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iliketoplaydrums10111
08-19-2004, 11:24 PM
Read the official list below.

sup niggas?

DFelon204409
08-20-2004, 01:03 AM
I will be reorganizing this list chronologically and by "style" or "scene." I haven't heard all of the bands so I'd like if you'd help me out. IM at DFelon204409 (leave a message) or just post in this thread. I'd prefer an IM though.

Proposed scenes: Founding Fathers, Early Screamo (Gravity Records), End of the Century (Grade, Saetia, whoever else), Modern/21st Century (CTTS, Hot Cross)

Unfiled Screamo
Neil Perry
The Vidablue
The Sea, The Sea
Cowboys Became Folk Heroes
Joshua Fit for Battle
Jerome's Dream
As the Sun Sets
After School Knife Fight
Van Johnson
Majority Rule
The Assistant
Cobra Kai
Mara'kate
Hassan I Sabbah
The Now
I Would Set Myself On Fire For You
The Fiction
Wolves


Dance/Indie/Grind/Metalcore that is rooted in emo but is eclectic
Trophy Scars
The Blood Brothers
An Albatross
The Red Light Sting
Fear Before the March of Flames
Crestfallen
Envy
The Great Redneck Hope
Frodus
Stop It!!
Planes Mistaken for Stars

contributors:
DFelon204409
BuddyBigsby
shane_italian
cbmartinez

Forefathers of Emo (80s-90s)
Rites of Spring*
Embrace*
Driftwood
Embassy
Moss Icon
Navio Forge
Native Nod
Still Life
Indian Summer

Forefathers of Screamo (Gravity Records; Early 90s-Mid 90s)
Heroin*
Angel Hair
Antioch Arrow
Clikitat Ikatowi
Swing Kids
Nuzzle
Mohinder

Midwest Indie/Emo (Mid 90s-Present)
Bells On Trike
Boy's Life
Christie Front Drive
Nuzzle
Rockets And Blue Lights

Emo/Screamo (Mid 90s-Present)
Indian Summer*
Hoover*
Reach Out*
Saetia
You and I
Grade
I Hate Myself
The Death of Anna Karina
Die! Emperor Die!
The Red Scare
The Khayembii Communiqué
Julia
Portrait
Song of Zarathustra
Wallside
Spirit of Versailles

Modern Emo
Hot Cross
Circle Takes the Square
A Day in Black and White
City of Catepillar
Kite-Flying Society
Comadre
JR Ewing
Funeral Diner
Yaphet Kotto
Amanda Woodward


Modern Screamo
Orchid*
Usurp Synapse*
Kaospilot
pageninetynine
Textbook Traitors
Welcome the Plague Year
Love Lost But Not Forgotten
combatwoundedveteran
lickgoldensky
The Kodan Armada
Off Minor
Love Like...Electrocution
Emo Summer

* = Unofficial founder of genre

Labels with Emo/Screamo Bands
Dischord
Gravity
Ebullition
Stonehenge
Level-Plane
No Idea
Alone

AKid2
08-20-2004, 01:15 AM
Anybody here like Underoath? I think they are pretty sweet.

DFelon204409
08-20-2004, 01:17 AM
Anybody here like Underoath? I think they are pretty sweet.

I like them but they're not screamo or emo.

BuddyBigsby
08-20-2004, 01:25 AM
*helped with above list*

as for song recommendations, everyone go out and download one of the most amazing songs ever.

Portrait - Constellations of a Stargazing Iris

Screamo with a violinist.

BuddyBigsby
08-20-2004, 01:26 AM
Anybody here like Underoath? I think they are pretty sweet.

Ah, the first of the ignorant. *draws sword*

iliketoplaydrums10111
08-20-2004, 01:31 AM
boo

DFelon204409
08-20-2004, 01:33 AM
:lol:

Has anyone heard 18 visions last album?

Silence ignoramus. That album stings with the pain of nu-metal and just straight crap.

BuddyBigsby
08-20-2004, 01:34 AM
:lol:

Has anyone heard 18 visions last album?

Yeah, but it's straight up rock. See my review of it in CD Reviews.

srt-4
08-20-2004, 02:38 AM
well, if you are looking for specific songs, some of my favorites after having listened to some of dfelon's recommendations are:

Hot Cross - Patience and Prudence
Between Minutes and Miles
Finger Redux
Pretty Picture of a Broken Face
Fortune Teller

Saetia - Notres Langues Nous Trompent
Venus and Bacchus

Planes Mistaken for Stars - Thunder in the Night Forever
Copper and Stars
Emo Diaries
The Past Two

DFelon204409
08-20-2004, 02:51 AM
The best Saetia songs are "Postlapsaria" and "Notres Langues Nous Trompent" (which interestingly enough isn't proper french).

BuddyBigsby
08-20-2004, 02:53 AM
Ahem. "An Open Letter", anyone?

shane italian
08-20-2004, 02:57 AM
Song Of Zarathustra "Tame"
Pg99 "Your Face Is A Rape Scene"
The Paper Chase "I Did A Terrible Thing"

hybridofsound
08-20-2004, 05:20 AM
Can anybody suggest some The (International) Noise Conspiricy for me to download? Ago they're hardcore, well I think I haven't heard anything by them to actually know.

shane italian
08-20-2004, 05:30 AM
Can anybody suggest some The (International) Noise Conspiricy for me to download? Ago they're hardcore, well I think I haven't heard anything by them to actually know.Not hardcore. Indie...post-punk...something along those Swedish lines.

hybridofsound
08-20-2004, 05:37 AM
I see. Any songs? I don't really feel like making a thread.

shane italian
08-20-2004, 05:50 AM
Hmm...I could give you the two I know of from my Punk-o-Rama comps.
"Up For Sale"
"Smash It Up"

GloryFaded
08-20-2004, 10:16 AM
Can anybody suggest some The (International) Noise Conspiricy for me to download? Ago they're hardcore, well I think I haven't heard anything by them to actually know.


A new Morning,Changing Weather

XemoXmoshXpitX
08-20-2004, 10:18 AM
Is Blindside considered screamo? I am going to see them today, but I've only heard one of their songs, so I wouldn't know.

Also: Someone sticky this! There have been too many emo threads floating around in several forums.

iliketoplaydrums10111
08-20-2004, 11:35 AM
I hope this thread is mod endorsed so it doesn't turn into flames/spam

DFelon204409
08-20-2004, 03:05 PM
Is Blindside considered screamo? I am going to see them today, but I've only heard one of their songs, so I wouldn't know.

Also: Someone sticky this! There have been too many emo threads floating around in several forums.

Blindside is really good but no where near screamo. They're like Glassjaw but they're Swedish.

DFelon204409
08-20-2004, 03:07 PM
I hope this thread is mod endorsed so it doesn't turn into flames/spam

It is DFelon endorsed so it's bound not to fail to hard. I decided to own "Emo:Is It Liked" and I did. It took about 100 posts but every ignoramus who entered, exited with a fresh bleeding asshole.

sink sink
08-20-2004, 10:22 PM
...I'll just comment a bit on the list posted up there

I Hate Myself - yay!
Amanda Woodward - Good, plus it's French, so it's kinda sexy ;)
Circle Takes the Square - Crazy good
The Kite-Flying Society - They only have a few songs and then broke up, right? Too bad.
Cowboys Became Folk Heroes - They also only have a few songs, hopefully they'll be making more music soon. I hope they don't end up like the afore mentioned band.

And I would add Portraits of Past and maybe Stop It!!, but I don't think they're really considered emo/screamo.

sink sink
08-20-2004, 10:29 PM
And I learned about a lot of these bands from http://www.ihatemusic.org (well, I guess it's a forum now). Sadly, the site is dead now, but it might come back someday. Until then you can hang out in the Soulseek chatroom of the same name: ihatemusic.org

srt-4
08-21-2004, 01:04 AM
Is Blindside considered screamo? I am going to see them today, but I've only heard one of their songs, so I wouldn't know.


i would also like to know what genre blindside is exactly. i of course know they aren't emo/scream, but i dont' know what they are. my guess would be post-hardcore? i have asked on here before, but never got a good answer.

BuddyBigsby
08-21-2004, 02:44 AM
Blindside are pretty much just rock now. Used to be hardcore.

BuddyBigsby
08-21-2004, 02:46 AM
The Kite-Flying Society - They only have a few songs and then broke up, right? Too bad.
Cowboys Became Folk Heroes - They also only have a few songs, hopefully they'll be making more music soon. I hope they don't end up like the afore mentioned band.


Actually, I asked some guy from Florida (where KFS reside) about them and he said they're still together, just that they've been quiet. Apparently their new stuff isn't that great though. I heard they also did a split or something with Cowboys.

Happymeal
08-21-2004, 07:14 AM
Anyone here know The Fall Of Troy? They're kinda ATDI-ish but I don't know if they're emo/screamo

br3ad_man
08-21-2004, 07:52 AM
Ok, can someone help me here. Some people call Brand New emo. DFelon reckons there pop-punk. How can they be emo when they sound nothing like bands such as Circle Takes The Square. How can they be pop-punk when they sound nothing like Simple Plan, Good Charlotte or Green Day?

Kif said they were "Alternative Emo" once, that seems like a reasonable classification to me.

GloryFaded
08-21-2004, 10:41 AM
Why can't people just call Brand New emo! Cause that's what they are! Just because they don't sound like circle takes the square doesn't mean their not emo. Most people who have listened to any Brand New Album all the way though would agree there emo.You can call them 'alternative emo' if you want but the key word in that sentance is emo, hence thats what they are.

BuddyBigsby
08-21-2004, 01:24 PM
Why can't people just call Brand New emo! Cause that's what they are! Just because they don't sound like circle takes the square doesn't mean their not emo. Most people who have listened to any Brand New Album all the way though would agree there emo.You can call them 'alternative emo' if you want but the key word in that sentance is emo, hence thats what they are.

Brad, read this.

No, they are not emo. Bottom line. Do you even know where emo came from? Can you trace the path of the genre to bands like Brand New? No, you can not. Emo started out as Emotional Hardcore with bands like Rites of Spring, Antioch Arrow, etc. Go listen to those bands now. The only thing that has changed about emo since those bands is that it has gotten heavier. Emo sounds nothing like Brand New, Taking Back Sunday, or any of that. It is not poppy. If there's one thing emo is not, it is poppy.

I'm not sure why bands like Brand New get called emo, but my guess is that when Sunny Day Real Estate came out, people started calling them emo. But they weren't. They were what's considered Post-Emo Indie Rock. I usually say Post-Emo for short (so as not to confuse it with Indie). After SDRE happened, a million clones popped up and a few years later we have bands like Brand New. The music has changed since SDRE, but the false label remains. Have you even heard Circle Takes the Square? Give them a listen. www.hxcmp3.com/circle_takes_the_square

sink sink
08-21-2004, 02:58 PM
Actually, I asked some guy from Florida (where KFS reside) about them and he said they're still together, just that they've been quiet. Apparently their new stuff isn't that great though. I heard they also did a split or something with Cowboys.
Ah, thanks.

hums_like_a_TELECASTER
08-21-2004, 08:18 PM
omg, you guys, are just lame, you have NO clue what screamo or emo is, and underoath IS SCREAMO! morons, i'll give a list of good emo/screamo bands,


Screamo:
Hidden In Plain View
Finch
Underoath

Emo:
brand new
the early november
straylight run
taking back sunday
Coheed & cambria
Matchbook romance

thats not all, im just not in the mood to think right now, but thats just to give you some examples

hums_like_a_TELECASTER
08-21-2004, 08:25 PM
Oh and madison for a screamo band, they are amazing, but i suggest you all listen to the bands i have on the list so you'll smarten up

www.purevolume.com/hiddeninplainview
www.purevolume.com/finch
www.purevolume.com/madison
www.purevolume.com/takingbacksunday
www.purevolume.com/underoath

download straylight's music at: www.straylightrun.com

and you can listen to hiddeninplainview/theearlynovember/finch at:
www.drivethrurecords.com

DFelon204409
08-21-2004, 08:32 PM
Ok, can someone help me here. Some people call Brand New emo. DFelon reckons there pop-punk. How can they be emo when they sound nothing like bands such as Circle Takes The Square. How can they be pop-punk when they sound nothing like Simple Plan, Good Charlotte or Green Day?

Kif said they were "Alternative Emo" once, that seems like a reasonable classification to me.

Simple Plan and Good Charlotte are pop. Straight up. The faux-hawk doesn't make them any more punk than their whelping. Brand New's earlier stuff was clearly pop-punk. Listen to real pop-punk bands like Bodyjar or Millencolin and listen to Your Favorite Weapon. Notice the similarities? Brand New's new CD is more indie than anything else, excepting when they take Taking Back Sunday's dual vocal thing and also on way poppy songs like "The Quiet Things No One Ever Knows." "The Boy Who Blocked His Own Shot" are clearly more indie. Alternative emo would be a good classifcation if emo were completely obliterated and replaced with "pop-punk." Breadboy I'm glad you at least try to discern what genre bands are. Your efforts in comprehension are respectable. Thank you.

DFelon204409
08-21-2004, 08:33 PM
hums like a telecaster - How about you read the thread before you post idiotic crap like that?

Happymeal
08-21-2004, 10:36 PM
Can't find emo cd's anywhere.. And I don't download mp3(this laptop sucks). Did they release their albums(Rites Of Spring, Indian Summer, etc etc..haven't listened to them yet) only on vinyl?

Hey DFelon, have you heard of The Fall Of Troy?? They're nothing groundbreaking really, but they have a tight sound("Ghostship Part Four" is ATDi-ish). www.purevolume.com/thefalloftroy In what category do they fit in?? Sorry to bother you and all.. but no one else here seems to notice them..

alkaline1832
08-21-2004, 10:58 PM
Alkaline Trio
Tuesday

br3ad_man
08-21-2004, 11:45 PM
Simple Plan and Good Charlotte are pop. Straight up. The faux-hawk doesn't make them any more punk than their whelping. Brand New's earlier stuff was clearly pop-punk. Listen to real pop-punk bands like Bodyjar or Millencolin and listen to Your Favorite Weapon. Notice the similarities? Brand New's new CD is more indie than anything else, excepting when they take Taking Back Sunday's dual vocal thing and also on way poppy songs like "The Quiet Things No One Ever Knows." "The Boy Who Blocked His Own Shot" are clearly more indie. Alternative emo would be a good classifcation if emo were completely obliterated and replaced with "pop-punk." Breadboy I'm glad you at least try to discern what genre bands are. Your efforts in comprehension are respectable. Thank you.

Yeah, YFW was pretty pop-punk. Some songs off DE have a pretty poppy sound, and others dont at all. Indie seems a strange classification to me though, they don't really sound much like Modest Mouse or Dinosaur Jr.

allmusic says that DE is pop-punk/emo. Is it possible that they are both. While they aren't very similar, I can see SOME similarities between them and Circle Takes The Square.

shane italian
08-22-2004, 12:03 AM
omg, you guys, are just lame, you have NO clue what screamo or emo is, and underoath IS SCREAMO! morons, i'll give a list of good emo/screamo bands,


Screamo:
Hidden In Plain View
Finch
Underoath

Emo:
brand new
the early november
straylight run
taking back sunday
Coheed & cambria
Matchbook romance

thats not all, im just not in the mood to think right now, but thats just to give you some examplesI can not express how I feel about you.

cbmartinez
08-22-2004, 01:07 AM
omg, you guys, are just lame, you have NO clue what screamo or emo is, and underoath IS SCREAMO! morons, i'll give a list of good emo/screamo bands,


Screamo:
Hidden In Plain View
Finch
Underoath

Emo:
brand new
the early november
straylight run
taking back sunday
Coheed & cambria
Matchbook romance

thats not all, im just not in the mood to think right now, but thats just to give you some examples

Never have I seen a post more wrong then that.

BuddyBigsby
08-22-2004, 01:31 AM
Yeah, YFW was pretty pop-punk. Some songs off DE have a pretty poppy sound, and others dont at all. Indie seems a strange classification to me though, they don't really sound much like Modest Mouse or Dinosaur Jr.

allmusic says that DE is pop-punk/emo. Is it possible that they are both. While they aren't very similar, I can see SOME similarities between them and Circle Takes The Square.

If you want to get technical, then Brand New are Poppy Post-Emo Indie Rock.

srt-4
08-22-2004, 02:56 AM
how do you pronounce saetia? like saytia? or saysha?

shane italian
08-22-2004, 03:00 AM
Saytia from what I know.

DFelon204409
08-22-2004, 03:11 AM
how do you pronounce saetia? like saytia? or saysha?

I always did "say she ah" like your latter example but "sayshea."

DFelon204409
08-22-2004, 03:20 AM
Yeah, YFW was pretty pop-punk. Some songs off DE have a pretty poppy sound, and others dont at all. Indie seems a strange classification to me though, they don't really sound much like Modest Mouse or Dinosaur Jr.

allmusic says that DE is pop-punk/emo. Is it possible that they are both. While they aren't very similar, I can see SOME similarities between them and Circle Takes The Square.

While allmusic is good on some things they're retarded on others. Their Blindside page (http://www.allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&sql=11:bl6ibks9jakv) is extremely spot on and informative. Just look at the similar artist and genre classification section. That's neat. Then read their one-sided emo explanation (http://www.allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&sql=77:4525). The first half was awesome. Then the second half they only payed attention to when indie become popular and ignorant people called it emo. Then instead of citing old school emo bands like Husker Du for their suggested listening they dive head first into recommending Mineral and Braid. Seriously...Weezer...emo?! WTF!!!!! C'mon! Alternative and indie are fitting definitions for Brand New.

DFelon204409
08-22-2004, 03:25 AM
Can't find emo cd's anywhere.. And I don't download mp3(this laptop sucks). Did they release their albums(Rites Of Spring, Indian Summer, etc etc..haven't listened to them yet) only on vinyl?

Hey DFelon, have you heard of The Fall Of Troy?? They're nothing groundbreaking really, but they have a tight sound("Ghostship Part Four" is ATDi-ish). www.purevolume.com/thefalloftroy In what category do they fit in?? Sorry to bother you and all.. but no one else here seems to notice them..

If you IM me I'll direct transfer songs to you.

Fall of Troy is definitely emoish dude. The screaming sounds more contrived but intense than emotional. The idea of screaming in emo is it's supposed to sound like a sputtering mess of honest emotion. Nonetheless when I listen to this I think instantly of the band Hot Cross, which is essentially emo with better instrumentalism and slicker production. I really love this! Thanks. (Also at this point I've only listened to "I just Got This Symphony Goin'" so I may change my opinion on the genre yet. So far it's awesome. I'd buy this CD. Where's it at.

srt-4
08-22-2004, 03:28 AM
thanks guys.

Happymeal
08-22-2004, 08:18 AM
If you IM me I'll direct transfer songs to you.

Fall of Troy is definitely emoish dude. The screaming sounds more contrived but intense than emotional. The idea of screaming in emo is it's supposed to sound like a sputtering mess of honest emotion. Nonetheless when I listen to this I think instantly of the band Hot Cross, which is essentially emo with better instrumentalism and slicker production. I really love this! Thanks. (Also at this point I've only listened to "I just Got This Symphony Goin'" so I may change my opinion on the genre yet. So far it's awesome. I'd buy this CD. Where's it at.

Actually I don't have AIM right now, but I'm thinking of signing up one of these days, thanks.

And my friend just told me about The Fall Of Troy a few days ago so I don't know much about them either so I'm doing a bit of research at www.thefalloftroy.com. Obviously I'm a noob, any stuff I can get from you vets I'm taking in and I really appreciate it. Thanks a bunch!

BuddyBigsby
08-22-2004, 08:30 AM
One of my favorite screamo bands Happymeal, they're called Kaospilot. Plus they're one of the few screamo bands I know of that has their music up on the internet, you should check them out. www.kaospilot.net

About Allmusic: Yeah, they can be pretty retarded when it comes to some stuff. Read the Rag Men review. They compare to them to Nickelback.

hums_like_a_TELECASTER
08-22-2004, 12:32 PM
hehehehehehehehehehehehehe heh he h

hums_like_a_TELECASTER
08-22-2004, 12:35 PM
old brand new could be pop-punk, other people migth say emo, its more emo then pop punk, specially soco armetto lime, that was deff more like the deja cd, but the one thingi have to say... OLD brand new and New brand new just kicks ***

DFelon204409
08-22-2004, 03:11 PM
old brand new could be pop-punk, other people migth say emo, its more emo then pop punk, specially soco armetto lime, im ignorant that was deff more like the deja cd, but the one thingi have to say... OLD brand new and New brand new just kicks ***

Are you done spamming yet?

Happymeal
08-22-2004, 06:24 PM
One of my favorite screamo bands Happymeal, they're called Kaospilot. Plus they're one of the few screamo bands I know of that has their music up on the internet, you should check them out. www.kaospilot.net

Ok, I'll check them out sometime, you keep mentioning Kaospilot when you give noobs a re-education.:p Thanks. But I think I have to buy a new PC first, this crappy laptop always crashes and gets viruses when I download stuff(I also don't want to get screamed at by my dad again).

I'm also digging Psyopus right now(they're grindcore, am I right?), they're freakin' great.

BuddyBigsby
08-22-2004, 07:00 PM
Psyopus' guitarist(s?) is/are jaw-droppingly amazing.

XemoXmoshXpitX
08-22-2004, 07:31 PM
Again, we need an emo/screamo thread. This should be stickied.

DFelon204409
08-22-2004, 07:34 PM
Psyopus' guitarist(s?) is/are jaw-droppingly amazing.

Ya they're great but they're not grind (happymeal). They're math meta'/progressive/grind.

Happymeal
08-23-2004, 07:20 AM
Ya they're great but they're not grind (happymeal). They're math meta'/progressive/grind.

That's a mouthful.:p Whatever you call them, they're awesome. "Death, I.."'s intro reminds me of Dream Theater..Weird.. I've only heard 3 songs and my favorite "The Long Road To The 4th Dimension"! It's a miracle the drums make it out alive after one song. The drummer is crazy. I don't get tired of anything progressive. I love that stuff.

That reminds me..I haven't listened The Blood Brothers yet..do they sound something like Fear Before The March Of Flames??? People say they're good. I wanna buy Burn Piano Island, Burn and I want to get an idea of what they sound like first.. Thanks again!

DFelon204409
08-23-2004, 03:11 PM
They're sort of like FBtMoF. I think they're much better. Go to www.espew.com and search for them. It should give you a few mp3s. They have most music up there. I recommend the songs "The Shame," "Fucking's Greatest Hits," and "Meet Me at the Waterfront After the Social."

capri sun junkie
08-23-2004, 08:17 PM
SILVERSTEIN is great!!!

DFelon204409
08-23-2004, 08:19 PM
SILVERSTEIN is great!!!

That's not funny. People who don't know you are going to not get it and start posting about pop-punk bands.

BuddyBigsby
08-24-2004, 02:03 AM
SILVERSTEIN is great!!!

I don't get you man. You're down with The Locust and Charles Bronson and then you have to go and pimp new Underoath and Silverstein.

capri sun junkie
08-24-2004, 07:24 AM
i dont get me either... its effed in the a

Happymeal
08-24-2004, 08:28 AM
I used to like Silverstein..before I got tired of them.:p

That reminds me, I'm liking The Locust too(cheapass Purevolume-er)..

They're sort of like FBtMoF. I think they're much better. Go to www.espew.com and search for them. It should give you a few mp3s. They have most music up there. I recommend the songs "The Shame," "****ing's Greatest Hits," and "Meet Me at the Waterfront After the Social."

Thanks. I will definitely check them out.. I'm torn between Burn piano island, Burn and Glassjaw's EYWTKAS(although I know they sound nothing like each other).

This is a useful thread. Keep it alive, people.

iliketoplaydrums1011
08-24-2004, 03:02 PM
Again, we need an emo/screamo thread. This should be stickied.

But then everyone will ignore it :rolleyes:

It will probably be better not stickified :)

capri sun junkie
08-24-2004, 04:06 PM
the blood brothers are truely an amazing band. but do you really consider them emo/screamo?

syurix
08-24-2004, 07:43 PM
Blood Bros are awesome, probably my favorite active band. If they're emo, its by way of the heavy Angel Hair and Drive Like Jehu(?) influences. If not, maybe they're post emo hardcore or something (but "crimes" defies hardcore, d*mn geniuses).

thanks for the rec on Fall of Troy, definitely emocore, it's got the caotic guitars, the screamy vocals, the defiance of obvious structures, the melodic flourishes.

iliketoplaydrums1011
08-24-2004, 08:41 PM
the blood brothers are truely an amazing band. but do you really consider them emo/screamo?


If i'm thinking of the right band, I'm pretty sure there screamo

DFelon204409
08-24-2004, 09:11 PM
Well the Blood Brothers definitely have some emo in them but like I mentioned on the first page, they're very diverse.

XemoXmoshXpitX
08-26-2004, 07:58 AM
But then everyone will ignore it :rolleyes:

It will probably be better not stickified :)


True, but one of these days, the thread will end up on the 2nd page, as it almost already did.

Happymeal
08-26-2004, 09:09 AM
Are there any more well-known emo/screamo bands nowadays, besides those that were mentioned(and Circle Takes The Square of course)? I think most of them broke up in the 90's...

loJic
08-26-2004, 12:57 PM
www.punchpeople.net for a very good high energetic band. Not really emo or screamo, but hey, they're good.

Bartender
08-26-2004, 01:22 PM
Why post them in here then?

shane italian
08-26-2004, 01:23 PM
Most likely a friend's band or he's on the street team...

NewKindofArmy03
08-26-2004, 01:32 PM
Psyopus' guitarist(s?) is/are jaw-droppingly amazing.
yeah, first time listening to them i would think they have like 3 guitarists, but they only have 1. but like i said before, i don't enjoy listening to them.

DFelon204409
08-26-2004, 01:47 PM
Most likely a friend's band or he's on the street team...

I'm on street teams but for good bands like Trophy Scars and Dillinger Escape Plan.

shane italian
08-26-2004, 04:16 PM
I'm on street teams but for good bands like Trophy Scars and Dillinger Escape Plan.I'm on Champion's "unofficial" street team. I use physical force to make people listen to them.

DFelon204409
08-26-2004, 06:27 PM
I'm on Champion's "unofficial" street team. I use physical force to make people listen to them.

I'm on a lot of unofficial street teams then.

Happymeal
08-27-2004, 10:03 AM
i forgot about Trophy Scars..I like them. Especially "..and that's where they found my body" with the jazzy keyboards. Although their sound reminds me a lot of Thursday(Post-hardcore??).. When the hell will they release a full album?? I don't get why bands release EP's with such good songs.. makes you want more.

loJic
08-27-2004, 11:28 AM
It's a friends band. Just trying to get them some publicity. It's hard down here in New Orleans for a rock band to be heard. They opened up for Buckethead at Howlin Wolf and were on the waiting list for VOODOO this year. So they're getting there, just need a couple of people in other states and countries to check em out. They're real melodic and emotional with there music, and they can have that Glassjaw edge at times. I just don't consider em Emo or Screamo. They have their on sound. Ya'll should check em out, and let me know what you think. www.punchpeople.net

DFelon204409
08-27-2004, 12:12 PM
i forgot about Trophy Scars..I like them. Especially "..and that's where they found my body" with the jazzy keyboards. Although their sound reminds me a lot of Thursday(Post-hardcore??).. When the hell will they release a full album?? I don't get why bands release EP's with such good songs.. makes you want more.

They're awesome and they do have a full length out (Darts to the Sea) and they will have another full length out soon. I have it in the mp3 form and it's tough to get online or anywhere actually so if you like you can IM me at DFelon204409. I'll be out a lot today but we'll see if we can work this.

Red is the new black
08-27-2004, 08:42 PM
i know its a bit late in the thread but post-emo indie rock your just making up a genre because you don't want to admit that taking back sunday and the like are emo. Yes emo has its roots but since then it has evolved because of people experimenting and listening to emo along with other genres of music just think about it, its the same with all music types they change to suit a different audience.

Red is the new black
08-27-2004, 08:43 PM
oh and just to add dillinger escape plan a good band, you make me p**s my self laughing.

Happymeal
08-27-2004, 09:04 PM
They're awesome and they do have a full length out (Darts to the Sea) and they will have another full length out soon. I have it in the mp3 form and it's tough to get online or anywhere actually so if you like you can IM me at DFelon204409. I'll be out a lot today but we'll see if we can work this.

They do?? I didn't know that too.:lol: oh well.. I'm trying to figure out how AIM works first.. I'm pretty stupid at these things really.:p But I'll try to download it this weekend if this laptop doesn't act sh*tty when I do. I'll contact you if everything goes well. Thanks.

BuddyBigsby
08-27-2004, 09:52 PM
i know its a bit late in the thread but post-emo indie rock your just making up a genre because you don't want to admit that taking back sunday and the like are emo. Yes emo has its roots but since then it has evolved because of people experimenting and listening to emo along with other genres of music just think about it, its the same with all music types they change to suit a different audience.

Hahahahahaha, no. Ok, let me break this down for you.

Post = After. So "Post-Emo" means after emo. Simple enough. But wait... aren't bands like Saetia and Hot Cross technically post-emo? Yes. So what makes bands like Sunny Day Real Estate different? They're more rock oriented, hence the Indie Rock.

...why in the hell would I not want to "admit" that Taking Back Sunday are emo? I don't care... I like bands like Taking Back Sunday that don't suck (Armor for Sleep) and I also like real emo. If you'd ever actually heard real emo rather than speak out of complete ignorance, you would see what I'm saying.

DFelon204409
08-27-2004, 10:30 PM
Hahahahahaha, no. Ok, let me break this down for you.

Post = After. So "Post-Emo" means after emo. Simple enough. But wait... aren't bands like Saetia and Hot Cross technically post-emo? Yes. So what makes bands like Sunny Day Real Estate different? They're more rock oriented, hence the Indie Rock.

...why in the hell would I not want to "admit" that Taking Back Sunday are emo? I don't care... I like bands like Taking Back Sunday that don't suck (Armor for Sleep) and I also like real emo. If you'd ever actually heard real emo rather than speak out of complete ignorance, you would see what I'm saying.

True that, nig.

A-Life-Less-Plagued
08-28-2004, 03:32 PM
What are Reach The Sky? They don't seem emo, but I guess they have the lyrics.

A-Life-Less-Plagued
08-28-2004, 03:37 PM
I guess they're just hardcore.

shane italian
08-29-2004, 12:02 AM
I guess they're just hardcore.Dude.......................WHAT THE EFF? Reach The Sky are hardcore no doubt man.

Wannabe Emo001
08-29-2004, 07:53 AM
whoa wait... isnt Thursday emo though?

Bartender
08-29-2004, 08:02 AM
Thursday are post-hardcore, I think.

DFelon204409
08-29-2004, 01:29 PM
whoa wait... isnt Thursday emo though?

I think the user name answers his own question. Of course not. Bartender is right.

Happymeal
08-30-2004, 07:34 AM
I heard Cecilia And The Silhouette Salloon by The Blood Brothers, and I was really impressed! I'm really gonna buy Burn Piano Island, Burn! Although I expected they were a little heavier, like a more melodic Converge or something.

CommieCanada
08-30-2004, 07:46 AM
i hate classifying bands uder the "post-something" genre. if Thursday is post-hardcore or post-emo or whatever, that means that the hardcore and emo movements had to end somewhere. So i supose my follow up question would be, when did hardcore and emo come to their end? or is it just that anything after the initial explosion is considered "post"?

Happymeal
08-30-2004, 10:36 AM
i hate classifying bands uder the "post-something" genre. if Thursday is post-hardcore or post-emo or whatever, that means that the hardcore and emo movements had to end somewhere. So i supose my follow up question would be, when did hardcore and emo come to their end? or is it just that anything after the initial explosion is considered "post"?

Now that you mention it, I never really thought about that... Well, Buddy and DFelon?? For me, I guess bands nowadays have more of a different sound than the original emo and hardcore bands that started the whole thing(although I've heard little about them)..but why not place them in another(or a new one) genre altogether to avoid all the "post" labeling?? And what the hell does post-punk sound like?!:confused:

Bartender
08-30-2004, 11:26 AM
I always thought post-genre meant something with its roots in the genre, but with differences (just not differences enough to make it a new genre).

Happymeal - The Cure get called post-punk.

Painful_Cheese
08-30-2004, 12:10 PM
Well from what i've heard Alexisonfire is emo/post-emo or something along those lines. So if it's true i'd recommend anything from their first album. (Not the second one, stay aawwaayy from the second one)

VoodooMagik
08-30-2004, 12:50 PM
hey painful cheese, i like their second album. I really like both even if the second is more... emo I guess?


Senses Fail and Unerderoath are also pretty good bands somewhere between emo and screamo.

DFelon204409
08-30-2004, 01:09 PM
Painful Cheese and Voodoo Magik go to the first page of this thread and read the first comment made by me. Notice none of your bands being those lists? There's a reason for that. The bands you mentioned are not emo at all. Go read up at www.fourfa.com and then listen to www.hxcmp3.com/bands/1710. Then as punishment for speaking ignorance go listen to every song at www.hxcmp3.com/bands/12660 (they're not emo; they're the equivalent of washing your mouth off with soap...aurally).

About the post-whatever argument, post has evolved to denote anything after the main wave of a genre that really expands on it and diversifies it. Thursday makes sense as a post-hardcore band because they have breakdowns but no where near the sense of modern hardcore and that of the early 1980's. They breakdown with clean open chords and freakin' arpeggiation and stuff. Thursday is a unique band and is tough to classify but they're certainly not screamo. They may have a splash in there because they'll "scream" with clean tone guitar but there isn't enough insane stuff to merit it being labelled as screamo or emo. In the case of The Cure, they're post-punk because they were in a genre with other bands that relied more heavily on punk. Devo and Joy Division put synth into and upbeat rock form and had a lot of punk guitar stuff in terms of palm muting going on. The Cure, who is undoubtedly in that genre, further expanded on pop-punk by including a lot of Alternative influences with arabian, latin, and other assorted feels entering the mix at other times. So ya, the post- label fits for a lot of stuff because a lot of bands have expanded on styles since 1979.

TMA
08-30-2004, 02:23 PM
From First To Last... good stuff. It commercialized Emo. It isn't the real thing, like what DeFelon is talking about, but... still. It's really good listenings.

Painful_Cheese
08-30-2004, 02:57 PM
www.fourfa.com pretty much cleared up emo and i'll try out some Circle Takes The Square and see if i like it. BUT i'm seriously going to listen to 'Optimus Prime, 5 DiGiorno Pizzas, and a Bag of Condoms Make One Awkward Morning After' by Dracula Core. I mean comeon, the title is so brilliant...

DFelon204409
08-30-2004, 04:03 PM
That's right. Eat it all up.

capri sun junkie
08-30-2004, 05:23 PM
Then as punishment for speaking ignorance go listen to every song at www.hxcmp3.com/bands/12660 (they're not emo; they're the equivalent of washing your mouth off with soap...aurally).

aww, i say that they are the equivilent to sex for the ears! ;)

BuddyBigsby
08-30-2004, 09:13 PM
www.fourfa.com pretty much cleared up emo and i'll try out some Circle Takes The Square and see if i like it. BUT i'm seriously going to listen to 'Optimus Prime, 5 DiGiorno Pizzas, and a Bag of Condoms Make One Awkward Morning After' by Dracula Core. I mean comeon, the title is so brilliant...

Hahahaha, yes. I came up with the title.

*does a little jig*

Happymeal
08-30-2004, 09:23 PM
Happymeal - The Cure get called post-punk.

Ok..I think I'm figuring post-punk out a bit..since punk became known in the 70's(Sex Pistols, etc etc), bands like The Cure and Joy Division(?) in the 80's sound somewhat reminiscent to them, but they created a different sound altogether(using synth and all)? I'm just so confused with so many genres out there.

I just downloaded some Antioch Arrow songs from epitonic, they're interesting.. I like it when the vocals really sing, I don't mind screaming, it just makes for a more interesting listen(like The Fall Of Troy, for example).

Bartender
08-30-2004, 09:33 PM
What's epitonic?

Happymeal
08-30-2004, 09:57 PM
What's epitonic?

I mean www.epitonic.com , sorry about that. It's a good source of Alt/Indie and even with some emo. Good site to do some research on. Hehe.

Bartender
08-30-2004, 10:02 PM
Thanks. I've been wanting to hear some Antioch Arrow from somewhere.

CommieCanada
08-30-2004, 11:39 PM
About the post-whatever argument, post has evolved to denote anything after the main wave of a genre that really expands on it and diversifies it.

In the case of The Cure, they're post-punk because they were in a genre with other bands that relied more heavily on punk.

yeah thats what i was thinking, as far as the "post" prefix was concerned.

if anyone wants to hear the Cure's post punk finest, listen to the song Boy's Don't Cry. it is just a 4 chord progression and is more fast paced, then most of their later works. actually their whole first album "Three Imaginary Boys" is like that, since they arrived on the music scene shortly after the initial explosion of UK punk

iliketoplaydrums10111
09-04-2004, 10:40 PM
Bump :)

cbmartinez
09-04-2004, 10:43 PM
Emo
Hot Cross
Saetia
Grade
A Day in Black and White
I Hate Myself
Indian Summer
Trophy Scars
Funeral Diner
Coffin
Song of Zarathustra
Moss Icon
Planes Mistaken for Stars
Native Nod
Spirit of Versailles
Amanda Woodward
Rites of Spring
Hoover
Still Life

Screamo
Love Like...Electrocution
Angel Hair
Antioch Arrow
Usurp Synapse
pageninteynine
Heroin
Clikitat Ikatowi
City of Caterpillar
Circle Takes the Square
Orchid
Neil Perry
Kaospilot
The Kite-Flying Society
The Khayembii Communique
The Vidablue
Portrait
combatwoundedveteran
lickgoldensky
Cowboys Became Folk Heroes
Joshua Fit for Battle
Jerome's Dream
You and I
Love Lost But Not Forgotten
The Great Redneck Hope
Textbook Traitors
As the Sun Sets
After School Knife Fight

Dance/Indie/Grind that is rooted in emo but is eclectic
The Blood Brothers
An Albatross
The Red Light Sting
Fear Before the March of Flames

contributors:
DFelon204409
BuddyBigsby
iHATEgc

I can't believe you forgot Envy! Japenese screamo, mmmmmm. And isn't The Number Twelve Looks Like You screamo?

CommieCanada
09-05-2004, 12:05 AM
/me adds Navio Forge to that list

Happymeal
09-05-2004, 07:30 AM
I've got to find that Trophy Scars cd somewhere..argh. haha

BuddyBigsby
09-05-2004, 02:18 PM
I can't believe you forgot Envy! Japenese screamo, mmmmmm. And isn't The Number Twelve Looks Like You screamo?

Oh yes, Envy!

I wouldn't say Number Twelve are screamo.

cbmartinez
09-05-2004, 02:25 PM
I wouldn't say Number Twelve are screamo.

What then? In that third category, influenced by screamo?

BuddyBigsby
09-05-2004, 02:45 PM
Grind, if anything.

Happymeal
09-06-2004, 10:59 AM
I'm still not sure if they fit in this category, but I just downloaded The Fall Of Troy's self titled, and it's freakin' amazing. I seriously recommend The Fall Of Troy to you guys.

bumskin
09-07-2004, 05:03 AM
Shai Hulud...Nuff Said
The Saddest Day (www.purevolume.com/thesaddestday) Theyre immense
Glassjaw

Erm, Brand New is quite emo im sure

BuddyBigsby
09-07-2004, 06:28 PM
Nope, shut up bumskin.

Happymeal
09-07-2004, 07:14 PM
The Saddest Day didn't work out for me.. And they really don't belong in here.

*promotes The Fall Of Troy-What Sound Does A Mastodon Make*

bohn
09-08-2004, 04:42 PM
Is this also a place for emo-core...or such music?


if so, I have some pretty kick booty bands to post up in hur.

shane italian
09-08-2004, 04:44 PM
Is this also a place for emo-core...or such music?


if so, I have some pretty kick booty bands to post up in hur.Emo is just a shortened term for Emocore. The genre didn't start as emo, but as emocore (because of the hardcore scene breaking out in DC). So I see the two as the same thing.

bohn
09-08-2004, 04:51 PM
I-personally-consider emo to be bands like Rufio and emo-core to be bands such as Avenged Sevenfold

shane italian
09-08-2004, 05:03 PM
I-personally-consider emo to be bands like Rufio and emo-core to be bands such as Avenged SevenfoldThis is the part where I tell you to read the thread. READ!

bohn
09-08-2004, 05:17 PM
I was just saying that is how I do it, and people that i know. Not everyone has to classify their music that same way.

shane italian
09-08-2004, 05:22 PM
I was just saying that is how I do it, and people that i know. Not everyone has to classify their music that same way.Hmm...maybe you should also stop classifying music. Genres don't bend and change like that because you think the lyrics are emotional. No, there is history behind genres that you can't change. Rufio are power pop and Avenged Sevenfold are metal...esque.

cbmartinez
09-08-2004, 06:04 PM
I'm digging The Great Redneck Hope hardcore. Their song titles are hilarious.

"A Rhetorical Question: What Do Christian Kids Talk About? (Ex: "God Is Awesome" "Totally!")"
"Pssst! Hey, the lord is awesome. Pass it on."
"Girl Are You Pregnant? It's Not My Fault! You Seduced Me!"

shane italian
09-08-2004, 06:08 PM
I'm digging The Great Redneck Hope hardcore. Their song titles are hilarious.

"A Rhetorical Question: What Do Christian Kids Talk About? (Ex: "God Is Awesome" "Totally!")"
"Pssst! Hey, the lord is awesome. Pass it on."
"Girl Are You Pregnant? It's Not My Fault! You Seduced Me!"Ah yes, who cannot love the Great Redneck Hope.

How about "Girl are down with bacteria, and if so will you come inside our tour van" I most likely ruined that one. Whatevs. I think I am gonna give them a listen right now actually.

Ramones Rock097
09-08-2004, 08:33 PM
blood brothers, snow patrol, army of freashmen, section 8, and tiger army

walker787
09-08-2004, 10:53 PM
what is senses fail classified under?

shane italian
09-08-2004, 10:59 PM
Pop Rock

Bartender
09-09-2004, 09:25 AM
blood brothers, snow patrol, army of freashmen, section 8, and tiger army

Is that the same Snow Patrol that are having success with singles here in England?

Also, I thought Tiger Army were rockabilly or psychobilly or something.

BuddyBigsby
09-09-2004, 10:17 AM
They are, but he's an idiot, you see.

Bartender
09-09-2004, 11:15 AM
Good point, well made.

iliketoplaydrums10111
09-11-2004, 12:10 AM
bumped because it's sinking

NoMoreHate
09-11-2004, 08:37 AM
Well I don't know much about the bands which most of you guys call emo, but you don't need to jump down someone's throat when they have a different opinion of what to class something as. What you call 'emo', I just call 'hardcore'. What you call 'post emo pop-punk' or whatever, I class that as 'emo'. I also have to say there are far more people in the world which classify bands like Taking Back Sunday as emo than people who classify the bands you mentioned as emo (as genres do evolve, change and whatever). It also depends on your previous musical background and taste as to what you call things.

But anyways my point was not everyone has to classify everything the same, that would suck. Nothing is set in stone :) (don't bother 'flaming' me if you don't like what I said, it's just an opinion).

Bartender
09-11-2004, 10:00 AM
Just a thought - why don't one of the big emo people here (the one who hates GC, Bigsby, DFelon even, if he's back long enough), do a Featured Genre article on emo/screamo for this forum, to try and clear up the constant misunderstandings?

Just a thought.

NoMoreHate
09-11-2004, 10:10 AM
Just a thought - why don't one of the big emo people here (the one who hates GC, Bigsby, DFelon even, if he's back long enough), do a Featured Genre article on emo/screamo for this forum, to try and clear up the constant misunderstandings?

Just a thought.

But the word means different things to different people. Alot would disagree with the article.

BuddyBigsby
09-11-2004, 12:35 PM
But the word means different things to different people. Alot would disagree with the article.

Yes, but unfortunately, genres aren't an opinion or an interpretation. I can go around all day saying John Coltrane is my favorite black metal frontman. Doesn't make it so.

What me, GC, and DFelon are saying is emo... really is emo. It came from bands like Rites of Spring, Moss Icon, etc. who were the first bands to receive the name "emo" which at the time was short for emotional hardcore. If you trace the history of the genre, you'll find the bands we listed are what emo has actually become, not bands like Taking Back Sunday. While the actual bands that influenced Taking back Sunday, Brand New, etc. were actually influenced by emo, they weren't entirely emo themselves. They were more rock than anything. I'm speaking of bands like Sunny Day Real Estate and Quicksand. This is what's referred to as Post-Emo Indie Rock, but I usually just refer to it as post-emo so as not to have to use that incredibly long genre name. Genres, once again, are not an opinion but are based around fact. Facts that we can present and facts that we can back up, unlike any single person naming off poppy post-emo bands in this thread.

Look at this website: www.fourfa.com

cbmartinez
09-11-2004, 12:38 PM
SDRE is post-emo indie rock? Or taking back sunday is post-emo indie rock?

Isn't majority rule screamo?

bohn
09-11-2004, 12:54 PM
you take this way to seriously. Its music, susposed to be fun....yeah..

NoMoreHate
09-11-2004, 01:03 PM
Look at this website: www.fourfa.com

Yeh I've checked out that site before and I get the whole 'real emo' thing (by the way thanks for not biting my head off like I expected) but, speaking objectively, the whole pop-punk kind of emo is what most people think about when they hear the word. It might be incorrect but eventually it's probably just going to be known as 'emo'. When I think 'emo', I think Funeral For A Friend, Finch, TBS. When I think 'Screamo' I think Alexisonfire, Underoath. I'm just musically illiterate but so is most of the world. Ah well it's just an opinion.

BuddyBigsby
09-11-2004, 01:10 PM
Yeh I've checked out that site before and I get the whole 'real emo' thing (by the way thanks for not biting my head off like I expected) but, speaking objectively, the whole pop-punk kind of emo is what most people think about when they hear the word. It might be incorrect but eventually it's probably just going to be known as 'emo'. When I think 'emo', I think Funeral For A Friend, Finch, TBS. When I think 'Screamo' I think Alexisonfire, Underoath. I'm just musically illiterate but so is most of the world. Ah well it's just an opinion.

And those people are wrong.

DFelon put it best when he said something to this effect:

It's like Michael Bolton in Office Space when he refuses to change his name because "I'm not the one that's wrong, he is. He sucks, not me"

BuddyBigsby
09-11-2004, 01:12 PM
SDRE is post-emo indie rock? Or taking back sunday is post-emo indie rock?

Isn't majority rule screamo?

SDRE were, and TBS are a distant offshoot of that. A lot of the bands in league with TBS are, but TBS themselves are way more poppy than SDRE and Quicksand.

Majority Rule are hardcore, but they do have a strong screamo undertone.

NoMoreHate
09-11-2004, 01:16 PM
And those people are wrong.

Yes they are, but like I said it's all about how many people believe something. Look at dollar bills, don't they say 'in God we trust' or something? (I'm assuming this because I'm not american) That's because most people believe in god. It doesn't mean they are right. Life's a bitch.

cbmartinez
09-11-2004, 01:18 PM
Yeh I've checked out that site before and I get the whole 'real emo' thing (by the way thanks for not biting my head off like I expected) but, speaking objectively, the whole pop-punk kind of emo is what most people think about when they hear the word. It might be incorrect but eventually it's probably just going to be known as 'emo'. When I think 'emo', I think Funeral For A Friend, Finch, TBS. When I think 'Screamo' I think Alexisonfire, Underoath. I'm just musically illiterate but so is most of the world. Ah well it's just an opinion.

I made the same argument. Then defintions of screamo, emo and hardcore have all morphed. And though we can't tell everyone in the world that they are wrong, we are at least trying to change and correct the views of those on this forum.

NoMoreHate
09-11-2004, 01:47 PM
I made the same argument. Then defintions of screamo, emo and hardcore have all morphed. And though we can't tell everyone in the world that they are wrong, we are at least trying to change and correct the views of those on this forum.

Yeh but eventually your use of the label (the proper use) will fade into obscurity and just not be used anymore the way you use it.

BuddyBigsby
09-11-2004, 01:50 PM
No, it's already "obscure" as it's going to get. There's still a strong fanbase of people that listen to emo and know what the word means. They're not just going to out of nowhere stop. The genre still gains new fans too. Take cb, when he came here he was just as misguided as the people we're talking about, and now look at him, he's genre nazi-ing with the best!

cbmartinez
09-11-2004, 01:57 PM
Take cb, when he came here he was just as misguided as the people we're talking about, and now look at him, he's genre nazi-ing with the best!

'Tis true. When I was a n00b like yourself, I called Poison the Well hardcore, Thursday screamo and Saves The Day emo. It was ugly. But I soon learned from the best of the best, Buddy, iHATEgc and Dfelon. I tried to hang on bitterly to my false realities, but now, I''m pwning many a noob so that one day, they might ride along side the greats.


That was so epic.

CommieCanada
09-11-2004, 01:58 PM
'Tis true. When I was a n00b like yourself, I called Poison the Well hardcore, Thursday screamo and Saves The Day emo. It was ugly. But I soon learned from the best of the best, Buddy, iHATEgc and Dfelon. I tried to hang on bitterly to my false realities, but now, I''m pwning many a noob so that one day, they might ride along side the greats.


That was so epic.
same here. i used to suck as much as you

Happymeal
09-11-2004, 03:37 PM
same here. i used to suck as much as you

123

syurix
09-11-2004, 05:13 PM
So where do lifetime and their inadvertant progeny fall into all of this?

shane italian
09-11-2004, 05:48 PM
Take cb, when he came here he was just as misguided as the people we're talking about, and now look at him, he's genre nazi-ing with the best!This is not a coalition, people.

CommieCanada
09-11-2004, 06:11 PM
So where do lifetime and their inadvertant progeny fall into all of this?
well, i know Lifetime is emo.

finchRULES
09-11-2004, 06:38 PM
In all seriousness, Finch is very talented. Even live! I hate bands that are talented on recording, and are awful live. :)

NewKindofArmy03
09-11-2004, 06:51 PM
too bad finch isn't emo. lifetime is considered emo? i always thought they were pop-punk or melodic punk.

shane italian
09-11-2004, 06:51 PM
In all seriousness, Finch is very talented. Even live! I hate bands that are talented on recording, and are awful live. :)No, their singer was drunk in Dallas. They sucked.

BuddyBigsby
09-12-2004, 01:07 AM
So where do lifetime and their inadvertant progeny fall into all of this?

I've only heard Lifetime and not enough to classify them.

and what the hell? You know more than us on this subject and you know it. You're just quiet. Damn you hogging the emo.

DFelon204409
09-12-2004, 11:24 AM
For some reason I feel like Lifetime would not be emo. Finch should be banned from this thread.

cbmartinez
09-12-2004, 11:25 AM
DFelon has returned!

DFelon204409
09-12-2004, 11:28 AM
Not really. I'm just procrastinating stuff on a Sunday morning and thought I'd splash a little anti-misnomer talk in here.

cbmartinez
09-12-2004, 11:29 AM
Oh. You gotta stop by more often.

Happymeal
09-13-2004, 06:05 AM
Hey DFelon, I thought you said Trophy Scars was post-hardcore in your EP review, but then it's in the emo list on the first page? Hair-trigger Flamenco is very cool by the way.

CommieCanada
09-13-2004, 08:15 AM
For some reason I feel like Lifetime would not be emo.
why not? i think they fit the category quite well

shane italian
09-13-2004, 05:32 PM
Not really. I'm just procrastinating stuff on a Sunday morning and thought I'd splash a little anti-misnomer talk in here.Bitch, I got my user name changed so I believe it's time for you to change the credits. :)

Ramones Rock097
09-13-2004, 07:39 PM
Tiger Army may not be emo, but they are a really good band and i would call them emo. Some people dont think of stuff as the same, some people say that the Ramones are punk others say pop-punk. Its almost an interpratation of the sound, they are like most other emo bands. O ya and the Ramones are definatly punk. :thumb:

BuddyBigsby
09-13-2004, 08:52 PM
Tiger Army may not be emo, but they are a really good band and i would call them emo. Some people dont think of stuff as the same, some people say that the Ramones are punk others say pop-punk. Its almost an interpratation of the sound, they are like most other emo bands. O ya and the Ramones are definatly punk. :thumb:

Drive into a tree.

listerine ice cream
09-15-2004, 07:40 AM
Tiger Army may not be emo, but they are a really good band and i would call them emo. Some people dont think of stuff as the same, some people say that the Ramones are punk others say pop-punk. Its almost an interpratation of the sound, they are like most other emo bands. O ya and the Ramones are definatly punk. :thumb:

hahahaha, i hope you find a dead baby's arm in your happy meal today.

Thechristianslovetheirguns
09-15-2004, 11:47 AM
tell which of these bands do you consider emo (or screamo):

the get up kids
my chemichal romance
taking back sunday
alkaline trio
finch
the early november
dashboard confessional
thrice
funeral for a friend
juliana theory
pedro the lion
homegrown
something corporate
a static lullaby
avenged sevenfold
brand new
story of the year
three days grace
matchbook romance
hidden in plain view
coheed and cambria
saves the day
jimmy eat world
the used
glassjaw
lost prophets
hoobastank
sugarcult
fugazi

Happymeal
09-15-2004, 06:01 PM
hahahaha, i hope you find a dead baby's arm in your happy meal today.

:eek:

That Portrait song is so hard to find.. I couldn't resist it "violins" was mentioned. Well, is Trophy Scars emo or post-hardcore???

Ramones Rock097
09-15-2004, 07:37 PM
listerine ice cream is a dumb-dumb head. (cartman voice)

skreamo_kid
09-15-2004, 10:23 PM
My favorite screamo/emo bands are:

Taking Back Sunday
Finch
Five Minute Ride
Brand New
The Used

Bartender
09-15-2004, 10:28 PM
Did you even read the thread?

DFelon204409
09-16-2004, 12:42 AM
tell which of these bands do you consider emo (or screamo):

the get up kids
my chemichal romance
taking back sunday
alkaline trio
finch
the early november
dashboard confessional
thrice
funeral for a friend
juliana theory
pedro the lion
homegrown
something corporate
a static lullaby
avenged sevenfold
brand new
story of the year
three days grace
matchbook romance
hidden in plain view
coheed and cambria
saves the day
jimmy eat world
the used
glassjaw
lost prophets
hoobastank
sugarcult
fugazi

Only one band on that list was even close to emo and that was Fugazi

That Portrait song is so hard to find.. I couldn't resist it "violins" was mentioned. Well, is Trophy Scars emo or post-hardcore???

Trophy Scars treads the line very convincingly but considering their lyrical content, I'd say post-hardcore. IM BuddyBigsby or IHateGC for the song. I forget which gave it to me. I guess you could get it from me too actually but this place may have a firewall.

DFelon204409
09-16-2004, 12:45 AM
Tiger Army may not be emo, but they are a really good band and i would call them emo. Some people dont think of stuff as the same, some people say that the Ramones are punk others say pop-punk. Its almost an interpratation of the sound, they are like most other emo bands. O ya and the Ramones are definatly punk. :thumb:

http://www.musicianforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=155921&page=1

Tiger Army is self-proclaimed psychobilly.

BuddyBigsby
09-16-2004, 12:50 AM
:eek:

That Portrait song is so hard to find.. I couldn't resist it "violins" was mentioned. Well, is Trophy Scars emo or post-hardcore???

Yeah, it took me forever to first find it too. IM me at whothenow and I'll send you it.

Phoenix In Flight
09-17-2004, 02:24 AM
Converge
they are screamo / hardcore i guess
they are probably the best band i've heard of

Happymeal
09-17-2004, 05:31 AM
I wouldn't call Converge screamo. They're more of grindcore/metalcore than anything else, they have a hint of emo sometimes though..

listerine ice cream
09-18-2004, 12:47 AM
listerine ice cream is a dumb-dumb head. (cartman voice)

beehotch please

cbmartinez
09-18-2004, 02:36 PM
Transisitor Transisitor, emo?

iliketoplaydrums1011
09-19-2004, 09:35 PM
I wouldn't call Converge screamo. They're more of grindcore/metalcore than anything else, they have a hint of emo sometimes though..

Converge = Emo, nah

BuddyBigsby
09-19-2004, 11:55 PM
Converge = Emo, nah

You = knowing what emo is, nah.

Link
09-21-2004, 07:03 PM
Emo/screamo/hardcore/metal:

Thursday
Atreyu
Hopesfall
From Autumn to Ashes
Unearth
Underoath
Thrice
Odd Project
Alexisonfire
Boysetfire
Funeral for a Friend
I Have Dreams
Shai Hulud
The Beautiful Mistake

and lots o'more...

cbmartinez
09-21-2004, 07:09 PM
Emo/screamo/hardcore/metal:

Thursday
Atreyu
Hopesfall
From Autumn to Ashes
Unearth
Underoath
Thrice
Odd Project
Alexisonfire
Boysetfire
Funeral for a Friend
I Have Dreams
Shai Hulud
The Beautiful Mistake

and lots o'more...

None of those are emo or screamo. You fail. 0%

Link
09-21-2004, 07:23 PM
None of those are emo or screamo. You fail. 0%

nope, you can whipe away the emo, but there are truly screamo bands I mentioned. Most of them are hardcore/metal bands, but they all have different styles in their music.

shane italian
09-21-2004, 08:08 PM
Thursday - Pop Rock
Atreyu - Psuedo Metalcore
Hopesfall - Psuedo Metalcore
From Autumn to Ashes - Psuedo Metalcore
Unearth - Psuedo Metalcore
Underoath - Pop Rock/Metal
Thrice - Pop Rock
Odd Project - dunno
Alexisonfire - Pop Rock
Boysetfire - dunno
Funeral for a Friend - Pop Rock/Metal
I Have Dreams - dunno
Shai Hulud - Metalcore
The Beautiful Mistake - Pop RockYou lose

CommieCanada
09-21-2004, 11:30 PM
how are Thursday and Alexisonfire pop-rock? they don't have enough hooks or mainstream radio play to warrent that label. they are post-emo for sure, but pop-rock?

BuddyBigsby
09-22-2004, 01:42 AM
nope, you can whipe away the emo, but there are truly screamo bands I mentioned. Most of them are hardcore/metal bands, but they all have different styles in their music.

Spend less time in Hot Topic.

Link
09-22-2004, 04:11 AM
You lose

Have you god any idea what pop-rock is?

And psuedo-metal is not a genre, you just think that it is a kind of metal but you don't know how to define is.

A band like odd project, or atreyu is more Melodic Metalcore!

Link
09-22-2004, 04:28 AM
I know, it is useless to talk about genres like emo/screamo etc. especially with people who think they know everything

Everybody wants to put it in boxes. This band is this..., this band is this... blablabla. When I previously mentioned some bands, it was a way to show other people some bands, if they like genres related to the socalled genres they can listen to these bands.

cbmartinez
09-22-2004, 02:50 PM
No. Screamo was a genre before The Used and Thursday came around. Check out some of the bands listed under screamo. You will then find that none of the bands you listed have an ounce of screamo in them.

syntaxerror
09-22-2004, 04:56 PM
critisize me.

what do you think of. bright eyes and a static lullaby

Happymeal
09-22-2004, 05:16 PM
^Dude, start from the first page of this thread and you'll have a pretty good idea of what the other guys are going to say.

cbmartinez
09-22-2004, 05:21 PM
critisize me.

what do you think of. bright eyes and a static lullaby

Bright Eyes= Indie (they suck)
A Static Lullaby= Emocore/Metalcore or Pop-Punk/Metal

*Note: Just because I used emocore, doesn't mean they have any emo in them. I've just yet to come across a better name for Pop-Punk with screaming, so I still use the misnomer emocore.

syntaxerror
09-22-2004, 05:57 PM
oh god,, haha.. talk about specific labelling. it's okay, i just wanted to see what other people thought ;)

DFelon204409
09-23-2004, 01:13 AM
I know, it is useless to talk about genres like emo/screamo etc. especially with people who think they know everything

Everybody wants to put it in boxes. This band is this..., this band is this... blablabla. When I previously mentioned some bands, it was a way to show other people some bands, if they like genres related to the socalled genres they can listen to these bands.

Well the main problem is that you suggested if people like emo then they should check out a bunch of bands that aren't emo. How are you helping at all?

Happymeal
09-23-2004, 06:19 AM
I listened to Hot Cross, City Of Catrepillar and Amanda Woodward for the first time. I think they're very good. It's a shame that emo/screamo bands generally don't get much support and better production would be nice.. But I guess that's the premise of emo bands.

I'm deciding on buying Burn Piano Island, Burn but I'm wondering if I'm better off waiting for Crimes to come out. What do you think?

cbmartinez
09-23-2004, 04:31 PM
Buy This Adultery Is Ripe.

I think Tangy Zizzle said that he loved Crimes. But my friend said she didn't like it at all. So I say, get the best Blood Brothers album, This Adultery Is Ripe.

Happymeal
09-23-2004, 06:04 PM
I've been thinking of buying it too but it's so hard to find it in my area.. I find it kinda hard to get into, it's a bit artsier than BPIB but it's growing on me. I dl'ed Rescue and Doctor! Doctor!, I'm liking them right now.

cbmartinez
09-23-2004, 06:38 PM
I lot of people prefer the catchy tunes of BPIB, but This Adultery Is Ripe is really their best work I think.

XemoXmoshXpitX
09-24-2004, 09:25 PM
So what is your guys opinion on screamo's connection to emo? Is it emotional screaming, or is it just....screaming?

cbmartinez
09-25-2004, 10:29 AM
Screamo is like really chaotic grind, but unlike grind bands like The Locust and Daughters, the lyrics and music usually have more meaning, art and emotion in them. Or a sometimes easier definition that is used is grind with breakdowns, because there are usually breakdowns to contribute to that sense of beauty, etc.

http://www.purevolume.com/circletakesthesquare
http://www.purevolume.com/thegreatredneckhope

Happymeal
09-25-2004, 10:56 AM
I didn't know The Great Redneck Hope's on purevol:eek: There's like dozens of great bands in Purevolume amid the stale pop punk facade.

GloryFaded
09-25-2004, 02:49 PM
why are most emo'ers such classification natzis. i can understand why you would not like some emo/screamo/hardcore/melodic hardcore bands because they arn't what you like, but its dumb to make fun of someone or even say you HATE someone you never met just because they have a different musical view than you do, even though they think enough of the music that you like to post it on a forum. And what the hell is wrong with people commenting on a band they strongly dislike, when they obviously don't own an album by them. I think before you cut down a band or a person you should actually know what your dealing with and not follow along in a crowd in which you feel emotionally safe cause your just sucking up to who you think is arbitrally in command (Dfelon) Anyways, to set the record straight, emo/screamo both share similar qualities. Both consist of emotionally charged lyrics or themes, somtimes with or without screaming, and have a loud soft guitar dynamic. That is emo no matter which way you slice it. So anything that fits into that catagory has to be emo, if you like the band or not, its still emocore.

BuddyBigsby
09-25-2004, 02:50 PM
I don't know about The Great Redneck Hope being screamo. The emphasis is on being chaotic and heavy, rather than having that emotion shine through. I hear virtually none of it.

cbmartinez
09-25-2004, 05:46 PM
That's true, but on "A Rhetorical Question: What Do Christian Kids Talk About? (Ex: "God Is Awesome" "Totally!")" there's like that soft piano part outro thing.

BuddyBigsby
09-26-2004, 01:16 AM
Yeah but that doesn't make them screamo.

cbmartinez
09-26-2004, 09:32 AM
stfu

XemoXmoshXpitX
09-26-2004, 01:16 PM
Is Strike Anywhere screamo?

LOVE THAT BAND!!

CommieCanada
09-26-2004, 01:44 PM
Is Strike Anywhere screamo?

LOVE THAT BAND!!
strike anywhere is punk.

moron

DFelon204409
09-26-2004, 08:20 PM
Anyways, to set the record straight, emo/screamo both share similar qualities. Both consist of emotionally charged lyrics or themes, somtimes with or without screaming, and have a loud soft guitar dynamic. That is emo no matter which way you slice it. So anything that fits into that catagory has to be emo, if you like the band or not, its still emocore.

Emo always has some form of screaming or shouting. The point is you're supposed to let out the emotion are hard as you can. Singing rarely cuts it unless it's so saturated with/fitting to the emotion of the song. When it is all screaming and doesn't vary much in magnitude or tone, the emo is rendered screamo. Ta da!

Also, you didn't include many of the musical components of emo. You just said that they have a loud soft guitar dynamic, which is often true but you're neglecting the fact that emo doesn't follow the verse chorus verse paradigm. It has mostly clean tone guitar and bass so that when the songs get fast and chaotic, which they do, the sound isn't heavy as much as it is abrasive, which complements the similar vocal style. Want me to go on? I have a bio lab to prepare and I don't want to spend the evening beating you in this argument. Just go away and masturbate in your closet while watching the OC.

cbmartinez
09-27-2004, 02:51 PM
Emo always has some form of screaming or shouting. The point is you're supposed to let out the emotion are hard as you can. Singing rarely cuts it unless it's so saturated with/fitting to the emotion of the song. When it is all screaming and doesn't vary much in magnitude or tone, the emo is rendered screamo. Ta da!

Also, you didn't include many of the musical components of emo. You just said that they have a loud soft guitar dynamic, which is often true but you're neglecting the fact that emo doesn't follow the verse chorus verse paradigm. It has mostly clean tone guitar and bass so that when the songs get fast and chaotic, which they do, the sound isn't heavy as much as it is abrasive, which complements the similar vocal style. Want me to go on? I have a bio lab to prepare and I don't want to spend the evening beating you in this argument. Just go away and masturbate in your closet while watching the OC.

Dfelon Owns All. Period.

CommieCanada
09-27-2004, 09:18 PM
Dfelon Owns All. Period.
agreed

syurix
09-27-2004, 10:14 PM
I don't know about The Great Redneck Hope being screamo. The emphasis is on being chaotic and heavy, rather than having that emotion shine through. I hear virtually none of it.

There's not any real emotional range to TGRH (at least from what I've heard of them), it's all a grind-style scream vocally, and the music is more technical than chaotic (think DEP vs. Heroin). I guess that you could say it's dynamically emo, but I tend to think that that would break the contraints and extent the proper emo tag to pretty much all midwest emo, because it employs the same dynamics.

cbmartinez
09-30-2004, 07:41 PM
I might have said this but I think Song Of Zarathustra and Clikitat Ikatowi should be switched on those lists. SOZ just seems more screamo to me. I've got some bands for the list though:

Emo:
Transistor, Transistor
Van Johnson (http://www.purevolume.com/vanjohnson)
Forstella Ford (http://www.purevolume.com/forstellaford)

Need Classification:
Ruins
Racebannon

jawbroken
10-01-2004, 01:02 PM
forstella ford is math rock, i thought. all this classification **** gives me a headache. but i agree with dfelon and the guy with the big list on the first page, plus a few bands. where the **** is indian summer? where the **** is still life? yaaaaaaaaawn.

BuddyBigsby
10-01-2004, 01:25 PM
Indian Summer and Stil Life have both been mentioned.

cbmartinez
10-01-2004, 01:59 PM
Did I classify those other ones right Buddy?

BuddyBigsby
10-01-2004, 03:38 PM
I'm not sure about Fortsella Ford...

Van Johnson, yeah. I don't remember what Transistor, Transistor and Racebannon sound like, and I've never heard Ruins.

Tangy zizzle
10-01-2004, 10:23 PM
Ruins = Japanese noise.

BuddyBigsby
10-01-2004, 11:46 PM
Ugh. Like Merzbow?

TMA
10-01-2004, 11:54 PM
I've been browsing around purevolume.com for independant bands. I found some really good ones.
When it comes to commercial Emo I recommend Bosio.
And, they have a different sound, IMO, but a good band (from Portland, Oregon, my hometown. Woot, bitches) is Duelesc. I also like Dear Whoever when it comes to the local scence.

Tangy zizzle
10-02-2004, 12:11 AM
Ugh. Like Merzbow?

A little, but they have much more cohesive sound. It's more noise-rock, with hardcore and prog influences.

Very good.

StormX
10-02-2004, 02:25 AM
Can anyone reccomend me some good bands that sound like Saetia. I started listening to them about a month ago and I love them, and I want to get into other bands that sound like that, kinda, that style.

cbmartinez
10-02-2004, 10:33 AM
A little, but they have much more cohesive sound. It's more noise-rock, with hardcore and prog influences.

Very good.

Nice to see someone who knows about them. They sounded impressive when I listened.

BuddyBigsby
10-02-2004, 08:01 PM
Can anyone reccomend me some good bands that sound like Saetia. I started listening to them about a month ago and I love them, and I want to get into other bands that sound like that, kinda, that style.

Firstly, Hot Cross. They have the same singer. I'm actually seeing them tonight.

Other good screamo:
After School Knife Fight
Usurp Synapse
Kaospilot
You and I
The Vidablue

cbmartinez
10-02-2004, 08:05 PM
I looked up every band on Level Plane last night, but I didn't have much luck (except for Van Johnson and Forstella Ford). But there are some weird bands on there. Anyway, I remember The Vidablue being on there. Have fun at the show.

*Missed Hot Cross when they came here with LickGoldenSky :upset:*

Gotkookie
10-03-2004, 01:00 AM
I looked up every band on Level Plane last night, but I didn't have much luck (except for Van Johnson and Forstella Ford). But there are some weird bands on there. Anyway, I remember The Vidablue being on there. Have fun at the show.

*Missed Hot Cross when they came here with LickGoldenSky :upset:*
level plane has good stuff, and some ****ty stuff

i'm_soooo_emo
10-04-2004, 07:32 AM
what would you class 'a perfect kiss' as. I got a few mp3s of them off hxcmp3.com and i really really like it, but what the hell is it?

topic to topic
10-04-2004, 08:02 PM
Check out my band.. Adora --- http://www.purevolume.com/adorama

Trust.... Will... Kill.. Me

Sorry if anyone gets mad that I posted it but a lot of people classify us as "screamo" so I thought I'd share.

Happymeal
10-04-2004, 08:30 PM
I'm really liking Bleeding Kansas right now.

/gots t3h Buddy fever

*dances to the tune of Boogie Nights*

BuddyBigsby
10-04-2004, 08:33 PM
Check out my band.. Adora --- http://www.purevolume.com/adorama

Trust.... Will... Kill.. Me

Sorry if anyone gets mad that I posted it but a lot of people classify us as "screamo" so I thought I'd share.

Haha, who are you in the band? I saw you guys at Jericho's a little while back with Trauma.

hollistersk808
10-04-2004, 08:42 PM
yeah id have to agree with u

hollistersk808
10-04-2004, 08:43 PM
nebody like "something corporate" ?

shane italian
10-04-2004, 08:46 PM
Haha, who are you in the band? I saw you guys at Jericho's a little while back with Trauma.It's a different Adora.

BuddyBigsby
10-04-2004, 08:48 PM
Oh. Well in that case

booooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

shane italian
10-04-2004, 08:50 PM
Hahaha, I know Adora now that I live in Irvine. How cool am I...I know...not that cool.

hollistersk808
10-04-2004, 08:50 PM
u guys are really boring haha no ones talking

shane italian
10-04-2004, 08:52 PM
Something Corporate are corporate pop rock.

topic to topic
10-04-2004, 09:00 PM
yeah unfortunately there's another adora out there.. but to answer your question, i'm the singer.

shane italian
10-04-2004, 09:08 PM
yeah unfortunately there's another adora out there.. but to answer your question, i'm the singer.I' listening to it right now. I dig these intro riffs a lot. Lead vocals sound pretty good for the style, but I don't dig the clean vocals. I like the harmonies a lot though. Good stuff besides the back up vox.

Who in the band is Shane? He must be a big pimp.

topic to topic
10-04-2004, 09:15 PM
Hahah yeah he is.. he's one of the guitarists... those vocals aren't me.. I just recently rejoined the band.. If you want to hear me sing I just finished recording a cover of a saosin song... http://207.36.181.131/breakcustom.mp3
... pretty ****ty since I recorded it on my computer.. but it'll give you an idea.. Our bassist Casey still does all the screams for Adora.
I used to play guitar for Adora then they replaced me with Shane.. Now I am a frontman.

shane italian
10-04-2004, 09:20 PM
Hahah yeah he is.. he's one of the guitarists... those vocals aren't me.. I just recently rejoined the band.. If you want to hear me sing I just finished recording a cover of a saosin song... http://207.36.181.131/breakcustom.mp3
... pretty ****ty since I recorded it on my computer.. but it'll give you an idea.. Our bassist Casey still does all the screams for Adora.
I used to play guitar for Adora then they replaced me with Shane.. Now I am a frontman.Wow dude, you really covered that song well. Kudos to you. Saosin are actually one of the few bands I REALLY like in their genre. I'm really digging this though.

topic to topic
10-04-2004, 09:21 PM
Thanks man, I'm glad you like it.. It really didn't come out bad considering I sang into a $5 labtec microphone on my computer... haha..

BuddyBigsby
10-04-2004, 09:50 PM
Speaking of which, my cheap Socom mic is getting a lot of hiss now for some reason, so Acapellica is delayed even further. :upset:

Irony My Friend
10-05-2004, 02:45 AM
^^*tear*

Irony My Friend
10-05-2004, 02:47 AM
Check out my band.. Adora --- http://www.purevolume.com/adorama

Trust.... Will... Kill.. Me

Sorry if anyone gets mad that I posted it but a lot of people classify us as "screamo" so I thought I'd share.
i like it :thumb:

DFelon204409
10-07-2004, 07:19 PM
I want to listen to these things but the hard drive on my computer fried again and I'm using my roommate's and he doesn't have speakers. I like Saosin. I want listen.

Happymeal
10-08-2004, 06:07 AM
Goodfellow Records omg omg omg

I ALMOST bought a Hot Cross(or This Adultery Is Ripe or R. Borlax) cd last weekend, but no money:upset:

cbmartinez
10-08-2004, 03:08 PM
This Adultery is where it's at.