. Ron]

He got fired.

Get it.

Where there's Smok(ey) there's fire(d)?
you sir, are KIDDER!





(but srsly what happened to him?)

[The Stig]

I dunno. I think he just went inactive.

[McP3000]

he's probably prancing around new zealand somewhere

[Bron-Yr-Aur]

he's with tway

[beso negro]

i hope he's ok

[mph4ever]

No they don't. Mod forum is a boring place. At least it was the two days the tabmods had access. Then PimpDaddyKabZ complained and got us kicked out.

i wouldn't be a mod ever. on the list of things to do it ranks below licking cows piss off a stinging nettle. i appreciate what they do but it would never be for me and if they need their little private places to relax and chill out then thats cool too

[siva_chair]

Guys policing an internet forum is a stressful job leave them alone.

[TheDarkHorse]

I enjoyed the days of Zero and Maveryck..mostly because they only argued with each other.

[BlisteryNixon]

I enjoyed the days of Zero and Maveryck..mostly because they only argued with each other.

Wow Maveryck. That was a freakin long time ago. I forgot all about him.

[Mr. Ron]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FABqq_jjRRo


this was disgusting.

[Bruce E Kinesis]

forget about it. There were pro palestinian rallies all over the world, most of which were individually better attended than that.

[Mr. Ron]

I just don't get how utterly illogical most of them were. They have to ask themselves the question of whether obliterating a school and vaporizing innocent people is worth getting to two guys launching an unguided rocket.

[Iskandar]

In before "z0mg it wuz teh j00z!!!1".

[spitfirejunky]

z0mg it wuz teh j00z!!!1

[Permanent Solution]

In before "z0mg it wuz teh j00z!!!1".

I thought you were better than this :(

[Iskandar]

z0mg it wuz teh j00z!!!1Omg, ur such an anti-semitic Arab.

[Mr. Ron]

if it weren't for their tasty bagels, dem jooz would get such a pinch from me!!!

[iliketoplaydrums10111]

guys, i need help asap

what are your * opinions on ayn rand?

*negative

[The Stig]

Generally positive but not perfect.

[beso negro]

her stances on pacifism and homosexuality. the only negatives I can think of.

[iliketoplaydrums10111]

coo thanks

[Der Übermensch]

guys, i need help asap

what are your * opinions on ayn rand?

*negative

a bitch

[Iskandar]

Her epistemology is terrible.

[Reaganista]

the dropper is a mod wtf

[Iskandar]

Get used to it.

[BlisteryNixon]

Get used to it.

I constantly entertain thoughts at night that maybe this was all a big joke and a week later you'll be demodded and made the laughing stock of the forum and then I, VF will be declared Judge, Jury, and Executioner of the PNWI.

[Reaganista]

dropper i did a post for them 2 unmod u

[mph4ever]

k my american friends. help me out here please

what does misunderestimated mean?

and where would you find a chopper driver?

[DBoons Ghost]

k my american friends. help me out here please

what does misunderestimated mean?

and where would you find a chopper driver?

I believe misunderestimated is a word invented by Dubya, unless I miss my mark.

I would find a chopper driver at an.. airport!

Did I get it did I did I? What'd I win?

[mph4ever]

I believe misunderestimated is a word invented by Dubya, unless I miss my mark.

I would find a chopper driver at an.. airport!

Did I get it did I did I? What'd I win?

yep, bush used it in his speech on toosday

and a chopper driver was one of those guys that bush met when he flew into new orleans

and for your success you get a six pack of beer and forty rounds of buckshot and an evening on the porch rocking chair pickin' off the young 'uns, and a pipe of the finest nepalese temple ball if'n it takes your fancy

[The Stig]

you don't pick things off with a shotgun

[mph4ever]

you don't pick things off with a shotgun

you do if they are only 6 feet away and you're full of nepalese temple ball. you pick off their head, their arms, their legs, any order you like

[The Stig]

but picking something off implies precision shots and you'd use a rifle for that

[mph4ever]

but picking something off implies precision shots and you'd use a rifle for that

yeah, and a pipe full of nepalese temple ball means no logic required /js

[Der Übermensch]

but picking something off implies precision shots and you'd use a rifle for that

Never seen competition skeet shooters I imagine?

[siva_chair]

Precision blasting. :p

[Bruce E Kinesis]

"tactical nukes"

[Pop music sucks]

what are nukes?

[Bruce E Kinesis]

nuclear bombs

bombs that rely on nuclear fission to generate a devastating amount of damage for a relatively small amount of missile

[Iscariot]

:eek: .cixelsyd flesym dekoms ev'I kniht I

[McP3000]

lol nice

[The Stig]

Never seen competition skeet shooters I imagine?

thing is since a shotgun makes a spread pattern it's not super precise

if you're in the area, you're good

But if they use slugs I guess it works.

But he wasn't talking about competitive skeet shooting anyhow.

[Iskandar]

What's that Olympic event that involves cross-country skiing and target shooting? I can't remember the name of it.

[Knifeboy]

skeeting

[Mr. Ron]

What's that Olympic event that involves cross-country skiing and target shooting? I can't remember the name of it.
biathlon

[Iskandar]

biathlonI used to love playing that on my crappy old Commodore 64. The floppy disk version from 1985 that still had East Germany and the Soviet Union. Lol.

[Mr. Ron]

lol

the sport is pretty badass though.

[Iskandar]

Well, I like snow, and I like high-powered rifles. How could I go wrong?

[McP3000]

paint the snow red with communist blood

[mph4ever]

thing is since a shotgun makes a spread pattern it's not super precise

if you're in the area, you're good

But if they use slugs I guess it works.

But he wasn't talking about competitive skeet shooting anyhow.

i suppose its really up to dboon to decide what weapon he uses

[siva_chair]

biathlon

Best winter olympic sport besides hockey.

[Already_Taken]

oh wow, i figured you'd be an ice dancing die-hard, siva

[siva_chair]

**** that ****.

Hockey and guns ftw.

[Bruce E Kinesis]

guys was i the only one back in the day that didn't realise siva was so..

american?

Like once upon a time all we'd talk about was quantum consciousness and theory of mind

am i thinking of someone else? or was some kind of change undertaken?

3 years ago i can't imagine your avatar (it was different then i think) saying the words "Hockey and Guns ftw"

it's not a bad thing

i'm just starting to doubt even myself

[siva_chair]

guys was i the only one back in the day that didn't realise siva was so..

american?

Like once upon a time all we'd talk about was quantum consciousness and theory of mind

am i thinking of someone else? or was some kind of change undertaken?

3 years ago i can't imagine your avatar (it was different then i think) saying the words "Hockey and Guns ftw"

it's not a bad thing

i'm just starting to doubt even myself

No, those subjects just haven't really been brought up for a while. I still feel relatively the same way about those things as I did then.

And I've always like hockey and guns.

[Iskandar]

What? Hockey is an American sport? Since when?

I was not informed of this. Stop monopolizing our sport, Big NHL.

[sweboy]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Good_old_days_of_ice_hockey.png

[Mr. Ron]

I always liked the look of the word "shoppe"

[guitrguy]

I goeth to the shoppe

[Already_Taken]

scarborough fair is just around ye corner. i always find time.

[Iskandar]

Are you going to Scarborough Fair?

[Bruce E Kinesis]

apparently the old english had a letter for "th" which somewhat resembled a Y

so they'd never call anything "Yee old shoppe"

but the sign would say

"Ye Olde Shoppe"

[Iskandar]

It's called thorn and it looks like this: Þ þ. So the, that would be spelled þe, þat.

In handwriting, it looked like a Y, hence the misconception.

Two other letters used were eth (Ð ð) which was used the same way as thorn, and ash (Æ æ) which was used for the vowel of cat, hat etc.

I know all this because I read Beowulf.

[BlisteryNixon]

It's called thorn and it looks like this: Þ þ. So the, that would be spelled þe, þat.

In handwriting, it looked like a Y, hence the misconception.

Two other letters used were eth (Ð ð) which was used the same way as thorn, and ash (Æ æ) which was used for the vowel of cat, hat etc.

I know all this because I read Beowulf.

Iskandar I am very excited to hear of this. I always kind of dismissed you as a tool but I must say this little history lesson was very informative.

[Iskandar]

I'm glad.

Incidentally, "ye olde shoppe" isn't pseudo Old English but rather pseudo Middle English. The layman can mostly understand Middle English, though it seems archaic, but Old English is incomprehensible without studying it first. The quintessential example of Middle English is The Canterbury Tales; the best known Old English work is Beowulf.

[BlisteryNixon]

I'm glad.

Incidentally, "ye olde shoppe" isn't pseudo Old English but rather pseudo Middle English. The layman can mostly understand Middle English, though it seems archaic, but Old English is incomprehensible without studying it first. The quintessential example of Middle English is The Canterbury Tales; the best known Old English work is Beowulf.

Middle English is a language I would like to study.

[Iskandar]

You could easily if you wanted to but there's not much point. You could read stuff from the Middle Ages and that's about it.

Besides which any intelligent person can figure it out. It's like reading Shakespeare.

[BlisteryNixon]

You could easily if you wanted to but there's not much point. You could read stuff from the Middle Ages and that's about it.

Besides which any intelligent person can figure it out. It's like reading Shakespeare.

Yeah it was a joke. Haha I fooled you! Peek-a-boo!! Oh and Shakespeare is thought of as a genius but he was really just a hack and a tool who invented most of the words he used.

[Iscariot]

Does anyone here study psychology?

And I'm not looking for college freshman whose dicks are swollen with the idea that because they've had one or two semesters of classes that they're ready to diagnose and treat.

[BlisteryNixon]

Does anyone here study psychology?

And I'm not looking for college freshman whose dicks are swollen with the idea that because they've had one or two semesters of classes that they're ready to diagnose and treat.

I am very familiar with many psychiatric conditions and would be honored to offer my services to you.

What is your question?

[mph4ever]

I am very familiar with many psychiatric conditions and would be honored to offer my services to you.

What is your question?

he said study not suffer from

[Iscariot]

I am very familiar with many psychiatric conditions and would be honored to offer my services to you.

What is your question?

You're the last person I'd ask.

[Iskandar]

Yeah it was a joke. Haha I fooled you! Peek-a-boo!! Oh and Shakespeare is thought of as a genius but he was really just a hack and a tool who invented most of the words he used.Er, okay?

[BlisteryNixon]

You're the last person I'd ask.

Go ahead and ask the question. If I have an answer I will gladly take my time to post a reply. If it is something I know nothing about, then you'll have to ask someone else. But it can't hurt to ask.

[BlisteryNixon]

he said study not suffer from

Well I am a sort of renaissance man, well versed in the sciences and literature.. et cetera. So I have quite the background necessary to help answer his pathetic elementary question.

[Iskandar]

:lol:

[BlisteryNixon]

:lol:

I admit I got a laugh out of that too. The two or three times I read it.

[mph4ever]

Well I am a sort of renaissance man, well versed in the sciences and literature.. et cetera. So I have quite the background necessary to help answer his pathetic elementary question.

but i thought you were a sufferer. everyone knows that those who suffer should not be used as a reliable source. the academics would be the only ones with sufficient knowledge to give a credible answer

[Iscariot]

I'll just go ahead and ask it and if someone who is capable of answering it can do so, then I suppose they will.

What causes a total lack of empathy? I'm not talking about the superficial, "People don't get me so I don't like anyone", lack of empathy, I'm talking about a real lack of compassion for any fellow human being.

What causes someone to hate everyone else so much that they don't even feel remorse or guilt for the smallest/biggest of infractions? What makes someone want to hurt other people?

[BlisteryNixon]

but i thought you were a sufferer. everyone knows that those who suffer should not be used as a reliable source. the academics would be the only ones with sufficient knowledge to give a credible answer

well i doubt if he would find many more qualified or experienced than i am

[mph4ever]

well i doubt if he would find many more qualified or experienced than i am

thats what i would of thought, if you want to know how the battle is going then talk to the soldiers in the front line

[Iskandar]

You guys, go to bed.

[BlisteryNixon]

thats what i would of thought, if you want to know how the battle is going then talk to the soldiers in the front line

and for someone as intelligent as you to not know the difference between "would of" and "would have"? you have a learning disability.

see how easy this is? i could be a psychiatrist easy.

[mph4ever]

and for someone as intelligent as you to not know the difference between "would of" and "would have"? you have a learning disability.

see how easy this is? i could be a psychiatrist easy.

i know but we tend to have less inclination to finish college then others

[BlisteryNixon]

i know but we tend to have less inclination to finish college then others

once again, it's "than", not "then"

i am beginning to suspect that you were born with a verbal learning disability

you might want to get that checked out before you get too old and beyond repair!

[mph4ever]

once again, it's "than", not "then"

i am beginning to suspect that you were born with a verbal learning disability

you might want to get that checked out before you get too old and beyond repair!

i am glad to see that there is actually a yank on here that gets those two and by your logic most americans were born with the difficulty. mine is just timely sarcasm

[BlisteryNixon]

i am glad to see that there is actually a yank on here that gets those two and by your logic most americans were born with the difficulty. mine is just timely sarcasm

Another thing to remember is a "nutter butter" is a tasty snack made of cracker, not to be confused with "peanut butter". Not to be confused with "nut her butter" or "nut in her butt" (although that could be an equally appetizing snack). Also for the ESL students, a nut is technically an institutionalized person, the snack you are referring to is actually a "legume". Oh, and if you want to be specific, every man has two legumes in a sack called the "scrotum" (or at least I hope they have legumes). I would also like to point out at this point that saliva is something your body produces naturally while sativa is something the earth produces naturally.

I hope I have cleared up some of your difficulties with the English language. It is hard to master, but with precise technique, it is easily accomplished.

[beso negro]

Does anyone here study psychology?

no why would anyone want to

I'll just go ahead and ask it and if someone who is capable of answering it can do so, then I suppose they will.

What causes a total lack of empathy? I'm not talking about the superficial, "People don't get me so I don't like anyone", lack of empathy, I'm talking about a real lack of compassion for any fellow human being.

What causes someone to hate everyone else so much that they don't even feel remorse or guilt for the smallest/biggest of infractions? What makes someone want to hurt other people?

i believe that people aren't born without empathy. murderers have empathy, just maybe not at the time they kill someone. you lose your sense of empathy when you stop thinking. something or someone pisses you off and you react instead of stopping and thinking about it. i believe they all feel remorse afterward but maybe try to hide it. just my opinion.

next question pls

[Iskandar]

People don't have empathy. Selfishness is empathy. Ron Paul 08.

[Bruce E Kinesis]

speed=emotion

[siva_chair]

What? Hockey is an American sport? Since when?

I was not informed of this. Stop monopolizing our sport, Big NHL.

I dunno Canada is part of North America. :p

I'll just go ahead and ask it and if someone who is capable of answering it can do so, then I suppose they will.

What causes a total lack of empathy? I'm not talking about the superficial, "People don't get me so I don't like anyone", lack of empathy, I'm talking about a real lack of compassion for any fellow human being.

What causes someone to hate everyone else so much that they don't even feel remorse or guilt for the smallest/biggest of infractions? What makes someone want to hurt other people?

Could be a few things. Could be NPD, or could be Schizoid or Schizotypal disorders.

[Knifeboy]

speed=emotion

fat=motion

[Mr. Ron]

motion=commotion

[mph4ever]

**** you

nice, real classy

speed=emotion

is this related to crying the next day?

[Knifeboy]

guess you guys never frequented the guitar forum

[mph4ever]

guess you guys never frequented the guitar forum

why?

[Bruce E Kinesis]

because it's from the guitar forum

If i was to ask you where i might get hold of 30 000 blank CDs

what might you answer

[Mr. Ron]

zee pit

[mph4ever]

because it's from the guitar forum

If i was to ask you where i might get hold of 30 000 blank CDs

what might you answer

i know a man in malaysia :rolleyes:

[Bruce E Kinesis]

i know a man in malaysia :rolleyes:

WRONG

you'd say

"Why not burn 100 and sell those first?"

and you'd get the answer

"I want the reduced prices for buying in bulk. I've had interest from the rap, metal and emo communities..."

[Knifeboy]

That **** is still funny...

[mph4ever]

WRONG

you'd say

"Why not burn 100 and sell those first?"

and you'd get the answer

"I want the reduced prices for buying in bulk. I've had interest from the rap, metal and emo communities..."

if you hung around up there, which i don't, furthest i go is punk which should be rid of emos, as a matter of fact all emos should be removable. but when you said speed i thought amphetimine and the next day is always laced with emotion, k

[Knifeboy]

someone find a link to the epic 30k thread

[Mr. Ron]

http://www.musicianforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=356604

[mph4ever]

perhap downloads have taken over

[Aaron]

lol

[Bruce E Kinesis]

getting your music downloaded 30 000 times isn't as easy as it sounds

[mph4ever]

getting your music downloaded 30 000 times isn't as easy as it sounds

it is if you get folks from emo and rap and metal communities to help

[1338 h4x0r]

That Holocaust discussion was interesting


I kidnapped Mr. Peabody and his Wayback Machine
When we got there I sold him to a Chinese restaurant

I punched every girl I saw in the face
On the way to the booth to vote for Hitler

I went back in time and voted for Hitler[x4]

I kidnapped Mr. Peabody and his Wayback Machine
When we got there I sold him to a Chinese restaurant

I punched every girl I saw in the face
On the way to the booth to vote for Hitler

I went back in time and voted for Hitler[x4]

i just voted for Adolf Hitler[x4]


BTW, I'm at UB now :wave:

[Iskandar]

The Holocaust "discussion" was about as interesting as having teeth pulled.

What's UB?

[BlisteryNixon]

The Holocaust "discussion" was about as interesting as having teeth pulled.

What's UB?

i don't like dentists they told me i needed my wisdom teeth pulled and i just left and never went back, that was two years ago

[beso negro]

university at buffalo

cs, ce, or ee?

[Chu]

EE.

Welcome back Chris.

[BlisteryNixon]

bilabial fricatives are the ****!

[Iskandar]

Cubva.

[Aaron]

Eeeeee

[1338 h4x0r]

university at buffalo

cs, ce, or ee?

None of the above.

Here's a shocker: MIS major / Chinese minor

What happened, 1338? Well STEM subjects are now a 'my time' activity. Asperger's makes it harder for me to take tests on these things plus I don't want university to ruin my interest in them.

Rest assured my interest in math and science remains keen. I just found out that Bayes' theorem can be used to revise subjective probabilities for the set of states of nature to virtually objective probabilities, even if your subjective probabilities were ***-backwards from the start. It's kind of a miracle if you think about it. :angry:/

[Mr. Ron]

0/0/

[BlisteryNixon]

None of the above.

Here's a shocker: MIS major / Chinese minor

What happened, 1338? Well STEM subjects are now a 'my time' activity. Asperger's makes it harder for me to take tests on these things plus I don't want university to ruin my interest in them.

Rest assured my interest in math and science remains keen. I just found out that Bayes' theorem can be used to revise subjective probabilities for the set of states of nature to virtually objective probabilities, even if your subjective probabilities were ***-backwards from the start. It's kind of a miracle if you think about it. :angry:/

haha you have assburgers

[The Stig]

haha so do you

[Iskandar]

Chris, what happened to going to Sweden? Kekeke.

[BlisteryNixon]

haha so do you

maybe we could put our assburgers together and make an asscow!

[The Stig]

you you'd just have an asswadofmeatslightlybiggerthanaburgermaybeanasscho psteak

[spitfirejunky]

http://www.musicianforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=356604

http://www.musicianforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8384375&postcount=89

Gold.