Heel-Toe Double Bass

[HAX]

Hello, Can anyone explain how this works?
I understand its done by alternating heel-up and heel-down but I can't seem to get it so can anyone give a quick explanation on how to do it?

Thanks.

[HAX]

I BUMPED my head on a wall.

[Jezen]

^^^^
That was silly. You can damage your brain that way.












Watch Steve Smith's 'History of the US Beat'.

[crazyguy832]

You mean just standard heel-toe? To do heel-toe, imagine your foot going in a rocking motion. You hit the back of the pedal with your heel and then, immediately after, do a standard stroke with your toes.

Hence, the heel-toe.

You don't alternate anything. I can do heel-toe playing heel-up or heel-down, that doesn't really make a difference. Also, unles you have something like the Axis Longboards, heel-toe is hard with shoes on.

:thumb:

[nametaken]

I think i was trying this but there want enough leverage with the heel to make a clean hit, but ill try again.

[HAX]

Yeh, Will my heel i can't seem to get a consistent (sp?) hit.

But thanks crazyguy :)

[Jezen]

That's because you guys aren't understanding the concept of heel toe. The heel doesn't make the hit, it just acts as a stopper. It's really the ball of your foot that makes the first note, and the toes make the second.

[crazyguy832]

Yeah, BB's got it. The heel alone doesn't have much power, unless you play heel-up. And, then, you have to slide your foot up the pedal before doing the h/t (if you're playing heel-up properly, at least). You have to do the heel-toe in a fluid motion. Practicing the two steps individually doesn't really work here like it does with other techniques. Just do a slow rocking motion with your foot, and slowly speed it up.

And don't worry, HAX, it comes with time.

One neat thing that I've noticed is that it took a couple hours to get a relatively clean heel-toe with my right foot, but as soon I tried it with my left foot, it took about 30 seconds. I found that quite cool.

:chug:

[-TheGlassPrison-]

That's because you guys aren't understanding the concept of heel toe. The heel doesn't make the hit, it just acts as a stopper. It's really the ball of your foot that makes the first note, and the toes make the second.

Exactly.
How many people saw my video?

[crazyguy832]

I never did.

After I heard about the "rocking" motion with my foot, I just went and tried that and got it after a bit.

I'd like to see your vid now, though, TGP.

^_^

[Japan3gro]

http://evansdrumheads.com/EVAMultimedia.aspx?VideoID=2650

Frank Bellucci vid.

/thread

[nametaken]

http://evansdrumheads.com/EVAMultimedia.aspx?VideoID=2650

Frank Bellucci vid.

/thread

Thanks man, its alot easier to understand when someone shows you. :thumb:

[jiashen]

http://evansdrumheads.com/EVAMultimedia.aspx?VideoID=2650

Frank Bellucci vid.

/thread
This is completely off-topic, but what accent is that?

[Basement Drummer]

Check ebay there is a guy that sells a video on there about it and I think that you can just download the video after the sale. It is a relatively cheap video too, and there is some good feedback from it.
I have never seen it but am think of buying it. If you do buy it let me know if it is any good.

[Jezen]

If it's the breaksticks one, then I say it's pretty crappy.

[HAX]

Just saw the video - Thankyou very very very much ;)

[The Jolly Pakistani]

That's because you guys aren't understanding the concept of heel toe. The heel doesn't make the hit, it just acts as a stopper. It's really the ball of your foot that makes the first note, and the toes make the second.

Very right sir.

Though I must admit, I actually used to play hell and toe on the pedal. Same concept, but a hinderance (sp?) when trying to really jack up the speed.

[Josiah]

Even then most people are missing the concept.


You can make a kick drum soar with your pinky... once the beater is already moving. It just takes very little effort to keep it going. The mechanics of the pedal and the rebound off the head provide this.

Once the first note is made, all one needs to do is provide the nessicary aditional force to over come what is lost in friction/motion change in the pedal/beat.

Like dribbling a basketball, once it drops, you only need to add a little to keep it going.

Kick drum, same thing.. just different axis. Heel toe, is a fantastic method of keeping the beater moving using minimal energy.

[jcs497]

So is this technique faster, or does it just save energy? Is it useful to learn if you only have a single pedal?

[firefoxzero]

So is this technique faster, or does it just save energy? Is it useful to learn if you only have a single pedal?
It's faster and it saves energy but I find the hits are less powerful. If you have a single pedal it's useful too, especially in latin beats.

[crazyguy832]

I can actually play the same volume with heel-toe, but that's just me.

Heel-toe is good for quick doubles. Sometimes triplets, too. Of course, some people become totally friggin insane (JoJo Mayer, anyone?) and take heel-toe to an artform.

[Josiah]

So is this technique faster, or does it just save energy? Is it useful to learn if you only have a single pedal?


Non of the above.

[jcs497]

Non of the above.
I hope you're not being sarcastic, because I just went up and tried it, and I have no idea how to get it to work. So I'll put it off for a while.

[Josiah]

Nope..

It's not for playing faster, it's not for conserving energy and it's not just for single pedal.


It's just another technique to add to your toolbox for pedal playing. That's all. Nothing more, nothing less. What you do with that particular tool, or any of the tools in your box is totally up to you.

One can say though, the more tools you have at your disposal, the better you can accomplish something.

So learn, and become profecient at all of the pedal playing techniques.

[jcs497]

Nope..

It's not for playing faster, it's not for conserving energy and it's not just for single pedal.


It's just another technique to add to your toolbox for pedal playing. That's all. Nothing more, nothing less. What you do with that particular tool, or any of the tools in your box is totally up to you.

One can say though, the more tools you have at your disposal, the better you can accomplish something.

So learn, and become profecient at all of the pedal playing techniques.
Christ man, way to confuse me... :upset:

I guess I'll figure it out sometime, but not now.

[Everything_and_Nothing_3:15]

http://www.pearldrummersforum.com/showthread.php?t=100222&highlight=heel+technique
Here's another heel toe vid, execpt with double stroke rolls with the bass drum. It's really easy, it took me a few minutes to get it going, and now I can do doubles with my feet around 220 max, but I don't like playing doubles like that. I'm taking the longer route and just learning striaght heel up doubles like Virg. It's taking alot longer but It'll be worth it.

[crazyguy832]

Josiah's right.

All heel-toe is, really, a means to an end. Yes, you can play faster with it, BUT, over time, your open roll will reach the same point (unless, of course, you're like JoJo Mayer).

It's good to know as much as possible, though. But remember... if you know 7000 techniques, and another drummer knows 10, are you better? No.

It's all in how you utalize the technique(s).