The Communication Involved in Free Jazz

[Eman Ruoy]

I've seen some interest in the subject of free jazz on these forums and I wanted to address this topic: the communication involved in free jazz. Now I barely know how free jazz really works. I have some ideas on the subject and I've learned a lot from live performances I've seen: "sound painting" free jazz with a conductor, Cecil Taylor's big band, etc. I wanted to see what people here know about the actual performance of the genre, and not just the names of the albums. What are the rhythmic aspects of it? The tonal or chordal structures (if any)? Any albums that are especially educational? Any books or programs that teach the subject (preferrably the performance)?

I was really interested in free jazz for a few months; I'm currently listening more to Charles Mingus and Monk more but I think once I understand the performance more I can relisten to the albums I have with a new set of ears.

I'm an avid pianist and trombonist. Perhaps on those specific instruments?

I know this is a lot to ask.



PS
Part of me writing all this is to make be feel good about myself. But I hope you guys can look past my arrogance and sincerely answer my questions. THanks!

[StrangelyBrewed13]

I dont really know what your asking. You're kinda talking about the rules of "free jazz" when the name kinda alienates them.

[just_a_girl]

I really can't explain it because I have trouble understanding it myself but I hear this book is excellent:

Free Jazz (The Roots of Jazz), by Ekkehard Jost

It really gets at the underlying "structure(s)" of free jazz, that most people incorrectly assume don't exist.

[Funky_c]

Don't quote me on this cuz i'm no expert, but recently i've started playing jazz, and i think the best way to play it is to not worry about the rules. For once, make the rules of music apply to you. Play a solo in a scale that you make up on the spot. My favorite jazz scale is basically that the whole neck is fair game..and if you hit a sour note slide it until its sweet.

For the spread rhythm? Make it up. Some of the most fun i've ever had in my life is trying to solo with chords by just dropping random fingers and seeing how it sounds. No one can argue with you, its jazz. Jazz is supposed to be so perfect that its evolved beyond musical rules (heh, at least that's what i tell myself.) The end rule of free jazz is that you just go with the flow. Look deep inside and play exactly what your feeling, and how you think it ought to sound.

Really i think that there's only 1 real rule to free jazz. And that would be that beats can't change. Unless your trippin on acid, music just doesn't sound all that hawt without a good beat. Granted you can change time whenever you feel like it, it hasta have some sort of sense to it otherwise your gonna hafta be one hell of a musician to make that sound nice and sexy.

[Eman Ruoy]

I have to disagree with you on a few points there man. I know you don't claim to be an expert, but I'll quote you anyway.

First of all, "beats can't change". One of the first things I ever noticed in free jazz was that there was no clear beat. In other words, I couldn't tap my foot to it, ever.

Second, one of the excuses I used to use, and i still use, when I mess up when I play is, "hey, it's jazz." As if jazz automatically makes it okay that i played the wrong notes. Eh....that excuse doesn't work too well in situations when you're jamming with real serious musicians. I dunno, maybe I'm misunderstanding what you ment.

The bottom line is, I know that many of you are saying, "there are no rules" but I know for a fact that there are some "guidelines" when it comes to free jazz. If there were no rules, seriously, anybody could do it. There would be no telling who was the better free jazzer, Ornette Coleman or the 4th grade saxophonist who squeaks unbearably high notes. I also know it has to do with communication and how it's really important. I saw the Cecil Taylor Big Band at Iridium Jazz Club in the city the other day and I learned so much from it; maybe it wasn't even "free jazz". Still, I have yet to really understand free jazz as a whole. So, can somebody, tell me? Come on all you jazz snobs.

[Funky_c]

Whelp, all i can say is that a wrong note at the right time is just as good as any.

[Eman Ruoy]

Whelp, all i can say is that a wrong note at the right time is just as good as any.
So basically you're saying, there are no wrong notes. Heh, I can dig that.

Even though Art Tatum said that years before.

[sexy_mexican_man]

The thing with jazz in general is that there are general ways to play it, as there is in other genres, but that you can push the limits.

Jazz evolved because of musicians who felt contricted to the current style or musicians who wanted to push the limits of what was "good." For example, swing was mainstream, and then musos began playing bebop in response. when bebop became mainstream, artists utilised free jazz to break the mould, so to speak.

Free jazz definately has its guidelines, and it takes incredible skill to master. Its not just random notes played randomly. Its sections of parts played so that dont fit at all. The piano will play a set of chords, for example, and the sax will solo with all the notes that arent in those chords.

Its difficult if youve been playing jazz where you solo within the chords for a while because it directly condradicts what youve learnt their. Thats why it was so revolutionary.

[Zappa]

I wonder how much of this question is covered by "the musicians play together often and listen well."

[Eman Ruoy]

A portion of it. I'm still confused if there is any structure to free jazz. I listen to Ornette's album, and there is definately structure there, I mean, it even has this unison melody line. When I compare that to the first take, they have their similarities. Is it just through composition? Or is it improvised?

[jazzfunkboy]

another point of free jazz is to train yourself to hear beyond chord changes/ conventional melody/ harmony. rythmecially, its just as free. you can almost never snap your finger or tap your foot to free jazz. its ameobic in reguards to time, it shifts and shapes. there is no clear tempo. you just need to be able to expand your mind beyond changes. thats basically free jazz in a nutshell. the only way to learn it is to do it.

[jazzfunkboy]

A portion of it. I'm still confused if there is any structure to free jazz. I listen to Ornette's album, and there is definately structure there, I mean, it even has this unison melody line. When I compare that to the first take, they have their similarities. Is it just through composition? Or is it improvised?

alot of free jazz will have heads before they go into striaight up improvisation. the difference is that the heads are not bound by changes. the heads are often simple little melodies that can be expanded later on. but yeah, there is structure.

[Funky_c]

Ok so i'm curious now that all these people are talking about music with no beat. Honestly i have no idea how imagine this sort of thing without it sounding like me at a jam session ending up off time, so do you think someone could post some good examples of songs without beat? (remembering that just because a song has syncapation does not mean that it doesn't have a beat)

[Zappa]

A portion of it. I'm still confused if there is any structure to free jazz. I listen to Ornette's album, and there is definately structure there, I mean, it even has this unison melody line. When I compare that to the first take, they have their similarities. Is it just through composition? Or is it improvised?

Free Jazz had a set structure for the solo/feature sections. They knew there would be that bass feature in there, etc. I'm not sure that any of the melodies were written out beforehand, though. Remember that through careful listening and getting to know one another musically, the level of singularity a group can achieve is pretty uncanny.

A lot of Ornette's records do feature "heads", as was already said. These can give a lot of context in a very short couple of phrases. The way I understand it, the music was often about creating an atmosphere—a plane of existence—in which a group may improvise collectively. The powers of suggestion are hard at work, and the way the players relate musically, physically, and emotionally all add to the cohesiveness of the recording. It's kind of like the way that great poker players can tell when someone, even a complete stranger, is bluffing.