Dream Theater

[MAthiAS]

Also, anyone who has JP's Suspended Animation: Am I the only one who wishes he would put that music towards Dream Theater? :(
Jaws of Life has one of the best opening riffs (As does Tunnel Vision), in my opinion, it would work great with Dream Theater, I dunno, I just wish they would do another Glass Prison.
I should be getting a copy from a friend in a week... so I'll see.

[Chu]

The Glass Prison = best DT song I've ever heard.
I first put that on, and i was like...this is pretty cool. Then about 7 minutes through, i was like...ok, this is still good, but starting to bore me.

Then they have the solo thing towards the end, and i was like...holy crap. This guy can solo.
I really love the work at 1:44 to 2:54 (Drums especially! That's the best display of drum discipline in my opinion). But I also reckon it's one of the songs James doesn't sound like a ***** on, I actually like his vocal work on TGP quite a bit.

Even thought it's ~14:00 it's one of my most listenned to songs. I think it's great :)

[progdrumman]

Is it me or does track 4 on Octavarium have a chorus like some U2 song?

Hehe... i thought the same thing man!!!

Yea, octovarium bored me a bit...i was expecting something much heavier like train of thought... they kinda backed off a bit into "falling into infinity territory". Train of thought was their best album as a whole by far.

[Deth]

You have to admit though, the song Octavarium rules beyond belief.

[The Stapler]

Everytime I get to the part in the title track that starts with "Innocent victims..." I get goosebumps. I love LaBrie's Mustaineish vocals there.

[MAthiAS]

Train of thought was their best album as a whole by far.
Definitely not.
You have to admit though, the song Octavarium rules beyond belief.
Yeah, its a great song. I still prefer A Change of Seasons though. But its the best on the album.

[Magicaltroll]

Definitely not.
What would you say is their best?
I would say Train Of Thought... Or Scenes From A Memory.
But thats just me.

[Mizar]

I just wish they would do another Glass Prison.
This Dying Soul, The Root of All Evil..... :p

Best DT album is by far Awake.
Reasons: Scarred and A Mind Beside Itself

[ThePatient]

I'll take Scenes From A Memory as the best, but A Change of Seasons is definetly my favorite song.

[iceman3019]

i'd say images and words is better than awake. images and words had a ton of progressive elements in it, while awake just kicked *** and was heavy . . .

[Chu]

This Dying Soul, The Root of All Evil.....
I haven't heard Octavarium yet, so I'm not too sure :p
I might go pick it up today actually.

Edit: I haven't heard Awake either.. But based off what I have heard (Images & Words, Scenes, SDOIT, ToT and ACOS) my favourite is SDOIT for The Glass Prison, and of course Disc 2, but Images & Words is definately one of their best, even if it's not so heavy, I still think it's an amazing album.

Edit2: Yeah I bought Octavarium, meh there's one or two tracks I don't mind, but the majority is a bit iffy, I've only given it a brief listen through once though, so my opinion will change. But seriously there's one song where I decided Labrie should leave the band, he does them no justice (But my faith in James was restored - Towards the end of title track, when he's sort of yelling I guess. I like it).

[red barchetta]

i just got octavarium and an evening with john petrucci/jordan ruddess from amazon today. they are both amazing.

octavarium really is a fantastic track

[MAthiAS]

I'm starting to think that the AA songs are just an excuse that one song per album, they don't have to write any new riffs.

[Mizar]

i'd say images and words is better than awake. images and words had a ton of progressive elements in it, while awake just kicked *** and was heavy . . .

Awake had a lot of balance on it which I enjoy and what puts it up over I&W slightly. It's weird because at first I listened to Awake and then hated it and threw it to the corner. A month or so later I picked it back up again and loved it.Octavarium had a simliar effect on me, it was alright when I listened to it the first time, and every other listen it got a lot better as I found something else great about it. There are a lot of great hidden "nuggets" in the album, and there is a great discussion on it at the Portnoy forums that I've been following.
For anybody who didn't like 8vm on their first listen, don't just throw it away as garbage, listen to it a few more times to get a full opinion on it. When it clicks with you, it becomes a great album.

[RiceMonster]

I finally got Octavarium yesterday. I'm very impressed with it. it's a lot better then I thought it would be.

[Chu]

Someone review Awake just here for me? :)
It's one of the only Dream Theater albums I don't have, so wondering if I should get it? :)

[jpshortstuff]

Someone review Awake just here for me? :)
It's one of the only Dream Theater albums I don't have, so wondering if I should get it? :)

http://www.sputnikmusic.com/album.php?albumid=1500

[TheBlackAcidChildren]

I finally got Octavarium yesterday. I'm very impressed with it. it's a lot better then I thought it would be.
123. At first I was a little sceptical because they put half of This Dying Soul into The Root Of All Evil, so I thought it was just going to be a re-hash of Train Of Thought (like Train Of Thought was of Six Degrees) but I was very pleased with having bought it. It's a great album.

[nowitzki]

Here's probably the explanation for the Muse influences coming through in Octavarium (From MikePortnoy.com):

Favorite CD's of 2004:

1. Muse - Absolution (technically this is a 2003 release - but it is hands down my favorite CD of the year and probably the decade as well!)

[Gusfmm]

Someone review Awake just here for me? :)
It's one of the only Dream Theater albums I don't have, so wondering if I should get it? :)
To me, the real ground-breaking music that DT was able to create and delight the world with (actually making progressive music sort of revive) was realized in two recordings: Images & Words, and Awake. Both kick *** big time over anything else. Bottom line. No nu-metal or techno-chuncky type of crappy influences. That was the REAL THING.

So if you don't have Awake, you are missing half of that. IT IS A MUST for anybody into real quality and progressive music. I wish Moore had never left... things have never been the same.......

[MAthiAS]

Someone review Awake just here for me? :)
It's one of the only Dream Theater albums I don't have, so wondering if I should get it? :)
Get it, you won't be disappointed. Its their best work along with Images...

[YouGottaBeCrazy]

This is a bit of a different question, but: what is everyone's least favorite song on Awake? Give a reason too. Actually, if you want, you can do any album, but I'm just curious about Awake right now. I would say my least favorites are Innocent Faded just because I think it has a really lame chorus and even though there are a couple cool parts in there, it's just not that great. I'm also not a big fan of Erotomania. Most DT fans seem to love it, but it just doesn't appeal to me I guess. It's too bland maybe. I pretty much love the rest of the album though. It's **** good.

[MAthiAS]

I'd say Voices or Erotomania, I just find them to drag. The other songs are all perfect though IMO.

[Lord Abortion]

Mike has said that there will be a Manchester date, to be announced soon.
Oh thank god, slightly closer but still a distance for me to go

NP - in the name of god

need to bloody get octavarium!

[clearvision]

I hate caught in a web, it just grates on me.

[Silent Death]

Ok, I have never really listend to Dream Theater much, I have only heard a few songs off the new album and I didn't really like it. Is all their stuff like that or is their older stuff different?

[MAthiAS]

Ok, I have never really listend to Dream Theater much, I have only heard a few songs off the new album and I didn't really like it. Is all their stuff like that or is their older stuff different?
Images and Words is very different, its much more progressive. After that, its often in the same style, but just better.
I hate caught in a web, it just grates on me.
Not really a fan of the chorus, but other than that I love that song.

[Lord Abortion]

images and words owns all IMO

[Biancazzurri]

Awake owns all

[juggalotricksta]

NEED ADVICE:


I ordered Suspended Animation on 05/18. Its now 06/18 and my order status still says "pending." Does this mean my order has been lost in translation? If so, how should I take care of that? I have already emailed Sound Mind Music and the DT website a number of times, but no response. There is no phone number, so I cant call. I'm wondering if I should just keep waiting, or if there is a way to cancel and reorder, could someone tell me how?

Anyone that owns Suspended Animation, your help would be much appreciated. I'm desperate here.

[Wish]

Pending: Awaiting conclusion or confirmation. Example: "business still pending".
It may be out of stock?

[juggalotricksta]

That would truly suck. You wouldnt happen to know how long something like that would normally take do you?

[Jack Daniels]

I'm also not a big fan of Erotomania. Most DT fans seem to love it, but it just doesn't appeal to me I guess.

Erotmania got me into dream theater, it is my all time favorit dream theater song. How can you not love that song? It has some of Petruccis greatest work ever by far IMO.

[Wish]

That would truly suck. You wouldnt happen to know how long something like that would normally take do you?
I'm not too sure, sorry. My mother ordered a book and it was 'pending' for ages.

[trev913]

I Think Panic Attack is my favorite song on Octavarium.

And Erotomania (specifically the LSFNY version) is my favorite DT song of all-time, as well.

[horseypie]

does anyone else think that flight of the bumblebee by JP sucks?

[Jimi Haze]

images and words owns all IMO
1234

Any of you DT fans from England and have booked tickets for the gig in the Hammersmith Apollo on Oct 24th... I can't seem to work out what the heck is going on with it, are all the tickets seated?

[Triangle]

1234

Any of you DT fans from England and have booked tickets for the gig in the Hammersmith Apollo on Oct 24th... I can't seem to work out what the heck is going on with it, are all the tickets seated?
Yes they are all seated. Me and a few mates are going. I can't wait. :cool:

[YouGottaBeCrazy]

Erotmania got me into dream theater, it is my all time favorit dream theater song. How can you not love that song? It has some of Petruccis greatest work ever by far IMO.

Because it just isn't catchy to my ears I guess. There is some great guitar playing in that song in terms of speed, but his greatest work? The best guitar work on that album is the 2nd solo to Lie (starts off with the wah, playing slow, and than it picks up). I'm not saying I dont like Erotomania, because I do, but I still dont think it's that great. Who knows, maybe I'll change my mind next time I listen to the album.

[red barchetta]

i may have to go to hammersmith gig on my own, because none of my friends are interested in DT :(

[the2stranger]

I'm going to the gig in the heiniken music hall in the Netherlands :)

I wonder if it's a seated concert as weel, since I've never been to that music hall before.
but I don't want to be standing up for 4 hours, so a seat would be pleasant

[Steve M.]

25th > 24th ;)

Classic Albumplayed in full!! WOooo! Can't wait

[red barchetta]

i hope it's images and words. their performence of 'learning to live' on 'scenes from new york' was great, and it should make a great closer to the night

[cliff solos for all]

what album should i get

[RNR]

I just got Octavarium!


It's very good in my opinion. It's no Awake, Images and Words, or Scenes from a Memory. But it was a great listen.

[MAthiAS]

I liked 8vm better than SFAM...

[YouGottaBeCrazy]

heh, I just heard SFAM for the first time today. I liked it. Gotta listen to it a bunch more times before I form any type of opinion on it. The only thing that really stuck out to me as kinda weak was this almost R&B sounding pop song in there. It's like number 7 or 8. I thought it was quite horrendous. Maybe it just needs another listen.

[RNR]

If you're talking about Through Her Eyes, that's one of my favorites on the album :mad:

[nowitzki]

I have to say Through Her Eyes is my least favourite song on the album by some distance, but the whole album flows so perfectly you can't really skip it.

[juggalotricksta]

I liked 8vm better than SFAM...


Are you joking? I think DT will have a pretty rough time topping the musical juggernaut that is SFAM. That album has everything.

[MAthiAS]

Are you joking? I think DT will have a pretty rough time topping the musical juggernaut that is Awake. That album has everything.
Fixed.

[The JoZ]

I liked 8vm better than SFAM...

I did too.

SFAM is too many ballady light songs. 8vm mixes heavy, light, and epic.

Anyone else here think 8vm is/could be their best? I sure do.

[Tails]

If you're talking about Through Her Eyes, that's one of my favorites on the album :mad:
It's such a great song, the LSFNY intro on it with the JP and vocal solo is amazing.

I think that by classic album they mean something like Master Of Puppets rather than one of their own albums. That's what they've done on previous tours, anyway.

123. Many people on the Portnoy forum are speculating a classic 70's prog album which would be amazing. Notice this time MP said a classic album, not a classic metal album like before.

[The JoZ]

Some have speculated that DT would cover an album by Tool.

God I would love nothing more than to see that.

[Tails]

Some have speculated that DT would cover an album by Tool.

God I would love nothing more than to see that.

That would be great, I'd love to see JR incorporate some keyboards into Tool covers.

[nowitzki]

If I'm not mistaken, they have previously covered in full:

Metallica - Master of Puppets
Iron Maiden - Number of the Beast
Yes - Fragile

and they may well have covered a few others, because on the Budokan documentary Mike says whenever they play a venue 2 nights in a row they always cover an album, so this must have happened a few times.

My guess is one of the following: Rush (Farewell to Kings or 2112), Pink Floyd (DSOTM or The Wall), early Genesis (The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway). A Yes album would be awesome as well.

[MAthiAS]

Anyone else here think 8vm is/could be their best? I sure do.
Not really, Awake and Images are definitely better IMO, but after that, I could see 8vm up there. Or at least tied with 6DOIT.

[The JoZ]

Not really, Awake and Images are definitely better IMO, but after that, I could see 8vm up there. Or at least tied with 6DOIT.

Well, I am one of those who thinks I&W is overrated, so yeah.

I personally want to see them cover Aenima or Lateralus...preferably Lateralus though.

[Cain]

Well, I am one of those who thinks I&W is overrated, so yeah.

I personally want to see them cover Aenima or Lateralus...preferably Lateralus though.

Ahh, they'd tech it out. I don't think a DT cover of a Tool song would be good at all. It would only serve as a forum for Mike Portnoy: Petrucci would have a tone that wasn't muddy enough, Labrie would go into histrionics trying to emulate Maynard, and Myung would fall asleep playing the bass parts. And Rudess would be out of the band.

Just my opinion, though. :)

[The JoZ]

Ahh, they'd tech it out. I don't think a DT cover of a Tool song would be good at all. It would only serve as a forum for Mike Portnoy: Petrucci would have a tone that wasn't muddy enough, Labrie would go into histrionics trying to emulate Maynard, and Myung would fall asleep playing the bass parts. And Rudess would be out of the band.

Just my opinion, though. :)

That's the thing, I don't see that happening.

Myung was quoted as saying he actually likes Tool quite a bit, so I don't see him getting bored by the basslines. Petrucci's tone shouldn't matter, how he plays the song is what matters. I quite prefer his tone to Adam's anyway. I think it'd actually be a challenge for Mike, because I truely believe Danny is a better drummer. I think Jordan could find a way to weave keys behind the songs, I've always thought it might be cool to have keys in Tool. Sadly, I think James would be sorely out of place singing Tool, but oh well.

[MAthiAS]

And Rudess would be out of the band.
Good, Rudess needs to sit down and shut up for once.

If they covered anything I think it should be like 2112.

[Cain]

Good, Rudess needs to sit down and shut up for once.

If they covered anything I think it should be like 2112.

They need to cover more Rush. They're like musical twins.

[Cain]

That's the thing, I don't see that happening.

Myung was quoted as saying he actually likes Tool quite a bit, so I don't see him getting bored by the basslines. Petrucci's tone shouldn't matter, how he plays the song is what matters. I quite prefer his tone to Adam's anyway. I think it'd actually be a challenge for Mike, because I truely believe Danny is a better drummer. I think Jordan could find a way to weave keys behind the songs, I've always thought it might be cool to have keys in Tool. Sadly, I think James would be sorely out of place singing Tool, but oh well.

I bet Portnoy would be able to play anything Carey plays, he just would sound much stiffer and not as free and psychedelic as Carey does.

But these debates were supposed to end a long time ago. :)

[Darkness]

I have to say this...

A while ago I heard The Glass Prison and was kinda turned off by them. A little while later I heard the song again and like.. slowly became addicted to it. So I got a friend to send me "A Change in Seasons" which I thought was plane awesome. Yesterday I purchased my first album "A Train of Thought" which truly is incredible. The whole cd is outright amazing. The instrumental is pure genious, and my 2 favorites would have to be "As I Am" and "In the Name of God" which are some of the best songs I've ever heard.

Where should I go from here? (cd wise?) I know a lot of people say Images and Words is their best, but I also heard it was a softer album... anything else they have thats nice and heavy? Maybe the cd with The Glass Prison... (forgot what it was called..)

Edit: oh and DC is the better drummer. :thumb: but MP still kicks ***

[red barchetta]

I have to say this...

A while ago I heard The Glass Prison and was kinda turned off by them. A little while later I heard the song again and like.. slowly became addicted to it. So I got a friend to send me "A Change in Seasons" which I thought was plane awesome. Yesterday I purchased my first album "A Train of Thought" which truly is incredible. The whole cd is outright amazing. The instrumental is pure genious, and my 2 favorites would have to be "As I Am" and "In the Name of God" which are some of the best songs I've ever heard.

Where should I go from here? (cd wise?) I know a lot of people say Images and Words is their best, but I also heard it was a softer album... anything else they have thats nice and heavy? Maybe the cd with The Glass Prison... (forgot what it was called..)

Edit: oh and DC is the better drummer. :thumb: but MP still kicks ***
awake is a good choice. it has a good mixture of heavy and quiet songs.

awake or octavarium in my opinion for you

[YouGottaBeCrazy]

If you want a heavier DT album after Train Of Thought, I'd say Awake as well. When I got Images And Words I was really surprised by how soft it was.

Same here, except I had Images and Words first and than I got Awake next and I was surprised at how much darker and angrier Awake was.

[Chu]

I got Awake :cool:
Yeah, it's pretty good, just had a rough listen, so far Caught in a Web is the winner though.

[Zirikzigil]

I agree, Awake and Train of THought are both in the same vein. Here is an incredibly breif rundown of what you should expect

When Dream and Day Unite: Sorry, I have no opinion. don't have the CD or know anyone who does. People seem to like the Ytse Jam (Majesty spelled backwards)

Images and Words: I don't have it, but I know enough to say it's much lighter than a lot of others. I have a live recording of Metropolis Pt 1, and it is amazing.

Awake: Much heavier, but not as much as Train of Thought. It's got some epics, like Scarred, Voices, Erotomania, and Lie. This CD took me months to get used to, but I like it a lot now. Also, expect a BIG change of direction in Space Dye Vest. Kevin Moore (the keyboardist) left the band after this CD was made due to musical differences, and it is more than apparent on this song.

Falling into Infinity: Many people agree that this is DT's worst album. They say that it's too mainstream. This is because DT got a lot of pressure to make radio-friendly songs. However, they never fail to give us a good opener; New Millennium is a classic. I think DT understood that everybody hated this album foir lack of progressive-ness, so at the Live in BUdokan recording, they stuck in a monstrous (and awesome) guitar solo in Hollow Years. Also, this is the first CD with the new keyboarder, Derek Sherinian.

A Change of Seasons: This is an enigma: the first disc is a 23 minute marathon, and the second is comprised of five live recordings and some Jazz Cafe. They cover a bunch of artists like Elton John, Zeppelin, Queen, etc. Btw, A Change of Seasons (the song) is their third longest song.

Metropolis Part 2: Scenes From a Memory: Again, a new keyboardist--Jordan Rudess. He's the best of the three DT keyboardists, and his mark is apparent on the last four albums. If you've heard Metropolis Pt 1, you'll understand this better. This is a rock opera dealing with reincarnation and hypnosis. Many people agree that this is one of their best (if not the greatest) album of all time. DT origionally named Metro 1 humorously, but fans gave them presure to do a part 2. They eventually started and expanded it into an entire album. Some highlights: Overture 1928, Fatal Tragedy, Beyond this Life, Home, The Dance of Eternity, and The Spirit Carries On. This is an amazing disc. It left me wanting them to do a Metropolis part 3 :D

Six Degrees Of Inner Turbulence: This is the CD with the Glass Prison. But be warned! The Glass Prison is the only song on the album of its type. The other four 'short' songs all have a different style. The second CD is their longest song ever, a 42 minute epic called Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence. ALl the songs a re amazong, but none are similar. This gets either really poor reviews or really great reviews, so sample each song before you buy it.

Train of Thought: You already have it, but I'll continue anyways. This is their darkest album, and it turns several people off, but I like it a lot. It has seven strong points: As I am, This Dying Soul, Endless Sacrifice, Honor Thy Father, Vacant, Stream of Conciosness (how do you spell that?), and In The name of God. The entire album is a masterpiece, and whoever says this album is bad should go screw a cow.

Octavarium: The lastest, and maybe the most controversial. DT has been known as the maker of some fantastic prog, but here they slacken the reins. The Root of all Evil, Sacrificed Sons, and Octavarium will please DT fans, but the rest are all more simplistic. While I personally like it, I can see how others don't. Thisnk of this as DT's answer to anybody who says they can't write a cohesive song.

Also, I just noticed that whenever DT makes a title song, the song s are always lengthy. Octavarium, A Change of Seasons, and Six Degrees are the only title tracks, and are very long (24, 23, and 42 minutes, respectively).

My personal reccomendations would be Awake or Metropolis Part 2: Scenes From a Memory.

[Zirikzigil]

^
|
|
Sorry for all those typos. I'm not good at typing.

[Zirikzigil]

And now I have an interersting idea for a debate...

Who is better at their instrument, Petrucci or Rudess?

Yes, it may be like comparing apples to ornages, but i want to known people's opinions.

[spenser93]

Hey im new 2 dream theater, ive heard very good things about them, who r they like and what r some good songs by them?

[RideTheSpiral]

I'm pretty sure I disagree with just about everything you just said then...

[Jovian]

Hey im new 2 dream theater, ive heard very good things about them, who r they like and what r some good songs by them?

Dream Theater is a modern progressive rock band who derives influence from the works of Yes and Genesis from the 1970's.

Some of their best works, in my opinion:

A Change of Seasons (EP)
Scenes from a Memory
6 Degrees of Inner Turbulence

[RideTheSpiral]

Hey im new 2 dream theater, ive heard very good things about them, who r they like and what r some good songs by them?



They are neo progressive metal. In the vein of Fates Warning, Queensryche, Vanden Plas etc.


Recommended songs:


Ytse Jam

Pull Me Under
Metropolis Pt 1
Learning to Live

Voices
Scarred

A Change of Seasons

Hells Kitchen
Trial of Tears

Fatal Tragedy
Finally Free

Blind Faith
The Great Debate

Stream of Conciousness

Panic Attack
Octavarium



Songs to Avoid:

The Glass Prison
Honor Thy Father

[Jovian]

, Queensryche,

Queensryche is awesome, but I don't really consider them "prog."

[RideTheSpiral]

Queensryche is awesome, but I don't really consider them "prog."


Er they pioneered NeoProg.

[lak89]

LaBrie's vocals don't really appeal to me, i only like their instrumentals though, "The Dance of Eternity" is simply amazing

[Jovian]

Er they pioneered NeoProg.

What is NeoProg??? :confused:

Never heard of that genre before.

Queensryche was a METAL band when they started out with the "Queen of the Ryche" and "The Warning."

They could be easily categorized with Iron Maiden and Judas Priest during this era. Maiden and Priest are anything but "prog."

[Darkness]

Songs to Avoid:

The Glass Prison
Honor Thy Father
Heh, those are their 2 best songs if you ask me... But I haven't heard to much else... yet.

[RideTheSpiral]

What is NeoProg??? :confused:

Never heard of that genre before.

Queensryche was a METAL band when they started out with the "Queen of the Ryche" and "The Warning."

They could be easily categorized with Iron Maiden and Judas Priest during this era. Maiden and Priest are anything but "prog."


NeoProg = New Wave of Progressive music.


They started out glam but became Prog with Operation Mindcrime.



Maiden and Priest have a lot of Progressive influences.

[RideTheSpiral]

Heh, those are their 2 best songs if you ask me...


Yeah...no I don't.

[Jovian]

NeoProg = New Wave of Progressive music.


They started out glam but became Prog with Operation Mindcrime.



Maiden and Priest have a lot of Progressive influences.

We'll have to agree to disagree on this. :)

When I think of "prog", I think of Dream Theater, The Mars Volta and Spock's Beard.

Queensyche is a **** good rock band... but not prog, IMO.

[Chu]

Songs to Avoid:

The Glass Prison
Honor Thy Father
I guess they're two songs that Metalheads would appreciate more then say, Another Day, Strange Deja Vu, or Solitary Shell. But I believe all their songs should be listenned to.

[nowitzki]

Songs to Avoid:

The Glass Prison
Honor Thy Father

That is the most stupid statement I've heard all day

[Darkness]

Yeah...no I don't.
Acutually I got confused with Honor Thy Father and In The Name of God (woops...) I don't acutually think Honor thy father is that special... heh heh sorry.

[ArcLite]

Glass Prison - Good song
Honor Thy Father - Not a big fan of "rapping James"

[Chu]

That is the most stupid statement I've heard all day
You obviously weren't here earlier...

[Triangle]

Glass Prison - Good song
Honor Thy Father - Not a big fan of "rapping James"
I thought the rapping was in This Dying Soul?

I love those two songs, esp TGP :)

[RiceMonster]

I've never understood all the hype about The Glass Prison.

[Amit]

Dream Theater is cool.

But so many people focus on the technical talents of its members...And I don't understand that since there are so many better or equally talented guitarists/bassists/drummers out there.

[Tails]

Dream Theater is cool.

But so many people focus on the technical talents of its members...And I don't understand that since there are so many better or equally talented guitarists/bassists/drummers out there.

It's usually the first introduction that people have to musicians of that caliber all playing together. When I first listened to them I thought they were the be-all end-all grouping of talent. I know this isn't true, but you can't deny that they are a very skilled group. I still will whore them out as being "omg teh best evar! j00 haf to lissen 2 dem!!!!" to some people if they catch me on a fanboy day.

[MAthiAS]

Never seen Eggo in R and M before. If you read this man, do you know Puzzle's AIM?

[nowitzki]

Dream Theater is cool.

But so many people focus on the technical talents of its members...And I don't understand that since there are so many better or equally talented guitarists/bassists/drummers out there.


So many? Go on then, name some rock/metal bands where all the members are more talented than DT.

[Amit]

So many? Go on then, name some rock/metal bands where all the members are more talented than DT.

I can't name any rock/metal bands, but the members of Dream Theater are pretty much inconsequential when compared to jazz musicians. And don't tell me you can't compare them, because I know Petrucci went to music school for jazz :)

[Josh]

I've never understood all the hype about The Glass Prison.
its a good song, but to be honest its not my favourite DT song...that's probably Wait for Sleep, or Pull Me Under.

[Darkness]

I can't name any rock/metal bands, but the members of Dream Theater are pretty much inconsequential when compared to jazz musicians. And don't tell me you can't compare them, because I know Petrucci went to music school for jazz :)
Thats true. But those jazz musicians probably couldn't make progressive metal the way Dream Theater does.

[RideTheSpiral]

We'll have to agree to disagree on this. :)

When I think of "prog", I think of Dream Theater, The Mars Volta and Spock's Beard.

Queensyche is a **** good rock band... but not prog, IMO.



You're an idiot. Spocks Beard and The Mars Volta are amazingly bad.

[RideTheSpiral]

That is the most stupid statement I've heard all day


Did you see that guy trying to argue Queensryche aren't prog?

[red barchetta]

You're an idiot. Spocks Beard and The Mars Volta are amazingly bad.
too true. i find them very annoying

[Deme]

6 Degrees of Inner Turbulence are one of my favorite DT albums.I have allot of friends that also love that album so im pretty suprised to hear y say that

Octavarium, their new album is pretty good too.Its a little different from their past three albums but not a bad direction either. :thumb:

[Vai's Jem #2]

I think Stream of Consciousness has the most difficult/fastest Petrucci solo in it. Anyone agree or have a different solo in mind?

[JonG]

Memorizing all of A Change of Seasons would be his most difficult task :P

[SRTracer]

I think Stream of Consciousness has the most difficult/fastest Petrucci solo in it. Anyone agree or have a different solo in mind?

that whole song is fairly complex and quick with some great riffs, and the solo is long, but I think his fastest playing is for the most part with LTE like in Acid Rain and Paradigm Shift and a few others. he is quite fast and a great composer in some cases.

ACOS is very long with tons of changes in moods and such, but it's not a highly technical song (compared to lots of his other work) but the long solo about 15 through is incredible still to say the least!

There are plenty of other guitarists and whole bands, though like Eggo said that are at a minimum of equal to if not better than DT. But I still love DT tons.

[SRTracer]

Glass Prison - Good song
Honor Thy Father - Not a big fan of "rapping James"


haha that's mass funny to read, even though it's true for me too. it's wierd to me how much he did that on ToT. "Don't cross the crooked step" and all of those other lyrics. haha but it's still good music.

[RideTheSpiral]

I think Stream of Consciousness has the most difficult/fastest Petrucci solo in it. Anyone agree or have a different solo in mind?



I'd say that's probably his fastest.

[Zirikzigil]

I agree, I've looked at the tabs (and listened to it) and yes, relative to the speed he's playing, the second solo from stream of consciousness is his fastest. Although not by far--the outro to TDS is fast and pretty much everything in the test that stumped them all is fast.

And to whoever said that petrucci was incomparable to jazz:

Petrucci's style is much more ecclectic, ranging from the solo on solitary shell to a slow and thoughful solo at the beginning of hollow years (at live in budokan), and then to pretty much anything he did on train of thought. Jazz musicians, while i give them credit, don't span as large a range. And, btw, that school for jazz he went to--he scored off the charts, so i assume that means something when compared to other musicians.

And there arent plenty of equally as talented musicians...only a hadful including Vai, Satch, that Sfoglio guy from elements of persuasion, among a few others.

Acid rain isnt actually that fast, solowise. although i agree that universal mind is.

And yes. The mars volta *is* amazingly bad

[PeEpHoLe_10]

You're an idiot. Spocks Beard and The Mars Volta are amazingly bad.

Shoosh!

[the2stranger]

I'm going to see them on sunday!!
although they have a short stage time.
1,5 hour I believe, but I will see them again for a fulltime concert in oktober, so this is just an appetizer (sp) :D

[Jovian]

Did you see that guy trying to argue Queensryche aren't prog?

You have to be one of the dumbest people I've ever seen on the internet. :lol:

[Jovian]

You're an idiot. Spocks Beard and The Mars Volta are amazingly bad.

Witness the Jackass in it's natural habitat... the internet. :)

[Jovian]

DumFuk Spiral guy doesn't know what real prog is.

Yes, the band, is real prog.

Peter Gabriel-era Genesis is real prog.

They make Queensryche look like the Ramones, you ignorant twat.

[the2stranger]

wow, triple post.

please use the edit button :)

[Triangle]

woot i got my ticket today for the London show :)

[jpshortstuff]

**** you i want tickets
im gonna wait for a closer venue though
how much was it?

[SRTracer]

You have to be one of the dumbest people I've ever seen on the internet. :lol:

...Right next to yourself I'm assuming? :lol: I think Queensryche are prog. for sure. RideTheSpiral is most definitely correct.

[YouGottaBeCrazy]

After listening to SFAM a few more times, I must say that Through Her Eyes keeps the album from being something truly great. It's so ****ing corny, and it sounds like a **** R&B song with the computer drums. This is all just my opinon though, and I wouldn't be surprised if you guys disagree with me.

[Shattered_Future]

...Right next to yourself I'm assuming? :lol: I think Queensryche are prog. for sure. RideTheSpiral is most definitely correct.

Queensryche are DEFINATELY prog. If you don't think that, you should learn how to listen to music.

[Jovian]

...Right next to yourself I'm assuming? :lol: I think Queensryche are prog. for sure. RideTheSpiral is most definitely correct.
Queensryche = far from prog; nowhere near as complicated and progressive as Dream Theater, Yes and Gabriel-era Genesis.

Spiral and yourself = AssHats

:)

[Jovian]

Queensryche are DEFINATELY prog. If you don't think that, you should learn how to listen to music.

WRONG!!!

[Triangle]

**** you i want tickets
im gonna wait for a closer venue though
how much was it?
£27 I think :)

[Jovian]

Which band does not fit?

The Mars Volta
Dream Theater
Queensryche
Spock's Beard
Yes
Genesis


Definitely.... Queensryche

:)

[red barchetta]

Which band does not fit?

The Mars Volta
Dream Theater
Queensryche
Spock's Beard
Yes
Genesis


Definitely.... Queensryche

:)
just shut up now

[Jovian]

just shut up now

NO!!!!

:)

[Shattered_Future]

WRONG!!!

SOMEbody doesn't know his music. :)

[Jovian]

SOMEbody doesn't know his music. :)

Have every Queensryche album from Rage for Order to Tribe.
Have every DT album from Images and Words to Train of Thought.
Have the "Yes... in a word" Box Set
Have "Lamb Lies Down on Broadway" "Foxtrot" and "Selling England by the Pound" by Genesis.
Have both Mars Volta CDs.

It's safe to say that Queensryche's song formats and structures are nowhere near as complicated as the other bands listed above. Progressive rock is defined by the complexity of the song structures, odd time signatures, etc. Queensryche's music is simplistic like Neil Young and Bob Dylan compared to Yes, Mars Volta, etc.

Been avid fan of rock music and Queensryche before most of you dilweeds were even born. ;)

[Chu]

So, I've been listenning to Awake.

I really like Scarred, Lie and Caught in a Web.. LaBrie's voice in the first song (Except for where he says "Six o'clock on a christmas morning" or whatever) is the best he has ever done, in my opinion..

Yeah, just listenning to it some more, I like this album :)

[AClotM1]

And if you knew two cents about the mars volta, you would know that it's very simple and also is all most always improvised live.


Meshuggah and Dillinger's stuff is as complex as all that stuff, yet the are not labeled progressive.

[Jovian]

[QUOTE=AClotM1]And if you knew two cents about the mars volta, you would know that it's very simple and also is all most always improvised live.
QUOTE]

:rolleyes:

*fart*

[Zirikzigil]

LaBrie doesn't say 'six o clock...' It's just a sample.

So Jovian: if you don't think Queensryche is prog, what is it? Don't tell me its just ordinary mainstream hard rock because then youre even more wrong.

[AClotM1]

The Mars Volta are not prog....Jovian.

But I must say that Queensryche are lacking the things that I would call prog. No long songs, No odd ball time sigs, no long winding instrumentals.... little technicallity.


They have Just a concept album, and a great one at that.

[Jovian]

LaBrie doesn't say 'six o clock...' It's just a sample.

So Jovian: if you don't think Queensryche is prog, what is it? Don't tell me its just ordinary mainstream hard rock because then youre even more wrong.

Queensryche in the 1980's = Metal (like Priest and Maiden)
Queensryche now = Hard Rock

:)

You people are totally clueless about Progressive Rock. Feel free to keep making complete A$$ES of yourselves, 'cause it's very entertaining for me. ;)

Who here has even heard the band... YES.... or Peter Gabriel-era Genesis?

[Jovian]

The Mars Volta are not prog....Jovian.

But I must say that Queensryche are lacking the things that I would call prog. No long songs, No odd ball time sigs, no long winding instrumentals.... little technicallity.


They have Just a concept album, and a great one at that.

Then what are they!??!?! Hardcore Complex Latino? :D

[Jovian]

But I must say that Queensryche are lacking the things that I would call prog. No long songs, No odd ball time sigs, no long winding instrumentals.... little technicallity.


They have Just a concept album, and a great one at that.

Finally, someone with some sense. :cool:

[AClotM1]

Yes, they are Hardcore Complex Latino. Minus the Hardcore (that at the drive in had) and complexity (that neither of them had). Leaving them to be just Latinos making noise rock. :D

[Darkness]

Use the dam edit button.

[Jovian]

Use the dam edit button.

Why do you hate multiple posts? :(

[Chu]

LaBrie doesn't say 'six o clock...' It's just a sample.
Good, because that pisses me off :p

[red barchetta]

Queensryche in the 1980's = Metal (like Priest and Maiden)
Queensryche now = Hard Rock

:)

You people are totally clueless about Progressive Rock. Feel free to keep making complete A$$ES of yourselves, 'cause it's very entertaining for me. ;)

Who here has even heard the band... YES.... or Peter Gabriel-era Genesis?
look, some people dont give a damn about queensryche being prog or not. just stop being so big-headed

[Jovian]

look, some people dont give a damn about queensryche being prog or not. just stop being so big-headed

:rolleyes:

Recent posts in this thread prove otherwise. :) :smoke:

[red barchetta]

:rolleyes:

Recent posts in this thread prove otherwise. :) :smoke:
what, the 'shut up' one?

i was just telling you to shut up.


EDIT: but this is a dream theater thread. stop arguing

[Jovian]

what, the 'shut up' one?

i was just telling you to shut up.

Don't like my truth-telling? :o :)

[Arrakakaka]

I'm going to see them on sunday!!
although they have a short stage time.
1,5 hour I believe, but I will see them again for a fulltime concert in oktober, so this is just an appetizer (sp) :D
Where?

[red barchetta]

someone clear one thing for me:

is the second hammersmith going to have a classic DT album played, or a classic album by another artist?

[Chu]

someone clear one thing for me:

is the second hammersmith going to have a classic DT album played, or a classic album by another artist?
Shh.. It's a secret :cool:

[3rdplanet]

Where?

Graspop.

I think thats how it's spelt.

[Arucard]

Im seeing DT on Saturday, supporting Maiden. Should alright, although i dislike some of the music.

[slappindabass]

I don't understand why "Octavarium" isn't being recommended. The only songs on the album that I have a problem with are "I Walk Beside You" becaus the chorus really kills the song, and the title track. When I bought the CD, I was hoping "Octavarium" would be the same quality as "A Change of Seasons", but heavier. Basically, I was going to be comparing it to Symphony X's "The Oddysey", a great song. It wasn't very good at all, though. In fact, there just wasn't enough variation.

But other than that, the album is great. "The Root of All Evil" was only a bit disappointing because it wasn't as heavy as I expect, but "Panic Attack" more than made up for that. Also, I love the vocals on "Never Enough" which made me feel more secure about the band because I've noticed how LaBrie's vocals have weakened as he's aged, but this song just shows that they're beating that. "Sacrificied Sons" is good, nice melody, nice instrumentals. Overall good song. It's a good album, definately more modern, which I think is good.

So if anybody wants to pick up a Dream Theater album, pick up "Octavarium" and move back.

[RNR]

Like I said earlier: In my Opinion Octavarium is good, but they have done better things.

[red barchetta]

i liked 'i walk beside you'... i think the chorus fits in well

[slappindabass]

i liked 'i walk beside you'... i think the chorus fits in well

The song is clearly an attempt to get on the radio. I think what they need to do is realize that soft songs will not get them on the radio. They need to put songs like "Never Enough" and "Panic Attack", or even "These Walls" on the radio. You know, something not so **** corny. Something people actually want to hear.

[red barchetta]

i agree that never enough is a MUCH better song, but i still like it


never enough reminded me A LOT of 'stockholm syndrome' by muse

[Tonkie]

DT has got it going on... hearing and seeing their live budakon performance was intense. I dream of one day having the tone of JP's triaxis. *drools* I don't know... having that or the JMP-1 with the 100/100 tube power amp would be pretty killer too.

[RideTheSpiral]

Have every Queensryche album from Rage for Order to Tribe.
Have every DT album from Images and Words to Train of Thought.
Have the "Yes... in a word" Box Set
Have "Lamb Lies Down on Broadway" "Foxtrot" and "Selling England by the Pound" by Genesis.
Have both Mars Volta CDs.

It's safe to say that Queensryche's song formats and structures are nowhere near as complicated as the other bands listed above. Progressive rock is defined by the complexity of the song structures, odd time signatures, etc. Queensryche's music is simplistic like Neil Young and Bob Dylan compared to Yes, Mars Volta, etc.

Been avid fan of rock music and Queensryche before most of you dilweeds were even born. ;)


Er you're making a fool of yourself. You might want to shup up soon.

[Chu]

Question that has been puzzling me.

Back when I first got into Dream Theater (I got Scenes From a Memory from a friend, because of a post here that recommended it) alot of people on these forums said Petrucci didn't play with any emotion, he would just shred, shred, shred.
Upon hearing SFaM I kinda agreed with that, the album didn't really have any emotional solos, at least in my opinion.
These days, I feel I have listenned to pretty much everything Dream Theater have/has to offer (Bar their first album) and I believe Petrucci has alot of emotion in some of his solos.

Examples are: The intro solo to Scarred (From Awake), personally my favourite Petrucci solo, I cannot describe the emotion, but I think the way he pulls off the solo with so much perfection is brilliant.

The intro solo to Another Day (Images & Words), this was my favourite Petrucci solo, until I heard Scarred. It's like a feeling of great achievement, this is the sort of solo I usually love, I don't know why, but it's just pouring emotion in my opinion.

The intro solo to Surrounded (Also from Images & Words), although sounding a little bit cheesy (To any Australians who read this, think E-Street from like early 90's :lol: ), it sounds very similar to the solo from Another Day (To my ears at least), also giving a feeling of achievement. As gay as it may sound, I just love this solo 'technique', I guess it could be called.

The little accoustic jizz at about 4:26 in Solitary Shell (From Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence), I don't know what it is about it, but I really like this, not just the guitar, but the little piano afterwards is amazing also. I don't know if you could call this a solo, but meh, I'm adding it.

That's all I have at the moment really, but I'm listenning to more songs now to add to it, I know there are more, I just wanted to get this out. Thanks for reading :)

Hah, sorry, I realised I didn't post the question:
Why would people say that Petrucci only shreds? Is it simple because they have only listenned to the songs in which he does shred? And thus, they automatically assume he must only shred..

[YouGottaBeCrazy]

Petrucci is definitely not just a shredder. Of course, he does shred at times and many people think it's just boring and mindless. I appreciate this type of skill and some it still gets me going even after hearing it many, many times (ex. the solo to Metropolis Pt. 1). I think both guitar solos in "Another Day" are really quite emotional. Then again, my definition of an emotional solo or music in general is something that doesn't give you a nuetral feeling when listening to it. Emotional music should make you feel happy, or sad, or angry, it just can't make you feel nothing. Anybody think like that? I also happen to think that in "Lie", the 2nd solo starts off with a really cool and EMOTIONAL part and than moves into some much faster shredding. You get the best of both worlds with that solo! ha. So, he's definitely not just a mindless shredder. He knows when to shred and when not to. He knows what solos will fit with what backing music.

[Chu]

Yeah, for sure I feel the same :)

[MAthiAS]

He knows when to shred and when not to.
He forgot on Train of Thought.

[slappindabass]

My ex-best friend (I moved) hated Petrucci and said the same **** that all he does is shred. Of course, he listened to bands like Rancid and just punk stuff, which really involves no talent. So I just told him he's only saying that because he can't do it. People criticize what they don't understand. If Rancid's guitarists are stars, Petrucci is the galaxy. He can play anything they can, and write it, and then some. Who's better? You decide.

[slappindabass]

He forgot on Train of Thought.

Ha true. ToT had it's moments, though. SoC was amazing, regardless of constant shredding. TDS and AIA were ****ing crazy too. ITNoG was insanity!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The rest didn't really appeal to me.

[MAthiAS]

SoC was good minus the solos. ITNOG was the best song on there. AIA and TDS were decent. Endless Sacrifice was a great song. After that they sucked.

[HUGE]

SoC was good minus the solos. ITNOG was the best song on there. AIA and TDS were decent. Endless Sacrifice was a great song. After that they sucked.
Train of thought makes me cry
i love it too much for anyone's good
at thier show...opening with as i am in the dark, into this dying soul, into beyond this life...i actually shed a tear.
IMO octavarium is amazing as well, slow at times but insanely sexified at all others

[Chu]

He forgot on Train of Thought.
rofl

I actually wouldn't mind getting your MSN, or ICQ if you use this old program?
You are a pretty cool guy, from what I know of you on MX.

[6-String_Slinger]

octavarium is good by normal standards but i don't think it quite lives up to DT's standards, it definetly has its moments (panic attack, and the track after it, cant remember the name) but other than that idk.....and the title track pisses me off, 24 minuets of meh... it really is not as solid as SFAM, I&W, or 6DOIT

...IMO

[bball_1523]

octavarium is good by normal standards but i don't think it quite lives up to DT's standards, it definetly has its moments (panic attack, and the track after it, cant remember the name) but other than that idk.....and the title track pisses me off, 24 minuets of meh... it really is not as solid as SFAM, I&W, or 6DOIT

...IMO

I agree, I just can't seem to feel Octavarium as a premiere DT album. It's ok according to regular rock/metal bands out there, but it's not something I want to put in my car cd player and listen to it non-stop like I have been doing with my Pain Of Salvation albums that I've been buying recently.

[slappindabass]

I agree, I just can't seem to feel Octavarium as a premiere DT album. It's ok according to regular rock/metal bands out there, but it's not something I want to put in my car cd player and listen to it non-stop like I have been doing with my Pain Of Salvation albums that I've been buying recently.

The thing is, while I can see how you may be somewhat disapointed with Octavarium, I find it amazingly good because of the somewhat newly established vocal presence. Honestly, ToT's vocals were weak (except for TDS), and they didn't satisfy me at all. But, the reason I enjoyed the album at all was because of the crazy instrumentals and the new-found heaviness the band brought to the table. But it was too heavy at some parts. With Octavarium, it's heavy and soft, and the vocals are perfect because they're more upfront and commanding, which LaBrie seemed to have lost in ToT because the instruments kind of took over. The way I see it, Octavarium is a perfect blend of the soft, melodic elements of 6DoIT and the heavy, fast-paced elements of ToT. On top of all of that, LaBrie has finally come in with some seriously amazing vocals.

One disapointment: Rudess' lack of a major presence, except for his few solos here and there. And for the most parts, the solos aren't very memorable, another disapointment. But overall, great DT album. Go get it.

[SlashHalen]

I jsut recently got Train of Thought I'm in love with it. This is the first of their albums that i have. What would be a good ones to get?

[JonG]

Get Awake.

[EinzingerIsGod]

Two words to why I'm not an Octavarium fan...Sacrificed Sons...I dont know what it is but that song just bothers me

[RideTheSpiral]

All you people are not true.


Octavarium is just about DT's best album. It show's the band is maturing. If you still want I&W or Awake then you need to grow up.


The album is each member of the bands best and most rounded performance to date and they finally work together as they haven't since KM left. This is where they should have gone after SFaM.

The title track is amazing; on the same level as A Change of Seasons.


IMO :p

[horseypie]

how do people say SoC sucked in the solo dept? The second shred solo JP does has a magic moment that is totally un-JP.....its amazing

[YouGottaBeCrazy]

Can somebody on here YSI these 2 off of A Change of Seasons:

The Zeppelin Medley
Funeral For a Friend/Love Lies Bleeding

[ArcLite]

Can somebody on here YSI these 2 off of A Change of Seasons:

The Zeppelin Medley
Funeral For a Friend/Love Lies Bleeding

Dude, I uploaded Funeral for you yesterday in the YSI thread, right after you requested it. Check it out.

EDIT: NM, you said the link didn't work... :upset:

[YouGottaBeCrazy]

Yeah it didn't work, so I just posted here rather in that thread again because they get mad you real easy for something like requesting a song again.

[The End]

My ex-best friend (I moved) hated Petrucci and said the same **** that all he does is shred. Of course, he listened to bands like Rancid and just punk stuff, which really involves no talent. So I just told him he's only saying that because he can't do it. People criticize what they don't understand. If Rancid's guitarists are stars, Petrucci is the galaxy. He can play anything they can, and write it, and then some. Who's better? You decide.

Thats not even close to being true... people criticize what they dont like, not what they dont understand. Do people go around criticizing the universe, or physics or evolution? I didn't think so. Your friend listens to what he considers to be 'good music' and I dont see anything wrong with that. Let him have his own views, he may not fully appreciate the talent of JP but whatever, thats his own ignorance for not caring.

[Rounder]

All you people are not true.


Octavarium is just about DT's best album. It show's the band is maturing. If you still want I&W or Awake then you need to grow up.


The album is each member of the bands best and most rounded performance to date and they finally work together as they haven't since KM left. This is where they should have gone after SFaM.

The title track is amazing; on the same level as A Change of Seasons.


IMO :p

i would have to disagree esp with the statement that the new stuff is ACOS good. While the production of the album is some of the best yet (they are finally turning Myung's bass up in the mix), I am getting really tired of the formula the band is using the last couple of albums. They are basically taking other peoples music, like Tool, Pink Floyd, Muse and others and stealing the style and mashing it with a standard DT middle crazy section. The lryics are getting really annoying, along with the vocals. the S.O.P. for JP's and JR's solos are getting extremely boring. They do the same **** every solo. I enjoy the fact that the music has become heavier but they getting a little repetitive imo. On earlier albums like SFAM and ACOS, every solo was different and memorable and maybe most imortant, melodic. but now every single solo is 64th note masterbation spams.

I dont know whos writing the most lryics now, but they are high school level duimb. I cant take it anymore with the cliches. Labrie's voice is bad as ever, and i dont think the band can keep evolving with jordan or labrie in the band.
I also think that Labries voice isnt meshing well with the heavier stuff. he's just imitating Mustaine and hetfield and i tend to crack up laughing when I hear that ****.

I respect Jp's growth as a guitarist, hes better than ever, I think though that a new keyboardist (or bringing KM back) would move the band forward, as would shutting labrie up and getting a new singer. Im assuming you guys have heard O.S.I. THOSE are the keyboard styles that belong in DT. O.S.I. also has some of the best portnoy stuff ive heard. The vocals and lryics are better than that of DT imo.

sorry for the rant, I just got through listening the the whole song Octavarium and got really pissed. Its started out with a complete Shine on You Crazy Diamond rip, then I hear some Tool **** in there as well, and the lyrics blow.

Im a huge fan Of DT, and it sucks that the band is making music I dont like. Its wierd, Im normally a person who likes it when bands get heavier. I just dont think DT is making true DT music... :confused:

[juggalotricksta]

Could somebody tell me about OSI? I want to know if its worth checking out...DT is my favorite band, I like the progressive/metal/virtuostic element. I picked up Transatlantic's DVD...and its really progressive, but not quite as metal or virtuostic as I like...how is OSI for that?

[McClain]

I like the album, but i think some of the lyrcs are extremely poor, such as in I Walk Beside You, Sacrificed Sons, and the chorus of The Answer Lies Within. Just to cheesy for my taste, sometimes you can pull off a song like those, but really, they didn't. As for Sons, it was too full of anti-Bush lyrics, kinda took away from the rest of the music.

[RideTheSpiral]

Could somebody tell me about OSI? I want to know if its worth checking out...DT is my favorite band, I like the progressive/metal/virtuostic element. I picked up Transatlantic's DVD...and its really progressive, but not quite as metal or virtuostic as I like...how is OSI for that?



OSI is brilliant. It's Progressive electro rock. Hard to explain really. Definitly worth the money though (typically excellent InsideOut packaging too).

[RideTheSpiral]

i would have to disagree esp with the statement that the new stuff is ACOS good. While the production of the album is some of the best yet (they are finally turning Myung's bass up in the mix), I am getting really tired of the formula the band is using the last couple of albums. They are basically taking other peoples music, like Tool, Pink Floyd, Muse and others and stealing the style and mashing it with a standard DT middle crazy section. The lryics are getting really annoying, along with the vocals. the S.O.P. for JP's and JR's solos are getting extremely boring. They do the same **** every solo. I enjoy the fact that the music has become heavier but they getting a little repetitive imo. On earlier albums like SFAM and ACOS, every solo was different and memorable and maybe most imortant, melodic. but now every single solo is 64th note masterbation spams.

I dont know whos writing the most lryics now, but they are high school level duimb. I cant take it anymore with the cliches. Labrie's voice is bad as ever, and i dont think the band can keep evolving with jordan or labrie in the band.
I also think that Labries voice isnt meshing well with the heavier stuff. he's just imitating Mustaine and hetfield and i tend to crack up laughing when I hear that ****.

I respect Jp's growth as a guitarist, hes better than ever, I think though that a new keyboardist (or bringing KM back) would move the band forward, as would shutting labrie up and getting a new singer. Im assuming you guys have heard O.S.I. THOSE are the keyboard styles that belong in DT. O.S.I. also has some of the best portnoy stuff ive heard. The vocals and lryics are better than that of DT imo.

sorry for the rant, I just got through listening the the whole song Octavarium and got really pissed. Its started out with a complete Shine on You Crazy Diamond rip, then I hear some Tool **** in there as well, and the lyrics blow.

Im a huge fan Of DT, and it sucks that the band is making music I dont like. Its wierd, Im normally a person who likes it when bands get heavier. I just dont think DT is making true DT music... :confused:



I love LaBrie's voice on Octavarium. It's fantastic.


Octavarium is the album where DT pay tribute to their influences so it's hardly surprising it sounds very reminiscent of bands like Pink Floyd and Yes.

[Chu]

There's one song on Octavarium that I really cannot stand, just because of the vocals. But faith is restored, in the title track, just towards the end where he is yelling "Trapped in this Octavarium" or similar. I think that's pretty good.

[MAthiAS]

I hate track 4 on 8vm, I already said it sounds like a U2 song.

i would have to disagree esp with the statement that the new stuff is ACOS good. While the production of the album is some of the best yet (they are finally turning Myung's bass up in the mix), I am getting really tired of the formula the band is using the last couple of albums. They are basically taking other peoples music, like Tool, Pink Floyd, Muse and others and stealing the style and mashing it with a standard DT middle crazy section. The lryics are getting really annoying, along with the vocals. the S.O.P. for JP's and JR's solos are getting extremely boring. They do the same **** every solo. I enjoy the fact that the music has become heavier but they getting a little repetitive imo. On earlier albums like SFAM and ACOS, every solo was different and memorable and maybe most imortant, melodic. but now every single solo is 64th note masterbation spams.
I agree for the most part, but you have to admit Octavarium was an improvement over ToT.
I dont know whos writing the most lryics now, but they are high school level duimb.
Yeah, I cringe at every line of The Answer Lies Within. These guys tried to rewrite Another Day, and failed... miserably. Oh well, at least there was no sax.
I love LaBrie's voice on Octavarium. It's fantastic.
Yeah, I think it was pretty sweet.

I agree that DT really lost their identity. Every song sounds like a different band, whether its Floyd, Muse, U2, or Linkin Park, there's no DT left.

[red barchetta]

i say LaBrie's vocal parts on Octavarium (throughout the whole album) proves that he is a good singer. its much less annoying than the vocals found on metropolis pt 2 and IAW

[Burdcheese]

I like the album, but i think some of the lyrcs are extremely poor, such as in I Walk Beside You, Sacrificed Sons, and the chorus of The Answer Lies Within. Just to cheesy for my taste, sometimes you can pull off a song like those, but really, they didn't. As for Sons, it was too full of anti-Bush lyrics, kinda took away from the rest of the music.

Sons isn't anti-Bush in any way - its about 9/11. Its anti-Osama/Islamic fundamentalists.

I hate the lyrics though - its crass in the extreme, and more to the point, they'd already covered the same ground in a far superior way with In The Name of God. I like it musically though.

[Quebec]

i say LaBrie's vocal parts on Octavarium (throughout the whole album) proves that he is a good singer. its much less annoying than the vocals found on metropolis pt 2 and IAW
I think he had a different vocal coach this time. I love his vocals on this one!

[Cain]

The lyrics stink on Octavarium, no question. And LaBrie has to go. He has not aged well as the band has gotten heavier in sound. He's essentially a power metal singer, not suited to Dream Theater's utter lack of fantasy elements, and their pretentions to musical sophistication. I just can't stand his voice anymore.

[Amit]

Thats true. But those jazz musicians probably couldn't make progressive metal the way Dream Theater does.

And Dream Theater can't make jazz the way the jazz musicians can...What's your point? :D

I'm just talking about pure technical skill.

[ThePanicInNeedlePark]

Do people go around criticizing the universe, or physics or evolution?

religion criticizes all three of those things....

I still think DT should go back to IaW era personally. The locals were at their most catchiest, the keys were at their best, the guitar was really well done, quite original really for a "metal" band.

JP's heavy riffs are abit sucky really, there quite nu metal and are heavy in a cr*ppy way. Im sticking with old school IaW lol

[Quebec]

religion criticizes all three of those things....

I still think DT should go back to IaW era personally. The locals were at their most catchiest, the keys were at their best, the guitar was really well done, quite original really for a "metal" band.

JP's heavy riffs are abit sucky really, there quite nu metal and are heavy in a cr*ppy way. Im sticking with old school IaW lol
I respect your opinion, but whats the point of being a PROGRESSIVE band if your gonna return to your old sound? They are constantly evolving and changing their sound, and it doesn't gets old (well for me at least).

[RideTheSpiral]

The lyrics stink on Octavarium, no question. And LaBrie has to go. He has not aged well as the band has gotten heavier in sound. He's essentially a power metal singer, not suited to Dream Theater's utter lack of fantasy elements, and their pretentions to musical sophistication. I just can't stand his voice anymore.


He's not a power metal vocalist at all...

That's a completely different style.

[MAthiAS]

But those jazz musicians probably couldn't make progressive metal the way Dream Theater does.
Dream Theater is hardly a progressive band anymore.
JP's heavy riffs are abit sucky really, there quite nu metal and are heavy in a cr*ppy way.
Yeah, that's pretty true, but his riffs that don't try to be uber heavy are awesome.
He's not a power metal vocalist at all...
Haha, yeah really. I thought the vocals were great on Octavarium, the lyrics were poor at points, but the vocals themselves were fine. Except for the Muse parts.

[Shattered_Future]

Dream Theater is hardly a progressive band anymore.

Yeah, that's pretty true, but his riffs that don't try to be uber heavy are awesome.

Haha, yeah really. I thought the vocals were great on Octavarium, the lyrics were poor at points, but the vocals themselves were fine. Except for the Muse parts.

I was disappointed with Octavarium...

It was very atmospheric, i will give it that. However, the whole band seems to have been toned down a lot. No more long long solos, no more of the occasional ultra heaviness...it all seems to have been abandoned to make the music more radio friendly. That's what it sounds like...watered down metal.

It was a decent release...however, it was not the Dream Theater we know, nor was it one of Dream Theater's best.

[Cain]

He's not a power metal vocalist at all...

That's a completely different style.

Loud bellow-singing with lots of vibrato?

I mean, I see your point, but still, Labrie can hardly stand accused of being a very nuanced singer.

I take back the power metal singer thought. I was really sort of complaining about LaBrie's rather toneless, thoughtless way of singing. I don't think it is suited to any part of Dream Theater's current sound.

[MAthiAS]

It was very atmospheric, i will give it that. However, the whole band seems to have been toned down a lot. No more long long solos, no more of the occasional ultra heaviness...it all seems to have been abandoned to make the music more radio friendly. That's what it sounds like...watered down metal.
I was never really a fan of the Train of Thought heaviness, but at the same time a lot of songs on 8vm sound like pop songs... They forgot how to write songs with structures like on IaW...

Portnoy needs to stop listening to Muse and Weezer and throw on some Rush dammit!

[jpshortstuff]

um... i just noticed it said Vocals and Percussion next to James LABrie on the Live At Budokan CD.
Percussion? What did he do?

[Burdcheese]

He had a hand-held shaker on some songs, namely Hollow Years.

[YouGottaBeCrazy]

I was never really a fan of the Train of Thought heaviness, but at the same time a lot of songs on 8vm sound like pop songs... They forgot how to write songs with structures like on IaW...

Portnoy needs to stop listening to Muse and Weezer and throw on some Rush dammit!

Do you mean they forgot how to write songs with the structure used in IaW or that they just forgot how to write structures, yet they used to know how like on IaW?

Either way, that doesn't really make sense. Some songs on IaW don't really have a structure. Look at "Learning To Live". It's probably my favorite DT song, but it's just one part after another. How is this a structure? "Another Day" was written to be a single, so stop acting like DT starting pulling this **** now. However, I do happen to think that AD is a lot better than The Answer Lies Within and I Stand Beside You *shudders*.

[MAthiAS]

Some songs on IaW don't really have a structure. Look at "Learning To Live".
Yeah, that's what I mean. That kind of stuff is interesting to listen to. I honestly don't see what's very progressive (other than being different from their previous albums) about ToT or 8vm, save a few songs here and there.

[RiceMonster]

The lyrics stink on Octavarium, no question. And LaBrie has to go. He has not aged well as the band has gotten heavier in sound. He's essentially a power metal singer, not suited to Dream Theater's utter lack of fantasy elements, and their pretentions to musical sophistication. I just can't stand his voice anymore.
I agree that the lyrics are terrible on Octavarium, but I'm the kind of person who thinks of good lyrics as a bonus. I still enjoy LaBrie's vocals, and I think Octavarium is great album, other than the lyrics of course.

[YouGottaBeCrazy]

Yeah, that's what I mean. That kind of stuff is interesting to listen to. I honestly don't see what's very progressive (other than being different from their previous albums) about ToT or 8vm, save a few songs here and there.

Okay, I see what you're saying. It seems a lot of it now is just verse chorus different verse chorus instrumental jam session for 5 minutes chorus outro. It gets lame after awhile. Especially since they are really just keyboard and guitar solos and don't really add anything to the song instead of how songs on IaW had different sections that added to the song and they were able to keep the pomp metal instrumentals down a lot (except for Metropolis Pt. 1, but it still seems to fit into the song). Some of the instrumental parts are so unneccesary. Was that instrumental section needed in "Sacrificed Sons"? How bout just putting in a few different parts that actually aren't just soloing? That song gets ruined by the instrumental section and the poor lyrics. A very nice melody. I also think the jam session in Octavarium doesn't fit with the song at all. It sounds so silly in parts of it (while that little acoustic lick is very awesome). Not to mention the fact that the lyrics to one of the sections is terrible (sailing on the seven seize the day tripper, etc.). Petrucci is the only member of the band that can actually write decent lyrics and he really should be the only one writing lyrics.

[guitarded_chuck]

I don't mind LaBrie's vocals on Octavarium, which is rare for me. Sometimes his vocals can literally ruin the music for me, but I think he sounds okay at times on the new album. It wasn't the biggest effort from the band though, but I still enjoy the album. Panic Attack is my favorite song.

[MAthiAS]

They should take Myung's poetry and use it as lyrics again. They only stopped because they got lazy turning abstract poetry into a structured song.

[RiceMonster]

They should take Myung's poetry and use it as lyrics again. They only stopped because they got lazy turning abstract poetry into a structured song.
I agree. I really like Myungs lyrics.

[guitarded_chuck]

I'm not an expert on the band so what albums/songs did they use Myung's poetry to make the lyrics?

[RiceMonster]

I'm not an expert on the band so what albums/songs did they use Myung's poetry to make the lyrics?
Well, I know he wrote the lyics on the song "Learning to Live".

[Chu]

Well, I know he wrote the lyics on the song "Learning to Live".
Myung's just bloody awesome.

[RNR]

He wrote the lyrics on Lifting Shadows Of A Dream. Which I can't make sense of but that's ok because it's a coo song :)

[Darkness]

And Dream Theater can't make jazz the way the jazz musicians can...What's your point? :D

I'm just talking about pure technical skill.
They probably could make some decent jazz...

[3rdplanet]

^ Question able.

[MAthiAS]

I wouldn't be so sure of that... Petrucci just doesn't seem to have the... what's the word...

[Otherside]

I was really annoyed by Petrucci's lyrics in Sacrificed Sons. I don't need politics in my Dream Theater.

[YouGottaBeCrazy]

I think Labrie wrote the lyrics to SS.

[slappindabass]

Thats not even close to being true... people criticize what they dont like, not what they dont understand. Do people go around criticizing the universe, or physics or evolution? I didn't think so. Your friend listens to what he considers to be 'good music' and I dont see anything wrong with that. Let him have his own views, he may not fully appreciate the talent of JP but whatever, thats his own ignorance for not caring.

Okay I'm sorry mom. That was basically my life wrapped up in a paragraph, it goes way beyond what I wrote. I don't even understand what you're saying. As for people criticizing physics, yeh millions do. They'd rather believe religious texts than science. The age old battle: science vs. relgion. And don't even get me started on evolution. Think before you speak, idiot.

[Tails]

Not to mention the fact that the lyrics to one of the sections is terrible (sailing on the seven seize the day tripper, etc.). Petrucci is the only member of the band that can actually write decent lyrics and he really should be the only one writing lyrics.

That part is just a giant homage to rock, mostly progressive rock from the 60's and 70's.

Even though Petrucci has written great lyrics in the past(see: Scarred), he has been getting progressively worse. The best two lyricists the band ever had were Myung and Moore. Myung stopped submitting lyrics to the band because they put a stipulation on lyrics that they had to be in a structured form or they would not use them at all, so Myung stopped submitting his abstract poetry, and well we all know what happened to Kevin Moore. Portnoy pulls some great lyrics out every now and then (ACOS, TGP/TDS/TROAE), but a lot of his stuff isn't that great. They really need to take a step back and look at the lyrics of then and now.

[MAthiAS]

Yeah, the maturity level has really gone down... its like they're 13 years old again.

[YouGottaBeCrazy]

That part is just a giant homage to rock, mostly progressive rock from the 60's and 70's.



So? You don't put lyrics like that in a serious song and than expect it to be taken seriously. It doesn't fit the song and it drags the song down a bit from where it could have been. It's still a great song IMO.

[the2stranger]

I saw them yesterday, they rocked.

from the new cd they played:
the root of all evil
and
Panic Attack

:D

[MAthiAS]

No 8vm? No These Walls?

[Quebec]

I was really annoyed by Petrucci's lyrics in Sacrificed Sons. I don't need politics in my Dream Theater.
So they need your approval when they write lyrics?

[slappindabass]

The thing is, their lyrics have never been that great. Myung wrote "Learning to Live", and that's it as far as I know, and that song is amazing both instrumentally and lyrically. Petrucci writes decent lyrics, but it's all average out-of-your-*** crap. Portnoy writes more edgy stuff, which I like. What really pisses me off is LaBrie's lack of a serious lyrical contribution to the band. He is the singer, right? He didn't even write all the lyrics to his solo album (Elements of Persuasion). I'm thinking: what the hell does this guy do other than what they tell him to? He's a good singer, but he sucks at writing.

Jordan Ruddess isn't a great lyricist, either. Listen to his last solo album (Rhythm of Time). There are a couple of songs with singing, he wrote the lyrics; somewhat similar to Petrucci's stuff.

My point is: I agree with everyone saying they really need to fix up their lyrics. But honestly, I never find the time to pay attention to lyrics anyway and analyze hidden messages or anything. I just listen to the vocal melody, and they're getting that part right, at least. But honestly, they really have to step it up. The lyrics have gotten progressively worse. The reason the title track of "Octavarium" disappointed me so much is because I was expecting an abstract story such as we saw on ACOS, which was basically the story of somebody's life in perspective. Those were amazing lyrics. But "Octavarium" didn't even tell a **** story. It was just random crap like "I don't want to be like him, and now I do" (????). And then that jibberish "sailing on the seven sieze the day tripper diem" thing, which could have been catchy, but it didn't belong in an epic song like "Octavarium", and LaBrie sang it totally wrong. He should've rapped it. What do you guys think?

Anyway, those are my thoughts.

[Cain]

Well, the comparisons are inevitable it seems, but DT's musical talent instrumentally is no excuse for subpar lyrics. You pay attention to what you do, I guess, but take a band like Tool, which manages to be insanely interesting on both levels. Dream Theater takes enough criticism for being too instrument-focused, and they can't afford to not bust their asses on every aspect of composition. You can tell when a musician is half-assing something, even if it's better than most other artists' best. It's still half-assing.

Let's face it: I'll need another album to be sure, but DT has been together for a decade plus, running on two. Very few bands have it together compositionally for such a long time. My opinion, they peaked with 6 Degrees. They have few places left to go, it seems. They'll be met with criticism no matter what modifications they make to their sound. That's what you get when a band sets such uncompromising standards for itself from the outset: a band that writes itself into a corner and has nowhere left to go by the end.

Look at a band like Rush. That band, it can be argued, has been tired at a lot of points in its career, most notably in the late '80s. But the difference is, they changed anyway, against the tides of their fans, and certainly against the tides of mainstream influence, from their shifts from 70s hard rock/proto-prog-metal to 80s synth-pop/Andy-Summers-type rock, and then to their 90s sound. That's why they're one of the best progressive bands: their sound changed, and they had no issues as a three piece with challenging each other musically.

But now later fans can look back and see that they've truly progressed and that's why so many of their eras provide literally 30-something albums of enjoyment. The same can hardly be said for Dream Theater: after about 9 or 10 albums, a few flaws in their sound have remained depressingly constant with little effort made to change them The instrumental prowess displays are among them. They're boring by now, but on the other hand Dream Theater as we know it would cease to exist if they were not there. Classic case of a band writing itself into a corner.

When you have five monster instrumentalists all vying for a piece of the composition, and a singer that doesn't do a thing except sing and leave when the rest of the boys play by themselves, and with very rigid roles for each bandmate, original-sounding composition becomes difficult. And a TON of Dream Theater songs are very derivitive, although that isn't immediately apparent because of the sheer skill on display. There have been more complaints about that lack of originality lately, but even back in IAW days it was like a good combination of Queensryche and Rush with more chops. I don't know, I just think they're pretty done. We'll see with the next album, like I said, but this is a band that could be close to spent creatively.

[slappindabass]

Well, the comparisons are inevitable it seems, but DT's musical talent instrumentally is no excuse for subpar lyrics. You pay attention to what you do, I guess, but take a band like Tool, which manages to be insanely interesting on both levels. Dream Theater takes enough criticism for being too instrument-focused, and they can't afford to not bust their asses on every aspect of composition. You can tell when a musician is half-assing something, even if it's better than most other artists' best. It's still half-assing.

Let's face it: I'll need another album to be sure, but DT has been together for a decade plus, running on two. Very few bands have it together compositionally for such a long time. My opinion, they peaked with 6 Degrees. They have few places left to go, it seems. They'll be met with criticism no matter what modifications they make to their sound. That's what you get when a band sets such uncompromising standards for itself from the outset: a band that writes itself into a corner and has nowhere left to go by the end.

Look at a band like Rush. That band, it can be argued, has been tired at a lot of points in its career, most notably in the late '80s. But the difference is, they changed anyway, against the tides of their fans, and certainly against the tides of mainstream influence, from their shifts from 70s hard rock/proto-prog-metal to 80s synth-pop/Andy-Summers-type rock, and then to their 90s sound. That's why they're one of the best progressive bands: their sound changed, and they had no issues as a three piece with challenging each other musically.

But now later fans can look back and see that they've truly progressed and that's why so many of their eras provide literally 30-something albums of enjoyment. The same can hardly be said for Dream Theater: after about 9 or 10 albums, a few flaws in their sound have remained depressingly constant with little effort made to change them The instrumental prowess displays are among them. They're boring by now, but on the other hand Dream Theater as we know it would cease to exist if they were not there. Classic case of a band writing itself into a corner.

When you have five monster instrumentalists all vying for a piece of the composition, and a singer that doesn't do a thing except sing and leave when the rest of the boys play by themselves, and with very rigid roles for each bandmate, original-sounding composition becomes difficult. And a TON of Dream Theater songs are very derivitive, although that isn't immediately apparent because of the sheer skill on display. There have been more complaints about that lack of originality lately, but even back in IAW days it was like a good combination of Queensryche and Rush with more chops. I don't know, I just think they're pretty done. We'll see with the next album, like I said, but this is a band that could be close to spent creatively.

Yeh I see what you mean.

[YouGottaBeCrazy]

Look at a band like Rush. That band, it can be argued, has been tired at a lot of points in its career, most notably in the late '80s. But the difference is, they changed anyway, against the tides of their fans, and certainly against the tides of mainstream influence, from their shifts from 70s hard rock/proto-prog-metal to 80s synth-pop/Andy-Summers-type rock, and then to their 90s sound. That's why they're one of the best progressive bands: their sound changed, and they had no issues as a three piece with challenging each other musically.

But now later fans can look back and see that they've truly progressed and that's why so many of their eras provide literally 30-something albums of enjoyment. The same can hardly be said for Dream Theater: after about 9 or 10 albums, a few flaws in their sound have remained depressingly constant with little effort made to change them The instrumental prowess displays are among them. They're boring by now, but on the other hand Dream Theater as we know it would cease to exist if they were not there. Classic case of a band writing itself into a corner.

When you have five monster instrumentalists all vying for a piece of the composition, and a singer that doesn't do a thing except sing and leave when the rest of the boys play by themselves, and with very rigid roles for each bandmate, original-sounding composition becomes difficult. And a TON of Dream Theater songs are very derivitive, although that isn't immediately apparent because of the sheer skill on display. There have been more complaints about that lack of originality lately, but even back in IAW days it was like a good combination of Queensryche and Rush with more chops. I don't know, I just think they're pretty done. We'll see with the next album, like I said, but this is a band that could be close to spent creatively.

123

[slappindabass]

Well, the comparisons are inevitable it seems, but DT's musical talent instrumentally is no excuse for subpar lyrics. You pay attention to what you do, I guess, but take a band like Tool, which manages to be insanely interesting on both levels. Dream Theater takes enough criticism for being too instrument-focused, and they can't afford to not bust their asses on every aspect of composition. You can tell when a musician is half-assing something, even if it's better than most other artists' best. It's still half-assing.

Let's face it: I'll need another album to be sure, but DT has been together for a decade plus, running on two. Very few bands have it together compositionally for such a long time. My opinion, they peaked with 6 Degrees. They have few places left to go, it seems. They'll be met with criticism no matter what modifications they make to their sound. That's what you get when a band sets such uncompromising standards for itself from the outset: a band that writes itself into a corner and has nowhere left to go by the end.

Look at a band like Rush. That band, it can be argued, has been tired at a lot of points in its career, most notably in the late '80s. But the difference is, they changed anyway, against the tides of their fans, and certainly against the tides of mainstream influence, from their shifts from 70s hard rock/proto-prog-metal to 80s synth-pop/Andy-Summers-type rock, and then to their 90s sound. That's why they're one of the best progressive bands: their sound changed, and they had no issues as a three piece with challenging each other musically.

But now later fans can look back and see that they've truly progressed and that's why so many of their eras provide literally 30-something albums of enjoyment. The same can hardly be said for Dream Theater: after about 9 or 10 albums, a few flaws in their sound have remained depressingly constant with little effort made to change them The instrumental prowess displays are among them. They're boring by now, but on the other hand Dream Theater as we know it would cease to exist if they were not there. Classic case of a band writing itself into a corner.

When you have five monster instrumentalists all vying for a piece of the composition, and a singer that doesn't do a thing except sing and leave when the rest of the boys play by themselves, and with very rigid roles for each bandmate, original-sounding composition becomes difficult. And a TON of Dream Theater songs are very derivitive, although that isn't immediately apparent because of the sheer skill on display. There have been more complaints about that lack of originality lately, but even back in IAW days it was like a good combination of Queensryche and Rush with more chops. I don't know, I just think they're pretty done. We'll see with the next album, like I said, but this is a band that could be close to spent creatively.

Overall, I can see what you're saying. The Dream Theater camp is going to be pretty static for the next few years. There was some tiny variations on "Octavarium", such as "Never Enough", but other than that they're just repeating themselves. Although it's a good and enjoyable album, one of my favorites they've released, one think I've noticed is the blandness of the solos. They've become somewhat predictable and far less memorable than solos such as the one for "Lines in the Sand" or "Fatal Tragedy", or "Stream of Consciousness", or even "Metropolis pt 1".

If you guys pay attention, Dream Theater has been an episode type band. They had Metropolis, then they made Metropolis pt. 2. The new "episode" thing is "The Glass Prison/This Dying Soul/The Root of All Evil" series. Whereas I've liked all 3 songs, they need to do something more epic. I don't give a **** about alcoholics. They really need to rekindle some of those old candles, get back on the epic side of things.

[MAthiAS]

He should've rapped it.
No, Labrie should never rap anything again.

[slappindabass]

No, Labrie should never rap anything again.

He raps every now and then like on TDS and a bit on his solo album. I like it. It's original, at least.

[Chu]

No, Labrie should never rap anything again.
lol

[RNR]

No 8vm? No These Walls?

Yeah, seriously. They could atleast play those two.

[MAthiAS]

He raps every now and then like on TDS and a bit on his solo album. I like it. It's original, at least.
Just because its different doesn't mean its good. He's Canadian, we can't rap.

[YouGottaBeCrazy]

Just because its different doesn't mean its good. He's Canadian, we can't rap.

That's true. Who could forget the brilliance of Snow and his breathtaking hit single "Informer"?

[nowitzki]

I saw them yesterday, they rocked.

from the new cd they played:
the root of all evil
and
Panic Attack

:D

How long was their set? I would expect them to play a lot more from the new album, and I'm sure in their headlining shows they will do.

[Rounder]

well I for one agree that KM and Myung were the best lyric writers in the band. Take a look at OSI. Those lryics are ****ing amazing. And Learning to live is one of the best lryical songs DT has ever made. even though i can't stand labries vocal style, i would still be listening to them right now if the lryics were worth half a sh1t.

And no Labrie should be banned from rapping. It makes DT sound ****ing gay.

[MAthiAS]

OSI? What?

They need to bring Kevin Moore back, and Portnoy and Petrucci need to regrow their hair. Maybe hanging with Mustaine all summer will make them cool again...

For the Labrie haters... who would you bring in to replace him? Stratovarius' singer?

[Cain]

OSI? What?

They need to bring Kevin Moore back, and Portnoy and Petrucci need to regrow their hair. Maybe hanging with Mustaine all summer will make them cool again...

For the Labrie haters... who would you bring in to replace him? Stratovarius' singer?

Last Tribe's singer. I'll upload tracks if anyone needs a sample, since I don't believe they are quite well-known. But he'd be my pick. He's got all the power of Labrie but a more pleasent tone and much better breath support, power, and intonation. I bet on quiet songs he doesn't shiver the note all to cheezy hell like LaBrie does.

Feh, sorry. I sound like such a DT hater now. :( But anyway, yeah, Last Tribe's singer would be my pick. He's the only power metal vocalist with a real, true voice that I've heard.

[Chu]

Maybe hanging with Mustaine all summer will make them cool again...
is this implying Mustaine's cool? :p

[Shattered_Future]

Overall, I can see what you're saying. The Dream Theater camp is going to be pretty static for the next few years. There was some tiny variations on "Octavarium", such as "Never Enough", but other than that they're just repeating themselves. Although it's a good and enjoyable album, one of my favorites they've released, one think I've noticed is the blandness of the solos. They've become somewhat predictable and far less memorable than solos such as the one for "Lines in the Sand" or "Fatal Tragedy", or "Stream of Consciousness", or even "Metropolis pt 1".

If you guys pay attention, Dream Theater has been an episode type band. They had Metropolis, then they made Metropolis pt. 2. The new "episode" thing is "The Glass Prison/This Dying Soul/The Root of All Evil" series. Whereas I've liked all 3 songs, they need to do something more epic. I don't give a **** about alcoholics. They really need to rekindle some of those old candles, get back on the epic side of things.

I really liked The Glass Prison "series" of songs...they are some of my favorite DT songs. I think the band put a LOT more effort into these than some of their other songs...they are chock full of some of the most talented riffs that DT has ever wrote. The solos are excellent...the vocals are more decent than others, save for the bit of rapping in TDS. The lyrics are forgiveable...there are better lyrics, but there are also worse lyrics.

However, yes, DT is starting to show its age. Octavarium, while it had a few good songs, i did NOT like at all. It seemed way too poppy for me...DT should do more of their ACOS or 6DOIT styled music than this new style...

[vashts80]

Somebody said Portnoy and Petrucci should regrow their hair...doesn't Portnoy still have long hair? He had a mullet-type style on the Live at Budokan DVD at least...Petrucci I agree on, he looks...homosexual with that short and dyed hair he has. (Again, Live at Budokan, he looks like his hair is dyed blonde in the front)

[slappindabass]

Somebody said Portnoy and Petrucci should regrow their hair...doesn't Portnoy still have long hair? He had a mullet-type style on the Live at Budokan DVD at least...Petrucci I agree on, he looks...homosexual with that short and dyed hair he has. (Again, Live at Budokan, he looks like his hair is dyed blonde in the front)

??? Why? Are you going to jerk off to their hair? It's all about the music, buddy. Get your priorities straight.

[juggalotricksta]

??? Why? Are you going to jerk off to their hair? It's all about the music, buddy. Get your priorities straight.

Thank you. These people have been pissing me off for a while. That is, people that criticize Metallica and DT and whoever else for cutting their hair.

"Their music sucks now because they have short hair. They need to grow it back so they can rock again."

This is ignorant. Length of hair has absolutely nothing to do with magnitude of rock. So get over it.

[guitar321]

the as i am solo is savage

[MAthiAS]

??? Why? Are you going to jerk off to their hair? It's all about the music, buddy. Get your priorities straight.
And the music sucks, and we have to blame something.
"Their music sucks now because they have short hair. They need to grow it back so they can rock again."
I highly doubt anyone ever says that with much seriousness.
This is ignorant. Length of hair has absolutely nothing to do with magnitude of rock. So get over it.
Again...
the as i am solo is savage
Savage wankage...

[slappindabass]

Length of hair has absolutely nothing to do with magnitude of rock.

Exactly.

Some of you people have a hard time understanding what music is. If I braid my pubic hairs, does that suddenly mean that the style of music I am going to be performing in the future will be different than the status quo? No. Maybe hair matters with some bands, but in regards to Dream Theater, if you're going to see them at a show to see Myung rock his hair, or Portnoy do a backflip while he's drumming, or Petrucci smash his guitar, or Rudess play his piano with his back facing it, or LaBrie jumping into the crowd, you're at the wrong **** show. Dream Theater is all about the music. They're not trying to be Nirvana.

[vashts80]

Stop ****ing attacking me you dickhead, it's a simple god****ed statement. In my opinion, Petrucci doesn't look right with short hair, just like I wouldn't look right with hair like LaBrie's.

[Chu]

Exactly.

Some of you people have a hard time understanding what music is. If I braid my pubic hairs, does that suddenly mean that the style of music I am going to be performing in the future will be different than the status quo? No. Maybe hair matters with some bands, but in regards to Dream Theater, if you're going to see them at a show to see Myung rock his hair, or Portnoy do a backflip while he's drumming, or Petrucci smash his guitar, or Rudess play his piano with his back facing it, or LaBrie jumping into the crowd, you're at the wrong **** show. Dream Theater is all about the music. They're not trying to be Nirvana.
I would pay to see Myung just wave his hair around.. Although, I think he cut it a bit shorter?

Edit: If you honestly believe people are serious when they say "Petrucci/Portnoy should re-grow their hair" then you're just being silly. Think about it...

[MAthiAS]

Edit: If you honestly believe people are serious when they say "Petrucci/Portnoy should re-grow their hair" then you're just being silly. Think about it...
Exactly. Seriously, you're wasting your time writing that bro.

[National chaos sam]

Myung has ****ing awseome hair, but altogether, hes quite boring on stage. hes an amazing player ythough, which counts.

The song Vacant...what is it based around? i was told it had something to do with La bries expiriences, wold this be correct?

[the2stranger]

^
it's one of the few songs he has written the lyrics for, so I guess, it's personal stuff.

but so is Portnoy's stuff, sometimes i feel like he should stop revealing his fücked up live to the world via his lyrics.
I mean I respect Portnoy very much, and feel sorry for him having gone through so much trouble, but no the entire world needs to know.

and the hair issue: length of hair has nothing to do with what music you play, but I think it does suit them better.
but that's just a mteer of taste ( i have long hair myself too), and has nothing to do with the way they write songs.

and before I end this post.
what do you guys think of the production of the albums?
I would like to see someone else produce their albums, Mike and Petrucci, produced the last 3, which were good production wise, but I would just like to hear what they would sound like, if someone else would produce.
opinions on this one?

[slappindabass]

^
and before I end this post.
what do you guys think of the production of the albums?
I would like to see someone else produce their albums, Mike and Petrucci, produced the last 3, which were good production wise, but I would just like to hear what they would sound like, if someone else would produce.
opinions on this one?

When Portnoy and Petrucci produce the DT albums, the guitar always sounds really thick and heavy, the bass is in the background, hardly noticeable, the keyboards always surprise every now and then, and the drums are always there. Vocals are there. Overall I think it sounds good, they just have to fix up the bass and keyboard a bit.

Jordan Rudess produced his solo album "Rhythm of Time" and it sounds pretty **** good for 14 days of writing/mixing/producing. The bass, unlike in DT, is loud and clear, but not too loud, just the right mix. The guitar, however, isn't. But in regards to this album it sounds good. The keyboards, of course is loud and clear. The drums: good enough for me. Vocals: loud and clear.

James LaBrie produced his solo album "Elements of Persuasion". Honestly, on this album everything sounds muddy, especially the guitars. You can't even hear the keyboards (except for when they're under the clean piano effect), and the drums and bass are either nearly inaudible or muddy. The vocals sound okay, similar to DT except lesser quality effects on them.

All that is really left is Myung and honestly there is no way we can tell what he would do, but he's an amazing musician, an amazing poet, and an amazing visionary. We just have to wait and see.

But either way, I think Petrucci and Portnoy should stick to production.

[juggalotricksta]

I have a feeling theres so much more to Myung than anybody knows. He contributes little compared to MP & JP as far as the band goes...imagine if he was up front like they are. Its like hes a musical iceberg and we've only seen the tip.

[nowitzki]

I would pay to see Myung just wave his hair around.

You've obviously never seen I&W Live in Tokyo ;)

[Chu]

Never seen a DT Video, well except for them doing Master of Puppets.

Should I get a DVD? :p