The different genres of metal

[Kriz864]

Nightwish. Not agressive at all, and on most songs not heavy. Still metal.

Anthrax. Never heard a single drop of emotion from them (I have 2 albums). Still metal.

Tricky. Heavy, agressive, emotional. Not metal.

Public Enemy. Heavy, agressive, emotional. Not metal.

Just but 4 reasons why your theory is flawed.

I appreciate that you like both Korn and Opeth, but I can't help but think that the fact that you like them is clouding your judgement. It can be tempting to view 'metal' as this holy grail, a mighty seal of approval upon a band. It's not - it's a way of describing a band. Same with people viewing nu-metal as a way of slagging a band off. It's not - Deftones and Dredg being two prime examples of good, sometimes great nu-metal bands.

Korn are nu-metal. That doesn't prevent them from being good.

I know I'm judging you and I shoudn't, but that's the impression I got.

If you're looking for a reason why Korn are not metal, then let me offer this - for me, the key ingredient in metal is escapism. With all metal, the goal is to help the listener escape their mundane lives and go somewhere else. Even if it's a subconscious thing with the band making the music, it's still there. It's the very spirit of metal. Be it fantasy-based lyrics to take you to a different world, unbridled agression to make you thrash the pain away, outrageously complex guitar lines to make you dream of being able to play them, or just embracing the rock'n'roll lifestyle to make the listener think of how great it would be to be in a band and have millions of fans.

Korn, on the other hand, are not escapist in the least bit. They are incredibly grounded in reality - nobody wants to escape their own life and live in a world where you get raped by neighbours, bullied for liking Duran Duran, and never get laid, do they?!? The purpose Korn serve is to let the listener wallow in their pain, and appreciate a kind of beauty in suffering, and indulge thier fascinations in watching someone break down. I'm not saying Korn are particularly good at this, but that's what nu-metal does. That's not a bad thing - grunge does it too, and grunge is nowhere near as scorned. The only escapism in nu-metal is when a band sings about beating up and surpressing those who opress you - which will not only conjue up images from your own life, but will remind you you're being oppressed in the first place, so it's not really escapist.

See, I disagree. Korn/modern metal and more traditional sounding metal are both types of escapism. Korn's music is more like "you have suffered and I have suffered, and we're together in this". It's different from traditional metal, but it still lets you escape the world if, say, you have a bad day or something. And I don't consider metal a "holy grail".....Dave Matthews Band, Lynyrd Skynyrd, and 3 Doors Down are definately three of my all time favorites, but I don't consider any of those bands to be metal - not by a long shot, because they're not all that heavy or aggressive.

[evilmenhavenosongs]

He's my rolemodel. :evil:


Do you hope to burn a lot of ugly dwarves in your lifetime?

And am I right in saying that that guy just agreed to the post in which Iai said that Korn aren't metal?

[Steerpike]

See, I disagree. Korn/modern metal and more traditional sounding metal are both types of escapism. Korn's music is more like "you have suffered and I have suffered, and we're together in this". It's different from traditional metal, but it still lets you escape the world if, say, you have a bad day or something.

I disagree. Korn simply says there is suffering in the world. This is true. But compare it to say... Judas Priest or Rhapsody. Entirely different approaches.

Rhapsody use their albums to tell a fairy tale in which there is good and evil, joy and suffering. But in the end, good wins. That's the escapism. We see a fantasy land, and we get to dream that good always prevails. It's not necessarily true, but it's good for the soul to hear it.

Judas Priest take an attitude that "Life's a bitch, but she's my bitch." This has actually become my personal philosophy. Judas Priest offer up the rallying calls of struggling and fighting against the pain of the world. They don't simply tell you it's there. And they're not trying to say "we can be miserable together." They're saying, "We're not afraid to die, but more so, we're not afraid to live. We will fight with you."

[Steerpike]

Do you hope to burn a lot of ugly dwarves in your lifetime?

And am I right in saying that that guy just agreed to the post in which Iai said that Korn aren't metal?

No, but I do hope to manipulate people into doing my will.

And, I'm not sure. I'm a little confused there.

[kornedbeef]

ive been trying to say all along that korn isnt any form of metal lol.

theyre just a rock band that has hard music = hard rock.

dont flame this please.

"Nightwish. Not agressive at all, and on most songs not heavy. Still metal."

i think it was posted earlier, metal isnt an attitude, it's a sound and attitude.

the reason i say korn isnt nu-metal is because they dont rap, and they dont have the generic nu-metal set up, im not saying i hate nu-metal (i am a very big fan of linkin park and taproot) and i like korn so i dont want them called nu-metal, im trying to say people lump them with nu-metal like they lump pod mudvayne and soad. they just throw them in with that cause its the most similar genre of metal, but these bands are just hard rock music.

[evilmenhavenosongs]

I could have sworn that you said they were metal. If they are nu-metal, which they are, then there's no shame in that at all. It's a legitimate genre and which people bash slightly more than other genres. But that adds to the put upon my parents hate me and so does everyone else image so it's all good.


PS Steerpike, you need a monkey.

[Steerpike]

I could have sworn that you said they were metal. If they are nu-metal, which they are, then there's no shame in that at all. It's a legitimate genre and which people bash slightly more than other genres. But that adds to the put upon my parents hate me and so does everyone else image so it's all good.


PS Steerpike, you need a monkey.

Exactly. Nu-metal is simply a movement/genre of music. It gets a lot of flack from professional musicians because they're irritated over the fact that they spend years honing their talent to produce their own unique sound, and nu-metal bands which don't require very much technical skill make it huge by coasting on an image and a trend.

It's similar to how Samuel L. Jackson once said he hated Snoop Dogg (or however the hell he spells his name) because where as Jackson spent years of his life dedicated to learning to be an actor by studying human behavior, the world around him, and how to stretch his ability to express emotion; Snoop Dogg makes these piss poor movies because he decided he wanted more money, and people still buy them and take him seriously.

Wouldn't you feel cheated, too? But that's only one part of the reason nu-metal is such a controversial topic in the music world.

And, I'd like to get a monkey, but with all the red tape involved, I'm considering just getting a greyhound, a llama, and possibly a ferret or python.

[kornedbeef]

Steerpike: Exactly. Nu-metal is simply a movement/genre of music. It gets a lot of flack from professional musicians because they're irritated over the fact that they spend years honing their talent to produce their own unique sound, and nu-metal bands which don't require very much technical skill make it huge by coasting on an image and a trend.

It's like the Nirvana effect, they can play music, and they can write good songs, but they know that if they act trendy and play something that sounds cool but is easy to play, they'll get big fast. It's just lazy people trying to appeal to people who like cool sounding guitar (regardless how crappy it is)<------me, and people who like rap.

[evilmenhavenosongs]

Llamas aren't sinister enough, how can you be sinister with a llama? But a greyhound would do; they're lazy too so you wouldn't have much work to do.

To a certain extent I think musicians are right to look down on nu-metal talentwise as it generally is less talented than other genres. However, it is a valid expression of the soul when it is done properly as is every other genre; there are complexities in areas of it that other genres don't have and vice versa. Bands that don't do things well occur in all genres and people don't look down on those genres for it unless they're close-minded, in the end it all comes down to personal choice and in the end that's how the world works even though I would prefer it if everyone agreed with me all the time. I would be a great dictator.

[kornedbeef]

speaking of nu/rap-metal whatever u wanna call it (i prefer the term rap-metal cause that's what it is: rap first metal second), anyone hear that new Good-Charlotte song, they get worse every day, it has a rap part! theyre awful

[Kingofdudes]

speaking of nu/rap-metal whatever u wanna call it (i prefer the term rap-metal cause that's what it is: rap first metal second), anyone hear that new Good-Charlotte song, they get worse every day, it has a rap part! theyre awful

Good Charlotte is pop-punk. But no need to get into that :p

[IronMaiden>You]

Nice list but Iron Maiden heavy? You should have a lighter category, because I'm pretty sure they're not heavy. Ligter Metal: Categorized by better vocalists and lighter distortion, guitar harmonies are key, less use of death and evil as a topic in songs. Key Bands: Iron Maiden, Helloween, Metallica, Thin Lizzy (not exactly metal, but they did contribute to the genre)
I'd say bands like Sabbath belong under "Heavy Metal". THIS IS NOT A CONFRONTATIONAL POST. Just suggestions :)

[Kingofdudes]

Heavy Metal bands arent exactly heavy, "Heavy Metal" bands are some of the first waves of metal bands to come out(which includes Maiden).

[IronMaiden>You]

Heavy Metal bands arent exactly heavy, "Heavy Metal" bands are some of the first waves of metal bands to come out(which includes Maiden). Ohh, so more like pioneer metal? I guess that'd work as a category, but some are extremes on the spectrum, Iron Maiden and Black Sabbath could both be considered pioneers, but sound nothing alike

[Steerpike]

Maiden is NWOBHM.

[RivFader]

^what?

[Kingofdudes]

^what?

New Wave of British Heavy Metal

[IronMaiden>You]

New Wave of British Heavy Metal Ya, but not much else to add to that category so don't bother

[Steerpike]

Ya, but not much else to add to that category so don't bother

Do some research. There are more bands in the genre, but very few lasted very long.

[kornedbeef]

Good Charlotte is pop-punk. But no need to get into that :p

good charlotte can't even be considered punk-pop....

lol

[Iai]

The problem with New Wave Of British Heavy Metal is that it's not new anymore. :) So most of the bands have been forgotten. But they're definitely out there. Saxon, Diamondhead....more I can't remember right now....

Shame the people naming it never thought at the time that it wouldn't be New forever.

[Bartender]

Every time someone mentions Saxon, I have to go listen to Denim and Leather. I've done it twice tonight because of you.

[Iai]

Every time someone mentions Saxon, I have to go listen to Denim and Leather. I've done it twice tonight because of you.

:cool:

[schweinhunt]

See, I disagree. Korn/modern metal and more traditional sounding metal are both types of escapism. Korn's music is more like "you have suffered and I have suffered, and we're together in this".
It's not escapism, it's saying the only thing you're worth anything for is at being worthless. Cobain may have said "It's ok to suck because that's the only thing I'm good at".

Shame the people naming it never thought at the time that it wouldn't be New forever.
Stravinsky is older than shít (and deader than Baloff!), if anyone is familiar with the neo-classical composer.

[Phil Anselmo]

does anyone know what the hell dark metal is?

[kornedbeef]

Dark Metal is just a name that people refer to both Black and Death Metal in, It's pretty much just "satanic, evil stuff"

[Phil Anselmo]

also, what is atmospheric metal?

[kornedbeef]

probably another one of those sub-genres of a sub-genre's sub-genre's

[Kingofdudes]

never heard of them, where do you find these at?

[Phil Anselmo]

www.metal-archives.com

a gargantuan amount of genres...half of them ive never even heard of

[Kingofdudes]

Oh, I've never used the genre search before . Ill try that out later.

[Phil Anselmo]

its the most specific and detailed metal website ever

[GothLoveMetal]

What about Love Metal?

Check out the love metal sensations

www.IconAndTheBlackRoses.com

www.Heartagram.com

www.charon.cjb.net

Believe me its worth it!

[Iai]

Love Metal is a silly name that all the HIM fans use for Gothic Metal.

[Kingofdudes]

Love Metal is a silly name that all the HIM fans use for Gothic Metal.

beat me to it

[Stoic]

Love Metal is a silly name that all the HIM fans use for Gothic Metal.

remove the metal and I... :thumb:

[Steerpike]

You're banned. See you in hell.

[Kingofdudes]

he didnt even link to it right

[Steerpike]

Yeah, but l figure if he thinks spamming like this will get more people to frequent that site, he's not terribly bright to begin with.

[Herr Walter]

Yeah, i'm banned.. RIGHT

[Iai]

Oh, go away, you moron. You fail at life, and especially at making links.

[Herr Walter]

I know.. But you can;t judge about my life..

[Iai]

I know.. But you can;t judge about my life..

Actually, I can. Your actions just now in these forums have proven to me that you lack the basic capacities and mental functions needed to succeed at life.

[Kingofdudes]

lets see your forums....

In total there is 1 user online :: 0 Registered, 0 Hidden and 1 Guest
Most users ever online was 16 on Sun Jan 11, 2004 8:33 am


YOU FAIL!

[Steerpike]

I know.. But you can;t judge about my life..

Oh yeah? I think I just did.

You can't spam properly, you can't troll properly. And since you have ot be pathetic to do both to begin with, that's pretty friggin' sad. I would pity you if you had done anything to earn it. But as it stands, you're too inconsequential for me to do anything more than laugh at you. At least, I would if you were in the least bit funny.

Get back in your cage.

[Herr Walter]

Nope, you can't because there is something little more in a life than only spamming.. It's only a matter of getting attention.

[Iai]

I was wondering when this moron would hit the brick wall known as Steerpike.

[Iai]

Nope, you can't because there is something little more in a life than only spamming.. It's only a matter of getting attention.

Well done. You have attention. 10 minutes ago only you realised that you fail at life. Now, everyone who visits these forums does! Nicely done, my son, you've accomplished something.

[Steerpike]

Nope, you can't because there is something little more in a life than only spamming.. It's only a matter of getting attention.

Yeah, and this level of attention must have you humping the desk right now.

I expect you to amuse me before you're banned. Gotta justify your existence somehow. Now get to work.

[Herr Walter]

And there is a little differance between real life and computers

[Steerpike]

And there is a little differance between real life and computers

By the look of things, you're substituting the computer for real life. Otherwise, you wouldn't feel the need to spam your site here and then stick around to argue.

[Herr Walter]

It's also a little pathetic if you depent your life on computers. En judge people about their lifes.

[Steerpike]

I was wondering when this moron would hit the brick wall known as Steerpike.

Exactly. Do not attempt to argue with me. I know all.

[Herr Walter]

By the look of things, you're substituting the computer for real life. Otherwise, you wouldn't feel the need to spam your site here and then stick around to argue.

Like I said before: That's a matter of attention...

[Iai]

It's also a little pathetic if you depent your life on computers. En judge people about their lifes.

O noes!!!!1 He called us pathetic!! I'm shocked and disgusted.

[Steerpike]

It's also a little pathetic if you depent your life on computers. En judge people about their lifes.

Not at all. I'm spending a little free time after dinner on the internet. I like message boards. On-line communities have a charm to them in their anonymity that forces you to get to really know people.

And you make it sound as if people can stop themselves from forming judgements and opinions. Besides, the way you've acted, you have absolutely business complaining about the responses you're getting.

[Herr Walter]

I hope it didn't ruin your life

[Steerpike]

Like I said before: That's a matter of attention...

No, it's more of a matter of desperation.

[Herr Walter]

Yeah, you feel what i feel..

[Steerpike]

I hope it didn't ruin your life

Again, not at all. I humor you people for my own amusement. Your antics and banter can be quite entertaining. Though so far, I haven't been able to provoke a decent response out of you.

I'm stubborn though. I'll keep this conversation going a little longer.

[Steerpike]

Yeah, you feel what i feel..

Ah, the first spark of wit appears. Dim, weak, and poorly articulated but it's there.

Maybe I can coax something better out of you yet...

[Iai]

Yeah, you feel what i feel..

And now we have the Loser Move #16 - the self-pity routine! Watch as the failure casts light upon his failings, in a desperate attempt to draw sympathy from bystanders!

[Iai]

Those two posts would have been great if those links were disguised ******* links.

[Steerpike]

Hmm... Nope. Still not funny.

/sigh You know what? I'm bored. You had your chance, dude. I'm done with you.

[rikje-tikje]

shut up, nerd

[Herr Walter]

Kinda hilarious that you give me so much attention. And the meaning of it? Nothing... Just judge about my life and wish me dead.

No, THAT IS HAVING A LIVE!!!! go girls!!

[pastor jacobi]

I've really been struggling with trying to find the right metal bands for me. I absolutely adore Megadeth, and hope to expand into black/death metal. I'm looking towards complex music overall, but it doesn't have to be mind-boggling to be good. I know asking for suggestions is asking quite a bit, considering you don't know who I am, but the twist to make things even more difficult is I don't have a music download system to try out each band.



except for emperor maybe, you'll bee dissapointed with black metal if you want it technical, its simple riff progressions over and over again

btw: if you want black metal, ignore cradle of filth, they give a bad impression of it and aren't black metal at all(in my extremly humble opinion)

edit: aah ****, replied to an old post=), didnt see all the pages...

[Steerpike]

Happens to the best of us sometimes.

By the way, I just recently started to get into some black metal. I have some Celtic Frost stuff, and I've heard a couple Opeth songs (can't remember the names), but I was thinking of looking into stuff that's... tasteful. You know, a band that doesn't play just for shock value. Any ideas of where I can look?

[kornedbeef]

Celtic Frost is the very first Death Metal band, or at least that's what my one friend said. They kick *** though.

[Steerpike]

Death Metal? No. They influenced some Death Metal bands, but they were a Black Metal band with some Thrash elements.

[RivFader]

Into The Pandemonium by celtic frost was black metal or something else?

[Steerpike]

The only song I have from that album is Babylon Fell. Sounds like Black Metal to me.

[kornedbeef]

Whatever Celtic Frost is, they're amazing.

[sacrifice93.2]

This thread went from informative to bitch fight pretty quick.

[Steerpike]

Whatever Celtic Frost is, they're amazing.

I'm still getting used to Tom Warrior's vocals, but you have to give him credit, he is a talented songwriter. And he's also the only guitarrist I've ever heard that could play a solo that genuinely sounded as if it was made from chaos.

[pastor jacobi]

yep, celtic frost are wonderful, though i feel warriors vocals is not very good, he doesn't growl or sing just talk agressively sort of=)

best vocal work ever is on darkthrones album panzerfaust imo or deathcrush(mayhem)

[kornedbeef]

I don't like mayhem too much. They don't compare at all with Celtic Frost.

Plus I just started listening to Opeth. They kick ***.

[The pet beaver on bass]

maybe someone can help me in here im looking for this band I heard with some insane guitar, sorta a Children of bodom kinda sound but with singing and the name sounded to me like yingling mobscene or something but that came up with nothing.

[evilmenhavenosongs]

Yngwie Malmsteen by any chance? Insane speed and scales, neo-classical etc.

[The pet beaver on bass]

Yngwie Malmsteen by any chance? Insane speed and scales, neo-classical etc.

yeah thats it thanks

[Impaled Death]

Hi, Two questions.
1. What is Impaled Nazerane considered? (Listen to them at www.impnaz.com )
2. Are you from Minnesota?

[Deciever]

hardcore is punk attitude with fast,simple guitars.

FASTER guitars.

Ive heard people call emo bands like Atreyu hardcore and emo-core, and they're sure as hell not punk.

And if it was metal, but punky, wouldn't it be Thrash (or close to it).

And another, little thing. What about speed metal and power metal? Cuz' if power metal is an actual genre, wouln't it be bands like Iron Maiden and JP?

[Steerpike]

And another, little thing. What about speed metal and power metal? Cuz' if power metal is an actual genre, wouln't it be bands like Iron Maiden and JP?

Speed metal is just another name for Thrash. Power metal is a real genre, and Iron Maiden and Judas Priest are not part of it.

Here was the definition I submitted like 10 pages back:

Power Metal

Power Metal was largely inspired by the works of Iron Maiden and Ronnie James Dio. Helloween is often given credit for defining the genre as we know it today. Power metal is often scorned and laughed at by outsiders due to the over-the-top lyrics and high fantasy imagery. The music itself is typically defined by a driving rhythm section, usually featuring a lot of double bass drumming, and a tight sense of melody, thus requiring a high degree of technical skill and musicianship. The vocalists tend to be very diverse and it is difficult to find unifying themes across the genre, though a singer with a very strong, epic-sounding voice is common. The lyrical content of power metal often has high fantasy or sword & sorcery themes. Many power metal bands are known for an over-the-top stage presence. A prime example of which is Manowar, who have on two separate occassions broken the records as "The World's Loudest Band."

Notable Bands: Hammerfall, Blind Guardian, Helloween, Manowar, Nightwish, Rhapsody, (arguably) Iced Earth, Dragonforce

Looking back, I can't believe I forgot to include Stratovarius on that list.

[Codyism]

Speed metal is just another name for Thrash. Power metal is a real genre, and Iron Maiden and Judas Priest are not part of it.

Here was the definition I submitted like 10 pages back:



Looking back, I can't believe I forgot to include Stratovarius on that list.
As I was re-reading that I thought the same thing before I read what you typed.

omgz!1!11 im teh sykik11!11!!!1!1

[evil ernie]

The vocalists tend to be very diverse and it is difficult to find unifying themes across the genre, though a singer with a very strong, epic-sounding voice is common.

Very diverse? I think that power metal vocals are all about high pitched melodies, often including falsettos. I can't think of any power metal band that have a singer who's singing mid-range. Bands I consider power : (those you listed), Angra, Edguy, Dream Evil, Primal Fear, Sonata Arctica, Lost Horizon.

Oh and, by the way, where does Evergrey belong?

[Steerpike]

Very diverse? I think that power metal vocals are all about high pitched melodies, often including falsettos. I can't think of any power metal band that have a singer who's singing mid-range. Bands I consider power : (those you listed), Angra, Edguy, Dream Evil, Primal Fear, Sonata Arctica, Lost Horizon.

In retrospect, I probably should have said that the vocalists' ranges and training backgrounds tend to be similar, but they do have very diverse forms of expression.

Hansi Kursch has his majestic bellows. Tarja sings in pure opera. Fabio Lione and Timo Kotipelto have a classical/rock blend. Eric Adams focuses on pure savagery and aggression.

So they do remain diverse, at least in comparison to some other sub-genres of metal. Death metal's Cookie Monster vox comes to mind, as well as Black Metal's raspy, phlegmy grunts and croaks.

[Iai]

Okay guys - Nevermore. Where'd you place them? For me they hover between Power and Thrash.

[frankenstein203]

I only got to the second page but...

so far it seems like you all forgot RAP METAL!! DUH! The best type of metal there is!

Rap Metal is basically just what it says: people rapping and screaming. Rap metal bands are somewhat hard to come by. Most bands just have some songs be rap metal. For instance, V-Mob, half their stuff is rap metal. the other half is other kinds of metal. Also, slipknot's "spit it out" is an excellent example of rap metal.

aahhhh....I love rap metal... :thumb:

[Steerpike]

I'm not sure if rap metal is actually considered a genre. I think it's more of sub-movement of nu-metal.

And if you declare anything to be "the best," then you better be prepared to face some of this forum's more volatile personalities.

[evil ernie]

Ok Steerpike you have a point. Compared to death and black metal, power metal vocalists are a lot more diverse, even if death metal has its own vocal diversity with singers like Swano or Akerfeltd that blend death growls with clean vocals.

I agree that Nevermore are kind of hard to label. The AMG classify them in the power metal category, but I don't agree since the guitar work is absolutly not power metal like. In fact, I can't think of any guitarist who plays like Loomis. I think this is the kind of band you can only place in the heavy metal bag, but yeah maybe trash would be kinda acceptable.

[Steerpike]

Akerfeltd I've heard. He's very impressive. The Cookie Monster vox still leaves me cold, but his clean voice is nothing short of breathtaking. In every genre, there are going to be some exceptions who are willing to experiment.

For example, in Power Metal you mentioned that there weren't many singers using mid-range. Hansi Kursch, Olaf Hayer, and Matt Barlow all used mid-range vocals in a lot of their works, but could still hit the high notes appropriately.

[RivFader]

is it true that Burzum was a one-man band(Count Grishnackh)and that he is doing time for murder?

[evil ernie]

is it true that Burzum was a one-man band(Count Grishnackh)and that he is doing time for murder?

Indeed.

Here's some info, you can find plenty on the Internet.

http://letthemeatlead.com/article.php?a=archives/issue6/mayhem.htm
http://www.metalstorm.ee/bands/view_band.php?band_id=burzum

By the way, I really don't like his music, it sickens me. :wave:

[schweinhunt]

Speed metal is just another name for Thrash.
I never would have thought you we're this clueless. Tell me this: do Motörhead or Priest's Painkiller sound like thrash to you?

[Steerpike]

I never would have thought you we're this clueless. Tell me this: do Motörhead or Priest's Painkiller sound like thrash to you?

You know, this is very much where you and I cannot see eye to eye. So I was misinformed. You can't be content to calmly, and politely correct me, can you?

Alright, I made a mistake. Not the first time, won't be the last. Are you satisfied?

[schweinhunt]

Alright, I made a mistake. Not the first time, won't be the last. Are you satisfied?
Yes.

[Impaled Death]

Hey would someone please tell me what catagory impaled Nazarene falls into?

[procreationb]

This type of genre's forum has gone on for way too long now... ::turns up lil wyte::

[Steerpike]

Hey would someone please tell me what catagory impaled Nazarene falls into?

Never heard them. Let me check... Black Metal.

[procreationb]

This type of genre's forum has gone on for way too long now... ::turns up lil wyte::

::turns it up louder to drown out everyones repeated comments::

[evilmenhavenosongs]

This type of genre's forum has gone on for way too long now... ::turns up lil wyte::

Are you saying that people arguing about genres has gone on too long because, try as I might, I can't decipher your post.

[Stoic]

I dont know much about doom so I'd like someone to explain me the doom sub-genres and give me band examples. After some research I've found out about "funeral", "traditional" and "epic" doom...details, help anyone?

EDIT:
are esoteric considered funeral doom?

[Impaled Death]

Thanks steerpike.

[Kingofdudes]

I dont know much about doom so I'd like someone to explain me the doom sub-genres and give me band examples. After some research I've found out about "funeral", "traditional" and "epic" doom...details, help anyone?

EDIT:
are esoteric considered funeral doom?

There was a "doom" thread a while back, you can search for that.

[Stoic]

^
oh, I havent come here for a week now I think...Thank you I'll check it out right now :)

[kornedbeef]

I think this needs to be added.

Alternative-Metal:

Alternative-Metal is basically just Alternative music, but with certain aspects of metal. The bands usually have "sad" lyrics and dwell on their past's and their music is usually very primal, but melodic. Bands I would consider to be Alt-Metal would be: Adema, Korn (other than Untouchables, cause that can't have a genre, there is nu-Metal, Indusrial, Emo, and Alt-Metal on it), TRUSTcompany, Simplistic., Taproot (new stuff isn't nu-Metal), Rayne, and Juice. Some of the band's I listed have been called nu-Metal, but they fit more into this category. Also some Alt-Metal bands don't have very melodic music (Rayne), but they do have most of those aspects.

http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/Alternative%20metal

King Of Dudes, you don't know everything

[kornedbeef]

haha I bet I get flamed soon

[procreationb]

Are you saying that people arguing about genres has gone on too long because, try as I might, I can't decipher your post.

Right you are, my young patawa.

[Kingofdudes]

Alternative Metal is just a BS genre that radio stations and record labels create when a band doesnt fit in with hip hop, oldies, rap, hard rock, etc. By their definition a band like metallica are alternative(they have even been nominated for an alternative award before).

[kornedbeef]

Alternative Metal is just a BS genre that radio stations and record labels create when a band doesnt fit in with hip hop, oldies, rap, hard rock, etc.

and nu-metal, and emocore, and metalcore and all that **** is stuff that bratty little kids like to call their music.

look, if the websites that stream music and the radio stations and record labels and the bands out there make a genre, it's probably a more accurate genre that actually exists. You really think that all you people know more about music than the record labels?

also ALTERNATIVE-METAL IS A GENRE, **** it, look up adema on music match, or wmp, or winamp, it won't have any "core" genres or "nu-Metal" it will have an actual genre, not a style of that genre.

[Kingofdudes]

You really think that all you people know more about music than the record labels?
Yes, I dont expect money making execs to know what the hell they are talking about, especially with metal. Alternative metal is not a genre. Like I said it is pretty much a misc. garbage bin for genres that dont fit in the basic mainstream ones.

Adema is numetal
Korn is numetal
Taproot is numetal

Let me check Metal-archives.com(A Trustworthy site) for alternative metal.

Black ~ Death ~ Doom ~ Electronic ~ Folk/Viking ~ Gothic ~ Heavy/Traditional ~ Orchestral/Symphonic ~ Power ~ Progressive ~ Speed/Thrash

Nope, no alternative.

Bottom line, it is Bull crap.

[kornedbeef]

Yes, I dont expect money making execs to know what the hell they are talking about, especially with metal. Alternative metal is not a genre. Like I said it is pretty much a misc. garbage bin for genres that dont fit in the basic mainstream ones.

Adema is numetal
Korn is numetal
Taproot is numetal

Let me check Metal-archives.com(A Trustworthy site) for alternative metal.

Black ~ Death ~ Doom ~ Electronic ~ Folk/Viking ~ Gothic ~ Heavy/Traditional ~ Orchestral/Symphonic ~ Power ~ Progressive ~ Speed/Thrash

Nope, no alternative.

Bottom line, it is Bull crap.

dude, that website was probably made by people like the people who post on this website. ONCE MORE, YOU DON'T KNOW MUSIC BETTER THAN THE MUSIC INDUSTRY.

[kornedbeef]

don't even say Adema is nu-Metal, I bet you;ve never even heard them, Korn is not nu-Metal, they have a FEW nu-Metal songs, Taproot isn't nu-Metal anymore.

Alternative-Metal is a genre, once more, check out websites that STREAM MUSIC, that were made by THE MUSIC INDUSTRY.

[Kingofdudes]

don't even say Adema is nu-Metal, I bet you;ve never even heard them, Korn is not nu-Metal, they have a FEW nu-Metal songs, Taproot isn't nu-Metal anymore.

Alternative-Metal is a genre, once more, check out websites that STREAM MUSIC, that were made by THE MUSIC INDUSTRY.

I have heard many songs by them, my brother had the CD, and my friend played them on his radio station all the time. I also have Taproots 2nd CD and heard much of their first. Korn pretty much created Numetal. Get out of your denial.

THE MUSIC INDUSTRY IS COMPLETE BULL ****, I and many people choose to disagree with it because they dont know jack squat about metal. Can you even make an argument besides "uhh welll the record companies say that so im gonna be a dumb tool and believe it"?

[kornedbeef]

I have heard many songs by them, my brother had the CD, and my friend played them on his radio station all the time. I also have Taproots 2nd CD and heard much of their first. Korn pretty much created Numetal. Get out of your denial.

THE MUSIC INDUSTRY IS COMPLETE BULL ****, I and many people choose to disagree with it because they dont know jack squat about metal. Can you even make an argument besides "uhh welll the record companies say that so im gonna be a dumb tool and believe it"?

your the dumb tool for falling into the internet nerd arrogance that says "i know better than all"

[Kingofdudes]

your the dumb tool for falling into the internet nerd arrogance that says "i know better than all"

Since you didnt even bother answering me, I am guessing it is true that you are gonna follow the record industries words without questioning them. You would make a perfect "Yes Man".

Like I said, I know better than a bunch of rich executives who dont even listen to metal.

[kornedbeef]

Since you didnt even bother answering me, I am guessing it is true that you are gonna follow the record industries words without questioning them. You would make a perfect "Yes Man".

Like I said, I know better than a bunch of rich executives who dont even listen to metal.

go on to any search engine and type alternative-metal. then tell me it's a fake genre.

[Kingofdudes]

go on to any search engine and type alternative-metal. then tell me it's a fake genre.

I can do a search on Santa, and get results. It doesnt mean he is real.

[kornedbeef]

one word describes you:

arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-arrogant-

[extreme_191]

your the dumb tool for falling into the internet nerd arrogance that says "i know better than all"

You're something else, man. How many posts does King have?

Maybe you've become accustomed to the faulty terms used everywhere. Just cause it's used, doesn't make it correct. :thumb:

King knows his fair share of music, for sure. :naughty:

Buddy, just hang on for a year longer and find out for yourself. :thumb:








:smoke:

[Kingofdudes]

You're something else, man. How many posts does King have?

Maybe you've become accustomed to the faulty terms used everywhere. Just cause it's used, doesn't make it correct. :thumb:

King knows his fair share of music, for sure. :naughty:

Buddy, just hang on for a year longer and find out for yourself. :thumb:








:smoke:

Thank you :thumb:

My basic argument against his:


These record companies, dont care about the music, they dont care about metal, they dont listen to metal, they only care about the money so they just throw on some quick label. A website like metal-archives.com is a website made by metalheads, for metalheads, and they dont get paid to do it. I think a website with people who actually care about metal has more legitimacy pointing out metal genres than some greedy record company.

[extreme_191]

Money makes the world go round.

[Steerpike]

dude, that website was probably made by people like the people who post on this website. ONCE MORE, YOU DON'T KNOW MUSIC BETTER THAN THE MUSIC INDUSTRY.

Dude, let me tell you what the music industry knows about music.

1. They know what hook will make a good radio single.
2. They know how to find the "money note."

That's about it. The execs know jack **** about playing an instrument, musical theory, artistic integrity, or anything overall about being a musician. They only know what sells. I suggest you take a lesson in mass communication and learn how modern corporations in the recording industry function.

[evil ernie]

I can do a search on Santa, and get results. It doesnt mean he is real.

:lol:

[procreationb]

Don't bitch about the music industry, it works and nobody has corrected it. None of your hero's seem to give a ****. C'mon, if people with money stood up and decided to do it themselves it would change. But since nobody has done this, this proves you wrong..

[Dr. Jake Destructo]

I can do a search on Santa, and get results. It doesnt mean he is real.

:lol: best analogy I've heard in a while.

Kornguy, what you are saying, or what it sounds like to me is that you don't want there be a "nu-metal" genre. You just want the name to be changed to alternative metal. Nu and alternative are sort of interchangable prefixes for the genres of metal.

[Steerpike]

Don't bitch about the music industry, it works and nobody has corrected it.

Take a class in mass media, dude. The recording industry works... at making money! It's a business that sells art, it is not an art itself... God, that sounded so pretentious. But, in literal terms, music is an artform and business is not because it doesn't create things of aesthetic value, it exists to acquire money.

None of your hero's seem to give a ****. C'mon, if people with money stood up and decided to do it themselves it would change. But since nobody has done this, this proves you wrong..

What the hell are you talking about?

[RivFader]

Edguy's Hellfire Club is metal or power metal?

[shortass]

Cheers man!
Being new to metal I didn't know any of these.

[kornedbeef]

:lol: best analogy I've heard in a while.

Kornguy, what you are saying, or what it sounds like to me is that you don't want there be a "nu-metal" genre. You just want the name to be changed to alternative metal. Nu and alternative are sort of interchangable prefixes for the genres of metal.

its not the same **** thing, they are two established genres and people on this forum don't realize that nu-metal is RAP METAL. that's why I say new taproot is alternative-metal. their old stuff is RAP METAL. Alternative Metal is completely different. and half those bands I listed sound nothing like nu-Metal. they are not interchangable prefix #1 and #2 some of the bands sound nothing like nu-metal. the main point i made was that most alternative metal is melodic, which is the major difference, and alt metal bands dont rap. some alt metal bands arent extremely melodic, but they are still melodic
(IE The Melvins, Korn, Rayne). they are different genres and nobody seems to realize it on this forum cause they don't listen to either of them.

[evilmenhavenosongs]

Nu-metal doesn't have to have rap in it as an element. Alt. metal is just another name for nu-metal which came about because of the negative connotations attached to nu-metal. I garuntee that numerous websites on the internet will list the same bands as both Nu and Alt. metal.

[oldskoolsoldier]

great list way to put the time in to the best genre of music

[Kingofdudes]

Edguy's Hellfire Club is metal or power metal?

Metalarchives has it them listed as power metal, but I have never heard them so Im not too sure.

[Iai]

From what I've heard of Edguy, they're definitely Power Metal.

[evil ernie]

From what I've heard of Edguy, they're definitely Power Metal.

I second that.

[Self Titled]

wow... impressive.
and to anyone who is interested in more info like this i really suggest picking up the book: The History of Heavy Metal

[shortass]

You should have seen it today. My freind was telling me that slipknot was death metal...this set him straight

[dayve_57]

Yeah they aren't very creative, but I've seen some worse 'just the band performing' music videos (especially down here in New Zealand where budgets are very very thin for new bands), at least Finger use some interesting sets and camera angles/visual effects.

The absolute worst music vids are ones of a band playing in concert, while the CD-quality single plays over it. *shiver*

I agree with this, however, Finger Eleven really isn't metal in general. They have some songs like nu-metal, but overall they're really just plain rock. Basically, i think they have a pretty set style, and then they have these few random songs that don't fit with the rest of it. like one thing has weird bongo-drums and it's all really soft. And then they have Drag You Down where he goes kinda crazy, and such, with the weird lyrics.
I dunno.

P.S. Yeah, I HATE those videos! they just have the band playing in concert and that's it. Ugh.
I agree, finger eleven music videos aren't very creative but, once again, i'm agreeing, they have neat camera angles and that.

[BornFedSlaughterd]

Grindcore is very beautiful, makes me cum my pants.

[Anaal_Nathrakh]

Dude, I'm a bit unsatisfied with your definition of black metal. I got myself into black metal mainly because of the brutal blasting and riffing of bands like Mayhem... and you said blast beats are not very utilized in bm or something like that. In my opinion bm is a more extreme and developed form of extreme music than death metal. A lot of death metal is stuck with simpler and very familiar riffing/drumming with the exception of a few bands like Hate Eternal. Even if the death or grind bands blast, they dont sound as brutal as bm blasting. The diffenence is that the death bands like to emphasize the low end alot in vocals and instrumentwise resulting in a cartoonish brutality. On the other hand, bm bands dont boost the low end in their records and dont play around with the efxs or the production that much.

[LordDargon]

Are you retarded? Black Metal bands play around with the production alot more than Death Metal, their stuff sounds like it was recorded on a telephone answering machine.

Don't get me wrong, I like black metal, but still. Have some sense.

[lilpete86]

I second that.
I third it

[shortass]

Grindcore is very beautiful, makes me cum my pants.
...nice :naughty:

[Anaal_Nathrakh]

Are you retarded? Black Metal bands play around with the production alot more than Death Metal, their stuff sounds like it was recorded on a telephone answering machine.

Don't get me wrong, I like black metal, but still. Have some sense.

What sort of bm bands are you talking about. Are you saying they delibrately play around with production just for the sake of atmosphere(this might be true for Emperor)? I thought they(mayhem, darkthrone etc) are just being low budget.

[Iai]

Are you retarded? Black Metal bands play around with the production alot more than Death Metal, their stuff sounds like it was recorded on a telephone answering machine.

Having just listened to Under A Funeral Moon by Darkthrone for the first time.....quoted for truth. :)

[LordDargon]

Budget, shmudget. They purposely eliminate the bottom end.

And yeah Iai, that has probably the worst/rawest production of any band I've ever heard, maybe except for Nunslaughter or Demoncy.

[Iai]

It's certainly the rawest I've heard. St. Anger probably takes the award for worst.

Still, quality stuff though. (Darkthrone, not Metallica)

[Silenius]

Emperor production is great imo, having the vocals in the backround and making them blend in like another instrument. Do Darkthrone even have bass and if so does Nocturno Culto play it?

[jerrydablindfish]

by he way metallica under thrash metal, its kill em all- justice

[FistTheGoon]

any1 listen 2 into eternity?

[Phil Anselmo]

what kind of metal besides progressive would you categorize opeth as?

[Steerpike]

Death/black? I'm not really certain as I've heard both. I need to get a full album before I can make a call.

[Kingofdudes]

I'd say they lean more towards Death Metal, due to the growls.

[Nra4ever_17]

Opeth? I'd call them somewhat melodic death.

[DroneMaster]

This IS and also NOT SO nice list:

PROZ: Very vivid description of genres' various differences with many examples given, plus in depth explanation thats dijestable to a musician as well as any average joe who just listens to any of these genres of metal.

CONZ: The list is very incomplete. Even though its updated, there's a lot thats missing that doesn't fit into any of these categories.

[LordDargon]

Wha....?



Man, sometimes I wonder if there should be an English test before you can join MX. Not just this guy, n00bs in general.

[MetaBen]

Man that was a great list ... hmmm .... I don't think I really have anything intelligent to add to the discussion ...

[MetalNightBodomNight]

wheather you no it or not legions you confirmed Children of Bodom to be melodic death when you called Kalmah and Norther melodic death. I guess you've settle that debate.

[Silenius]

They're power metal.
*Sighs and asks himself how many times he has said that*

[DroneMaster]

Wha....?



Man, sometimes I wonder if there should be an English test before you can join MX. Not just this guy, n00bs in general.


I'm sorry that my comments went totally over your head. Maybe you cant smoke some more crack or take acid in higher doses so you could dissolve the rest of your brain cells. Obviously you have no other use for them...besides ignorance. :smoke: :thumb:

[Steerpike]

I'm sorry that my comments went totally over your head. Maybe you cant smoke some more crack or take acid in higher doses so you could dissolve the rest of your brain cells. Obviously you have no other use for them...besides ignorance. :smoke: :thumb:

I suggest ritalin.

Come back when you grow some pubes or can come up with a decent, witty retort. You know, whichever occurs first.

[Steerpike]

wheather you no it or not legions you confirmed Children of Bodom to be melodic death when you called Kalmah and Norther melodic death. I guess you've settle that debate.

They're power metal. The vocals are black/death growls, but intrumentally, they are power metal.

[sten]

nice list. Never knew what the difference between Black and Death Metal was. Thanks for clearing that up
yeh me either, which is why i read this, thanks for that, it was realy informative! :thumb:

[Kreator2112]

although i dont favor growling lyrics opeth is an awesome band

[ScotJay]

great list dude!

[Silent Ryan]

Another improtant Death Metal band is death, they are probably the most important death metal band.

[i am the robots]

They're power metal. The vocals are black/death growls, but intrumentally, they are power metal.

I normally agree with you, but they are definately melodeath, the vocal style is a very major factor in a genre.

[Steerpike]

I normally agree with you, but they are definately melodeath, the vocal style is a very major factor in a genre.

Other than the vocals, I don't see much resemblance between Children of Bodom and bands like In Flames or Opeth. CoB lacks the same sense aggression, borderlining brutality, that melodeath bands have. Vocals are important, but not more than the instrumentation.

[i am the robots]

I wouldnt put Slipknot and Mudvayne in the Nu-Metal catagory. Even tho they are newer bands, they both have Talent, unlike System of a Down, Linkin Park and P.O.D. I like to think of them as different, not crap.

That is the most retarded post ever, Slipknot and Mudvayne do have talent, as well as most other nu-metal bands, just because someone chooses to play something simple doesn't mean they aren't a good instrumentalist (arguments in Linkin Park's Broken Glass, and Korn's James Brown).

[i am the robots]

Other than the vocals, I don't see much resemblance between Children of Bodom and bands like In Flames or Opeth. CoB lacks the same sense aggression, borderlining brutality, that melodeath bands have. Vocals are important, but not more than the instrumentation.

yeah, CoB isn't melodeath but Norther and Kalmah are, I know that Dargon and FF are gonna be on my *** for this, but I don't care

[i am the robots]

Another improtant Death Metal band is death, they are probably the most important death metal band.

That would be because they are commonly credited with inventing the genre (hence the name Death Metal).

[Iron Man]

"Even tho they are newer bands, they both have Talent"

Try looking a little harder next time.

[Steerpike]

yeah, CoB isn't melodeath but Norther and Kalmah are, I know that Dargon and FF are gonna be on my *** for this, but I don't care

Oh, well I was just referring to Children of Bodom. I don't listen to Norther or Kalmah.

[Per Ardua Ad Astra]

Opeth is progressive death metal.

Children of Bodom is power metal with Harsh vocals.

Emperor production is great imo, having the vocals in the backround and making them blend in like another instrument. Do Darkthrone even have bass and if so does Nocturno Culto play it?

Zephyrous used to play bass for them, not anymore though.

[LordDargon]

That would be because they are commonly credited with inventing the genre (hence the name Death Metal).
Eleventeen, just shut up. You don't know anything. The term "Death Metal" was in use before Death even released anything.

[Toozey]

Seriously, that's the most retarded thing ever.

[Dancin' Man]

I'd like to add that all of these genres can have progressive slapped on the front. Progressive alone has a tendency to mean muiscal wankery and amazing musicians everywhere but the real definition is a band that is pushing the limits of songwriting making some "Progressive" bands not.

Examples -

Dillinger Escape Plan - Progressive Grindcore
Opeth - Progressive Melodic Death Metal
Meshuggah - Progressive Industrial Metal
Arcturus - Progressive Black Metal (Arguable with Avant Garde)

There are others but these seem to be the most well known without me having to label Tool.

[EonBlueApocalypse]

WHOA! Mustard Plug! God it's been forever since I saw anything about them! Can't say I'm a huge fan, but they're from around here. Not Kalamazoo, but I think they're from Grand Rapids or Ann Arbor which are only an hour or so away.

mustard plug...fun band to listen to.

and your explaination of different generas was very good. should clear up the air a bit around here.

[i am the robots]

Eleventeen, just shut up. You don't know anything. The term "Death Metal" was in use before Death even released anything.


Oooh internet tuffguy!

anyway, I'm just saying what I've read from other people on these forums thank you.

[i am the robots]

Oh, well I was just referring to Children of Bodom. I don't listen to Norther or Kalmah.

They both kinda remind me of In Flames and Opeth mixed, they're really good, you should check them out, and Kalmah's vocalist has the widest range in screaming I've heard, he does the really low kind to the ridiculously high scream.

[Dancin' Man]

Well how about you do some research so you don't sound stupid anymore. And ask questions instead of making statements. And then.... learn from the answers.

[Dancin' Man]

They both kinda remind me of In Flames and Opeth mixed, they're really good, you should check them out, and Kalmah's vocalist has the widest range in screaming I've heard, he does the really low kind to the ridiculously high scream.

No. They are definitely more like CoB than In Flames or Opeth. Power Metal.

[Per Ardua Ad Astra]

Dillinger Escape Plan - Progressive Grindcore
Opeth - Progressive Melodic Death Metal
Meshuggah - Progressive Industrial Metal
Arcturus - Progressive Black Metal (Arguable with Avant Garde)

I would think that the Dillinger Escape Plan would be more progressive hardcore, than grindcore.
On Arcturus, they were only progressive black metal on their first album, Aspera Heims Symfonia. They since moved on to post-black/Avant Garde music.

[i am the robots]

No. They are definitely more like CoB than In Flames or Opeth. Power Metal.

OPINION

[Dancin' Man]

I would think that the Dillinger Escape Plan would be more progressive hardcore, than grindcore.
On Arcturus, they were only progressive black metal on their first album, Aspera Heims Symfonia. They since moved on to post-black/Avant Garde music.


DEPs seem to sway. The hard part about them is that they have to super technical fast heavy stuff that is traditional to grindcore but longer songs and more melody. I can see both easily though.

Thank you for clearing up Arcturus.

[Per Ardua Ad Astra]

DEPs seem to sway. The hard part about them is that they have to super technical fast heavy stuff that is traditional to grindcore but longer songs and more melody. I can see both easily though.

Thank you for clearing up Arcturus.

You probably know more about DEP, than I do. I've only heard a few songs (which I didn't really like) but from what I've heard it seemed like hardcore, with just a few small technical interludes thrown in there.

[IheartSP]

Children of Bodom is not at all like In Flames. If In Flames is melodeath, CoB is not. I really think our problem is saying that things like vocals or what not are a big difference in the genre. You can't just put everything into specific categories because most bands succeed by synthesizing previous ideas. You cant call CoB death/black or powermetal, instead just go 2 seconds out of your way and say powermetal with harsh vocals. And also theres no exact definition of a genre because every band is different, so just because CoB doesn't have traditional power metal drumming, there still power metal. I've heard enough about this arguing.

[i am the robots]

Children of Bodom is not at all like In Flames. If In Flames is melodeath, CoB is not. I really think our problem is saying that things like vocals or what not are a big difference in the genre. You can't just put everything into specific categories because most bands succeed by synthesizing previous ideas. You cant call CoB death/black or powermetal, instead just go 2 seconds out of your way and say powermetal with harsh vocals. And also theres no exact definition of a genre because every band is different, so just because CoB doesn't have traditional power metal drumming, there still power metal. I've heard enough about this arguing.

I was saying Kalmah and Norther sound like In Flames, and in my opinion they do.

[Devil Inferno]

What do you think about this?

A Detailed Thrash Metal Defination

Mostly my personal opinion, mixed with some research. You MIGHT NOT AGREE WITH THIS, feel free to make any corrections.

Country Of Origin : America
Pioneer bands : Slayer, Metallica, Megadeth, Kreator, Anthrax
Year it developed : 1980
Influenced by : Heavy Metal
Influencial Bands : Judas Priest, Motorhead, Diamond Head, Venom*
Branched out from (if applicable) : New Wave Of British Heavy Metal
Type : Extreme Metal

*Venom existed before the big four of thrash, but i would not consider
them as pioneers of thrash, but black metal

Music

Thrash metal is defined by its aggressiveness, speed and mostly palm
muted guitars' bass strings. The infamous palmuting of the "E" bass
string on the guitar, used by almost all thrash metal bands, has
become thrash metal's signature sound. Melody and symphony are almost
non-existant here, except in a few experimental bands.

VOCALS
Its vocals are neither screamed nor sung, but they're "vocalized" in a
special way, probrably a mix of a very mellow scream, non-melodic
singing, and aggressive talking.
Good example of thrash metal vocal is Slayer's Tom Araya in Hell awaits
era.
Also see James Hetfield's vocals on Kill Em All and Ride the Lightning

GUITARS
The guitars are normally not downtuned, and standard tuning is used.
Thrash rythmn guitars are normally very fast, with power chords and
the palm muting of bass strings, and occasional dissodant scaling
giving a thrashy feel to it, as if the song was not composed and
arranged properly, and it was only thrashed out with extreme speed and
agressiveness.

Thrash leads are also very fast, with crazy solos. They can sound
quite chaotic, but still retaining the hard rock/heavy metal feel of
bends and pinch harmonics.
Good examples of thrash metal rythmn guitar are probrably Slayer's
"Angel Of Death", Metallica's "Master Of Puppets", "Motorbreath".
Good examples of thrash metal leads are also Slayer's "Angel Of Death"
and Metallica's "Seek And Destroy".

Bass
Thrash metal bass normally follows the rythmn guitar, playing the root
notes when the guitars play the power chords, and scaling along with
the rythmn guitar in the case of dissodant riffs. ALso, the basses
continually attacks the root notes they play, giving build to the
intensity of the song, especially during song buildups. Occasionally,
the bass might have its seperate riff from the guitar, but in most
cases, it follows closely with the rythmn guitar.

DRUM
Thrash drumming is normally in the same style as thrash rythmn guitars.
Normally concentrated on the hihats, snares and bass drums, with
different patterns, occasional tom rolls, and on the the ride. The
crashes often are harmonized with the rythmn guitar's single power
chords.
Good example of thrash drumming can be found also in Slayer's
"Angel Of deatH" and "Raining blood"

Recommended Thrash Metal Bands : Slayer, Kreator, early Metallica
early Anthrax, Overkill, Sodom, Megadeth, Testament, Pantera

Recommended Albums :
Metallica - Kill Em' All
Metallica - Master Of Puppets
Megadeth - Peace Sells...But Who's Buying?
Slayer - Reign In Blood

Recommended Songs :
Metallica - Master Of Puppets
Megadeth - Hangar 18
Slayer - Angel Of Death (Highly recommended)

Sub Genres Of Thrash Metal
There are no known sub genres so far.

Known Prefixes
Symphonic Thrash
-Thrash metal, with symphony at the back, although this takes out
alot of the aggression in thrash, it might still be worth a listen.
Therion might be an example of a symphonic thrash band.

Melodic Thrash
-Thrash metal, less aggressive, more melodic. Another so called
"oxymoron", but its still thrash.
Tourniquet is an example of melodic thrash.

Progressive Thrash
-Thrash metal that is progressive. Which means varying in time
signature and thrash riffs. An example of this is Meshuggah

Common Mixtures
Thrash And Death
-Also known as the transition period between thrash and death metal, or
the roots of death metal. This is where thrash metal is pushed to its
limits, and where death metal is born. This is a extremely, super
aggresive thrash metal, with the aggression limits over pushed, but not
very death metal yet.
Bands : Death*, Darkane, Carnal Forge, Lamb Of God, Living Sacrifice
*They are the pioneers of death metal, but you can still hear much
thrash in their music.

Thrash And Black
-Also known as the transition period between thrash and black meta, or
the roots of black metal. This is where thrash metal is pushed to its
limit, similar to death metal, to create black metal. Although death
and black metal have gone different paths now, their early roots are
definately traced back to thrash metal, in which in their births, they
sound similar.
Bands : Venom, Celtic Frost, Bathory.

[Jondur]

Not too bad althogh Exodus should definitely be in your list of pioneer bands as they were around before Metallica etc. Oh and Venom were definitely a thrash band. Don't argue.

Thrash branched out from NWOBHM and punk so you want to have Discharge in your influential bands.

But all in all, a good job

[DroneMaster]

Umm..I'm sure that you must have confused me with your inbred brother. But if you insist, how about I'll just grow some hair around my a$$hole then trim it and give you to smoke it all. You can use your old crack pipe with no problem..plus, this will give you something else to do besides posting these IDIOTIC replies and jacking off in the back of your grandma's trailer

I suggest ritalin.

Come back when you grow some pubes or can come up with a decent, witty retort. You know, whichever occurs first.

[Steerpike]

Umm..I'm sure that you must have confused me with your inbred brother. But if you insist, how about I'll just grow some hair around my a$$hole then trim it and give you to smoke it all. You can use your old crack pipe with no problem..plus, this will give you something else to do besides posting these IDIOTIC replies and jacking off in the back of your grandma's trailer

Am I supposed to feel insulted? Your attempt at burning me was too long-winded, too cliched, and really failed to make any kind of impact. Besides that, it seems it took you an eternity to come up with it.

You fail. I'm done with you.

[DroneMaster]

Eleventeen, just shut up. You don't know anything. The term "Death Metal" was in use before Death even released anything.

You might be right, but Death made it way more mainstream than it was before. In relevance to genre they are exactly what is Korn to nu-metal (for a lack of a better example)

[DroneMaster]

Am I supposed to feel insulted? Your attempt at burning me was too long-winded, too cliched, and really failed to make any kind of impact. Besides that, it seems it took you an eternity to come up with it.

You fail. I'm done with you.


Insulted ? No..it should make you feel pulverized ! It seems like you sit here all day and look for any opportunity to annoy the sh*t out of anyone you choose to pick on. Good God.. if I ever turn out to be like this, can anyone please shoot me ? ....Actually, the only reason why guys like you ARE still alive is because its illegal to kill you. F*cking loser...

[Bartender]

10 posts a day does not translate to sitting here all day.

[Steerpike]

Insulted ? No..it should make you feel pulverized !

Really? Because all I feel is bored.

It seems like you sit here all day and look for any opportunity to annoy the sh*t out of anyone you choose to pick on.

Actually, I only flame those who do something to deserve it. Otherwise, I'm a fairly easy-going guy. Just ask around.

Good God.. if I ever turn out to be like this, can anyone please shoot me ?

I would, but I don't really like guns.

....Actually, the only reason why guys like you ARE still alive is because its illegal to kill you.

Just so long as you notice me. :thumb:

F*cking loser...

I prefer the term "leech" or "f*cknuts" over "loser," but whatever.

[DroneMaster]

OPINION


Lmao.. Some guys in here don't understand what it is

[DroneMaster]

Really? Because all I feel is bored.



Actually, I only flame those who do something to deserve it. Otherwise, I'm a fairly easy-going guy. Just ask around.



I would, but I don't really like guns.



Just so long as you notice me. :thumb:



I prefer the term "leech" or "f*cknuts" over "loser," but whatever.


...I thought you said you was 'done' ? Hmmm... apparently I'm not boring after all - got YOUR attention repeatedly (not that I give 2 drops of monkey's piss about having it). It is obvious that after more than 3,000 tasteless replies on this forum you have used up all of your cheesy one-liners and clearly suffering from a lack or material. You might be suffering from a psychiatric disorder, therefore I strongly suggest that you should get help..the sooner - the better !

Note to OTHER users of this forum: I fully understand the purpose of this message board is carry a discussion about various genres of metal and NOT using it harass and/or insult other members...espessially if there was nothing done to initiate that type of attitude to begin with. Therefore I apologize to anyone who is offended by some of my previous comments, as long as you are someone who intended to use this forum for its original purpose

[DroneMaster]

10 posts a day does not translate to sitting here all day.


In his case, it would include all night too....

[Steerpike]

...I thought you said you was 'done' ? Hmmm... apparently I'm not boring after all - got YOUR attention repeatedly (not that I give 2 drops of monkey's piss about having it).

You started to be amusing again. I view you as free entertainment. If the show gets good again as I'm walking out, I'm gonna go back to my seat and watch.

It is obvious that after more than 3,000 tasteless replies on this forum you have used up all of your cheesy one-liners and clearly suffering from a lack or material.

And once again your attempt to burn me fails miserably. You seem to be feeling much more hostile than me.

You might be suffering from a psychiatric disorder, therefore I strongly suggest that you should get help..the sooner - the better !

Actually, yes, I am crazy. Have been for years. How'd you know?

Note to OTHER users of this forum: I fully understand the purpose of this message board is carry a discussion about various genres of metal and NOT using it harass and/or insult other members...espessially if there was nothing done to initiate that type of attitude to begin with. Therefore I apologize to anyone who is offended by some of my previous comments, as long as you are someone who intended to use this forum for its original purpose

Oh get over yourself. I don't mess with people around here, unless they do something to deserve it. You said something horrifyingly stupid, I responded.

If you ask around, there aren't a whole lot of people around here who are going to take your stance against me. I don't stir up trouble, I try to put an end to it. Or at the very least, try to make it amusing for everyone else.

If you've got a problem with me, that's too bad. Whether you want to believe it or not, I've provided a lot of constructive and useful posts around here and I've spent the last year trying to make myself a respected member of these boards. If you don't like me, I wish I could tell you I cared, but I don't. You haven't given me any reason to value your opinion at all.

[DroneMaster]

You started to be amusing again. I view you as free entertainment. If the show gets good again as I'm walking out, I'm gonna go back to my seat and watch.



And once again your attempt to burn me fails miserably. You seem to be feeling much more hostile than me.



Actually, yes, I am crazy. Have been for years. How'd you know?



Oh get over yourself. I don't mess with people around here, unless they do something to deserve it. You said something horrifyingly stupid, I responded.

If you ask around, there aren't a whole lot of people around here who are going to take your stance against me. I don't stir up trouble, I try to put an end to it. Or at the very least, try to make it amusing for everyone else.

If you've got a problem with me, that's too bad. Whether you want to believe it or not, I've provided a lot of constructive and useful posts around here and I've spent the last year trying to make myself a respected member of these boards. If you don't like me, I wish I could tell you I cared, but I don't. You haven't given me any reason to value your opinion at all.


Riiiiiiight... dont pass out from patting your own back so much. I'm sure most people in here secretly resent you, only I chose to say something back. Noone cares what you think or what you think you know...hell, I dont dislike you because I know that you won't stop talking that senseless crap no matter what anyway. You resemble a little annoying dog that keeps on barking but noone pays attention to it. I looked at your postings and noone even responds to most of them... unless you have said something to piss someone off by making a smart a$$ comment just like you did in my case. See, I dont have a problem with you at all...you are the complete opposite of me and that can only make me feel good about myself.
As far as you spending last year desperately trying to become a "respected member of these boards" ..well HAH!! Good luck on that one, bud...I'm afraid that will never happen. You made 3 something ..thousand postings and said absolutely NOTHING. I made a just 8 and had more to say. You would have been a bigger man by not saying anything back to me.. but you chose to continue exposing your stupidity even further. Oh well, sad as it is for now... one day undobtedly you'll learn your lesson. Morons like you always do.. the hard way. I rest my case....respectfully

[Steerpike]

Oh this should be fun. Where to start...

Riiiiiiight... dont pass out from patting your own back so much. I'm sure most people in here secretly resent you, only I chose to say something back.

This is the internet. They have nothing to lose by being blunt with me. Also, take a look at the stars I have and check how the rep system works around here.

Noone cares what you think or what you think you know...

Funny then that I've got the four stars I have now. It takes more than postcount to get those.

hell, I dont dislike you because I know that you won't stop talking that senseless crap no matter what anyway.

Then why not just put me on ignore? The only reason I'm still talking to you is because you're amusing to me.

You resemble a little annoying dog that keeps on barking but noone pays attention to it.

Must I reference the stars again?

I looked at your postings and noone even responds to most of them...

Interesting how you can make that claim when I'm guessing all you've done is read a few pages back in this thread and probably looked at a couple of posts I made today, if even that.

unless you have said something to piss someone off by making a smart a$$ comment just like you did in my case.

So I'm sarcastic. What's your point?

See, I dont have a problem with you at all...you are the complete opposite of me and that can only make me feel good about myself.

Glad I could be of service. :D

As far as you spending last year desperately trying to become a "respected member of these boards" ..well HAH!! Good luck on that one, bud...I'm afraid that will never happen.

Again with the stars. I've earned a positive reputation here whether you want to believe it or not. Your argument is circling the drain at this point.

You made 3 something ..thousand postings and said absolutely NOTHING.

How many of my posts have you actually read? 12, tops?

I made a just 8 and had more to say.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

It's even funnier because you're serious.

You would have been a bigger man by not saying anything back to me.. but you chose to continue exposing your stupidity even further.

And also proven that I'm still smarter, wittier, and less emotionally excitable than you. Funny how that works isn't it?

Oh well, sad as it is for now... one day undobtedly you'll learn your lesson. Morons like you always do.. the hard way. I rest my case....respectfully

Respectully?

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Oh keep talking. You are **** entertaining!

[Blood Venom]

Entertainment ?!? OMFG, you both suck ! But it looks like Drone has nailed you on this one

:naughty: :amaze:

[LordDargon]

Uh... No?

[DroneMaster]

Entertainment ?!? OMFG, you both suck ! But it looks like Drone has nailed you on this one

:naughty: :amaze:

I gotta give hime some credit though....his mom gived some great head :thumb:

[Bartender]

I gotta give hime some credit though....his mom gived some great head :thumb:

Oh wow, dude, now you, like, totally won :awe:


Stop it.

[Thor]

Shouldnt power metal be on there? I saw Iced Earth under Traditional Heavy Metal and thought that it should be somewhere else.

[Steerpike]

Entertainment ?!? OMFG, you both suck ! But it looks like Drone has nailed you on this one

:naughty: :amaze:

Seriously, dude. Learn how to burn people. "OMFG, you both suck !" Jesus Christ, is that the best you can do?

I gotta give hime some credit though....his mom gived some great head :thumb:

How long you been saving that old chestnut?

But seriously, you think I'd feel insulted by you going out and trying to score with married, middle-aged women? That says more about you than it does about me, you ****in' perv.

Seriously, you can't burn me. I'm as flame-retardant as you are retarded. My advice to you would be to give up, and move on with your life. I'm trying to be nice and just let you run free and we can both put this behind us. If you want to continue, no skin off my nose.

[Bartender]

Steerpike, you stop it too, please. Take it to an IM if you both really feel the need to continue, but this thread is supposed to be about education, not flame retardant middle aged women.

[Steerpike]

Right. If he makes another crack at me, I'll just stick him on the ignore list and end it there.

[DroneMaster]

Steerpike, you stop it too, please. Take it to an IM if you both really feel the need to continue, but this thread is supposed to be about education, not flame retardant middle aged women.

You are absolutely right. This thread's purpose IS supposed to be educational, but unfortunately there are nit wits like steerpike who..as it appears to be are beyond any help, let alone education. So anyone thats pissed off b/c this thread has driffted off on a tangent, you got him to thank for that.

P.S. By the way, will this count as "another crack" against you steerpike ?? :D

[Steerpike]

You are absolutely right. This thread's purpose IS supposed to be educational, but unfortunately there are nit wits like steerpike who..as it appears to be are beyond any help, let alone education. So anyone thats pissed off b/c this thread has driffted off on a tangent, you got him to thank for that.

P.S. By the way, will this count as "another crack" against you steerpike ?? :D

Well, since you posted it just to be an *******... yes. Welcome to eternity. Ignore list.

[LordDargon]

You are absolutely right. This thread's purpose IS supposed to be educational, but unfortunately there are nit wits like steerpike who..as it appears to be are beyond any help, let alone education. So anyone thats pissed off b/c this thread has driffted off on a tangent, you got him to thank for that.

P.S. By the way, will this count as "another crack" against you steerpike ?? :D
I weep for humanity.

[Jondur]

You might be right, but Death made it way more mainstream than it was before. In relevance to genre they are exactly what is Korn to nu-metal (for a lack of a better example)

Flame war aside, this is truly ridiculous. Name me other death metal bands around before death apart from Possessed.

[Steerpike]

Flame war aside, this is truly ridiculous. Name me other death metal bands around before death apart from Possessed.

Wasn't Massacre among the early death metal bands as well? I know they formed in '84.

I know Death originally formed in '83 as Venom/Celtic Frost inspired black metal band called Mantas, but made the switch to death metal in '84/'85.

[Jondur]

Aye there was a few around back then including the godly Master. But DroneMaster's "death are the equivalent to Korn" comment is still ridiculous.

[Steerpike]

Aye there was a few around back then including the godly Master. But DroneMaster's "death are the equivalent to Korn" comment is still ridiculous.

I agree. I'm just throwing my two cents in. Death's major contribution was twofold.

For one, their work in the 90's was more accessible and helped to bring the death metal movement to more prominence.

Secondly, Chuck's intake of progressive influences was a huge leap forward musically for the American metal scene. In the 80's and 90's, metal either went underground or went stale. It took the more daring acts like Death to revive the scene.

[Jondur]

Actually the big albums that brought death metal to the mainstream were Morbid Angel "Domination", Carcass "Heartwork" and especially Obituary "World Demise" (last one made the top fifty!). Death were nowhere near the draw of those bands at the time.

[Steerpike]

Ah. I stand corrected.

Death metal isn't really my forte, so it's little surprise that I got that wrong.

[LordDargon]

I wasn't around back then, but going by pure stats, the best selling death metal is

Morbid Angel - Covenant
Cannibal Corpse - Bloodthirst
Deicide - Deicide
Obituary - World Demise

[Jondur]

Aye but some of them had been out for ages. The ones I mentioned made a huge impact when they were released and had quite a lot of crossover appeal - especially World Demise. The video for I don't Care was even on a prime time music show.

And these albums had a large degree of commercialism to them. Each was much more accessible than its predecessor.

[willis2441]

I wasn't around back then, but going by pure stats, the best selling death metal is

Morbid Angel - Covenant
Cannibal Corpse - Bloodthirst
Deicide - Deicide
Obituary - World Demise
technically,cannibal corpse is "gore metal" according to some dudes list he posted from a fancy metal site awhile back,it had stupid sub genres like ice metal and scandenavian metal,pretty stupid $hit

[DroneMaster]

Aye there was a few around back then including the godly Master. But DroneMaster's "death are the equivalent to Korn" comment is still ridiculous.

I think you are just having a hard time grasping the concept..jeeez, it cant be that complicated !

[DroneMaster]

Actually the big albums that brought death metal to the mainstream were Morbid Angel "Domination", Carcass "Heartwork" and especially Obituary "World Demise" (last one made the top fifty!). Death were nowhere near the draw of those bands at the time.

Thing is, Carcass was well known overseas, not in US until later on...unless you was a hardcore death metal fan

[Blood Venom]

Can anyone tell me what Black Metal bands did actually worship Satan ? Was Mercyfull Fate one of them ?

[DroneMaster]

Can anyone tell me what Black Metal bands did actually worship Satan ? Was Mercyfull Fate one of them ?

You should ask steerpike, he knows everything here..or at least thats the perception he is pityfully trying to create

[Steerpike]

Can anyone tell me what Black Metal bands did actually worship Satan ? Was Mercyfull Fate one of them ?

No, King Diamond and Mercyful Fate aren't Satanists. Not many bands are actually. Most black metal bands I'm familiar with are either pagan or anti-Christian.

I think Varg Vikernes was a Satanist for a time, but that means very little because he'll probably be a deist next week and Shinto the week after.

[Blood Venom]

Do you know where Diabolic is originally from ? I dont know if you heard of them or not, but they been touring with Deicide, Cannibal Corpse and others

[Steerpike]

Can't say I'm familiar with them. As I said, death metal is not my forte. I'm a power metal junkie.

[LegionsofMarduk]

No, King Diamond and Mercyful Fate aren't Satanists. Not many bands are actually. Most black metal bands I'm familiar with are either pagan or anti-Christian.

I think Varg Vikernes was a Satanist for a time, but that means very little because he'll probably be a deist next week and Shinto the week after.

According to Anton LeVay, King Diamond was one of the only true Satanic metal acts around. Of course LeVay was a fool so considering the source... And Yes, for a brief period Varg was a Satanist. Either he or Euronymous was quoted as saying "Yes, we worship the devil", refering to both of them, in an interview.

Members of Akercocke are practicing Satanists I believe. I don't know what type of Satanism though. That's kind of a hard questions to answer because there are a few different schools of thought when it comes to Satanism.

[coolidgeALL]

Metal, what an awesome genre.

[Steerpike]

According to Anton LeVay, King Diamond was one of the only true Satanic metal acts around. Of course LeVay was a fool so considering the source...

LaVey also did not worship the Christian devil. He merely upheld Lucifer the Morningstar as an ideal of the struggle of the individual. Half the stuff he said was just to shock people. If nothing else, he was very good at pushing people's buttons.

[Bartender]

Members of Akercocke are practicing Satanists I believe. I don't know what type of Satanism though. That's kind of a hard questions to answer because there are a few different schools of thought when it comes to Satanism.

Their brand seems to be very much just the exemplification of the self, gratification of the desires and so on. I think I've seen them make mention of worshipping both women and Satan, though.

[Blood Venom]

Worshiping to women ?? How is that relevant to Satanism ?

[craggyisland]

Well, in Anton LaVey's brand of Satanism at least, naked women can be used as altars, since Satanism is regarded as a religion of the flesh, and not of the spirit.

[Bartender]

Ah, no, not that kind of worshipping. Just generally holding them to be worthy of admiration, respect, etc.

[Deathcrush]

That book was such a waste of my girlfriend's money.

Death to LaVey's Satanism.

[Drone Master]

..Amen to that :thumb:




:wave:

[Bartender]

Go away, you've got nine days left to serve.

[Johnny Dough]

And To Jacka$$ Administrator Of This Thread And/or Site I'd Like To Say - Lick My Motherf*cking Balls !!! Same Goes For Steerpike, Lorddargon, Bartender And Everyone Else Who Has Problem With My Comments. You Can Ban Me Now... You Bunch Of Miserable Fagg0ts !!

[Johnny Dough]

Go away, you've got nine days left to serve.


No, but you can serve me for eternity tossing my salad :thumb:

[Lav]

that is a very good summary of metal. But i disagree that Nu-metal is the latest type. Nu-metal IMHO is actually dead, maybe i have become disconected from the genre but I believe the latest is either Hardcore Metal or Metalcore. They take alot of influences from modern hardcore Punk in the drums but the guitar riffs are fast and thrashy but contain breakdowns and middle 8's like slayer used to!! Examples of bands include Shadows fall (the saviours of metal)... All that Remains (Shadows fall but better!!)... Caliban and Killswitch Engage. The Guitars are useually downtuned but not always! The music is very Technical and if you like double bass drums and guitar riffage this is for you.

[Steerpike]

And To Jacka$$ Administrator Of This Thread And/or Site I'd Like To Say - Lick My Motherf*cking Balls !!! Same Goes For Steerpike, Lorddargon, Bartender And Everyone Else Who Has Problem With My Comments. You Can Ban Me Now... You Bunch Of Miserable Fagg0ts !!

I'd flame you... but you're so bad at trolling that it's not even worth the effort. You pretty much pwned yourself the instant you opened your mouth.

[Steerpike]

Shadows fall (the saviours of metal)

I wouldn't go that far. You seen the European metal scene lately?

[ninjamonkey]

lol. the saviors.

it never died.

[Blood Venom]

that is a very good summary of metal. But i disagree that Nu-metal is the latest type. Nu-metal IMHO is actually dead, maybe i have become disconected from the genre but I believe the latest is either Hardcore Metal or Metalcore. They take alot of influences from modern hardcore Punk in the drums but the guitar riffs are fast and thrashy but contain breakdowns and middle 8's like slayer used to!! Examples of bands include Shadows fall (the saviours of metal)... All that Remains (Shadows fall but better!!)... Caliban and Killswitch Engage. The Guitars are useually downtuned but not always! The music is very Technical and if you like double bass drums and guitar riffage this is for you.

Let's not forget Hatebreed. I think of them as of one of the most important metalcore bands ever

[Bartender]

And To Jacka$$ Administrator Of This Thread And/or Site I'd Like To Say - Lick My Motherf*cking Balls !!! Same Goes For Steerpike, Lorddargon, Bartender And Everyone Else Who Has Problem With My Comments. You Can Ban Me Now... You Bunch Of Miserable Fagg0ts !!

I gave you a very clear warning to stop spamming and sniping in the thread, and you didn't. Just wait out the length of the ban.

[Invicta_Veritas]

Let's not forget Hatebreed. I think of them as of one of the most important metalcore bands ever

Whilst Jasta is a Genius with business and working with other bands, I see hatebreeds influence in metalcore(if that's what you really think they are) as pretty nominal.

[Decoy D]

I'd flame you... but you're so bad at trolling that it's not even worth the effort. You pretty much pwned yourself the instant you opened your mouth.


Aaaarh !! The 'wiseazz fairy' has visited us again.. HA! The only reason why you 'decided' not to flame me is cause you all out of fire ! Dude face it, I have totally smoked you. Your pityfull "retaliations" has caused you not only embarassment, but totally exposed how pathetic you are as a writer, reader, commentator, reseacher, humorist, observer ...and I could go on and on. For all I know, I should find your mother and torture her to death for giving birth to a maggot like you. I'd sure be doing the world a huge favor. Now 'flame' that !!

[Blood Venom]

Whilst Jasta is a Genius with business and working with other bands, I see hatebreeds influence in metalcore(if that's what you really think they are) as pretty nominal.

To add to that, Hatebreed definitely stands out as a live band. (as anything influenced by Slayer would, in my opinion). Also Killswitch Engage and Lamb of God have set trends in this genre